You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to dev@commons.apache.org by Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org> on 2014/07/21 12:24:17 UTC
[DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Dear Commons community,
I'd like to start a discussion about incubating a new commons component
we have been developing in the last weeks at github: commons-rdf [1].
RDF (Resource Description Framework [2]) is a W3C framework for
representing information in the Web. The core structure of the abstract
syntax is a set of triples, each consisting of a subject, a predicate
and an object. A set of such triples is called an RDF graph. An RDF
graph can be visualized as a node and directed-arc diagram, in which
each triple is represented as a node-arc-node link. RDF abstract syntax
can be serialized using different formats (XML, JSON, Turtle, etc.).
In the Java world there has been historically an incompatibility issue
between the two major RDF toolkits: Apache Jena and OpenRDF Sesame.
Commons RDF takes an approach to interoperability that is completely
different from what has been done so far. This is a library that does
not attempt to be a generic API wrapping for these libraries, but
provide a set of interfaces for the RDF 1.1 concepts that can be used to
expose cores concepts using common Java interfaces. In the initial phase
Commons RDF is focused on a subset of the core concepts defined by RDF
1.1 (URI/IRI, Blank Node, Literal, Triple, and Graph). In particular,
Commons RDF aims to provide a type-safe, non-general API that covers RDF
1.1. In a future other aspects around RDF (datasets, query, etc.) may be
also included.
The project counts in ASF commiters of related project (Jena, Marmotta,
Any23) as well of developers of OpenRDF Sesame. At this stage we already
have a very initial version that implementations (Jena and Sesame) could
start to play around to validate and provide early feedback. But for
that we should do it properly and avoid confusion and potential
trademark issues with the naming we're already using (both groupId and
namespace). Therefore we'd like to ask how to proceed further to include
the new component in the Commons sandbox.
For the moment all the work has been completely organized based on git
workflow (new features or design proposals as PRs to be discussed, etc).
It not only allows us to work together, but also helps to get
contributions from early users; so we can say the model is quite agile
and successful. Therefore keep using git is a very important requirement
for us. I saw that all commons-* use svn, so is there any way to us the
ASF git infrastructure for incubating this new component?
All feedback will be appreciated.
Kind regards,
[1] https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf
[2] http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf11-concepts/
--
Sergio Fernández
Partner Technology Manager
Redlink GmbH
m: +43 660 2747 925
e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
w: http://redlink.co
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
[CLOSED][DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>.
Dear Commons community,
the discussion has been very productive. Thanks so much for all your
valuable feedback.
But I let myself go for passion, so we went beyond my initial goals for
the discussion. I think the project still needs some more time to decide
whether to go, if Commons is the right place to incubate this or we
should study any of the other options.
Therefore, I do apologize for the possible problems caused. I'll freeze
all the open actions until an actual decisions is made. And then I'll
come back if still relevant.
Thanks so much.
Best regards,
--
Sergio Fernández
Partner Technology Manager
Redlink GmbH
m: +43 660 2747 925
e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
w: http://redlink.co
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Andy Seaborne <an...@apache.org>.
On 21/07/14 12:12, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
> About the commons-rdf code itself: I only took a very brief look. As far as
> I understand this is only supposed to be an API, hence there are no
> implementation classes, right? One thing that caught my eye is
> BlankNoreOrIRI... Is this defined as such in the standard? It just feels
> wrong, and I'm seeing people doing:
>
> if(term instanceof BlankNode)
> BlankNode node = (BlankNode) term
> else
> IRI iri = (IRI) term
>
> But as I said, I only too a very brief look and I don't know RDF too well.
> Further more, where are the license headers in your files?!
Hi all,
It's a feature of the data format - we're putting a strictly typed
interface on a differently typed data model and dynamically downcasting
is fundamentally yukky.
A graph node (the first slot in a triple - triples being graph edges)
can be one of two different things.
Fixing RDF or fixing Java aren't options :-) so we're left with a
compromise.
Once upon a previous spec, it was a "Resource" (as in "Resource
Description Framework") but "Resource" is now a wider term and "(web)
resource in web architecture is used for various different things with
different nuances.
Andy
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org>.
2014-07-22 9:05 GMT+02:00 Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>:
>
>
> On 22/07/14 08:55, Peter Ansell wrote:
>
>> On 22 July 2014 16:30, Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org> wrote:
>> All of the code contributions have been from Peter Ansell, Andy
>> Seabourne and Sergio Fernández, per the GitHub contributors list, and
>> we all are Apache committers already, in case that helps:
>>
>> https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/graphs/contributors
>>
>
> That's what I stated in the IP clearance report; see r1612386 for the
> details http://svn.apache.org/r1612386
>
>
> I created SANDBOX-479 with that purpose. It is rather easy, but you are
>>>> right that the process needs to be properly managed.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I've looked at the github repo again. I think we all agree that future
>>> discussions have to take place on this ML. For structuring the
>>> development
>>> efforts it makes sense to create a jira project right from the start
>>> (instead of using the sandbox project). I don't know if Gary can do that
>>> or
>>> if we need help from Infra for that.
>>>
>>
>> Once there is a Jira project available that would be practical, but
>> until then (assuming we can't do it immediately), continuing to
>> discuss the open issues on GitHub Issues and Pull Requests seems fine
>> to me.
>>
>
> Sure, let's await to have all infrastructure in place to do the migration,
> which also means a formal code donation (git bundle) attached to
> SANDBOX-479.
>
>
> The infrastructure team have made it possible to link up to GitHub
>> Pull Requests so that emails are sent to this list when they are
>> opened and when comments are added to them (similar to Marmotta and
>> Any23), to keep a copy of the code review discussion here, but enable
>> the use of GitHub's intuitive code review interface for fluent
>> development of the project.
>>
>
> I'll already asked that at INFRA-8068, but I'll stress it.
This already works for all our github mirrors, so it shouldn't be a problem.
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> --
> Sergio Fernández
> Partner Technology Manager
> Redlink GmbH
> m: +43 660 2747 925
> e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
> w: http://redlink.co
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
>
>
--
http://people.apache.org/~britter/
http://www.systemoutprintln.de/
http://twitter.com/BenediktRitter
http://github.com/britter
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>.
On 22/07/14 08:55, Peter Ansell wrote:
> On 22 July 2014 16:30, Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org> wrote:
> All of the code contributions have been from Peter Ansell, Andy
> Seabourne and Sergio Fernández, per the GitHub contributors list, and
> we all are Apache committers already, in case that helps:
>
> https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/graphs/contributors
That's what I stated in the IP clearance report; see r1612386 for the
details http://svn.apache.org/r1612386
>>> I created SANDBOX-479 with that purpose. It is rather easy, but you are
>>> right that the process needs to be properly managed.
>>
>> I've looked at the github repo again. I think we all agree that future
>> discussions have to take place on this ML. For structuring the development
>> efforts it makes sense to create a jira project right from the start
>> (instead of using the sandbox project). I don't know if Gary can do that or
>> if we need help from Infra for that.
>
> Once there is a Jira project available that would be practical, but
> until then (assuming we can't do it immediately), continuing to
> discuss the open issues on GitHub Issues and Pull Requests seems fine
> to me.
Sure, let's await to have all infrastructure in place to do the
migration, which also means a formal code donation (git bundle) attached
to SANDBOX-479.
> The infrastructure team have made it possible to link up to GitHub
> Pull Requests so that emails are sent to this list when they are
> opened and when comments are added to them (similar to Marmotta and
> Any23), to keep a copy of the code review discussion here, but enable
> the use of GitHub's intuitive code review interface for fluent
> development of the project.
I'll already asked that at INFRA-8068, but I'll stress it.
Cheers,
--
Sergio Fernández
Partner Technology Manager
Redlink GmbH
m: +43 660 2747 925
e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
w: http://redlink.co
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Peter Ansell <an...@gmail.com>.
On 22 July 2014 16:30, Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org> wrote:
> 2014-07-21 19:44 GMT+02:00 Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>> On 21/07/14 17:33, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
>> >
>>
>>> 2014-07-21 16:55 GMT+02:00 Phil Steitz <ph...@gmail.com>:
>>>
>> >>
>>
>>> On 7/21/14, 5:11 AM, Sergio Fernández wrote:
>>>>
>>> >>>
>>
>>> Sorry, I tried to find it, but in the web site there is no
>>>>> information about such procedure. Do we need to start a vote and
>>>>> get a consensus from the Commons PMC?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> There is no formal process for starting a sandbox component per se,
>>>> as long as existing ASF committer(s) are initiating it. To get
>>>> sandbox karma, ASF committers just have to ask for it here. There
>>>> is, however, a process for accepting a software grant, which in this
>>>> case we are going to have to follow, since the initial code was
>>>> developed outside the ASF (i.e., not under the oversight of an ASF
>>>> PMC, unless I am misunderstanding something). Have a look at [1]
>>>> for how Commons sandbox works and [2] for the IP clearance process.
>>>>
All of the code contributions have been from Peter Ansell, Andy
Seabourne and Sergio Fernández, per the GitHub contributors list, and
we all are Apache committers already, in case that helps:
https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/graphs/contributors
>> I created SANDBOX-479 with that purpose. It is rather easy, but you are
>> right that the process needs to be properly managed.
>
>
> I've looked at the github repo again. I think we all agree that future
> discussions have to take place on this ML. For structuring the development
> efforts it makes sense to create a jira project right from the start
> (instead of using the sandbox project). I don't know if Gary can do that or
> if we need help from Infra for that.
Once there is a Jira project available that would be practical, but
until then (assuming we can't do it immediately), continuing to
discuss the open issues on GitHub Issues and Pull Requests seems fine
to me.
The infrastructure team have made it possible to link up to GitHub
Pull Requests so that emails are sent to this list when they are
opened and when comments are added to them (similar to Marmotta and
Any23), to keep a copy of the code review discussion here, but enable
the use of GitHub's intuitive code review interface for fluent
development of the project.
Cheers,
Peter
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org>.
2014-07-23 1:35 GMT+02:00 Peter Ansell <an...@gmail.com>:
> On 22 July 2014 22:17, Gary Gregory <ga...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I just saw my name pop up here: Yes we will help from infra with JIRA and
> > using Git is fine as long as it is hosted at Apache and not GitHub. We
> > still have to use Subversion for publishing the site and the release
> files
> > of course, this is an Apache-wide procedure.
>
> As long as there is a mirror at https://github.com/apache we will
> still be able to use GitHub for code review.
>
As long as all important development decisions are made public through the
dev ML, I'm okay with that.
Benedikt
>
> Cheers,
>
> Peter
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
>
>
--
http://people.apache.org/~britter/
http://www.systemoutprintln.de/
http://twitter.com/BenediktRitter
http://github.com/britter
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Peter Ansell <an...@gmail.com>.
On 22 July 2014 22:17, Gary Gregory <ga...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I just saw my name pop up here: Yes we will help from infra with JIRA and
> using Git is fine as long as it is hosted at Apache and not GitHub. We
> still have to use Subversion for publishing the site and the release files
> of course, this is an Apache-wide procedure.
As long as there is a mirror at https://github.com/apache we will
still be able to use GitHub for code review.
Cheers,
Peter
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Gary Gregory <ga...@gmail.com>.
I just saw my name pop up here: Yes we will help from infra with JIRA and
using Git is fine as long as it is hosted at Apache and not GitHub. We
still have to use Subversion for publishing the site and the release files
of course, this is an Apache-wide procedure.
Gary
On Tue, Jul 22, 2014 at 2:30 AM, Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org> wrote:
> 2014-07-21 19:44 GMT+02:00 Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>:
>
> > Hi,
> >
> >
> > On 21/07/14 17:33, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
> > >
> >
> >> 2014-07-21 16:55 GMT+02:00 Phil Steitz <ph...@gmail.com>:
> >>
> > >>
> >
> >> On 7/21/14, 5:11 AM, Sergio Fernández wrote:
> >>>
> >> >>>
> >
> >> Sorry, I tried to find it, but in the web site there is no
> >>>> information about such procedure. Do we need to start a vote and
> >>>> get a consensus from the Commons PMC?
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> There is no formal process for starting a sandbox component per se,
> >>> as long as existing ASF committer(s) are initiating it. To get
> >>> sandbox karma, ASF committers just have to ask for it here. There
> >>> is, however, a process for accepting a software grant, which in this
> >>> case we are going to have to follow, since the initial code was
> >>> developed outside the ASF (i.e., not under the oversight of an ASF
> >>> PMC, unless I am misunderstanding something). Have a look at [1]
> >>> for how Commons sandbox works and [2] for the IP clearance process.
> >>>
> >>
> > I created SANDBOX-479 with that purpose. It is rather easy, but you are
> > right that the process needs to be properly managed.
>
>
> I've looked at the github repo again. I think we all agree that future
> discussions have to take place on this ML. For structuring the development
> efforts it makes sense to create a jira project right from the start
> (instead of using the sandbox project). I don't know if Gary can do that or
> if we need help from Infra for that.
>
> I'll bootstrap a website for you and include it at
> http://commons.apache.org/sandbox.html right after the git repo is
> available.
>
> Benedikt
>
>
> >
> >
> > I think after sorting the IP stuff out, the guys don't need sandbox
> karma
> >> (in svn), but a sandbox git repo (since they insist on developing via
> git)
> >>
> >
> > In the meantime I also requested the it to infra (INFRA-8068), because
> > that could take some time depending on how much work they do have.
> >
> > Please, feel free to comment to any of those issues if further
> information
> > would be required.
> >
> > Thanks so much.
>
>
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > --
> > Sergio Fernández
> > Partner Technology Manager
> > Redlink GmbH
> > m: +43 660 2747 925
> > e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
> > w: http://redlink.co
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> http://people.apache.org/~britter/
> http://www.systemoutprintln.de/
> http://twitter.com/BenediktRitter
> http://github.com/britter
>
--
E-Mail: garydgregory@gmail.com | ggregory@apache.org
Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition
<http://www.manning.com/bauer3/>
JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/>
Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/>
Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com
Home: http://garygregory.com/
Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>.
Hi,
On 22/07/14 08:30, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
> 2014-07-21 19:44 GMT+02:00 Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>:
>
>> I created SANDBOX-479 with that purpose. It is rather easy, but you are
>> right that the process needs to be properly managed.
>
> I've looked at the github repo again. I think we all agree that future
> discussions have to take place on this ML. For structuring the development
> efforts it makes sense to create a jira project right from the start
> (instead of using the sandbox project). I don't know if Gary can do that or
> if we need help from Infra for that.
Makes sense, right. Because according the Commons Etiquette we won't
stay so long at the Sandbox, since we'll try to push out a release
sooner than later.
> I'll bootstrap a website for you and include it at
> http://commons.apache.org/sandbox.html right after the git repo is
> available.
Thanks.
--
Sergio Fernández
Partner Technology Manager
Redlink GmbH
m: +43 660 2747 925
e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
w: http://redlink.co
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org>.
2014-07-21 19:44 GMT+02:00 Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>:
> Hi,
>
>
> On 21/07/14 17:33, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
> >
>
>> 2014-07-21 16:55 GMT+02:00 Phil Steitz <ph...@gmail.com>:
>>
> >>
>
>> On 7/21/14, 5:11 AM, Sergio Fernández wrote:
>>>
>> >>>
>
>> Sorry, I tried to find it, but in the web site there is no
>>>> information about such procedure. Do we need to start a vote and
>>>> get a consensus from the Commons PMC?
>>>>
>>>
>>> There is no formal process for starting a sandbox component per se,
>>> as long as existing ASF committer(s) are initiating it. To get
>>> sandbox karma, ASF committers just have to ask for it here. There
>>> is, however, a process for accepting a software grant, which in this
>>> case we are going to have to follow, since the initial code was
>>> developed outside the ASF (i.e., not under the oversight of an ASF
>>> PMC, unless I am misunderstanding something). Have a look at [1]
>>> for how Commons sandbox works and [2] for the IP clearance process.
>>>
>>
> I created SANDBOX-479 with that purpose. It is rather easy, but you are
> right that the process needs to be properly managed.
I've looked at the github repo again. I think we all agree that future
discussions have to take place on this ML. For structuring the development
efforts it makes sense to create a jira project right from the start
(instead of using the sandbox project). I don't know if Gary can do that or
if we need help from Infra for that.
I'll bootstrap a website for you and include it at
http://commons.apache.org/sandbox.html right after the git repo is
available.
Benedikt
>
>
> I think after sorting the IP stuff out, the guys don't need sandbox karma
>> (in svn), but a sandbox git repo (since they insist on developing via git)
>>
>
> In the meantime I also requested the it to infra (INFRA-8068), because
> that could take some time depending on how much work they do have.
>
> Please, feel free to comment to any of those issues if further information
> would be required.
>
> Thanks so much.
>
> Cheers,
>
> --
> Sergio Fernández
> Partner Technology Manager
> Redlink GmbH
> m: +43 660 2747 925
> e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
> w: http://redlink.co
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
>
>
--
http://people.apache.org/~britter/
http://www.systemoutprintln.de/
http://twitter.com/BenediktRitter
http://github.com/britter
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>.
Hi,
On 21/07/14 17:33, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
>
> 2014-07-21 16:55 GMT+02:00 Phil Steitz <ph...@gmail.com>:
>>
>> On 7/21/14, 5:11 AM, Sergio Fernández wrote:
>>>
>>> Sorry, I tried to find it, but in the web site there is no
>>> information about such procedure. Do we need to start a vote and
>>> get a consensus from the Commons PMC?
>>
>> There is no formal process for starting a sandbox component per se,
>> as long as existing ASF committer(s) are initiating it. To get
>> sandbox karma, ASF committers just have to ask for it here. There
>> is, however, a process for accepting a software grant, which in this
>> case we are going to have to follow, since the initial code was
>> developed outside the ASF (i.e., not under the oversight of an ASF
>> PMC, unless I am misunderstanding something). Have a look at [1]
>> for how Commons sandbox works and [2] for the IP clearance process.
I created SANDBOX-479 with that purpose. It is rather easy, but you are
right that the process needs to be properly managed.
> I think after sorting the IP stuff out, the guys don't need sandbox karma
> (in svn), but a sandbox git repo (since they insist on developing via git)
In the meantime I also requested the it to infra (INFRA-8068), because
that could take some time depending on how much work they do have.
Please, feel free to comment to any of those issues if further
information would be required.
Thanks so much.
Cheers,
--
Sergio Fernández
Partner Technology Manager
Redlink GmbH
m: +43 660 2747 925
e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
w: http://redlink.co
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Phil Steitz <ph...@gmail.com>.
On 7/21/14, 8:33 AM, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
> 2014-07-21 16:55 GMT+02:00 Phil Steitz <ph...@gmail.com>:
>
>> On 7/21/14, 5:11 AM, Sergio Fernández wrote:
>>> Hi Benedikt,
>>>
>>> On 21/07/14 13:12, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
>>>> first of all, welcome the Apache Commons dev mailing list. It's
>>>> nice to
>>>> hear that you have decided to share code with others using the
>>>> Apache
>>>> Commons project.
>>> Consider this contribution our (Andy, Peter and mine) two cents to
>>> such important project. Thanks for having us on board.
>>>
>>>> In the past we had the policy, that the commons sandbox is free
>>>> for all ASF
>>>> committers. So you could have started coding at commons right
>>>> from the
>>>> beginning ;-)
>>>> Since you already bringing a group of people who are willing to
>>>> work on the
>>>> component, I don't have a problem with letting commons-rdf join
>>>> the sandbox.
>>> Sorry, I tried to find it, but in the web site there is no
>>> information about such procedure. Do we need to start a vote and
>>> get a consensus from the Commons PMC?
>> There is no formal process for starting a sandbox component per se,
>> as long as existing ASF committer(s) are initiating it. To get
>> sandbox karma, ASF committers just have to ask for it here. There
>> is, however, a process for accepting a software grant, which in this
>> case we are going to have to follow, since the initial code was
>> developed outside the ASF (i.e., not under the oversight of an ASF
>> PMC, unless I am misunderstanding something). Have a look at [1]
>> for how Commons sandbox works and [2] for the IP clearance process.
>>
> Phil, thanks for clearing this up.
>
> I think after sorting the IP stuff out, the guys don't need sandbox karma
> (in svn), but a sandbox git repo (since they insist on developing via git)
OK, that will require an Infra ticket, I guess.
Phil
>
> Benedikt
>
>
>> Welcome to Commons!
>>
>> Phil
>>
>> [1] http://wiki.apache.org/commons/CommonsEtiquette
>> [2] http://incubator.apache.org/ip-clearance/
>>
>>
>>>> Using git may be an issue. We had long discussions about svn vs.
>>>> git and we
>>>> came to the conclusion that using the one or the other should be
>>>> decided on
>>>> a component basis by the developers of the components. So far
>>>> only Commons
>>>> Math is really taking action to migrate to git.
>>>> If you really want to use git, we need to figure out how we can
>>>> integrate
>>>> that with our release process. Having you join us, may be a
>>>> chance for us
>>>> to learn from more experienced git users ;-)
>>> Definitely we do need git, otherwise some tasks would require
>>> extra time to fuss with the weird way that svn does things after
>>> working with git.
>>>
>>> I'm not aware of the long discussions you mention. But of course
>>> I'm willing to help you guys with the migration of those
>>> subprojects that want to try.
>>>
>>>> I'm not sure about the git PRs. Does that involve github? What
>>>> about the IP
>>>> in such a case? It legal okay with that?
>>> Infra has already worked on providing the basic infrastructure.
>>> Then each project is free to manage it as they prefer. What we did
>>> in Marmotta, for instance, is to force to file issues in Jira for
>>> all PRs (so having the regular IP in place).
>>>
>>>> About the commons-rdf code itself: I only took a very brief look.
>>>> As far as
>>>> I understand this is only supposed to be an API, hence there are no
>>>> implementation classes, right? One thing that caught my eye is
>>>> BlankNoreOrIRI... Is this defined as such in the standard?
>>> You are completely right. There has been a long discussion about
>>> that aspect, see issue #9 fir further background:
>>>
>>> https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/issues/9
>>>
>>> Because there is not such official term for what a RDF subject
>>> could have a triple.
>>>
>>>> It just feels wrong, and I'm seeing people doing:
>>>>
>>>> if(term instanceof BlankNode)
>>>> BlankNode node = (BlankNode) term
>>>> else
>>>> IRI iri = (IRI) term
>>> It is not expected to have classes implementing only that
>>> interface, so it's only useful for the methods signature. That's
>>> indeed a problem in Java, so we may have to figure out better
>>> design solutions.
>>>
>>>> But as I said, I only too a very brief look and I don't know RDF
>>>> too well.
>>>> Further more, where are the license headers in your files?!
>>> Already working on it ;-)
>>>
>>> https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/issues/28
>>>
>>> Thanks for all your comments.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
>>
>>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org>.
2014-07-21 16:55 GMT+02:00 Phil Steitz <ph...@gmail.com>:
> On 7/21/14, 5:11 AM, Sergio Fernández wrote:
> > Hi Benedikt,
> >
> > On 21/07/14 13:12, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
> >> first of all, welcome the Apache Commons dev mailing list. It's
> >> nice to
> >> hear that you have decided to share code with others using the
> >> Apache
> >> Commons project.
> >
> > Consider this contribution our (Andy, Peter and mine) two cents to
> > such important project. Thanks for having us on board.
> >
> >> In the past we had the policy, that the commons sandbox is free
> >> for all ASF
> >> committers. So you could have started coding at commons right
> >> from the
> >> beginning ;-)
> >> Since you already bringing a group of people who are willing to
> >> work on the
> >> component, I don't have a problem with letting commons-rdf join
> >> the sandbox.
> >
> > Sorry, I tried to find it, but in the web site there is no
> > information about such procedure. Do we need to start a vote and
> > get a consensus from the Commons PMC?
>
> There is no formal process for starting a sandbox component per se,
> as long as existing ASF committer(s) are initiating it. To get
> sandbox karma, ASF committers just have to ask for it here. There
> is, however, a process for accepting a software grant, which in this
> case we are going to have to follow, since the initial code was
> developed outside the ASF (i.e., not under the oversight of an ASF
> PMC, unless I am misunderstanding something). Have a look at [1]
> for how Commons sandbox works and [2] for the IP clearance process.
>
Phil, thanks for clearing this up.
I think after sorting the IP stuff out, the guys don't need sandbox karma
(in svn), but a sandbox git repo (since they insist on developing via git)
Benedikt
>
> Welcome to Commons!
>
> Phil
>
> [1] http://wiki.apache.org/commons/CommonsEtiquette
> [2] http://incubator.apache.org/ip-clearance/
>
>
> >
> >> Using git may be an issue. We had long discussions about svn vs.
> >> git and we
> >> came to the conclusion that using the one or the other should be
> >> decided on
> >> a component basis by the developers of the components. So far
> >> only Commons
> >> Math is really taking action to migrate to git.
> >> If you really want to use git, we need to figure out how we can
> >> integrate
> >> that with our release process. Having you join us, may be a
> >> chance for us
> >> to learn from more experienced git users ;-)
> >
> > Definitely we do need git, otherwise some tasks would require
> > extra time to fuss with the weird way that svn does things after
> > working with git.
> >
> > I'm not aware of the long discussions you mention. But of course
> > I'm willing to help you guys with the migration of those
> > subprojects that want to try.
> >
> >> I'm not sure about the git PRs. Does that involve github? What
> >> about the IP
> >> in such a case? It legal okay with that?
> >
> > Infra has already worked on providing the basic infrastructure.
> > Then each project is free to manage it as they prefer. What we did
> > in Marmotta, for instance, is to force to file issues in Jira for
> > all PRs (so having the regular IP in place).
> >
> >> About the commons-rdf code itself: I only took a very brief look.
> >> As far as
> >> I understand this is only supposed to be an API, hence there are no
> >> implementation classes, right? One thing that caught my eye is
> >> BlankNoreOrIRI... Is this defined as such in the standard?
> >
> > You are completely right. There has been a long discussion about
> > that aspect, see issue #9 fir further background:
> >
> > https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/issues/9
> >
> > Because there is not such official term for what a RDF subject
> > could have a triple.
> >
> >> It just feels wrong, and I'm seeing people doing:
> >>
> >> if(term instanceof BlankNode)
> >> BlankNode node = (BlankNode) term
> >> else
> >> IRI iri = (IRI) term
> >
> > It is not expected to have classes implementing only that
> > interface, so it's only useful for the methods signature. That's
> > indeed a problem in Java, so we may have to figure out better
> > design solutions.
> >
> >> But as I said, I only too a very brief look and I don't know RDF
> >> too well.
> >> Further more, where are the license headers in your files?!
> >
> > Already working on it ;-)
> >
> > https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/issues/28
> >
> > Thanks for all your comments.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
>
>
--
http://people.apache.org/~britter/
http://www.systemoutprintln.de/
http://twitter.com/BenediktRitter
http://github.com/britter
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Phil Steitz <ph...@gmail.com>.
On 7/21/14, 5:11 AM, Sergio Fernández wrote:
> Hi Benedikt,
>
> On 21/07/14 13:12, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
>> first of all, welcome the Apache Commons dev mailing list. It's
>> nice to
>> hear that you have decided to share code with others using the
>> Apache
>> Commons project.
>
> Consider this contribution our (Andy, Peter and mine) two cents to
> such important project. Thanks for having us on board.
>
>> In the past we had the policy, that the commons sandbox is free
>> for all ASF
>> committers. So you could have started coding at commons right
>> from the
>> beginning ;-)
>> Since you already bringing a group of people who are willing to
>> work on the
>> component, I don't have a problem with letting commons-rdf join
>> the sandbox.
>
> Sorry, I tried to find it, but in the web site there is no
> information about such procedure. Do we need to start a vote and
> get a consensus from the Commons PMC?
There is no formal process for starting a sandbox component per se,
as long as existing ASF committer(s) are initiating it. To get
sandbox karma, ASF committers just have to ask for it here. There
is, however, a process for accepting a software grant, which in this
case we are going to have to follow, since the initial code was
developed outside the ASF (i.e., not under the oversight of an ASF
PMC, unless I am misunderstanding something). Have a look at [1]
for how Commons sandbox works and [2] for the IP clearance process.
Welcome to Commons!
Phil
[1] http://wiki.apache.org/commons/CommonsEtiquette
[2] http://incubator.apache.org/ip-clearance/
>
>> Using git may be an issue. We had long discussions about svn vs.
>> git and we
>> came to the conclusion that using the one or the other should be
>> decided on
>> a component basis by the developers of the components. So far
>> only Commons
>> Math is really taking action to migrate to git.
>> If you really want to use git, we need to figure out how we can
>> integrate
>> that with our release process. Having you join us, may be a
>> chance for us
>> to learn from more experienced git users ;-)
>
> Definitely we do need git, otherwise some tasks would require
> extra time to fuss with the weird way that svn does things after
> working with git.
>
> I'm not aware of the long discussions you mention. But of course
> I'm willing to help you guys with the migration of those
> subprojects that want to try.
>
>> I'm not sure about the git PRs. Does that involve github? What
>> about the IP
>> in such a case? It legal okay with that?
>
> Infra has already worked on providing the basic infrastructure.
> Then each project is free to manage it as they prefer. What we did
> in Marmotta, for instance, is to force to file issues in Jira for
> all PRs (so having the regular IP in place).
>
>> About the commons-rdf code itself: I only took a very brief look.
>> As far as
>> I understand this is only supposed to be an API, hence there are no
>> implementation classes, right? One thing that caught my eye is
>> BlankNoreOrIRI... Is this defined as such in the standard?
>
> You are completely right. There has been a long discussion about
> that aspect, see issue #9 fir further background:
>
> https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/issues/9
>
> Because there is not such official term for what a RDF subject
> could have a triple.
>
>> It just feels wrong, and I'm seeing people doing:
>>
>> if(term instanceof BlankNode)
>> BlankNode node = (BlankNode) term
>> else
>> IRI iri = (IRI) term
>
> It is not expected to have classes implementing only that
> interface, so it's only useful for the methods signature. That's
> indeed a problem in Java, so we may have to figure out better
> design solutions.
>
>> But as I said, I only too a very brief look and I don't know RDF
>> too well.
>> Further more, where are the license headers in your files?!
>
> Already working on it ;-)
>
> https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/issues/28
>
> Thanks for all your comments.
>
> Cheers,
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>.
Hi Benedikt,
On 21/07/14 13:12, Benedikt Ritter wrote:
> first of all, welcome the Apache Commons dev mailing list. It's nice to
> hear that you have decided to share code with others using the Apache
> Commons project.
Consider this contribution our (Andy, Peter and mine) two cents to such
important project. Thanks for having us on board.
> In the past we had the policy, that the commons sandbox is free for all ASF
> committers. So you could have started coding at commons right from the
> beginning ;-)
> Since you already bringing a group of people who are willing to work on the
> component, I don't have a problem with letting commons-rdf join the sandbox.
Sorry, I tried to find it, but in the web site there is no information
about such procedure. Do we need to start a vote and get a consensus
from the Commons PMC?
> Using git may be an issue. We had long discussions about svn vs. git and we
> came to the conclusion that using the one or the other should be decided on
> a component basis by the developers of the components. So far only Commons
> Math is really taking action to migrate to git.
> If you really want to use git, we need to figure out how we can integrate
> that with our release process. Having you join us, may be a chance for us
> to learn from more experienced git users ;-)
Definitely we do need git, otherwise some tasks would require extra time
to fuss with the weird way that svn does things after working with git.
I'm not aware of the long discussions you mention. But of course I'm
willing to help you guys with the migration of those subprojects that
want to try.
> I'm not sure about the git PRs. Does that involve github? What about the IP
> in such a case? It legal okay with that?
Infra has already worked on providing the basic infrastructure. Then
each project is free to manage it as they prefer. What we did in
Marmotta, for instance, is to force to file issues in Jira for all PRs
(so having the regular IP in place).
> About the commons-rdf code itself: I only took a very brief look. As far as
> I understand this is only supposed to be an API, hence there are no
> implementation classes, right? One thing that caught my eye is
> BlankNoreOrIRI... Is this defined as such in the standard?
You are completely right. There has been a long discussion about that
aspect, see issue #9 fir further background:
https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/issues/9
Because there is not such official term for what a RDF subject could
have a triple.
> It just feels wrong, and I'm seeing people doing:
>
> if(term instanceof BlankNode)
> BlankNode node = (BlankNode) term
> else
> IRI iri = (IRI) term
It is not expected to have classes implementing only that interface, so
it's only useful for the methods signature. That's indeed a problem in
Java, so we may have to figure out better design solutions.
> But as I said, I only too a very brief look and I don't know RDF too well.
> Further more, where are the license headers in your files?!
Already working on it ;-)
https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf/issues/28
Thanks for all your comments.
Cheers,
--
Sergio Fernández
Partner Technology Manager
Redlink GmbH
m: +43 660 2747 925
e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
w: http://redlink.co
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Benedikt Ritter <br...@apache.org>.
Hello Sergio,
first of all, welcome the Apache Commons dev mailing list. It's nice to
hear that you have decided to share code with others using the Apache
Commons project.
In the past we had the policy, that the commons sandbox is free for all ASF
committers. So you could have started coding at commons right from the
beginning ;-)
Since you already bringing a group of people who are willing to work on the
component, I don't have a problem with letting commons-rdf join the sandbox.
Using git may be an issue. We had long discussions about svn vs. git and we
came to the conclusion that using the one or the other should be decided on
a component basis by the developers of the components. So far only Commons
Math is really taking action to migrate to git.
If you really want to use git, we need to figure out how we can integrate
that with our release process. Having you join us, may be a chance for us
to learn from more experienced git users ;-)
I'm not sure about the git PRs. Does that involve github? What about the IP
in such a case? It legal okay with that?
About the commons-rdf code itself: I only took a very brief look. As far as
I understand this is only supposed to be an API, hence there are no
implementation classes, right? One thing that caught my eye is
BlankNoreOrIRI... Is this defined as such in the standard? It just feels
wrong, and I'm seeing people doing:
if(term instanceof BlankNode)
BlankNode node = (BlankNode) term
else
IRI iri = (IRI) term
But as I said, I only too a very brief look and I don't know RDF too well.
Further more, where are the license headers in your files?!
HTH,
Benedikt
2014-07-21 12:24 GMT+02:00 Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>:
> Dear Commons community,
>
> I'd like to start a discussion about incubating a new commons component we
> have been developing in the last weeks at github: commons-rdf [1].
>
> RDF (Resource Description Framework [2]) is a W3C framework for
> representing information in the Web. The core structure of the abstract
> syntax is a set of triples, each consisting of a subject, a predicate and
> an object. A set of such triples is called an RDF graph. An RDF graph can
> be visualized as a node and directed-arc diagram, in which each triple is
> represented as a node-arc-node link. RDF abstract syntax can be serialized
> using different formats (XML, JSON, Turtle, etc.).
>
> In the Java world there has been historically an incompatibility issue
> between the two major RDF toolkits: Apache Jena and OpenRDF Sesame. Commons
> RDF takes an approach to interoperability that is completely different from
> what has been done so far. This is a library that does not attempt to be a
> generic API wrapping for these libraries, but provide a set of interfaces
> for the RDF 1.1 concepts that can be used to expose cores concepts using
> common Java interfaces. In the initial phase Commons RDF is focused on a
> subset of the core concepts defined by RDF 1.1 (URI/IRI, Blank Node,
> Literal, Triple, and Graph). In particular, Commons RDF aims to provide a
> type-safe, non-general API that covers RDF 1.1. In a future other aspects
> around RDF (datasets, query, etc.) may be also included.
>
> The project counts in ASF commiters of related project (Jena, Marmotta,
> Any23) as well of developers of OpenRDF Sesame. At this stage we already
> have a very initial version that implementations (Jena and Sesame) could
> start to play around to validate and provide early feedback. But for that
> we should do it properly and avoid confusion and potential trademark issues
> with the naming we're already using (both groupId and namespace). Therefore
> we'd like to ask how to proceed further to include the new component in the
> Commons sandbox.
>
> For the moment all the work has been completely organized based on git
> workflow (new features or design proposals as PRs to be discussed, etc). It
> not only allows us to work together, but also helps to get contributions
> from early users; so we can say the model is quite agile and successful.
> Therefore keep using git is a very important requirement for us. I saw that
> all commons-* use svn, so is there any way to us the ASF git infrastructure
> for incubating this new component?
>
> All feedback will be appreciated.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> [1] https://github.com/wikier/commons-rdf
> [2] http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf11-concepts/
>
> --
> Sergio Fernández
> Partner Technology Manager
> Redlink GmbH
> m: +43 660 2747 925
> e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
> w: http://redlink.co
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
>
>
--
http://people.apache.org/~britter/
http://www.systemoutprintln.de/
http://twitter.com/BenediktRitter
http://github.com/britter
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Andy Seaborne <an...@apache.org>.
On 21/07/14 13:05, Emmanuel Bourg wrote:
> Hi Sergio,
>
> If I understand well this is a kind of specification API? The actual
> implementations will be done in Jena/Marmotta/OpenRDF?
>
> Emmanuel Bourg
>
>
While, as I understand it, OpenRDF [*] is adopting the interface natively,
It does not look any anyone is coming forward to follow that route in
Jena. It would be be a massive decision to uproot the existing 10+
year-old APIs. A cultural aspect of Jena is preserving user code
investment.
So Jena would provide a separate API for this for the interworking case.
So far commons-rdf is mostly design - we haven't (as far as I know)
tried actually using it in a mixed environment.
Jena has a higher level interface to RDF based on graph nodes, not the
edge+global terms style of commons-rdf.
As a system, Jena has an internal storage interface that can support
multiple user APIs. A quick sketch suggests that using that will give a
commons-rdf API to Jena graphs. There's a lot more outside commons-rdf
(e.g. SPARQL query language) that is out of scope currently.
svn/git:
Jena is in svn current and likely to move to git "some time". We get
pull requests from the github Apache mirror quite regularly and it all
just works (except for occasional diff format issues).
Andy
on the Jena PMC.
[*] http://openrdf.org
Some sort of copyright-consolidated BSD license.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Peter Ansell <an...@gmail.com>.
On 21 July 2014 22:14, Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hi Emmanuel,
>
> On 21/07/14 14:05, Emmanuel Bourg wrote:
>>
>> If I understand well this is a kind of specification API? The actual
>> implementations will be done in Jena/Marmotta/OpenRDF?
>
>
> With the current scope yes, that the overall idea. But we do not discard to
> include some actual code in the future for whatever will be needed.
>
We may have JSR330 @Inject annotations to inject providers into
commons-rdf, so that we can have helper methods available there, based
on the injected implementations. We are not likely to standardise on a
given implementation, as the implementation of these classes may need
to be finely tuned to work efficiently with each application and for
each database.
In the context of OpenRDF, there are multiple implementations of the
current API, including a default one that is provided alongside the
interfaces as "ValueFactoryImpl/etc.". We may provide a similar
general-purpose RDFTermFactoryImpl etc. implementation for similar
purposes, but it won't be used for the internals of the RDF databases
that reuse the model:
https://bitbucket.org/openrdf/sesame/src/b4c240904cfb371b4adee21c75cbd8ec5b0586ac/core/model/src/main/java/org/openrdf/model/
Marmotta for instance define there own implementation of the OpenRDF
Model API, and convert instances created by other implementations to
their own at the boundaries of their application for interoperabilty:
https://github.com/apache/marmotta/tree/master/libraries/kiwi/kiwi-triplestore/src/main/java/org/apache/marmotta/kiwi/model/rdf
Cheers,
Peter
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Sergio Fernández <wi...@apache.org>.
Hi Emmanuel,
On 21/07/14 14:05, Emmanuel Bourg wrote:
> If I understand well this is a kind of specification API? The actual
> implementations will be done in Jena/Marmotta/OpenRDF?
With the current scope yes, that the overall idea. But we do not discard
to include some actual code in the future for whatever will be needed.
Cheers,
--
Sergio Fernández
Partner Technology Manager
Redlink GmbH
m: +43 660 2747 925
e: sergio.fernandez@redlink.co
w: http://redlink.co
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] commons-rdf
Posted by Emmanuel Bourg <eb...@apache.org>.
Hi Sergio,
If I understand well this is a kind of specification API? The actual
implementations will be done in Jena/Marmotta/OpenRDF?
Emmanuel Bourg
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@commons.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@commons.apache.org