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Posted to server-dev@james.apache.org by echo <ec...@gmail.com> on 2012/04/05 13:01:53 UTC
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Hi, Manolo
My "[GSOC2012] Hupa evolution" proposal has been updated in
http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/proposal/review/google/gsoc2012/echo/1.
Could you give me some advices about it? If it looks Ok, I am gonna to
cope with some beginning stuff. If not, however, I will have to change
something through your suggests.
Many thanks for your consideration.
-Echo
On 03/30/2012 06:08 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
> Hi Echo
>
> I'm CCing the mailing list because other developers could be
> interested in these questions.
>
> Proly you can not login into gmail because of either cacerts issues or
> you have not enabled imap in your gmail account.
>
> Yesterday, I committed a fix to the default config.properties removing
> the 'TrustStore' line so as hupa can use the default java cacerts
> file.
> If you are using openjdk, you should check that cacerts file is complete.
>
> There are several MVP articles, the one you say is a good start point.
> There are different approaches of how implement MVP, hupa is using
> gwt-presenter which is similar to the stuff in gwt-2.4 so the idea is
> to replace it with gwt-2.4 although we could consider other nice
> libraries like mvp4g or gwtp. I recomend to you to read everything you
> find in order to write a good proposal.
>
> gwt-dispatcher is used in client and server sides because it is the
> framework used to comunicate both sides (this is the reason why you
> can see it in many modules). We used it instead of RPC in order to use
> the command pattern and facilitate testing of remote procedures in the
> jvm. This library is not very used nowadays because people uses the
> new RequestFactory stuff. The evolution of gwt-dispatcher is in the
> gwtp library.
>
> Although RequestFactory is though to be used with ddbb entities, I
> think we can consider our objects (emails, folders, etc) like entities
> and take advantage of this pattern. Anyway, you could consider other
> library like gwtp if it simplifies the code or the developing of new
> features in hupa.
>
> Gin is the only way to have injection in client side. Gin syntax is
> the same than Guice and you have to use both to test client presenters
> and code in the jvm. Note that one of the main goals in MVP is to test
> in the jvm client code, so we need a way to decouple presenters, etc
> and inject the necessary stuff to test them in the jvm.
>
> We use gwt-dnd because it was the only available library those days.
> It is necessary to move messages to folders. Now gwt has dnd support
> although Cell widgets do not support it, may be we had to use
> gwtquery-dnd etc. when we replace the message celltable.
>
> gwtquery brings the simplicity of jquery to gwt, specially when
> dealing with dom elements or html content, note that it doesn't need
> jquery at all. I think gquery can help to display messages (clean
> them, resize, etc). I maintain this library so feel free to ask me any
> question you had about it.
>
> All of these new features you suggest are welcome. Note that hupa does
> not have any ddbb in server side, we are storing stuff in a hidden
> message in the imap server, it is experimental, so maybe you could
> consider to add a ddbb to handle this info (we use derby in james
> server as the default one).
>
> The project is big and it is difficult to estimate the effort for each
> thing. But I think your schedule could be a good start point.
>
>
> Cheers
> - Manolo
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 3:43 PM, echo<ec...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi, Manuel Carrasco
>>
>> Hupa is an Rich IMAP-based Webmail application written in GWT, but there is
>> no release delivered yet
>>
>> We propose that gsoc student/s take the actual Hupa code and make it fully
>> functional adding many features which are missing and removing out-of-dated
>> dependencies in favor of the new stuff in the latest GWT version.
>>
>> ** Hupa Status
>> - Hupa has been entirely written in java to be coherent with the
>> language used in the James project.
>>
>> The Hupa has been checked out and deployed successfully on my
>> ArchLinux+openjdk6+eclipse，even though I could not login with my gmail
>> account and password which can access http://hupa.alcala.org. Maybe it need
>> config the .hupa/config.properties, I think.
>>
>> - Time ago, Hupa was a reference of a GWT MVP pattern application.
>> - Hupa MVP design is based of a set of libraries available for gwt a
>> couple of years ago when Gwt-core didn't have support for MVP
>> Gwt-presenter: for the MVP and EventBus patterns.
>> Gwt-dispatch: for the Command pattern
>> Gin + Guice: for dependency injection.
>> - Hupa was developed before GWT-2.0 was released, when LayoutPanels,
>> uibinders, Cells, RF, etc. were not available.
>> - Although Hupa is using the last GWT release, it still depends on some
>> unmaintained libraries because they have an equivalent feature in modern
>> GWT.
>> - In summary, Hupa is a functional and well designed email client, ready
>> to read, send and manage messages, but it lacks many of the nice features
>> any email client nowadays has.
>>
>> I also found some examples or instructions on GWT's own MVP architectrue at
>> here, it can be as a reference in my opinion, can it?
>> It is found that gwt-dispatch is used in more places than the others, since
>> almost every maven module(sever, client, share, etc.) needs it. So I believe
>> it will take more time to change it by Command Pattern(RequestFactory as
>> below) than the others.
>> Acutally I have no idea about "Gin + Guice: for dependency injection." which
>> needs to deeply discuss with you.
>>
>> ** Hupa roadmap
>> - Replace out-of-date dependencies with GWT-2.4.0 stuff
>> Replace gwt-dispatch by RequestFactory
>> Replace gwt-presenter with the available stuff in GWT-2.4
>> Remove gwt-incubator dependency in favor of CellTable and CellTree
>> Use LayoutPanels and DecoratorPanels of css workarounds
>> Use Gwt DnD
>>
>> It is necessary for the theme to be improved by nearly all the recent apis
>> and I think it also need some time to be familiar with those new features.
>> Another thing I found in the code base is gwt-dnd-3.1.1 has been imported in
>> the maven dependencies, while I am not sure whether it is using or not.
>>
>> - Performance
>> Use gQuery in client side to enhance message view, specially to
>> parse html messages and remove dangerous tags, instead of expensive parsing
>> in server side
>> Implement Server cache and client storage
>>
>> I played with gQuery roughly yesterday and am familiar with its concept of
>> JQuery in GWT.
>>
>> - New features
>> Contact management.
>> Authentication: Oauth
>> Message filtering, grouping, sorting and labeling.
>> User settings: name, emails, signature.
>> Theming.
>>
>> And some other small but user-friendly stuffs such as "archive", "draft
>> save", user cookies(maybe HTML5 local storage) and so forth.
>>
>> All right, this is very first draft of the my plan on Hupa:
>> [From now to the announcement of GSoC] get started to be familiar with both
>> of the Hupa and GWT.
>> [Week 1~4] replace gwt-dispatch by RequestFactory, after which I will get
>> more familiar with Hupa.
>> Deliverable #1: the improved Hupa after replacing something.
>> [Week 5] Remove gwt-incubator dependency in favor of CellTable and CellTree.
>> [Week 6~7] Replace gwt-presenter with the available stuff in GWT-2.4
>> Deliverable #2: the improved Hupa with almost all GWT-2.4 owning
>> [Week 8~9] make several prototypes of new features(Contact management,
>> Message filtering, grouping, sorting and labeling, etc.). And then try to
>> commit to the mail list for quickly feedback.
>> [Week 10~11] develop Oauth and User settings, meanwhile update the feedback
>> from Week8~9.
>> Deliverable #3: the improved Hupa with some new features.
>> [Week 12] suggested "pencils down" date: write documentation, test
>> everything...
>>
>> To be honest, I am not really sure about it(probably two few things to do or
>> priorities to change and not very well specified). So could you tell me how
>> do you think? Any advices will be welcome.
>>
>>
>> --
>> cheers,
>> echo
--
cheers,
echo
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Eric Charles <er...@apache.org>.
On 04/19/2012 10:58 AM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 10:54 AM, Eric Charles
> <er...@u-mangate.com>wrote:
>
>> After all, if we develop mailbox-imap, we could have Hupa using the
>> mailbox-api to a local james or any remote server.
>>
>
> Yep, this is the point, I think with that is not necessary to maintain imap
> code in hupa server side, although we need to have a james server doing
> that work, also we can use james storage to cache copies of the messages.
>
Yep, it will be mailbox-imap responsibility to interact to the external
servers (ideally with a performant nio client, not the oracle one), and
cache in memory (we even have mailbox-memory) and/or storage for Hupa.
>
>>
>> Prolly the user and domain stuff could go in a separate hupa module
>> (separation of concerns).
>>
>
> agree
>
>
>>
>> That would be cool,
>>
>> Eric
>>
>>
>> On 04/19/2012 10:38 AM, Eric Charles wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Manolo,
>>>
>>> Thx a lot for the detailed information.
>>>
>>> - On the decoupling: I like gwt-dispatch, but was thinking to still
>>> further decouple stuff in separate module independent of any http/gwt/...
>>>
>>> - Direct access to james mailbox will be killer, but efficient imap
>>> client service is still needed for non-james users (I have in my
>>> bookmarks
>>> https://github.com/dhanji/**sitebricks/tree/master/**sitebricks-mail<https://github.com/dhanji/sitebricks/tree/master/sitebricks-mail>which
>>> support oauth2...)
>>>
>>> - mailbox-imap would be a cool module :)
>>>
>>> - About the client side, I work since 5 months on a GWT project and I
>>> made stuff I couldn't have done with any other web technology, so you
>>> won't have to convince a prayer ;). We now use also separate module for
>>> client, shared and server, but important, we put our business logic in
>>> other modules agnostic from any presentation.
>>>
>>> Thx again,
>>>
>>> Eric
>>>
>>> On 04/19/2012 09:48 AM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Eric,
>>>>
>>>> Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use MVP
>>>> and Command patterns.
>>>> Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your
>>>> realize.
>>>>
>>>> - Server side
>>>> Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser), we
>>>> use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We
>>>> offer
>>>> those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet,
>>>> although we
>>>> could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
>>>> client applications.
>>>> The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
>>>> caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
>>>> So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the
>>>> imap-server
>>>> and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
>>>> far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
>>>> attachments).
>>>>
>>>> I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
>>>> should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
>>>> mailboxes.
>>>> Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
>>>> imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible that
>>>> a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
>>>>
>>>> There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we just
>>>> have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
>>>> part.
>>>>
>>>> - Client side
>>>> It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
>>>> desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax to
>>>> the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
>>>>
>>>> The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
>>>> plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of
>>>> the
>>>> full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring, coverage,
>>>> javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
>>>> dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
>>>> programing because of java.
>>>>
>>>> The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter) with
>>>> allows completely decouple the views from the client-application
>>>> logic, so
>>>> as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
>>>> dialog with the server).
>>>> With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container
>>>> so as
>>>> we can run integration tests very fast.
>>>>
>>>> Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is
>>>> java, we
>>>> use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can
>>>> use the
>>>> same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
>>>> pattern).
>>>>
>>>> We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
>>>> them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets
>>>> like
>>>> gxt, smartgwt, etc.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
>>>> build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
>>>> client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
>>>> Hupa code.
>>>> What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app to
>>>> run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely javascript
>>>> (apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
>>>> that:
>>>> 1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
>>>> makes the work easier.
>>>> 2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is
>>>> also a
>>>> scala to js compiler)
>>>> 3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
>>>> javascript portions into html templates.
>>>>
>>>> Based in my experience,
>>>> #1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good
>>>> skills in
>>>> js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
>>>> deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
>>>> performance apps.
>>>> #2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code
>>>> wont be
>>>> run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
>>>> will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
>>>> #3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with some
>>>> kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
>>>> single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
>>>> javascript.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
>>>>
>>>> - Manolo
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles<er...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
>>>>>
>>>>> If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
>>>>> contact management, authentication/authorization..****. (name any), we
>>>>> can:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
>>>>> current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes
>>>>> fails
>>>>> due to (I think) latency,...
>>>>>
>>>>> 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
>>>>> could be further added.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thx,
>>>>> Eric
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
>>>>>> good
>>>>>> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
>>>>>> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
>>>>>> sometimes)
>>>>>> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
>>>>>> James jail server).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user
>>>>>> (previously you
>>>>>> have to enable imap in that user).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen
>>>>>> Stan<st...@gmail.com>**
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>>>>>>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>>>>>>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
>>>>>>> to maintain in the long run).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>>>>>>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>>>>>>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>>>>>>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>>>>>>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>>>>>>> that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My cents ;).
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>****:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Manolo -
>>>>>>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>>>>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/****showcase-labs/ui/****layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>>>>> <http://www.**primefaces.org/showcase-labs/**ui/layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component
>>>>>>>> suite
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> also
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich
>>>>>>>> editor
>>>>>>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>>>>>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>>>>>>> http://code.google.com/p/****primefaces-extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>>>>> <http://**code.google.com/p/primefaces-**extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>>>>>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OUTLOOK
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> project i
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
>>>>>>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> commit
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is
>>>>>>>> modular app
>>>>>>>> development. Please check this link -
>>>>>>>> https://community.jboss.org/****wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_***
>>>>>>>> *sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t>
>>>>>>>> <https://community.**jboss.org/wiki/**ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
>>>>>>>> **>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>>>>>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of
>>>>>>>> primefaces?,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> JEE
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> how
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2
>>>>>>>>>>> imp, we
>>>>>>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Teknoloji
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>>>>>>>>>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being
>>>>>>>>>>>> java
>>>>>>>>>>>> centric
>>>>>>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit
>>>>>>>>>>>> tested and
>>>>>>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich
>>>>>>>>>>>> apps
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> web.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> controlled
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> by
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2 -
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> import
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deadline
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mvp
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> features,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> that a
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> period,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instead
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> face
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> new
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------******--------------------------*
>>>>>>>>>> *--**
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --**---------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.******
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> apache.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<server-dev-**
>>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe@james.apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<server-dev-help@james.**
>>>>>>>>>>> apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.**com/in/dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.**com/in/dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.**com/in/dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.**com/in/dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**--**
>>>>>>> ---------
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<server-dev-**
>>>>>>> unsubscribe@james.apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail:
>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<server-dev-help@james.**
>>>>>>> apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
>>>>> --**---------
>>>>>
>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<server-dev-**
>>>>> unsubscribe@james.apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>>
>>>>>
>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail:
>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> --
>> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>>
>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>
>>
>
--
eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 10:54 AM, Eric Charles
<er...@u-mangate.com>wrote:
> After all, if we develop mailbox-imap, we could have Hupa using the
> mailbox-api to a local james or any remote server.
>
Yep, this is the point, I think with that is not necessary to maintain imap
code in hupa server side, although we need to have a james server doing
that work, also we can use james storage to cache copies of the messages.
>
> Prolly the user and domain stuff could go in a separate hupa module
> (separation of concerns).
>
agree
>
> That would be cool,
>
> Eric
>
>
> On 04/19/2012 10:38 AM, Eric Charles wrote:
>
>> Hi Manolo,
>>
>> Thx a lot for the detailed information.
>>
>> - On the decoupling: I like gwt-dispatch, but was thinking to still
>> further decouple stuff in separate module independent of any http/gwt/...
>>
>> - Direct access to james mailbox will be killer, but efficient imap
>> client service is still needed for non-james users (I have in my
>> bookmarks
>> https://github.com/dhanji/**sitebricks/tree/master/**sitebricks-mail<https://github.com/dhanji/sitebricks/tree/master/sitebricks-mail>which
>> support oauth2...)
>>
>> - mailbox-imap would be a cool module :)
>>
>> - About the client side, I work since 5 months on a GWT project and I
>> made stuff I couldn't have done with any other web technology, so you
>> won't have to convince a prayer ;). We now use also separate module for
>> client, shared and server, but important, we put our business logic in
>> other modules agnostic from any presentation.
>>
>> Thx again,
>>
>> Eric
>>
>> On 04/19/2012 09:48 AM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Eric,
>>>
>>> Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use MVP
>>> and Command patterns.
>>> Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your
>>> realize.
>>>
>>> - Server side
>>> Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser), we
>>> use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We
>>> offer
>>> those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet,
>>> although we
>>> could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
>>> client applications.
>>> The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
>>> caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
>>> So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the
>>> imap-server
>>> and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
>>> far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
>>> attachments).
>>>
>>> I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
>>> should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
>>> mailboxes.
>>> Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
>>> imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible that
>>> a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
>>>
>>> There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we just
>>> have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
>>> part.
>>>
>>> - Client side
>>> It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
>>> desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax to
>>> the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
>>>
>>> The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
>>> plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of
>>> the
>>> full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring, coverage,
>>> javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
>>> dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
>>> programing because of java.
>>>
>>> The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter) with
>>> allows completely decouple the views from the client-application
>>> logic, so
>>> as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
>>> dialog with the server).
>>> With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container
>>> so as
>>> we can run integration tests very fast.
>>>
>>> Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is
>>> java, we
>>> use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can
>>> use the
>>> same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
>>> pattern).
>>>
>>> We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
>>> them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets
>>> like
>>> gxt, smartgwt, etc.
>>>
>>> Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
>>> build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
>>> client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
>>> Hupa code.
>>> What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app to
>>> run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely javascript
>>> (apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
>>> that:
>>> 1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
>>> makes the work easier.
>>> 2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is
>>> also a
>>> scala to js compiler)
>>> 3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
>>> javascript portions into html templates.
>>>
>>> Based in my experience,
>>> #1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good
>>> skills in
>>> js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
>>> deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
>>> performance apps.
>>> #2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code
>>> wont be
>>> run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
>>> will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
>>> #3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with some
>>> kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
>>> single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
>>> javascript.
>>>
>>>
>>> I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
>>>
>>> - Manolo
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles<er...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
>>>>
>>>> If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
>>>> contact management, authentication/authorization..****. (name any), we
>>>> can:
>>>>
>>>> 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
>>>> current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes
>>>> fails
>>>> due to (I think) latency,...
>>>>
>>>> 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
>>>> could be further added.
>>>>
>>>> Thx,
>>>> Eric
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
>>>>> good
>>>>> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>>>>>
>>>>> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
>>>>> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
>>>>> sometimes)
>>>>> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
>>>>> James jail server).
>>>>>
>>>>> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user
>>>>> (previously you
>>>>> have to enable imap in that user).
>>>>>
>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen
>>>>> Stan<st...@gmail.com>**
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>>>>>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>>>>>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
>>>>>> to maintain in the long run).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>>>>>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>>>>>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>>>>>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>>>>>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>>>>>> that?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My cents ;).
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>****:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Manolo -
>>>>>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>>>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/****showcase-labs/ui/****layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>>>> <http://www.**primefaces.org/showcase-labs/**ui/layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component
>>>>>>> suite
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> also
>>>>>>
>>>>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich
>>>>>>> editor
>>>>>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>>>>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>>>>>> http://code.google.com/p/****primefaces-extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>>>> <http://**code.google.com/p/primefaces-**extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>>>>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> OUTLOOK
>>>>>>
>>>>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> project i
>>>>>>
>>>>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
>>>>>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> commit
>>>>>>
>>>>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is
>>>>>>> modular app
>>>>>>> development. Please check this link -
>>>>>>> https://community.jboss.org/****wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_***
>>>>>>> *sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t>
>>>>>>> <https://community.**jboss.org/wiki/**ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
>>>>>>> **>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>>>>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of
>>>>>>> primefaces?,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> JEE
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> how
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2
>>>>>>>>>> imp, we
>>>>>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Teknoloji
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> :)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>>>>>>>>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being
>>>>>>>>>>> java
>>>>>>>>>>> centric
>>>>>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit
>>>>>>>>>>> tested and
>>>>>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich
>>>>>>>>>>> apps
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> web.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> controlled
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> by
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 2 -
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> import
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deadline
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mvp
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> features,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> that a
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> period,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instead
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> face
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> new
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> more.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------******--------------------------*
>>>>>>>>> *--**
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --**---------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.******
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> apache.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<server-dev-**
>>>>>>>>> unsubscribe@james.apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<server-dev-help@james.**
>>>>>>>>>> apache.org <se...@james.apache.org>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.**com/in/dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.**com/in/dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.**com/in/dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.**com/in/dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**--**
>>>>>> ---------
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<server-dev-**
>>>>>> unsubscribe@james.apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail:
>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<server-dev-help@james.**
>>>>>> apache.org <se...@james.apache.org>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
>>>> --**---------
>>>>
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<server-dev-**
>>>> unsubscribe@james.apache.org <se...@james.apache.org>>
>>>>
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail:
>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
> --
> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
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>
>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Eric Charles <er...@u-mangate.com>.
After all, if we develop mailbox-imap, we could have Hupa using the
mailbox-api to a local james or any remote server.
Prolly the user and domain stuff could go in a separate hupa module
(separation of concerns).
That would be cool,
Eric
On 04/19/2012 10:38 AM, Eric Charles wrote:
> Hi Manolo,
>
> Thx a lot for the detailed information.
>
> - On the decoupling: I like gwt-dispatch, but was thinking to still
> further decouple stuff in separate module independent of any http/gwt/...
>
> - Direct access to james mailbox will be killer, but efficient imap
> client service is still needed for non-james users (I have in my
> bookmarks
> https://github.com/dhanji/sitebricks/tree/master/sitebricks-mail which
> support oauth2...)
>
> - mailbox-imap would be a cool module :)
>
> - About the client side, I work since 5 months on a GWT project and I
> made stuff I couldn't have done with any other web technology, so you
> won't have to convince a prayer ;). We now use also separate module for
> client, shared and server, but important, we put our business logic in
> other modules agnostic from any presentation.
>
> Thx again,
>
> Eric
>
> On 04/19/2012 09:48 AM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>> Hi Eric,
>>
>> Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use MVP
>> and Command patterns.
>> Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your
>> realize.
>>
>> - Server side
>> Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser), we
>> use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We
>> offer
>> those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet,
>> although we
>> could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
>> client applications.
>> The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
>> caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
>> So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the
>> imap-server
>> and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
>> far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
>> attachments).
>>
>> I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
>> should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
>> mailboxes.
>> Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
>> imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible that
>> a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
>>
>> There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we just
>> have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
>> part.
>>
>> - Client side
>> It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
>> desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax to
>> the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
>>
>> The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
>> plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of
>> the
>> full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring, coverage,
>> javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
>> dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
>> programing because of java.
>>
>> The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter) with
>> allows completely decouple the views from the client-application
>> logic, so
>> as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
>> dialog with the server).
>> With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container
>> so as
>> we can run integration tests very fast.
>>
>> Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is
>> java, we
>> use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can
>> use the
>> same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
>> pattern).
>>
>> We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
>> them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets
>> like
>> gxt, smartgwt, etc.
>>
>> Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
>> build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
>> client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
>> Hupa code.
>> What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app to
>> run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely javascript
>> (apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
>> that:
>> 1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
>> makes the work easier.
>> 2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is
>> also a
>> scala to js compiler)
>> 3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
>> javascript portions into html templates.
>>
>> Based in my experience,
>> #1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good
>> skills in
>> js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
>> deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
>> performance apps.
>> #2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code
>> wont be
>> run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
>> will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
>> #3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with some
>> kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
>> single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
>> javascript.
>>
>>
>> I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
>>
>> - Manolo
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles<er...@apache.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
>>>
>>> If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
>>> contact management, authentication/authorization..**. (name any), we
>>> can:
>>>
>>> 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
>>> current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes
>>> fails
>>> due to (I think) latency,...
>>>
>>> 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
>>> could be further added.
>>>
>>> Thx,
>>> Eric
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
>>>> good
>>>> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>>>>
>>>> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
>>>> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
>>>> sometimes)
>>>> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
>>>> James jail server).
>>>>
>>>> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user
>>>> (previously you
>>>> have to enable imap in that user).
>>>>
>>>> - Manolo
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen
>>>> Stan<st...@gmail.com>**
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>>>>
>>>>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>>>>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>>>>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
>>>>> to maintain in the long run).
>>>>>
>>>>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>>>>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>>>>
>>>>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>>>>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>>>>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>>>>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>>>>> that?
>>>>>
>>>>> My cents ;).
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>
>>>>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>**:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Manolo -
>>>>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component
>>>>>> suite
>>>>>>
>>>>> also
>>>>>
>>>>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich
>>>>>> editor
>>>>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>>>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>>>>> http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>>>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>>>>>>
>>>>> OUTLOOK
>>>>>
>>>>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>>>>>>
>>>>> project i
>>>>>
>>>>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
>>>>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>>>>>>
>>>>> commit
>>>>>
>>>>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is
>>>>>> modular app
>>>>>> development. Please check this link -
>>>>>> https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>>>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of
>>>>>> primefaces?,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> or
>>>>>
>>>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> JEE
>>>>>
>>>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> which
>>>>>
>>>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> how
>>>>>
>>>>>> too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2
>>>>>>>>> imp, we
>>>>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Teknoloji
>>>>>
>>>>>> :)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>>>>>>>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being
>>>>>>>>>> java
>>>>>>>>>> centric
>>>>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit
>>>>>>>>>> tested and
>>>>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich
>>>>>>>>>> apps
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> web.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> controlled
>>>>>
>>>>>> by
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> 2 -
>>>>>
>>>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>
>>>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> import
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>
>>>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> deadline
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> mvp
>>>>>
>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> features,
>>>>>
>>>>>> that a
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC
>>>>>
>>>>>> period,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>>>>>>>>>>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> instead
>>>>>
>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> face
>>>>>
>>>>>> new
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> more.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
>>>>> --**---------
>>>>>
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> apache.org
>>>>>
>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
>>>>> ---------
>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>
>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail:
>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>> --
>>> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
>>>
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>
>>> For additional commands, e-mail:
>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
--
eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Eric Charles <er...@apache.org>.
Hi Manolo,
Thx a lot for the detailed information.
- On the decoupling: I like gwt-dispatch, but was thinking to still
further decouple stuff in separate module independent of any http/gwt/...
- Direct access to james mailbox will be killer, but efficient imap
client service is still needed for non-james users (I have in my
bookmarks
https://github.com/dhanji/sitebricks/tree/master/sitebricks-mail which
support oauth2...)
- mailbox-imap would be a cool module :)
- About the client side, I work since 5 months on a GWT project and I
made stuff I couldn't have done with any other web technology, so you
won't have to convince a prayer ;). We now use also separate module for
client, shared and server, but important, we put our business logic in
other modules agnostic from any presentation.
Thx again,
Eric
On 04/19/2012 09:48 AM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
> Hi Eric,
>
> Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use MVP
> and Command patterns.
> Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your realize.
>
> - Server side
> Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser), we
> use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We offer
> those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet, although we
> could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
> client applications.
> The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
> caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
> So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the imap-server
> and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
> far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
> attachments).
>
> I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
> should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
> mailboxes.
> Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
> imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible that
> a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
>
> There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we just
> have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
> part.
>
> - Client side
> It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
> desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax to
> the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
>
> The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
> plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of the
> full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring, coverage,
> javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
> dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
> programing because of java.
>
> The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter) with
> allows completely decouple the views from the client-application logic, so
> as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
> dialog with the server).
> With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container so as
> we can run integration tests very fast.
>
> Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is java, we
> use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can use the
> same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
> pattern).
>
> We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
> them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets like
> gxt, smartgwt, etc.
>
> Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
> build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
> client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
> Hupa code.
> What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app to
> run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely javascript
> (apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
> that:
> 1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
> makes the work easier.
> 2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is also a
> scala to js compiler)
> 3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
> javascript portions into html templates.
>
> Based in my experience,
> #1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good skills in
> js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
> deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
> performance apps.
> #2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code wont be
> run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
> will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
> #3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with some
> kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
> single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
> javascript.
>
>
> I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
>
> - Manolo
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles<er...@apache.org> wrote:
>
>> Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
>>
>> If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
>> contact management, authentication/authorization..**. (name any), we can:
>>
>> 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
>> current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes fails
>> due to (I think) latency,...
>>
>> 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
>> could be further added.
>>
>> Thx,
>> Eric
>>
>>
>>
>> On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>>
>>> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
>>> good
>>> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>>>
>>> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
>>> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
>>> sometimes)
>>> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
>>> James jail server).
>>>
>>> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously you
>>> have to enable imap in that user).
>>>
>>> - Manolo
>>>
>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<st...@gmail.com>**
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>>>
>>>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>>>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>>>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
>>>> to maintain in the long run).
>>>>
>>>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>>>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>>>
>>>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>>>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>>>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>>>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>>>> that?
>>>>
>>>> My cents ;).
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>**:
>>>>
>>>>> Manolo -
>>>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>>
>>>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite
>>>>>
>>>> also
>>>>
>>>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich editor
>>>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>>>> http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>>
>>>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>>>
>>>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>>>>>
>>>> OUTLOOK
>>>>
>>>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>>>>>
>>>> project i
>>>>
>>>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
>>>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>>>>>
>>>> commit
>>>>
>>>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular app
>>>>> development. Please check this link -
>>>>> https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
>>>>>
>>>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?,
>>>>>>
>>>>> or
>>>>
>>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> JEE
>>>>
>>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> which
>>>>
>>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> how
>>>>
>>>>> too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
>>>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Teknoloji
>>>>
>>>>> :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>>>>>>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
>>>>>>>>> centric
>>>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
>>>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> web.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> controlled
>>>>
>>>>> by
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 2 -
>>>>
>>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> import
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>
>>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> deadline
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> mvp
>>>>
>>>>> in
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> features,
>>>>
>>>>> that a
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC
>>>>
>>>>> period,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>>>>>>>>>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> instead
>>>>
>>>>> of
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> face
>>>>
>>>>> new
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> more.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
>>>> --**---------
>>>>
>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> apache.org
>>>>
>>>>> <
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>
>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
>>>> ---------
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> --
>> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>
>>
>
--
eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
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Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
Hi echo I'm very sorry for the death of your granny.
Don't worry about not contacting us for this while, we understand each
contributor circunstances.
As you can see in this thread we just have shared opinions about the status
and future of hupa and advantages/disadvantages about different
technologies, don't hesitate to participate with your ideas as well.
Related with gsoc, we would know if you are selected in the course of the
next days, I wish you good luck.
- Manolo
On Sat, Apr 21, 2012 at 7:31 AM, Eric Charles <er...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hi echo,
> My sincerest condolences for your grandmother.
> All the best,
> Eric
>
>
>
> On 04/21/2012 02:57 AM, echo wrote:
>
>> I am sorry for not contacting with this channel, because my grandma got
>> the
>> lung cancer and passed away the other day. I am too sad to do anything
>> until now.
>> However, I pick up my spirits to continue the project and my life. Pls
>> believe in me.
>> Thank you.
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Luis Slocker<sl...@gmail.com>**
>> wrote:
>>
>> Great!, Manolo, thank you very much.
>>>
>>> This new contribution is serving me a lot to get to understand the
>>> architecture of Hupa, and to know where they fit the pieces of this
>>> interesting puzzle.
>>>
>>> 2012/4/19 Manuel Carrasco Moñino<ma...@apache.org>
>>>
>>> Hi Eric,
>>>>
>>>> Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use
>>>> MVP
>>>> and Command patterns.
>>>> Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your
>>>>
>>> realize.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> - Server side
>>>> Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser),
>>>> we
>>>> use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We
>>>>
>>> offer
>>>
>>>> those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet, although
>>>>
>>> we
>>>
>>>> could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
>>>> client applications.
>>>> The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
>>>> caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
>>>> So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the
>>>>
>>> imap-server
>>>
>>>> and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
>>>> far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
>>>> attachments).
>>>>
>>>> I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
>>>> should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
>>>> mailboxes.
>>>> Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
>>>> imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible
>>>>
>>> that
>>>
>>>> a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
>>>>
>>>> There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we
>>>> just
>>>> have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
>>>> part.
>>>>
>>>> - Client side
>>>> It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
>>>> desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax
>>>> to
>>>> the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
>>>>
>>>> The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
>>>> plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of
>>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>>> full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring,
>>>> coverage,
>>>> javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
>>>> dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
>>>> programing because of java.
>>>>
>>>> The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter)
>>>> with
>>>> allows completely decouple the views from the client-application logic,
>>>>
>>> so
>>>
>>>> as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
>>>> dialog with the server).
>>>> With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container so
>>>>
>>> as
>>>
>>>> we can run integration tests very fast.
>>>>
>>>> Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is java,
>>>>
>>> we
>>>
>>>> use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can use
>>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>>> same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
>>>> pattern).
>>>>
>>>> We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
>>>> them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets
>>>>
>>> like
>>>
>>>> gxt, smartgwt, etc.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
>>>> build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
>>>> client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
>>>> Hupa code.
>>>> What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app
>>>> to
>>>> run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely
>>>> javascript
>>>> (apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
>>>> that:
>>>> 1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
>>>> makes the work easier.
>>>> 2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is also
>>>>
>>> a
>>>
>>>> scala to js compiler)
>>>> 3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
>>>> javascript portions into html templates.
>>>>
>>>> Based in my experience,
>>>> #1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good skills
>>>>
>>> in
>>>
>>>> js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
>>>> deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
>>>> performance apps.
>>>> #2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code wont
>>>>
>>> be
>>>
>>>> run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
>>>> will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
>>>> #3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with
>>>> some
>>>> kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
>>>> single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
>>>> javascript.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
>>>>
>>>> - Manolo
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles<er...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
>>>>>
>>>>> If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
>>>>> contact management, authentication/authorization..****. (name any), we
>>>>>
>>>> can:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
>>>>> current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes
>>>>>
>>>> fails
>>>>
>>>>> due to (I think) latency,...
>>>>>
>>>>> 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
>>>>> could be further added.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thx,
>>>>> Eric
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
>>>>>> good
>>>>>> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
>>>>>> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
>>>>>> sometimes)
>>>>>> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in
>>>>>>
>>>>> the
>>>
>>>> James jail server).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously
>>>>>>
>>>>> you
>>>>
>>>>> have to enable imap in that user).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>
>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>
>>>> **
>>>>>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>>>>>>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>>>>>>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> hard
>>>
>>>> to maintain in the long run).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>>>>>>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>>>>>>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>>>>>>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>>>>>>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>>>>>>> that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My cents ;).
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>****:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Manolo -
>>>>>>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>>>>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/****showcase-labs/ui/****
>>>>>>>> layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> suite
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> also
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> editor
>>>>
>>>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>>>>>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>>>>>>> http://code.google.com/p/****primefaces-extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>>>>>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> OUTLOOK
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> project i
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2,
>>>
>>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> commit
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> app
>>>>
>>>>> development. Please check this link -
>>>>>>>> https://community.jboss.org/****wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_***
>>>>>>>> *sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <
>>>
>>>> https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> configuration.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>>>>>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> primefaces?,
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> the
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> JEE
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> how
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> we
>>>>
>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Teknoloji
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> apache-2
>>>
>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> java
>>>>
>>>>> centric
>>>>>>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>
>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> apps
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> web.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> controlled
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> by
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use -
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> JSF
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2 -
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> import
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deadline
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mvp
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> features,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> that a
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> period,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deeper
>>>
>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me.
>>>
>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instead
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> face
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> new
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------**
>>>>>>>>>> ****--------------------------**--**
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --**---------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.******
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> apache.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/****dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo>
>>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**--**
>>>>>>> ---------
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org <se...@james.apache.org>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
>>> --**---------
>>>
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****apache.org<
>>>>>
>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.****org<
>>>>>
>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org <se...@james.apache.org>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Correo de Luis R. Slocker
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
> --
> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>
>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Eric Charles <er...@apache.org>.
Hi echo,
My sincerest condolences for your grandmother.
All the best,
Eric
On 04/21/2012 02:57 AM, echo wrote:
> I am sorry for not contacting with this channel, because my grandma got the
> lung cancer and passed away the other day. I am too sad to do anything
> until now.
> However, I pick up my spirits to continue the project and my life. Pls
> believe in me.
> Thank you.
>
> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Luis Slocker<sl...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Great!, Manolo, thank you very much.
>>
>> This new contribution is serving me a lot to get to understand the
>> architecture of Hupa, and to know where they fit the pieces of this
>> interesting puzzle.
>>
>> 2012/4/19 Manuel Carrasco Moñino<ma...@apache.org>
>>
>>> Hi Eric,
>>>
>>> Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use MVP
>>> and Command patterns.
>>> Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your
>> realize.
>>>
>>> - Server side
>>> Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser), we
>>> use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We
>> offer
>>> those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet, although
>> we
>>> could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
>>> client applications.
>>> The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
>>> caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
>>> So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the
>> imap-server
>>> and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
>>> far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
>>> attachments).
>>>
>>> I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
>>> should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
>>> mailboxes.
>>> Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
>>> imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible
>> that
>>> a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
>>>
>>> There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we just
>>> have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
>>> part.
>>>
>>> - Client side
>>> It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
>>> desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax to
>>> the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
>>>
>>> The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
>>> plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of
>> the
>>> full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring, coverage,
>>> javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
>>> dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
>>> programing because of java.
>>>
>>> The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter) with
>>> allows completely decouple the views from the client-application logic,
>> so
>>> as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
>>> dialog with the server).
>>> With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container so
>> as
>>> we can run integration tests very fast.
>>>
>>> Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is java,
>> we
>>> use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can use
>> the
>>> same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
>>> pattern).
>>>
>>> We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
>>> them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets
>> like
>>> gxt, smartgwt, etc.
>>>
>>> Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
>>> build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
>>> client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
>>> Hupa code.
>>> What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app to
>>> run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely javascript
>>> (apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
>>> that:
>>> 1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
>>> makes the work easier.
>>> 2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is also
>> a
>>> scala to js compiler)
>>> 3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
>>> javascript portions into html templates.
>>>
>>> Based in my experience,
>>> #1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good skills
>> in
>>> js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
>>> deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
>>> performance apps.
>>> #2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code wont
>> be
>>> run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
>>> will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
>>> #3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with some
>>> kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
>>> single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
>>> javascript.
>>>
>>>
>>> I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
>>>
>>> - Manolo
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles<er...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
>>>>
>>>> If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
>>>> contact management, authentication/authorization..**. (name any), we
>> can:
>>>>
>>>> 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
>>>> current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes
>>> fails
>>>> due to (I think) latency,...
>>>>
>>>> 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
>>>> could be further added.
>>>>
>>>> Thx,
>>>> Eric
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
>>>>> good
>>>>> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>>>>>
>>>>> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
>>>>> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
>>>>> sometimes)
>>>>> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in
>> the
>>>>> James jail server).
>>>>>
>>>>> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously
>>> you
>>>>> have to enable imap in that user).
>>>>>
>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>> **
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>>>>>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>>>>>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely
>> hard
>>>>>> to maintain in the long run).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>>>>>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>>>>>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>>>>>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>>>>>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>>>>>> that?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My cents ;).
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>**:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Manolo -
>>>>>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>>>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf<
>>> http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component
>> suite
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> also
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich
>>> editor
>>>>>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>>>>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>>>>>> http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/<
>>> http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>>>>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> OUTLOOK
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> project i
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF
>> 2,
>>>>>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> commit
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular
>>> app
>>>>>>> development. Please check this link -
>>>>>>> https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t
>> <
>>> https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style
>> configuration.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>>>>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of
>>> primefaces?,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is
>> the
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> JEE
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> which
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> how
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> too.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp,
>>> we
>>>>>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Teknoloji
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and
>> apache-2
>>>>>>>>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being
>>> java
>>>>>>>>>>> centric
>>>>>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested
>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich
>> apps
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along
>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> web.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> controlled
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> by
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use -
>> JSF
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 2 -
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> import
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> deadline
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> mvp
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> features,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> that a
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GSoC
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> period,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my
>> deeper
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to
>> me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instead
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> face
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> new
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> more.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
>>>>>> --**---------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> apache.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
>>>>>> ---------
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Correo de Luis R. Slocker
>>
>
>
>
--
eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by echo <ec...@gmail.com>.
I am sorry for not contacting with this channel, because my grandma got the
lung cancer and passed away the other day. I am too sad to do anything
until now.
However, I pick up my spirits to continue the project and my life. Pls
believe in me.
Thank you.
On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 10:58 PM, Luis Slocker <sl...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Great!, Manolo, thank you very much.
>
> This new contribution is serving me a lot to get to understand the
> architecture of Hupa, and to know where they fit the pieces of this
> interesting puzzle.
>
> 2012/4/19 Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>
>
> > Hi Eric,
> >
> > Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use MVP
> > and Command patterns.
> > Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your
> realize.
> >
> > - Server side
> > Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser), we
> > use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We
> offer
> > those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet, although
> we
> > could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
> > client applications.
> > The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
> > caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
> > So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the
> imap-server
> > and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
> > far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
> > attachments).
> >
> > I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
> > should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
> > mailboxes.
> > Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
> > imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible
> that
> > a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
> >
> > There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we just
> > have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
> > part.
> >
> > - Client side
> > It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
> > desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax to
> > the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
> >
> > The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
> > plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of
> the
> > full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring, coverage,
> > javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
> > dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
> > programing because of java.
> >
> > The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter) with
> > allows completely decouple the views from the client-application logic,
> so
> > as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
> > dialog with the server).
> > With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container so
> as
> > we can run integration tests very fast.
> >
> > Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is java,
> we
> > use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can use
> the
> > same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
> > pattern).
> >
> > We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
> > them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets
> like
> > gxt, smartgwt, etc.
> >
> > Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
> > build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
> > client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
> > Hupa code.
> > What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app to
> > run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely javascript
> > (apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
> > that:
> > 1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
> > makes the work easier.
> > 2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is also
> a
> > scala to js compiler)
> > 3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
> > javascript portions into html templates.
> >
> > Based in my experience,
> > #1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good skills
> in
> > js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
> > deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
> > performance apps.
> > #2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code wont
> be
> > run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
> > will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
> > #3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with some
> > kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
> > single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
> > javascript.
> >
> >
> > I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
> >
> > - Manolo
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles <er...@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> > > Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
> > >
> > > If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
> > > contact management, authentication/authorization..**. (name any), we
> can:
> > >
> > > 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
> > > current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes
> > fails
> > > due to (I think) latency,...
> > >
> > > 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
> > > could be further added.
> > >
> > > Thx,
> > > Eric
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
> > >
> > >> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
> > >> good
> > >> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
> > >>
> > >> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
> > >> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
> > >> sometimes)
> > >> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in
> the
> > >> James jail server).
> > >>
> > >> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously
> > you
> > >> have to enable imap in that user).
> > >>
> > >> - Manolo
> > >>
> > >> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> > >**
> > >> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
> > >>>
> > >>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
> > >>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
> > >>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely
> hard
> > >>> to maintain in the long run).
> > >>>
> > >>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
> > >>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
> > >>>
> > >>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
> > >>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
> > >>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
> > >>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
> > >>> that?
> > >>>
> > >>> My cents ;).
> > >>> Cheers,
> > >>>
> > >>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>**:
> > >>>
> > >>>> Manolo -
> > >>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
> > >>>> http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf<
> > http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component
> suite
> > >>>>
> > >>> also
> > >>>
> > >>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich
> > editor
> > >>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
> > >>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
> > >>>> http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/<
> > http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
> > >>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
> > >>>>
> > >>> OUTLOOK
> > >>>
> > >>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
> > >>>>
> > >>> project i
> > >>>
> > >>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF
> 2,
> > >>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
> > >>>>
> > >>> commit
> > >>>
> > >>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular
> > app
> > >>>> development. Please check this link -
> > >>>> https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t
> <
> > https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style
> configuration.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
> > >>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of
> > primefaces?,
> > >>>>>
> > >>>> or
> > >>>
> > >>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Thanks
> > >>>>> - Manolo
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
> > >>>>> wrote:
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is
> the
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>> JEE
> > >>>
> > >>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>> which
> > >>>
> > >>>> may help you get started very fast.
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> really
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> how
> > >>>
> > >>>> too.
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp,
> > we
> > >>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Primefaces
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> So my two cents
> > >>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
> > >>>>>>> -1 GWT
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Teknoloji
> > >>>
> > >>>> :)
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
> > >>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> -1 JSF2
> > >>>>>>>> +1 GWT
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and
> apache-2
> > >>>>>>>> licensed.
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being
> > java
> > >>>>>>>> centric
> > >>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> understand
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> the
> > >>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested
> > and
> > >>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich
> apps
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> with
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> gwt
> > >>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along
> the
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> web.
> > >>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>>>> - Manolo
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> wrote:
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> controlled
> > >>>
> > >>>> by
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> one
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> company.
> > >>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use -
> JSF
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> 2 -
> > >>>
> > >>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> wrote:
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> the
> > >>>
> > >>>> gwt-platform
> > >>>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> > >>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
> > >>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> import
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> the
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> other
> > >>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> gwt
> > >>>
> > >>>> itself.
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> I was
> > >>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> deadline
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> of
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
> > >>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> mvp
> > >>>
> > >>>> in
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> gwt
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> to
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> project
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> and
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> GWT
> > >>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> changing.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> features,
> > >>>
> > >>>> that a
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> current
> > >>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> GSoC
> > >>>
> > >>>> period,
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> but also
> > >>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> where
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> some
> > >>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my
> deeper
> > >>>>>>>>>>> discription after
> > >>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to
> me.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> instead
> > >>>
> > >>>> of
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> the
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> prefer
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> the
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> first option.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> face
> > >>>
> > >>>> new
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
> > >>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>> --
> > >>>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
> > >>>>>>>>>>> echo
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> more.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> Good
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> --
> > >>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
> > >>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
> > >>> --**---------
> > >>>
> > >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> apache.org
> > >>>
> > >>>> <
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> > >>>>>>>>> >
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> **org<
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> > >>>>>>>>> >
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> --
> > >>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > >>>>>>>>> >
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> --
> > >>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > >>>>>>> >
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> --
> > >>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > >>>>>> >
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> --
> > >>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > >>>>
> > >>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > >>>> >
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >>> Ioan Eugen Stan
> > >>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
> > >>>
> > >>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
> > >>> ---------
> > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > > --
> > > eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
> > >
> > >
> > >
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Correo de Luis R. Slocker
>
--
*echo*
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Luis Slocker <sl...@gmail.com>.
Great!, Manolo, thank you very much.
This new contribution is serving me a lot to get to understand the
architecture of Hupa, and to know where they fit the pieces of this
interesting puzzle.
2012/4/19 Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>
> Hi Eric,
>
> Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use MVP
> and Command patterns.
> Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your realize.
>
> - Server side
> Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser), we
> use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We offer
> those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet, although we
> could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
> client applications.
> The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
> caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
> So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the imap-server
> and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
> far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
> attachments).
>
> I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
> should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
> mailboxes.
> Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
> imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible that
> a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
>
> There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we just
> have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
> part.
>
> - Client side
> It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
> desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax to
> the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
>
> The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
> plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of the
> full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring, coverage,
> javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
> dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
> programing because of java.
>
> The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter) with
> allows completely decouple the views from the client-application logic, so
> as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
> dialog with the server).
> With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container so as
> we can run integration tests very fast.
>
> Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is java, we
> use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can use the
> same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
> pattern).
>
> We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
> them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets like
> gxt, smartgwt, etc.
>
> Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
> build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
> client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
> Hupa code.
> What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app to
> run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely javascript
> (apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
> that:
> 1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
> makes the work easier.
> 2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is also a
> scala to js compiler)
> 3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
> javascript portions into html templates.
>
> Based in my experience,
> #1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good skills in
> js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
> deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
> performance apps.
> #2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code wont be
> run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
> will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
> #3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with some
> kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
> single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
> javascript.
>
>
> I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
>
> - Manolo
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles <er...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> > Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
> >
> > If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
> > contact management, authentication/authorization..**. (name any), we can:
> >
> > 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
> > current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes
> fails
> > due to (I think) latency,...
> >
> > 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
> > could be further added.
> >
> > Thx,
> > Eric
> >
> >
> >
> > On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
> >
> >> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
> >> good
> >> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
> >>
> >> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
> >> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
> >> sometimes)
> >> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
> >> James jail server).
> >>
> >> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously
> you
> >> have to enable imap in that user).
> >>
> >> - Manolo
> >>
> >> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> >**
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
> >>>
> >>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
> >>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
> >>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
> >>> to maintain in the long run).
> >>>
> >>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
> >>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
> >>>
> >>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
> >>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
> >>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
> >>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
> >>> that?
> >>>
> >>> My cents ;).
> >>> Cheers,
> >>>
> >>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>**:
> >>>
> >>>> Manolo -
> >>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
> >>>> http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf<
> http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
> >>>>
> >>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite
> >>>>
> >>> also
> >>>
> >>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich
> editor
> >>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
> >>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
> >>>> http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/<
> http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
> >>>>
> >>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
> >>>>
> >>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
> >>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
> >>>>
> >>> OUTLOOK
> >>>
> >>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
> >>>>
> >>> project i
> >>>
> >>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
> >>>>
> >>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
> >>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
> >>>>
> >>> commit
> >>>
> >>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular
> app
> >>>> development. Please check this link -
> >>>> https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t<
> https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
> >>>>
> >>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
> >>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of
> primefaces?,
> >>>>>
> >>>> or
> >>>
> >>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Thanks
> >>>>> - Manolo
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> JEE
> >>>
> >>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> which
> >>>
> >>>> may help you get started very fast.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> really
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> how
> >>>
> >>>> too.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp,
> we
> >>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> Primefaces
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> So my two cents
> >>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
> >>>>>>> -1 GWT
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> Teknoloji
> >>>
> >>>> :)
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
> >>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> -1 JSF2
> >>>>>>>> +1 GWT
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
> >>>>>>>> licensed.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being
> java
> >>>>>>>> centric
> >>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> understand
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested
> and
> >>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> with
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> gwt
> >>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> web.
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>> - Manolo
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> controlled
> >>>
> >>>> by
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> one
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> company.
> >>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> 2 -
> >>>
> >>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
> >>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> the
> >>>
> >>>> gwt-platform
> >>>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> >>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
> >>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> import
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> other
> >>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> gwt
> >>>
> >>>> itself.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I was
> >>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> deadline
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> of
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
> >>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> mvp
> >>>
> >>>> in
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> gwt
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> to
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> project
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> GWT
> >>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> changing.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> features,
> >>>
> >>>> that a
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> current
> >>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> GSoC
> >>>
> >>>> period,
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> but also
> >>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> where
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> some
> >>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
> >>>>>>>>>>> discription after
> >>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> >>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> instead
> >>>
> >>>> of
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> prefer
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> first option.
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> face
> >>>
> >>>> new
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
> >>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
> >>>>>>>>>>> echo
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> more.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Good
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
> >>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
> >>> --**---------
> >>>
> >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> apache.org
> >>>
> >>>> <
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> >>>>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> **org<
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
> server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> >>>>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >>>>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >>>>>> >
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >>>>
> >>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >>>> >
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Ioan Eugen Stan
> >>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
> >>>
> >>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
> >>> ---------
> >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> >>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
> server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> > --
> > eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
> server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> >
> >
>
--
Correo de Luis R. Slocker
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
Hi Eric,
Actually hupa has everything decoupled, this is the reason why we use MVP
and Command patterns.
Let me explain how hupa is designed, and why the imap latency your realize.
- Server side
Everything in server-side is agnostic about the client-side (browser), we
use handlers for each service and they are very well unit tested. We offer
those services via ajax, rigth now with a gwt-dispatch servlet, although we
could easily add other servlets to allow rpc via ajax (json) for non-gwt
client applications.
The main problem now in the server side is that we are not doing imap
caching nor we access directly to the mailbox.
So each time a user interacts with the ui, hupa have to ask the imap-server
and download headers or messages just in case (this is very expensive in
far-off imap servers like gmail, large inboxes or messages with
attachments).
I have in mind to use directly the james mailbox instead of imap, this
should increase considerably the performance like gmail does with
mailboxes.
Even we could have a mailbox implementation in James which could be an
imap/pop client (something like fetchmail) and it should be feasible that
a user in James could configure other mail sources (like gmail does)
There are many things to do in the server side though, think that we just
have coded a simple imap client so as we could develop faster the visual
part.
- Client side
It is gwt, so everything is converted into javascript resulting a pure
desktop-like app made with javascript which requests services via ajax to
the server. Note that we don't have any jsp parser not html generator.
The goal of using gwt is that instead of coding in javascript (jquery +
plugins + widgets etc) we code in Java, so as we can take advantage of the
full java ecosystem: first we have a featured IDE (refactoring, coverage,
javadoc...), second a way to decouple code modules using libs and maven
dependencies, and finally we can use real patterns and object oriented
programing because of java.
The main pattern we use in client side is MVP (model-view-presenter) with
allows completely decouple the views from the client-application logic, so
as we can mock the view and test every single method (including the ajax
dialog with the server).
With this pattern, testing does not need to start a servlet container so as
we can run integration tests very fast.
Instead of using ajax json or xml, and because the server side is java, we
use a special ajax serialization which comes with gwt, so as we can use the
same objects in both server and client sides (here we use the command
pattern).
We have a set of very simple views styled with css, but we could enrich
them very easily either using css3 or replacing with more rich widgets like
gxt, smartgwt, etc.
Of course, like you say, we could replace gwt by any other approach to
build a web application, in this case the only reusable part is the imap
client in the server part. But this is a very small part of the all the
Hupa code.
What we pretended with hupa is to develop a very rich desktop-like app to
run in the browser, the only way to do that is using profusely javascript
(apart from java applets, flash, etc). There are many technologies to do
that:
1.- codding javascript by hand (you have js libraries like jquery with
makes the work easier.
2.- using java and converting it to js using gwt-compiler (there is also a
scala to js compiler)
3.- using frameworks like jsf-2, rails, grails, lift, etc which injects
javascript portions into html templates.
Based in my experience,
#1 You have full control over the generated js, but you need good skills in
js (most people who uses js tend to copy pieces from here and there) and
deep knowledge of obfuscation and compression js tools to produce good
performance apps.
#2 There is a learning curve to understand well that your java code wont be
run in a jvm but in a browser, but the IDE helps a lot and gwt-compiler
will take care of generating good quality js (optimized, reduced, etc).
#3 It's very good for traditional apps based on a page per view with some
kind of ajax to update, edit, etc. But when you want a
single-page-application, sooner than later you have to deal with
javascript.
I hope this clarifies a bit the architecture or Hupa.
- Manolo
On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 5:50 AM, Eric Charles <er...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
>
> If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
> contact management, authentication/authorization..**. (name any), we can:
>
> 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
> current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes fails
> due to (I think) latency,...
>
> 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
> could be further added.
>
> Thx,
> Eric
>
>
>
> On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>
>> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
>> good
>> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>>
>> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
>> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
>> sometimes)
>> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
>> James jail server).
>>
>> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously you
>> have to enable imap in that user).
>>
>> - Manolo
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<st...@gmail.com>**
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>>
>>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
>>> to maintain in the long run).
>>>
>>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>>
>>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>>> that?
>>>
>>> My cents ;).
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>**:
>>>
>>>> Manolo -
>>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>
>>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite
>>>>
>>> also
>>>
>>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich editor
>>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>>> http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>
>>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>>
>>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>>>>
>>> OUTLOOK
>>>
>>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>>>>
>>> project i
>>>
>>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>>
>>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
>>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>>>>
>>> commit
>>>
>>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular app
>>>> development. Please check this link -
>>>> https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
>>>>
>>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?,
>>>>>
>>>> or
>>>
>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
>>>>>>
>>>>> JEE
>>>
>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>>>>>>
>>>>> which
>>>
>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> really
>>>>>
>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> how
>>>
>>>> too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
>>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Teknoloji
>>>
>>>> :)
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>>>>>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
>>>>>>>> centric
>>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
>>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>
>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> web.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> controlled
>>>
>>>> by
>>>>>
>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 2 -
>>>
>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>
>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> import
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>
>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> deadline
>>>>>
>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> mvp
>>>
>>>> in
>>>>>
>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>
>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> features,
>>>
>>>> that a
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> GSoC
>>>
>>>> period,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>
>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>>>>>>>>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> instead
>>>
>>>> of
>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> face
>>>
>>>> new
>>>>>
>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> more.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
>>> --**---------
>>>
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> apache.org
>>>
>>>> <
>>>>>
>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>
>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>>
>>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
>>> ---------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> --
> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>
>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>
>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>.
Looks good!!!
On Thu, Apr 19, 2012 at 9:20 AM, Eric Charles <er...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
>
> If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
> contact management, authentication/authorization..**. (name any), we can:
>
> 1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
> current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes fails
> due to (I think) latency,...
>
> 2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
> could be further added.
>
> Thx,
> Eric
>
>
>
> On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>
>> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a
>> good
>> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>>
>> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
>> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
>> sometimes)
>> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
>> James jail server).
>>
>> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously you
>> have to enable imap in that user).
>>
>> - Manolo
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<st...@gmail.com>**
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>>
>>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
>>> to maintain in the long run).
>>>
>>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>>
>>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>>> that?
>>>
>>> My cents ;).
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>**:
>>>
>>>> Manolo -
>>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>>> http://www.primefaces.org/**showcase-labs/ui/**layoutMailbox.jsf<http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf>
>>>>
>>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite
>>>>
>>> also
>>>
>>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich editor
>>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>>> http://code.google.com/p/**primefaces-extensions/<http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/>
>>>>
>>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>>
>>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>>>>
>>> OUTLOOK
>>>
>>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>>>>
>>> project i
>>>
>>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>>
>>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
>>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>>>>
>>> commit
>>>
>>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular app
>>>> development. Please check this link -
>>>> https://community.jboss.org/**wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_**sscc=t<https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t>
>>>>
>>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?,
>>>>>
>>>> or
>>>
>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
>>>>>>
>>>>> JEE
>>>
>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>>>>>>
>>>>> which
>>>
>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> really
>>>>>
>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> how
>>>
>>>> too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
>>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Teknoloji
>>>
>>>> :)
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>>>>>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
>>>>>>>> centric
>>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> understand
>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
>>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>
>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> web.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> controlled
>>>
>>>> by
>>>>>
>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 2 -
>>>
>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>
>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> import
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> gwt
>>>
>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> deadline
>>>>>
>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> mvp
>>>
>>>> in
>>>>>
>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> project
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> changing.
>>>>>
>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> features,
>>>
>>>> that a
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> GSoC
>>>
>>>> period,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>
>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>>>>>>>>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> instead
>>>
>>>> of
>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> prefer
>>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> face
>>>
>>>> new
>>>>>
>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> more.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------****----------------------------**
>>> --**---------
>>>
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.****
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> apache.org
>>>
>>>> <
>>>>>
>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>
>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/**dhrubo<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>>
>>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
>>> ---------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
> --
> eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
>
>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>
>
--
Kind Regards... Dhrubo
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Eric Charles <er...@apache.org>.
Hupa should also focus to decouple the 'services' from the 'ui'.
If we have independent services for efficient IMAP mailbox read/write,
contact management, authentication/authorization... (name any), we can:
1.- Focus on those libraries without the ui concern - for example, my
current experience with hupa is that the mailboxes reading sometimes
fails due to (I think) latency,...
2.- Put any ui on top, GWT being the first developed, but any other one
could be further added.
Thx,
Eric
On 04/18/2012 05:20 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
> I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a good
> selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
>
> You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
> http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
> sometimes)
> http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
> James jail server).
>
> In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously you
> have to enable imap in that user).
>
> - Manolo
>
> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<st...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>>
>> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
>> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
>> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
>> to maintain in the long run).
>>
>> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
>> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>>
>> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
>> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
>> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
>> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
>> that?
>>
>> My cents ;).
>> Cheers,
>>
>> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>:
>>> Manolo -
>>> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
>>> http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf
>>>
>>> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite
>> also
>>> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich editor
>>> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
>>> The extensions project is hosted here -
>>> http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/
>>>
>>> They also have their entire showcase online.
>>>
>>> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
>>> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
>> OUTLOOK
>>> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
>> project i
>>> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>>>
>>> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
>>> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
>> commit
>>> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular app
>>> development. Please check this link -
>>> https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t
>>>
>>> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
>>> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?,
>> or
>>>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>> - Manolo
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
>> JEE
>>>>> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
>> which
>>>>> may help you get started very fast.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>>>> really
>>>>>> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
>> how
>>>>> too.
>>>>>> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
>>>>>> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>>>>> Primefaces
>>>>>> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So my two cents
>>>>>> +1 Primefaces
>>>>>> -1 GWT
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
>> Teknoloji
>>>> :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino<
>>>>>> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -1 JSF2
>>>>>>> +1 GWT
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>>>>>>> licensed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
>>>>>>> centric
>>>>>>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>>>> understand
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
>>>>>>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
>>>> with
>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
>> web.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo<dh...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
>> controlled
>>>> by
>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>> company.
>>>>>>>> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
>> 2 -
>>>>>>>> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan<
>>>>> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Manolo
>>>>>>>>>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
>> the
>>>>>>>>>> gwt-platform
>>>>>>>>>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>>>>>>>>>> state(gwt-presenter).
>>>>>>>>>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>>>>> import
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
>> gwt
>>>>>>> itself.
>>>>>>>>>> I was
>>>>>>>>>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>>>> deadline
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>> GSoC, so
>>>>>>>>>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
>> mvp
>>>> in
>>>>>>> gwt
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>>>>> project
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>> GWT
>>>>>>>>>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>>>> changing.
>>>>>>>>>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
>> features,
>>>>>>> that a
>>>>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>>>>> email client should have, as possible not only during the
>> GSoC
>>>>>>> period,
>>>>>>>>>> but also
>>>>>>>>>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>>>> JIRA,
>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>>>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>>>>>>>>>> discription after
>>>>>>>>>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot :)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Wish you a happy
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Echo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>>>>>>>>>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
>> instead
>>>> of
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>>>> prefer
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> first option.
>>>>>>>>>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
>> face
>>>> new
>>>>>>>>>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>>>>>>> - Manolo
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>>>>>> echo
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hello Echo,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>>>> more.
>>>>>>> Good
>>>>>>>>> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cheers.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>>>>>>>>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**
>> apache.org
>>>> <
>>>>>>>> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>>>>> **org<
>>>>>>>> server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>>>
>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>>>
>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ioan Eugen Stan
>> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.org
>>
>>
>
--
eric | http://about.echarles.net | @echarles
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Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
I've been taking a look to the demo, it looks pretty nice because of a good
selection of css, I'll deep into the code when I had a while.
You can see Hupa in action in either servers:
http://hupa.alcala.org (it's a shared server I use, it could be down
sometimes)
http://james.zones.apache.org (it's a recent instance deployed in the
James jail server).
In order to use hupa you have to login with any gmail user (previously you
have to enable imap in that user).
- Manolo
On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <st...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
>
> I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
> he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
> and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
> to maintain in the long run).
>
> As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
> wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
>
> MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
> know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
> and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
> like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
> that?
>
> My cents ;).
> Cheers,
>
> 2012/4/18 Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>:
> > Manolo -
> > Primefaces Mailbox template ---
> > http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf
> >
> > Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite
> also
> > you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich editor
> > support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
> > The extensions project is hosted here -
> > http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/
> >
> > They also have their entire showcase online.
> >
> > Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
> > (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS
> OUTLOOK
> > or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead
> project i
> > guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
> >
> > Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
> > Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a
> commit
> > privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular app
> > development. Please check this link -
> > https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t
> >
> > This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
> > <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
> >
> >> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?,
> or
> >> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >> - Manolo
> >>
> >> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> > I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the
> JEE
> >> > standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
> which
> >> > may help you get started very fast.
> >> >
> >> > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
> >> really
> >> > > need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know
> how
> >> > too.
> >> > > Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
> >> > >
> >> > > James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
> >> > > should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
> >> > Primefaces
> >> > > which is excellent documented highly active community.
> >> > >
> >> > > So my two cents
> >> > > +1 Primefaces
> >> > > -1 GWT
> >> > >
> >> > > Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime
> Teknoloji
> >> :)
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino <
> >> > > manolo@apache.org> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > >> -1 JSF2
> >> > >> +1 GWT
> >> > >>
> >> > >> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
> >> > >> licensed.
> >> > >>
> >> > >> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
> >> > >> centric
> >> > >> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
> >> understand
> >> > >> the
> >> > >> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
> >> > >> javadoc-ed in all its components.
> >> > >>
> >> > >> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
> >> with
> >> > >> gwt
> >> > >> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
> web.
> >> > >>
> >> > >> - Manolo
> >> > >>
> >> > >> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> > >>
> >> > >> > I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
> controlled
> >> by
> >> > >> one
> >> > >> > company.
> >> > >> > Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
> 2 -
> >> > >> > Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <
> >> > stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> >> > >> > >wrote:
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > > Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> >> > >> > >
> >> > >> > >> Hi Manolo
> >> > >> > >> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
> the
> >> > >> > >> gwt-platform
> >> > >> > >> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> >> > >> > >> state(gwt-presenter).
> >> > >> > >> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
> >> > import
> >> > >> the
> >> > >> > >> other
> >> > >> > >> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
> gwt
> >> > >> itself.
> >> > >> > >> I was
> >> > >> > >> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
> >> deadline
> >> > >> of
> >> > >> > >> GSoC, so
> >> > >> > >> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
> mvp
> >> in
> >> > >> gwt
> >> > >> > to
> >> > >> > >> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
> >> > project
> >> > >> > and
> >> > >> > >> GWT
> >> > >> > >> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
> >> changing.
> >> > >> > >> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
> features,
> >> > >> that a
> >> > >> > >> current
> >> > >> > >> email client should have, as possible not only during the
> GSoC
> >> > >> period,
> >> > >> > >> but also
> >> > >> > >> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
> >> JIRA,
> >> > >> where
> >> > >> > >> some
> >> > >> > >> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
> >> > >> > >> discription after
> >> > >> > >> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> >> > >> > >> Thanks a lot :)
> >> > >> > >>
> >> > >> > >>
> >> > >> > >> Wish you a happy
> >> > >> > >>
> >> > >> > >> Hi Echo
> >> > >> > >>>
> >> > >> > >>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> >> > >> > >>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
> instead
> >> of
> >> > >> the
> >> > >> > >>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
> >> prefer
> >> > >> the
> >> > >> > >>> first option.
> >> > >> > >>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to
> face
> >> new
> >> > >> > >>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
> >> > >> > >>>
> >> > >> > >>> Cheers
> >> > >> > >>> - Manolo
> >> > >> > >>>
> >> > >> > >>> --
> >> > >> > >> cheers,
> >> > >> > >> echo
> >> > >> > >>
> >> > >> > >>
> >> > >> > > Hello Echo,
> >> > >> > >
> >> > >> > > Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
> >> more.
> >> > >> Good
> >> > >> > > luck with your research and send us the findings.
> >> > >> > >
> >> > >> > > Cheers.
> >> > >> > >
> >> > >> > > --
> >> > >> > > Ioan Eugen Stan
> >> > >> > > http://ieugen.blogspot.com
> >> > >> > >
> >> > >> > >
> >> > >>
> >> >
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> >> > >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**
> apache.org
> >> <
> >> > >> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> >> > >> > > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
> >> > **org<
> >> > >> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> >> > >> > >
> >> > >> > >
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > --
> >> > >> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >> > >> >
> >> > >> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >> > >> >
> >> > >>
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > --
> >> > > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >> > >
> >> > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >> >
> >> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >
> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>
>
>
> --
> Ioan Eugen Stan
> http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.org
>
>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Ioan Eugen Stan <st...@gmail.com>.
Hi Dhurbo, Manolo,
I think the developer doing the work should choose whatever platform
he is most comfortable with. Good code has to come out of his hands
and comfort aids that. Having both with be great (but most likely hard
to maintain in the long run).
As a user I would like to see something usable that looks nice. I
wouldn't care if it where implemented in a specific platform.
MyFaces mailbox demo looks very nice. I haven't checked Hupa demo (I
know Manolo has one installed, but I don't have a gmail test account
and I didn't see any SSL), maybe we should have a mocked HUPA install
like MyFaces one available online. I wonder what it will take to do
that?
My cents ;).
Cheers,
2012/4/18 Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>:
> Manolo -
> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
> http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf
>
> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite also
> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich editor
> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
> The extensions project is hosted here -
> http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/
>
> They also have their entire showcase online.
>
> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS OUTLOOK
> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead project i
> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>
> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a commit
> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular app
> development. Please check this link -
> https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t
>
> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>
>> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?, or
>> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>>
>> Thanks
>> - Manolo
>>
>> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the JEE
>> > standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail which
>> > may help you get started very fast.
>> >
>> > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
>> really
>> > > need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know how
>> > too.
>> > > Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>> > >
>> > > James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
>> > > should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
>> > Primefaces
>> > > which is excellent documented highly active community.
>> > >
>> > > So my two cents
>> > > +1 Primefaces
>> > > -1 GWT
>> > >
>> > > Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime Teknoloji
>> :)
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino <
>> > > manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >> -1 JSF2
>> > >> +1 GWT
>> > >>
>> > >> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>> > >> licensed.
>> > >>
>> > >> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
>> > >> centric
>> > >> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
>> understand
>> > >> the
>> > >> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
>> > >> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>> > >>
>> > >> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
>> with
>> > >> gwt
>> > >> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the web.
>> > >>
>> > >> - Manolo
>> > >>
>> > >> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> > I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly controlled
>> by
>> > >> one
>> > >> > company.
>> > >> > Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF 2 -
>> > >> > Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>> > >> >
>> > >> > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <
>> > stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>> > >> > >wrote:
>> > >> >
>> > >> > > Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >> Hi Manolo
>> > >> > >> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
>> > >> > >> gwt-platform
>> > >> > >> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>> > >> > >> state(gwt-presenter).
>> > >> > >> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
>> > import
>> > >> the
>> > >> > >> other
>> > >> > >> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by gwt
>> > >> itself.
>> > >> > >> I was
>> > >> > >> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
>> deadline
>> > >> of
>> > >> > >> GSoC, so
>> > >> > >> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core mvp
>> in
>> > >> gwt
>> > >> > to
>> > >> > >> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
>> > project
>> > >> > and
>> > >> > >> GWT
>> > >> > >> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
>> changing.
>> > >> > >> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features,
>> > >> that a
>> > >> > >> current
>> > >> > >> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC
>> > >> period,
>> > >> > >> but also
>> > >> > >> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
>> JIRA,
>> > >> where
>> > >> > >> some
>> > >> > >> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>> > >> > >> discription after
>> > >> > >> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>> > >> > >> Thanks a lot :)
>> > >> > >>
>> > >> > >>
>> > >> > >> Wish you a happy
>> > >> > >>
>> > >> > >> Hi Echo
>> > >> > >>>
>> > >> > >>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>> > >> > >>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead
>> of
>> > >> the
>> > >> > >>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
>> prefer
>> > >> the
>> > >> > >>> first option.
>> > >> > >>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face
>> new
>> > >> > >>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>> > >> > >>>
>> > >> > >>> Cheers
>> > >> > >>> - Manolo
>> > >> > >>>
>> > >> > >>> --
>> > >> > >> cheers,
>> > >> > >> echo
>> > >> > >>
>> > >> > >>
>> > >> > > Hello Echo,
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
>> more.
>> > >> Good
>> > >> > > luck with your research and send us the findings.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > Cheers.
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > > --
>> > >> > > Ioan Eugen Stan
>> > >> > > http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >>
>> > ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
>> > >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org
>> <
>> > >> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
>> > >> > > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
>> > **org<
>> > >> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
>> > >> > >
>> > >> > >
>> > >> >
>> > >> >
>> > >> > --
>> > >> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>> > >> >
>> > >> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>> > >> >
>> > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>> > >
>> > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>> >
>> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>> >
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>
> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
--
Ioan Eugen Stan
http://ieugen.blogspot.com/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
Dhrubo,
More helpful info about gwt.
On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:24 PM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Manolo -
> Primefaces Mailbox template ---
> http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf
>
Gwt guys have an example of a Mail application as a start-point as well (we
did not use it at the beginning of hupa though)
http://gwt.google.com/samples/Mail/Mail.html
>
> Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite also
> you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich editor
> support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
> The extensions project is hosted here -
> http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/
>
> They also have their entire showcase online.
>
Gwt show-case (it is fully customizable using just a well documented css
api)
http://gwt.google.com/samples/Showcase/Showcase.html#!CwCellList
Of course, out of the core there are several widgets, suites and libs
available.
>
> Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
> (hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS OUTLOOK
> or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead project i
> guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
>
> Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
> Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a commit
> privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular app
> development. Please check this link -
> https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t
>
> This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
>
Hupa already is packaged with jetty, so it could be run in any desktop with
java, using a browser or even xul.
Hupa works out-of-the-box in mobile devices (try access with a mobile or
tablet to the demmoing instances), and because gwt is pure js, it should be
easy to convert in a mobile native app using phonegap (now apache cordova).
- Manolo
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
> <ma...@apache.org>wrote:
>
> > Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?,
> or
> > is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
> >
> > Thanks
> > - Manolo
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the JEE
> > > standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail
> which
> > > may help you get started very fast.
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > > These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
> > really
> > > > need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know how
> > > too.
> > > > Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
> > > >
> > > > James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
> > > > should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
> > > Primefaces
> > > > which is excellent documented highly active community.
> > > >
> > > > So my two cents
> > > > +1 Primefaces
> > > > -1 GWT
> > > >
> > > > Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime Teknoloji
> > :)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino <
> > > > manolo@apache.org> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> -1 JSF2
> > > >> +1 GWT
> > > >>
> > > >> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
> > > >> licensed.
> > > >>
> > > >> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
> > > >> centric
> > > >> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
> > understand
> > > >> the
> > > >> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
> > > >> javadoc-ed in all its components.
> > > >>
> > > >> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
> > with
> > > >> gwt
> > > >> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the
> web.
> > > >>
> > > >> - Manolo
> > > >>
> > > >> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> > I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly
> controlled
> > by
> > > >> one
> > > >> > company.
> > > >> > Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF
> 2 -
> > > >> > Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
> > > >> >
> > > >> > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <
> > > stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> > > >> > >wrote:
> > > >> >
> > > >> > > Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >> Hi Manolo
> > > >> > >> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose
> the
> > > >> > >> gwt-platform
> > > >> > >> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> > > >> > >> state(gwt-presenter).
> > > >> > >> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
> > > import
> > > >> the
> > > >> > >> other
> > > >> > >> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by
> gwt
> > > >> itself.
> > > >> > >> I was
> > > >> > >> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
> > deadline
> > > >> of
> > > >> > >> GSoC, so
> > > >> > >> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core
> mvp
> > in
> > > >> gwt
> > > >> > to
> > > >> > >> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
> > > project
> > > >> > and
> > > >> > >> GWT
> > > >> > >> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
> > changing.
> > > >> > >> To the new features, I would like to implement as many
> features,
> > > >> that a
> > > >> > >> current
> > > >> > >> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC
> > > >> period,
> > > >> > >> but also
> > > >> > >> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
> > JIRA,
> > > >> where
> > > >> > >> some
> > > >> > >> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
> > > >> > >> discription after
> > > >> > >> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> > > >> > >> Thanks a lot :)
> > > >> > >>
> > > >> > >>
> > > >> > >> Wish you a happy
> > > >> > >>
> > > >> > >> Hi Echo
> > > >> > >>>
> > > >> > >>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> > > >> > >>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform
> instead
> > of
> > > >> the
> > > >> > >>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
> > prefer
> > > >> the
> > > >> > >>> first option.
> > > >> > >>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face
> > new
> > > >> > >>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
> > > >> > >>>
> > > >> > >>> Cheers
> > > >> > >>> - Manolo
> > > >> > >>>
> > > >> > >>> --
> > > >> > >> cheers,
> > > >> > >> echo
> > > >> > >>
> > > >> > >>
> > > >> > > Hello Echo,
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
> > more.
> > > >> Good
> > > >> > > luck with your research and send us the findings.
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > Cheers.
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > --
> > > >> > > Ioan Eugen Stan
> > > >> > > http://ieugen.blogspot.com
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >
> > > >>
> > >
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> > > >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**
> apache.org
> > <
> > > >> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> > > >> > > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
> > > **org<
> > > >> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > --
> > > >> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > > >> >
> > > >> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > > >> >
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > > >
> > > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > >
> > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>
> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>.
Manolo -
Primefaces Mailbox template ---
http://www.primefaces.org/showcase-labs/ui/layoutMailbox.jsf
Its basic but good starting point. They have very rich component suite also
you can look into Primefaces extensions for more layouts and Rich editor
support besides what is provided by Primefaces itself.
The extensions project is hosted here -
http://code.google.com/p/primefaces-extensions/
They also have their entire showcase online.
Slight deviation - following the principles of Zimbra we can easily
(hopefully) we can turn this webmail app into a desktop app like MS OUTLOOK
or Thunderbird by embeding Jetty with Mozilla Prism (is it a dead project i
guess) or some kind of XULRunner.
Also I am available for any consultancy or help on Primefaces, JSF 2,
Spring. I can also do lot of development as well provided I have a commit
privilege on SVN :) . One big advantage I see using JSF 2 is modular app
development. Please check this link -
https://community.jboss.org/wiki/ModularWebAppsWithJSF2?_sscc=t
This can be further extended with Spring and Ant style configuration.
On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 3:37 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
<ma...@apache.org>wrote:
> Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?, or
> is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
>
> Thanks
> - Manolo
>
> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the JEE
> > standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail which
> > may help you get started very fast.
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not
> really
> > > need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know how
> > too.
> > > Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
> > >
> > > James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
> > > should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
> > Primefaces
> > > which is excellent documented highly active community.
> > >
> > > So my two cents
> > > +1 Primefaces
> > > -1 GWT
> > >
> > > Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime Teknoloji
> :)
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino <
> > > manolo@apache.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >> -1 JSF2
> > >> +1 GWT
> > >>
> > >> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
> > >> licensed.
> > >>
> > >> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
> > >> centric
> > >> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to
> understand
> > >> the
> > >> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
> > >> javadoc-ed in all its components.
> > >>
> > >> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps
> with
> > >> gwt
> > >> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the web.
> > >>
> > >> - Manolo
> > >>
> > >> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly controlled
> by
> > >> one
> > >> > company.
> > >> > Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF 2 -
> > >> > Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
> > >> >
> > >> > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <
> > stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> > >> > >wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > > Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> > >> > >
> > >> > >> Hi Manolo
> > >> > >> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
> > >> > >> gwt-platform
> > >> > >> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> > >> > >> state(gwt-presenter).
> > >> > >> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
> > import
> > >> the
> > >> > >> other
> > >> > >> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by gwt
> > >> itself.
> > >> > >> I was
> > >> > >> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the
> deadline
> > >> of
> > >> > >> GSoC, so
> > >> > >> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core mvp
> in
> > >> gwt
> > >> > to
> > >> > >> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
> > project
> > >> > and
> > >> > >> GWT
> > >> > >> technology and later on I want to show you something I am
> changing.
> > >> > >> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features,
> > >> that a
> > >> > >> current
> > >> > >> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC
> > >> period,
> > >> > >> but also
> > >> > >> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's
> JIRA,
> > >> where
> > >> > >> some
> > >> > >> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
> > >> > >> discription after
> > >> > >> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> > >> > >> Thanks a lot :)
> > >> > >>
> > >> > >>
> > >> > >> Wish you a happy
> > >> > >>
> > >> > >> Hi Echo
> > >> > >>>
> > >> > >>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> > >> > >>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead
> of
> > >> the
> > >> > >>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you
> prefer
> > >> the
> > >> > >>> first option.
> > >> > >>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face
> new
> > >> > >>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
> > >> > >>>
> > >> > >>> Cheers
> > >> > >>> - Manolo
> > >> > >>>
> > >> > >>> --
> > >> > >> cheers,
> > >> > >> echo
> > >> > >>
> > >> > >>
> > >> > > Hello Echo,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know
> more.
> > >> Good
> > >> > > luck with your research and send us the findings.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Cheers.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > --
> > >> > > Ioan Eugen Stan
> > >> > > http://ieugen.blogspot.com
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >>
> > ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> > >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org
> <
> > >> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> > >> > > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
> > **org<
> > >> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > --
> > >> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > >> >
> > >> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> > >
> > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >
> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >
>
--
Kind Regards... Dhrubo
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
Dhrubo, Is there a site running the the webmail example of primefaces?, or
is there a way to download the .war file?, I'd like to take a look.
Thanks
- Manolo
On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 9:41 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the JEE
> standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail which
> may help you get started very fast.
>
> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not really
> > need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know how
> too.
> > Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
> >
> > James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
> > should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in
> Primefaces
> > which is excellent documented highly active community.
> >
> > So my two cents
> > +1 Primefaces
> > -1 GWT
> >
> > Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime Teknoloji :)
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino <
> > manolo@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> >> -1 JSF2
> >> +1 GWT
> >>
> >> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
> >> licensed.
> >>
> >> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
> >> centric
> >> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to understand
> >> the
> >> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
> >> javadoc-ed in all its components.
> >>
> >> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps with
> >> gwt
> >> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the web.
> >>
> >> - Manolo
> >>
> >> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> > I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly controlled by
> >> one
> >> > company.
> >> > Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF 2 -
> >> > Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
> >> >
> >> > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <
> stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> >> > >wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> >> > >
> >> > >> Hi Manolo
> >> > >> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
> >> > >> gwt-platform
> >> > >> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> >> > >> state(gwt-presenter).
> >> > >> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will
> import
> >> the
> >> > >> other
> >> > >> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by gwt
> >> itself.
> >> > >> I was
> >> > >> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the deadline
> >> of
> >> > >> GSoC, so
> >> > >> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core mvp in
> >> gwt
> >> > to
> >> > >> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa
> project
> >> > and
> >> > >> GWT
> >> > >> technology and later on I want to show you something I am changing.
> >> > >> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features,
> >> that a
> >> > >> current
> >> > >> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC
> >> period,
> >> > >> but also
> >> > >> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's JIRA,
> >> where
> >> > >> some
> >> > >> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
> >> > >> discription after
> >> > >> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> >> > >> Thanks a lot :)
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> > >> Wish you a happy
> >> > >>
> >> > >> Hi Echo
> >> > >>>
> >> > >>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> >> > >>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of
> >> the
> >> > >>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer
> >> the
> >> > >>> first option.
> >> > >>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
> >> > >>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
> >> > >>>
> >> > >>> Cheers
> >> > >>> - Manolo
> >> > >>>
> >> > >>> --
> >> > >> cheers,
> >> > >> echo
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> > > Hello Echo,
> >> > >
> >> > > Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know more.
> >> Good
> >> > > luck with your research and send us the findings.
> >> > >
> >> > > Cheers.
> >> > >
> >> > > --
> >> > > Ioan Eugen Stan
> >> > > http://ieugen.blogspot.com
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> >> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> >> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> >> > > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.
> **org<
> >> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > --
> >> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >> >
> >> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >
> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>
> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>.
I do not intend to launch a debate on GWT v JSF 2. But JSF 2 is the JEE
standard for UI and Primefaces comes with sample layout for webmail which
may help you get started very fast.
On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not really
> need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know how too.
> Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
>
> James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we
> should use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in Primefaces
> which is excellent documented highly active community.
>
> So my two cents
> +1 Primefaces
> -1 GWT
>
> Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime Teknoloji :)
>
>
> On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino <
> manolo@apache.org> wrote:
>
>> -1 JSF2
>> +1 GWT
>>
>> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2
>> licensed.
>>
>> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java
>> centric
>> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to understand
>> the
>> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
>> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>>
>> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps with
>> gwt
>> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the web.
>>
>> - Manolo
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly controlled by
>> one
>> > company.
>> > Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF 2 -
>> > Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>> >
>> > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <stan.ieugen@gmail.com
>> > >wrote:
>> >
>> > > Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>> > >
>> > >> Hi Manolo
>> > >> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
>> > >> gwt-platform
>> > >> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>> > >> state(gwt-presenter).
>> > >> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will import
>> the
>> > >> other
>> > >> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by gwt
>> itself.
>> > >> I was
>> > >> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the deadline
>> of
>> > >> GSoC, so
>> > >> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core mvp in
>> gwt
>> > to
>> > >> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa project
>> > and
>> > >> GWT
>> > >> technology and later on I want to show you something I am changing.
>> > >> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features,
>> that a
>> > >> current
>> > >> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC
>> period,
>> > >> but also
>> > >> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's JIRA,
>> where
>> > >> some
>> > >> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>> > >> discription after
>> > >> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>> > >> Thanks a lot :)
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> Wish you a happy
>> > >>
>> > >> Hi Echo
>> > >>>
>> > >>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>> > >>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of
>> the
>> > >>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer
>> the
>> > >>> first option.
>> > >>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
>> > >>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Cheers
>> > >>> - Manolo
>> > >>>
>> > >>> --
>> > >> cheers,
>> > >> echo
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > > Hello Echo,
>> > >
>> > > Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know more.
>> Good
>> > > luck with your research and send us the findings.
>> > >
>> > > Cheers.
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > Ioan Eugen Stan
>> > > http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>> > >
>> > >
>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
>> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
>> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
>> > > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
>> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>> >
>> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>> >
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>
> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>
--
Kind Regards... Dhrubo
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>.
These days with JSF 2 frameworks like Primefaces et all we do not really
need any js , ajax is out of the box and we need little html know how too.
Also they come with more than standard layouts and theme support.
James being an Apache product and Apache also develops JSF 2 imp, we should
use JSF 2 with easiest and huge set of components like in Primefaces which
is excellent documented highly active community.
So my two cents
+1 Primefaces
-1 GWT
Please note I have no affiliation or neither work for Prime Teknoloji :)
On Wed, Apr 18, 2012 at 12:29 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino
<ma...@apache.org>wrote:
> -1 JSF2
> +1 GWT
>
> Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2 licensed.
>
> GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java centric
> and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to understand the
> project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
> javadoc-ed in all its components.
>
> I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps with gwt
> vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the web.
>
> - Manolo
>
> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly controlled by
> one
> > company.
> > Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF 2 -
> > Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> > >
> > >> Hi Manolo
> > >> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
> > >> gwt-platform
> > >> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> > >> state(gwt-presenter).
> > >> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will import
> the
> > >> other
> > >> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by gwt
> itself.
> > >> I was
> > >> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the deadline of
> > >> GSoC, so
> > >> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core mvp in
> gwt
> > to
> > >> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa project
> > and
> > >> GWT
> > >> technology and later on I want to show you something I am changing.
> > >> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features, that
> a
> > >> current
> > >> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC
> period,
> > >> but also
> > >> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's JIRA,
> where
> > >> some
> > >> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
> > >> discription after
> > >> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> > >> Thanks a lot :)
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Wish you a happy
> > >>
> > >> Hi Echo
> > >>>
> > >>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> > >>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of
> the
> > >>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer
> the
> > >>> first option.
> > >>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
> > >>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
> > >>>
> > >>> Cheers
> > >>> - Manolo
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >> cheers,
> > >> echo
> > >>
> > >>
> > > Hello Echo,
> > >
> > > Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know more.
> Good
> > > luck with your research and send us the findings.
> > >
> > > Cheers.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Ioan Eugen Stan
> > > http://ieugen.blogspot.com
> > >
> > >
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> > server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
> > server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Kind Regards... Dhrubo
> >
> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
> >
>
--
Kind Regards... Dhrubo
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
-1 JSF2
+1 GWT
Like JSF2, GWT is a proved technology, open sourced, and apache-2 licensed.
GWT adds a set of benefices to James, mainly we continue being java centric
and we dont need serious javascript, ajax nor html skills to understand the
project, secondly we can deliver a product which is unit tested and
javadoc-ed in all its components.
I don't want to expose the benefices of developing large rich apps with gwt
vs hand-written js because there is a lot of literature along the web.
- Manolo
On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 6:05 AM, Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly controlled by one
> company.
> Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF 2 -
> Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
>
> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <stan.ieugen@gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> >
> >> Hi Manolo
> >> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
> >> gwt-platform
> >> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> >> state(gwt-presenter).
> >> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will import the
> >> other
> >> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by gwt itself.
> >> I was
> >> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the deadline of
> >> GSoC, so
> >> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core mvp in gwt
> to
> >> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa project
> and
> >> GWT
> >> technology and later on I want to show you something I am changing.
> >> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features, that a
> >> current
> >> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC period,
> >> but also
> >> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's JIRA, where
> >> some
> >> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
> >> discription after
> >> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> >> Thanks a lot :)
> >>
> >>
> >> Wish you a happy
> >>
> >> Hi Echo
> >>>
> >>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> >>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of the
> >>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer the
> >>> first option.
> >>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
> >>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
> >>>
> >>> Cheers
> >>> - Manolo
> >>>
> >>> --
> >> cheers,
> >> echo
> >>
> >>
> > Hello Echo,
> >
> > Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know more. Good
> > luck with your research and send us the findings.
> >
> > Cheers.
> >
> > --
> > Ioan Eugen Stan
> > http://ieugen.blogspot.com
> >
> > ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<
> server-dev-unsubscribe@james.apache.org>
> > For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<
> server-dev-help@james.apache.org>
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Kind Regards... Dhrubo
>
> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Dhrubo <dh...@gmail.com>.
I think we should move to JSF 2 than GWT which is mostly controlled by one
company.
Apache with its vision and endeavor for OSS we should use - JSF 2 -
Tomahawk (or Mojarra) + Primefaces
On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 6:37 PM, Ioan Eugen Stan <st...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
>
>> Hi Manolo
>> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
>> gwt-platform
>> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
>> state(gwt-presenter).
>> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will import the
>> other
>> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by gwt itself.
>> I was
>> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the deadline of
>> GSoC, so
>> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core mvp in gwt to
>> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa project and
>> GWT
>> technology and later on I want to show you something I am changing.
>> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features, that a
>> current
>> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC period,
>> but also
>> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's JIRA, where
>> some
>> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper
>> discription after
>> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
>> Thanks a lot :)
>>
>>
>> Wish you a happy
>>
>> Hi Echo
>>>
>>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of the
>>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer the
>>> first option.
>>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
>>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>> - Manolo
>>>
>>> --
>> cheers,
>> echo
>>
>>
> Hello Echo,
>
> Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know more. Good
> luck with your research and send us the findings.
>
> Cheers.
>
> --
> Ioan Eugen Stan
> http://ieugen.blogspot.com
>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-dev-unsubscribe@james.**apache.org<se...@james.apache.org>
> For additional commands, e-mail: server-dev-help@james.apache.**org<se...@james.apache.org>
>
>
--
Kind Regards... Dhrubo
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/dhrubo>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Ioan Eugen Stan <st...@gmail.com>.
Pe 11.04.2012 18:48, echo a scris:
> Hi Manolo
> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the gwt-platform
> was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's state(gwt-presenter).
> However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since it will import the other
> resources. What I really want to do is to replace the MVP by gwt itself. I was
> just afraid whether I can complete the proposal before the deadline of GSoC, so
> I asked for you advices. If possible, I want to use the core mvp in gwt to
> realize it. Over these days, I have been researching the Hupa project and GWT
> technology and later on I want to show you something I am changing.
> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features, that a current
> email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC period, but also
> after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the Hupa's JIRA, where some
> wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will give my deeper discription after
> my researching. I don't think it will be late.
> Thanks a lot :)
>
>
> Wish you a happy
>
>> Hi Echo
>>
>> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
>> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of the
>> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer the
>> first option.
>> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
>> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>>
>> Cheers
>> - Manolo
>>
> --
> cheers,
> echo
>
Hello Echo,
Sound good. I'm not familiar with GWT and I would like to know more.
Good luck with your research and send us the findings.
Cheers.
--
Ioan Eugen Stan
http://ieugen.blogspot.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
Hello Echo.
It sounds good to me.
Keep me informed about your progress, and modify your proposal or write
comments with your thoughts and details in the gsoc melange site as well.
Cheers
- Manolo
On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 5:48 PM, echo <ec...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Manolo
> Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
> gwt-platform was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
> state(gwt-presenter). However, I like the native one rather than gwtp since
> it will import the other resources. What I really want to do is to replace
> the MVP by gwt itself. I was just afraid whether I can complete the
> proposal before the deadline of GSoC, so I asked for you advices. If
> possible, I want to use the core mvp in gwt to realize it. Over these days,
> I have been researching the Hupa project and GWT technology and later on I
> want to show you something I am changing.
> To the new features, I would like to implement as many features, that a
> current email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC
> period, but also after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the
> Hupa's JIRA, where some wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will
> give my deeper discription after my researching. I don't think it will be
> late.
> Thanks a lot :)
>
>
> [image: Wish you a happy]
>
>
> Hi Echo
>
> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of the
> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer the
> first option.
> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>
> Cheers
> - Manolo
>
>
> --
> cheers,
> echo
>
>
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by echo <ec...@gmail.com>.
Hi Manolo
Very glad to see your reply. The reason why I want to choose the
gwt-platform was that it is more smoothly to update from current Hupa's
state(gwt-presenter). However, I like the native one rather than gwtp
since it will import the other resources. What I really want to do is to
replace the MVP by gwt itself. I was just afraid whether I can complete
the proposal before the deadline of GSoC, so I asked for you advices. If
possible, I want to use the core mvp in gwt to realize it. Over these
days, I have been researching the Hupa project and GWT technology and
later on I want to show you something I am changing.
To the new features, I would like to implement as many features, that a
current email client should have, as possible not only during the GSoC
period, but also after that. And I am also keeping my eyes open on the
Hupa's JIRA, where some wonderful ideas come out gradually. Sure I will
give my deeper discription after my researching. I don't think it will
be late.
Thanks a lot :)
Wish you a happy
> Hi Echo
>
> I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
> One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of the
> core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer the
> first option.
> Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
> features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
>
> Cheers
> - Manolo
>
--
cheers,
echo
Re: [GSOC2012] Hupa evolution
Posted by Manuel Carrasco Moñino <ma...@apache.org>.
Hi Echo
I've been reading your application and it looks right to me.
One thing I see is that you have selected gwt-platform instead of the
core mvp in gwt but you don't say any reason about why you prefer the
first option.
Also I'd like a deeper description of how you pretend to face new
features, I mean components, persistence, customization etc.
Cheers
- Manolo
On Thu, Apr 5, 2012 at 1:01 PM, echo <ec...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi, Manolo
> My "[GSOC2012] Hupa evolution" proposal has been updated in
>
> http://www.google-melange.com/gsoc/proposal/review/google/gsoc2012/echo/1.
>
> Could you give me some advices about it? If it looks Ok, I am gonna to cope
> with some beginning stuff. If not, however, I will have to change something
> through your suggests.
> Many thanks for your consideration.
>
> -Echo
>
>
>
> On 03/30/2012 06:08 PM, Manuel Carrasco Moñino wrote:
>
> Hi Echo
>
> I'm CCing the mailing list because other developers could be
> interested in these questions.
>
> Proly you can not login into gmail because of either cacerts issues or
> you have not enabled imap in your gmail account.
>
> Yesterday, I committed a fix to the default config.properties removing
> the 'TrustStore' line so as hupa can use the default java cacerts
> file.
> If you are using openjdk, you should check that cacerts file is complete.
>
> There are several MVP articles, the one you say is a good start point.
> There are different approaches of how implement MVP, hupa is using
> gwt-presenter which is similar to the stuff in gwt-2.4 so the idea is
> to replace it with gwt-2.4 although we could consider other nice
> libraries like mvp4g or gwtp. I recomend to you to read everything you
> find in order to write a good proposal.
>
> gwt-dispatcher is used in client and server sides because it is the
> framework used to comunicate both sides (this is the reason why you
> can see it in many modules). We used it instead of RPC in order to use
> the command pattern and facilitate testing of remote procedures in the
> jvm. This library is not very used nowadays because people uses the
> new RequestFactory stuff. The evolution of gwt-dispatcher is in the
> gwtp library.
>
> Although RequestFactory is though to be used with ddbb entities, I
> think we can consider our objects (emails, folders, etc) like entities
> and take advantage of this pattern. Anyway, you could consider other
> library like gwtp if it simplifies the code or the developing of new
> features in hupa.
>
> Gin is the only way to have injection in client side. Gin syntax is
> the same than Guice and you have to use both to test client presenters
> and code in the jvm. Note that one of the main goals in MVP is to test
> in the jvm client code, so we need a way to decouple presenters, etc
> and inject the necessary stuff to test them in the jvm.
>
> We use gwt-dnd because it was the only available library those days.
> It is necessary to move messages to folders. Now gwt has dnd support
> although Cell widgets do not support it, may be we had to use
> gwtquery-dnd etc. when we replace the message celltable.
>
> gwtquery brings the simplicity of jquery to gwt, specially when
> dealing with dom elements or html content, note that it doesn't need
> jquery at all. I think gquery can help to display messages (clean
> them, resize, etc). I maintain this library so feel free to ask me any
> question you had about it.
>
> All of these new features you suggest are welcome. Note that hupa does
> not have any ddbb in server side, we are storing stuff in a hidden
> message in the imap server, it is experimental, so maybe you could
> consider to add a ddbb to handle this info (we use derby in james
> server as the default one).
>
> The project is big and it is difficult to estimate the effort for each
> thing. But I think your schedule could be a good start point.
>
>
> Cheers
> - Manolo
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 29, 2012 at 3:43 PM, echo <ec...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi, Manuel Carrasco
>
> Hupa is an Rich IMAP-based Webmail application written in GWT, but there is
> no release delivered yet
>
> We propose that gsoc student/s take the actual Hupa code and make it fully
> functional adding many features which are missing and removing out-of-dated
> dependencies in favor of the new stuff in the latest GWT version.
>
> ** Hupa Status
> - Hupa has been entirely written in java to be coherent with the
> language used in the James project.
>
> The Hupa has been checked out and deployed successfully on my
> ArchLinux+openjdk6+eclipse，even though I could not login with my gmail
> account and password which can access http://hupa.alcala.org. Maybe it need
> config the .hupa/config.properties, I think.
>
> - Time ago, Hupa was a reference of a GWT MVP pattern application.
> - Hupa MVP design is based of a set of libraries available for gwt a
> couple of years ago when Gwt-core didn't have support for MVP
> Gwt-presenter: for the MVP and EventBus patterns.
> Gwt-dispatch: for the Command pattern
> Gin + Guice: for dependency injection.
> - Hupa was developed before GWT-2.0 was released, when LayoutPanels,
> uibinders, Cells, RF, etc. were not available.
> - Although Hupa is using the last GWT release, it still depends on some
> unmaintained libraries because they have an equivalent feature in modern
> GWT.
> - In summary, Hupa is a functional and well designed email client, ready
> to read, send and manage messages, but it lacks many of the nice features
> any email client nowadays has.
>
> I also found some examples or instructions on GWT's own MVP architectrue at
> here, it can be as a reference in my opinion, can it?
> It is found that gwt-dispatch is used in more places than the others, since
> almost every maven module(sever, client, share, etc.) needs it. So I believe
> it will take more time to change it by Command Pattern(RequestFactory as
> below) than the others.
> Acutally I have no idea about "Gin + Guice: for dependency injection." which
> needs to deeply discuss with you.
>
> ** Hupa roadmap
> - Replace out-of-date dependencies with GWT-2.4.0 stuff
> Replace gwt-dispatch by RequestFactory
> Replace gwt-presenter with the available stuff in GWT-2.4
> Remove gwt-incubator dependency in favor of CellTable and CellTree
> Use LayoutPanels and DecoratorPanels of css workarounds
> Use Gwt DnD
>
> It is necessary for the theme to be improved by nearly all the recent apis
> and I think it also need some time to be familiar with those new features.
> Another thing I found in the code base is gwt-dnd-3.1.1 has been imported in
> the maven dependencies, while I am not sure whether it is using or not.
>
> - Performance
> Use gQuery in client side to enhance message view, specially to
> parse html messages and remove dangerous tags, instead of expensive parsing
> in server side
> Implement Server cache and client storage
>
> I played with gQuery roughly yesterday and am familiar with its concept of
> JQuery in GWT.
>
> - New features
> Contact management.
> Authentication: Oauth
> Message filtering, grouping, sorting and labeling.
> User settings: name, emails, signature.
> Theming.
>
> And some other small but user-friendly stuffs such as "archive", "draft
> save", user cookies(maybe HTML5 local storage) and so forth.
>
> All right, this is very first draft of the my plan on Hupa:
> [From now to the announcement of GSoC] get started to be familiar with both
> of the Hupa and GWT.
> [Week 1~4] replace gwt-dispatch by RequestFactory, after which I will get
> more familiar with Hupa.
> Deliverable #1: the improved Hupa after replacing something.
> [Week 5] Remove gwt-incubator dependency in favor of CellTable and CellTree.
> [Week 6~7] Replace gwt-presenter with the available stuff in GWT-2.4
> Deliverable #2: the improved Hupa with almost all GWT-2.4 owning
> [Week 8~9] make several prototypes of new features(Contact management,
> Message filtering, grouping, sorting and labeling, etc.). And then try to
> commit to the mail list for quickly feedback.
> [Week 10~11] develop Oauth and User settings, meanwhile update the feedback
> from Week8~9.
> Deliverable #3: the improved Hupa with some new features.
> [Week 12] suggested "pencils down" date: write documentation, test
> everything...
>
> To be honest, I am not really sure about it(probably two few things to do or
> priorities to change and not very well specified). So could you tell me how
> do you think? Any advices will be welcome.
>
>
> --
> cheers,
> echo
>
>
>
> --
> cheers,
> echo
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