How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[Raphael Bircher <rb...@apache.org>]

Hi at all

We allready talked about crowdfunding and generaly agree, that this will be a good idea. I will start at the next time a p'roject at a crowdfunding platform to rise money for a LTS Version for 4.0.2. So we can still support Mac OS X 10.6 downward. I plane to back port security fixes and really important bug fixes. The costs will be about $2000. This just for information.

The big question is, how we handle such projects? My proposal:

- Create a site with open / in programming / finished crowd funding projects.
- Make a blog about it if the organizer whish that.
Other Ideas?

Greetings Raphael
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Re: How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[jan i <ja...@apache.org>]

On 28 February 2014 15:46, Donald Whytock <dw...@apache.org> wrote:

> On Fri, Feb 28, 2014 at 9:39 AM, Raphael Bircher <rbircher@apache.org
> >wrote:
>
> > Hi at all
> >
> > We allready talked about crowdfunding and generaly agree, that this will
> > be a good idea. I will start at the next time a p'roject at a
> crowdfunding
> > platform to rise money for a LTS Version for 4.0.2. So we can still
> support
> > Mac OS X 10.6 downward. I plane to back port security fixes and really
> > important bug fixes. The costs will be about $2000. This just for
> > information.
> >
> > The big question is, how we handle such projects? My proposal:
> >
> > - Create a site with open / in programming / finished crowd funding
> > projects.
> > - Make a blog about it if the organizer whish that.
> > Other Ideas?
> >
>
> These crowdfunding activities would not be official acts of AOO or Apache,
> right?  Since (my understanding is) Apache doesn't support targeted
> donations or paid development?
>
It cannot be official from neither Apache or AOO,  ASF cannot and should
not be involved in commercial activities.

therefore we cannot hosts a site about crowd funding.

rgds
jan I.

>
> If they're outside/independent acts, wouldn't they be, for all practical
> purposes, a subclass of third-party support vendors?
>
> Don
>

Re: How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[jan i <ja...@apache.org>]

On 28 February 2014 16:31, Raphael Bircher <rb...@apache.org> wrote:

> Hi Don
>
> Am 28.02.2014 um 15:46 schrieb Donald Whytock:
>
> > On Fri, Feb 28, 2014 at 9:39 AM, Raphael Bircher <rbircher@apache.org
> >wrote:
> >
> >> Hi at all
> >>
> >> We allready talked about crowdfunding and generaly agree, that this will
> >> be a good idea. I will start at the next time a p'roject at a
> crowdfunding
> >> platform to rise money for a LTS Version for 4.0.2. So we can still
> support
> >> Mac OS X 10.6 downward. I plane to back port security fixes and really
> >> important bug fixes. The costs will be about $2000. This just for
> >> information.
> >>
> >> The big question is, how we handle such projects? My proposal:
> >>
> >> - Create a site with open / in programming / finished crowd funding
> >> projects.
> >> - Make a blog about it if the organizer whish that.
> >> Other Ideas?
> >>
> >
> > These crowdfunding activities would not be official acts of AOO or
> Apache,
> > right?  Since (my understanding is) Apache doesn't support targeted
> > donations or paid development?
>
> exactly
>
> >
> > If they're outside/independent acts, wouldn't they be, for all practical
> > purposes, a subclass of third-party support vendors?
>
> You can see it like this, yes. But mainly for the start, it's important
> too have some help. It is a taff job anyway, to get money for AOO
> development. But this is also important for the ecosystem. And caring about
> the ecosystem is a very important job at Apache.
>

your reply was in parallel with my reply. Any person/committer can help
with these matters (I f.x. would like to help), but ASF as such cannot be
involved.

meaning, such a site:
- cannot be hosted on ASF hardware,
- have a domain name that ends in apache.org

since that would indicate an official endorsement by ASF.

rgds
jan I.


> The founding etc. is ofcourse outside ASF. The works flows maybe back to
> the project.
>
> Greetings Raphael
>
>
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Re: How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[Raphael Bircher <rb...@apache.org>]

Hi Don

Am 28.02.2014 um 15:46 schrieb Donald Whytock:

> On Fri, Feb 28, 2014 at 9:39 AM, Raphael Bircher <rb...@apache.org>wrote:
> 
>> Hi at all
>> 
>> We allready talked about crowdfunding and generaly agree, that this will
>> be a good idea. I will start at the next time a p'roject at a crowdfunding
>> platform to rise money for a LTS Version for 4.0.2. So we can still support
>> Mac OS X 10.6 downward. I plane to back port security fixes and really
>> important bug fixes. The costs will be about $2000. This just for
>> information.
>> 
>> The big question is, how we handle such projects? My proposal:
>> 
>> - Create a site with open / in programming / finished crowd funding
>> projects.
>> - Make a blog about it if the organizer whish that.
>> Other Ideas?
>> 
> 
> These crowdfunding activities would not be official acts of AOO or Apache,
> right?  Since (my understanding is) Apache doesn't support targeted
> donations or paid development?

exactly

> 
> If they're outside/independent acts, wouldn't they be, for all practical
> purposes, a subclass of third-party support vendors?

You can see it like this, yes. But mainly for the start, it's important too have some help. It is a taff job anyway, to get money for AOO development. But this is also important for the ecosystem. And caring about the ecosystem is a very important job at Apache.

The founding etc. is ofcourse outside ASF. The works flows maybe back to the project.

Greetings Raphael


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Re: How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[Donald Whytock <dw...@apache.org>]

On Fri, Feb 28, 2014 at 9:39 AM, Raphael Bircher <rb...@apache.org>wrote:

> Hi at all
>
> We allready talked about crowdfunding and generaly agree, that this will
> be a good idea. I will start at the next time a p'roject at a crowdfunding
> platform to rise money for a LTS Version for 4.0.2. So we can still support
> Mac OS X 10.6 downward. I plane to back port security fixes and really
> important bug fixes. The costs will be about $2000. This just for
> information.
>
> The big question is, how we handle such projects? My proposal:
>
> - Create a site with open / in programming / finished crowd funding
> projects.
> - Make a blog about it if the organizer whish that.
> Other Ideas?
>

These crowdfunding activities would not be official acts of AOO or Apache,
right?  Since (my understanding is) Apache doesn't support targeted
donations or paid development?

If they're outside/independent acts, wouldn't they be, for all practical
purposes, a subclass of third-party support vendors?

Don

Re: How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>]

On Fri, Feb 28, 2014 at 9:39 AM, Raphael Bircher <rb...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hi at all
>
> We allready talked about crowdfunding and generaly agree, that this will be a good idea. I will start at the next time a p'roject at a crowdfunding platform to rise money for a LTS Version for 4.0.2. So we can still support Mac OS X 10.6 downward. I plane to back port security fixes and really important bug fixes. The costs will be about $2000. This just for information.
>
> The big question is, how we handle such projects? My proposal:
>
> - Create a site with open / in programming / finished crowd funding projects.
> - Make a blog about it if the organizer whish that.
> Other Ideas?
>

The subject is "promoting" such projects.  I think others have stated
correctly that there are restrictions on use of Apache resources for
hosting binaries, etc.  I think that should be clear.

On the promotion side the general rule is that the PMC should look be
looking at things like:

1) What benefits the public?

2) What benefits the ecosystem?

3) What is fair and equal treatment to all participants in the ecosystem?

4) What preserve the independence of AOO and the ASF, legally and in
terms of brand and reputation, from commercial activities?

I think the example of how we treat consultants and 3rd party ports is
a good example here.  We list all 3rd party ports and consults, on our
website, so long as they follow some rules regarding trademark use.

You can look at Adfinis Sygroup for another possibility.  We did a
blog post  on their Solaris port work:

https://blogs.apache.org/OOo/entry/porting_apache_openoffice_to_solaris

Note:  This was not an advertisement.   It was a blog post discussing
some interesting work occurring in the ecosystem, and the blog
discussed a mix of topics that were interesting to our users.  As a
side-effect it may have had promotional value for Adfinis Sygroup, but
that is true any time a company participates in open source.  Heck, it
is even true when individuals participate in open source, you can grow
your professional reputation.  This is all fine.

We just need to avoid something that reads like an advertisement.  A
good way to do that would be to have another project members, someone
not involved in the commercial side, ask the interview questions and
write the blog post.

Regards,

-Rob
> Greetings Raphael
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Re: How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[Ariel Constenla-Haile <ar...@apache.org>]

On Fri, Feb 28, 2014 at 04:47:18PM +0100, Raphael Bircher wrote:
> I know, that I can't realy count on the ASF Infrastructure for it
> (depending on the decision of the community) If we support LTS

Supporting a LTS is not something that can be submitted to a community
vote; it looks like you have no idea of the implications of back-porting
bug fixes from trunk to that LTS.


Regards
-- 
Ariel Constenla-Haile
La Plata, Argentina

Re: How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[Raphael Bircher <rb...@apache.org>]

Hi Jürgen

Am 28.02.2014 um 15:47 schrieb Jürgen Schmidt:

> just one quick first remark. We should first discuss if we want such a
> LTS version and if we can manage and maintain it.

For me, this is not the important question. Ofcorce we should discuss it. But for me it is not the question if I do it or not. If People give the money I will do a LTS anyway, Inside or outside ASF is less important for me.
> 
> If you plan do do that with your private business you have to request
> the normal trademark usage etc. and should probably rename it to make
> clear what it is and where it comes from ... You can't expect to use the
> ASF resources (servers) for it.

I know, that I can't realy count on the ASF Infrastructure for it (depending on the decision of the community) If we support LTS, then I will follow the normal way for a third party product.

> 
> In general I see many open questions that should be solved or answered
> first.

I think, if we do LTS, we just make the source tar.gz, and let the binaries to the Supporters. Just a Idea.

Greetings Raphael



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Re: How can we promote Crowdfunding Project relatet to AOO?

[Jürgen Schmidt <jo...@gmail.com>]

just one quick first remark. We should first discuss if we want such a
LTS version and if we can manage and maintain it.

If you plan do do that with your private business you have to request
the normal trademark usage etc. and should probably rename it to make
clear what it is and where it comes from ... You can't expect to use the
ASF resources (servers) for it.

In general I see many open questions that should be solved or answered
first.

Juergen


On 2/28/14 3:39 PM, Raphael Bircher wrote:
> Hi at all
> 
> We allready talked about crowdfunding and generaly agree, that this will be a good idea. I will start at the next time a p'roject at a crowdfunding platform to rise money for a LTS Version for 4.0.2. So we can still support Mac OS X 10.6 downward. I plane to back port security fixes and really important bug fixes. The costs will be about $2000. This just for information.
> 
> The big question is, how we handle such projects? My proposal:
> 
> - Create a site with open / in programming / finished crowd funding projects.
> - Make a blog about it if the organizer whish that.
> Other Ideas?
> 
> Greetings Raphael
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
> 


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