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Posted to server-dev@james.apache.org by Nicola Ken Barozzi <ni...@apache.org> on 2003/01/23 08:39:59 UTC
Apache James... HORRAY! :-D
Congrats guys, in case you've missed it ;-) you're a TLP at Apache
@see http://www.apache.org/.
:-D
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Re: Apache James... HORRAY! :-D
Posted by Serge Knystautas <se...@lokitech.com>.
Kenny Smith wrote:
> Awesome! :)
>
> Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
>
>>
>> Congrats guys, in case you've missed it ;-) you're a TLP at Apache
>> @see http://www.apache.org/.
We just posted something to slashdot about James becoming a TLP, but
their site is running like molasses.... (*&)# Perl. :)
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Re: Apache James... HORRAY! :-D
Posted by Kenny Smith <ja...@journalscape.com>.
Awesome! :)
Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
>
> Congrats guys, in case you've missed it ;-) you're a TLP at Apache
> @see http://www.apache.org/.
>
> :-D
>
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RE: Apache James...
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> I just built what was in the head. On a positive note
> it still seemed to make some kind of sense ;-)
I checked the CVS. I'd prodded myself into merging the updates on Jan 17th,
before getting back on the road. So we're good there (whew). I did forget
to merge README.html, HEADER.html, and KEYS from the v2.1 branch, but those
aren't in the www/ tree, anyway. Something we'll fix in the site module.
> I 'gree about seperate repo's, I thought site, server, mailet api and
mailets.
> No doubt you've seen my polite q. on the infrastructure list.
Yup :-)
--- Noel
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RE: Apache James...
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
I dunno. I just built what was in the head.
On a positive note it still seemed to make some kind of sense ;-)
I 'gree about seperate repo's, I thought site, server, mailet api and mailets.
No doubt you've seen my polite q. on the infrastructure list.
d.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Noel J. Bergman [mailto:noel@devtech.com]
> Sent: 24 January 2003 19:34
> To: James Developers List
> Subject: RE: Apache James...
>
>
> Danny,
>
> No worries. If I'd have been home, I'd probably have done it too. I
> appreciate your doing it, and doing it so quickly.
>
> One concern ...
>
> Did I remember to merge the xdocs/ changes that are in the 2.1 branch into
> HEAD? This is one, but only one, reason I want to separate the web site
> from the code. The code may branch, but we have only one web site.
>
> --- Noel
>
>
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RE: Apache James...
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
Danny,
No worries. If I'd have been home, I'd probably have done it too. I
appreciate your doing it, and doing it so quickly.
One concern ...
Did I remember to merge the xdocs/ changes that are in the 2.1 branch into
HEAD? This is one, but only one, reason I want to separate the web site
from the code. The code may branch, but we have only one web site.
--- Noel
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RE: Apache James...
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
> Made perfect sense to me. At some point we may want to get our own copies
> of the download scripts, but that can wait.
I figured that as I'd done this bit I'd leave the mirrors to you... :-)
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RE: Apache James...
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> I know I'm the only one here ...
Huh?
> ... but I'm going to move the James site
> to james.apache.org and reverse the redirect
> to direct jakarta hits to james.
Made perfect sense to me. At some point we may want to get our own copies
of the download scripts, but that can wait.
--- Noel
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Re: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Serge Knystautas <se...@lokitech.com>.
Danny Angus wrote:
> The website is now here http://james.apache.org and the site files on daedalus have been moved.
> I haven't tried cvs up yet.
>
> d.
Thanks!! Looks great!
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> eventually dev@james.apache.org
>From what I've read, the mailing list bit is the most troubling change for
everyone, so I'm not in any great rush to see it happen.
--- Noel
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
eventually dev@james.apache.org
But we're waiting for best practice to emerge, so to speak, before we rush in with anything silly.
Apache isn't a sourceforge with tools to administer everything, its basically a lot of guys hum-ing and ha-ing and doing stuff.
d.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christian Andersson [mailto:ca@ofs.no]
> Sent: 23 January 2003 14:49
> To: James Developers List
> Subject: Re: http://james.apache.org
>
>
> so, will the mailinglist change address to? .-) from
> james-dev@jakarta.aache.org to james-dev@james.apache.org, or even
> possible dev@james.apache.org?
>
> I hope that the mailinglist will not be broken yet :-)
>
> >>The website is now here http://james.apache.org and the site
> >>files on daedalus have been moved.
> >>I haven't tried cvs up yet.
>
>
>
>
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Re: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Christian Andersson <ca...@ofs.no>.
so, will the mailinglist change address to? .-) from
james-dev@jakarta.aache.org to james-dev@james.apache.org, or even
possible dev@james.apache.org?
I hope that the mailinglist will not be broken yet :-)
>>The website is now here http://james.apache.org and the site
>>files on daedalus have been moved.
>>I haven't tried cvs up yet.
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Re: Logo competion..
Posted by Kenny Smith <ja...@journalscape.com>.
My wife was thinking about playing around with some images, is it cool
to make some submissions for powered by images and logos and such?
Kenny
Serge Knystautas wrote:
> Danny Angus wrote:
>
>> would he like to make the feather colours match the new apache feather
>> colours... at all..?
>>
>
>
> Sure, I asked him to see if he could make a powered-by version this
> morning, and can ask him to put out the big one with the new apache
> feature colo[u]rs.
>
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Re: Logo competion..
Posted by Serge Knystautas <se...@lokitech.com>.
Danny Angus wrote:
> would he like to make the feather colours match the new apache feather colours... at all..?
>
Sure, I asked him to see if he could make a powered-by version this
morning, and can ask him to put out the big one with the new apache
feature colo[u]rs.
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RE: Logo competion..
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
would he like to make the feather colours match the new apache feather colours... at all..?
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Serge Knystautas [mailto:sergek@lokitech.com]
> Sent: 23 January 2003 14:54
> To: James Developers List
> Subject: Re: Logo competion..
>
>
> Danny Angus wrote:
> > I remember somewhere some suggestions for a new logo, I was
> thinking that perhaps we should have a competition.
> > New name, new look kind of thing.
> >
> > Thoughts?
>
> I like the current logo... someone here (Randy Stanard) actually
> designed it, so I'm probably a bit biased. He's been doing more open
> source logos lately, like Apache Rivet (http://tcl.apache.org/rivet) and
> now Apache TCL wants him to do one. He also submitted a ton of logos
> for the POI competition and finished in spots 2 through 6 (split his own
> vote :)
>
> Anyway, my 2 cents.
>
> --
> Serge Knystautas
> Lokitech
> Software - Strategy - Design
> http://www.lokitech.com
>
>
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Re: Logo competion..
Posted by Serge Knystautas <se...@lokitech.com>.
Danny Angus wrote:
> I remember somewhere some suggestions for a new logo, I was thinking that perhaps we should have a competition.
> New name, new look kind of thing.
>
> Thoughts?
I like the current logo... someone here (Randy Stanard) actually
designed it, so I'm probably a bit biased. He's been doing more open
source logos lately, like Apache Rivet (http://tcl.apache.org/rivet) and
now Apache TCL wants him to do one. He also submitted a ton of logos
for the POI competition and finished in spots 2 through 6 (split his own
vote :)
Anyway, my 2 cents.
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RE: Logo competion..
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> New logo is fine with me, but I don't think that a name change is in
order.
Clarification: I don't care one way or the other about the logo.
--- Noel
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RE: Logo competion..
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
New logo is fine with me, but I don't think that a name change is in order.
I have a list of reasons for not changing the name, but I'd like to hear any
reasons for a change before clouding the waters.
--- Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: Danny Angus [mailto:danny@apache.org]
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 9:53
To: James Developers List
Subject: Logo competion..
I remember somewhere some suggestions for a new logo, I was thinking that
perhaps we should have a competition.
New name, new look kind of thing.
Thoughts?
d.
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Logo competion..
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
I remember somewhere some suggestions for a new logo, I was thinking that perhaps we should have a competition.
New name, new look kind of thing.
Thoughts?
d.
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
... and there's a redirect in jakarta.apache.org/james/.htaccess so links to james won't break
d.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Danny Angus [mailto:danny@apache.org]
> Sent: 23 January 2003 13:23
> To: James Developers List
> Subject: http://james.apache.org
>
>
> The website is now here http://james.apache.org and the site
> files on daedalus have been moved.
> I haven't tried cvs up yet.
>
> d.
>
>
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> The avalon-tigris skin comes with a css that can be used to change some
> parts. Look here for example, it's avalon-tigris:
> http://chaperon.sourceforge.net/
That was the one I had looked at for comparison. The font is larger than
the others I I mentioned.
> To have Forrest build the site, you have to install Forrest. That is
> download the Forrest distro, unpack it in a dir, ans set FORREST_HOME
> env variable and set the bin dir in the path.
Not too bad. There was also some talk about requiring people to install
their own current version of Ant, rather than bundling with James. Maven
would help, in that Maven can pull whatever tools are needed from the
repository.
> To have it integrated in the buildfile, Forrest comes with an entity
> that can be included in the Ant buildfile, so you can use the Forrest
> targets as they were in the buildfile itself.
That should work.
> As for Maven, it can simply in the meantime call an Ant project to run
> Forrest, till Dion or someone elso does the plugin.
Dion was working on a Maven project file for James. From what I heard, it
should be good to use as soon as Avalon releases a tagged milestone build
for inclusion in the Maven repository, and Stephen finishes the James
updates to match.
--- Noel
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Re: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Nicola Ken Barozzi <ni...@apache.org>.
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> Nicola,
>
> I prefer the new avalon-tigris skin, but I'd rather have the smaller font
> size used by Avalon or Centipede. And maybe punch the colors to match a
> color scheme drawn from the logo, perhaps our logo designer would like to
> provide some input on that score.
The avalon-tigris skin comes with a css that can be used to change some
parts. Look here for example, it's avalon-tigris:
http://chaperon.sourceforge.net/
>>So, do I have a go-ahead to do the conversion now? :-)
>
> As per Danny's comment, I think that you and Dion need to tell us how we
> would run Forrest by itself and/or through Maven. For example, could you
> update the web-site target in build.xml, and tell us what we need to have
> installed so that we can just run:
>
> $./build.sh web-site
>
> and have our new Forrest-built site?
To have Forrest build the site, you have to install Forrest. That is
download the Forrest distro, unpack it in a dir, ans set FORREST_HOME
env variable and set the bin dir in the path.
To use Forrest standalone do just "forrest".
To have it integrated in the buildfile, Forrest comes with an entity
that can be included in the Ant buildfile, so you can use the Forrest
targets as they were in the buildfile itself.
As for Maven, it can simply in the meantime call an Ant project to run
Forrest, till Dion or someone elso does the plugin.
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RE: Build process: was http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
I do recall a "shoot-out" between Maven and Forrest for the web site, and we
seemed to prefer Forrest. In discussions with Dion, he noted that Maven's
primary benefit was process and build related, and that we could seamlessly
use Forrest with Maven, getting what appeared to be the best of both worlds.
Dion has been working on a project file for James so that we can see the
benefits of Maven. As Danny says on our list (which is where this should be
discussed), we'd like to hear more about our build and web publishing
options so that we can make the informed selection.
For example, if we have james-site, james-mailet and james-server, and we
want james-site to be populated with HTML generated from javadocs in
james-mailet and james-server, is Maven able to handle such a thing? Is
Forrest?
Unlike Jakarta, our sub-projects are related. Is Maven's report generator
capable of giving us integrated reports across our sub-projects, or is it
only capable of separate reports? We will have dependencies such that
james-mailet will produce one or more jar files that james-server depends
upon. Will Maven handle that? How?
Right now, everytime I generate the build, every javadoc page is regenerated
for publication, even though the javadoc hasn't changed. Will Maven clean
up that idiotic process? Will Forrest?
--- Noel
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com>.
On Sun, 2003-01-26 at 16:26, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> Jason,
>
> When we looked at them before, the rough consensus appeared to be that we
> prefered Forrest for the publishing tool, Maven for the rest. According to
> Dion, we ought to be able to get the best of both because Maven can use
> Forrest to generate the HTML.
I was just curious what exact features in Forrest made you choose it.
I'm certainly biased as I think JSL (the tool used in Maven) and I have
never been a big fan of Cocoon. I just wanted to know what features are
present in Forrest that you think will lend toward a more coherent site?
> Dion is still working on the project file for James, I believe. I'm really
> looking forward to seeing the integrated result between Dion and Nicola's
> work. Now that James is a TLP, and will have some formal sub-projects of
> its own, I think these will be good tools to use.
>
> In fact, Serge and I were discussing tests, and I am very much hoping that
> we can add testing to our build process. I should ask Dion whether or not
> it is possible for Maven to run tests that require running an external test
> suite against a running server. In other words, first build the server,
> then start the server, then run test programs that need to provide results.
You certainly should be able to. With Plexus, the container Bob
McWhirter and I wrote, I assemble an entire runtime from the
configuration file for the application and then run tests for Tambora
against two separate runtimes. It certainly is possible as I do it with
Plexus everyday, so there's no reason why you couldn't do it with
Phoenix. You could probably rip off the plexus plugin in Maven and make
it work with Phoenix.
> --- Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jason van Zyl [mailto:jason@zenplex.com]
> Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2003 16:04
> To: James Developers List
> Subject: RE: http://james.apache.org
>
>
> On Fri, 2003-01-24 at 22:37, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> > Nicola,
> >
> > I prefer the new avalon-tigris skin, but I'd rather have the smaller font
> > size used by Avalon or Centipede. And maybe punch the colors to match a
> > color scheme drawn from the logo, perhaps our logo designer would like to
> > provide some input on that score.
>
> Can I ask why you are choosing to use Forrest instead of the
> documentation mechanism provided by Maven? I'm just curious.
>
> --
> jvz.
>
> Jason van Zyl
> jason@zenplex.com
> http://tambora.zenplex.org
>
>
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jvz.
Jason van Zyl
jason@zenplex.com
http://tambora.zenplex.org
In short, man creates for himself a new religion of a rational
and technical order to justify his work and to be justified in it.
-- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
Jason,
When we looked at them before, the rough consensus appeared to be that we
prefered Forrest for the publishing tool, Maven for the rest. According to
Dion, we ought to be able to get the best of both because Maven can use
Forrest to generate the HTML.
Dion is still working on the project file for James, I believe. I'm really
looking forward to seeing the integrated result between Dion and Nicola's
work. Now that James is a TLP, and will have some formal sub-projects of
its own, I think these will be good tools to use.
In fact, Serge and I were discussing tests, and I am very much hoping that
we can add testing to our build process. I should ask Dion whether or not
it is possible for Maven to run tests that require running an external test
suite against a running server. In other words, first build the server,
then start the server, then run test programs that need to provide results.
--- Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: Jason van Zyl [mailto:jason@zenplex.com]
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2003 16:04
To: James Developers List
Subject: RE: http://james.apache.org
On Fri, 2003-01-24 at 22:37, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> Nicola,
>
> I prefer the new avalon-tigris skin, but I'd rather have the smaller font
> size used by Avalon or Centipede. And maybe punch the colors to match a
> color scheme drawn from the logo, perhaps our logo designer would like to
> provide some input on that score.
Can I ask why you are choosing to use Forrest instead of the
documentation mechanism provided by Maven? I'm just curious.
--
jvz.
Jason van Zyl
jason@zenplex.com
http://tambora.zenplex.org
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RE: Build process: was http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> > Apparently, one of the benefits of using Maven is that a minimum
> > installation is just Maven and our project file. The user runs
> > Maven, which downloads and installs all of the requisite files
> > from the repository, including the necessary builds of third
> > party jar files.
> What is it you say Noel? ROTFLMAO! We can do that with Avalon? that is
magic.
Well, yes. It would be if the Avalon folks had actually done a Release, or
otherwise provided a coordinated set of jars. Dion could take our Jars and
rename them something like filename-james-v2.1.jar, but that's a bit silly.
I'd just as soon see Avalon do their job, and put out the ACR. And this is
one of those perfect examples for why there IS such a thing as Avalon. We
don't want piecemeal releases of technology bits.
--- Noel
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RE: Build process: was http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
> Apparently, one of the benefits of using Maven is that a minimum
> installation is just Maven and our project file. The user runs
> Maven, which
> downloads and installs all of the requisite files from the repository,
> including the necessary builds of third party jar files.
What is it you say Noel? ROTFLMAO! We can do that with Avalon? that is magic.
<disclaimer> That was just kiddin' I know lots of people are working very hard on the avalon/james version issues.</disclaimer>
d.
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RE: Build process: was http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> Anyway, I'm pretty sure I've broken where the javadocs get created, but
> if we're going to just scrap all of that, then maybe it's not important
> for me to fix it before I commit.
Until we see a/the better way working, I'm not in favor of scrapping
anything. :-) If/when Maven were to become the better way, we'd end up
"scrapping" the entirety of build.xml, as I understand it.
Apparently, one of the benefits of using Maven is that a minimum
installation is just Maven and our project file. The user runs Maven, which
downloads and installs all of the requisite files from the repository,
including the necessary builds of third party jar files.
Other benefits include a whole set of canned project reports. But I'd
rather let Dion and Jason promote Maven, and let Nicola promote Forrest.
:-) That way we will all learn more about these non-exclusive options.
--- Noel
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Re: Build process: was http://james.apache.org
Posted by Serge Knystautas <se...@lokitech.com>.
Danny Angus wrote:
> Anyway, I'm pretty sure I've broken where the javadocs get created, but
> if we're going to just scrap all of that, then maybe it's not important
> for me to fix it before I commit.
>
>
> Its pretty important for the web-site though.
Ok, I can sort that out before committing. Just didn't think we'd be
updating the website with HEAD before we moved to Forrest or whatever
the decision is.
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RE: Build process: was http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
> Anyway, I'm pretty sure I've broken where the javadocs get created, but
> if we're going to just scrap all of that, then maybe it's not important
> for me to fix it before I commit.
Its pretty important for the web-site though.
d.
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Re: Build process: was http://james.apache.org
Posted by Serge Knystautas <se...@lokitech.com>.
Danny Angus wrote:
> I'd like to see a formal proposal, so we can have a synopsis of why we need to change things, debate the benefits and drawbacks of competing systems are, and, if we don't reach concensus, a vote.
>
> I'm susceptable to persuasion on all counts, including retaining the status-quo (ant & xslt) and would like to hear someone make the case for change. Otherwise it would seem to be change for change's sake, or keeping up with the Joneses.
>
> d.
This is somewhat perpendicular to this, but could have an impact...
The tests we have right now (they don't compile, but that
notwithstanding) are functional tests, not unit tests.
So last night I created a new directory and build tasks for junit tests
on the individual classes in James. This was primarily driven by
wanting to unit test ExtraDotOutputStream, and we can use this test
build task for over unit tests as they get written.
Adding this prompted me to do some renaming in the build.xml since
between the multiple javadocs, multiple source code locations, etc...,
the naming conventions were becoming somewhat confusing. For example,
the intermediate build directories are named "build.[something]" while
the source directories are named "[something].dir".
Anyway, I'm pretty sure I've broken where the javadocs get created, but
if we're going to just scrap all of that, then maybe it's not important
for me to fix it before I commit.
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Build process: was http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
I'd like to see a formal proposal, so we can have a synopsis of why we need to change things, debate the benefits and drawbacks of competing systems are, and, if we don't reach concensus, a vote.
I'm susceptable to persuasion on all counts, including retaining the status-quo (ant & xslt) and would like to hear someone make the case for change. Otherwise it would seem to be change for change's sake, or keeping up with the Joneses.
d.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jason van Zyl [mailto:jason@zenplex.com]
> Sent: 26 January 2003 21:04
> To: James Developers List
> Subject: RE: http://james.apache.org
>
>
> On Fri, 2003-01-24 at 22:37, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> > Nicola,
> >
> > I prefer the new avalon-tigris skin, but I'd rather have the
> smaller font
> > size used by Avalon or Centipede. And maybe punch the colors to match a
> > color scheme drawn from the logo, perhaps our logo designer
> would like to
> > provide some input on that score.
>
> Can I ask why you are choosing to use Forrest instead of the
> documentation mechanism provided by Maven? I'm just curious.
>
> --
> jvz.
>
> Jason van Zyl
> jason@zenplex.com
> http://tambora.zenplex.org
>
> In short, man creates for himself a new religion of a rational
> and technical order to justify his work and to be justified in it.
>
> -- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
>
>
> --
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com>.
On Fri, 2003-01-24 at 22:37, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> Nicola,
>
> I prefer the new avalon-tigris skin, but I'd rather have the smaller font
> size used by Avalon or Centipede. And maybe punch the colors to match a
> color scheme drawn from the logo, perhaps our logo designer would like to
> provide some input on that score.
Can I ask why you are choosing to use Forrest instead of the
documentation mechanism provided by Maven? I'm just curious.
--
jvz.
Jason van Zyl
jason@zenplex.com
http://tambora.zenplex.org
In short, man creates for himself a new religion of a rational
and technical order to justify his work and to be justified in it.
-- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
Nicola,
I prefer the new avalon-tigris skin, but I'd rather have the smaller font
size used by Avalon or Centipede. And maybe punch the colors to match a
color scheme drawn from the logo, perhaps our logo designer would like to
provide some input on that score.
> So, do I have a go-ahead to do the conversion now? :-)
As per Danny's comment, I think that you and Dion need to tell us how we
would run Forrest by itself and/or through Maven. For example, could you
update the web-site target in build.xml, and tell us what we need to have
installed so that we can just run:
$./build.sh web-site
and have our new Forrest-built site?
--- Noel
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
Nicola
I vote for the krysalis skin, but there were one or two formatting issues in the conversion you did before, particularly with code samples being re-formatted on http://james.apache.org/james_and_sendmail.html
I'm also still a bit wary of changing the way our site is generated because yesterdays quick swap demonstrated that the single xslt we use now is fast and easy, and I'd hate to give that up without concrete benefit.
d.
Nicola wrote:
> My opinion is that I can all simply convert the site now and fix
> possible skin style issues as they come.
>
> So, do I have a go-ahead to do the conversion now? :-)
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Re: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Nicola Ken Barozzi <ni...@apache.org>.
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> Danny,
>
> I'd like to request that we ask for a james-site CVS module. I'd like to
> move the HTML out of our james CVS module, and I'd also like a better place
> to keep things like the .htaccess and other site related files.
>
> It might also be more convenient for Maven/Forrest. Speaking of which ...
> Nico, what is the current status of Forrest and James? :-)
Well, I had converted the site some time back, but now you guys have
changed lots of pages :-) (smile because they are really good )
There were some reservations with the style, but now we have the
avalon-tigris skin that seems ok for you. I'll be updating shortly from
some fixes.
Here are the Forrest skins now working (ps: apache webservices is using
the krysalis skin :-) )
http://xml.apache.org/forrest/
http://www.krysalis.org/centipede/
http://jakarta.apache.org/avalon/
(new avalon-tigris) http://chaperon.sourceforge.net/
My opinion is that I can all simply convert the site now and fix
possible skin style issues as they come.
So, do I have a go-ahead to do the conversion now? :-)
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Re: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Nicola Ken Barozzi <ni...@apache.org>.
Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
>
> Noel J. Bergman wrote:
>
>>> So it would seem to me that docs and code should reside in the same
>>> repo.
>>
>> Nicola, I'd like to avoid problems like when we branched v2, and I had to
>> manually update both sides because I accidentally updated the web site in
>> the v2 branch instead of HEAD. I prefer a structural solution to the
>> problem.
>
> Ahh.
>
>> I agree that generated javadocs are part of the result, but just
>> because the
>> java code is in a module doesn't mean that we can't emit the HTML into
>> another module.
>
>
> Err, it's about the doc writers that want to add javadocs, not the
> generation.
>
> Anyway, I'm not saying that having different repos is /wrong/, those
> were just things to ponder upon.
After some pondering, I understand that one thing is the site, and one
thing is the documentation.
If I branch the code, I would want to branch the docs about that code,
not about the James project. By having a site module for common James
site pages, I won't have this problem. Docs should be with the code, but
the main site is not.
Yep, this makes more sense now :-)
(Thanks also to Leo Simmons for starting it on Avalon and showing me the
benefit)
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Re: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Nicola Ken Barozzi <ni...@apache.org>.
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
>>So it would seem to me that docs and code should reside in the same
>>repo.
>
>
> Nicola, I'd like to avoid problems like when we branched v2, and I had to
> manually update both sides because I accidentally updated the web site in
> the v2 branch instead of HEAD. I prefer a structural solution to the
> problem.
Ahh.
> I agree that generated javadocs are part of the result, but just because the
> java code is in a module doesn't mean that we can't emit the HTML into
> another module.
Err, it's about the doc writers that want to add javadocs, not the
generation.
Anyway, I'm not saying that having different repos is /wrong/, those
were just things to ponder upon.
I'm happy to see how it plays out with different repos, who knows, it
might teach me something new :-)
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> So it would seem to me that docs and code should reside in the same
> repo.
Nicola, I'd like to avoid problems like when we branched v2, and I had to
manually update both sides because I accidentally updated the web site in
the v2 branch instead of HEAD. I prefer a structural solution to the
problem.
I agree that generated javadocs are part of the result, but just because the
java code is in a module doesn't mean that we can't emit the HTML into
another module.
--- Noel
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Re: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Nicola Ken Barozzi <ni...@apache.org>.
Noel J. Bergman wrote:
>>I think we should move everything "up" inside /james/ so we have
>>james/www/, james/server/, james/mailet/
>
>
> With one CVS module? We already have www/, and could reorganize src/conf
> and src/java into server/ and mailet/ structures. But that leaves us with
> some issues.
>
> First, as I mentioned earlier, one of my issues is I'd like to get the web
> site out of the same area as the code.
>
> Second, I'd like to be able to give commit rights to someone like a Nicola
> Ken to work on the web site without the code. Not that I think he'd doing
> anything wrong in the code,
>;->
> but from an indemnification perspective, one
> shouldn't have access to more than one needs.
>
> Related to that last point, there may be people to whom we would like to
> give rights to the Mailet structure; someone who is working on another
> server supporting the Mailet API, and common mailets.
>
> Right now, that requires separate modules. One Community, one PMC, but
> several sub-projects.
I have been thinking about this, and it kinda makes sense, but I'm not
*that* sure.
Concrete example: Cocoon has a documentation team with its own mailing
list. Docers have access to cocoon-dev. Commit problems? nope.
Docers, devs, apiers, all are part of the same CVS.
The upside: more feel of being part of the same community, more
possibility of getting actively involved in the rest of the code in the
future.
So it would seem to me that docs and code should reside in the same
repo. Overmore javadocs are part of the docs too, and in Cocoon we are
going to use them as in Ant to make automatic docs...
Code and Documentation IMV are very closely related.
http://krysalis.org/cgi-bin/krywiki.pl?CoPDoC
Which is also the reason why jakarta-site never took off. It's docs far
from the code.
As for the mailet, the thing is a bit different. You have explained that
you *want* the community to be possibly indipendent. Mailet would have
its own set of docs too, so the mailet docs would go there too.
Take these as ramblings, based on some thoughts springing from recent
experiences.
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
> With one CVS module?
its not an issue, when you check out instead of "cvs co james-site" do "cvs co james/site"
we don't have to tag & branch the whole repo.
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> I think we should move everything "up" inside /james/ so we have
> james/www/, james/server/, james/mailet/
With one CVS module? We already have www/, and could reorganize src/conf
and src/java into server/ and mailet/ structures. But that leaves us with
some issues.
First, as I mentioned earlier, one of my issues is I'd like to get the web
site out of the same area as the code.
Second, I'd like to be able to give commit rights to someone like a Nicola
Ken to work on the web site without the code. Not that I think he'd doing
anything wrong in the code, but from an indemnification perspective, one
shouldn't have access to more than one needs.
Related to that last point, there may be people to whom we would like to
give rights to the Mailet structure; someone who is working on another
server supporting the Mailet API, and common mailets.
Right now, that requires separate modules. One Community, one PMC, but
several sub-projects.
--- Noel
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
I think we should move everything "up" inside /james/ so we have james/www/, james/server/, james/mailet/
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Noel J. Bergman [mailto:noel@devtech.com]
> Sent: 24 January 2003 03:47
> To: James Developers List
> Subject: RE: http://james.apache.org
>
>
> Danny,
>
> I'd like to request that we ask for a james-site CVS module. I'd like to
> move the HTML out of our james CVS module, and I'd also like a
> better place
> to keep things like the .htaccess and other site related files.
>
> It might also be more convenient for Maven/Forrest. Speaking of which ...
> Nico, what is the current status of Forrest and James? :-)
>
> --- Noel
>
>
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> <ma...@jakarta.apache.org>
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RE: http://james.apache.org
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
Danny,
I'd like to request that we ask for a james-site CVS module. I'd like to
move the HTML out of our james CVS module, and I'd also like a better place
to keep things like the .htaccess and other site related files.
It might also be more convenient for Maven/Forrest. Speaking of which ...
Nico, what is the current status of Forrest and James? :-)
--- Noel
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http://james.apache.org
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
The website is now here http://james.apache.org and the site files on daedalus have been moved.
I haven't tried cvs up yet.
d.
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RE: Apache James...
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
Now I've removed it again (!) and put an http redirect in.
I know I'm the only one here, but I'm going to move the James site to james.apache.org and reverse the redirect to direct jakarta hits to james.
d.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Danny Angus [mailto:danny@apache.org]
> Sent: 23 January 2003 10:01
> To: James Developers List
> Subject: RE: Apache James...
>
>
> Applied Aaron's index page to http://james.apache.org
>
> d.
>
>
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RE: Apache James...
Posted by Danny Angus <da...@apache.org>.
Applied Aaron's index page to http://james.apache.org
d.
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Re: Apache James... HORRAY! :-D
Posted by Aaron Knauf <ak...@xtra.co.nz>.
Hmmm. That attachment doesn't seem to have made it. (I definitely did
attach it!)
Here it is, tarred/gzipped and inline too.
Cheers
ADK
---------------------
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META http-equiv="Refresh" content="5;
URL=http://jakarta.apache.org/james/">
<TITLE>Apache James</TITLE>
<LINK TITLE="Style"
HREF="http://jakarta.apache.org/james/stylesheet.css" TYPE="text/css"
REL="stylesheet">
</HEAD>
<BODY vlink="#525D76" alink="#525D76" link="#525D76" text="#000000"
bgcolor="#ffffff">
<table cellspacing="4" width="100%" border="0">
<!--PAGE HEADER-->
<tr>
<td colspan="2">
<!--JAKARTA LOGO--><a href="http://jakarta.apache.org/"><img border="0"
alt="The Jakarta Project" align="left"
src="http://jakarta.apache.org/images/jakarta-logo.gif"></a>
<!--PROJECT LOGO--><a href="http://jakarta.apache.org/james/"><img
border="0" alt="James - Java Apache Mail Enterprise Server"
align="right"
src="http://jakarta.apache.org/james/images/james-logo.jpg"></a>
</td>
</tr>
<!--HEADER SEPARATOR-->
<tr>
<td colspan="2">
<hr size="1" noshade="">
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">
<h1>Under Construction</H1>
<p>
This site is curently under construction. If your browser
does not
redirect you automatically, you can reach the Jakarta James
web site
by following <a href="http://jakarta.apache.org/james/">this
link</A>.
</p>
</td>
</tr>
</table>
</body>
</html>
-----------------------------
Aaron Knauf wrote:
> Excellent!
>
> Now - how about we try to beat those Avalon guys to getting a webpage
> up at http://james.apache.org! This just returns an empty directory
> listing at the moment. (Theirs has for weeks, now!)
>
> Here is a quick hack page that displays an under construction message,
> before redirecting the user to the jakarta site. You may wish to
> change the refresh period.
>
> ADK
>
>
> Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
>
>>
>> Congrats guys, in case you've missed it ;-) you're a TLP at Apache
>> @see http://www.apache.org/.
>>
>> :-D
>>
>
>
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Re: Apache James... HORRAY! :-D
Posted by Aaron Knauf <ak...@xtra.co.nz>.
Excellent!
Now - how about we try to beat those Avalon guys to getting a webpage up
at http://james.apache.org! This just returns an empty directory
listing at the moment. (Theirs has for weeks, now!)
Here is a quick hack page that displays an under construction message,
before redirecting the user to the jakarta site. You may wish to change
the refresh period.
ADK
Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
>
> Congrats guys, in case you've missed it ;-) you're a TLP at Apache
> @see http://www.apache.org/.
>
> :-D
>