jakarta-commons -> apache-commons

["Michael A. Smith" <ma...@apache.org>]

All:

As previously mentioned on this list, there is ongoing apache-wide 
discussions aimed at reorganizing the apache software foundation.  These 
discussions are taking place on the reorg@apache.org mailing list[1].

Also mentioned here briefly, is that the apache board recently voted to 
create an apache commons project (at the same level of jakarta).  This 
project is still currently in the process of being formed in terms of 
structure.  There is light discussion about this on the 
general@commons.apache.org mailing list[2].

Recently, on the reorg list, Costin Manolache, made the following proposal:

--------

Ok, let's take this - I assume Java will be one of the languages in the
new commons. Why not move the current jakarta-commons as the
java-language sub-project of the apache-commons.

As for flamewar - as long as we can keep our ties with jakarta ( and now
build ties to xml ) - I suspect most people will be happy.

Actually, a much better idea would be to join the xml-commons with
jakarta-commons and form the self-managed java side of apache-commons.
With all commiters forming the PMC. There are quite a few people
in xml.apache.org who are interested in participating in jakarta-commons
( and some are actually doing so ).

Of course, the first step would be to ask the question on
jakarta-commons and xml-commons and eventually put it to a vote. That's
the only way to know - and avoids any flamewar.

Consider this as a proposal.

--------

I should reiterate here that apache commons has not fully formed, so at 
this point there is no definition on how it is setup or how it works. 
The first few projects in apache commons will probably have a hand in 
shaping it to some degree.

So, as mentioned in his proposal, I'm sending the question to 
jakarta-commons.  What do committers here think?  Is this something we 
would want to consider?

regards,
michael

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Re: jakarta-commons -> apache-commons

[Costin Manolache <cm...@yahoo.com>]

It is also worth noting the other comments from Ken ( who is 
the PMC chair of apache-commons ) about decision making
and few other things.

With the current apache-commons PMC structure and spirit, I
am voting -1 on this proposal. However each commons component
can choose for itself - and have a vote. I'll vote -1 on 
the components I work on, and I don't plan to participate
in any apache-common component until the decision making issues
are sorted out in an acceptable form. ( i.e. jakarta-commons
commiters can decide for themself - just like they do in 
jakarta ).

I do think it would be great for jakarta-commons to organise 
itself and form it's own formal management body, similar with
the httpd and apr apache projects. In other words, each active
member of the jakarta-commons should be part of the pre-PMC. 

I also think that it would be a good idea to expand jakarta-commons
to xml and other apache projects. 

I do not think apache-commons is the right solution, and I find 
revolting that ASF named it 'commons' and it created this project
empty, with only a random PMC and without a clear community. At least in
jakarta or jakarta-commons such a think wouldn't happen - the
community is the first thing we look at.

Costin

Michael A. Smith wrote:

> All:
> 
> As previously mentioned on this list, there is ongoing apache-wide
> discussions aimed at reorganizing the apache software foundation.  These
> discussions are taking place on the reorg@apache.org mailing list[1].
> 
> Also mentioned here briefly, is that the apache board recently voted to
> create an apache commons project (at the same level of jakarta).  This
> project is still currently in the process of being formed in terms of
> structure.  There is light discussion about this on the
> general@commons.apache.org mailing list[2].
> 
> Recently, on the reorg list, Costin Manolache, made the following
> proposal:
> 
> --------
> 
> Ok, let's take this - I assume Java will be one of the languages in the
> new commons. Why not move the current jakarta-commons as the
> java-language sub-project of the apache-commons.
> 
> As for flamewar - as long as we can keep our ties with jakarta ( and now
> build ties to xml ) - I suspect most people will be happy.
> 
> Actually, a much better idea would be to join the xml-commons with
> jakarta-commons and form the self-managed java side of apache-commons.
> With all commiters forming the PMC. There are quite a few people
> in xml.apache.org who are interested in participating in jakarta-commons
> ( and some are actually doing so ).
> 
> Of course, the first step would be to ask the question on
> jakarta-commons and xml-commons and eventually put it to a vote. That's
> the only way to know - and avoids any flamewar.
> 
> Consider this as a proposal.
> 
> --------
> 
> I should reiterate here that apache commons has not fully formed, so at
> this point there is no definition on how it is setup or how it works.
> The first few projects in apache commons will probably have a hand in
> shaping it to some degree.
> 
> So, as mentioned in his proposal, I'm sending the question to
> jakarta-commons.  What do committers here think?  Is this something we
> would want to consider?
> 
> regards,
> michael
> 
> [1]  You can subscribe to the mailing list by sending a mail to
> reorg-subscribe@apache.org
> [2]  You can subscribe to the mailing list by sending a mail to
> general-subscribe@commons.apache.org

-- 
Costin



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