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Posted to dev@tomee.apache.org by David Blevins <da...@gmail.com> on 2018/05/01 22:13:09 UTC

Re: [VOTE] Explore creating a reusable JWT Library

Requested a repo we could potentially use for this.

Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line tools for converting between them.

This could be useful to both the TomEE and Geronimo MicroProfile JWT impls.


-- 
David Blevins
http://twitter.com/dblevins
http://www.tomitribe.com

> On Apr 4, 2018, at 5:32 AM, Jean-Louis Monteiro <jl...@tomitribe.com> wrote:
> 
> The code still is in a PR (#123) for the moment
> 
> I'm in to help.
> Still some small fixes to do and I'd like MP-Config to be used to configure
> keys, issues, and others.
> 
> --
> Jean-Louis Monteiro
> http://twitter.com/jlouismonteiro
> http://www.tomitribe.com
> 
> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 1:06 PM, Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de.invalid>
> wrote:
> 
>> As noted elsewhere: the vote question was a mixture of 'what do you
>> think' (consensus -> majority vote)  and 'is it ok' (technical -> unanimous
>> vote).
>> I'd also be in favour to do the generic parts in Geronimo and only do the
>> integration in TomEE. So yes, in a consensus vote I'd also vote -1. If this
>> is interpreted as commit vote then I vote -0
>> The work is the same and as long as it's been done I'm fine either ways.
>> Now that we did all the 3 weeks of rambling and discussions let's focus on
>> the important stuff.
>> Where is the code? Who did already work on it? Or do we again have 30
>> people discussing but just 2 working? ;)
>> 
>> LieGrue,strub
>>    On Wednesday, 4 April 2018, 01:14:57 CEST, David Blevins <
>> david.blevins@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> On Mar 31, 2018, at 2:16 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau <rm...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> It was more as a "if im always the only one seeing tomee differently i
>> can
>>> leave to let you space". Not as a threat.
>> 
>> That's a generous sentiment.  Either way the best outcome is that you stay
>> and we all learn the lesson that disagreeing is ok and healthy.  How is the
>> most important part.
>> 
>> Disagreement can be an incredibly productive and innovative thing if done
>> right.  By definition, that means this project is sitting on some
>> incredible innovative potential.
>> 
>> A concrete way I think we can measure ourselves is by the number of people
>> who feel comfortable voting.  I would consider a vote of 20 people that
>> included 3 -1 votes to be significantly more healthy than a vote of 3
>> people and all +1s.
>> 
>>> [...]
>>> There is no veto at apache if you check rules closely. All is more about
>>> respect and overall consensus IIRC.
>> 
>> I want to be careful that we don't learn a false lesson as Apache does
>> have technical vetos.  These are more meant for line-of-code level input vs
>> community direction.
>> 
>> The intention of the two votes was to make the line a little more clear.
>> 
>> - The first vote "Merge Pull Request 123 - MicroProfile JWT support" was
>> intended to flush out line-of-code level technical issues with the PR:
>> breaks the build; doesn't follow code style; introduces security issues.
>> It's ultimately a Review-than-Commit vote and a -1 should be viewed as a
>> technical veto.
>> 
>> - The second vote "Explore creating a reusable JWT Library" was intended
>> to determine overall desire on what the next step should be.  No commit
>> being reviewed, more of a community level discussion.  A -1 should not be
>> viewed as a veto.
>> 
>> 
>> -David
>> 
>> 


Re: [VOTE] Explore creating a reusable JWT Library

Posted by Romain Manni-Bucau <rm...@gmail.com>.
CXF doesn't do that AFAIK and fully relies on the JVM API, Tomcat has some
code (
https://github.com/apache/tomcat/blob/trunk/java/org/apache/tomcat/util/net/openssl/OpenSSLContext.java)
but it is not much reusable so having a kind of commons-keys (bouncycastle
@asf to not hide it ;)).


Romain Manni-Bucau
@rmannibucau <https://twitter.com/rmannibucau> |  Blog
<https://rmannibucau.metawerx.net/> | Old Blog
<http://rmannibucau.wordpress.com> | Github <https://github.com/rmannibucau> |
LinkedIn <https://www.linkedin.com/in/rmannibucau> | Book
<https://www.packtpub.com/application-development/java-ee-8-high-performance>

2018-05-02 10:28 GMT+02:00 Matthew Broadhead <matthew.broadhead@nbmlaw.co.uk
>:

> aren't there apache projects already dealing with public key formats?  cxf
> must have done a lot of work on that?  would this just be a wrapper to
> existing libs?
>
>
>
> On 02/05/18 10:03, Jean-Louis Monteiro wrote:
>
>> PCS8 "standard" or not is probably the one to no miss
>>
>> --
>> Jean-Louis Monteiro
>> http://twitter.com/jlouismonteiro
>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>>
>> On Wed, May 2, 2018 at 6:27 AM, Rudy De Busscher <rd...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format
>>>> manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to
>>>> come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all
>>>> the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line
>>>>
>>> tools
>>>
>>>> for converting between them.
>>>>
>>>
>>> That would be super awesome. I have been working on the same thing the
>>> past
>>> month or so.
>>>
>>> Rudy
>>>
>>> On 2 May 2018 at 00:13, David Blevins <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Requested a repo we could potentially use for this.
>>>>
>>>> Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format
>>>> manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to
>>>> come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all
>>>> the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line
>>>>
>>> tools
>>>
>>>> for converting between them.
>>>>
>>>> This could be useful to both the TomEE and Geronimo MicroProfile JWT
>>>>
>>> impls.
>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> David Blevins
>>>> http://twitter.com/dblevins
>>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>>>>
>>>> On Apr 4, 2018, at 5:32 AM, Jean-Louis Monteiro <
>>>>>
>>>> jlmonteiro@tomitribe.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The code still is in a PR (#123) for the moment
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm in to help.
>>>>> Still some small fixes to do and I'd like MP-Config to be used to
>>>>>
>>>> configure
>>>>
>>>>> keys, issues, and others.
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Jean-Louis Monteiro
>>>>> http://twitter.com/jlouismonteiro
>>>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 1:06 PM, Mark Struberg
>>>>>
>>>> <struberg@yahoo.de.invalid
>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> As noted elsewhere: the vote question was a mixture of 'what do you
>>>>>> think' (consensus -> majority vote)  and 'is it ok' (technical ->
>>>>>>
>>>>> unanimous
>>>>
>>>>> vote).
>>>>>> I'd also be in favour to do the generic parts in Geronimo and only do
>>>>>>
>>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>> integration in TomEE. So yes, in a consensus vote I'd also vote -1. If
>>>>>>
>>>>> this
>>>>
>>>>> is interpreted as commit vote then I vote -0
>>>>>> The work is the same and as long as it's been done I'm fine either
>>>>>>
>>>>> ways.
>>>
>>>> Now that we did all the 3 weeks of rambling and discussions let's
>>>>>>
>>>>> focus
>>>
>>>> on
>>>>
>>>>> the important stuff.
>>>>>> Where is the code? Who did already work on it? Or do we again have 30
>>>>>> people discussing but just 2 working? ;)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> LieGrue,strub
>>>>>>     On Wednesday, 4 April 2018, 01:14:57 CEST, David Blevins <
>>>>>> david.blevins@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mar 31, 2018, at 2:16 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau <
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> rmannibucau@gmail.com
>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It was more as a "if im always the only one seeing tomee differently
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> i
>>>
>>>> can
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> leave to let you space". Not as a threat.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's a generous sentiment.  Either way the best outcome is that you
>>>>>>
>>>>> stay
>>>>
>>>>> and we all learn the lesson that disagreeing is ok and healthy.  How
>>>>>>
>>>>> is
>>>
>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>> most important part.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Disagreement can be an incredibly productive and innovative thing if
>>>>>>
>>>>> done
>>>>
>>>>> right.  By definition, that means this project is sitting on some
>>>>>> incredible innovative potential.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A concrete way I think we can measure ourselves is by the number of
>>>>>>
>>>>> people
>>>>
>>>>> who feel comfortable voting.  I would consider a vote of 20 people
>>>>>>
>>>>> that
>>>
>>>> included 3 -1 votes to be significantly more healthy than a vote of 3
>>>>>> people and all +1s.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [...]
>>>>>>> There is no veto at apache if you check rules closely. All is more
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> about
>>>>
>>>>> respect and overall consensus IIRC.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> I want to be careful that we don't learn a false lesson as Apache does
>>>>>> have technical vetos.  These are more meant for line-of-code level
>>>>>>
>>>>> input vs
>>>>
>>>>> community direction.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The intention of the two votes was to make the line a little more
>>>>>>
>>>>> clear.
>>>
>>>> - The first vote "Merge Pull Request 123 - MicroProfile JWT support"
>>>>>>
>>>>> was
>>>
>>>> intended to flush out line-of-code level technical issues with the PR:
>>>>>> breaks the build; doesn't follow code style; introduces security
>>>>>>
>>>>> issues.
>>>
>>>> It's ultimately a Review-than-Commit vote and a -1 should be viewed
>>>>>>
>>>>> as a
>>>
>>>> technical veto.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - The second vote "Explore creating a reusable JWT Library" was
>>>>>>
>>>>> intended
>>>
>>>> to determine overall desire on what the next step should be.  No
>>>>>>
>>>>> commit
>>>
>>>> being reviewed, more of a community level discussion.  A -1 should not
>>>>>>
>>>>> be
>>>>
>>>>> viewed as a veto.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -David
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>

Re: [VOTE] Explore creating a reusable JWT Library

Posted by Matthew Broadhead <ma...@nbmlaw.co.uk>.
aren't there apache projects already dealing with public key formats?  
cxf must have done a lot of work on that?  would this just be a wrapper 
to existing libs?


On 02/05/18 10:03, Jean-Louis Monteiro wrote:
> PCS8 "standard" or not is probably the one to no miss
>
> --
> Jean-Louis Monteiro
> http://twitter.com/jlouismonteiro
> http://www.tomitribe.com
>
> On Wed, May 2, 2018 at 6:27 AM, Rudy De Busscher <rd...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>> Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format
>>> manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to
>>> come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all
>>> the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line
>> tools
>>> for converting between them.
>>
>> That would be super awesome. I have been working on the same thing the past
>> month or so.
>>
>> Rudy
>>
>> On 2 May 2018 at 00:13, David Blevins <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Requested a repo we could potentially use for this.
>>>
>>> Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format
>>> manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to
>>> come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all
>>> the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line
>> tools
>>> for converting between them.
>>>
>>> This could be useful to both the TomEE and Geronimo MicroProfile JWT
>> impls.
>>>
>>> --
>>> David Blevins
>>> http://twitter.com/dblevins
>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>>>
>>>> On Apr 4, 2018, at 5:32 AM, Jean-Louis Monteiro <
>>> jlmonteiro@tomitribe.com> wrote:
>>>> The code still is in a PR (#123) for the moment
>>>>
>>>> I'm in to help.
>>>> Still some small fixes to do and I'd like MP-Config to be used to
>>> configure
>>>> keys, issues, and others.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Jean-Louis Monteiro
>>>> http://twitter.com/jlouismonteiro
>>>> http://www.tomitribe.com
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 1:06 PM, Mark Struberg
>> <struberg@yahoo.de.invalid
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> As noted elsewhere: the vote question was a mixture of 'what do you
>>>>> think' (consensus -> majority vote)  and 'is it ok' (technical ->
>>> unanimous
>>>>> vote).
>>>>> I'd also be in favour to do the generic parts in Geronimo and only do
>>> the
>>>>> integration in TomEE. So yes, in a consensus vote I'd also vote -1. If
>>> this
>>>>> is interpreted as commit vote then I vote -0
>>>>> The work is the same and as long as it's been done I'm fine either
>> ways.
>>>>> Now that we did all the 3 weeks of rambling and discussions let's
>> focus
>>> on
>>>>> the important stuff.
>>>>> Where is the code? Who did already work on it? Or do we again have 30
>>>>> people discussing but just 2 working? ;)
>>>>>
>>>>> LieGrue,strub
>>>>>     On Wednesday, 4 April 2018, 01:14:57 CEST, David Blevins <
>>>>> david.blevins@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mar 31, 2018, at 2:16 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau <
>> rmannibucau@gmail.com
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> It was more as a "if im always the only one seeing tomee differently
>> i
>>>>> can
>>>>>> leave to let you space". Not as a threat.
>>>>> That's a generous sentiment.  Either way the best outcome is that you
>>> stay
>>>>> and we all learn the lesson that disagreeing is ok and healthy.  How
>> is
>>> the
>>>>> most important part.
>>>>>
>>>>> Disagreement can be an incredibly productive and innovative thing if
>>> done
>>>>> right.  By definition, that means this project is sitting on some
>>>>> incredible innovative potential.
>>>>>
>>>>> A concrete way I think we can measure ourselves is by the number of
>>> people
>>>>> who feel comfortable voting.  I would consider a vote of 20 people
>> that
>>>>> included 3 -1 votes to be significantly more healthy than a vote of 3
>>>>> people and all +1s.
>>>>>
>>>>>> [...]
>>>>>> There is no veto at apache if you check rules closely. All is more
>>> about
>>>>>> respect and overall consensus IIRC.
>>>>> I want to be careful that we don't learn a false lesson as Apache does
>>>>> have technical vetos.  These are more meant for line-of-code level
>>> input vs
>>>>> community direction.
>>>>>
>>>>> The intention of the two votes was to make the line a little more
>> clear.
>>>>> - The first vote "Merge Pull Request 123 - MicroProfile JWT support"
>> was
>>>>> intended to flush out line-of-code level technical issues with the PR:
>>>>> breaks the build; doesn't follow code style; introduces security
>> issues.
>>>>> It's ultimately a Review-than-Commit vote and a -1 should be viewed
>> as a
>>>>> technical veto.
>>>>>
>>>>> - The second vote "Explore creating a reusable JWT Library" was
>> intended
>>>>> to determine overall desire on what the next step should be.  No
>> commit
>>>>> being reviewed, more of a community level discussion.  A -1 should not
>>> be
>>>>> viewed as a veto.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -David
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>


Re: [VOTE] Explore creating a reusable JWT Library

Posted by Jean-Louis Monteiro <jl...@tomitribe.com>.
PCS8 "standard" or not is probably the one to no miss

--
Jean-Louis Monteiro
http://twitter.com/jlouismonteiro
http://www.tomitribe.com

On Wed, May 2, 2018 at 6:27 AM, Rudy De Busscher <rd...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> >
> > Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format
> > manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to
> > come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all
> > the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line
> tools
> > for converting between them.
>
>
> That would be super awesome. I have been working on the same thing the past
> month or so.
>
> Rudy
>
> On 2 May 2018 at 00:13, David Blevins <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Requested a repo we could potentially use for this.
> >
> > Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format
> > manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to
> > come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all
> > the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line
> tools
> > for converting between them.
> >
> > This could be useful to both the TomEE and Geronimo MicroProfile JWT
> impls.
> >
> >
> > --
> > David Blevins
> > http://twitter.com/dblevins
> > http://www.tomitribe.com
> >
> > > On Apr 4, 2018, at 5:32 AM, Jean-Louis Monteiro <
> > jlmonteiro@tomitribe.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > The code still is in a PR (#123) for the moment
> > >
> > > I'm in to help.
> > > Still some small fixes to do and I'd like MP-Config to be used to
> > configure
> > > keys, issues, and others.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Jean-Louis Monteiro
> > > http://twitter.com/jlouismonteiro
> > > http://www.tomitribe.com
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 1:06 PM, Mark Struberg
> <struberg@yahoo.de.invalid
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> As noted elsewhere: the vote question was a mixture of 'what do you
> > >> think' (consensus -> majority vote)  and 'is it ok' (technical ->
> > unanimous
> > >> vote).
> > >> I'd also be in favour to do the generic parts in Geronimo and only do
> > the
> > >> integration in TomEE. So yes, in a consensus vote I'd also vote -1. If
> > this
> > >> is interpreted as commit vote then I vote -0
> > >> The work is the same and as long as it's been done I'm fine either
> ways.
> > >> Now that we did all the 3 weeks of rambling and discussions let's
> focus
> > on
> > >> the important stuff.
> > >> Where is the code? Who did already work on it? Or do we again have 30
> > >> people discussing but just 2 working? ;)
> > >>
> > >> LieGrue,strub
> > >>    On Wednesday, 4 April 2018, 01:14:57 CEST, David Blevins <
> > >> david.blevins@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> On Mar 31, 2018, at 2:16 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau <
> rmannibucau@gmail.com
> > >
> > >> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> It was more as a "if im always the only one seeing tomee differently
> i
> > >> can
> > >>> leave to let you space". Not as a threat.
> > >>
> > >> That's a generous sentiment.  Either way the best outcome is that you
> > stay
> > >> and we all learn the lesson that disagreeing is ok and healthy.  How
> is
> > the
> > >> most important part.
> > >>
> > >> Disagreement can be an incredibly productive and innovative thing if
> > done
> > >> right.  By definition, that means this project is sitting on some
> > >> incredible innovative potential.
> > >>
> > >> A concrete way I think we can measure ourselves is by the number of
> > people
> > >> who feel comfortable voting.  I would consider a vote of 20 people
> that
> > >> included 3 -1 votes to be significantly more healthy than a vote of 3
> > >> people and all +1s.
> > >>
> > >>> [...]
> > >>> There is no veto at apache if you check rules closely. All is more
> > about
> > >>> respect and overall consensus IIRC.
> > >>
> > >> I want to be careful that we don't learn a false lesson as Apache does
> > >> have technical vetos.  These are more meant for line-of-code level
> > input vs
> > >> community direction.
> > >>
> > >> The intention of the two votes was to make the line a little more
> clear.
> > >>
> > >> - The first vote "Merge Pull Request 123 - MicroProfile JWT support"
> was
> > >> intended to flush out line-of-code level technical issues with the PR:
> > >> breaks the build; doesn't follow code style; introduces security
> issues.
> > >> It's ultimately a Review-than-Commit vote and a -1 should be viewed
> as a
> > >> technical veto.
> > >>
> > >> - The second vote "Explore creating a reusable JWT Library" was
> intended
> > >> to determine overall desire on what the next step should be.  No
> commit
> > >> being reviewed, more of a community level discussion.  A -1 should not
> > be
> > >> viewed as a veto.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -David
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >
>

Re: [VOTE] Explore creating a reusable JWT Library

Posted by Rudy De Busscher <rd...@gmail.com>.
>
> Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format
> manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to
> come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all
> the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line tools
> for converting between them.


That would be super awesome. I have been working on the same thing the past
month or so.

Rudy

On 2 May 2018 at 00:13, David Blevins <da...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Requested a repo we could potentially use for this.
>
> Primarily what I'd like to do is really nail the public key format
> manipulation.  I did a huge amount of research in this and would like to
> come up with an extremely well tested library that can natively read all
> the dominate file formats PKCS 1 & 5 PEM, JWK{S} and has command-line tools
> for converting between them.
>
> This could be useful to both the TomEE and Geronimo MicroProfile JWT impls.
>
>
> --
> David Blevins
> http://twitter.com/dblevins
> http://www.tomitribe.com
>
> > On Apr 4, 2018, at 5:32 AM, Jean-Louis Monteiro <
> jlmonteiro@tomitribe.com> wrote:
> >
> > The code still is in a PR (#123) for the moment
> >
> > I'm in to help.
> > Still some small fixes to do and I'd like MP-Config to be used to
> configure
> > keys, issues, and others.
> >
> > --
> > Jean-Louis Monteiro
> > http://twitter.com/jlouismonteiro
> > http://www.tomitribe.com
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 1:06 PM, Mark Struberg <struberg@yahoo.de.invalid
> >
> > wrote:
> >
> >> As noted elsewhere: the vote question was a mixture of 'what do you
> >> think' (consensus -> majority vote)  and 'is it ok' (technical ->
> unanimous
> >> vote).
> >> I'd also be in favour to do the generic parts in Geronimo and only do
> the
> >> integration in TomEE. So yes, in a consensus vote I'd also vote -1. If
> this
> >> is interpreted as commit vote then I vote -0
> >> The work is the same and as long as it's been done I'm fine either ways.
> >> Now that we did all the 3 weeks of rambling and discussions let's focus
> on
> >> the important stuff.
> >> Where is the code? Who did already work on it? Or do we again have 30
> >> people discussing but just 2 working? ;)
> >>
> >> LieGrue,strub
> >>    On Wednesday, 4 April 2018, 01:14:57 CEST, David Blevins <
> >> david.blevins@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Mar 31, 2018, at 2:16 AM, Romain Manni-Bucau <rmannibucau@gmail.com
> >
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> It was more as a "if im always the only one seeing tomee differently i
> >> can
> >>> leave to let you space". Not as a threat.
> >>
> >> That's a generous sentiment.  Either way the best outcome is that you
> stay
> >> and we all learn the lesson that disagreeing is ok and healthy.  How is
> the
> >> most important part.
> >>
> >> Disagreement can be an incredibly productive and innovative thing if
> done
> >> right.  By definition, that means this project is sitting on some
> >> incredible innovative potential.
> >>
> >> A concrete way I think we can measure ourselves is by the number of
> people
> >> who feel comfortable voting.  I would consider a vote of 20 people that
> >> included 3 -1 votes to be significantly more healthy than a vote of 3
> >> people and all +1s.
> >>
> >>> [...]
> >>> There is no veto at apache if you check rules closely. All is more
> about
> >>> respect and overall consensus IIRC.
> >>
> >> I want to be careful that we don't learn a false lesson as Apache does
> >> have technical vetos.  These are more meant for line-of-code level
> input vs
> >> community direction.
> >>
> >> The intention of the two votes was to make the line a little more clear.
> >>
> >> - The first vote "Merge Pull Request 123 - MicroProfile JWT support" was
> >> intended to flush out line-of-code level technical issues with the PR:
> >> breaks the build; doesn't follow code style; introduces security issues.
> >> It's ultimately a Review-than-Commit vote and a -1 should be viewed as a
> >> technical veto.
> >>
> >> - The second vote "Explore creating a reusable JWT Library" was intended
> >> to determine overall desire on what the next step should be.  No commit
> >> being reviewed, more of a community level discussion.  A -1 should not
> be
> >> viewed as a veto.
> >>
> >>
> >> -David
> >>
> >>
>
>