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Posted to dev@apr.apache.org by Colm MacCarthaigh <co...@stdlib.net> on 2005/11/08 22:41:30 UTC
Bundled hello world
A bundled hello world, in somewhere like docs/helloworld/ might be
useful for encouraging adoption. Every time I have to write an APR app,
I remember how hard getting the basic build-envrionment right is.
So, it'd be a helloworld.c (this is a solved problem), the autoconf foo
for *nix, and build environments that work for the other platforms. The
idea being that adopters would have a massive head start and be able to
take it and start modifying it to create new apps, or to use it as a
reference for existing projects.
Sound sane? Or something that's better placed elsewhere?
--
Colm MacCárthaigh Public Key: colm+pgp@stdlib.net
Re: Bundled hello world
Posted by Sander Temme <sa...@temme.net>.
On Nov 8, 2005, at 3:41 PM, Colm MacCarthaigh wrote:
>
> A bundled hello world, in somewhere like docs/helloworld/ might be
> useful for encouraging adoption. Every time I have to write an APR
> app,
> I remember how hard getting the basic build-envrionment right is.
>
> So, it'd be a helloworld.c (this is a solved problem), the autoconf
> foo
> for *nix, and build environments that work for the other platforms.
> The
> idea being that adopters would have a massive head start and be
> able to
> take it and start modifying it to create new apps, or to use it as a
> reference for existing projects.
So, like, a cleanroom implementation of an APR-ified GNU Hello? Yes,
that would be a great idea.
+1
S.
> Sound sane? Or something that's better placed elsewhere?
>
> --
> Colm MacCárthaigh Public Key: colm
> +pgp@stdlib.net
>
>
Re: Bundled hello world
Posted by David Reid <da...@jetnet.co.uk>.
Colm MacCarthaigh wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 12, 2005 at 12:36:46PM +0000, David Reid wrote:
>
>>>This is going to need maintaining, not much, but over time, things will
>>>have to be changed. Not having it live in ASF svn would be a real pain.
>>>Is PD material currently hostable on ASF infrastructure?
>>
>>If it's not we can host it elsewhere, but I don't see why it shouldn't
>>be hostable by the asf. I'd actually like to see us expand the examples
>>so that we have a few that cover some of the advanced features, and
>>maybe apr-util as well.
>>
>>It's one thing that i think is holding back apr a little.
>
>
> Definitely. Some research over the last few days has found a lot of
> public domain material in the ASF repositories, so I think it's
> hostable. (releasable as ASF software on the other hand is a grey area,
> but then this need never release).
>
> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/apr/examples/
>
> seem reasonable? With a hello world at;
>
> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/apr/examples/trunk/helloworld/
>
And with a framework to allow the samples to be built in the root dir?
Seems like a plan to me :-)
We should also add a helpful README and so on, but start the ball
rolling and I'm sure we'll all follow on. Baaaaaaaaaa :-)
Re: Bundled hello world
Posted by Colm MacCarthaigh <co...@stdlib.net>.
On Sat, Nov 12, 2005 at 12:36:46PM +0000, David Reid wrote:
> > This is going to need maintaining, not much, but over time, things will
> > have to be changed. Not having it live in ASF svn would be a real pain.
> > Is PD material currently hostable on ASF infrastructure?
>
> If it's not we can host it elsewhere, but I don't see why it shouldn't
> be hostable by the asf. I'd actually like to see us expand the examples
> so that we have a few that cover some of the advanced features, and
> maybe apr-util as well.
>
> It's one thing that i think is holding back apr a little.
Definitely. Some research over the last few days has found a lot of
public domain material in the ASF repositories, so I think it's
hostable. (releasable as ASF software on the other hand is a grey area,
but then this need never release).
http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/apr/examples/
seem reasonable? With a hello world at;
http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/apr/examples/trunk/helloworld/
--
Colm MacCárthaigh Public Key: colm+pgp@stdlib.net
Re: Bundled hello world
Posted by David Reid <da...@jetnet.co.uk>.
Colm MacCarthaigh wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 08, 2005 at 02:57:09PM -0800, Justin Erenkrantz wrote:
>
>>I'd prefer that such an 'example' bundle be distributed separately from
>>APR, but it can be referred to in our release notes and on the website.
I'm very much +1 for this, but agree with Justin.
>
>
> Since it's aimed at developers, that shouldn't be any kind of a problem.
> The only advantage to in-bundle is that it would get to piggyback on the
> httpd source tarballs and get deployed in lots of places were curious
> coders might casually come accross it. Of course, this is probably an
> inapproriate waste of bytes too.
Nah, it's not aimed at the same set of developers.
>
>
>>At first thought, I would probably also prefer that such example code be
>>released in the public domain instead of having it under the ALv2 - but
>>could be convinced otherwise. (I'd want zero strings attached to this
>>example bundle; the ALv2 is essentially unrestricted though...) -- justin
>
>
> This is going to need maintaining, not much, but over time, things will
> have to be changed. Not having it live in ASF svn would be a real pain.
> Is PD material currently hostable on ASF infrastructure?
If it's not we can host it elsewhere, but I don't see why it shouldn't
be hostable by the asf. I'd actually like to see us expand the examples
so that we have a few that cover some of the advanced features, and
maybe apr-util as well.
It's one thing that i think is holding back apr a little.
david
Re: Bundled hello world
Posted by Colm MacCarthaigh <co...@stdlib.net>.
On Tue, Nov 08, 2005 at 02:57:09PM -0800, Justin Erenkrantz wrote:
> I'd prefer that such an 'example' bundle be distributed separately from
> APR, but it can be referred to in our release notes and on the website.
Since it's aimed at developers, that shouldn't be any kind of a problem.
The only advantage to in-bundle is that it would get to piggyback on the
httpd source tarballs and get deployed in lots of places were curious
coders might casually come accross it. Of course, this is probably an
inapproriate waste of bytes too.
> At first thought, I would probably also prefer that such example code be
> released in the public domain instead of having it under the ALv2 - but
> could be convinced otherwise. (I'd want zero strings attached to this
> example bundle; the ALv2 is essentially unrestricted though...) -- justin
This is going to need maintaining, not much, but over time, things will
have to be changed. Not having it live in ASF svn would be a real pain.
Is PD material currently hostable on ASF infrastructure?
I can see the ALv2 section 4 strings being annoying for some, since it
would be possible to consider any programs built out of the example a
derived work.
--
Colm MacCárthaigh Public Key: colm+pgp@stdlib.net
Re: Bundled hello world
Posted by Justin Erenkrantz <ju...@erenkrantz.com>.
--On November 8, 2005 9:41:30 PM +0000 Colm MacCarthaigh <co...@stdlib.net>
wrote:
> So, it'd be a helloworld.c (this is a solved problem), the autoconf foo
> for *nix, and build environments that work for the other platforms. The
> idea being that adopters would have a massive head start and be able to
> take it and start modifying it to create new apps, or to use it as a
> reference for existing projects.
>
> Sound sane? Or something that's better placed elsewhere?
Greg and I were chatting about this with Serf (which I recently auto-fu'd).
We pondered adding some auto-fu macros to find_ap[ru].m4 to help set up the
environment - something like APR_USE_APR that calls the APR_FIND_APR macro and
then does all of the 'silly' magic to make auto-fu use the detected
APR/APR-util. As is, I agree that there is too much -fu required and there's
no reason that APR can't m4-ize it somehow.
I'd prefer that such an 'example' bundle be distributed separately from APR,
but it can be referred to in our release notes and on the website. At first
thought, I would probably also prefer that such example code be released in
the public domain instead of having it under the ALv2 - but could be convinced
otherwise. (I'd want zero strings attached to this example bundle; the ALv2
is essentially unrestricted though...) -- justin