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Posted to library-dev@jakarta.apache.org by Ted Husted <ne...@husted.com> on 2001/02/24 12:49:45 UTC
General Consensus, Round 3
OLD BUSINESS
Subproject Guidelines - 6 +1s out of a possible 11 (eight responding).
First packages - 6 +1s out of a possible 11 (eight responding).
< http://husted.com/about/jakarta/lib003.htm >
NEW BUSINESS
Documentation and testing requirements
As a starting point for documentation requirements, I would suggest the
following:
(0) substantial JavaDocs (of course),
(1) a standard catalog entry, outlining the package's "high concept"
(purpose and scope), prerequisites, release history, mailing list and
archive links, FAQ and Bugzilla links, and active committers
("whoWeAre"),
(2) a developer's guide, that explains how to use the package in more
detail, developer to developer,
(3) a quick-start installation page for people who just want to plug it
in,
(4) obligatory quick-start FAQ,
--
An example of a developer's guide is here:
<
http://jakarta.apache.org/struts/api/org/apache/struts/taglib/bean/package-summary.html#package_description
>
"(1)" would be the foundation for a CJAN type catalog, and might
ultimately land in a database.
--
As to the Web site documentation requirements, my first thoughts are
(0) Mission statement
(1) General guidelines (part (1) of recent poll)
(2) Catalog (collection of (1) above)
(3) Primer (package creation, use, and abuse)
(4) Standards - naming hierarchy, testing requirements; sample directory
layout, build file, documentation
(5) Interactive FAQ (Jyve, if it can be fixed)
(6) Omnibus index to mailing lists, archives, bugzilla, and master list
of committers
--
As to testing requirements, the obvious starting points are Junit,
J2EEUnit, and HttpUnit.
< http://junit.org/ >
< http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net/ >
< http://sourceforge.net/projects/httpunit >
To the extent possible, we should try an integrate testing with Ant.
This could lead to a gump that not only builds code, but tests it as
well.-)
There's some initial background on this at
<
http://www.mail-archive.com/struts-dev%40jakarta.apache.org/msg00481.html
>
-Ted.
Re: General Consensus, Round 3
Posted by Vincent Massol <vm...@octo.fr>.
oopps ... cross posting ...
>As to testing requirements, the obvious starting points are Junit,
>J2EEUnit, and HttpUnit.
>
>< http://junit.org/ >
>
>< http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net/ >
>
>< http://sourceforge.net/projects/httpunit >
>
>To the extent possible, we should try an integrate testing with Ant.
>This could lead to a gump that not only builds code, but tests it as
>well.-)
>
>
>-Ted.
I have posted a message saying I am willing to donate J2EEUnit to Apache if
it helps.
Also, I have already created Ant scripts that automate J2EEUnit testing with
several Servlet Engines. My Ant scripts has test-xxx targets (where xxx is
the name of the servlet engine) which does the following :
- start the servlet engine,
- run the J2EEUnit/JUnit tests,
- stop the servlet engine
where xxx is for the moment = {Resin 1.2, Resin 1.3, Tomcat 3.1.1, Tomcat
3.2.1, Tomcat 4.0, Orion 1.4, WebLogic 5.1}
In order to be able to do this I had to create an Ant target (called
startserver) which calls an Ant target (the target that should start the
server) in another thread and waits for the server to be started (by trying
to connect to it on a specified URL)...
Look at
http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/j2eeunit/build/build.xml?rev=1
.18&content-type=text/x-cvsweb-markup&cvsroot=j2eeunit if you want to check
my Ant build.xml file.
So I guess integration with Gump should be a breeze ... :)
Thanks.
Vincent
Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Peter Donald <do...@apache.org>.
At 07:29 17/3/01 +0100, Vincent Massol wrote:
>2) Has anyone ever done a migration of license from GPL to APL ? I am the
>sole owner of J2EEUnit
You simply just change the banner at top of each source file ;) However I
would also keep a GPL ed version around for a few months so you do no tpiss
of any users that require a GPLed framework due to working with other GPL
works.
>3) Are you interested by the J2EEUnit framework ?
yep ;)
Cheers,
Pete
*-----------------------------------------------------*
| "Faced with the choice between changing one's mind, |
| and proving that there is no need to do so - almost |
| everyone gets busy on the proof." |
| - John Kenneth Galbraith |
*-----------------------------------------------------*
Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Ted Husted <ne...@husted.com>.
Vincent Massol wrote:
> Ok thanks. So I'll have to convince a PMC member to initialize this
> subproject creation ... :)
The best way to start the process would be for you to submit a proposal
to the general list. I'm sure it would come up for a vote in due course.
If you would like to send it me privately first, I'd be happy to review
it.
-- Ted Husted, Husted dot Com, Fairport NY USA.
-- Custom Software ~ Technical Services.
-- Tel 716 737-3463.
-- http://www.husted.com/about/struts/
Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Ted Husted <ne...@husted.com>.
Vincent Massol wrote:
> Ok thanks. So I'll have to convince a PMC member to initialize this
> subproject creation ... :)
The best way to start the process would be for you to submit a proposal
to the general list. I'm sure it would come up for a vote in due course.
If you would like to send it me privately first, I'd be happy to review
it.
-- Ted Husted, Husted dot Com, Fairport NY USA.
-- Custom Software ~ Technical Services.
-- Tel 716 737-3463.
-- http://www.husted.com/about/struts/
Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Vincent Massol <vm...@octo.fr>.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Husted" <ne...@husted.com>
To: <li...@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2001 10:39 PM
Subject: Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
> Vincent Massol wrote:
> > Some time ago, I posted a message on this mailing list mentionning that
I
> > was willing to donate J2EEUnit (http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net) to the
> > Apache Group. I have tried to follow a bit the ongoing discussion
regarding
> > the Commons/Agora/... (although I have not read *all* the posts ... too
> > many ... :) ) but I am not sure about the latest status regarding server
> > test frameworks. I seem to remember that DBCP was number 1 on the list
of
> > todo and test frameworks would come later, is that right ?
>
> QA testing is actually something that we would want to work on along
> with the DBCP pool. Ideally, we would like each package to ship with its
> own suite of tests.
>
> > 1) What is the process for a project to be accepted as part of the
Apache
> > Project ? (sorry if this is a FAQ somewhere ... point me to the URL if
it is
>
> < http://jakarta.apache.org/site/management.html >
>
> at the bottom.
>
> For a sample proposal, see
>
> < http://www.husted.com/about/commons/ >
>
Ok thanks. So I'll have to convince a PMC member to initialize this
subproject creation ... :)
> > 4) What's the timeframe for choosing a server framework (or several) for
the
> > Commons/Agora/... ?
>
> Could you expand on this question?
>
I just meant that it seemed you were very focused on the DBCP for the moment
and you probably had a lot of work to do in order to bootstrap the Commons.
I didn't want to intrude with the server-side testing framework issue if it
is not the correct time ... JUnit is probably enough for DBCP unit tests.
However, for projects like Struts, Turbine, Cocoon, ... J2EEUnit would be
very useful.
> -Ted.
>
Thanks
Vincent.
Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Vincent Massol <vm...@octo.fr>.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ted Husted" <ne...@husted.com>
To: <li...@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2001 10:39 PM
Subject: Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
> Vincent Massol wrote:
> > Some time ago, I posted a message on this mailing list mentionning that
I
> > was willing to donate J2EEUnit (http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net) to the
> > Apache Group. I have tried to follow a bit the ongoing discussion
regarding
> > the Commons/Agora/... (although I have not read *all* the posts ... too
> > many ... :) ) but I am not sure about the latest status regarding server
> > test frameworks. I seem to remember that DBCP was number 1 on the list
of
> > todo and test frameworks would come later, is that right ?
>
> QA testing is actually something that we would want to work on along
> with the DBCP pool. Ideally, we would like each package to ship with its
> own suite of tests.
>
> > 1) What is the process for a project to be accepted as part of the
Apache
> > Project ? (sorry if this is a FAQ somewhere ... point me to the URL if
it is
>
> < http://jakarta.apache.org/site/management.html >
>
> at the bottom.
>
> For a sample proposal, see
>
> < http://www.husted.com/about/commons/ >
>
Ok thanks. So I'll have to convince a PMC member to initialize this
subproject creation ... :)
> > 4) What's the timeframe for choosing a server framework (or several) for
the
> > Commons/Agora/... ?
>
> Could you expand on this question?
>
I just meant that it seemed you were very focused on the DBCP for the moment
and you probably had a lot of work to do in order to bootstrap the Commons.
I didn't want to intrude with the server-side testing framework issue if it
is not the correct time ... JUnit is probably enough for DBCP unit tests.
However, for projects like Struts, Turbine, Cocoon, ... J2EEUnit would be
very useful.
> -Ted.
>
Thanks
Vincent.
Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Ted Husted <ne...@husted.com>.
Vincent Massol wrote:
> Some time ago, I posted a message on this mailing list mentionning that I
> was willing to donate J2EEUnit (http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net) to the
> Apache Group. I have tried to follow a bit the ongoing discussion regarding
> the Commons/Agora/... (although I have not read *all* the posts ... too
> many ... :) ) but I am not sure about the latest status regarding server
> test frameworks. I seem to remember that DBCP was number 1 on the list of
> todo and test frameworks would come later, is that right ?
QA testing is actually something that we would want to work on along
with the DBCP pool. Ideally, we would like each package to ship with its
own suite of tests.
> 1) What is the process for a project to be accepted as part of the Apache
> Project ? (sorry if this is a FAQ somewhere ... point me to the URL if it is
< http://jakarta.apache.org/site/management.html >
at the bottom.
For a sample proposal, see
< http://www.husted.com/about/commons/ >
> 4) What's the timeframe for choosing a server framework (or several) for the
> Commons/Agora/... ?
Could you expand on this question?
-Ted.
Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Ted Husted <ne...@husted.com>.
Vincent Massol wrote:
> Some time ago, I posted a message on this mailing list mentionning that I
> was willing to donate J2EEUnit (http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net) to the
> Apache Group. I have tried to follow a bit the ongoing discussion regarding
> the Commons/Agora/... (although I have not read *all* the posts ... too
> many ... :) ) but I am not sure about the latest status regarding server
> test frameworks. I seem to remember that DBCP was number 1 on the list of
> todo and test frameworks would come later, is that right ?
QA testing is actually something that we would want to work on along
with the DBCP pool. Ideally, we would like each package to ship with its
own suite of tests.
> 1) What is the process for a project to be accepted as part of the Apache
> Project ? (sorry if this is a FAQ somewhere ... point me to the URL if it is
< http://jakarta.apache.org/site/management.html >
at the bottom.
For a sample proposal, see
< http://www.husted.com/about/commons/ >
> 4) What's the timeframe for choosing a server framework (or several) for the
> Commons/Agora/... ?
Could you expand on this question?
-Ted.
J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Vincent Massol <vm...@octo.fr>.
Hi,
Some time ago, I posted a message on this mailing list mentionning that I
was willing to donate J2EEUnit (http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net) to the
Apache Group. I have tried to follow a bit the ongoing discussion regarding
the Commons/Agora/... (although I have not read *all* the posts ... too
many ... :) ) but I am not sure about the latest status regarding server
test frameworks. I seem to remember that DBCP was number 1 on the list of
todo and test frameworks would come later, is that right ?
I have a few questions :
1) What is the process for a project to be accepted as part of the Apache
Project ? (sorry if this is a FAQ somewhere ... point me to the URL if it is
...)
2) Has anyone ever done a migration of license from GPL to APL ? I am the
sole owner of J2EEUnit
3) Are you interested by the J2EEUnit framework ?
4) What's the timeframe for choosing a server framework (or several) for the
Commons/Agora/... ?
Thanks a lot.
Vincent Massol
Re: J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Peter Donald <do...@apache.org>.
At 07:29 17/3/01 +0100, Vincent Massol wrote:
>2) Has anyone ever done a migration of license from GPL to APL ? I am the
>sole owner of J2EEUnit
You simply just change the banner at top of each source file ;) However I
would also keep a GPL ed version around for a few months so you do no tpiss
of any users that require a GPLed framework due to working with other GPL
works.
>3) Are you interested by the J2EEUnit framework ?
yep ;)
Cheers,
Pete
*-----------------------------------------------------*
| "Faced with the choice between changing one's mind, |
| and proving that there is no need to do so - almost |
| everyone gets busy on the proof." |
| - John Kenneth Galbraith |
*-----------------------------------------------------*
J2EEUnit donation to the Apache Group
Posted by Vincent Massol <vm...@octo.fr>.
Hi,
Some time ago, I posted a message on this mailing list mentionning that I
was willing to donate J2EEUnit (http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net) to the
Apache Group. I have tried to follow a bit the ongoing discussion regarding
the Commons/Agora/... (although I have not read *all* the posts ... too
many ... :) ) but I am not sure about the latest status regarding server
test frameworks. I seem to remember that DBCP was number 1 on the list of
todo and test frameworks would come later, is that right ?
I have a few questions :
1) What is the process for a project to be accepted as part of the Apache
Project ? (sorry if this is a FAQ somewhere ... point me to the URL if it is
...)
2) Has anyone ever done a migration of license from GPL to APL ? I am the
sole owner of J2EEUnit
3) Are you interested by the J2EEUnit framework ?
4) What's the timeframe for choosing a server framework (or several) for the
Commons/Agora/... ?
Thanks a lot.
Vincent Massol
Re: General Consensus, Round 3
Posted by "Geir Magnusson Jr." <ge...@optonline.net>.
Ted Husted wrote:
> NEW BUSINESS
>
> Documentation and testing requirements
>
> As a starting point for documentation requirements, I would suggest the
> following:
>
> (0) substantial JavaDocs (of course),
of course... +1
> (1) a standard catalog entry, outlining the package's "high concept"
> (purpose and scope), prerequisites, release history, mailing list and
> archive links, FAQ and Bugzilla links, and active committers
> ("whoWeAre"),
Yep.
> (2) a developer's guide, that explains how to use the package in more
> detail, developer to developer,
+1 : required
> (3) a quick-start installation page for people who just want to plug it
> in,
+1 : required
> (4) obligatory quick-start FAQ,
sure, if needed.
> --
>
> As to the Web site documentation requirements, my first thoughts are
>
> (0) Mission statement
Can we call it 'charter'? I have too many bad feelings about the words
'mission statement'. Reminds me of #7 of the 10 Best Things to Say When
Caught Napping :
"I wasn't sleeping! I was meditating on the mission statement and
envisioning a new paradigm."
> (1) General guidelines (part (1) of recent poll)
>
> (2) Catalog (collection of (1) above)
>
> (3) Primer (package creation, use, and abuse)
>
> (4) Standards - naming hierarchy, testing requirements; sample directory
> layout, build file, documentation
+1 on requiring building with Ant.
> (5) Interactive FAQ (Jyve, if it can be fixed)
>
> (6) Omnibus index to mailing lists, archives, bugzilla, and master list
> of committers
>
> --
>
> As to testing requirements, the obvious starting points are Junit,
> J2EEUnit, and HttpUnit.
>
> < http://junit.org/ >
We use JUnit very effectively in Velocity to exercise the parser et al.
It's been a literal ${DEITY}-send.
> < http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net/ >
>
> < http://sourceforge.net/projects/httpunit >
>
> To the extent possible, we should try an integrate testing with Ant.
> This could lead to a gump that not only builds code, but tests it as
> well.-)
>
> There's some initial background on this at
>
> <
> http://www.mail-archive.com/struts-dev%40jakarta.apache.org/msg00481.html
> >
>
> -Ted.
--
Geir Magnusson Jr. geirm@optonline.com
Developing for the web? See http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/
Re: General Consensus, Round 3
Posted by "Geir Magnusson Jr." <ge...@optonline.net>.
Ted Husted wrote:
> NEW BUSINESS
>
> Documentation and testing requirements
>
> As a starting point for documentation requirements, I would suggest the
> following:
>
> (0) substantial JavaDocs (of course),
of course... +1
> (1) a standard catalog entry, outlining the package's "high concept"
> (purpose and scope), prerequisites, release history, mailing list and
> archive links, FAQ and Bugzilla links, and active committers
> ("whoWeAre"),
Yep.
> (2) a developer's guide, that explains how to use the package in more
> detail, developer to developer,
+1 : required
> (3) a quick-start installation page for people who just want to plug it
> in,
+1 : required
> (4) obligatory quick-start FAQ,
sure, if needed.
> --
>
> As to the Web site documentation requirements, my first thoughts are
>
> (0) Mission statement
Can we call it 'charter'? I have too many bad feelings about the words
'mission statement'. Reminds me of #7 of the 10 Best Things to Say When
Caught Napping :
"I wasn't sleeping! I was meditating on the mission statement and
envisioning a new paradigm."
> (1) General guidelines (part (1) of recent poll)
>
> (2) Catalog (collection of (1) above)
>
> (3) Primer (package creation, use, and abuse)
>
> (4) Standards - naming hierarchy, testing requirements; sample directory
> layout, build file, documentation
+1 on requiring building with Ant.
> (5) Interactive FAQ (Jyve, if it can be fixed)
>
> (6) Omnibus index to mailing lists, archives, bugzilla, and master list
> of committers
>
> --
>
> As to testing requirements, the obvious starting points are Junit,
> J2EEUnit, and HttpUnit.
>
> < http://junit.org/ >
We use JUnit very effectively in Velocity to exercise the parser et al.
It's been a literal ${DEITY}-send.
> < http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net/ >
>
> < http://sourceforge.net/projects/httpunit >
>
> To the extent possible, we should try an integrate testing with Ant.
> This could lead to a gump that not only builds code, but tests it as
> well.-)
>
> There's some initial background on this at
>
> <
> http://www.mail-archive.com/struts-dev%40jakarta.apache.org/msg00481.html
> >
>
> -Ted.
--
Geir Magnusson Jr. geirm@optonline.com
Developing for the web? See http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/
Re: General Consensus, Round 3
Posted by Vincent Massol <vm...@octo.fr>.
oopps ... cross posting ...
>As to testing requirements, the obvious starting points are Junit,
>J2EEUnit, and HttpUnit.
>
>< http://junit.org/ >
>
>< http://j2eeunit.sourceforge.net/ >
>
>< http://sourceforge.net/projects/httpunit >
>
>To the extent possible, we should try an integrate testing with Ant.
>This could lead to a gump that not only builds code, but tests it as
>well.-)
>
>
>-Ted.
I have posted a message saying I am willing to donate J2EEUnit to Apache if
it helps.
Also, I have already created Ant scripts that automate J2EEUnit testing with
several Servlet Engines. My Ant scripts has test-xxx targets (where xxx is
the name of the servlet engine) which does the following :
- start the servlet engine,
- run the J2EEUnit/JUnit tests,
- stop the servlet engine
where xxx is for the moment = {Resin 1.2, Resin 1.3, Tomcat 3.1.1, Tomcat
3.2.1, Tomcat 4.0, Orion 1.4, WebLogic 5.1}
In order to be able to do this I had to create an Ant target (called
startserver) which calls an Ant target (the target that should start the
server) in another thread and waits for the server to be started (by trying
to connect to it on a specified URL)...
Look at
http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/j2eeunit/build/build.xml?rev=1
.18&content-type=text/x-cvsweb-markup&cvsroot=j2eeunit if you want to check
my Ant build.xml file.
So I guess integration with Gump should be a breeze ... :)
Thanks.
Vincent
Re: General Consensus, Round 3
Posted by cm...@yahoo.com.
> As to testing requirements, the obvious starting points are Junit,
> J2EEUnit, and HttpUnit.
Maybe GTest too ? ( used in tomcat3.3, with duplicates in watchdog and I
believe tomcat 4.0 - or something very similar at leat ).
It's XML based, implemented as a group of Ant tasks:
http://jakarta.apache.org/cvsweb/index.cgi/~checkout~/jakarta-tomcat/src/tests/webpages/WEB-INF/test-tomcat.xml
The main issue is that right now there are few hundreds tests for tomcat
based on GTest - so any testing framework that can be adopted by
tomcat should at least support the same features and provide a way to run
the current DTD.
( it is similar with HttpUnit - if I understand what HttpUnit does )
> To the extent possible, we should try an integrate testing with Ant.
> This could lead to a gump that not only builds code, but tests it as
> well.-)
I'm working on this - we use such a thing on tomcat, but integrating it
into Gump might take some time ( my understanding is that we can trick
gump by adding a "test" target, but I'm not sure how to do builds with
different VMs )
Costin
Re: General Consensus, Round 3
Posted by cm...@yahoo.com.
> As to testing requirements, the obvious starting points are Junit,
> J2EEUnit, and HttpUnit.
Maybe GTest too ? ( used in tomcat3.3, with duplicates in watchdog and I
believe tomcat 4.0 - or something very similar at leat ).
It's XML based, implemented as a group of Ant tasks:
http://jakarta.apache.org/cvsweb/index.cgi/~checkout~/jakarta-tomcat/src/tests/webpages/WEB-INF/test-tomcat.xml
The main issue is that right now there are few hundreds tests for tomcat
based on GTest - so any testing framework that can be adopted by
tomcat should at least support the same features and provide a way to run
the current DTD.
( it is similar with HttpUnit - if I understand what HttpUnit does )
> To the extent possible, we should try an integrate testing with Ant.
> This could lead to a gump that not only builds code, but tests it as
> well.-)
I'm working on this - we use such a thing on tomcat, but integrating it
into Gump might take some time ( my understanding is that we can trick
gump by adding a "test" target, but I'm not sure how to do builds with
different VMs )
Costin