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Posted to users@subversion.apache.org by kf...@collab.net on 2003/11/09 03:33:11 UTC
making the "rXXXX" convention official
Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
instead of
rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
We all seem to have settled into the "rXXXX" convention pretty well,
judging from emails and the issue tracker. It's an elegant shorthand
that's good for regexp matching, and it has no spaces, hence is never
broken across lines.
If 'svn log' output uses it, that will help new users fall into the
same convention faster. Also, we'll save three characters of width.
(I'd also adjust tools/dev/svn-dev.el:svn-log-msg-boundary-regexp to
match the new convention. I didn't see any other tools that needed
adjusting, but let me know if I missed any.)
-Karl
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
Sorry. Subversion repository browser. My error.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
Files said:
> I don't mind. But I question the need.
>
> The RPM build set currently uses the rev data, as does the subversion
> repository I have been working on, as do a bunch of other little utilities
> I've got.
>
> I've never really seen the need for the rXXXX EXCEPT in determining the
> blessed version of the Subversion programs themselves.
>
> -1 IMHO.
> --
> Shamim Islam
> BA BS
>
> kfogel@collab.net said:
>> Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
>>
>> r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>>
>> instead of
>>
>> rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
Sorry. Subversion repository browser. My error.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
Files said:
> I don't mind. But I question the need.
>
> The RPM build set currently uses the rev data, as does the subversion
> repository I have been working on, as do a bunch of other little utilities
> I've got.
>
> I've never really seen the need for the rXXXX EXCEPT in determining the
> blessed version of the Subversion programs themselves.
>
> -1 IMHO.
> --
> Shamim Islam
> BA BS
>
> kfogel@collab.net said:
>> Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
>>
>> r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>>
>> instead of
>>
>> rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
I don't mind. But I question the need.
The RPM build set currently uses the rev data, as does the subversion
repository I have been working on, as do a bunch of other little utilities
I've got.
I've never really seen the need for the rXXXX EXCEPT in determining the
blessed version of the Subversion programs themselves.
-1 IMHO.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
kfogel@collab.net said:
> Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
>
> r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>
> instead of
>
> rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
I don't mind. But I question the need.
The RPM build set currently uses the rev data, as does the subversion
repository I have been working on, as do a bunch of other little utilities
I've got.
I've never really seen the need for the rXXXX EXCEPT in determining the
blessed version of the Subversion programs themselves.
-1 IMHO.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
kfogel@collab.net said:
> Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
>
> r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>
> instead of
>
> rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
Greg Hudson said:
> This is going to come across as unfriendly, but: please cut down on the
> "musing out loud" on the dev list. It's a very high-traffic list even
Ok.
I still vote -1 on the changing from 'rev XXXX' to 'rXXXX'. I would have been
surprised to see the 'r' in place of the abbreviation 'rev' when I first
started as a subversion newbie. I can now logically surmise that it might have
had something to do with the flag, but not everyone thinks along those lines.
Thanks.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Greg Hudson <gh...@MIT.EDU>.
On Mon, 2003-11-10 at 14:07, Files wrote:
> I agree on the user-friendliness part. Just wondering if we could have used -
> instead maybe? Just a thought in passing.
>
> - is only a character class meta-character.
There is sometimes a balance to be struck between human-readability and
machine-readability, but here the appropriate call is clear: one should
never ever choose punctuation in a human-readable output format based on
what characters are special in a regexp.
> Doesn't matter. I'm just musing out loud. Don't mind me.
This is going to come across as unfriendly, but: please cut down on the
"musing out loud" on the dev list. It's a very high-traffic list even
without your contributions, which have been extremely prolific. When
the development community is this active, we all need to exercise
restraint and restrict ourselves to carefully thought-out commentary.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
Agreed - the issue is when the underlying platform starts using the |
character all of a sudden.
For example, recently, PHP started using the regexes for their split() function.
They did not do so in the past. So anywhere there was a meta-character used,
it broke the code. In the subversion example, I had to go back through and add
\| everywhere.
Just pointing out that subversion might not be causing the problem but we
might be mitigating it. :)
I agree on the user-friendliness part. Just wondering if we could have used -
instead maybe? Just a thought in passing.
- is only a character class meta-character.
Doesn't matter. I'm just musing out loud. Don't mind me.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
kfogel@collab.net said:
> "Files" <fi...@poetryunlimited.com> writes:
> We have been using "|" as a separator since the first 'svn log'
> output. The only difference is that now we're using it in the one
> place left where it wasn't used.
>
> We are balancing regexp friendliness against human-eye friendliness.
>
> This won't hurt anyone who actually tests their code.
>
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
Agreed - the issue is when the underlying platform starts using the |
character all of a sudden.
For example, recently, PHP started using the regexes for their split() function.
They did not do so in the past. So anywhere there was a meta-character used,
it broke the code. In the subversion example, I had to go back through and add
\| everywhere.
Just pointing out that subversion might not be causing the problem but we
might be mitigating it. :)
I agree on the user-friendliness part. Just wondering if we could have used -
instead maybe? Just a thought in passing.
- is only a character class meta-character.
Doesn't matter. I'm just musing out loud. Don't mind me.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
kfogel@collab.net said:
> "Files" <fi...@poetryunlimited.com> writes:
> We have been using "|" as a separator since the first 'svn log'
> output. The only difference is that now we're using it in the one
> place left where it wasn't used.
>
> We are balancing regexp friendliness against human-eye friendliness.
>
> This won't hurt anyone who actually tests their code.
>
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by kf...@collab.net.
"Files" <fi...@poetryunlimited.com> writes:
> | is a tough choice IMHO for separating content. | is the alternate regex
> match character. If we're really making this more regex friendly, maybe it's
> time to look at that first? There's gotta be a better way.
>
> To boot, more and more code is automatically using regex behind the scenes,
> which makes for breaking a pattern VERY easy when you use metacharacters to
> separate your content.
We have been using "|" as a separator since the first 'svn log'
output. The only difference is that now we're using it in the one
place left where it wasn't used.
We are balancing regexp friendliness against human-eye friendliness.
This won't hurt anyone who actually tests their code.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by kf...@collab.net.
"Files" <fi...@poetryunlimited.com> writes:
> | is a tough choice IMHO for separating content. | is the alternate regex
> match character. If we're really making this more regex friendly, maybe it's
> time to look at that first? There's gotta be a better way.
>
> To boot, more and more code is automatically using regex behind the scenes,
> which makes for breaking a pattern VERY easy when you use metacharacters to
> separate your content.
We have been using "|" as a separator since the first 'svn log'
output. The only difference is that now we're using it in the one
place left where it wasn't used.
We are balancing regexp friendliness against human-eye friendliness.
This won't hurt anyone who actually tests their code.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
| is a tough choice IMHO for separating content. | is the alternate regex
match character. If we're really making this more regex friendly, maybe it's
time to look at that first? There's gotta be a better way.
To boot, more and more code is automatically using regex behind the scenes,
which makes for breaking a pattern VERY easy when you use metacharacters to
separate your content.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
kfogel@collab.net said:
> I should have said, three in general, but two in this case, because
> the proposal also regularizes the use of " | " as a separator pattern
> in the log headers.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Files <fi...@poetryunlimited.com>.
| is a tough choice IMHO for separating content. | is the alternate regex
match character. If we're really making this more regex friendly, maybe it's
time to look at that first? There's gotta be a better way.
To boot, more and more code is automatically using regex behind the scenes,
which makes for breaking a pattern VERY easy when you use metacharacters to
separate your content.
--
Shamim Islam
BA BS
kfogel@collab.net said:
> I should have said, three in general, but two in this case, because
> the proposal also regularizes the use of " | " as a separator pattern
> in the log headers.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by kf...@collab.net.
kfogel@collab.net writes:
> If 'svn log' output uses it, that will help new users fall into the
> same convention faster. Also, we'll save three characters of width.
^^^^^
I should have said, three in general, but two in this case, because
the proposal also regularizes the use of " | " as a separator pattern
in the log headers.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Brian Denny <br...@briandenny.net>.
On Tue, Nov 11, 2003 at 07:59:51PM +0000, Barry Scott wrote:
> Be consistent then. Leave the log output as it is.
How would that be consistent?
The old log output says "rev 1045", which isn't consistent with
anything.
The new output "r1045" is at least consistent with "svn ls -r1045".
-brian
> >> Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org> writes:
> >> > And on input it must work as well.
> >> >
> >> > svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org>.
Be consistent then. Leave the log output as it is.
Barry
At 10-11-2003 15:55, C. Michael Pilato wrote:
>kfogel@collab.net writes:
>
> > Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org> writes:
> > > And on input it must work as well.
> > >
> > > svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
> >
> > "must"? :-)
> >
> > That's a bikeshed I have no interest in painting. If someone feels
> > it's important, they should feel free to do it.
>
>I'll paint it. Or, more specifically, I'll paint *over* it, ugliness
>that it is. -1. Karl's desire to see 'rXXXX' makes sense where
>"revision" or "r" is not already present. This is not the case for
>--revision or -r.
>
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org>.
Be consistent then. Leave the log output as it is.
Barry
At 10-11-2003 15:55, C. Michael Pilato wrote:
>kfogel@collab.net writes:
>
> > Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org> writes:
> > > And on input it must work as well.
> > >
> > > svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
> >
> > "must"? :-)
> >
> > That's a bikeshed I have no interest in painting. If someone feels
> > it's important, they should feel free to do it.
>
>I'll paint it. Or, more specifically, I'll paint *over* it, ugliness
>that it is. -1. Karl's desire to see 'rXXXX' makes sense where
>"revision" or "r" is not already present. This is not the case for
>--revision or -r.
>
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by "C. Michael Pilato" <cm...@collab.net>.
kfogel@collab.net writes:
> Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org> writes:
> > And on input it must work as well.
> >
> > svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
>
> "must"? :-)
>
> That's a bikeshed I have no interest in painting. If someone feels
> it's important, they should feel free to do it.
I'll paint it. Or, more specifically, I'll paint *over* it, ugliness
that it is. -1. Karl's desire to see 'rXXXX' makes sense where
"revision" or "r" is not already present. This is not the case for
--revision or -r.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by "C. Michael Pilato" <cm...@collab.net>.
kfogel@collab.net writes:
> Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org> writes:
> > And on input it must work as well.
> >
> > svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
>
> "must"? :-)
>
> That's a bikeshed I have no interest in painting. If someone feels
> it's important, they should feel free to do it.
I'll paint it. Or, more specifically, I'll paint *over* it, ugliness
that it is. -1. Karl's desire to see 'rXXXX' makes sense where
"revision" or "r" is not already present. This is not the case for
--revision or -r.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by kf...@collab.net.
Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org> writes:
> And on input it must work as well.
>
> svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
"must"? :-)
That's a bikeshed I have no interest in painting. If someone feels
it's important, they should feel free to do it.
-K
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by kf...@collab.net.
Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org> writes:
> And on input it must work as well.
>
> svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
"must"? :-)
That's a bikeshed I have no interest in painting. If someone feels
it's important, they should feel free to do it.
-K
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org>.
And on input it must work as well.
svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
Barry
At 09-11-2003 21:14, C. Michael Pilato wrote:
>kfogel@collab.net writes:
>
> > Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
> >
> > r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
> >
> > instead of
> >
> > rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>
>Gopherit.
>
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by Barry Scott <ba...@barrys-emacs.org>.
And on input it must work as well.
svn ls --revision r1045:r2065
Barry
At 09-11-2003 21:14, C. Michael Pilato wrote:
>kfogel@collab.net writes:
>
> > Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
> >
> > r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
> >
> > instead of
> >
> > rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>
>Gopherit.
>
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by "C. Michael Pilato" <cm...@collab.net>.
kfogel@collab.net writes:
> Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
>
> r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>
> instead of
>
> rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
Gopherit.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by kf...@collab.net.
kfogel@collab.net writes:
> If 'svn log' output uses it, that will help new users fall into the
> same convention faster. Also, we'll save three characters of width.
^^^^^
I should have said, three in general, but two in this case, because
the proposal also regularizes the use of " | " as a separator pattern
in the log headers.
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Re: making the "rXXXX" convention official
Posted by "C. Michael Pilato" <cm...@collab.net>.
kfogel@collab.net writes:
> Anyone mind if I tweak 'svn log' output to print
>
> r7673 | jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
>
> instead of
>
> rev 7673: jszakmeister | 2003-11-07 16:35:54 ... | ...
Gopherit.
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