You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com> on 2012/05/12 16:40:27 UTC
[4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
I would like to ask you for feedback on this idea, to know if you
think it is good or bad and why, and finally if you think it is
feasible.
Writer shows page breaks (PB) with a line on top of next page's text
area. LyX shows PB with a line crossing the page on the insertion
point with the text "Page break" on the middle of it. These different
approaches can be more or less useful, but both are conceptually
wrong:
PB are not about breaking pages, but about breaking *text
flow* and sending content to the next page.
So PB should be an attribute of the object (a paragraph, a table) that
actually breaks content flow. Writer already work that way: on the
paragraph format (both direct and style) or table properties we have a
"text flow" tab that allows us to define breaks, either before or
after the object, either with or without page style change.
Considering all this, I believe PB should be shown on the same object
that creates the break, and on the object side where break occurs:
this way, PB display will be consistent with the way PB works on
Writer.
See here for a lousy mock-up:
http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks3.png
What do you think?
Regards
Ricardo
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by Torokhov Sergey <to...@mail.ru>.
>On Sunday 13 of May 2012 01:26:41 Torokhov Sergey wrote:
>
> What about the same actions for Line Break and Column Break preferencies?
>
> --
> Regards
Sorry, LineBreak seems no need such complicated behaviour as it is now
dispaying as nonprintable character that can be easily seen.
But what about position of ColumnBreak indication and menu
as an example in case of three columns
with it's Breaks before second and third columns?
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by Kevin Grignon <ke...@gmail.com>.
Ricardo,
Thanks for sharing. I'll take a look at this and provide any UX thoughts
and feedback.
Once the design elaboration crystallizes, perhaps we could perform some
quick user testing to validate the interaction design.
Regards,
Kevin
AOO UX
On Tue, May 15, 2012 at 5:28 PM, RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2012/5/13 RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com>:
> > 2012/5/12 Torokhov Sergey <to...@mail.ru>:
> >> On Saturday 12 of May 2012 22:50:16 RGB ES wrote:
> >>>...
> >>>I put it to the left mainly to avoid clash with notes
> >>> (they are always to the right), but moving the label near to the text
> >>> area for a more compact design is a good idea.
> >>>
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Regards
> >>> >> Ricardo
> >>
> >> Could it be a pop-up object with on-mouseover action in position of
> cursor
> >> over such PageBreak line (to avoid averting of user by permanent
> presence)?
> >> If of couse it will not be clash with some over actions within top of
> text
> >> area, i.e. for adding and manage of "Header" - if it's planing similar
> control
> >> tool for it.
> >
> > New iteration ;)
> > http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks4.png
> >
> I submitted the idea as feature request:
>
> https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=119355
>
> Regards
> Ricardo
>
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by chengjh <ch...@apache.org>.
+1 Sounds a good idea...Making PB visible will benefit users'
satisfaction...
On Tue, May 15, 2012 at 5:28 PM, RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2012/5/13 RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com>:
> > 2012/5/12 Torokhov Sergey <to...@mail.ru>:
> >> On Saturday 12 of May 2012 22:50:16 RGB ES wrote:
> >>>...
> >>>I put it to the left mainly to avoid clash with notes
> >>> (they are always to the right), but moving the label near to the text
> >>> area for a more compact design is a good idea.
> >>>
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Regards
> >>> >> Ricardo
> >>
> >> Could it be a pop-up object with on-mouseover action in position of
> cursor
> >> over such PageBreak line (to avoid averting of user by permanent
> presence)?
> >> If of couse it will not be clash with some over actions within top of
> text
> >> area, i.e. for adding and manage of "Header" - if it's planing similar
> control
> >> tool for it.
> >
> > New iteration ;)
> > http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks4.png
> >
> I submitted the idea as feature request:
>
> https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=119355
>
> Regards
> Ricardo
>
--
Thanks...
Best Regards!
Jian Hong Cheng
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/13 RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com>:
> 2012/5/12 Torokhov Sergey <to...@mail.ru>:
>> On Saturday 12 of May 2012 22:50:16 RGB ES wrote:
>>>...
>>>I put it to the left mainly to avoid clash with notes
>>> (they are always to the right), but moving the label near to the text
>>> area for a more compact design is a good idea.
>>>
>>> >>
>>> >> Regards
>>> >> Ricardo
>>
>> Could it be a pop-up object with on-mouseover action in position of cursor
>> over such PageBreak line (to avoid averting of user by permanent presence)?
>> If of couse it will not be clash with some over actions within top of text
>> area, i.e. for adding and manage of "Header" - if it's planing similar control
>> tool for it.
>
> New iteration ;)
> http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks4.png
>
I submitted the idea as feature request:
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=119355
Regards
Ricardo
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/12 Torokhov Sergey <to...@mail.ru>:
> On Saturday 12 of May 2012 22:50:16 RGB ES wrote:
>>...
>>I put it to the left mainly to avoid clash with notes
>> (they are always to the right), but moving the label near to the text
>> area for a more compact design is a good idea.
>>
>> >>
>> >> Regards
>> >> Ricardo
>
> Could it be a pop-up object with on-mouseover action in position of cursor
> over such PageBreak line (to avoid averting of user by permanent presence)?
> If of couse it will not be clash with some over actions within top of text
> area, i.e. for adding and manage of "Header" - if it's planing similar control
> tool for it.
New iteration ;)
http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks4.png
> What about the same actions for Line Break and Column Break preferencies?
+1!!
Ricardo
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by Torokhov Sergey <to...@mail.ru>.
On Saturday 12 of May 2012 22:50:16 RGB ES wrote:
>...
>I put it to the left mainly to avoid clash with notes
> (they are always to the right), but moving the label near to the text
> area for a more compact design is a good idea.
>
> >>
> >> Regards
> >> Ricardo
Could it be a pop-up object with on-mouseover action in position of cursor
over such PageBreak line (to avoid averting of user by permanent presence)?
If of couse it will not be clash with some over actions within top of text
area, i.e. for adding and manage of "Header" - if it's planing similar control
tool for it.
What about the same actions for Line Break and Column Break preferencies?
--
Regards
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/12 Hagar Delest <ha...@laposte.net>:
> +1.
> Seems very logical indeed.
> The "Page break" label should be visible somewhere in line with the PB
> location. Do you mean it should be in the margin?
Not necessarily: I put it to the left mainly to avoid clash with notes
(they are always to the right), but moving the label near to the text
area for a more compact design is a good idea.
> A hot spot that opens the attributes by double-click would improve th user
> experience to change page numbers, page styles, ...
Indeed!!
Ricardo
> Hagar
>
> Le sam. 12 mai 2012 16:40:27 CEST, RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com> a écrit :
>
>
>> I would like to ask you for feedback on this idea, to know if you
>> think it is good or bad and why, and finally if you think it is
>> feasible.
>>
>> Writer shows page breaks (PB) with a line on top of next page's text
>> area. LyX shows PB with a line crossing the page on the insertion
>> point with the text "Page break" on the middle of it. These different
>> approaches can be more or less useful, but both are conceptually
>> wrong:
>>
>> PB are not about breaking pages, but about breaking *text
>> flow* and sending content to the next page.
>>
>> So PB should be an attribute of the object (a paragraph, a table) that
>> actually breaks content flow. Writer already work that way: on the
>> paragraph format (both direct and style) or table properties we have a
>> "text flow" tab that allows us to define breaks, either before or
>> after the object, either with or without page style change.
>>
>> Considering all this, I believe PB should be shown on the same object
>> that creates the break, and on the object side where break occurs:
>> this way, PB display will be consistent with the way PB works on
>> Writer.
>>
>> See here for a lousy mock-up:
>>
>> http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks3.png
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>> Regards
>> Ricardo
>>
>
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by Hagar Delest <ha...@laposte.net>.
+1.
Seems very logical indeed.
The "Page break" label should be visible somewhere in line with the PB location. Do you mean it should be in the margin?
A hot spot that opens the attributes by double-click would improve th user experience to change page numbers, page styles, ...
Hagar
Le sam. 12 mai 2012 16:40:27 CEST, RGB ES <rg...@gmail.com> a écrit :
> I would like to ask you for feedback on this idea, to know if you
> think it is good or bad and why, and finally if you think it is
> feasible.
>
> Writer shows page breaks (PB) with a line on top of next page's text
> area. LyX shows PB with a line crossing the page on the insertion
> point with the text "Page break" on the middle of it. These different
> approaches can be more or less useful, but both are conceptually
> wrong:
>
> PB are not about breaking pages, but about breaking *text
> flow* and sending content to the next page.
>
> So PB should be an attribute of the object (a paragraph, a table) that
> actually breaks content flow. Writer already work that way: on the
> paragraph format (both direct and style) or table properties we have a
> "text flow" tab that allows us to define breaks, either before or
> after the object, either with or without page style change.
>
> Considering all this, I believe PB should be shown on the same object
> that creates the break, and on the object side where break occurs:
> this way, PB display will be consistent with the way PB works on
> Writer.
>
> See here for a lousy mock-up:
>
> http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks3.png
>
> What do you think?
>
> Regards
> Ricardo
>
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by Oliver-Rainer Wittmann <or...@googlemail.com>.
Hi
On 12.05.2012 16:40, RGB ES wrote:
> I would like to ask you for feedback on this idea, to know if you
> think it is good or bad and why, and finally if you think it is
> feasible.
>
> Writer shows page breaks (PB) with a line on top of next page's text
> area. LyX shows PB with a line crossing the page on the insertion
> point with the text "Page break" on the middle of it. These different
> approaches can be more or less useful, but both are conceptually
> wrong:
>
> PB are not about breaking pages, but about breaking *text
> flow* and sending content to the next page.
>
> So PB should be an attribute of the object (a paragraph, a table) that
> actually breaks content flow. Writer already work that way: on the
> paragraph format (both direct and style) or table properties we have a
> "text flow" tab that allows us to define breaks, either before or
> after the object, either with or without page style change.
>
> Considering all this, I believe PB should be shown on the same object
> that creates the break, and on the object side where break occurs:
> this way, PB display will be consistent with the way PB works on
> Writer.
>
> See here for a lousy mock-up:
>
> http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks3.png
>
> What do you think?
>
I like the idea of changing the representation of page breaks in the view and to
add corresponding functionality to easy access the corresponding format dialogs.
As I am not an user experience expert I only have my developer view on such things.
May be certain UX people should work on this issue presenting their results to
the users - may be in the forum.
Best regards, Oliver.
Re: [4.0 brainstorming] Making Page Breaks more visible
Posted by Torokhov Sergey <to...@mail.ru>.
On Saturday 12 of May 2012 16:40:27 RGB ES wrote:
> ....
>
> Considering all this, I believe PB should be shown on the same object
> that creates the break, and on the object side where break occurs:
> this way, PB display will be consistent with the way PB works on
> Writer.
>
> See here for a lousy mock-up:
>
> http://people.apache.org/~rgb-es/PageBreaks3.png
>
> What do you think?
>
> Regards
> Ricardo
The current PB is not visiable at all with it's default colour and user don't
see PB until he reaches next page.
IMHO (as user), it's a good and reasonable idea to change representation of PB
and make available the quick changing of this object's propeties.
The realisation described on attached picture looks great :)