Nice job on new configuration document

["Jaeger, Jay" <ja...@dot.state.wi.us>]

Just a quick follow up on a message I sent long, long ago.

The new configuration document at
http://synapse.apache.org/Synapse_Configuration_Language.html seems much
improved -- some good ground-level explanations of structure, examples, a
basic explanation of what Axis2 is doing there, and so on.

Now, that being said, one small critique:  because of the way it is laid
out, it won't print reasonably from some certain browsers made by a vendor
whose name begins with "M" unless you print it in landscape mode.  It would
be really nice to see a PDF of this thing.

(The Quick Start guide has the same kind of issue).

Overall, though, a really nice job.  Keep up the good work.

Jay Jaeger

-----Original Message-----
From: Jaeger, Jay 
Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 7:54 AM
To: 'synapse-user@ws.apache.org'
Subject: RE: any news about new version of synapse?


I would like to add my voice to those who have expressed interest in JDBC as
an interface/transport for synapse.

We have a number of systems in our organization which interact in an
unstructured way, by reading from and writing to each others' databases.  We
have found that in trying to institute more of an SOA approach, that it has
been very hard to convince projects to invest even modest amounts of time to
build or user service interfaces.  The single biggest reason I am following
developments of synapse is a hope that if we could expose those databases in
a more structured way, by coupling an HTTP service to a JDBC SQL Query (with
data in our out) we could "lift" these interactions out of application code
into service interfaces without having to write code.  Once we have some
services, the client side requesting the service will probably fall into
place, and once we do that, then I think it will be easier to get folks to
define higher level service interfaces.

But we have to start somewhere, and getting started has proved challenging.

I would a;lso point out the need for some higher level documentation /
tutorial.  The tutorial is great for installation verification, and as code
examples, but is not so great for trying to figure out what synapse might
actually be good for, or for understanding what all the pieces do.  (For
example, a newbie might ask, what the heck is Axis2, anyway....).
Ordinarily, it is the kind of thing I might volunteer to dig in and do, but
with a full time "day job" plus teaching a 3 credit course at the local tech
school in Linux (with labs and all that -- coming to another 12 hours/week
including class time), I just won't have the time.

JRJ

Re: Nice job on new configuration document

[Jens Goldhammer <go...@googlemail.com>]

Hi Ruwan,

*generation of pdf:*
it is a good point to have a generation to pdf. I have found some 
information on the maven site:
http://maven.apache.org/doxia/index.html

I have read that XDoc is still supported, but is replaced by Apt in general.
http://maven.apache.org/doxia/references/xdoc-format.html
http://maven.apache.org/doxia/references/apt-format.html

Ok, you use xdoc, so maybe this is a point to generate the pdf?

*what do others according to pdf docs?*
For example, camel uses BOOM CSS in conjunction with Prince to generate 
a good looking pdf.

http://activemq.apache.org/camel/pdf-documentation-guide.html
http://www.princexml.com/samples/

But I don´t know how do they get Prince- it is very expensive (except 
the personal license)....

*my persional opinion to pdf documentaiton:*
LaTeX is the best way to generate a good looking pdf-documentation. I 
have written my thesis with it and it was great to have so many packages 
who format my text, listings, figures and tables like I want. 
Nevertheless it will be a pain to have two entry points for 
documentation- the LaTeX files for pdf and the xdoc files for html. Both 
must be kept synchronized. But I would prepare a LaTeX template if you 
are interested in! Maybe you say, the documentation on the website and 
the pdf have not to be the same.
Maybe, anybody knows a better way?
What´s about docbook?

*general comments/hints:
*- Is there any way to have a autobreak for the source listings, e.g. in 
http://synapse.apache.org/Synapse_Configuration_Language.html?
   Some code cannot be read very good...
- My opinion about the website in general is that it would be better to 
have a cms or a wiki behind it? It would be great to have changes on the 
news site without building and deploying the complete synapse 
documentation. (I think, you have a good mechanism on your site wso2.org)
- do you ever think of joining synapse and wso2 esb? I know, Synapse is 
hosted at Apache and wso2 esb not, but it would be better for the users 
to know that there is one product and you get the admin-ui as a plugin? 
Or are there any licence hurdles?

Thanks,
Jens


Ruwan Linton schrieb:
> Hi Jay,
>
> Thanks for the comments, I think the pdf of the above specified guide is a
> cool addition. We need to find a mechanism to generate the pdf from the xdoc
> pages. I will work on this and try to add a pdf of the documents too.
>
> Thanks,
> Ruwan
>
> On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 2:14 AM, Jaeger, Jay <ja...@dot.state.wi.us>
> wrote:
>
>   
>> Just a quick follow up on a message I sent long, long ago.
>>
>> The new configuration document at
>> http://synapse.apache.org/Synapse_Configuration_Language.html seems much
>> improved -- some good ground-level explanations of structure, examples, a
>> basic explanation of what Axis2 is doing there, and so on.
>>
>> Now, that being said, one small critique:  because of the way it is laid
>> out, it won't print reasonably from some certain browsers made by a vendor
>> whose name begins with "M" unless you print it in landscape mode.  It
>> would
>> be really nice to see a PDF of this thing.
>>
>> (The Quick Start guide has the same kind of issue).
>>
>> Overall, though, a really nice job.  Keep up the good work.
>>
>> Jay Jaeger
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Jaeger, Jay
>> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 7:54 AM
>> To: 'synapse-user@ws.apache.org'
>> Subject: RE: any news about new version of synapse?
>>
>>
>> I would like to add my voice to those who have expressed interest in JDBC
>> as
>> an interface/transport for synapse.
>>
>> We have a number of systems in our organization which interact in an
>> unstructured way, by reading from and writing to each others' databases.
>>  We
>> have found that in trying to institute more of an SOA approach, that it
>> has
>> been very hard to convince projects to invest even modest amounts of time
>> to
>> build or user service interfaces.  The single biggest reason I am
>> following
>> developments of synapse is a hope that if we could expose those databases
>> in
>> a more structured way, by coupling an HTTP service to a JDBC SQL Query
>> (with
>> data in our out) we could "lift" these interactions out of application
>> code
>> into service interfaces without having to write code.  Once we have some
>> services, the client side requesting the service will probably fall into
>> place, and once we do that, then I think it will be easier to get folks to
>> define higher level service interfaces.
>>
>> But we have to start somewhere, and getting started has proved
>> challenging.
>>
>> I would a;lso point out the need for some higher level documentation /
>> tutorial.  The tutorial is great for installation verification, and as
>> code
>> examples, but is not so great for trying to figure out what synapse might
>> actually be good for, or for understanding what all the pieces do.  (For
>> example, a newbie might ask, what the heck is Axis2, anyway....).
>> Ordinarily, it is the kind of thing I might volunteer to dig in and do,
>> but
>> with a full time "day job" plus teaching a 3 credit course at the local
>> tech
>> school in Linux (with labs and all that -- coming to another 12 hours/week
>> including class time), I just won't have the time.
>>
>> JRJ
>>
>>
>>     
>
>
>   

Re: Nice job on new configuration document

[Ruwan Linton <ru...@gmail.com>]

Hi Jay,

Thanks for the comments, I think the pdf of the above specified guide is a
cool addition. We need to find a mechanism to generate the pdf from the xdoc
pages. I will work on this and try to add a pdf of the documents too.

Thanks,
Ruwan

On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 2:14 AM, Jaeger, Jay <ja...@dot.state.wi.us>
wrote:

> Just a quick follow up on a message I sent long, long ago.
>
> The new configuration document at
> http://synapse.apache.org/Synapse_Configuration_Language.html seems much
> improved -- some good ground-level explanations of structure, examples, a
> basic explanation of what Axis2 is doing there, and so on.
>
> Now, that being said, one small critique:  because of the way it is laid
> out, it won't print reasonably from some certain browsers made by a vendor
> whose name begins with "M" unless you print it in landscape mode.  It
> would
> be really nice to see a PDF of this thing.
>
> (The Quick Start guide has the same kind of issue).
>
> Overall, though, a really nice job.  Keep up the good work.
>
> Jay Jaeger
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jaeger, Jay
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 7:54 AM
> To: 'synapse-user@ws.apache.org'
> Subject: RE: any news about new version of synapse?
>
>
> I would like to add my voice to those who have expressed interest in JDBC
> as
> an interface/transport for synapse.
>
> We have a number of systems in our organization which interact in an
> unstructured way, by reading from and writing to each others' databases.
>  We
> have found that in trying to institute more of an SOA approach, that it
> has
> been very hard to convince projects to invest even modest amounts of time
> to
> build or user service interfaces.  The single biggest reason I am
> following
> developments of synapse is a hope that if we could expose those databases
> in
> a more structured way, by coupling an HTTP service to a JDBC SQL Query
> (with
> data in our out) we could "lift" these interactions out of application
> code
> into service interfaces without having to write code.  Once we have some
> services, the client side requesting the service will probably fall into
> place, and once we do that, then I think it will be easier to get folks to
> define higher level service interfaces.
>
> But we have to start somewhere, and getting started has proved
> challenging.
>
> I would a;lso point out the need for some higher level documentation /
> tutorial.  The tutorial is great for installation verification, and as
> code
> examples, but is not so great for trying to figure out what synapse might
> actually be good for, or for understanding what all the pieces do.  (For
> example, a newbie might ask, what the heck is Axis2, anyway....).
> Ordinarily, it is the kind of thing I might volunteer to dig in and do,
> but
> with a full time "day job" plus teaching a 3 credit course at the local
> tech
> school in Linux (with labs and all that -- coming to another 12 hours/week
> including class time), I just won't have the time.
>
> JRJ
>
>


-- 
Ruwan Linton
http://www.wso2.org - "Oxygenating the Web Services Platform"