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Posted to general@incubator.apache.org by sasaboy <sa...@prozone.rs> on 2009/03/02 13:21:07 UTC
Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Hi,
some weeks ago, I've posted a question on this mailing list on how to start
new project on Apache.
After reading posts on mailing lists, apache documentation, etc. ... it
seems first we need a champion for the project proposal.
Once again about the project:
Enhydra Shark workflow engine is a project currently hosted on ObjectWeb
(http://shark.objectweb.org/)
It is the most popular open-source java workflow engine completely based on
WfMC standards.
It uses XPDL1.0 as its native workflow process definition language.
It can be embedded into other Java applications (Swing, Console, ...) or can
be used as a server through WebService, EJB, CORBA, ...
Shark's modular, plug-in architecture makes shark suitable for integration
into different kind of projects.
It is a mature project started 5years ago, has a significant community and
more than 100000 downloads on ObjectWeb and almost 10000 posts on mailing
list. It is widely used all around the world in production, typically
integrated into different kind of applications, from DocumentManagement and
government applications up to applications for special purposes like bank
services, HR, Help desk, ... and in many, many others
If you would be willing to act as a champion on Shark's behalf, please let
us know.
Thanks in advance,
Sasa.
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by Matthieu Riou <ma...@gmail.com>.
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 2:28 PM, Janne Jalkanen <Ja...@ecyrd.com>wrote:
> I don't mind championing you but as mentioned by others, there will be
>> several hurdles to overcome. To change the license, you will have to get
>> an
>> agreement from everybody who ever contributed a patch to the source you
>> plan
>> to incubate, even for a minor bug fix. I don't know how painful that would
>> be in your case.
>>
>
> IANAL, but why would you need a CLA for a minor bug fix or small patch? For
> copyright to form, the item needs to be long and complex enough to be
> recognized as original - a few lines don't a copyrighted work make.
>
Right, I probably pushed that exaggeration to make a point a little too
much.
Matthieu
>
> With JSPWiki, we took CLAs from major contributors (of which there were
> over 20, that was quite a job) when they were identifiable, and rewrote the
> sections which didn't have an identifiable author or for which CLA could not
> be obtained.
>
> /Janne
>
>
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>
Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by Janne Jalkanen <Ja...@ecyrd.com>.
> I don't mind championing you but as mentioned by others, there will be
> several hurdles to overcome. To change the license, you will have to
> get an
> agreement from everybody who ever contributed a patch to the source
> you plan
> to incubate, even for a minor bug fix. I don't know how painful that
> would
> be in your case.
IANAL, but why would you need a CLA for a minor bug fix or small
patch? For copyright to form, the item needs to be long and complex
enough to be recognized as original - a few lines don't a copyrighted
work make.
With JSPWiki, we took CLAs from major contributors (of which there
were over 20, that was quite a job) when they were identifiable, and
rewrote the sections which didn't have an identifiable author or for
which CLA could not be obtained.
/Janne
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by Matthieu Riou <ma...@gmail.com>.
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 10:05 AM, sasaboy <sa...@prozone.rs> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> don't think CLA will be the problem. Althouth a mature project, the core
> and
> all the main components of the engine are written by the core
> developers...the community mostly helped by contributing different
> implementations of some other components and by giving ideas for the
> improvement of the core functionallity.
>
I don't mind championing you but as mentioned by others, there will be
several hurdles to overcome. To change the license, you will have to get an
agreement from everybody who ever contributed a patch to the source you plan
to incubate, even for a minor bug fix. I don't know how painful that would
be in your case.
If you want, we can also discuss having ODE acting as your sponsor. I'd just
like to have more people of ODE included in the discussion so if we could
discuss at least that part on dev@ode.apache.org, that'd be swell.
Cheers,
Matthieu
>
> Greetings,
> Sasa.
>
>
> Siegfried Goeschl wrote:
> >
> > Hi Sasa,
> >
> > I'm following apache.incubator not very closely but looking at
> > "http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-ip" you need
> > a CLA for all contributions (and probable patches). And this seems
> > difficult for a mature project where many people contributed stuff under
> > LGPL - but a lot of folks here are more fluent with the intellectual
> > property legalese.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Siegfried Goeschl
> >
> > sasaboy wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> ObjectWeb allows Apache licensed projects but one of our reasons is also
> >> to
> >> be recognized as Apache project, which will of course provide us with
> >> much
> >> more visibility than beeing ObjectWeb project :-) plus to get more
> >> developers, ideas, community, etc....
> >>
> >> I didn't provide a link for the proposal yet since I understood that
> >> first I
> >> need a champion to agree on a proposal etc...
> >>
> >> Moving from LGPL to Apache shouldn't be so hard since for the beginning
> >> we
> >> only want to move the core of the engine to Apache ...
> >>
> >>
> >> Greetings,
> >> Sasa.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> sasaboy wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> some weeks ago, I've posted a question on this mailing list on how to
> >>> start new project on Apache.
> >>> After reading posts on mailing lists, apache documentation, etc. ... it
> >>> seems first we need a champion for the project proposal.
> >>>
> >>> Once again about the project:
> >>>
> >>> Enhydra Shark workflow engine is a project currently hosted on
> ObjectWeb
> >>> (http://shark.objectweb.org/)
> >>>
> >>> It is the most popular open-source java workflow engine completely
> based
> >>> on WfMC standards.
> >>> It uses XPDL1.0 as its native workflow process definition language.
> >>> It can be embedded into other Java applications (Swing, Console, ...)
> or
> >>> can be used as a server through WebService, EJB, CORBA, ...
> >>>
> >>> Shark's modular, plug-in architecture makes shark suitable for
> >>> integration
> >>> into different kind of projects.
> >>>
> >>> It is a mature project started 5years ago, has a significant community
> >>> and
> >>> more than 100000 downloads on ObjectWeb and almost 10000 posts on
> >>> mailing
> >>> list. It is widely used all around the world in production, typically
> >>> integrated into different kind of applications, from DocumentManagement
> >>> and government applications up to applications for special purposes
> like
> >>> bank services, HR, Help desk, ... and in many, many others
> >>>
> >>> If you would be willing to act as a champion on Shark's behalf, please
> >>> let
> >>> us know.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks in advance,
> >>> Sasa.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://www.nabble.com/Champion-needed-for-new-workflow-project-proposal-tp22287174p22293359.html
> Sent from the Apache Incubator - General mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
>
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by sasaboy <sa...@prozone.rs>.
Hi,
don't think CLA will be the problem. Althouth a mature project, the core and
all the main components of the engine are written by the core
developers...the community mostly helped by contributing different
implementations of some other components and by giving ideas for the
improvement of the core functionallity.
Greetings,
Sasa.
Siegfried Goeschl wrote:
>
> Hi Sasa,
>
> I'm following apache.incubator not very closely but looking at
> "http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-ip" you need
> a CLA for all contributions (and probable patches). And this seems
> difficult for a mature project where many people contributed stuff under
> LGPL - but a lot of folks here are more fluent with the intellectual
> property legalese.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Siegfried Goeschl
>
> sasaboy wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> ObjectWeb allows Apache licensed projects but one of our reasons is also
>> to
>> be recognized as Apache project, which will of course provide us with
>> much
>> more visibility than beeing ObjectWeb project :-) plus to get more
>> developers, ideas, community, etc....
>>
>> I didn't provide a link for the proposal yet since I understood that
>> first I
>> need a champion to agree on a proposal etc...
>>
>> Moving from LGPL to Apache shouldn't be so hard since for the beginning
>> we
>> only want to move the core of the engine to Apache ...
>>
>>
>> Greetings,
>> Sasa.
>>
>>
>>
>> sasaboy wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> some weeks ago, I've posted a question on this mailing list on how to
>>> start new project on Apache.
>>> After reading posts on mailing lists, apache documentation, etc. ... it
>>> seems first we need a champion for the project proposal.
>>>
>>> Once again about the project:
>>>
>>> Enhydra Shark workflow engine is a project currently hosted on ObjectWeb
>>> (http://shark.objectweb.org/)
>>>
>>> It is the most popular open-source java workflow engine completely based
>>> on WfMC standards.
>>> It uses XPDL1.0 as its native workflow process definition language.
>>> It can be embedded into other Java applications (Swing, Console, ...) or
>>> can be used as a server through WebService, EJB, CORBA, ...
>>>
>>> Shark's modular, plug-in architecture makes shark suitable for
>>> integration
>>> into different kind of projects.
>>>
>>> It is a mature project started 5years ago, has a significant community
>>> and
>>> more than 100000 downloads on ObjectWeb and almost 10000 posts on
>>> mailing
>>> list. It is widely used all around the world in production, typically
>>> integrated into different kind of applications, from DocumentManagement
>>> and government applications up to applications for special purposes like
>>> bank services, HR, Help desk, ... and in many, many others
>>>
>>> If you would be willing to act as a champion on Shark's behalf, please
>>> let
>>> us know.
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>> Sasa.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
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>
>
>
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by Siegfried Goeschl <si...@it20one.at>.
Hi Sasa,
I'm following apache.incubator not very closely but looking at
"http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html#template-ip" you need
a CLA for all contributions (and probable patches). And this seems
difficult for a mature project where many people contributed stuff under
LGPL - but a lot of folks here are more fluent with the intellectual
property legalese.
Cheers,
Siegfried Goeschl
sasaboy wrote:
> Hi,
>
> ObjectWeb allows Apache licensed projects but one of our reasons is also to
> be recognized as Apache project, which will of course provide us with much
> more visibility than beeing ObjectWeb project :-) plus to get more
> developers, ideas, community, etc....
>
> I didn't provide a link for the proposal yet since I understood that first I
> need a champion to agree on a proposal etc...
>
> Moving from LGPL to Apache shouldn't be so hard since for the beginning we
> only want to move the core of the engine to Apache ...
>
>
> Greetings,
> Sasa.
>
>
>
> sasaboy wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> some weeks ago, I've posted a question on this mailing list on how to
>> start new project on Apache.
>> After reading posts on mailing lists, apache documentation, etc. ... it
>> seems first we need a champion for the project proposal.
>>
>> Once again about the project:
>>
>> Enhydra Shark workflow engine is a project currently hosted on ObjectWeb
>> (http://shark.objectweb.org/)
>>
>> It is the most popular open-source java workflow engine completely based
>> on WfMC standards.
>> It uses XPDL1.0 as its native workflow process definition language.
>> It can be embedded into other Java applications (Swing, Console, ...) or
>> can be used as a server through WebService, EJB, CORBA, ...
>>
>> Shark's modular, plug-in architecture makes shark suitable for integration
>> into different kind of projects.
>>
>> It is a mature project started 5years ago, has a significant community and
>> more than 100000 downloads on ObjectWeb and almost 10000 posts on mailing
>> list. It is widely used all around the world in production, typically
>> integrated into different kind of applications, from DocumentManagement
>> and government applications up to applications for special purposes like
>> bank services, HR, Help desk, ... and in many, many others
>>
>> If you would be willing to act as a champion on Shark's behalf, please let
>> us know.
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>> Sasa.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by sasaboy <sa...@prozone.rs>.
Hi,
ObjectWeb allows Apache licensed projects but one of our reasons is also to
be recognized as Apache project, which will of course provide us with much
more visibility than beeing ObjectWeb project :-) plus to get more
developers, ideas, community, etc....
I didn't provide a link for the proposal yet since I understood that first I
need a champion to agree on a proposal etc...
Moving from LGPL to Apache shouldn't be so hard since for the beginning we
only want to move the core of the engine to Apache ...
Greetings,
Sasa.
sasaboy wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> some weeks ago, I've posted a question on this mailing list on how to
> start new project on Apache.
> After reading posts on mailing lists, apache documentation, etc. ... it
> seems first we need a champion for the project proposal.
>
> Once again about the project:
>
> Enhydra Shark workflow engine is a project currently hosted on ObjectWeb
> (http://shark.objectweb.org/)
>
> It is the most popular open-source java workflow engine completely based
> on WfMC standards.
> It uses XPDL1.0 as its native workflow process definition language.
> It can be embedded into other Java applications (Swing, Console, ...) or
> can be used as a server through WebService, EJB, CORBA, ...
>
> Shark's modular, plug-in architecture makes shark suitable for integration
> into different kind of projects.
>
> It is a mature project started 5years ago, has a significant community and
> more than 100000 downloads on ObjectWeb and almost 10000 posts on mailing
> list. It is widely used all around the world in production, typically
> integrated into different kind of applications, from DocumentManagement
> and government applications up to applications for special purposes like
> bank services, HR, Help desk, ... and in many, many others
>
> If you would be willing to act as a champion on Shark's behalf, please let
> us know.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Sasa.
>
>
>
--
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by Siegfried Goeschl <si...@it20one.at>.
Hi Sasa,
+) sorry but I could find no link to the proposal - could you repost the
link?
+) I worked for Together Teamlösungen many moons ago so I'm aware of
Enhydra Shark (but no affiliation for the time being)
So without knowing the proposal I think it is a successful open source
project but moving to LGPL for a mature project is a serious issue ...
Cheers,
Siegfried Goeschl
sasaboy wrote:
> Hi,
>
> well, we already wrote this in proposal, but here it is:
>
> * The legal umbrella. There are no outstanding legal issues with Shark, but
> the protection that Apache affords is valuable for Shark developers and
> users.
> * Resolve current potential licensing issues that are addressed in the
> Apache 2.0 license, but not in the LGPL license.
> * Increase public awareness of Shark and of the application of Apache
> licensing.
> * Help to attract clients who would feel more comfortable with the licensing
> coming through a well known and established organization like Apache
> * To get more people involved in the further development of software
>
>
> Greetings,
> Sasa.
>
>
> Siegfried Goeschl wrote:
>
>> Hi Sasa,
>>
>> the very first question is - why are moving from ObjectWeb since it is
>> well-known and respected community?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Siegfried Goeschl
>>
>> sasaboy wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> some weeks ago, I've posted a question on this mailing list on how to
>>> start
>>> new project on Apache.
>>> After reading posts on mailing lists, apache documentation, etc. ... it
>>> seems first we need a champion for the project proposal.
>>>
>>> Once again about the project:
>>>
>>> Enhydra Shark workflow engine is a project currently hosted on ObjectWeb
>>> (http://shark.objectweb.org/)
>>>
>>> It is the most popular open-source java workflow engine completely based
>>> on
>>> WfMC standards.
>>> It uses XPDL1.0 as its native workflow process definition language.
>>> It can be embedded into other Java applications (Swing, Console, ...) or
>>> can
>>> be used as a server through WebService, EJB, CORBA, ...
>>>
>>> Shark's modular, plug-in architecture makes shark suitable for
>>> integration
>>> into different kind of projects.
>>>
>>> It is a mature project started 5years ago, has a significant community
>>> and
>>> more than 100000 downloads on ObjectWeb and almost 10000 posts on mailing
>>> list. It is widely used all around the world in production, typically
>>> integrated into different kind of applications, from DocumentManagement
>>> and
>>> government applications up to applications for special purposes like bank
>>> services, HR, Help desk, ... and in many, many others
>>>
>>> If you would be willing to act as a champion on Shark's behalf, please
>>> let
>>> us know.
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>> Sasa.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>.
Hi,
> Siegfried Goeschl wrote:
>> ...why are moving from ObjectWeb since it is
>> well-known and respected community?...
On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 1:56 PM, sasaboy <sa...@prozone.rs> wrote:
> ...* Resolve current potential licensing issues that are addressed in the
> Apache 2.0 license, but not in the LGPL license....
Does ObjectWeb require its projects to use the GPL or LGPL?
-Bertrand (just curious, nothing hiding behind in that question)
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by sasaboy <sa...@prozone.rs>.
Hi,
well, we already wrote this in proposal, but here it is:
* The legal umbrella. There are no outstanding legal issues with Shark, but
the protection that Apache affords is valuable for Shark developers and
users.
* Resolve current potential licensing issues that are addressed in the
Apache 2.0 license, but not in the LGPL license.
* Increase public awareness of Shark and of the application of Apache
licensing.
* Help to attract clients who would feel more comfortable with the licensing
coming through a well known and established organization like Apache
* To get more people involved in the further development of software
Greetings,
Sasa.
Siegfried Goeschl wrote:
>
> Hi Sasa,
>
> the very first question is - why are moving from ObjectWeb since it is
> well-known and respected community?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Siegfried Goeschl
>
> sasaboy wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> some weeks ago, I've posted a question on this mailing list on how to
>> start
>> new project on Apache.
>> After reading posts on mailing lists, apache documentation, etc. ... it
>> seems first we need a champion for the project proposal.
>>
>> Once again about the project:
>>
>> Enhydra Shark workflow engine is a project currently hosted on ObjectWeb
>> (http://shark.objectweb.org/)
>>
>> It is the most popular open-source java workflow engine completely based
>> on
>> WfMC standards.
>> It uses XPDL1.0 as its native workflow process definition language.
>> It can be embedded into other Java applications (Swing, Console, ...) or
>> can
>> be used as a server through WebService, EJB, CORBA, ...
>>
>> Shark's modular, plug-in architecture makes shark suitable for
>> integration
>> into different kind of projects.
>>
>> It is a mature project started 5years ago, has a significant community
>> and
>> more than 100000 downloads on ObjectWeb and almost 10000 posts on mailing
>> list. It is widely used all around the world in production, typically
>> integrated into different kind of applications, from DocumentManagement
>> and
>> government applications up to applications for special purposes like bank
>> services, HR, Help desk, ... and in many, many others
>>
>> If you would be willing to act as a champion on Shark's behalf, please
>> let
>> us know.
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>> Sasa.
>>
>>
>>
>
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>
>
>
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Re: Champion needed for new workflow project proposal
Posted by Siegfried Goeschl <si...@it20one.at>.
Hi Sasa,
the very first question is - why are moving from ObjectWeb since it is
well-known and respected community?
Cheers,
Siegfried Goeschl
sasaboy wrote:
> Hi,
>
> some weeks ago, I've posted a question on this mailing list on how to start
> new project on Apache.
> After reading posts on mailing lists, apache documentation, etc. ... it
> seems first we need a champion for the project proposal.
>
> Once again about the project:
>
> Enhydra Shark workflow engine is a project currently hosted on ObjectWeb
> (http://shark.objectweb.org/)
>
> It is the most popular open-source java workflow engine completely based on
> WfMC standards.
> It uses XPDL1.0 as its native workflow process definition language.
> It can be embedded into other Java applications (Swing, Console, ...) or can
> be used as a server through WebService, EJB, CORBA, ...
>
> Shark's modular, plug-in architecture makes shark suitable for integration
> into different kind of projects.
>
> It is a mature project started 5years ago, has a significant community and
> more than 100000 downloads on ObjectWeb and almost 10000 posts on mailing
> list. It is widely used all around the world in production, typically
> integrated into different kind of applications, from DocumentManagement and
> government applications up to applications for special purposes like bank
> services, HR, Help desk, ... and in many, many others
>
> If you would be willing to act as a champion on Shark's behalf, please let
> us know.
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Sasa.
>
>
>
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