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Posted to users@tomcat.apache.org by honyk <j....@email.cz> on 2013/06/26 20:27:10 UTC
Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Dear All,
I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external script.
This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it and
save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original settings), it
works fine.
When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint fails
because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings (tomcat7w.exe).
I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any explanation yet:
http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-92413aaecc2e
But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between problematic
and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe there is something
related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just guessing.
Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
Thanks, Jan
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Re: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256
Jan,
On 6/26/13 2:27 PM, honyk wrote:
> I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external
> script. This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object,
> manipulate it and save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit,
> 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
>
> When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original
> settings), it works fine.
>
> When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint
> fails because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings
> (tomcat7w.exe).
>
> I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any
> explanation yet:
> http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-92413aaecc2e
>
> But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between
> problematic and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode,
> maybe there is something related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just
> guessing.
>
> Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
Is it Tomcat that dies or the sub-process? Do you get a stack trace?
If so, post it. Do you get a core dump? If so, post it (at least the
back-trace of the offending thread).
What actually happens, here?
- -chris
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RE: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by honyk <j....@email.cz>.
On 2013-06-26 Jeffrey Janner wrote:
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: honyk [mailto:j.tosovsky@email.cz]
> > Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 1:27 PM
> > To: 'Tomcat Users List'
> > Subject: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as
> > service?
> >
> > Dear All,
> >
> > I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external
> > script.
> > This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it
> and
> > save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
> >
> > When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original settings),
> > it works fine.
> >
> > When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint
> fails
> > because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings
> (tomcat7w.exe).
> >
> > I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any explanation
> > yet:
> > http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-
> > 92413aaecc2e
> >
> > But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between
> > problematic and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe
> > there is something related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just
> guessing.
> >
> > Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
> >
> > Thanks, Jan
>
> What user is the Tomcat service running under?
> What other differences could exist between a user session (running with
> startup.bat) and a background session?
I forgot to mention that the Tomcat service is launched using my credentials
(not as local admin). The same account I use for a remote access and hence
for launching the tomcat via startup.bat.
I really do not see any differences. The same commands (cmd.exe, csript.exe,
...) are executed (64-bit variants) with the same params, but in one case
there are memory limits.
Btw, could be there any memory differences between users? I'll rather double
check this. But I don't know how :-(
What else... antivirus, firewall? I'll try to disable it for a while.
AFAIK tomcat.exe is based on procrun wrapper. Is this wrapper memory safe?
I just think (aloud) I could write a custom wrapper and execute my script
directly from this new service... Quite complex to me... But I could check
if it behaves differently or not...
Jan
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RE: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as
service?
Posted by Jeffrey Janner <Je...@PolyDyne.com>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: honyk [mailto:j.tosovsky@email.cz]
> Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2013 1:27 PM
> To: 'Tomcat Users List'
> Subject: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as
> service?
>
> Dear All,
>
> I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external
> script.
> This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it and
> save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
>
> When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original settings),
> it works fine.
>
> When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint fails
> because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings (tomcat7w.exe).
>
> I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any explanation
> yet:
> http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-
> 92413aaecc2e
>
> But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between
> problematic and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe
> there is something related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just guessing.
>
> Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
>
> Thanks, Jan
What user is the Tomcat service running under?
What other differences could exist between a user session (running with startup.bat) and a background session?
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Re: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256
Martin,
On 6/27/13 3:44 PM, Martin Gainty wrote:
> When you run your MS app standalone how much heap, stack does this
> process occupy?
>
> When TC startsup how much heap,stack is left over for the
> standalone Microsoft app?
Read the documentation for java.lang.System.exec() and for the exec()
family of calls in the C library, and you'll realize that your
questions are irrelevant.
> If you're not going to powerup your machine with 8GB RAM and at
> least tera of storage your only solution
What in the world are you talking about?
> is to configure your Microsoft Compound Documents be opened, read
> and written using POI https://poi.apache.org/
*rolls eyes*
- -chris
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RE: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as
service?
Posted by Martin Gainty <mg...@hotmail.com>.
When you run your MS app standalone how much heap, stack does this process occupy?
When TC startsup how much heap,stack is left over for the standalone Microsoft app?
If youre not going to powerup your machine with 8GB RAM and at least tera of storage your only solution
is to configure your Microsoft Compound Documents be opened, read and written using POI
https://poi.apache.org/
Keep us apprised,
Martin
> From: j.tosovsky@email.cz
> To: users@tomcat.apache.org
> Subject: RE: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
> Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 21:24:03 +0200
>
> On 2013-06-27 André Warnier wrote:
> > honyk wrote:
> > > On 2013-06-26 André Warnier wrote:
> > >> honyk wrote:
> > >>> Dear All,
> > >>>
> > >>> I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external
> > >> script.
> > >>> This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it
> > >> and
> > >>> save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
> > >>>
> > >>> When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original
> > settings),
> > >> it
> > >>> works fine.
> > >>>
> > >>> When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint
> > >> fails
> > >>> because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings
> > >> (tomcat7w.exe).
> > >>> I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any
> > explanation
> > >> yet:
> > >>> http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-
> > >> 92413aaecc2e
> > >>> But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between
> > >> problematic
> > >>> and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe there is
> > >> something
> > >>> related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just guessing.
> > >>>
> > >>> Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
> > >>>
> > >> Hi.
> > >> The problem has nothing to do with Tomcat per se.
> > >> It is due to running a Microsoft Office program (or library modules
> > >> such as the "Interop"
> > >> series) as a sub-process of a Windows Service (and thus in the same
> > >> Service context) which
> > >> is something that is not in the design of Microsoft Office, not
> > >> supported by Microsoft,
> > >> and even actively discouraged by Microsoft.
> > >> See : http://support.microsoft.com/kb/257757
> > >>
> > >> The problem is basically that a Windows Service does not run in the
> > >> same "environment" as
> > >> a "user session" environment, and as they say in that article, you
> > will
> > >> certainly
> > >> experience "unstable behavior and/or deadlock" somewhere, and will
> > get
> > >> no help for it.
> > >
> > > I read this article but because I do not need intraction and my code
> > doesn't
> > > run simultaneously and tomcat is launched using my credentials - I
> > still
> > > thought it could be possible.
> > >
> > > Now realizing that tomcat launched using my credentials do not
> > necesarily
> > > mean that Office use the same...
> > >
> > >> Personal experience : some things will work with one MS-Office
> > program,
> > >> and totally fail
> > >> with another; even simple things like opening or saving a file. It
> > may
> > >> work with one
> > >> file, and fail with another, for no apparent reason.
> > >> You get an OOM error in this case, but other cases may be "file not
> > >> found" (although it's
> > >> there) or whatever other bizarre failures.
> > >> Ultimately it is unpredictable, frustrating and time-consuming.
> > >
> > > I was an optimist when everything worked in the user mode...
> > >
> > >> Solutions :
> > >> 1) instead of MS-Office, use LibreOffice or OpenOffice. Both can
> > run
> > >> in "headless" mode,
> > >> and provide an API to have them "do things with documents". And both
> > >> can open and
> > >> manipulate MS-Office documents. Depending on what you do, there may
> > be
> > >> some differences
> > >> in the results, but it works fine for many things.
> > >> Or try one of the other solutions suggested in the above article.
> > >> (I have not tried them, I use OpenOffice/LibreOffice).
> > >
> > > I'll give it a try. I originaly tested Apache POI, but required
> > > functionality is not implemented yet.
> > >
> > >> 2) do not run Tomcat as a Service. Create a virtual Windows machine,
> > >> and run it in a user
> > >> console (with startup.bat). You can restrict access to the VM, and
> > >> since it is a VM, it
> > >> can run unattended, just as a service would.
> > >> (I am also using this scheme, when circumstances permit).
> > >> But in that case, also pay attention to the licensing considerations
> > at
> > >> the end of the
> > >> article.
> > >
> > > I am quite lost in this ;-) But I'll investigate further.
> > >
> > > Thanks a lot for your exhaustive analysis! Finally it looks my way is
> > no way
> > > :-)
> > >
> >
> > No problem. I went myself through the exact same issues as you
> > described, I did believe
> > that there must be a workaround, tried a number of things with great
> > loss of time, and
> > finally had to admit that the MS article was right and that there is no
> > good solution with
> > MS-Office when starting it from a Service.
>
> I appreciate a lot your response and sharing your experience. Without it I
> would spend many additional hours of investigating, trial and error
> attempts, asking the same topic in different places, all this in heavy
> frustration...
>
> > About the Virtual Machine solution : usually, when you want something
> > to run as a Service,
> > it is because it has to run in the background, without a user being
> > logged-in, because of
> > security e.g. Also because otherwise, when the logged-in user logs
> > off, any program that
> > he's running get killed.
> > With Virtual Machines (VM in short), you can create a Windows machine
> > that has no real
> > physical console, runs all the time, and where a user session can stay
> > logged-in all the
> > time. So in that kind of machine, it is not usually a problem if a
> > user is logged-in and
> > remains logged-in, with a console window open, and Tomcat running in
> > it.
> > And in that console window, your Tomcat could be running via
> > startup.bat, and execute your
> > MS-Office commands without problems, as it is not a Service.
>
> If I understand it correctly, this would need a special care when the VM is
> restarted - the user should log-in again. In meantime this system is out of
> work. It is a rare case though.
>
> Jan
>
>
>
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>
RE: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by honyk <j....@email.cz>.
On 2013-06-27 André Warnier wrote:
> honyk wrote:
> > On 2013-06-26 André Warnier wrote:
> >> honyk wrote:
> >>> Dear All,
> >>>
> >>> I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external
> >> script.
> >>> This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it
> >> and
> >>> save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
> >>>
> >>> When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original
> settings),
> >> it
> >>> works fine.
> >>>
> >>> When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint
> >> fails
> >>> because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings
> >> (tomcat7w.exe).
> >>> I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any
> explanation
> >> yet:
> >>> http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-
> >> 92413aaecc2e
> >>> But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between
> >> problematic
> >>> and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe there is
> >> something
> >>> related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just guessing.
> >>>
> >>> Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
> >>>
> >> Hi.
> >> The problem has nothing to do with Tomcat per se.
> >> It is due to running a Microsoft Office program (or library modules
> >> such as the "Interop"
> >> series) as a sub-process of a Windows Service (and thus in the same
> >> Service context) which
> >> is something that is not in the design of Microsoft Office, not
> >> supported by Microsoft,
> >> and even actively discouraged by Microsoft.
> >> See : http://support.microsoft.com/kb/257757
> >>
> >> The problem is basically that a Windows Service does not run in the
> >> same "environment" as
> >> a "user session" environment, and as they say in that article, you
> will
> >> certainly
> >> experience "unstable behavior and/or deadlock" somewhere, and will
> get
> >> no help for it.
> >
> > I read this article but because I do not need intraction and my code
> doesn't
> > run simultaneously and tomcat is launched using my credentials - I
> still
> > thought it could be possible.
> >
> > Now realizing that tomcat launched using my credentials do not
> necesarily
> > mean that Office use the same...
> >
> >> Personal experience : some things will work with one MS-Office
> program,
> >> and totally fail
> >> with another; even simple things like opening or saving a file. It
> may
> >> work with one
> >> file, and fail with another, for no apparent reason.
> >> You get an OOM error in this case, but other cases may be "file not
> >> found" (although it's
> >> there) or whatever other bizarre failures.
> >> Ultimately it is unpredictable, frustrating and time-consuming.
> >
> > I was an optimist when everything worked in the user mode...
> >
> >> Solutions :
> >> 1) instead of MS-Office, use LibreOffice or OpenOffice. Both can
> run
> >> in "headless" mode,
> >> and provide an API to have them "do things with documents". And both
> >> can open and
> >> manipulate MS-Office documents. Depending on what you do, there may
> be
> >> some differences
> >> in the results, but it works fine for many things.
> >> Or try one of the other solutions suggested in the above article.
> >> (I have not tried them, I use OpenOffice/LibreOffice).
> >
> > I'll give it a try. I originaly tested Apache POI, but required
> > functionality is not implemented yet.
> >
> >> 2) do not run Tomcat as a Service. Create a virtual Windows machine,
> >> and run it in a user
> >> console (with startup.bat). You can restrict access to the VM, and
> >> since it is a VM, it
> >> can run unattended, just as a service would.
> >> (I am also using this scheme, when circumstances permit).
> >> But in that case, also pay attention to the licensing considerations
> at
> >> the end of the
> >> article.
> >
> > I am quite lost in this ;-) But I'll investigate further.
> >
> > Thanks a lot for your exhaustive analysis! Finally it looks my way is
> no way
> > :-)
> >
>
> No problem. I went myself through the exact same issues as you
> described, I did believe
> that there must be a workaround, tried a number of things with great
> loss of time, and
> finally had to admit that the MS article was right and that there is no
> good solution with
> MS-Office when starting it from a Service.
I appreciate a lot your response and sharing your experience. Without it I
would spend many additional hours of investigating, trial and error
attempts, asking the same topic in different places, all this in heavy
frustration...
> About the Virtual Machine solution : usually, when you want something
> to run as a Service,
> it is because it has to run in the background, without a user being
> logged-in, because of
> security e.g. Also because otherwise, when the logged-in user logs
> off, any program that
> he's running get killed.
> With Virtual Machines (VM in short), you can create a Windows machine
> that has no real
> physical console, runs all the time, and where a user session can stay
> logged-in all the
> time. So in that kind of machine, it is not usually a problem if a
> user is logged-in and
> remains logged-in, with a console window open, and Tomcat running in
> it.
> And in that console window, your Tomcat could be running via
> startup.bat, and execute your
> MS-Office commands without problems, as it is not a Service.
If I understand it correctly, this would need a special care when the VM is
restarted - the user should log-in again. In meantime this system is out of
work. It is a rare case though.
Jan
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Re: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
honyk wrote:
> On 2013-06-26 André Warnier wrote:
>> honyk wrote:
>>> Dear All,
>>>
>>> I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external
>> script.
>>> This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it
>> and
>>> save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
>>>
>>> When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original settings),
>> it
>>> works fine.
>>>
>>> When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint
>> fails
>>> because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings
>> (tomcat7w.exe).
>>> I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any explanation
>> yet:
>>> http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-
>> 92413aaecc2e
>>> But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between
>> problematic
>>> and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe there is
>> something
>>> related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just guessing.
>>>
>>> Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
>>>
>> Hi.
>> The problem has nothing to do with Tomcat per se.
>> It is due to running a Microsoft Office program (or library modules
>> such as the "Interop"
>> series) as a sub-process of a Windows Service (and thus in the same
>> Service context) which
>> is something that is not in the design of Microsoft Office, not
>> supported by Microsoft,
>> and even actively discouraged by Microsoft.
>> See : http://support.microsoft.com/kb/257757
>>
>> The problem is basically that a Windows Service does not run in the
>> same "environment" as
>> a "user session" environment, and as they say in that article, you will
>> certainly
>> experience "unstable behavior and/or deadlock" somewhere, and will get
>> no help for it.
>
> I read this article but because I do not need intraction and my code doesn't
> run simultaneously and tomcat is launched using my credentials - I still
> thought it could be possible.
>
> Now realizing that tomcat launched using my credentials do not necesarily
> mean that Office use the same...
>
>> Personal experience : some things will work with one MS-Office program,
>> and totally fail
>> with another; even simple things like opening or saving a file. It may
>> work with one
>> file, and fail with another, for no apparent reason.
>> You get an OOM error in this case, but other cases may be "file not
>> found" (although it's
>> there) or whatever other bizarre failures.
>> Ultimately it is unpredictable, frustrating and time-consuming.
>
> I was an optimist when everything worked in the user mode...
>
>> Solutions :
>> 1) instead of MS-Office, use LibreOffice or OpenOffice. Both can run
>> in "headless" mode,
>> and provide an API to have them "do things with documents". And both
>> can open and
>> manipulate MS-Office documents. Depending on what you do, there may be
>> some differences
>> in the results, but it works fine for many things.
>> Or try one of the other solutions suggested in the above article.
>> (I have not tried them, I use OpenOffice/LibreOffice).
>
> I'll give it a try. I originaly tested Apache POI, but required
> functionality is not implemented yet.
>
>> 2) do not run Tomcat as a Service. Create a virtual Windows machine,
>> and run it in a user
>> console (with startup.bat). You can restrict access to the VM, and
>> since it is a VM, it
>> can run unattended, just as a service would.
>> (I am also using this scheme, when circumstances permit).
>> But in that case, also pay attention to the licensing considerations at
>> the end of the
>> article.
>
> I am quite lost in this ;-) But I'll investigate further.
>
> Thanks a lot for your exhaustive analysis! Finally it looks my way is no way
> :-)
>
No problem. I went myself through the exact same issues as you described, I did believe
that there must be a workaround, tried a number of things with great loss of time, and
finally had to admit that the MS article was right and that there is no good solution with
MS-Office when starting it from a Service.
About the Virtual Machine solution : usually, when you want something to run as a Service,
it is because it has to run in the background, without a user being logged-in, because of
security e.g. Also because otherwise, when the logged-in user logs off, any program that
he's running get killed.
With Virtual Machines (VM in short), you can create a Windows machine that has no real
physical console, runs all the time, and where a user session can stay logged-in all the
time. So in that kind of machine, it is not usually a problem if a user is logged-in and
remains logged-in, with a console window open, and Tomcat running in it.
And in that console window, your Tomcat could be running via startup.bat, and execute your
MS-Office commands without problems, as it is not a Service.
With respect to licensing, as long as that machine runs a licensed version of MS-Office,
and all your Tomcat client workstations themselves are allowed to use MS-Office, you
shoukd be in the clear.
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RE: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by honyk <j....@email.cz>.
On 2013-06-26 André Warnier wrote:
> honyk wrote:
> > Dear All,
> >
> > I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external
> script.
> > This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it
> and
> > save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
> >
> > When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original settings),
> it
> > works fine.
> >
> > When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint
> fails
> > because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings
> (tomcat7w.exe).
> >
> > I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any explanation
> yet:
> > http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-
> 92413aaecc2e
> >
> > But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between
> problematic
> > and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe there is
> something
> > related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just guessing.
> >
> > Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
> >
>
> Hi.
> The problem has nothing to do with Tomcat per se.
> It is due to running a Microsoft Office program (or library modules
> such as the "Interop"
> series) as a sub-process of a Windows Service (and thus in the same
> Service context) which
> is something that is not in the design of Microsoft Office, not
> supported by Microsoft,
> and even actively discouraged by Microsoft.
> See : http://support.microsoft.com/kb/257757
>
> The problem is basically that a Windows Service does not run in the
> same "environment" as
> a "user session" environment, and as they say in that article, you will
> certainly
> experience "unstable behavior and/or deadlock" somewhere, and will get
> no help for it.
I read this article but because I do not need intraction and my code doesn't
run simultaneously and tomcat is launched using my credentials - I still
thought it could be possible.
Now realizing that tomcat launched using my credentials do not necesarily
mean that Office use the same...
> Personal experience : some things will work with one MS-Office program,
> and totally fail
> with another; even simple things like opening or saving a file. It may
> work with one
> file, and fail with another, for no apparent reason.
> You get an OOM error in this case, but other cases may be "file not
> found" (although it's
> there) or whatever other bizarre failures.
> Ultimately it is unpredictable, frustrating and time-consuming.
I was an optimist when everything worked in the user mode...
> Solutions :
> 1) instead of MS-Office, use LibreOffice or OpenOffice. Both can run
> in "headless" mode,
> and provide an API to have them "do things with documents". And both
> can open and
> manipulate MS-Office documents. Depending on what you do, there may be
> some differences
> in the results, but it works fine for many things.
> Or try one of the other solutions suggested in the above article.
> (I have not tried them, I use OpenOffice/LibreOffice).
I'll give it a try. I originaly tested Apache POI, but required
functionality is not implemented yet.
> 2) do not run Tomcat as a Service. Create a virtual Windows machine,
> and run it in a user
> console (with startup.bat). You can restrict access to the VM, and
> since it is a VM, it
> can run unattended, just as a service would.
> (I am also using this scheme, when circumstances permit).
> But in that case, also pay attention to the licensing considerations at
> the end of the
> article.
I am quite lost in this ;-) But I'll investigate further.
Thanks a lot for your exhaustive analysis! Finally it looks my way is no way
:-)
Regards, Jan
PS: And sorry for blaming the Tomcat.
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Re: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256
André,
On 6/26/13 3:52 PM, André Warnier wrote:
> Solutions : 1) instead of MS-Office, use LibreOffice or OpenOffice.
> Both can run in "headless" mode, and provide an API to have them
> "do things with documents". And both can open and manipulate
> MS-Office documents. Depending on what you do, there may be some
> differences in the results, but it works fine for many things. Or
> try one of the other solutions suggested in the above article.
Or Apache POI - http://poi.apache.org/
...but it looks like you have already commented on the PowerPoint
forum about that.
I'm interested in what kind of OutOfMemoryError OP is getting: there
is more than one kind. It may be that OP is out of file handles or
something like that, and so changing the heap size isn't useful.
- -chris
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Re: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
honyk wrote:
> Dear All,
>
> I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external script.
> This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it and
> save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
>
> When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original settings), it
> works fine.
>
> When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint fails
> because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings (tomcat7w.exe).
>
> I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any explanation yet:
> http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-92413aaecc2e
>
> But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between problematic
> and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe there is something
> related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just guessing.
>
> Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
>
Hi.
The problem has nothing to do with Tomcat per se.
It is due to running a Microsoft Office program (or library modules such as the "Interop"
series) as a sub-process of a Windows Service (and thus in the same Service context) which
is something that is not in the design of Microsoft Office, not supported by Microsoft,
and even actively discouraged by Microsoft.
See : http://support.microsoft.com/kb/257757
The problem is basically that a Windows Service does not run in the same "environment" as
a "user session" environment, and as they say in that article, you will certainly
experience "unstable behavior and/or deadlock" somewhere, and will get no help for it.
Personal experience : some things will work with one MS-Office program, and totally fail
with another; even simple things like opening or saving a file. It may work with one
file, and fail with another, for no apparent reason.
You get an OOM error in this case, but other cases may be "file not found" (although it's
there) or whatever other bizarre failures.
Ultimately it is unpredictable, frustrating and time-consuming.
Solutions :
1) instead of MS-Office, use LibreOffice or OpenOffice. Both can run in "headless" mode,
and provide an API to have them "do things with documents". And both can open and
manipulate MS-Office documents. Depending on what you do, there may be some differences
in the results, but it works fine for many things.
Or try one of the other solutions suggested in the above article.
(I have not tried them, I use OpenOffice/LibreOffice).
2) do not run Tomcat as a Service. Create a virtual Windows machine, and run it in a user
console (with startup.bat). You can restrict access to the VM, and since it is a VM, it
can run unattended, just as a service would.
(I am also using this scheme, when circumstances permit).
But in that case, also pay attention to the licensing considerations at the end of the
article.
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RE: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by honyk <j....@email.cz>.
On 2013-06-26 André Warnier wrote:
> honyk wrote:
> > Dear All,
> >
> > I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external
> script.
> > This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it
> and
> > save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
> >
> > When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original settings),
> it
> > works fine.
> >
> > When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint
> fails
> > because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings
> (tomcat7w.exe).
>
> Note that the Xmx setting is probably irrelevant here.
I suppose so, but I rather mentioned this.
> But the PPT process which you start will not use that memory area, it
> will use its own totally separate memory allocation.
Ok, thanks.
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Re: Memory limits for children processes when running Tomcat as service?
Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
honyk wrote:
> Dear All,
>
> I have a JSF2.0 app that executes (via ProcessBuilder) an external script.
> This script opens PPTX via PowerPoint ActiveX object, manipulate it and
> save. It runs on Windows Server 2008 R2 64-bit, 4GB RAM, JDK 7.
>
> When tomcat 7 is launched using startup.bat (with original settings), it
> works fine.
>
> When tomcat runs as a service, opening the PPTX in the PowerPoint fails
> because of Out Of Memory error regardless Xmx settings (tomcat7w.exe).
Note that the Xmx setting is probably irrelevant here. It determines how much memory the
JVM (which runs Tomcat) will allocate for its Heap (which it uses to store Java object
instances and data).
But the PPT process which you start will not use that memory area, it will use its own
totally separate memory allocation.
>
> I originally asked PowerPoint forum, but haven't get any explanation yet:
> http://answers.microsoft.com/thread/37cbebf6-4003-4ab0-9295-92413aaecc2e
>
> But as the entry point is Tomcat and the only difference between problematic
> and non problematic behavior is the 'service' mode, maybe there is something
> related in the tomcat7.exe code base. Just guessing.
>
> Has anybody an idea why both modes behave differently?
>
> Thanks, Jan
>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
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