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Posted to dev@hama.apache.org by Tommaso Teofili <to...@gmail.com> on 2011/11/04 09:52:02 UTC
Lowering the barrier
Hi all,
I've been thinking about how to improve our community experience and
attract new users and contributors for some time and I am quite sure we
should, at least, try to do the following :
1. make our getting started guides much much more easy for someone who
doesn't have any clue about what, for instance, Hadoop is and how to
configure it; defining a more tiny and clear list of small steps in order
to start Hama, the web interface, etc. I don't know if that's a common
opinion but it seems to me the 'quick start' page contains all the needed
stuff to know to start Hama but for a new user it may be not so easy to
manage all that information.
2. allow more users to contribute creating small and self contained
issues. This was the way I started here at ASF: I didn't have a deep
understanding of each of the components of the first project I was involved
with (Apache UIMA) but I found some small and trivial issues (a couple of
lines of code to document / fix / create) I could start from and that
allowed me to get more familiar with the code and the insights of the
project AND at the same time this allowed the project committers to care
more about bigger and more complex issues. The big design decisions and
improvements will be still handled by committers most of the times but
simpler things can be improved and taken from newcomers.
One other thing could be improve how we present to the "public" with our
website but it may be tricky, however there I suggest adding some
screenshots/pictures for the architecture / BSP model.
One last thing regards a technical point: it may be good if we could define
a Maven profile to automatically start a Hama cluster from Maven but we
should decide if / how to do that; this would allow the user to do a SVN
checkout, run the Maven goal and understanding by seeing Hama working.
Just as an example for the web interface to be started from Maven, we could
use the Maven Jetty plugin [1].
I hope this helps but I look forward to ear other people opinions and
points.
Have a nice day.
Tommaso
[1] : http://docs.codehaus.org/display/JETTY/Maven+Jetty+Plugin
Re: Lowering the barrier
Posted by "Edward J. Yoon" <ed...@apache.org>.
Thank you for your helpful advice!
On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 5:52 PM, Tommaso Teofili
<to...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
> I've been thinking about how to improve our community experience and
> attract new users and contributors for some time and I am quite sure we
> should, at least, try to do the following :
>
> 1. make our getting started guides much much more easy for someone who
> doesn't have any clue about what, for instance, Hadoop is and how to
> configure it; defining a more tiny and clear list of small steps in order
> to start Hama, the web interface, etc. I don't know if that's a common
> opinion but it seems to me the 'quick start' page contains all the needed
> stuff to know to start Hama but for a new user it may be not so easy to
> manage all that information.
> 2. allow more users to contribute creating small and self contained
> issues. This was the way I started here at ASF: I didn't have a deep
> understanding of each of the components of the first project I was involved
> with (Apache UIMA) but I found some small and trivial issues (a couple of
> lines of code to document / fix / create) I could start from and that
> allowed me to get more familiar with the code and the insights of the
> project AND at the same time this allowed the project committers to care
> more about bigger and more complex issues. The big design decisions and
> improvements will be still handled by committers most of the times but
> simpler things can be improved and taken from newcomers.
>
> One other thing could be improve how we present to the "public" with our
> website but it may be tricky, however there I suggest adding some
> screenshots/pictures for the architecture / BSP model.
> One last thing regards a technical point: it may be good if we could define
> a Maven profile to automatically start a Hama cluster from Maven but we
> should decide if / how to do that; this would allow the user to do a SVN
> checkout, run the Maven goal and understanding by seeing Hama working.
> Just as an example for the web interface to be started from Maven, we could
> use the Maven Jetty plugin [1].
> I hope this helps but I look forward to ear other people opinions and
> points.
> Have a nice day.
> Tommaso
>
> [1] : http://docs.codehaus.org/display/JETTY/Maven+Jetty+Plugin
>
--
Best Regards, Edward J. Yoon
@eddieyoon
Re: Lowering the barrier
Posted by "Edward J. Yoon" <ed...@apache.org>.
+1
On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 9:54 PM, Thomas Jungblut
<th...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> This here could be a good beginner issue:
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/HAMA-445
>
> We have to add a better description. But actually this is a simple task
> just adding a configuration value in the BSPJob and reading it in the Peer.
>
> What do you think?
>
> 2011/11/4 Edward J. Yoon <ed...@apache.org>
>
>> Good Idea.
>>
>> But, I think we have to fix HAMA-455 and cdh issues before prepare
>> guide. As I mentioned before, many people reports/asks them to me.
>>
>> 2011/11/4 ChiaHung Lin <ch...@nuk.edu.tw>:
>> > For the 1st issue, probably we should provide a step by step guide with
>> a simple example such as hello world. There we provides concrete setting
>> how the system is configured, including hdfs, bsp daemons, etc., and
>> execution steps because some users perhaps even have no clues what cluster
>> is. Concrete pictures, configuration setting, and a working example may
>> better illustrate what hama is and how it might work.
>> >
>> > For the second issue, a todo list linking to jira or threads may be a
>> bit cleaner for new comer to check if something they have interest. The
>> disadvantage is the list may need updated periodically.
>> >
>> > I would like to take on the first task if we think that's ok. But what
>> example we should take as some examples e.g. serialized printing are going
>> to be moved to test package?
>> >
>> > -----Original message-----
>> > From:Tommaso Teofili <to...@gmail.com>
>> > To:hama-dev@incubator.apache.org
>> > Date:Fri, 4 Nov 2011 09:52:02 +0100
>> > Subject:Lowering the barrier
>> >
>> > Hi all,
>> > I've been thinking about how to improve our community experience and
>> > attract new users and contributors for some time and I am quite sure we
>> > should, at least, try to do the following :
>> >
>> > 1. make our getting started guides much much more easy for someone who
>> > doesn't have any clue about what, for instance, Hadoop is and how to
>> > configure it; defining a more tiny and clear list of small steps in
>> order
>> > to start Hama, the web interface, etc. I don't know if that's a common
>> > opinion but it seems to me the 'quick start' page contains all the
>> needed
>> > stuff to know to start Hama but for a new user it may be not so easy to
>> > manage all that information.
>> > 2. allow more users to contribute creating small and self contained
>> > issues. This was the way I started here at ASF: I didn't have a deep
>> > understanding of each of the components of the first project I was
>> involved
>> > with (Apache UIMA) but I found some small and trivial issues (a couple
>> of
>> > lines of code to document / fix / create) I could start from and that
>> > allowed me to get more familiar with the code and the insights of the
>> > project AND at the same time this allowed the project committers to
>> care
>> > more about bigger and more complex issues. The big design decisions and
>> > improvements will be still handled by committers most of the times but
>> > simpler things can be improved and taken from newcomers.
>> >
>> > One other thing could be improve how we present to the "public" with our
>> > website but it may be tricky, however there I suggest adding some
>> > screenshots/pictures for the architecture / BSP model.
>> > One last thing regards a technical point: it may be good if we could
>> define
>> > a Maven profile to automatically start a Hama cluster from Maven but we
>> > should decide if / how to do that; this would allow the user to do a SVN
>> > checkout, run the Maven goal and understanding by seeing Hama working.
>> > Just as an example for the web interface to be started from Maven, we
>> could
>> > use the Maven Jetty plugin [1].
>> > I hope this helps but I look forward to ear other people opinions and
>> > points.
>> > Have a nice day.
>> > Tommaso
>> >
>> > [1] : http://docs.codehaus.org/display/JETTY/Maven+Jetty+Plugin
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > ChiaHung Lin
>> > Department of Information Management
>> > National University of Kaohsiung
>> > Taiwan
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Best Regards, Edward J. Yoon
>> @eddieyoon
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Thomas Jungblut
> Berlin <th...@gmail.com>
>
--
Best Regards, Edward J. Yoon
@eddieyoon
Re: Lowering the barrier
Posted by Thomas Jungblut <th...@googlemail.com>.
This here could be a good beginner issue:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/HAMA-445
We have to add a better description. But actually this is a simple task
just adding a configuration value in the BSPJob and reading it in the Peer.
What do you think?
2011/11/4 Edward J. Yoon <ed...@apache.org>
> Good Idea.
>
> But, I think we have to fix HAMA-455 and cdh issues before prepare
> guide. As I mentioned before, many people reports/asks them to me.
>
> 2011/11/4 ChiaHung Lin <ch...@nuk.edu.tw>:
> > For the 1st issue, probably we should provide a step by step guide with
> a simple example such as hello world. There we provides concrete setting
> how the system is configured, including hdfs, bsp daemons, etc., and
> execution steps because some users perhaps even have no clues what cluster
> is. Concrete pictures, configuration setting, and a working example may
> better illustrate what hama is and how it might work.
> >
> > For the second issue, a todo list linking to jira or threads may be a
> bit cleaner for new comer to check if something they have interest. The
> disadvantage is the list may need updated periodically.
> >
> > I would like to take on the first task if we think that's ok. But what
> example we should take as some examples e.g. serialized printing are going
> to be moved to test package?
> >
> > -----Original message-----
> > From:Tommaso Teofili <to...@gmail.com>
> > To:hama-dev@incubator.apache.org
> > Date:Fri, 4 Nov 2011 09:52:02 +0100
> > Subject:Lowering the barrier
> >
> > Hi all,
> > I've been thinking about how to improve our community experience and
> > attract new users and contributors for some time and I am quite sure we
> > should, at least, try to do the following :
> >
> > 1. make our getting started guides much much more easy for someone who
> > doesn't have any clue about what, for instance, Hadoop is and how to
> > configure it; defining a more tiny and clear list of small steps in
> order
> > to start Hama, the web interface, etc. I don't know if that's a common
> > opinion but it seems to me the 'quick start' page contains all the
> needed
> > stuff to know to start Hama but for a new user it may be not so easy to
> > manage all that information.
> > 2. allow more users to contribute creating small and self contained
> > issues. This was the way I started here at ASF: I didn't have a deep
> > understanding of each of the components of the first project I was
> involved
> > with (Apache UIMA) but I found some small and trivial issues (a couple
> of
> > lines of code to document / fix / create) I could start from and that
> > allowed me to get more familiar with the code and the insights of the
> > project AND at the same time this allowed the project committers to
> care
> > more about bigger and more complex issues. The big design decisions and
> > improvements will be still handled by committers most of the times but
> > simpler things can be improved and taken from newcomers.
> >
> > One other thing could be improve how we present to the "public" with our
> > website but it may be tricky, however there I suggest adding some
> > screenshots/pictures for the architecture / BSP model.
> > One last thing regards a technical point: it may be good if we could
> define
> > a Maven profile to automatically start a Hama cluster from Maven but we
> > should decide if / how to do that; this would allow the user to do a SVN
> > checkout, run the Maven goal and understanding by seeing Hama working.
> > Just as an example for the web interface to be started from Maven, we
> could
> > use the Maven Jetty plugin [1].
> > I hope this helps but I look forward to ear other people opinions and
> > points.
> > Have a nice day.
> > Tommaso
> >
> > [1] : http://docs.codehaus.org/display/JETTY/Maven+Jetty+Plugin
> >
> >
> > --
> > ChiaHung Lin
> > Department of Information Management
> > National University of Kaohsiung
> > Taiwan
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Best Regards, Edward J. Yoon
> @eddieyoon
>
--
Thomas Jungblut
Berlin <th...@gmail.com>
Re: Lowering the barrier
Posted by "Edward J. Yoon" <ed...@apache.org>.
Good Idea.
But, I think we have to fix HAMA-455 and cdh issues before prepare
guide. As I mentioned before, many people reports/asks them to me.
2011/11/4 ChiaHung Lin <ch...@nuk.edu.tw>:
> For the 1st issue, probably we should provide a step by step guide with a simple example such as hello world. There we provides concrete setting how the system is configured, including hdfs, bsp daemons, etc., and execution steps because some users perhaps even have no clues what cluster is. Concrete pictures, configuration setting, and a working example may better illustrate what hama is and how it might work.
>
> For the second issue, a todo list linking to jira or threads may be a bit cleaner for new comer to check if something they have interest. The disadvantage is the list may need updated periodically.
>
> I would like to take on the first task if we think that's ok. But what example we should take as some examples e.g. serialized printing are going to be moved to test package?
>
> -----Original message-----
> From:Tommaso Teofili <to...@gmail.com>
> To:hama-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Date:Fri, 4 Nov 2011 09:52:02 +0100
> Subject:Lowering the barrier
>
> Hi all,
> I've been thinking about how to improve our community experience and
> attract new users and contributors for some time and I am quite sure we
> should, at least, try to do the following :
>
> 1. make our getting started guides much much more easy for someone who
> doesn't have any clue about what, for instance, Hadoop is and how to
> configure it; defining a more tiny and clear list of small steps in order
> to start Hama, the web interface, etc. I don't know if that's a common
> opinion but it seems to me the 'quick start' page contains all the needed
> stuff to know to start Hama but for a new user it may be not so easy to
> manage all that information.
> 2. allow more users to contribute creating small and self contained
> issues. This was the way I started here at ASF: I didn't have a deep
> understanding of each of the components of the first project I was involved
> with (Apache UIMA) but I found some small and trivial issues (a couple of
> lines of code to document / fix / create) I could start from and that
> allowed me to get more familiar with the code and the insights of the
> project AND at the same time this allowed the project committers to care
> more about bigger and more complex issues. The big design decisions and
> improvements will be still handled by committers most of the times but
> simpler things can be improved and taken from newcomers.
>
> One other thing could be improve how we present to the "public" with our
> website but it may be tricky, however there I suggest adding some
> screenshots/pictures for the architecture / BSP model.
> One last thing regards a technical point: it may be good if we could define
> a Maven profile to automatically start a Hama cluster from Maven but we
> should decide if / how to do that; this would allow the user to do a SVN
> checkout, run the Maven goal and understanding by seeing Hama working.
> Just as an example for the web interface to be started from Maven, we could
> use the Maven Jetty plugin [1].
> I hope this helps but I look forward to ear other people opinions and
> points.
> Have a nice day.
> Tommaso
>
> [1] : http://docs.codehaus.org/display/JETTY/Maven+Jetty+Plugin
>
>
> --
> ChiaHung Lin
> Department of Information Management
> National University of Kaohsiung
> Taiwan
>
--
Best Regards, Edward J. Yoon
@eddieyoon
Re: Lowering the barrier
Posted by ChiaHung Lin <ch...@nuk.edu.tw>.
For the 1st issue, probably we should provide a step by step guide with a simple example such as hello world. There we provides concrete setting how the system is configured, including hdfs, bsp daemons, etc., and execution steps because some users perhaps even have no clues what cluster is. Concrete pictures, configuration setting, and a working example may better illustrate what hama is and how it might work.
For the second issue, a todo list linking to jira or threads may be a bit cleaner for new comer to check if something they have interest. The disadvantage is the list may need updated periodically.
I would like to take on the first task if we think that's ok. But what example we should take as some examples e.g. serialized printing are going to be moved to test package?
-----Original message-----
From:Tommaso Teofili <to...@gmail.com>
To:hama-dev@incubator.apache.org
Date:Fri, 4 Nov 2011 09:52:02 +0100
Subject:Lowering the barrier
Hi all,
I've been thinking about how to improve our community experience and
attract new users and contributors for some time and I am quite sure we
should, at least, try to do the following :
1. make our getting started guides much much more easy for someone who
doesn't have any clue about what, for instance, Hadoop is and how to
configure it; defining a more tiny and clear list of small steps in order
to start Hama, the web interface, etc. I don't know if that's a common
opinion but it seems to me the 'quick start' page contains all the needed
stuff to know to start Hama but for a new user it may be not so easy to
manage all that information.
2. allow more users to contribute creating small and self contained
issues. This was the way I started here at ASF: I didn't have a deep
understanding of each of the components of the first project I was involved
with (Apache UIMA) but I found some small and trivial issues (a couple of
lines of code to document / fix / create) I could start from and that
allowed me to get more familiar with the code and the insights of the
project AND at the same time this allowed the project committers to care
more about bigger and more complex issues. The big design decisions and
improvements will be still handled by committers most of the times but
simpler things can be improved and taken from newcomers.
One other thing could be improve how we present to the "public" with our
website but it may be tricky, however there I suggest adding some
screenshots/pictures for the architecture / BSP model.
One last thing regards a technical point: it may be good if we could define
a Maven profile to automatically start a Hama cluster from Maven but we
should decide if / how to do that; this would allow the user to do a SVN
checkout, run the Maven goal and understanding by seeing Hama working.
Just as an example for the web interface to be started from Maven, we could
use the Maven Jetty plugin [1].
I hope this helps but I look forward to ear other people opinions and
points.
Have a nice day.
Tommaso
[1] : http://docs.codehaus.org/display/JETTY/Maven+Jetty+Plugin
--
ChiaHung Lin
Department of Information Management
National University of Kaohsiung
Taiwan
Re: Lowering the barrier
Posted by Thomas Jungblut <th...@googlemail.com>.
+1.
The main problem is that we have very huge issues: I/O, graph, multitask.
We need more minor bugfixes or a better splitting of issues.
And like you already said, a far more better documentation. Not in the Wiki
and in some PDF, but on the website.
In my opinion people should already have some experience with Hadoop, like
starting HDFS for example.
But this is not the case for everyone, so we should add a tutorial for that
too.
Thanks for the good ideas ;)
2011/11/4 Tommaso Teofili <to...@gmail.com>
> Hi all,
> I've been thinking about how to improve our community experience and
> attract new users and contributors for some time and I am quite sure we
> should, at least, try to do the following :
>
> 1. make our getting started guides much much more easy for someone who
> doesn't have any clue about what, for instance, Hadoop is and how to
> configure it; defining a more tiny and clear list of small steps in order
> to start Hama, the web interface, etc. I don't know if that's a common
> opinion but it seems to me the 'quick start' page contains all the needed
> stuff to know to start Hama but for a new user it may be not so easy to
> manage all that information.
> 2. allow more users to contribute creating small and self contained
> issues. This was the way I started here at ASF: I didn't have a deep
> understanding of each of the components of the first project I was
> involved
> with (Apache UIMA) but I found some small and trivial issues (a couple of
> lines of code to document / fix / create) I could start from and that
> allowed me to get more familiar with the code and the insights of the
> project AND at the same time this allowed the project committers to care
> more about bigger and more complex issues. The big design decisions and
> improvements will be still handled by committers most of the times but
> simpler things can be improved and taken from newcomers.
>
> One other thing could be improve how we present to the "public" with our
> website but it may be tricky, however there I suggest adding some
> screenshots/pictures for the architecture / BSP model.
> One last thing regards a technical point: it may be good if we could define
> a Maven profile to automatically start a Hama cluster from Maven but we
> should decide if / how to do that; this would allow the user to do a SVN
> checkout, run the Maven goal and understanding by seeing Hama working.
> Just as an example for the web interface to be started from Maven, we could
> use the Maven Jetty plugin [1].
> I hope this helps but I look forward to ear other people opinions and
> points.
> Have a nice day.
> Tommaso
>
> [1] : http://docs.codehaus.org/display/JETTY/Maven+Jetty+Plugin
>
--
Thomas Jungblut
Berlin <th...@gmail.com>