Fwd: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report

[Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>]

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---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>
Date: Thu, May 19, 2011 at 10:56 AM
Subject: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report
To: xalan-dev@xml.apache.org
Cc: private@xalan.apache.org, board <bo...@apache.org>, dbertoni@apache.org


Hi Xalan PMC members,

Despite asking several times on your private PMC list, the board had
not received a report from this project since a few months.

As a result, we are considering moving the project to the attic,
unless someone steps in quickly to fix things.

Please reply to board@apache.org if you are a member of the Xalan PMC
and willing to take care of this project.
The sooner the better, my guess is that we'll make a decision at next
month's board meeting unless we hear from you.

Thanks,
-Bertrand, for the ASF board of directors

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Re: Fwd: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report

[Michael Glavassevich <mr...@ca.ibm.com>]

To be fair, there were committers from Sun too and at least two people on
the PMC who I believe never worked for either.

Others in the community have had a long time (over a decade) to volunteer
if they genuinely wanted to get involved. If folks are emerging now who
want to pick up the ball there would probably need to be a new PMC.

Thanks.

Michael Glavassevich
XML Parser Development
IBM Toronto Lab
E-mail: mrglavas@ca.ibm.com
E-mail: mrglavas@apache.org

David Carver <d_...@yahoo.com> wrote on 05/20/2011 12:51:40 PM:

> I just cloned the xalan-j trunk, and there have been no active commits
> to Xalan-J in the last 17 months.
>
> So for all intents and purposes, I would suspect that none of the
> existing PMC members for Xalan-J are actively involved.   The problem
> with Xalan and Xalan-J in general was the lack of project diversity, as
> it was primarily staffed by IBM supplied committers, and once their
> interests moved elsewhere development pretty much stopped on on Xalan-J
> at least.
>
> So I doubt there are 3 active members of the PMC to do anything.
>
> Is there anything in the community by laws that allows nomination of new
> PMC or committers if an existing set of PMC members goes inactive?
>
> Dave
>
> On 05/20/2011 12:41 PM, Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> > Hi Steve,
> >
> > Thanks for your message, comments inline.
> >
> > On Thu, May 19, 2011 at 10:48 PM, Steve Hathaway<sh...@e-z.net>
wrote:
> >> ...I am not a member of the Xalan PMC, but would like to help create
> >> an official release of the Xalan-C++ version 1.11 library.  I am
hoping
> >> to have the documentation ready for review in July and ready to
> >> publish in September....
> > Ok - good too see that there's some activity.
> >
> >> I am unsure of what you need for the ASF board meeting...
> >> ....At present I am relying on the few remaining committers to apply
> >> patches to the Xalan-C++ SVN repository....
> > What we need from the board's point of view is a PMC with at least 3
> > active members, so as to be able to vote on releases, and a responsive
> > PMC chair who communicates with the board according to the PMC report
> > schedule (usually every 3 months). The last board report we got from
> > Xalan was in November 2011 [1], and was rejected as insufficiently
> > detailed, so that needs to be fixed.
> >
> > It also seems to me like there are no active moderators for the
> > private@xalan.apache.org mailing list, messages that we sent there
> > have not appeared in the archives.
> >
> > Do you think the project can motivate existing PMC members to fill
> > these gaps? Or are there only committers remaining with no active PMC
> > members?
> >
> > -Bertrand
> >
> > [1] http://www.apache.org/foundation/records/minutes/2010/
> board_minutes_2010_11_17.txt
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: xalan-dev-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: xalan-dev-help@xml.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
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Re: Fwd: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report

[David Carver <d_...@yahoo.com>]

I just cloned the xalan-j trunk, and there have been no active commits 
to Xalan-J in the last 17 months.

So for all intents and purposes, I would suspect that none of the 
existing PMC members for Xalan-J are actively involved.   The problem 
with Xalan and Xalan-J in general was the lack of project diversity, as 
it was primarily staffed by IBM supplied committers, and once their 
interests moved elsewhere development pretty much stopped on on Xalan-J 
at least.

So I doubt there are 3 active members of the PMC to do anything.

Is there anything in the community by laws that allows nomination of new 
PMC or committers if an existing set of PMC members goes inactive?

Dave

On 05/20/2011 12:41 PM, Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> Hi Steve,
>
> Thanks for your message, comments inline.
>
> On Thu, May 19, 2011 at 10:48 PM, Steve Hathaway<sh...@e-z.net>  wrote:
>> ...I am not a member of the Xalan PMC, but would like to help create
>> an official release of the Xalan-C++ version 1.11 library.  I am hoping
>> to have the documentation ready for review in July and ready to
>> publish in September....
> Ok - good too see that there's some activity.
>
>> I am unsure of what you need for the ASF board meeting...
>> ....At present I am relying on the few remaining committers to apply
>> patches to the Xalan-C++ SVN repository....
> What we need from the board's point of view is a PMC with at least 3
> active members, so as to be able to vote on releases, and a responsive
> PMC chair who communicates with the board according to the PMC report
> schedule (usually every 3 months). The last board report we got from
> Xalan was in November 2011 [1], and was rejected as insufficiently
> detailed, so that needs to be fixed.
>
> It also seems to me like there are no active moderators for the
> private@xalan.apache.org mailing list, messages that we sent there
> have not appeared in the archives.
>
> Do you think the project can motivate existing PMC members to fill
> these gaps? Or are there only committers remaining with no active PMC
> members?
>
> -Bertrand
>
> [1] http://www.apache.org/foundation/records/minutes/2010/board_minutes_2010_11_17.txt
>
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xalan-dev-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: xalan-dev-help@xml.apache.org
>
>


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Re: Fwd: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report

[Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>]

Hi David,

Thanks for your reply - as you can see with my delay now, you're not
the only who's too busy to keep up with things ;-)

On Fri, May 20, 2011 at 7:58 PM, David Bertoni <db...@apache.org> wrote:
> I apologize for not responding sooner.  I'm the current PMC chair, but I've
> been too busy with work responsibilities to give adequate time to the
> project. There are currently no other active PMC members....

Ok - if no one steps up the logical thing is to move Xalan to the
attic, as without 3 active PMC members it's impossible to make
releases or have valid votes. Thank you very much for trying to stay
on board, but that cannot work with just you, and it's not fair to put
all the burden on you.

Unless others step up before say one week before the next board
meeting which is on June 15th, I guess the board will vote to move
Xalan to attic.apache.org. Please let us know if you have other
suggestions.

>
> I am, however, confused about moderating for the private list. I don't know
> who the current moderators are, but your previous email appeared in my
> inbox, and I don't get any moderator requests for that list, so from what I
> can see, there's no need for moderation....

I checked the archives on people.apache.org and messages from the
board were not there - but you were in CC on most of them, that's
maybe why you got them.

>
> I am the current moderator for the Xalan-C users list, and I do see
> moderator requests for that list on a regular basis. Is the mechanism for
> moderating the private Xalan list the same? That is, should I be seeing the
> same sorts of emails if I'm one of the moderators for the private list?...

Yes it's the same mechanism.

>
> ...As for the future of the Xalan project -- I don't think there are any active
> committers left, besides me, and I don't think I will have the time to do
> more than I'm doing at this point. However, I have offered to review and
> commit Steve's changes....

Ok - as I said from the board's point of view we need 3 active PMC
members for the project to stay active, let us know if you see any
possibility of reaching that "quorum" in the near future.

-Bertrand

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Re: Fwd: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report

[David Bertoni <db...@apache.org>]

On 5/20/2011 9:41 AM, Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> Hi Steve,
>
> Thanks for your message, comments inline.
>
> On Thu, May 19, 2011 at 10:48 PM, Steve Hathaway<sh...@e-z.net>  wrote:
>> ...I am not a member of the Xalan PMC, but would like to help create
>> an official release of the Xalan-C++ version 1.11 library.  I am hoping
>> to have the documentation ready for review in July and ready to
>> publish in September....
>
> Ok - good too see that there's some activity.
>
>>
>> I am unsure of what you need for the ASF board meeting...
>
>> ....At present I am relying on the few remaining committers to apply
>> patches to the Xalan-C++ SVN repository....
>
> What we need from the board's point of view is a PMC with at least 3
> active members, so as to be able to vote on releases, and a responsive
> PMC chair who communicates with the board according to the PMC report
> schedule (usually every 3 months). The last board report we got from
> Xalan was in November 2011 [1], and was rejected as insufficiently
> detailed, so that needs to be fixed.
>
> It also seems to me like there are no active moderators for the
> private@xalan.apache.org mailing list, messages that we sent there
> have not appeared in the archives.
>
> Do you think the project can motivate existing PMC members to fill
> these gaps? Or are there only committers remaining with no active PMC
> members?
Hi Bertrand,

I apologize for not responding sooner.  I'm the current PMC chair, but 
I've been too busy with work responsibilities to give adequate time to 
the project. There are currently no other active PMC members.

I am, however, confused about moderating for the private list. I don't 
know who the current moderators are, but your previous email appeared in 
my inbox, and I don't get any moderator requests for that list, so from 
what I can see, there's no need for moderation.

I am the current moderator for the Xalan-C users list, and I do see 
moderator requests for that list on a regular basis. Is the mechanism 
for moderating the private Xalan list the same? That is, should I be 
seeing the same sorts of emails if I'm one of the moderators for the 
private list?

As for the future of the Xalan project -- I don't think there are any 
active committers left, besides me, and I don't think I will have the 
time to do more than I'm doing at this point. However, I have offered to 
review and commit Steve's changes.

Dave

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Re: Fwd: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report

[Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for your message, comments inline.

On Thu, May 19, 2011 at 10:48 PM, Steve Hathaway <sh...@e-z.net> wrote:
> ...I am not a member of the Xalan PMC, but would like to help create
> an official release of the Xalan-C++ version 1.11 library.  I am hoping
> to have the documentation ready for review in July and ready to
> publish in September....

Ok - good too see that there's some activity.

>
> I am unsure of what you need for the ASF board meeting...

> ....At present I am relying on the few remaining committers to apply
> patches to the Xalan-C++ SVN repository....

What we need from the board's point of view is a PMC with at least 3
active members, so as to be able to vote on releases, and a responsive
PMC chair who communicates with the board according to the PMC report
schedule (usually every 3 months). The last board report we got from
Xalan was in November 2011 [1], and was rejected as insufficiently
detailed, so that needs to be fixed.

It also seems to me like there are no active moderators for the
private@xalan.apache.org mailing list, messages that we sent there
have not appeared in the archives.

Do you think the project can motivate existing PMC members to fill
these gaps? Or are there only committers remaining with no active PMC
members?

-Bertrand

[1] http://www.apache.org/foundation/records/minutes/2010/board_minutes_2010_11_17.txt

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Re: Fwd: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report

[Steve Hathaway <sh...@e-z.net>]

FOR THE ASF BOARD - XALAN C PROJECT

I am not a member of the Xalan PMC, but would like to help create
an official release of the Xalan-C++ version 1.11 library.  I am hoping
to have the documentation ready for review in July and ready to
publish in September.

I am unsure of what you need for the ASF board meeting, but
here is a summary of what I am doing.

I am working on a project to package the Xalan-C++ version 1.11
documentation and hope to have the documentation ready for review
in July 2011.  I am still preparing the page markup and templates to
create a new draft of the Xalan-C++ web pages that can be published
on the ASF web servers and mirrors.

I hope to have a documentation release in September.

I have a signed ASF Contributor License Agreement on file and
am offering my services as a committer to the Xalan-C++ project.
I am willing to nominate myself as a committer, but according to
ASF, I need to be nominated by the PMC.

At present I am relying on the few remaining committers to apply
patches to the Xalan-C++ SVN repository.

Sincerely,
Steven J. Hathaway

Email: Steven.J.Hathaway@state.or.us  (work)
Email: shathawa@e-z.net (home)



On 5/19/2011 5:15 AM, Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> (resend - previous message was not moderated in, subscribed now)
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Bertrand Delacretaz<bd...@apache.org>
> Date: Thu, May 19, 2011 at 10:56 AM
> Subject: [IMPORTANT] Xalan PMC members: last call to submit a board report
> To: xalan-dev@xml.apache.org
> Cc: private@xalan.apache.org, board<bo...@apache.org>, dbertoni@apache.org
>
>
> Hi Xalan PMC members,
>
> Despite asking several times on your private PMC list, the board had
> not received a report from this project since a few months.
>
> As a result, we are considering moving the project to the attic,
> unless someone steps in quickly to fix things.
>
> Please reply to board@apache.org if you are a member of the Xalan PMC
> and willing to take care of this project.
> The sooner the better, my guess is that we'll make a decision at next
> month's board meeting unless we hear from you.
>
> Thanks,
> -Bertrand, for the ASF board of directors
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: xalan-dev-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: xalan-dev-help@xml.apache.org
>


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