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Posted to user@struts.apache.org by Bill Johnson <pe...@yahoo.com> on 2003/06/07 22:39:13 UTC
What's next for Struts?
Thanks for passing that on. I have read it now. So I
can infer that Struts will likely become an
implementation of JSF. That makes total sense given
its popularity. It seems though that there will be a
fair amount of overlap and that the version of Struts
that implements the JSF spec will be quite different
from the Struts we know today.
It also infers that companies like BEA and IBM will
have implementations of JSF and that JSF will be a
requirement of the J2EE spec. Can anyone confirm that
JSF will be a requirement of the J2EE spec for app
server vendors, etc?
Ted, you're one of the better known Struts people
right? What do you think of JSF? For that matter,
what do all of the Struts devs think of JSF?
I think there should be more discussion on this topic
as I'm sure its on the minds of many more people than
those at my company. I've CCed user list for that
input.
By the way, thanks for creating a great software
framework!
Regards,
Bill
--- Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
> Have you read this, Bill?
>
>
http://nagoya.apache.org/wiki/apachewiki.cgi?StrutsMoreAboutJSF
>
> Bill Johnson wrote:
> > But isn't JSF just a spec? So couldn't Struts
> become
> > the reference implementation for JSF, like Tomcat?
> >
> > I'm hoping Sun or one of the Struts committers
> will
> > stand up and give all of us Struts users some more
> > guidance. I know my company is definitely curious
> to
> > know where things are headed so we can plan
> > accordingly. It would be great if JSF came with
> all
> > the promised components and tools.
> >
> > I can't wait.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Bill
> >
> >
> > --- Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> >>Not every Java developer is willing to simply
> accept
> >>whatever technology
> >>Sun or the JCP brings out.
> >>
> >>If we were, there wouldn't be Velocity and
> Tapestry
> >>and Turbine and
> >>Maverick and WebWorks and JPublish, and quite a
> few
> >>others.
> >>
> >>But, regardless of what happens next, just as
> >>dinosaurs live on as the
> >>birds outside my window, Struts will always live
> on
> >>as the many
> >>components we have placed in the Commons.
> >>
> >>-Ted.
> >>
> >>Bill Johnson wrote:
> >>
> >>>Well, best I can tell EA4 tells the story. I
> just
> >>>read some stuff online today that says this could
> >>
> >>very
> >>
> >>>likely be the end to Struts as we know it. EA4
> >>
> >>has
> >>
> >>>much of what Struts has and it will be a standard
> >>
> >>from
> >>
> >>>Sun. Now theres a faces-config.xml very similar
> >>
> >>to
> >>
> >>>struts-config.xml, but with all the validation
> and
> >>>message resources wrapped into one.
> >>>
> >>>Is it possible that Struts will become the JSF
> >>>reference implementation kind of like Tomcat for
> >>>Servlets and JSPs. That makes sense to me.
> >>>
> >>>Regards,
> >>>
> >>>Bill
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
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> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
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> >
> >
>
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> >
>
>
> --
> Ted Husted,
> Struts in Action
> <http://husted.com/struts/book.html>
>
>
>
>
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Re: What's next for Struts?
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
Bill Johnson wrote:
> Ted, you're one of the better known Struts people
> right? What do you think of JSF?
I need to ship things now, and JSF isn't final yet. I've strolled
through the tutorial, and parts of it look interesting. But I'm not
going to study it carefully until 1.0 ships.
I'm also not a JSP tag guy, and so that part of the framework is
irrelevant to me. Though, I'm thinking that any presentation system,
including Velocity, should be able to hookup with them-there server-side
UI objects. But, I'm leaving tomorrow's development for tomorrow =:)
-Ted.
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Re: What's next for Struts?
Posted by "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>.
On Sat, 7 Jun 2003, Bill Johnson wrote:
> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 13:39:13 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Bill Johnson <pe...@yahoo.com>
> Reply-To: Struts Developers List <st...@jakarta.apache.org>
> To: Struts Developers List <st...@jakarta.apache.org>
> Cc: struts-user@jakarta.apache.org
> Subject: What's next for Struts?
>
> Thanks for passing that on. I have read it now. So I
> can infer that Struts will likely become an
> implementation of JSF.
I don't know the basis for you inferring that this is "likely" -- but it
is certainly feasible, and might very well be a very great idea -- but
that's up to the Struts developer community to decide.
> That makes total sense given
> its popularity. It seems though that there will be a
> fair amount of overlap and that the version of Struts
> that implements the JSF spec will be quite different
> from the Struts we know today.
>
Not necessarily.
It's quite clear already that you can treat JavaServer Faces as a
rendering library nad continue to use existing Struts based application
design architectures. Enabling this was the whole point of my developing
the Struts-Faces integration library.
http://jakarta.apache.org/builds/jakarta-struts/release/struts-faces/
> It also infers that companies like BEA and IBM will
> have implementations of JSF
Having more than one implementation of JavaServer Faces in the world seems
pretty much assured already. Next week, being JavaOne week, seems like a
likely candidate for announcements in this regard :-). But you'll have to
ask individual companies for their own plans regarding JavaServer Faces.
> and that JSF will be a
> requirement of the J2EE spec. Can anyone confirm that
> JSF will be a requirement of the J2EE spec for app
> server vendors, etc?
JavaServer Faces is *not* part of the J2EE 1.4 specification. Whether it
will or will not be part of of J2EE 1.5 depends on what the expert group
for J2EE 1.5's JSR decides to do. Nobody knows at this point.
>
> Ted, you're one of the better known Struts people
> right? What do you think of JSF? For that matter,
> what do all of the Struts devs think of JSF?
>
I'm not Ted, but I am the original developer of the Struts Framework. As
it happens, part of my "day job" is to be the co-spec-lead for JavaServer
Faces, so I have more than a little bit to do with how that turns out :-).
Trust me ... Struts oriented developers and users *definitely* need to pay
attention to what is going on with JavaServer Faces.
> I think there should be more discussion on this topic
> as I'm sure its on the minds of many more people than
> those at my company. I've CCed user list for that
> input.
>
> By the way, thanks for creating a great software
> framework!
>
> Regards,
>
> Bill
Craig McClanahan
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Re: What's next for Struts?
Posted by "Craig R. McClanahan" <cr...@apache.org>.
On Sat, 7 Jun 2003, Bill Johnson wrote:
> Date: Sat, 7 Jun 2003 13:39:13 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Bill Johnson <pe...@yahoo.com>
> Reply-To: Struts Developers List <st...@jakarta.apache.org>
> To: Struts Developers List <st...@jakarta.apache.org>
> Cc: struts-user@jakarta.apache.org
> Subject: What's next for Struts?
>
> Thanks for passing that on. I have read it now. So I
> can infer that Struts will likely become an
> implementation of JSF.
I don't know the basis for you inferring that this is "likely" -- but it
is certainly feasible, and might very well be a very great idea -- but
that's up to the Struts developer community to decide.
> That makes total sense given
> its popularity. It seems though that there will be a
> fair amount of overlap and that the version of Struts
> that implements the JSF spec will be quite different
> from the Struts we know today.
>
Not necessarily.
It's quite clear already that you can treat JavaServer Faces as a
rendering library nad continue to use existing Struts based application
design architectures. Enabling this was the whole point of my developing
the Struts-Faces integration library.
http://jakarta.apache.org/builds/jakarta-struts/release/struts-faces/
> It also infers that companies like BEA and IBM will
> have implementations of JSF
Having more than one implementation of JavaServer Faces in the world seems
pretty much assured already. Next week, being JavaOne week, seems like a
likely candidate for announcements in this regard :-). But you'll have to
ask individual companies for their own plans regarding JavaServer Faces.
> and that JSF will be a
> requirement of the J2EE spec. Can anyone confirm that
> JSF will be a requirement of the J2EE spec for app
> server vendors, etc?
JavaServer Faces is *not* part of the J2EE 1.4 specification. Whether it
will or will not be part of of J2EE 1.5 depends on what the expert group
for J2EE 1.5's JSR decides to do. Nobody knows at this point.
>
> Ted, you're one of the better known Struts people
> right? What do you think of JSF? For that matter,
> what do all of the Struts devs think of JSF?
>
I'm not Ted, but I am the original developer of the Struts Framework. As
it happens, part of my "day job" is to be the co-spec-lead for JavaServer
Faces, so I have more than a little bit to do with how that turns out :-).
Trust me ... Struts oriented developers and users *definitely* need to pay
attention to what is going on with JavaServer Faces.
> I think there should be more discussion on this topic
> as I'm sure its on the minds of many more people than
> those at my company. I've CCed user list for that
> input.
>
> By the way, thanks for creating a great software
> framework!
>
> Regards,
>
> Bill
Craig McClanahan
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