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Posted to users@spamassassin.apache.org by Justin Mason <jm...@jmason.org> on 2007/02/05 22:51:47 UTC

Re: Obfuscated URL detection via DNS

- (a) It provides an easy way for a spammer to tell if a piece of mail
  passes through a SpamAssassin filter, by monitoring hits on their NS.

- (b) it's pretty common in some groups to mail around unregistered
  domains/unresolvable hostnames/XML DTD locations/etc.

--j.

John D. Hardin writes:
> How about this for testing whether a URL is obfuscated: just see if
> the host resolves via DNS?
> 
> Pros:
> 
> No complex REs needed.
> 
> No more playing whack-a-mole chasing new obfuscation mechanisms.
> 
> 
> Cons:
> 
> A DNS lookup.
> 
> It won't catch obfuscation in the filepath part. (But then, the reason
> for the obfuscation is to avoid URIBLs, which don't use the filepath
> part...)
> 
> It may subject you to DNS cache poisoning.
> 
> 
> Do the pros outweigh the cons?
> 
> --
>  John Hardin KA7OHZ                    http://www.impsec.org/~jhardin/
>  jhardin@impsec.org    FALaholic #11174     pgpk -a jhardin@impsec.org
>  key: 0xB8732E79 -- 2D8C 34F4 6411 F507 136C  AF76 D822 E6E6 B873 2E79
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>   Gun control is marketed to the public with the idea that violent
>   criminals will obey the law. This is an appealing delusion.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
>  7 days until Abraham Lincoln's and Charles Darwin's 198th Birthdays

Re: Obfuscated URL detection via DNS

Posted by Kenneth Porter <sh...@sewingwitch.com>.
On Monday, February 05, 2007 9:51 PM +0000 Justin Mason <jm...@jmason.org> 
wrote:

> - (a) It provides an easy way for a spammer to tell if a piece of mail
>   passes through a SpamAssassin filter, by monitoring hits on their NS.

You could give the URIBL rules first shot at the raw name, then invoke the 
normal lookup only if those don't get a hit.

> - (b) it's pretty common in some groups to mail around unregistered
>   domains/unresolvable hostnames/XML DTD locations/etc.

Yep, that's a hard one.

Re: Obfuscated URL detection via DNS

Posted by Kenneth Porter <sh...@sewingwitch.com>.
On Tuesday, February 06, 2007 8:49 PM +1300 Jason Haar 
<Ja...@trimble.co.nz> wrote:

> Hmm - I would assume the opposite. Most people would run SA in DMZes
> wouldn't they? And most DMZ design philosophies are that DMZ hosts
> should attempt to have near-zero access to internal resources. i.e. no
> internal DNS.

Why would you be sending internal domain names through your external SA? If 
you send to another internal user who might use a VPN from outside, you 
still send to his internal address.



Re: Obfuscated URL detection via DNS

Posted by Jason Haar <Ja...@trimble.co.nz>.
John D. Hardin wrote:
>> - (b) it's pretty common in some groups to mail around unregistered
>>   domains/unresolvable hostnames/XML DTD locations/etc.
>>     
>
> I would assume that your SA host has visibility to your internal
> DNS...
>   
Hmm - I would assume the opposite. Most people would run SA in DMZes
wouldn't they? And most DMZ design philosophies are that DMZ hosts
should attempt to have near-zero access to internal resources. i.e. no
internal DNS.

That's certainly the case for us...

-- 
Cheers

Jason Haar
Information Security Manager, Trimble Navigation Ltd.
Phone: +64 3 9635 377 Fax: +64 3 9635 417
PGP Fingerprint: 7A2E 0407 C9A6 CAF6 2B9F 8422 C063 5EBB FE1D 66D1


Re: Obfuscated URL detection via DNS

Posted by "John D. Hardin" <jh...@impsec.org>.
On Mon, 5 Feb 2007, Justin Mason wrote:

> - (a) It provides an easy way for a spammer to tell if a piece of mail
>   passes through a SpamAssassin filter, by monitoring hits on their NS.

They will also get hits from people following the URL. Maybe this will
help to pollute their databases with a lot of false positives, and
reduce the value of such tracking.

DNS caching affects this, unless they intentionally set a very short
TTL.

> - (b) it's pretty common in some groups to mail around unregistered
>   domains/unresolvable hostnames/XML DTD locations/etc.

I would assume that your SA host has visibility to your internal
DNS...

Okay, add support for a list of domain names that it wouldn't try to
resolve, and would score zero for.

> John D. Hardin writes:
> > How about this for testing whether a URL is obfuscated: just see if
> > the host resolves via DNS?

--
 John Hardin KA7OHZ                    http://www.impsec.org/~jhardin/
 jhardin@impsec.org    FALaholic #11174     pgpk -a jhardin@impsec.org
 key: 0xB8732E79 -- 2D8C 34F4 6411 F507 136C  AF76 D822 E6E6 B873 2E79
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
  Gun control is marketed to the public with the idea that violent
  criminals will obey the law. This is an appealing delusion.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
 7 days until Abraham Lincoln's and Charles Darwin's 198th Birthdays