I volunteer!

[ch...@hamptons.com]

Howdy all,

As one of the less experienced (with web servers & open source) & gifted
programmers on this list, I've decided to work on behalf of less
experienced and gifted programmers everywhere. It seems that in open-source
projects like this, things move at a high rate technologically,  but
accessiblity & ease of use lag quite a bit behind. I suppose I'm thinking
chiefly of Linux, which to me is a technlogical marvel of Open Source, that
while the technical equal (at least!) of Windows, lags far behind in ease
of use.

This is always a bit of a shame, as it seems in such cases, a little
ambassadorship (in the sense of reaching out to non-wizards) can go a long
way towards increasing the size and satisfaction of the user base. The all
too familiar converse of this, is technically superior products being
outdone by less sound yet 'prettier' (in any sense of the word) alternatives.

It's clear from the obvious energy and skill of the people on this list,
that Jakarta will be a carefully and wisely designed, and superbly
technically executed project. I'm probably not enough of a programmer to
help with this. However, I think I could help keeping Jakarta as close to
the 'common man' as possible.

Specifically, here's the first thing I've thought of. Right now, JSP is a
little crazy. A number of JSP engines, for a number of servlet engines, for
a number of servers. 0.91. 0.92, 1.0, 1.1. There's a lot of traffic on the
JSP list (some of it from me) about getting JSP up and running on various
platforms, and a lot of that is due to absent, hard to find, or incorrect
docs. 

I think it would be nice to collect & neaten up all the JSP docs, so that
any idiot could immediately figure out  what his JSP options were, and what
to do for each. But beyond that, I want to make it easy for all of these
people to be able to switch over to Jakarta (if they wish) once it rolls
out. Maybe this just means excellent "How to switch" docs for each JSP
option. Maybe it means little scripts that will help change their config
files or whatever to Jakarts. Heck, maybe there could be a website where
people could upload their config files and get back Jakarta friendly ones.

That's just my first thought - there's always a million ways to open
projects like this up to the little guy (in terms of use & understanding,
if not contribution).

Anyway, if any of you guys thinks this would be energy well spent, I'm
happy to do it.

 - Chris

(sorry about the verbosity)

Re: I volunteer!

["Craig R. McClanahan" <cm...@mytownnet.com>]

chrisl@hamptons.com wrote:

>
> Anyway, if any of you guys thinks this would be energy well spent, I'm
> happy to do it.
>

Please please please please please!!!!

Unfortunately, documentation and example apps are not considered as "cool" or
"important" as the core code, but they make all the difference in the world
between a cool technological hack and an app that is used all over the world.  I
would *love* to see good "how-to" documentation, and examples,  to help people
take advantage of the code that is produced by a project like this.

>
>  - Chris
>

Craig McClanahan

Re: I volunteer!

[ch...@hamptons.com]

Wow - thanks guys! I was a little nervous with my little suggestion, and
I'm pleased to have it so well received, esp. by such high-n-mighty's.

Craig - I like what you said about doc'ing not being considered as cool as
core coding. I think I know why it isn't considered as cool - cause it
ISN'T as cool!!! Hey, I'd be core coding if I could, but it's not to be.
Besides, SOMEone's gotta be uncool.

Anil - Thank you for offering your Q&A services. I certainly plan to make
use of 'em, and of others. Sounds absurd & giddy, but my hope is to help
set a new standard in approachability for this kind of project. Maybe this
open source project will be the most 'open' yet.

As for me . . . any pestering of you guys I need to do to gather info, I
think would be best done off the list, to avoid clutter. Does this sound
right?

 - Chris

Re: I volunteer!

[Anil Vijendran <ak...@eng.sun.com>]

Chris,

This is really wonderful. Its really a pity people have to grope with specs and
mailing lists to start using cool technology.

The JSWDK (and soon Jakarta) team will be more than happy to help you with any
questions you might have on the JSWDK (Servlets 2.1+ or JSP 1.0+).

chrisl@hamptons.com wrote:

> Howdy all,
>
> As one of the less experienced (with web servers & open source) & gifted
> programmers on this list, I've decided to work on behalf of less
> experienced and gifted programmers everywhere. It seems that in open-source
> projects like this, things move at a high rate technologically,  but
> accessiblity & ease of use lag quite a bit behind. I suppose I'm thinking
> chiefly of Linux, which to me is a technlogical marvel of Open Source, that
> while the technical equal (at least!) of Windows, lags far behind in ease
> of use.
>
> This is always a bit of a shame, as it seems in such cases, a little
> ambassadorship (in the sense of reaching out to non-wizards) can go a long
> way towards increasing the size and satisfaction of the user base. The all
> too familiar converse of this, is technically superior products being
> outdone by less sound yet 'prettier' (in any sense of the word) alternatives.
>
> It's clear from the obvious energy and skill of the people on this list,
> that Jakarta will be a carefully and wisely designed, and superbly
> technically executed project. I'm probably not enough of a programmer to
> help with this. However, I think I could help keeping Jakarta as close to
> the 'common man' as possible.
>
> Specifically, here's the first thing I've thought of. Right now, JSP is a
> little crazy. A number of JSP engines, for a number of servlet engines, for
> a number of servers. 0.91. 0.92, 1.0, 1.1. There's a lot of traffic on the
> JSP list (some of it from me) about getting JSP up and running on various
> platforms, and a lot of that is due to absent, hard to find, or incorrect
> docs.
>
> I think it would be nice to collect & neaten up all the JSP docs, so that
> any idiot could immediately figure out  what his JSP options were, and what
> to do for each. But beyond that, I want to make it easy for all of these
> people to be able to switch over to Jakarta (if they wish) once it rolls
> out. Maybe this just means excellent "How to switch" docs for each JSP
> option. Maybe it means little scripts that will help change their config
> files or whatever to Jakarts. Heck, maybe there could be a website where
> people could upload their config files and get back Jakarta friendly ones.
>
> That's just my first thought - there's always a million ways to open
> projects like this up to the little guy (in terms of use & understanding,
> if not contribution).
>
> Anyway, if any of you guys thinks this would be energy well spent, I'm
> happy to do it.
>
>  - Chris
>
> (sorry about the verbosity)
>
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Re: I volunteer!

[James Duncan Davidson <du...@x180.com>]

> Anyway, if any of you guys thinks this would be energy well spent, I'm
> happy to do it.

Oh man, efforts like this is what will turn the (hoped for) excellent
and well designed Jakarta projects of the future into the world
tromping, super sucessful, widely adoped entities that we want them to
be.

Coding is only one part of the game. Docs, especially a variety of docs
for different calibers of users, is a major part of the game as well.
To-do's, FAQ's, etc are the bread and butter of Linux. I've got one of
the super slim Sony Vaio's that I've just replaced with a newer more
super slim Vaio. A quick search and I've found a How-To for slapping
linux on my older machine. James was a very happy guy right about then!
:)

-- 
James Davidson       
duncan@eng.sun.com                http://java.sun.com/products/servlet
duncan@x180.com                              http://jakarta.apache.org
!try; do()                                              PGP:0x7D776205