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Posted to dev@carbondata.apache.org by Jean-Baptiste Onofré <jb...@nanthrax.net> on 2017/03/02 06:49:12 UTC

[DISCUSS] Apache CarbonData podling graduation

Hi all,

Apache CarbonData started incubation in June '16. CarbonData did (and 
still doing) great moves: several releases, website, documentation, new 
features, community grow, new committers.

I think it's time to discuss the graduation of CarbonData.

To prepare this discussion, I prepared a self-assessment against the 
Maturity Model:

https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=68714623

You can find the discussion between the PPMC, including some numbers 
about the podling activity here:

http://apache-carbondata-mailing-list-archive.1130556.n5.nabble.com/DISCUSS-Graduation-to-a-TLP-Top-Level-Project-td7715.html

If we were to graduate, the CarbonData PPMC recommends the following 
information for the Board resolution:
         * Project Name: Apache CarbonData
         * Project description and scope: Apache CarbonData is an 
indexed columnar data format for fast analytics on big data platform, 
e.g. Apache Hadoop, Apache Spark, etc.
         * PMC composition:
                 * Liang Chen
                 * Jean-Baptiste Onofr�
                 * Henry Saputra
                 * Uma Maheswara Rao G
                 * Jenny MA
                 * Jacky Li
                 * Vimal Das Kammath
                 * Jarray Qiu

Any thoughts, comments, questions ?

Thanks !

Regards
JB
-- 
Jean-Baptiste Onofr�
jbonofre@apache.org
http://blog.nanthrax.net
Talend - http://www.talend.com

Re: [DISCUSS] Apache CarbonData podling graduation

Posted by Niclas Hedhman <he...@gmail.com>.

I think the wording needs tuning, and my own interpretation of the intent
has been,

Project claims itself to comply, and list any exceptions and why that is
the case.

I think that can deal with the invariance that exists.

Cheers
Niclas


On Mar 7, 2017 14:48, "Jim Apple" <jb...@cloudera.com> wrote:

> > Actually, the Maturity Model can be a very nice framework to organize
> > incubation around.
>
> If you're talking about a platonic MM, then I agree. If you are
> talking about the MM at
> https://community.apache.org/apache-way/apache-project-maturity-model.html
> ,
> I think it needs to be much more carefully written and much more
> accurate to be a "nice framework". In particular, "aims to capture the
> invariants of Apache projects ... A mature Apache project complies
> with all the elements of this model" is wishful thinking or outdated
> or both.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>

Re: [DISCUSS] Apache CarbonData podling graduation

Posted by Niclas Hedhman <he...@gmail.com>.

I think the wording needs tuning, and my own interpretation of the intent
has been,

Project claims itself to comply, and list any exceptions and why that is
the case.

I think that can deal with the invariance that exists.

Cheers
Niclas


On Mar 7, 2017 14:48, "Jim Apple" <jb...@cloudera.com> wrote:

> > Actually, the Maturity Model can be a very nice framework to organize
> > incubation around.
>
> If you're talking about a platonic MM, then I agree. If you are
> talking about the MM at
> https://community.apache.org/apache-way/apache-project-maturity-model.html
> ,
> I think it needs to be much more carefully written and much more
> accurate to be a "nice framework". In particular, "aims to capture the
> invariants of Apache projects ... A mature Apache project complies
> with all the elements of this model" is wishful thinking or outdated
> or both.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>

Re: [DISCUSS] Apache CarbonData podling graduation

Posted by Jim Apple <jb...@cloudera.com>.

> Actually, the Maturity Model can be a very nice framework to organize
> incubation around.

If you're talking about a platonic MM, then I agree. If you are
talking about the MM at
https://community.apache.org/apache-way/apache-project-maturity-model.html,
I think it needs to be much more carefully written and much more
accurate to be a "nice framework". In particular, "aims to capture the
invariants of Apache projects ... A mature Apache project complies
with all the elements of this model" is wishful thinking or outdated
or both.

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To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
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Re: [DISCUSS] Apache CarbonData podling graduation

Posted by Jim Apple <jb...@cloudera.com>.

> Actually, the Maturity Model can be a very nice framework to organize
> incubation around.

If you're talking about a platonic MM, then I agree. If you are
talking about the MM at
https://community.apache.org/apache-way/apache-project-maturity-model.html,
I think it needs to be much more carefully written and much more
accurate to be a "nice framework". In particular, "aims to capture the
invariants of Apache projects ... A mature Apache project complies
with all the elements of this model" is wishful thinking or outdated
or both.

Re: [DISCUSS] Apache CarbonData podling graduation

Posted by Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com>.

On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 11:45 PM, Bertrand Delacretaz
<bd...@codeconsult.ch> wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 7:49 AM, Jean-Baptiste Onofré <jb...@nanthrax.net> wrote:
>> ...To prepare this discussion, I prepared a self-assessment against the
>> Maturity Model:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=68714623
> ...
>
> Thanks! This helps build confidence about graduating CarbonData, I'm
> +1 for that.

+1

On https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-287 I wrote the following,
which sounds harsh and may have resulted in a miscommunication:

  The Incubator itself does not require that podlings assess progress using
  the Maturity Model. If there are podlings or Mentors who need to be
  disabused of such a notion, that education work needs to happen in the
  Incubator's own forums.

It's only a problem when a podling treats the Maturity Model and its soft
criteria as hard requirements and lets progress be blocked.  That's a
misapplication of the Maturity Model itself (and arguably shows that the
project is not mature).  Mature contributors understand how to avoid getting
hung up unnecessarily.

Actually, the Maturity Model can be a very nice framework to organize
incubation around.  (Moreso than, say, an enumeration of our policies, which
would overemphasize rules.)  The Incubator might not formally integrate the
Maturity Model today, but perhaps that could change.

Marvin Humphrey

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Re: [DISCUSS] Apache CarbonData podling graduation

Posted by Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com>.

On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 11:45 PM, Bertrand Delacretaz
<bd...@codeconsult.ch> wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 7:49 AM, Jean-Baptiste Onofré <jb...@nanthrax.net> wrote:
>> ...To prepare this discussion, I prepared a self-assessment against the
>> Maturity Model:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=68714623
> ...
>
> Thanks! This helps build confidence about graduating CarbonData, I'm
> +1 for that.

+1

On https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-287 I wrote the following,
which sounds harsh and may have resulted in a miscommunication:

  The Incubator itself does not require that podlings assess progress using
  the Maturity Model. If there are podlings or Mentors who need to be
  disabused of such a notion, that education work needs to happen in the
  Incubator's own forums.

It's only a problem when a podling treats the Maturity Model and its soft
criteria as hard requirements and lets progress be blocked.  That's a
misapplication of the Maturity Model itself (and arguably shows that the
project is not mature).  Mature contributors understand how to avoid getting
hung up unnecessarily.

Actually, the Maturity Model can be a very nice framework to organize
incubation around.  (Moreso than, say, an enumeration of our policies, which
would overemphasize rules.)  The Incubator might not formally integrate the
Maturity Model today, but perhaps that could change.

Marvin Humphrey