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Posted to dev@commons.apache.org by Stephen Colebourne <sc...@btopenworld.com> on 2004/02/29 23:09:55 UTC

[all] Which website entity?

As I started looking at updating some of the websites, I realised that we
have two competing approaches:
- incl_nav.xml
- menus.dtd

I have been updating everything to use the former, but I suspect others may
be updating towards the latter. Have we agreed on which to use? If so, can
we mark the other as deprecated in the file ;-)

Stephen


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Re: [all] Which website entity?

Posted by "Mark R. Diggory" <md...@latte.harvard.edu>.
Yes, right now the direction we've been taking is to include the common 
navigation using the following Entity Reference strategy:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="ISO-8859-1"?>
<!DOCTYPE project [
<!ENTITY commons-nav SYSTEM "../../commons-build/incl_nav.xml">
]>
<project name="Math">
   <title>Math</title>
   <organizationLogo href="/images/jakarta-logo-blue.gif">
      Jakarta
   </organizationLogo>
   <body>
     ...

     &commons-nav;
   </body>
</project>

I think that incl_nav.xml and navigation.vm are basically the same and 
we should remove one of them.

Betwixt and various others are doing the same similar strategy using a 
different set of files:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="ISO-8859-1"?>
<!DOCTYPE org.apache.commons.menus SYSTEM 
'../../xdocs/stylesheets/menus/org-apache-commons-menus.dtd'>
<project name="Betwixt">

   <title>Betwixt</title>
   <organizationLogo 
href="/images/jakarta-logo-blue.gif">Jakarta</organizationLogo>
   <body>
     <links>
       <item name="Jakarta Commons"
             href="http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/"/>
     </links>

     &about-menu;

     ...

     &information-menu;
     &community-menu;
     &translations-menu;

   </body>
</project>


This should seriously be consolidated into "one" and only "one" approach 
for generating navigation across the sites.

I think the method should be a transparent as possible for the 
underlying sites as well, with having multiple includes from the dtd in 
the project navigation.xml level, theres too much room for individual 
projects to manipulate what the commons navigation looks like, it should 
look the same for all projects, with this in mind I think there should 
be only one include, like is currently being done with the incl_navi.xml 
approach. Plus the whole dtd thing is somewhat of an overkill for a 
simple entity include.

2cents,
Mark

Henri Yandell wrote:

> Heh. Looks like Dirk created/moved the menus.dtd the other day.
> 
> Any reason why we should be using menus.dtd Dirk?
> 
> Betwixt, Pool, Launcher and DBCP are using it.
> 
> Hen
> 
> On Sun, 29 Feb 2004, Stephen Colebourne wrote:
> 
> 
>>As I started looking at updating some of the websites, I realised that we
>>have two competing approaches:
>>- incl_nav.xml
>>- menus.dtd
>>
>>I have been updating everything to use the former, but I suspect others may
>>be updating towards the latter. Have we agreed on which to use? If so, can
>>we mark the other as deprecated in the file ;-)
>>
>>Stephen
>>
>>
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>>
> 
> 
> 
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-- 
Mark Diggory
Software Developer
Harvard MIT Data Center
http://www.hmdc.harvard.edu

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Re: [all] Which website entity?

Posted by "Mark R. Diggory" <md...@latte.harvard.edu>.
I did alot of tweeking this morning, I changed over the navigation.xml 
files we change to use your dtd inclusion, I added another entity called 
common-menus that just has all the ones we want in place, all commons 
projects have the commons-site.jsl referenced in thier 
project.properties as:

maven.xdoc.jsl=../commons-build/commons-site.jsl

You may have already been building with it unknowingly, there a re very 
small differences between it and Mavens default site.jsl, as I took a 
copy of it and hardcoded the css styles and fixed soem of the menu 
ordering code (which was broken).

-Mark

Dirk Verbeeck wrote:
> As long as the result is the same I don't really care much about exactly 
> how it is done, I'll going to experiment with the commons-site.jsl 
> solution more this weekend.
> 
> -- Dirk
> 
> Mark R. Diggory wrote:
> 
>> As a plausable solution, rebuilding the 
>> commons-build/xdocs/navigation.xml and commons-build/navi_incl.xml 
>> document to draw its contents from the menu "ent" files. Set the types 
>> of the "about menu" to "header" and the rest to "footer". These 
>> attributes are used in the commons-site.jsl to separate the rendering 
>> of the navigation menus as so:
>>
>> <jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[@type='header']"/>
>> <jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[not(@type)] | 
>> $nav/body/search"/>
>> <jsl:applyTemplates select="$projectNav/body/menu"/>
>> <jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[@type='footer']"/>
>>
>>
>> This means that any menu of type "header" comes before "no type" or 
>> search, which comes before the type footer.
>>
>> This means that it doesn't matter the order for which they are added 
>> to the navigation.xml as entities and they can even be added to the 
>> navigation.xml as one entity and still show up either above or below 
>> the various project navigation and menu items added by the project.
>>
>> -Mark
> 
> 
> 
> 
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-- 
Mark Diggory
Software Developer
Harvard MIT Data Center
http://www.hmdc.harvard.edu

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Re: [all] Which website entity?

Posted by Dirk Verbeeck <di...@pandora.be>.
As long as the result is the same I don't really care much about 
exactly how it is done, I'll going to experiment with the 
commons-site.jsl solution more this weekend.

-- Dirk

Mark R. Diggory wrote:
> As a plausable solution, rebuilding the 
> commons-build/xdocs/navigation.xml and commons-build/navi_incl.xml 
> document to draw its contents from the menu "ent" files. Set the types 
> of the "about menu" to "header" and the rest to "footer". These 
> attributes are used in the commons-site.jsl to separate the rendering of 
> the navigation menus as so:
> 
> <jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[@type='header']"/>
> <jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[not(@type)] | 
> $nav/body/search"/>
> <jsl:applyTemplates select="$projectNav/body/menu"/>
> <jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[@type='footer']"/>
> 
> 
> This means that any menu of type "header" comes before "no type" or 
> search, which comes before the type footer.
> 
> This means that it doesn't matter the order for which they are added to 
> the navigation.xml as entities and they can even be added to the 
> navigation.xml as one entity and still show up either above or below the 
> various project navigation and menu items added by the project.
> 
> -Mark



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Re: [all] Which website entity?

Posted by "Mark R. Diggory" <md...@latte.harvard.edu>.
As a plausable solution, rebuilding the 
commons-build/xdocs/navigation.xml and commons-build/navi_incl.xml 
document to draw its contents from the menu "ent" files. Set the types 
of the "about menu" to "header" and the rest to "footer". These 
attributes are used in the commons-site.jsl to separate the rendering of 
the navigation menus as so:

<jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[@type='header']"/>
<jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[not(@type)] | $nav/body/search"/>
<jsl:applyTemplates select="$projectNav/body/menu"/>
<jsl:applyTemplates select="$nav/body/menu[@type='footer']"/>


This means that any menu of type "header" comes before "no type" or 
search, which comes before the type footer.

This means that it doesn't matter the order for which they are added to 
the navigation.xml as entities and they can even be added to the 
navigation.xml as one entity and still show up either above or below the 
various project navigation and menu items added by the project.

-Mark

Mark R. Diggory wrote:

> Dirk Verbeeck wrote:
> 
>> Robert Burrell Donkin did the initial implementation of this
>> menus.dtd for the Betwixt site. (the current main site also uses it
>> and the sandbox components I mavenized as well)
>>
>> I like the way you can put the "About Us" section above the "Commons
>> DBCP" without any special scripting. 
>> http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/dbcp/
>>
>> Another advantage is that you can use/reuse different menus between
>> the main site and a component site.
> 
> 
> I do not disagree that it is flexible. My concern is with maintaining
> the "common section" throughout all the subproject sites so that it is
> the same in each one, if component A and B can place the parts where ever
> they want, then its going to be difficult to maintain a consistent
> navigational model for the entire commons. Consistency is important so
> users know who to get around the site from within any project.
> 
> The site.jsl gives us a full opportunity to adjust where specific
> navigation items show up in the navigation without each individual site
> needing to configure the "entities" in the navigation.xml
> 
> If you want to see specific ordering or toggling of menus to be
> shown/not shown, it can be controlled globally across all the sites from
> one location. The top level navigation.xml can have specific items 
> within it, while the subproject navigations can be configured to only 
> have specific "global" items we designate show up there. The project can 
> still add whatever custom menus they want, but they appear in a specific 
> portion of the navigation and cannot alter the global menus.
> 
> 
>> For example the "View CVS" and "Download" menus are usefull on the
>> main site but on the DBCP site they aren't. There you have a specific
>>  downloads page: http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/dbcp/downloads.html
>>
> 
> I think we can accomplish this while still maintaining a golobally 
> consistent site navigation.
> 
> -Mark
> 
>> -- Dirk
>>
>>
>> Henri Yandell wrote:
>>
>>> Heh. Looks like Dirk created/moved the menus.dtd the other day.
>>>
>>> Any reason why we should be using menus.dtd Dirk?
>>>
>>> Betwixt, Pool, Launcher and DBCP are using it.
>>>
>>> Hen
>>>
>>> On Sun, 29 Feb 2004, Stephen Colebourne wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> As I started looking at updating some of the websites, I realised
>>>>  that we have two competing approaches: - incl_nav.xml -
>>>> menus.dtd
>>>>
>>>> I have been updating everything to use the former, but I suspect
>>>>  others may be updating towards the latter. Have we agreed on
>>>> which to use? If so, can we mark the other as deprecated in the
>>>> file ;-)
>>>>
>>>> Stephen
>>>>
> 

-- 
Mark Diggory
Software Developer
Harvard MIT Data Center
http://www.hmdc.harvard.edu

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Re: [all] Which website entity?

Posted by Stephen Colebourne <sc...@btopenworld.com>.
> > For example the "View CVS" and "Download" menus are usefull on the
> > main site but on the DBCP site they aren't. There you have a specific
> >  downloads page:
IMO, the downloads page of a project is additional. This will become more
obvious when we get a different background colour for the project part of
the left nav.

FYI, at present, the incl_nav is used by the majority. In commons, only
launcher, dbcp and pool use the menus.dtd file. (and 5 of the sandbox)

The menus.dtd has one key advantage in that it allows a menu item to be
inserted above the project section. My vote is for a solution that keeps the
entity including simple, especially as the files are duplicated between
commons and sandbox.

Stephen



From: "Mark R. Diggory" <md...@latte.harvard.edu>
> Dirk Verbeeck wrote:
> > Robert Burrell Donkin did the initial implementation of this
> > menus.dtd for the Betwixt site. (the current main site also uses it
> > and the sandbox components I mavenized as well)
> >
> > I like the way you can put the "About Us" section above the "Commons
> > DBCP" without any special scripting.
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/dbcp/
> >
> > Another advantage is that you can use/reuse different menus between
> > the main site and a component site.
>
> I do not disagree that it is flexible. My concern is with maintaining
> the "common section" throughout all the subproject sites so that it is
> the same in each one, if component A and B can place the parts where ever
> they want, then its going to be difficult to maintain a consistent
> navigational model for the entire commons. Consistency is important so
> users know who to get around the site from within any project.
>
> The site.jsl gives us a full opportunity to adjust where specific
> navigation items show up in the navigation without each individual site
> needing to configure the "entities" in the navigation.xml
>
> If you want to see specific ordering or toggling of menus to be
> shown/not shown, it can be controlled globally across all the sites from
> one location. The top level navigation.xml can have specific items
> within it, while the subproject navigations can be configured to only
> have specific "global" items we designate show up there. The project can
> still add whatever custom menus they want, but they appear in a specific
> portion of the navigation and cannot alter the global menus.
>
>
> > For example the "View CVS" and "Download" menus are usefull on the
> > main site but on the DBCP site they aren't. There you have a specific
> >  downloads page:
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/dbcp/downloads.html
> >
>
> I think we can accomplish this while still maintaining a golobally
> consistent site navigation.
>
> -Mark
>
> > -- Dirk
> >
> >
> > Henri Yandell wrote:
> >
> >> Heh. Looks like Dirk created/moved the menus.dtd the other day.
> >>
> >> Any reason why we should be using menus.dtd Dirk?
> >>
> >> Betwixt, Pool, Launcher and DBCP are using it.
> >>
> >> Hen
> >>
> >> On Sun, 29 Feb 2004, Stephen Colebourne wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> As I started looking at updating some of the websites, I realised
> >>>  that we have two competing approaches: - incl_nav.xml -
> >>> menus.dtd
> >>>
> >>> I have been updating everything to use the former, but I suspect
> >>>  others may be updating towards the latter. Have we agreed on
> >>> which to use? If so, can we mark the other as deprecated in the
> >>> file ;-)
> >>>
> >>> Stephen
> >>>
>
> --
> Mark Diggory
> Software Developer
> Harvard MIT Data Center
> http://www.hmdc.harvard.edu
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org


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Re: [all] Which website entity?

Posted by "Mark R. Diggory" <md...@latte.harvard.edu>.
Dirk Verbeeck wrote:
> Robert Burrell Donkin did the initial implementation of this
> menus.dtd for the Betwixt site. (the current main site also uses it
> and the sandbox components I mavenized as well)
> 
> I like the way you can put the "About Us" section above the "Commons
> DBCP" without any special scripting. 
> http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/dbcp/
> 
> Another advantage is that you can use/reuse different menus between
> the main site and a component site.

I do not disagree that it is flexible. My concern is with maintaining
the "common section" throughout all the subproject sites so that it is
the same in each one, if component A and B can place the parts where ever
they want, then its going to be difficult to maintain a consistent
navigational model for the entire commons. Consistency is important so
users know who to get around the site from within any project.

The site.jsl gives us a full opportunity to adjust where specific
navigation items show up in the navigation without each individual site
needing to configure the "entities" in the navigation.xml

If you want to see specific ordering or toggling of menus to be
shown/not shown, it can be controlled globally across all the sites from
one location. The top level navigation.xml can have specific items 
within it, while the subproject navigations can be configured to only 
have specific "global" items we designate show up there. The project can 
still add whatever custom menus they want, but they appear in a specific 
portion of the navigation and cannot alter the global menus.


> For example the "View CVS" and "Download" menus are usefull on the
> main site but on the DBCP site they aren't. There you have a specific
>  downloads page: 
> http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/dbcp/downloads.html
> 

I think we can accomplish this while still maintaining a golobally 
consistent site navigation.

-Mark

> -- Dirk
> 
> 
> Henri Yandell wrote:
> 
>> Heh. Looks like Dirk created/moved the menus.dtd the other day.
>> 
>> Any reason why we should be using menus.dtd Dirk?
>> 
>> Betwixt, Pool, Launcher and DBCP are using it.
>> 
>> Hen
>> 
>> On Sun, 29 Feb 2004, Stephen Colebourne wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> As I started looking at updating some of the websites, I realised
>>>  that we have two competing approaches: - incl_nav.xml -
>>> menus.dtd
>>> 
>>> I have been updating everything to use the former, but I suspect
>>>  others may be updating towards the latter. Have we agreed on
>>> which to use? If so, can we mark the other as deprecated in the
>>> file ;-)
>>> 
>>> Stephen
>>> 

-- 
Mark Diggory
Software Developer
Harvard MIT Data Center
http://www.hmdc.harvard.edu

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Re: [all] Which website entity?

Posted by Dirk Verbeeck <di...@pandora.be>.
Robert Burrell Donkin did the initial implementation of this menus.dtd 
for the Betwixt site. (the current main site also uses it and the 
sandbox components I mavenized as well)

I like the way you can put the "About Us" section above the
"Commons DBCP" without any special scripting.
http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/dbcp/

Another advantage is that you can use/reuse different menus between 
the main site and a component site.
For example the "View CVS" and "Download" menus are usefull on the 
main site but on the DBCP site they aren't. There you have a specific 
downloads page:
http://jakarta.apache.org/commons/dbcp/downloads.html

-- Dirk


Henri Yandell wrote:
> Heh. Looks like Dirk created/moved the menus.dtd the other day.
> 
> Any reason why we should be using menus.dtd Dirk?
> 
> Betwixt, Pool, Launcher and DBCP are using it.
> 
> Hen
> 
> On Sun, 29 Feb 2004, Stephen Colebourne wrote:
> 
> 
>>As I started looking at updating some of the websites, I realised that we
>>have two competing approaches:
>>- incl_nav.xml
>>- menus.dtd
>>
>>I have been updating everything to use the former, but I suspect others may
>>be updating towards the latter. Have we agreed on which to use? If so, can
>>we mark the other as deprecated in the file ;-)
>>
>>Stephen
>>
>>
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>>
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 



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Re: [all] Which website entity?

Posted by Henri Yandell <ba...@generationjava.com>.
Heh. Looks like Dirk created/moved the menus.dtd the other day.

Any reason why we should be using menus.dtd Dirk?

Betwixt, Pool, Launcher and DBCP are using it.

Hen

On Sun, 29 Feb 2004, Stephen Colebourne wrote:

> As I started looking at updating some of the websites, I realised that we
> have two competing approaches:
> - incl_nav.xml
> - menus.dtd
>
> I have been updating everything to use the former, but I suspect others may
> be updating towards the latter. Have we agreed on which to use? If so, can
> we mark the other as deprecated in the file ;-)
>
> Stephen
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>


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