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Posted to dev@geronimo.apache.org by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net> on 2003/09/04 11:50:24 UTC
[wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead of
apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting to
make readable pages.
wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
(apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
and more...
I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
yourself:
* http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
* http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I believe
that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
Further (lite) reading:
http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
--jason
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
And now the codehaus wiki knows how to format Java code too ;-)
--jason
On Thursday, September 4, 2003, at 08:34 PM, Andy Barnett wrote:
> Putting all other concerns aside (administrative, political, etc), I've
> got to admit as a simple user, I believe the Codehaus Wiki Twiddle page
> is much more readable and professional looking.
> ~Andy
>
> On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 04:50, Jason Dillon wrote:
>> I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
>> yourself:
>> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
>> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
>> --jason
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Andy Barnett <ab...@cantilevertech.com>.
Putting all other concerns aside (administrative, political, etc), I've
got to admit as a simple user, I believe the Codehaus Wiki Twiddle page
is much more readable and professional looking.
~Andy
On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 04:50, Jason Dillon wrote:
> I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
> yourself:
> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
> --jason
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
Ya can just install moinmoin and den copy over the data. Can worry
about the style later. Codehaus is using a mostly standard moinmoin
install...
from cvs though, it is 1.1ish
--jason
On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 07:18 PM, Daniel S. Haischt wrote:
> James Strachan wrote:
>
>> Anyone fancy volunteering to install a codehaus-style wiki at Apache?
>
> i can do that. tho - i guess i would need a shell account.
>
>
> Jason, is the Moin Moin Wiki template based so we can just
> take the templates that you are currently using @ codehause?
>
> regards
>
> daniel s. haischt
> --
>
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Daniel S. Haischt" <me...@daniel.stefan.haischt.name>.
James Strachan wrote:
> Anyone fancy volunteering to install a codehaus-style wiki at Apache?
>
>
i can do that. tho - i guess i would need a shell account.
Jason, is the Moin Moin Wiki template based so we can just
take the templates that you are currently using @ codehause?
regards
daniel s. haischt
--
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
I think they would need perms to modify apache config, which would
require an apache admin... :-|
--jason
On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 07:12 PM, James Strachan wrote:
> Anyone fancy volunteering to install a codehaus-style wiki at Apache?
>
>
> On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 11:19 am, Jason Dillon wrote:
>
>> Okay, wiki now has a BugTracker macro ;-)
>>
>> [[BugTracker(GERONIMO-10)]]
>>
>> will make a link to
>> http://jira.codehaus.org/ViewIssue.jspa?key=GERONIMO-10
>>
>> With a little bug next to it... which I shamelessly grabbed from the
>> twiki bugzilla plugin.
>>
>> Note, this is only enabled for the geronimo wiki at the moment, none
>> of the other codehaus wikis have it.
>>
>> --jason
>>
>>
>> On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 04:34 AM, Daniel S. Haischt wrote:
>>
>>> Jason Dillon wrote:
>>>
>>>> Do you have a link to the twiki page which shows this?
>>>
>>> sure!
>>>
>>> TWiki supports so-called plugins. bug trackers will be
>>> supported using a bug tracker plugin. the plugin was
>>> originally written for bugzilla but the people who
>>> wrote the plugin told me that i can use it for scarab
>>> or the SF tracker as well.
>>>
>>> see:
>>>
>>> -> http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/BugzillaLinkPlugin
>>>
>>> FYI - TWiki and each plugin is based on perl source code.
>>>
>>> regards
>>>
>>> daniel s. haischt
>>> --
>>>
>>
>>
>
> James
> -------
> http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
> Yes, MoinMoin allows you to subscribe to pages (although the user
> management capabilities leave something to be desired). FWIW, I've
> been really impressed with the hackability of MoinMoin...
I was super giddy when I added Bablefish translations... and the JIRI
macros were fun too ;-)
--jason
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Elias Sinderson <el...@cse.ucsc.edu>.
Jason Dillon wrote:
> [...] some markup will need to change to get things to look preatty
Certainly, although this could be accomplished with a (couple/few?)
carefully crafted sed scripts. Creating a mapping from UseMod to
MoinMoin markups should be pretty straightforward, especially as UseMod
only has a subset of the possible markups that MoinMoin offers. The
greater burden would be on users to update their pages over time so as
to take advantage of the def Moin styles.
> [...] I think you can watch pages and get notifications when stuff
> changes.
Yes, MoinMoin allows you to subscribe to pages (although the user
management capabilities leave something to be desired). FWIW, I've been
really impressed with the hackability of MoinMoin...
Cheers,
Elias
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Daniel S. Haischt" <me...@daniel.stefan.haischt.name>.
Erin Mulder wrote:
[...]
>
> IIRC, MoinMoin stores complete copies of pages as they change, while
> UseModWiki stores some kind of monster diff. The former is easier if
> you ever want to convert again, but may be harder on disk space.
>
most time i am using TWiki which internally stores the Wiki topics as
CVS *,v files. maybe UseModWiki does the same ...
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Erin Mulder <me...@alumni.princeton.edu>.
>> Also, what kinds of oversight support does MoinMoin offer? One of the
>
> I have not played with it very much but I think you can watch pages and
> get notifications when stuff changes.
I use MoinMoin at work and like it a lot. Once you set yourself up as
a user, you can subscribe to pages and/or regular expressions. (So to
get an email when anything changes anywhere, just subscribe to *)
"Logged in" users also get breadcrumbs at the top making it easy to
navigate without extra backwards links.
The default style is very clean, you can embed HTML if you have to, and
macros are very easy to create.
IIRC, MoinMoin stores complete copies of pages as they change, while
UseModWiki stores some kind of monster diff. The former is easier if
you ever want to convert again, but may be harder on disk space.
The only major complaint I have is that within the editor, you can't put
a line-break in the middle of a formatting element. For tables in
particular, this means that every table row has to be typed in as one
long line. Of course, there may be an extension to fix that. Not sure.
Cheers,
Erin
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
Looked over, not too impressed at the moment. I still prefer MoinMoin
for its out of the box usability and advanced syntax, not to mention
how simple it is to add new syntax or macros to facilitate building
richer wiki pages.
--jason
On Monday, September 8, 2003, at 01:03 PM, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
> Jason,
>
> If you get a free moment, would you please take a look at
> http://www.JSPWiki.org? That is the Wiki the Cocoon folks are already
> using, and which is already in the process of being installed. Would
> that
> work for your needs? It appears to have all of the requisite items,
> including plug-ins. You can talk with Steven Noels (stevenn at
> outerthought.org) about it.
>
> --- Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jason Dillon [mailto:jason@coredevelopers.net]
> Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2003 5:50
> To: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
>
>
> FYI. I am willing to setup and maintain a moinmoin instance on apache
> if an apache admin can setup a wiki.apache.or subdomain, a wiki group
> and give me perms to modify the config. I have been maintaining the
> codehaus wiki & it is trivrial to setup as long as the right perms are
> there.
>
> --jason
>
>
> On Saturday, September 6, 2003, at 06:30 AM, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
>
>>>> Any idea what it would take to migrate existing content from
>>>> UseModWIKI?
>>
>>> Not really, not sure how UseModWiki internals work.
>>
>> UTSL, UTS.
>>
>> http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.txt
>> http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/config.txt
>>
>> The data appears to be stored in .db files. A tarball would be about
>> 26MB (uncompressed).
>>
>> --- Noel
>
>
RE: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
Jason,
If you get a free moment, would you please take a look at
http://www.JSPWiki.org? That is the Wiki the Cocoon folks are already
using, and which is already in the process of being installed. Would that
work for your needs? It appears to have all of the requisite items,
including plug-ins. You can talk with Steven Noels (stevenn at
outerthought.org) about it.
--- Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: Jason Dillon [mailto:jason@coredevelopers.net]
Sent: Saturday, September 06, 2003 5:50
To: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
FYI. I am willing to setup and maintain a moinmoin instance on apache
if an apache admin can setup a wiki.apache.or subdomain, a wiki group
and give me perms to modify the config. I have been maintaining the
codehaus wiki & it is trivrial to setup as long as the right perms are
there.
--jason
On Saturday, September 6, 2003, at 06:30 AM, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
>>> Any idea what it would take to migrate existing content from
>>> UseModWIKI?
>
>> Not really, not sure how UseModWiki internals work.
>
> UTSL, UTS.
>
> http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.txt
> http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/config.txt
>
> The data appears to be stored in .db files. A tarball would be about
> 26MB (uncompressed).
>
> --- Noel
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
FYI. I am willing to setup and maintain a moinmoin instance on apache
if an apache admin can setup a wiki.apache.or subdomain, a wiki group
and give me perms to modify the config. I have been maintaining the
codehaus wiki & it is trivrial to setup as long as the right perms are
there.
--jason
On Saturday, September 6, 2003, at 06:30 AM, Noel J. Bergman wrote:
>>> Any idea what it would take to migrate existing content from
>>> UseModWIKI?
>
>> Not really, not sure how UseModWiki internals work.
>
> UTSL, UTS.
>
> http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.txt
> http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/config.txt
>
> The data appears to be stored in .db files. A tarball would be about
> 26MB
> (uncompressed).
>
> --- Noel
>
RE: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> > Any idea what it would take to migrate existing content from
> > UseModWIKI?
> Not really, not sure how UseModWiki internals work.
UTSL, UTS.
http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.txt
http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/config.txt
The data appears to be stored in .db files. A tarball would be about 26MB
(uncompressed).
--- Noel
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
> Shouldn't cause any problem to USE the tool.
Cool.
> Any idea what it would take to migrate existing content from
> UseModWIKI?
Not really, not sure how UseModWiki internals work. If they can dump a
plain text version then would be fairly simple, though some markup will
need to change to get things to look preatty
> Also, what kinds of oversight support does MoinMoin offer? One of the
I have not played with it very much but I think you can watch pages and
get notifications when stuff changes.
Going to look into this more as I hack up some more macros to hook into
other services.
--jason
RE: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> What would it take to get other projects to migrate to a new server?
Probably automated migration of the existing Wiki content. Do you really
think that anyone cares about the wiki implementation? This one works, and
that's about all that you can say about it. It lacks admin features that
people have wanted, but it does the job.
--- Noel
RE: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jeremy Boynes <je...@coredevelopers.net>.
> From: Noel J. Bergman [mailto:noel@devtech.com]
> Any idea what it would take to migrate existing content from UseModWIKI?
It can't be that much harder to migrate to an installation at ASF rather
than at codehaus, and that keeps the shared knowledge base.
What would it take to get other projects to migrate to a new server?
--
Jeremy
RE: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> MoinMoin is GPL, is that gonna cause problems? It is just a tool, not
> like we are distributing it...
Shouldn't cause any problem to USE the tool.
Any idea what it would take to migrate existing content from UseModWIKI?
Also, what kinds of oversight support does MoinMoin offer? One of the
things that the infrastructure folks have suggested would be desirable is
for each PMC to have notification of changes made to pages under that PMC's
oversight.
--- Noel
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
MoinMoin is GPL, is that gonna cause problems? It is just a tool, not
like we are distributing it...
--jason
On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 07:12 PM, James Strachan wrote:
> Anyone fancy volunteering to install a codehaus-style wiki at Apache?
>
>
> On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 11:19 am, Jason Dillon wrote:
>
>> Okay, wiki now has a BugTracker macro ;-)
>>
>> [[BugTracker(GERONIMO-10)]]
>>
>> will make a link to
>> http://jira.codehaus.org/ViewIssue.jspa?key=GERONIMO-10
>>
>> With a little bug next to it... which I shamelessly grabbed from the
>> twiki bugzilla plugin.
>>
>> Note, this is only enabled for the geronimo wiki at the moment, none
>> of the other codehaus wikis have it.
>>
>> --jason
>>
>>
>> On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 04:34 AM, Daniel S. Haischt wrote:
>>
>>> Jason Dillon wrote:
>>>
>>>> Do you have a link to the twiki page which shows this?
>>>
>>> sure!
>>>
>>> TWiki supports so-called plugins. bug trackers will be
>>> supported using a bug tracker plugin. the plugin was
>>> originally written for bugzilla but the people who
>>> wrote the plugin told me that i can use it for scarab
>>> or the SF tracker as well.
>>>
>>> see:
>>>
>>> -> http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/BugzillaLinkPlugin
>>>
>>> FYI - TWiki and each plugin is based on perl source code.
>>>
>>> regards
>>>
>>> daniel s. haischt
>>> --
>>>
>>
>>
>
> James
> -------
> http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by James Strachan <ja...@yahoo.co.uk>.
Anyone fancy volunteering to install a codehaus-style wiki at Apache?
On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 11:19 am, Jason Dillon wrote:
> Okay, wiki now has a BugTracker macro ;-)
>
> [[BugTracker(GERONIMO-10)]]
>
> will make a link to
> http://jira.codehaus.org/ViewIssue.jspa?key=GERONIMO-10
>
> With a little bug next to it... which I shamelessly grabbed from the
> twiki bugzilla plugin.
>
> Note, this is only enabled for the geronimo wiki at the moment, none
> of the other codehaus wikis have it.
>
> --jason
>
>
> On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 04:34 AM, Daniel S. Haischt wrote:
>
>> Jason Dillon wrote:
>>
>>> Do you have a link to the twiki page which shows this?
>>
>> sure!
>>
>> TWiki supports so-called plugins. bug trackers will be
>> supported using a bug tracker plugin. the plugin was
>> originally written for bugzilla but the people who
>> wrote the plugin told me that i can use it for scarab
>> or the SF tracker as well.
>>
>> see:
>>
>> -> http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/BugzillaLinkPlugin
>>
>> FYI - TWiki and each plugin is based on perl source code.
>>
>> regards
>>
>> daniel s. haischt
>> --
>>
>
>
James
-------
http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
Okay, wiki now has a BugTracker macro ;-)
[[BugTracker(GERONIMO-10)]]
will make a link to
http://jira.codehaus.org/ViewIssue.jspa?key=GERONIMO-10
With a little bug next to it... which I shamelessly grabbed from the
twiki bugzilla plugin.
Note, this is only enabled for the geronimo wiki at the moment, none of
the other codehaus wikis have it.
--jason
On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 04:34 AM, Daniel S. Haischt wrote:
> Jason Dillon wrote:
>
>> Do you have a link to the twiki page which shows this?
>
> sure!
>
> TWiki supports so-called plugins. bug trackers will be
> supported using a bug tracker plugin. the plugin was
> originally written for bugzilla but the people who
> wrote the plugin told me that i can use it for scarab
> or the SF tracker as well.
>
> see:
>
> -> http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/BugzillaLinkPlugin
>
> FYI - TWiki and each plugin is based on perl source code.
>
> regards
>
> daniel s. haischt
> --
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
> FYI - TWiki and each plugin is based on perl source code.
Ick, perl :-(
--jason
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Daniel S. Haischt" <me...@daniel.stefan.haischt.name>.
Jason Dillon wrote:
> Do you have a link to the twiki page which shows this?
>
sure!
TWiki supports so-called plugins. bug trackers will be
supported using a bug tracker plugin. the plugin was
originally written for bugzilla but the people who
wrote the plugin told me that i can use it for scarab
or the SF tracker as well.
see:
-> http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Plugins/BugzillaLinkPlugin
FYI - TWiki and each plugin is based on perl source code.
regards
daniel s. haischt
--
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
Do you have a link to the twiki page which shows this?
--jason
On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 02:00 AM, Daniel S. Haischt wrote:
> TWiki [1] is able to link to (any) bug tracker.
> maybe Moin Moin Wiki does that too ...
>
> regards
>
> daniel s. haischt
> --
>
> [1} http://twiki.org/
>
> David Blevins wrote:
>
>> +1
>> Love the numbering and the code windows. Wouldn't it be neat if it
>> could link to the jira items -- don't know how useful that would be,
>> just strikes me as "neat."
>> -David
>> On Thu, Sep 04, 2003 at 04:50:24PM +0700, Jason Dillon wrote:
>>> I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead
>>> of apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
>>> letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting
>>> to make readable pages.
>>>
>>> wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
>>> (apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page
>>> name), supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
>>> formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
>>> and more...
>>>
>>> I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
>>> yourself:
>>>
>>> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
>>> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
>>>
>>> I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
>>> beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I
>>> believe that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
>>>
>>> Further (lite) reading:
>>>
>>> http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
>>>
>>> --jason
>
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Daniel S. Haischt" <me...@daniel.stefan.haischt.name>.
TWiki [1] is able to link to (any) bug tracker.
maybe Moin Moin Wiki does that too ...
regards
daniel s. haischt
--
[1} http://twiki.org/
David Blevins wrote:
> +1
>
> Love the numbering and the code windows. Wouldn't it be neat if it could link to the jira items -- don't know how useful that would be, just strikes me as "neat."
>
> -David
>
> On Thu, Sep 04, 2003 at 04:50:24PM +0700, Jason Dillon wrote:
>
>>I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead of
>>apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
>>letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting to
>>make readable pages.
>>
>>wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
>>(apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
>>supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
>>formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
>>and more...
>>
>>I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
>>yourself:
>>
>> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
>> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
>>
>>I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
>>beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I believe
>>that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
>>
>>Further (lite) reading:
>>
>>http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
>>
>>--jason
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
> Wouldn't it be neat if it could link to the jira items -- don't know
> how useful that would be, just strikes me as "neat."
I bet I could do that ;-)
--jason
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by David Blevins <da...@visi.com>.
+1
Love the numbering and the code windows. Wouldn't it be neat if it could link to the jira items -- don't know how useful that would be, just strikes me as "neat."
-David
On Thu, Sep 04, 2003 at 04:50:24PM +0700, Jason Dillon wrote:
> I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead of
> apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
> letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting to
> make readable pages.
>
> wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
> (apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
> supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
> formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
> and more...
>
> I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
> yourself:
>
> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
>
> I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
> beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I believe
> that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
>
> Further (lite) reading:
>
> http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
>
> --jason
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Hiram Chirino <hi...@coredevelopers.net>.
+1
The codehaus wiki looks great!
Regards,
Hiram
On Thu, 2003-09-04 at 05:50, Jason Dillon wrote:
> I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead of
> apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
> letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting to
> make readable pages.
>
> wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
> (apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
> supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
> formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
> and more...
>
> I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
> yourself:
>
> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
>
> I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
> beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I believe
> that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
>
> Further (lite) reading:
>
> http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
>
> --jason
--
/**************************
* Hiram Chirino
* Partner
* Core Developers Network
**************************/
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
For what its worth I think the Japanese translation looks very
beautiful... but I can not ready it ;-) Only kanji I know if for water
and I did not see that in there ;-)
--jason
On Friday, September 5, 2003, at 06:33 AM, Tetsuya Kitahata wrote:
>
> What? ... machine translations (especially into Japanese, of course)
> are what I *DO* hate...
>
> Please do not destroy the beauty of our language. :-(
>
> -- Tetsuya (tetsuya@apache.org)
>
> P.S. Also, I found that the translation of the
> "EU Software Patents protest action" page (into Japanese)
> is/was a bit funny :-)
>
> On Fri, 5 Sep 2003 01:16:47 +0700
> (Subject: Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki)
> Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net> wrote:
>
>> Well, now got bablefish integrated so you can translate it into
>> japanese if you wanted too ;-)
>
>> --jason
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> Tetsuya Kitahata -- Terra-International, Inc.
> E-mail: tetsuya@apache.org
> http://www.terra-intl.com/ (Japanese Only)
> (Accredited Herrmann Brain Dominance Instrument Facilitator)
> http://www.hbdi.com/
>
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Tetsuya Kitahata <te...@apache.org>.
What? ... machine translations (especially into Japanese, of course)
are what I *DO* hate...
Please do not destroy the beauty of our language. :-(
-- Tetsuya (tetsuya@apache.org)
P.S. Also, I found that the translation of the
"EU Software Patents protest action" page (into Japanese)
is/was a bit funny :-)
On Fri, 5 Sep 2003 01:16:47 +0700
(Subject: Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki)
Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net> wrote:
> Well, now got bablefish integrated so you can translate it into
> japanese if you wanted too ;-)
> --jason
-----------------------------------------------------------
Tetsuya Kitahata -- Terra-International, Inc.
E-mail: tetsuya@apache.org
http://www.terra-intl.com/ (Japanese Only)
(Accredited Herrmann Brain Dominance Instrument Facilitator)
http://www.hbdi.com/
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Daniel S. Haischt" <me...@daniel.stefan.haischt.name>.
Jason Dillon wrote:
> Well, now got bablefish integrated so you can translate it into japanese
> if you wanted too ;-)
btw - the german translation sounds very funny ;-)
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
Well, now got bablefish integrated so you can translate it into
japanese if you wanted too ;-)
--jason
On Thursday, September 4, 2003, at 07:23 PM, Daniel S. Haischt wrote:
> Jason Dillon wrote:
>
>> That assumes there are pages with that language though... but could
>> be wrong.
>
> i was refereing to the wiki navigation items etc..
>
> regards
>
> daniel s. haischt
> --
>
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Daniel S. Haischt" <me...@daniel.stefan.haischt.name>.
Jason Dillon wrote:
> That assumes there are pages with that language though... but could be
> wrong.
>
i was refereing to the wiki navigation items etc..
regards
daniel s. haischt
--
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
That assumes there are pages with that language though... but could be
wrong.
--jason
On Thursday, September 4, 2003, at 05:07 PM, Daniel S. Haischt wrote:
> Jason Dillon wrote:
>> I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead
>> of apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
>> letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting
>> to make readable pages.
>
> btw - the codhaus wiki supports content negotiation, which means that
> you will get a localized version of the wiki pages ;-)
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Daniel S. Haischt" <me...@daniel.stefan.haischt.name>.
Jason Dillon wrote:
> I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead of
> apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
> letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting to
> make readable pages.
>
btw - the codhaus wiki supports content negotiation, which means that
you will get a localized version of the wiki pages ;-)
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Elias Sinderson <el...@cse.ucsc.edu>.
Jason Dillon wrote:
> I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead
> of apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
> letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting
> to make readable pages.
> [...]
<delurk>
+1 Anything that makes the available project documentation easier to
read and manage is a step in the right direction.
</delurk>
Cheers,
Elias
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Daniel S. Haischt" <me...@daniel.stefan.haischt.name>.
to everyone who is wondering why it is called Moin Moin Wiki:
-> http://moin.sourceforge.net/ (1st paragraph)
instead of Moin Moin you could also call it Servus Wiki or
Gruess Gott Wiki - but Moin Moin seems to be the best variant ;-)
regards
daniel s. haischt
--
p.s. i guess Alan Cabrera is especially interested in this
information ;-)
Dain Sundstrom wrote:
> +1
>
> Codehaus wiki is clearly a better tool.
>
> -dain
>
> On Thursday, September 4, 2003, at 04:50 AM, Jason Dillon wrote:
>
>> I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead
>> of apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
>> letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting
>> to make readable pages.
>>
>> wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
>> (apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
>> supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
>> formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
>> and more...
>>
>> I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
>> yourself:
>>
>> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
>> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
>>
>> I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
>> beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I
>> believe that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
>>
>> Further (lite) reading:
>>
>> http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
>>
>> --jason
>>
>>
>
> /*************************
> * Dain Sundstrom
> * Partner
> * Core Developers Network
> *************************/
>
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Dain Sundstrom <da...@coredevelopers.net>.
+1
Codehaus wiki is clearly a better tool.
-dain
On Thursday, September 4, 2003, at 04:50 AM, Jason Dillon wrote:
> I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead
> of apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
> letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting
> to make readable pages.
>
> wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
> (apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
> supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
> formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
> and more...
>
> I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
> yourself:
>
> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
>
> I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
> beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I
> believe that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
>
> Further (lite) reading:
>
> http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
>
> --jason
>
>
/*************************
* Dain Sundstrom
* Partner
* Core Developers Network
*************************/
RE: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Matt Kurjanowicz <mk...@cc.gatech.edu>.
+1 for Codehaus.
It looks nicer to me (IMHO).
-Matt
-----Original Message-----
From: Jason Dillon [mailto:jason@coredevelopers.net]
Sent: Thursday, September 04, 2003 5:50 AM
To: geronimo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead of
apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting to
make readable pages.
wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
(apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
and more...
I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
yourself:
* http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
* http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I believe
that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
Further (lite) reading:
http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
--jason
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "n. alex rupp" <ru...@umn.edu>.
+1 Great idea, Jason : )
> This one time, at band camp, Jason Dillon said:
>
> JD>I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead of
> JD>apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
> JD>letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting to
> JD>make readable pages.
> JD>
> JD>wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
> JD>(apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
> JD>supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
> JD>formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
> JD>and more...
> JD>
> JD>I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
> JD>yourself:
> JD>
> JD> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
> JD> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
> JD>
> JD>I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
> JD>beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I believe
> JD>that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
> JD>
> JD>Further (lite) reading:
> JD>
> JD>http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Bruce Snyder <fe...@frii.com>.
This one time, at band camp, Jason Dillon said:
JD>I really think we should use the wiki system on codehaus.org instead of
JD>apachewiki. The codehaus wiki produces much more readable pages,
JD>letting content writers deal with the content and not the formatting to
JD>make readable pages.
JD>
JD>wiki.codehaus.org, supports nesting pages deeper than two levels
JD>(apachewiki will bitch if there is more than one '/' in a page name),
JD>supports generation of table of contents for sections, better
JD>formatting for code blocks, spell checking, page watching, templates
JD>and more...
JD>
JD>I ported the Twiddle docs (as they were), so you can compare for
JD>yourself:
JD>
JD> * http://wiki.codehaus.org/geronimo/Modules/Twiddle
JD> * http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?ApacheJ2EE/Twiddle
JD>
JD>I am willing to port the rest of the pages as I believe that it is
JD>beneficial to switch wikis. The wiki will only get bigger so I believe
JD>that we need a more robust wiki to keep things in order.
JD>
JD>Further (lite) reading:
JD>
JD>http://wiki.codehaus.org/maven/WhyNotUseMod
+1
The content is much easier to read using Moin Moin.
Bruce
--
perl -e 'print unpack("u30","<0G)U8V4\@4VYY9&5R\"F9E<G)E=\$\!F<FEI+F-O;0\`\`");'
The Castor Project
http://www.castor.org/
Apache Geronimo
http://incubator.apache.org/projects/geronimo.html
Re: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by Jason Dillon <ja...@coredevelopers.net>.
> If you move to use the Wiki on codehaus, you take data away from the
> common
> place where everyone in the ASF can search for things, and cross-link
> between projects.
Searching perhaps... but linking no. You can interwiki to anything.
> If there is an issue with UseModWiki, it can be replaced. All it
> takes is
> someone willing to do it. Steven Noels did the Cocoon wiki, which is
> being
> moved onto an ASF machine. If there is someone who wants to help move
> the
> ASF Wiki onto a different Wiki system, that is something worth
> discussing.
UseModWiki is not very friendly or easy to look at. MoinMoin is much
better for producing readable wiki pages IMO. Codehaus already had it
setup so I just started using it. If someone at Apache wants to set it
up that would be fine... but I am starting to get the impression that
things do not change very quickly so it is easier to use Codehaus for
now. If MoinMoin gets setup on an Apache machine somewhere it should
be trivial to move the wiki data.
I guess I am also a little weary about maintenance and additions to
make the wiki more functional. Right now I have more or less direct
control over the wiki, so am free to add java syntax highlighters,
translators or whatever.
But as always just my opinion ;-)
--jason
RE: [wiki] I really think we should use the codehaus wiki
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
If you move to use the Wiki on codehaus, you take data away from the common
place where everyone in the ASF can search for things, and cross-link
between projects.
If there is an issue with UseModWiki, it can be replaced. All it takes is
someone willing to do it. Steven Noels did the Cocoon wiki, which is being
moved onto an ASF machine. If there is someone who wants to help move the
ASF Wiki onto a different Wiki system, that is something worth discussing.
--- Noel