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Posted to server-user@james.apache.org by "Peter T. Brown" <pe...@flippyhead.com> on 2005/06/14 18:22:00 UTC
Connection timed out and Too many recipients
I have a mailing list of modest size, less than 1500 members. But it seems
I cannot even use james to deploy to hotmail or yahoo because it tries to
send to ALL the hotmail addresses in my list at ONCE, which produces one of
two errors: Connection Times Out, or Too Many Recipients.
Is there any fix for this?
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RE: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
At some point, the MLM should use VERP, which would mean a per-recipient
MAIL FROM and would make this point moot. Also, enable sendpartial and see
if those mis-behaving servers will at least accept N, and reject the
remaining recipients, which we would then retry. This can be done now,
since it is already supported by JAMES. Try the latest nightly code if
you're going to do it, since we've recently made some changes in how we
handle responses in remote delivery.
--- Noel
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RE: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
Posted by Daniel Perry <d....@netcase.co.uk>.
hmm.... maybe james should be able to have a configurable per domain limit
so we can deal with dodgy servers. Maybe also it should try to detect "too
many recipients" when sending the message and break it down there too.
Applying it to all servers, including well behaved ones would cost me a lot
in terms of bandwidth. For example, i have an academic mailing list with
about 500 members, of which 95% are accounted for by two different domains.
It often gets 1 or 2 MB emails. 1mb email ends up using 20 to 30 mb of
bandwidth instead of 500mb!
Daniel.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Peter T. Brown [mailto:peter@flippyhead.com]
> Sent: 15 June 2005 18:02
> To: James Users List
> Subject: Re: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
>
>
> Right, but practically speaking if James cannot support sending to major
> email vendors it can't really be considered a useable mailing
> list manager,
> as far as I am concerned. I mean, I simply cannot use James if a
> significant
> portion of my users will be left in the cold...
>
> A common approach I've seen is for the list manager to detect when a
> recipient list is getting to long, and break it up into smaller
> chunks that
> can be sent separately.
>
> Cheers
>
> --
> Peter T. Brown
> Founding Partner
> Headless Hunter, Inc.
> peter@headlesshunter.com
>
> "Rewarding you for who you know."
> http://www.headlesshunter.com/
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > From: "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>
> > Reply-To: James Users List <se...@james.apache.org>
> > Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 09:01:30 -0400
> > To: James Users List <se...@james.apache.org>, Andrew Hayden
> > <an...@gmail.com>
> > Subject: RE: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
> >
> > Andrew Hayden wrote:
> >
> >> this is an issue with hotmail, yahoo, etc's spam-prevention
> >> techniques. They tend to set very low limits on the number of
> >> recipients that a message can be sent to at once
> >
> > Which is, by the way, an RFC violation. I appreciate why they
> do it, but
> > their limits are well below those mandated by RFC 2821:
> >
> > The minimum total number of recipients that must be buffered is
> > 100 recipients. Rejection of messages (for excessive recipients)
> > with fewer than 100 RCPT commands is a violation of this
> > specification.
> >
> > --- Noel
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-user-unsubscribe@james.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: server-user-help@james.apache.org
> >
>
>
>
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Re: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
Posted by "Peter T. Brown" <pe...@flippyhead.com>.
Right, but practically speaking if James cannot support sending to major
email vendors it can't really be considered a useable mailing list manager,
as far as I am concerned. I mean, I simply cannot use James if a significant
portion of my users will be left in the cold...
A common approach I've seen is for the list manager to detect when a
recipient list is getting to long, and break it up into smaller chunks that
can be sent separately.
Cheers
--
Peter T. Brown
Founding Partner
Headless Hunter, Inc.
peter@headlesshunter.com
"Rewarding you for who you know."
http://www.headlesshunter.com/
> From: "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>
> Reply-To: James Users List <se...@james.apache.org>
> Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 09:01:30 -0400
> To: James Users List <se...@james.apache.org>, Andrew Hayden
> <an...@gmail.com>
> Subject: RE: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
>
> Andrew Hayden wrote:
>
>> this is an issue with hotmail, yahoo, etc's spam-prevention
>> techniques. They tend to set very low limits on the number of
>> recipients that a message can be sent to at once
>
> Which is, by the way, an RFC violation. I appreciate why they do it, but
> their limits are well below those mandated by RFC 2821:
>
> The minimum total number of recipients that must be buffered is
> 100 recipients. Rejection of messages (for excessive recipients)
> with fewer than 100 RCPT commands is a violation of this
> specification.
>
> --- Noel
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-user-unsubscribe@james.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: server-user-help@james.apache.org
>
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RE: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
Andrew Hayden wrote:
> this is an issue with hotmail, yahoo, etc's spam-prevention
> techniques. They tend to set very low limits on the number of
> recipients that a message can be sent to at once
Which is, by the way, an RFC violation. I appreciate why they do it, but
their limits are well below those mandated by RFC 2821:
The minimum total number of recipients that must be buffered is
100 recipients. Rejection of messages (for excessive recipients)
with fewer than 100 RCPT commands is a violation of this
specification.
--- Noel
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Re: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
Posted by Andrew Hayden <an...@gmail.com>.
It seems from your message that you are probably already aware of
thise, but just in case (and for the benefit of others): Note that
this is an issue with hotmail, yahoo, etc's spam-prevention
techniques. They tend to set very low limits on the number of
recipients that a message can be sent to at once - I think hotmail
used to be limited to 5, or something similarly tiny.
With 1500 members it is of course vastly more efficient on James' part
to make one connection instead of 1500 separate ones... but given the
prevalence of hotmail/yahoo/etc it seems to me that there could be a
configurable section somewhere that lets you specify the max #
recipients per domain to send to at once... just my two cents.
-Andrew Hayden
On 6/14/05, Peter T. Brown <pe...@flippyhead.com> wrote:
> I have a mailing list of modest size, less than 1500 members. But it seems
> I cannot even use james to deploy to hotmail or yahoo because it tries to
> send to ALL the hotmail addresses in my list at ONCE, which produces one of
> two errors: Connection Times Out, or Too Many Recipients.
>
> Is there any fix for this?
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: server-user-unsubscribe@james.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: server-user-help@james.apache.org
>
>
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RE: Connection timed out and Too many recipients
Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
> [james] tries to send to ALL the hotmail addresses in my list at ONCE,
> which produces one of two errors: Connection Times Out, or Too Many
> Recipients.
> Is there any fix for this?
Not overly difficult, but it would require a code change.
--- Noel
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