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Posted to general@incubator.apache.org by Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> on 2013/05/10 04:29:21 UTC
Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
Hey Marvin,
Did you get anywhere with this?
Thanks,
On 30 March 2013 15:39, Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Mar 30, 2013 at 8:06 AM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
> > Thanks Greg. Sane advice. I'll add this to my todo list and see if I can
> > come up with a patch for the docs.
>
> The obvious place to patch is the descriptive paragraph here:
>
> http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
>
> However, I question whether decisions about mailing lists should be made by
> the small group that typically works up a proposal. Why not start off with
> just a dev list and have the entire community participate in discussions
> about
> what additional mailing lists to add?
>
> * Do we need a user@ list yet?
> * Where should commit notifications be sent?
> * Where should issue tracker notifications be sent?
> * Should we add an announce@ list?
>
> These questions all have interesting implications with regard to community
> dynamics, and I think it would benefit podlings to be considering them
> early
> on.
>
> So, I'd like to propose a page describing the various mailing list choices
> that top-level Apache projects have made and the tradeoffs, which I
> volunteer
> to write and which I think ought to live on community.a.o rather than
> incubator.a.o.
>
> Once that page is live, I propose that we modify the proposal template so
> that
> the default is only a dev list. Mailing list expansion then becomes part
> of
> the incubation curriculum, along with code import, header change,
> preparation
> of a release management procedure, making a release, recruiting new
> contributors/committers/PMC-members, and so on.
>
> Marvin Humphrey
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
--
NS
Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org>.
"Wade" might be a little OTT. ;) I think the doc is too terse, if anything.
(But actually, I think it strikes the balance very well.)
On 3 July 2013 17:51, Eric Johnson <er...@tibco.com> wrote:
> My one suggestion would be to group all the historical patterns/commentary
> at the end of the document. That way, people looking for specific
> information about current practices will not have to wade through
> historical information.
>
> Eric
>
>
> On 7/2/13 6:59 PM, Marvin Humphrey wrote:
>
>> On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Marvin,
>>>
>>> Did you get anywhere with this?
>>>
>> Finally, yes. I've written up the subject on the Incubator wiki and
>> linked to
>> it from the proposal guide.
>>
>> https://wiki.apache.org/**incubator/MailingListOptions<https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/MailingListOptions>
>> http://incubator.apache.org/**guides/proposal.html#template-**
>> mailing-lists<http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists>
>>
>> I'm having second thoughts about where it should live permanently, though.
>> The Incubator's documentation could withstand some reorganization and I'm
>> contemplating some proposals which I'll put forth in a little while.
>>
>> Marvin Humphrey
>>
>> On 30 March 2013 15:39, Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> On Sat, Mar 30, 2013 at 8:06 AM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Thanks Greg. Sane advice. I'll add this to my todo list and see if I
>>>>> can
>>>>> come up with a patch for the docs.
>>>>>
>>>> The obvious place to patch is the descriptive paragraph here:
>>>>
>>>> http://incubator.apache.org/**guides/proposal.html#template-**
>>>> mailing-lists<http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists>
>>>>
>>>> However, I question whether decisions about mailing lists should be
>>>> made by
>>>> the small group that typically works up a proposal. Why not start off
>>>> with
>>>> just a dev list and have the entire community participate in discussions
>>>> about what additional mailing lists to add?
>>>>
>>>> * Do we need a user@ list yet?
>>>> * Where should commit notifications be sent?
>>>> * Where should issue tracker notifications be sent?
>>>> * Should we add an announce@ list?
>>>>
>>>> These questions all have interesting implications with regard to
>>>> community
>>>> dynamics, and I think it would benefit podlings to be considering them
>>>> early on.
>>>>
>>>> So, I'd like to propose a page describing the various mailing list
>>>> choices
>>>> that top-level Apache projects have made and the tradeoffs, which I
>>>> volunteer to write and which I think ought to live on community.a.o
>>>> rather
>>>> than incubator.a.o.
>>>>
>>>> Once that page is live, I propose that we modify the proposal template
>>>> so
>>>> that the default is only a dev list. Mailing list expansion then
>>>> becomes
>>>> part of the incubation curriculum, along with code import, header
>>>> change,
>>>> preparation of a release management procedure, making a release,
>>>> recruiting
>>>> new contributors/committers/PMC-**members, and so on.
>>>>
>>>> Marvin Humphrey
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**
>>>> ---------
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.**apache.org<ge...@incubator.apache.org>
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.**org<ge...@incubator.apache.org>
>>>>
>>> --
>>> NS
>>>
>> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.**apache.org<ge...@incubator.apache.org>
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.**org<ge...@incubator.apache.org>
>>
>>
>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.**apache.org<ge...@incubator.apache.org>
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.**org<ge...@incubator.apache.org>
>
>
--
NS
Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
Posted by Eric Johnson <er...@tibco.com>.
My one suggestion would be to group all the historical
patterns/commentary at the end of the document. That way, people looking
for specific information about current practices will not have to wade
through historical information.
Eric
On 7/2/13 6:59 PM, Marvin Humphrey wrote:
> On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
>> Hey Marvin,
>>
>> Did you get anywhere with this?
> Finally, yes. I've written up the subject on the Incubator wiki and linked to
> it from the proposal guide.
>
> https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/MailingListOptions
> http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
>
> I'm having second thoughts about where it should live permanently, though.
> The Incubator's documentation could withstand some reorganization and I'm
> contemplating some proposals which I'll put forth in a little while.
>
> Marvin Humphrey
>
>> On 30 March 2013 15:39, Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, Mar 30, 2013 at 8:06 AM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>> Thanks Greg. Sane advice. I'll add this to my todo list and see if I can
>>>> come up with a patch for the docs.
>>> The obvious place to patch is the descriptive paragraph here:
>>>
>>> http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
>>>
>>> However, I question whether decisions about mailing lists should be made by
>>> the small group that typically works up a proposal. Why not start off with
>>> just a dev list and have the entire community participate in discussions
>>> about what additional mailing lists to add?
>>>
>>> * Do we need a user@ list yet?
>>> * Where should commit notifications be sent?
>>> * Where should issue tracker notifications be sent?
>>> * Should we add an announce@ list?
>>>
>>> These questions all have interesting implications with regard to community
>>> dynamics, and I think it would benefit podlings to be considering them
>>> early on.
>>>
>>> So, I'd like to propose a page describing the various mailing list choices
>>> that top-level Apache projects have made and the tradeoffs, which I
>>> volunteer to write and which I think ought to live on community.a.o rather
>>> than incubator.a.o.
>>>
>>> Once that page is live, I propose that we modify the proposal template so
>>> that the default is only a dev list. Mailing list expansion then becomes
>>> part of the incubation curriculum, along with code import, header change,
>>> preparation of a release management procedure, making a release, recruiting
>>> new contributors/committers/PMC-members, and so on.
>>>
>>> Marvin Humphrey
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>> --
>> NS
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
Posted by "Mattmann, Chris A (398J)" <ch...@jpl.nasa.gov>.
+1 great work Marvin.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
-----Original Message-----
From: Greg Stein <gs...@gmail.com>
Reply-To: "general@incubator.apache.org" <ge...@incubator.apache.org>
Date: Tuesday, July 2, 2013 7:32 PM
To: "general@incubator.apache.org" <ge...@incubator.apache.org>
Subject: Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
>On Tue, Jul 2, 2013 at 9:59 PM, Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com>
>wrote:
>> On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
>>> Hey Marvin,
>>>
>>> Did you get anywhere with this?
>>
>> Finally, yes. I've written up the subject on the Incubator wiki and
>>linked to
>> it from the proposal guide.
>>
>> https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/MailingListOptions
>
>Hell yeah!! I <3 that page. Repeat: <3
>
>Great job, Marvin! I have zero suggestions to improve.
>
>(now just save it under www.a.o/dev/ and get it fully linked in from
>everywhere)
>
>Cheers,
>-g
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
Posted by Greg Stein <gs...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Jul 2, 2013 at 9:59 PM, Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com> wrote:
> On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
>> Hey Marvin,
>>
>> Did you get anywhere with this?
>
> Finally, yes. I've written up the subject on the Incubator wiki and linked to
> it from the proposal guide.
>
> https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/MailingListOptions
Hell yeah!! I <3 that page. Repeat: <3
Great job, Marvin! I have zero suggestions to improve.
(now just save it under www.a.o/dev/ and get it fully linked in from everywhere)
Cheers,
-g
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
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Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org>.
Nice. Thanks Marvin!
On 3 July 2013 06:00, Craig L Russell <cr...@oracle.com> wrote:
> Marvin,
>
> Nice work. +1
>
> Craig
>
> On Jul 2, 2013, at 6:59 PM, Marvin Humphrey wrote:
>
> > On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
> >> Hey Marvin,
> >>
> >> Did you get anywhere with this?
> >
> > Finally, yes. I've written up the subject on the Incubator wiki and
> linked to
> > it from the proposal guide.
> >
> > https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/MailingListOptions
> > http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
> >
> > I'm having second thoughts about where it should live permanently,
> though.
> > The Incubator's documentation could withstand some reorganization and I'm
> > contemplating some proposals which I'll put forth in a little while.
> >
> > Marvin Humphrey
> >
> >> On 30 March 2013 15:39, Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Sat, Mar 30, 2013 at 8:06 AM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >>>> Thanks Greg. Sane advice. I'll add this to my todo list and see if I
> can
> >>>> come up with a patch for the docs.
> >>>
> >>> The obvious place to patch is the descriptive paragraph here:
> >>>
> >>>
> http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
> >>>
> >>> However, I question whether decisions about mailing lists should be
> made by
> >>> the small group that typically works up a proposal. Why not start off
> with
> >>> just a dev list and have the entire community participate in
> discussions
> >>> about what additional mailing lists to add?
> >>>
> >>> * Do we need a user@ list yet?
> >>> * Where should commit notifications be sent?
> >>> * Where should issue tracker notifications be sent?
> >>> * Should we add an announce@ list?
> >>>
> >>> These questions all have interesting implications with regard to
> community
> >>> dynamics, and I think it would benefit podlings to be considering them
> >>> early on.
> >>>
> >>> So, I'd like to propose a page describing the various mailing list
> choices
> >>> that top-level Apache projects have made and the tradeoffs, which I
> >>> volunteer to write and which I think ought to live on community.a.o
> rather
> >>> than incubator.a.o.
> >>>
> >>> Once that page is live, I propose that we modify the proposal template
> so
> >>> that the default is only a dev list. Mailing list expansion then
> becomes
> >>> part of the incubation curriculum, along with code import, header
> change,
> >>> preparation of a release management procedure, making a release,
> recruiting
> >>> new contributors/committers/PMC-members, and so on.
> >>>
> >>> Marvin Humphrey
> >>>
> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >> --
> >> NS
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >
>
> Craig L Russell
> Architect, Oracle
> http://db.apache.org/jdo
> 408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@oracle.com
> P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
--
NS
Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
Posted by Craig L Russell <cr...@oracle.com>.
Marvin,
Nice work. +1
Craig
On Jul 2, 2013, at 6:59 PM, Marvin Humphrey wrote:
> On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
>> Hey Marvin,
>>
>> Did you get anywhere with this?
>
> Finally, yes. I've written up the subject on the Incubator wiki and linked to
> it from the proposal guide.
>
> https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/MailingListOptions
> http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
>
> I'm having second thoughts about where it should live permanently, though.
> The Incubator's documentation could withstand some reorganization and I'm
> contemplating some proposals which I'll put forth in a little while.
>
> Marvin Humphrey
>
>> On 30 March 2013 15:39, Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, Mar 30, 2013 at 8:06 AM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>> Thanks Greg. Sane advice. I'll add this to my todo list and see if I can
>>>> come up with a patch for the docs.
>>>
>>> The obvious place to patch is the descriptive paragraph here:
>>>
>>> http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
>>>
>>> However, I question whether decisions about mailing lists should be made by
>>> the small group that typically works up a proposal. Why not start off with
>>> just a dev list and have the entire community participate in discussions
>>> about what additional mailing lists to add?
>>>
>>> * Do we need a user@ list yet?
>>> * Where should commit notifications be sent?
>>> * Where should issue tracker notifications be sent?
>>> * Should we add an announce@ list?
>>>
>>> These questions all have interesting implications with regard to community
>>> dynamics, and I think it would benefit podlings to be considering them
>>> early on.
>>>
>>> So, I'd like to propose a page describing the various mailing list choices
>>> that top-level Apache projects have made and the tradeoffs, which I
>>> volunteer to write and which I think ought to live on community.a.o rather
>>> than incubator.a.o.
>>>
>>> Once that page is live, I propose that we modify the proposal template so
>>> that the default is only a dev list. Mailing list expansion then becomes
>>> part of the incubation curriculum, along with code import, header change,
>>> preparation of a release management procedure, making a release, recruiting
>>> new contributors/committers/PMC-members, and so on.
>>>
>>> Marvin Humphrey
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>
>> --
>> NS
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
Craig L Russell
Architect, Oracle
http://db.apache.org/jdo
408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@oracle.com
P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Creating announce@ lists by default
Posted by Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com>.
On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 7:29 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hey Marvin,
>
> Did you get anywhere with this?
Finally, yes. I've written up the subject on the Incubator wiki and linked to
it from the proposal guide.
https://wiki.apache.org/incubator/MailingListOptions
http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
I'm having second thoughts about where it should live permanently, though.
The Incubator's documentation could withstand some reorganization and I'm
contemplating some proposals which I'll put forth in a little while.
Marvin Humphrey
> On 30 March 2013 15:39, Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, Mar 30, 2013 at 8:06 AM, Noah Slater <ns...@apache.org> wrote:
>> > Thanks Greg. Sane advice. I'll add this to my todo list and see if I can
>> > come up with a patch for the docs.
>>
>> The obvious place to patch is the descriptive paragraph here:
>>
>> http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-mailing-lists
>>
>> However, I question whether decisions about mailing lists should be made by
>> the small group that typically works up a proposal. Why not start off with
>> just a dev list and have the entire community participate in discussions
>> about what additional mailing lists to add?
>>
>> * Do we need a user@ list yet?
>> * Where should commit notifications be sent?
>> * Where should issue tracker notifications be sent?
>> * Should we add an announce@ list?
>>
>> These questions all have interesting implications with regard to community
>> dynamics, and I think it would benefit podlings to be considering them
>> early on.
>>
>> So, I'd like to propose a page describing the various mailing list choices
>> that top-level Apache projects have made and the tradeoffs, which I
>> volunteer to write and which I think ought to live on community.a.o rather
>> than incubator.a.o.
>>
>> Once that page is live, I propose that we modify the proposal template so
>> that the default is only a dev list. Mailing list expansion then becomes
>> part of the incubation curriculum, along with code import, header change,
>> preparation of a release management procedure, making a release, recruiting
>> new contributors/committers/PMC-members, and so on.
>>
>> Marvin Humphrey
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
> --
> NS
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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