[FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Piotr Zarzycki <pi...@gmail.com>]

Hi All,

Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting it also
here:


With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some publicity, I
want to ask the community to answer this question:

Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?

I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we are in
a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it gives
the marketing folks something to work with.


[1]
http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html

Thanks,
Piotr

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>]

Thanks for the the response. This is good stuff!

We could use all the help we can to get this right! :-)

Harbs

> On Sep 14, 2017, at 7:12 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <be...@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
> 
> I like this question. We must get this right, guys.
> 
> As a marketing guy, turned developer (sort of), it's critical to rightly
> position FlexJS in front of the competition and the (unfortunate) legacy of
> flash.
> 
> To be frank, I have not used FlexJS so far, but I'm a convinced believer in
> its potential. So here are some keywords I can think of:
> 
> "Robust"
> "Flexible"
> "Open"
> "Dynamic community"
> "Committed community"
> "The right way"
> "Embraces modern platforms"
> "HTML"
> "Powerful"
> "Built on technology that empowered the web several years back - empowered
> by the community to drive the future"
> 
> my humble 2cents...
> 
> 
> 
> Berty Tonta
> 
> ____________________________________________________________________________
> 
> 
> 
> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
> 
> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 5:38 PM, Piotr Zarzycki <pi...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
>> Hi All,
>> 
>> Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting it also
>> here:
>> 
>> 
>> With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some publicity, I
>> want to ask the community to answer this question:
>> 
>> Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
>> with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>> 
>> I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we are in
>> a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it gives
>> the marketing folks something to work with.
>> 
>> 
>> [1]
>> http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-
>> should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> Piotr
>> 

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

["Berty Tonta (Leadstalk)" <be...@leadstalk.pro>]

I like this question. We must get this right, guys.

As a marketing guy, turned developer (sort of), it's critical to rightly
position FlexJS in front of the competition and the (unfortunate) legacy of
flash.

To be frank, I have not used FlexJS so far, but I'm a convinced believer in
its potential. So here are some keywords I can think of:

"Robust"
"Flexible"
"Open"
"Dynamic community"
"Committed community"
"The right way"
"Embraces modern platforms"
"HTML"
"Powerful"
"Built on technology that empowered the web several years back - empowered
by the community to drive the future"

my humble 2cents...



Berty Tonta

____________________________________________________________________________



LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO

On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 5:38 PM, Piotr Zarzycki <pi...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting it also
> here:
>
>
> With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some publicity, I
> want to ask the community to answer this question:
>
> Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
> with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>
> I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we are in
> a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it gives
> the marketing folks something to work with.
>
>
> [1]
> http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-
> should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
>
> Thanks,
> Piotr
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Berty Tonta <be...@gmail.com>]

I'm definitely counting on FlexJS.

On Sat, Sep 16, 2017 at 3:16 AM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
wrote:

> I was hoping the Flash 2020 announcement would result in more folks saying
> "OK, no Flash after 2020, but now we need FlexJS!"  So it is useful to
> hear whether folks are counting on FlexJS or whether they are moving on to
> other options and why.  The more requests we get for FlexJS, the more
> likely it is that Adobe will continue to donate my time to FlexJS.
>
> Manually porting ActionScript business logic to some other language sounds
> resource-intensive to me.  The hope for open source is that we all band
> together and contribute what we can and collectively produce a less
> resource-intensive solution for everybody.
>
> My 2 cents,
> -Alex
>
> On 9/15/17, 3:36 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>
> >.. understood. This is still why I have FlexJS listed as incomplete with
> >missing components. It's in Beta, and Adobe (your employer no less; I bet
> >those conversations are fun at your office!) kind of dropped the ball on
> >Flash Player  before FlexJS was ready. But do they care? No, they have
> >their own HTML5 output and stuff now, and I'm not buying into it. What I
> >would have loved would have been Flex 5, outputting to JS and SWF's! I
> >don't really care 'how small' a lot of the components are now. Look where
> >Adobe went with their Spark stuff on mobile? "So small, efficient and tiny
> >for all the mobile phones!" .. and then everyone got a gig or more of RAM
> >in their phone.. But now I'm getting off topic on a Friday afternoon. None
> >of this is a slight to any of the devs; it's just where things are right
> >now, for various reasons.
> >
> >I really want to go with FlexJS, but at this point ExtJS is looking more
> >appealing (other than the cost of course) with their AMF support and their
> >component set. Maybe FlexJS will just have to be for my personal
> >projects..
> >
> >
> >On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:47 PM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
> >wrote:
> >
> >> I forgot to mention why we are building our own components.  One is to
> >>see
> >> how small we can get, but the other is to have pieces around to use to
> >> mock or replicate one platform's controls on another platform.  For
> >> example, you can't currently use the MDL components in a SWF, but you
> >>can
> >> use Jquery Button in an app that has both SWF and JS output since we've
> >> roughly emulated Jquery's Button in SWF by assembling the right beads.
> >>We
> >> could assemble the right beads for MDL components in SWF if we wanted
> >>to.
> >> And if we do get around to targeting another runtime, we should be able
> >>to
> >> reuse a lot of this code.
> >>
> >> HTH,
> >> -Alex
> >>
> >> On 9/15/17, 2:42 PM, "Alex Harui" <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
> >>
> >> >We are building our own versions of Charts and DataGrids and
> >>DatePickers.
> >> >But how robust they will be depends on customer input.  This project
> >> >doesn't currently have enough people power to try to match the feature
> >>set
> >> >of popular JS components and I'm not even clear we want to.  We should
> >> >probably try to make it simple to drop in a third-party component
> >>and/or
> >> >component set.  We've got a set for MDL and partial sets for CreateJS
> >>and
> >> >Jquery.
> >> >
> >> >At least for Jquery, we are really wrapping JQueryUI.  Jquery is its
> >>own
> >> >programming environment based on queries, AIUI.  Peter Ent did play
> >>with
> >> >ReactJS over a year ago [1] and concluded it is its own programming
> >> >environment with JSX.  But it may be possible to wrap their UI controls
> >> >like their DataGrid.
> >> >
> >> >HTH,
> >> >-Alex
> >> >
> >> >[1]
> >> >https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> >> https%3A%2F%2Flists.apa
> >> >che.org%2Fthread.html%2F32497faf105a4eeac28d082159b2
> >> 32e514f60e&data=02%7C0
> >> >1%7C%7Cc6a0dd88d34148bed35e08d4fc82aa8e%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
> >> cee1
> >> >%7C0%7C0%7C636411085523537188&sdata=PkawEZTMj7%
> >> 2BRPLGexdn2r2sV9wLfngUcwv8I
> >> >Olz9PiY%3D&reserved=0
> >> >eedd033157b46e8d3c@%3Cdev.flex.apache.org%3E
> >> >
> >> >On 9/15/17, 2:18 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>I have looked at the MDL Table, and it's going to work for most of the
> >> >>use-cases, for sure. The MDL components [1] went a long way to
> >>showing me
> >> >>what could be done in FlexJS.
> >> >>
> >> >>Using a React-based DataGrid isn't important, the important part is
> >> >>having
> >> >>an awesome datagrid to display and manipulate data. I believe it's
> >> >>possible
> >> >>in FlexJS now, but I haven't seen any awesome ones yet.
> >> >>
> >> >>Looking back (a decade..), the third party components for Flex was a
> >>big
> >> >>part of what attracted us. You could seemingly do anything, and if
> >>not,
> >> >>it
> >> >>wasn't hard to expand upon an existing component, and you didn't have
> >>to
> >> >>worry about browser compatabilities at all! It was awesome. Now? Well,
> >> >>we're looking at all the options. The biggest thing we will have to
> >>say
> >> >>goodbye to is LCDS at this point. DataServices was fun...
> >> >>
> >> >>While I'm at it - does anyone know of any good Calendar components
> >>that
> >> >>FlexJS could use? We've been using the KC-Calendar in a couple of
> >> >>projects
> >> >>for a while now, and I am not looking forward to replacing that
> >>either..
> >> >>
> >> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> >> https%3A%2F%2Fcwiki.ap
> >> >>a
> >> >>che.org%2Fconfluence%2Fdisplay%2FFLEX%2FTable%2BOf%
> >> 2BComponents&data=02%7
> >> >>C
> >>
> >>>>01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f6532%
> 7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
> >> ce
> >> >>e
> >> >>1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&sdata=ezisKITOriPDFCkEqzvOuhKTH8xNG9
> >> q6l8tg
> >> >>B
> >> >>Q9vXvw%3D&reserved=0
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:03 PM, OmPrakash Muppirala
> >> >><bi...@gmail.com>
> >> >>wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>> On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com>
> >> wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>> > I have another developer going through our apps and identifying
> >> >>> components
> >> >>> > that are potential issues going forward.
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > So far they have only found a few third-party components - so,
> >>not a
> >> >>> fault
> >> >>> > of FlexJS really.
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled
> >>with
> >> >>>the
> >> >>> > Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we
> >>use
> >> >>> that
> >> >>> > in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.
> >> >>> >
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Have you looked at the MDTable?
> >> >>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> >> http%3A%2F%2Fs.apache
> >> >>>.
> >> >>>org%2FMDLExample&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f
> >> 6532%7Cfa
> >> >>>7
> >> >>>b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&
> >> sdata=BOhWili
> >> >>>7
> >> >>>F80kAQz8h7Yu%2F4%2FEhFT60eDC2CldKHI8Q3s%3D&reserved=0
> >> >>> That is a good starting point to add more features.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Thanks,
> >> >>> Om
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's
> >> >>>motto
> >> >>> in
> >> >>> > the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end
> >> >>> result..
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui
> >> >>><ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
> >> >>> > wrote:
> >> >>> >
> >> >>> > > Hi Adam,
> >> >>> > >
> >> >>> > > What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
> >> >>> > >
> >> >>> > > Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get
> >> >>>control
> >> >>> > over
> >> >>> > > your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high
> >> >>>priority
> >> >>> > > for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in
> >>the
> >> >>> past,
> >> >>> > > you can just commit the change.
> >> >>> > >
> >> >>> > > Thanks,
> >> >>> > > -Alex
> >> >>> > >
> >> >>> > > On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
> >> >>> > >
> >> >>> > > >More strengths to add:
> >> >>> > > >- AMF support getting better
> >> >>> > > >- RemoteObject support!
> >> >>> > > >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
> >> >>> > > >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
> >> >>> > > >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
> >> >>> > > >- Works in several IDE's
> >> >>> > > >
> >> >>> > > >A few weaknesses to add:
> >> >>> > > >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not
> >>all
> >> >>>done
> >> >>> in
> >> >>> > > >FlexJS yet.
> >> >>> > > >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support
> >>is
> >> >>> > > >wonderful!)
> >> >>> > > >- Lack of documentation
> >> >>> > > >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
> >> >>> > > >
> >> >>> > > >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
> >> >>> > > >
> >> >>> > > >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to
> >> >>>React,
> >> >>> > > >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and
> >>looking
> >> >>>in
> >> >>> to
> >> >>> > > >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
> >> >>> > > >
> >> >>> > > >
> >> >>> > > >
> >> >>> > > >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
> >> >>> > > >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
> >> >>> > > >
> >> >>> > > >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing
> >>perspective,
> >> >>> would a
> >> >>> > > >>SWOT
> >> >>> > > >> help?
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the
> >> >>> reality
> >> >>> > > >>and
> >> >>> > > >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer
> >>weaknesses
> >> >>>and
> >> >>> > > >>threats
> >> >>> > > >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really
> >>makes
> >> >>> FlexJS
> >> >>> > > >>stand
> >> >>> > > >> out.
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> STRENGTH
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
> >> >>> > > >>    - Multiplatform
> >> >>> > > >>    - Open Source
> >> >>> > > >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to
> >>confirm)
> >> >>> > > >>    - ...
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> WEAKNESSES
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>    - Association with Flash
> >> >>> > > >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
> >> >>> > > >>    -
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> OPPORTUNITIES
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
> >> >>> > > >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
> >> >>> > > >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
> >> >>> > > >>    - Powered by the community
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> THREATS
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
> >> >>> > > >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
> >> >>> > > >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> Berty Tonta
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> ____________________________________________________________
> >> >>> > > >> ________________
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> >> >>> > > >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO -
> >> >>>LEADSTALK.PRO
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb
> >><modjklist@comcast.net
> >> >
> >> >>> > wrote:
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > > >> > In addition to...
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS
> >>applications,
> >> >>>and
> >> >>> > not
> >> >>> > > >>go
> >> >>> > > >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g.
> >>TypeScript/Angular?"
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That
> >>is,
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in
> >>FlexJS
> >> >>> > rather
> >> >>> > > >> than
> >> >>> > > >> > ..."
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its
> >> >>> lifecycle
> >> >>> > by
> >> >>> > > >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from
> >> >>>mainstream
> >> >>> > > >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some
> >> >>> compelling
> >> >>> > > >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
> >> >>> > > >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> > >     Hi All,
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting
> >>question.
> >> >>>I'm
> >> >>> > > >>posting
> >> >>> > > >> > it also
> >> >>> > > >> > >     here:
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most
> >>likely
> >> >>> some
> >> >>> > > >> > publicity, I
> >> >>> > > >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS
> >> >>>applications,
> >> >>> > and
> >> >>> > > >> not
> >> >>> > > >> > go
> >> >>> > > >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g.
> >> >>>TypeScript/Angular?
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a
> >> >>>compelling
> >> >>> > > >>way, we
> >> >>> > > >> > are in
> >> >>> > > >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective,
> >>at
> >> >>> least)
> >> >>> > > >>and
> >> >>> > > >> it
> >> >>> > > >> > gives
> >> >>> > > >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> > >     [1]
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> >> >>> > > http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
> >> >>> > > >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
> >> >>> > > 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
> >> >>> > > >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
> >> >>> > > 7C63641100209603241
> >> >>> > >
> >> >>>>>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
> >> >>> > > >> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-
> >> >>> > FlexJS-td64292.html
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> > >     Thanks,
> >> >>> > > >> > >     Piotr
> >> >>> > > >> > >
> >> >>> > > >> >
> >> >>> > > >>
> >> >>> > >
> >> >>> > >
> >> >>> >
> >> >>>
> >> >
> >>
> >>
>
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

I was hoping the Flash 2020 announcement would result in more folks saying
"OK, no Flash after 2020, but now we need FlexJS!"  So it is useful to
hear whether folks are counting on FlexJS or whether they are moving on to
other options and why.  The more requests we get for FlexJS, the more
likely it is that Adobe will continue to donate my time to FlexJS.

Manually porting ActionScript business logic to some other language sounds
resource-intensive to me.  The hope for open source is that we all band
together and contribute what we can and collectively produce a less
resource-intensive solution for everybody.

My 2 cents,
-Alex

On 9/15/17, 3:36 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:

>.. understood. This is still why I have FlexJS listed as incomplete with
>missing components. It's in Beta, and Adobe (your employer no less; I bet
>those conversations are fun at your office!) kind of dropped the ball on
>Flash Player  before FlexJS was ready. But do they care? No, they have
>their own HTML5 output and stuff now, and I'm not buying into it. What I
>would have loved would have been Flex 5, outputting to JS and SWF's! I
>don't really care 'how small' a lot of the components are now. Look where
>Adobe went with their Spark stuff on mobile? "So small, efficient and tiny
>for all the mobile phones!" .. and then everyone got a gig or more of RAM
>in their phone.. But now I'm getting off topic on a Friday afternoon. None
>of this is a slight to any of the devs; it's just where things are right
>now, for various reasons.
>
>I really want to go with FlexJS, but at this point ExtJS is looking more
>appealing (other than the cost of course) with their AMF support and their
>component set. Maybe FlexJS will just have to be for my personal
>projects..
>
>
>On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:47 PM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
>wrote:
>
>> I forgot to mention why we are building our own components.  One is to
>>see
>> how small we can get, but the other is to have pieces around to use to
>> mock or replicate one platform's controls on another platform.  For
>> example, you can't currently use the MDL components in a SWF, but you
>>can
>> use Jquery Button in an app that has both SWF and JS output since we've
>> roughly emulated Jquery's Button in SWF by assembling the right beads.
>>We
>> could assemble the right beads for MDL components in SWF if we wanted
>>to.
>> And if we do get around to targeting another runtime, we should be able
>>to
>> reuse a lot of this code.
>>
>> HTH,
>> -Alex
>>
>> On 9/15/17, 2:42 PM, "Alex Harui" <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
>>
>> >We are building our own versions of Charts and DataGrids and
>>DatePickers.
>> >But how robust they will be depends on customer input.  This project
>> >doesn't currently have enough people power to try to match the feature
>>set
>> >of popular JS components and I'm not even clear we want to.  We should
>> >probably try to make it simple to drop in a third-party component
>>and/or
>> >component set.  We've got a set for MDL and partial sets for CreateJS
>>and
>> >Jquery.
>> >
>> >At least for Jquery, we are really wrapping JQueryUI.  Jquery is its
>>own
>> >programming environment based on queries, AIUI.  Peter Ent did play
>>with
>> >ReactJS over a year ago [1] and concluded it is its own programming
>> >environment with JSX.  But it may be possible to wrap their UI controls
>> >like their DataGrid.
>> >
>> >HTH,
>> >-Alex
>> >
>> >[1]
>> >https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>> https%3A%2F%2Flists.apa
>> >che.org%2Fthread.html%2F32497faf105a4eeac28d082159b2
>> 32e514f60e&data=02%7C0
>> >1%7C%7Cc6a0dd88d34148bed35e08d4fc82aa8e%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
>> cee1
>> >%7C0%7C0%7C636411085523537188&sdata=PkawEZTMj7%
>> 2BRPLGexdn2r2sV9wLfngUcwv8I
>> >Olz9PiY%3D&reserved=0
>> >eedd033157b46e8d3c@%3Cdev.flex.apache.org%3E
>> >
>> >On 9/15/17, 2:18 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >>I have looked at the MDL Table, and it's going to work for most of the
>> >>use-cases, for sure. The MDL components [1] went a long way to
>>showing me
>> >>what could be done in FlexJS.
>> >>
>> >>Using a React-based DataGrid isn't important, the important part is
>> >>having
>> >>an awesome datagrid to display and manipulate data. I believe it's
>> >>possible
>> >>in FlexJS now, but I haven't seen any awesome ones yet.
>> >>
>> >>Looking back (a decade..), the third party components for Flex was a
>>big
>> >>part of what attracted us. You could seemingly do anything, and if
>>not,
>> >>it
>> >>wasn't hard to expand upon an existing component, and you didn't have
>>to
>> >>worry about browser compatabilities at all! It was awesome. Now? Well,
>> >>we're looking at all the options. The biggest thing we will have to
>>say
>> >>goodbye to is LCDS at this point. DataServices was fun...
>> >>
>> >>While I'm at it - does anyone know of any good Calendar components
>>that
>> >>FlexJS could use? We've been using the KC-Calendar in a couple of
>> >>projects
>> >>for a while now, and I am not looking forward to replacing that
>>either..
>> >>
>> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>> https%3A%2F%2Fcwiki.ap
>> >>a
>> >>che.org%2Fconfluence%2Fdisplay%2FFLEX%2FTable%2BOf%
>> 2BComponents&data=02%7
>> >>C
>> 
>>>>01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f6532%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
>> ce
>> >>e
>> >>1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&sdata=ezisKITOriPDFCkEqzvOuhKTH8xNG9
>> q6l8tg
>> >>B
>> >>Q9vXvw%3D&reserved=0
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:03 PM, OmPrakash Muppirala
>> >><bi...@gmail.com>
>> >>wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> > I have another developer going through our apps and identifying
>> >>> components
>> >>> > that are potential issues going forward.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > So far they have only found a few third-party components - so,
>>not a
>> >>> fault
>> >>> > of FlexJS really.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled
>>with
>> >>>the
>> >>> > Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we
>>use
>> >>> that
>> >>> > in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.
>> >>> >
>> >>>
>> >>> Have you looked at the MDTable?
>> >>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>> http%3A%2F%2Fs.apache
>> >>>.
>> >>>org%2FMDLExample&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f
>> 6532%7Cfa
>> >>>7
>> >>>b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&
>> sdata=BOhWili
>> >>>7
>> >>>F80kAQz8h7Yu%2F4%2FEhFT60eDC2CldKHI8Q3s%3D&reserved=0
>> >>> That is a good starting point to add more features.
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks,
>> >>> Om
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's
>> >>>motto
>> >>> in
>> >>> > the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end
>> >>> result..
>> >>> >
>> >>> > On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui
>> >>><ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
>> >>> > wrote:
>> >>> >
>> >>> > > Hi Adam,
>> >>> > >
>> >>> > > What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
>> >>> > >
>> >>> > > Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get
>> >>>control
>> >>> > over
>> >>> > > your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high
>> >>>priority
>> >>> > > for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in
>>the
>> >>> past,
>> >>> > > you can just commit the change.
>> >>> > >
>> >>> > > Thanks,
>> >>> > > -Alex
>> >>> > >
>> >>> > > On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>> >>> > >
>> >>> > > >More strengths to add:
>> >>> > > >- AMF support getting better
>> >>> > > >- RemoteObject support!
>> >>> > > >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
>> >>> > > >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
>> >>> > > >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
>> >>> > > >- Works in several IDE's
>> >>> > > >
>> >>> > > >A few weaknesses to add:
>> >>> > > >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not
>>all
>> >>>done
>> >>> in
>> >>> > > >FlexJS yet.
>> >>> > > >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support
>>is
>> >>> > > >wonderful!)
>> >>> > > >- Lack of documentation
>> >>> > > >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
>> >>> > > >
>> >>> > > >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
>> >>> > > >
>> >>> > > >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to
>> >>>React,
>> >>> > > >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and
>>looking
>> >>>in
>> >>> to
>> >>> > > >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
>> >>> > > >
>> >>> > > >
>> >>> > > >
>> >>> > > >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
>> >>> > > >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
>> >>> > > >
>> >>> > > >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing
>>perspective,
>> >>> would a
>> >>> > > >>SWOT
>> >>> > > >> help?
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the
>> >>> reality
>> >>> > > >>and
>> >>> > > >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer
>>weaknesses
>> >>>and
>> >>> > > >>threats
>> >>> > > >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really
>>makes
>> >>> FlexJS
>> >>> > > >>stand
>> >>> > > >> out.
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> STRENGTH
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
>> >>> > > >>    - Multiplatform
>> >>> > > >>    - Open Source
>> >>> > > >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to
>>confirm)
>> >>> > > >>    - ...
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> WEAKNESSES
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>    - Association with Flash
>> >>> > > >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
>> >>> > > >>    -
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> OPPORTUNITIES
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
>> >>> > > >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
>> >>> > > >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
>> >>> > > >>    - Powered by the community
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> THREATS
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
>> >>> > > >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
>> >>> > > >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> Berty Tonta
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> ____________________________________________________________
>> >>> > > >> ________________
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
>> >>> > > >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO -
>> >>>LEADSTALK.PRO
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb
>><modjklist@comcast.net
>> >
>> >>> > wrote:
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > > >> > In addition to...
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS
>>applications,
>> >>>and
>> >>> > not
>> >>> > > >>go
>> >>> > > >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g.
>>TypeScript/Angular?"
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That
>>is,
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in
>>FlexJS
>> >>> > rather
>> >>> > > >> than
>> >>> > > >> > ..."
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its
>> >>> lifecycle
>> >>> > by
>> >>> > > >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from
>> >>>mainstream
>> >>> > > >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some
>> >>> compelling
>> >>> > > >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
>> >>> > > >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> > >     Hi All,
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting
>>question.
>> >>>I'm
>> >>> > > >>posting
>> >>> > > >> > it also
>> >>> > > >> > >     here:
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most
>>likely
>> >>> some
>> >>> > > >> > publicity, I
>> >>> > > >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS
>> >>>applications,
>> >>> > and
>> >>> > > >> not
>> >>> > > >> > go
>> >>> > > >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g.
>> >>>TypeScript/Angular?
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a
>> >>>compelling
>> >>> > > >>way, we
>> >>> > > >> > are in
>> >>> > > >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective,
>>at
>> >>> least)
>> >>> > > >>and
>> >>> > > >> it
>> >>> > > >> > gives
>> >>> > > >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> > >     [1]
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>> >>> > > http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>> >>> > > >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
>> >>> > > 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
>> >>> > > >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
>> >>> > > 7C63641100209603241
>> >>> > >
>> >>>>>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
>> >>> > > >> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-
>> >>> > FlexJS-td64292.html
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> > >     Thanks,
>> >>> > > >> > >     Piotr
>> >>> > > >> > >
>> >>> > > >> >
>> >>> > > >>
>> >>> > >
>> >>> > >
>> >>> >
>> >>>
>> >
>>
>>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com>]

.. understood. This is still why I have FlexJS listed as incomplete with
missing components. It's in Beta, and Adobe (your employer no less; I bet
those conversations are fun at your office!) kind of dropped the ball on
Flash Player  before FlexJS was ready. But do they care? No, they have
their own HTML5 output and stuff now, and I'm not buying into it. What I
would have loved would have been Flex 5, outputting to JS and SWF's! I
don't really care 'how small' a lot of the components are now. Look where
Adobe went with their Spark stuff on mobile? "So small, efficient and tiny
for all the mobile phones!" .. and then everyone got a gig or more of RAM
in their phone.. But now I'm getting off topic on a Friday afternoon. None
of this is a slight to any of the devs; it's just where things are right
now, for various reasons.

I really want to go with FlexJS, but at this point ExtJS is looking more
appealing (other than the cost of course) with their AMF support and their
component set. Maybe FlexJS will just have to be for my personal projects..


On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:47 PM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
wrote:

> I forgot to mention why we are building our own components.  One is to see
> how small we can get, but the other is to have pieces around to use to
> mock or replicate one platform's controls on another platform.  For
> example, you can't currently use the MDL components in a SWF, but you can
> use Jquery Button in an app that has both SWF and JS output since we've
> roughly emulated Jquery's Button in SWF by assembling the right beads.  We
> could assemble the right beads for MDL components in SWF if we wanted to.
> And if we do get around to targeting another runtime, we should be able to
> reuse a lot of this code.
>
> HTH,
> -Alex
>
> On 9/15/17, 2:42 PM, "Alex Harui" <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:
>
> >We are building our own versions of Charts and DataGrids and DatePickers.
> >But how robust they will be depends on customer input.  This project
> >doesn't currently have enough people power to try to match the feature set
> >of popular JS components and I'm not even clear we want to.  We should
> >probably try to make it simple to drop in a third-party component and/or
> >component set.  We've got a set for MDL and partial sets for CreateJS and
> >Jquery.
> >
> >At least for Jquery, we are really wrapping JQueryUI.  Jquery is its own
> >programming environment based on queries, AIUI.  Peter Ent did play with
> >ReactJS over a year ago [1] and concluded it is its own programming
> >environment with JSX.  But it may be possible to wrap their UI controls
> >like their DataGrid.
> >
> >HTH,
> >-Alex
> >
> >[1]
> >https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Flists.apa
> >che.org%2Fthread.html%2F32497faf105a4eeac28d082159b2
> 32e514f60e&data=02%7C0
> >1%7C%7Cc6a0dd88d34148bed35e08d4fc82aa8e%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
> cee1
> >%7C0%7C0%7C636411085523537188&sdata=PkawEZTMj7%
> 2BRPLGexdn2r2sV9wLfngUcwv8I
> >Olz9PiY%3D&reserved=0
> >eedd033157b46e8d3c@%3Cdev.flex.apache.org%3E
> >
> >On 9/15/17, 2:18 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
> >
> >>I have looked at the MDL Table, and it's going to work for most of the
> >>use-cases, for sure. The MDL components [1] went a long way to showing me
> >>what could be done in FlexJS.
> >>
> >>Using a React-based DataGrid isn't important, the important part is
> >>having
> >>an awesome datagrid to display and manipulate data. I believe it's
> >>possible
> >>in FlexJS now, but I haven't seen any awesome ones yet.
> >>
> >>Looking back (a decade..), the third party components for Flex was a big
> >>part of what attracted us. You could seemingly do anything, and if not,
> >>it
> >>wasn't hard to expand upon an existing component, and you didn't have to
> >>worry about browser compatabilities at all! It was awesome. Now? Well,
> >>we're looking at all the options. The biggest thing we will have to say
> >>goodbye to is LCDS at this point. DataServices was fun...
> >>
> >>While I'm at it - does anyone know of any good Calendar components that
> >>FlexJS could use? We've been using the KC-Calendar in a couple of
> >>projects
> >>for a while now, and I am not looking forward to replacing that either..
> >>
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Fcwiki.ap
> >>a
> >>che.org%2Fconfluence%2Fdisplay%2FFLEX%2FTable%2BOf%
> 2BComponents&data=02%7
> >>C
> >>01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f6532%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
> ce
> >>e
> >>1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&sdata=ezisKITOriPDFCkEqzvOuhKTH8xNG9
> q6l8tg
> >>B
> >>Q9vXvw%3D&reserved=0
> >>
> >>
> >>On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:03 PM, OmPrakash Muppirala
> >><bi...@gmail.com>
> >>wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > I have another developer going through our apps and identifying
> >>> components
> >>> > that are potential issues going forward.
> >>> >
> >>> > So far they have only found a few third-party components - so, not a
> >>> fault
> >>> > of FlexJS really.
> >>> >
> >>> > The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled with
> >>>the
> >>> > Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we use
> >>> that
> >>> > in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>> Have you looked at the MDTable?
> >>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fs.apache
> >>>.
> >>>org%2FMDLExample&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f
> 6532%7Cfa
> >>>7
> >>>b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&
> sdata=BOhWili
> >>>7
> >>>F80kAQz8h7Yu%2F4%2FEhFT60eDC2CldKHI8Q3s%3D&reserved=0
> >>> That is a good starting point to add more features.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Om
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> >
> >>> > Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's
> >>>motto
> >>> in
> >>> > the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end
> >>> result..
> >>> >
> >>> > On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui
> >>><ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
> >>> > wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> > > Hi Adam,
> >>> > >
> >>> > > What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
> >>> > >
> >>> > > Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get
> >>>control
> >>> > over
> >>> > > your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high
> >>>priority
> >>> > > for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in the
> >>> past,
> >>> > > you can just commit the change.
> >>> > >
> >>> > > Thanks,
> >>> > > -Alex
> >>> > >
> >>> > > On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
> >>> > >
> >>> > > >More strengths to add:
> >>> > > >- AMF support getting better
> >>> > > >- RemoteObject support!
> >>> > > >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
> >>> > > >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
> >>> > > >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
> >>> > > >- Works in several IDE's
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >A few weaknesses to add:
> >>> > > >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all
> >>>done
> >>> in
> >>> > > >FlexJS yet.
> >>> > > >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
> >>> > > >wonderful!)
> >>> > > >- Lack of documentation
> >>> > > >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to
> >>>React,
> >>> > > >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking
> >>>in
> >>> to
> >>> > > >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
> >>> > > >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
> >>> > > >
> >>> > > >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective,
> >>> would a
> >>> > > >>SWOT
> >>> > > >> help?
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the
> >>> reality
> >>> > > >>and
> >>> > > >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses
> >>>and
> >>> > > >>threats
> >>> > > >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes
> >>> FlexJS
> >>> > > >>stand
> >>> > > >> out.
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> STRENGTH
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
> >>> > > >>    - Multiplatform
> >>> > > >>    - Open Source
> >>> > > >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
> >>> > > >>    - ...
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> WEAKNESSES
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>    - Association with Flash
> >>> > > >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
> >>> > > >>    -
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> OPPORTUNITIES
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
> >>> > > >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
> >>> > > >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
> >>> > > >>    - Powered by the community
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> THREATS
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
> >>> > > >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
> >>> > > >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> Berty Tonta
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> ____________________________________________________________
> >>> > > >> ________________
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> >>> > > >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO -
> >>>LEADSTALK.PRO
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <modjklist@comcast.net
> >
> >>> > wrote:
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > > >> > In addition to...
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications,
> >>>and
> >>> > not
> >>> > > >>go
> >>> > > >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS
> >>> > rather
> >>> > > >> than
> >>> > > >> > ..."
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its
> >>> lifecycle
> >>> > by
> >>> > > >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from
> >>>mainstream
> >>> > > >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some
> >>> compelling
> >>> > > >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
> >>> > > >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> > >     Hi All,
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question.
> >>>I'm
> >>> > > >>posting
> >>> > > >> > it also
> >>> > > >> > >     here:
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely
> >>> some
> >>> > > >> > publicity, I
> >>> > > >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS
> >>>applications,
> >>> > and
> >>> > > >> not
> >>> > > >> > go
> >>> > > >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g.
> >>>TypeScript/Angular?
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a
> >>>compelling
> >>> > > >>way, we
> >>> > > >> > are in
> >>> > > >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at
> >>> least)
> >>> > > >>and
> >>> > > >> it
> >>> > > >> > gives
> >>> > > >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> > >     [1]
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> >>> > > http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
> >>> > > >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
> >>> > > 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
> >>> > > >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
> >>> > > 7C63641100209603241
> >>> > >
> >>>>>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
> >>> > > >> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-
> >>> > FlexJS-td64292.html
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> > >     Thanks,
> >>> > > >> > >     Piotr
> >>> > > >> > >
> >>> > > >> >
> >>> > > >>
> >>> > >
> >>> > >
> >>> >
> >>>
> >
>
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

I forgot to mention why we are building our own components.  One is to see
how small we can get, but the other is to have pieces around to use to
mock or replicate one platform's controls on another platform.  For
example, you can't currently use the MDL components in a SWF, but you can
use Jquery Button in an app that has both SWF and JS output since we've
roughly emulated Jquery's Button in SWF by assembling the right beads.  We
could assemble the right beads for MDL components in SWF if we wanted to.
And if we do get around to targeting another runtime, we should be able to
reuse a lot of this code.

HTH,
-Alex

On 9/15/17, 2:42 PM, "Alex Harui" <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:

>We are building our own versions of Charts and DataGrids and DatePickers.
>But how robust they will be depends on customer input.  This project
>doesn't currently have enough people power to try to match the feature set
>of popular JS components and I'm not even clear we want to.  We should
>probably try to make it simple to drop in a third-party component and/or
>component set.  We've got a set for MDL and partial sets for CreateJS and
>Jquery.
>
>At least for Jquery, we are really wrapping JQueryUI.  Jquery is its own
>programming environment based on queries, AIUI.  Peter Ent did play with
>ReactJS over a year ago [1] and concluded it is its own programming
>environment with JSX.  But it may be possible to wrap their UI controls
>like their DataGrid.
>
>HTH,
>-Alex
>
>[1] 
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.apa
>che.org%2Fthread.html%2F32497faf105a4eeac28d082159b232e514f60e&data=02%7C0
>1%7C%7Cc6a0dd88d34148bed35e08d4fc82aa8e%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1
>%7C0%7C0%7C636411085523537188&sdata=PkawEZTMj7%2BRPLGexdn2r2sV9wLfngUcwv8I
>Olz9PiY%3D&reserved=0
>eedd033157b46e8d3c@%3Cdev.flex.apache.org%3E
>
>On 9/15/17, 2:18 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>
>>I have looked at the MDL Table, and it's going to work for most of the
>>use-cases, for sure. The MDL components [1] went a long way to showing me
>>what could be done in FlexJS.
>>
>>Using a React-based DataGrid isn't important, the important part is
>>having
>>an awesome datagrid to display and manipulate data. I believe it's
>>possible
>>in FlexJS now, but I haven't seen any awesome ones yet.
>>
>>Looking back (a decade..), the third party components for Flex was a big
>>part of what attracted us. You could seemingly do anything, and if not,
>>it
>>wasn't hard to expand upon an existing component, and you didn't have to
>>worry about browser compatabilities at all! It was awesome. Now? Well,
>>we're looking at all the options. The biggest thing we will have to say
>>goodbye to is LCDS at this point. DataServices was fun...
>>
>>While I'm at it - does anyone know of any good Calendar components that
>>FlexJS could use? We've been using the KC-Calendar in a couple of
>>projects
>>for a while now, and I am not looking forward to replacing that either..
>>
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcwiki.ap
>>a
>>che.org%2Fconfluence%2Fdisplay%2FFLEX%2FTable%2BOf%2BComponents&data=02%7
>>C
>>01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f6532%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178dece
>>e
>>1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&sdata=ezisKITOriPDFCkEqzvOuhKTH8xNG9q6l8tg
>>B
>>Q9vXvw%3D&reserved=0
>>
>>
>>On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:03 PM, OmPrakash Muppirala
>><bi...@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > I have another developer going through our apps and identifying
>>> components
>>> > that are potential issues going forward.
>>> >
>>> > So far they have only found a few third-party components - so, not a
>>> fault
>>> > of FlexJS really.
>>> >
>>> > The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled with
>>>the
>>> > Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we use
>>> that
>>> > in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.
>>> >
>>>
>>> Have you looked at the MDTable?
>>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fs.apache
>>>.
>>>org%2FMDLExample&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f6532%7Cfa
>>>7
>>>b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&sdata=BOhWili
>>>7
>>>F80kAQz8h7Yu%2F4%2FEhFT60eDC2CldKHI8Q3s%3D&reserved=0
>>> That is a good starting point to add more features.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Om
>>>
>>>
>>> >
>>> > Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's
>>>motto
>>> in
>>> > the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end
>>> result..
>>> >
>>> > On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui
>>><ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> > > Hi Adam,
>>> > >
>>> > > What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
>>> > >
>>> > > Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get
>>>control
>>> > over
>>> > > your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high
>>>priority
>>> > > for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in the
>>> past,
>>> > > you can just commit the change.
>>> > >
>>> > > Thanks,
>>> > > -Alex
>>> > >
>>> > > On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>>> > >
>>> > > >More strengths to add:
>>> > > >- AMF support getting better
>>> > > >- RemoteObject support!
>>> > > >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
>>> > > >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
>>> > > >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
>>> > > >- Works in several IDE's
>>> > > >
>>> > > >A few weaknesses to add:
>>> > > >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all
>>>done
>>> in
>>> > > >FlexJS yet.
>>> > > >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
>>> > > >wonderful!)
>>> > > >- Lack of documentation
>>> > > >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
>>> > > >
>>> > > >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
>>> > > >
>>> > > >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to
>>>React,
>>> > > >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking
>>>in
>>> to
>>> > > >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
>>> > > >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
>>> > > >
>>> > > >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective,
>>> would a
>>> > > >>SWOT
>>> > > >> help?
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the
>>> reality
>>> > > >>and
>>> > > >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses
>>>and
>>> > > >>threats
>>> > > >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes
>>> FlexJS
>>> > > >>stand
>>> > > >> out.
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> STRENGTH
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
>>> > > >>    - Multiplatform
>>> > > >>    - Open Source
>>> > > >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
>>> > > >>    - ...
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> WEAKNESSES
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>    - Association with Flash
>>> > > >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
>>> > > >>    -
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> OPPORTUNITIES
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
>>> > > >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
>>> > > >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
>>> > > >>    - Powered by the community
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> THREATS
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
>>> > > >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
>>> > > >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> Berty Tonta
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> ____________________________________________________________
>>> > > >> ________________
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
>>> > > >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO -
>>>LEADSTALK.PRO
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net>
>>> > wrote:
>>> > > >>
>>> > > >> > In addition to...
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications,
>>>and
>>> > not
>>> > > >>go
>>> > > >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS
>>> > rather
>>> > > >> than
>>> > > >> > ..."
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its
>>> lifecycle
>>> > by
>>> > > >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from
>>>mainstream
>>> > > >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some
>>> compelling
>>> > > >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
>>> > > >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> > >     Hi All,
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question.
>>>I'm
>>> > > >>posting
>>> > > >> > it also
>>> > > >> > >     here:
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely
>>> some
>>> > > >> > publicity, I
>>> > > >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS
>>>applications,
>>> > and
>>> > > >> not
>>> > > >> > go
>>> > > >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g.
>>>TypeScript/Angular?
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a
>>>compelling
>>> > > >>way, we
>>> > > >> > are in
>>> > > >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at
>>> least)
>>> > > >>and
>>> > > >> it
>>> > > >> > gives
>>> > > >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> > >     [1]
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>>> > > http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>>> > > >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
>>> > > 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
>>> > > >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
>>> > > 7C63641100209603241
>>> > > 
>>>>>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
>>> > > >> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-
>>> > FlexJS-td64292.html
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> > >     Thanks,
>>> > > >> > >     Piotr
>>> > > >> > >
>>> > > >> >
>>> > > >>
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> >
>>>
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

We are building our own versions of Charts and DataGrids and DatePickers.
But how robust they will be depends on customer input.  This project
doesn't currently have enough people power to try to match the feature set
of popular JS components and I'm not even clear we want to.  We should
probably try to make it simple to drop in a third-party component and/or
component set.  We've got a set for MDL and partial sets for CreateJS and
Jquery.

At least for Jquery, we are really wrapping JQueryUI.  Jquery is its own
programming environment based on queries, AIUI.  Peter Ent did play with
ReactJS over a year ago [1] and concluded it is its own programming
environment with JSX.  But it may be possible to wrap their UI controls
like their DataGrid.

HTH,
-Alex

[1] 
https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/32497faf105a4eeac28d082159b232e514f60e
eedd033157b46e8d3c@%3Cdev.flex.apache.org%3E

On 9/15/17, 2:18 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:

>I have looked at the MDL Table, and it's going to work for most of the
>use-cases, for sure. The MDL components [1] went a long way to showing me
>what could be done in FlexJS.
>
>Using a React-based DataGrid isn't important, the important part is having
>an awesome datagrid to display and manipulate data. I believe it's
>possible
>in FlexJS now, but I haven't seen any awesome ones yet.
>
>Looking back (a decade..), the third party components for Flex was a big
>part of what attracted us. You could seemingly do anything, and if not, it
>wasn't hard to expand upon an existing component, and you didn't have to
>worry about browser compatabilities at all! It was awesome. Now? Well,
>we're looking at all the options. The biggest thing we will have to say
>goodbye to is LCDS at this point. DataServices was fun...
>
>While I'm at it - does anyone know of any good Calendar components that
>FlexJS could use? We've been using the KC-Calendar in a couple of projects
>for a while now, and I am not looking forward to replacing that either..
>
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcwiki.apa
>che.org%2Fconfluence%2Fdisplay%2FFLEX%2FTable%2BOf%2BComponents&data=02%7C
>01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f6532%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee
>1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&sdata=ezisKITOriPDFCkEqzvOuhKTH8xNG9q6l8tgB
>Q9vXvw%3D&reserved=0
>
>
>On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:03 PM, OmPrakash Muppirala
><bi...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>>
>> > I have another developer going through our apps and identifying
>> components
>> > that are potential issues going forward.
>> >
>> > So far they have only found a few third-party components - so, not a
>> fault
>> > of FlexJS really.
>> >
>> > The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled with
>>the
>> > Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we use
>> that
>> > in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.
>> >
>>
>> Have you looked at the MDTable?
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fs.apache.
>>org%2FMDLExample&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cbe25aba0e8b440eba51808d4fc7f6532%7Cfa7
>>b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636411071471715569&sdata=BOhWili7
>>F80kAQz8h7Yu%2F4%2FEhFT60eDC2CldKHI8Q3s%3D&reserved=0
>> That is a good starting point to add more features.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Om
>>
>>
>> >
>> > Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's
>>motto
>> in
>> > the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end
>> result..
>> >
>> > On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hi Adam,
>> > >
>> > > What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
>> > >
>> > > Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get
>>control
>> > over
>> > > your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high
>>priority
>> > > for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in the
>> past,
>> > > you can just commit the change.
>> > >
>> > > Thanks,
>> > > -Alex
>> > >
>> > > On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > >More strengths to add:
>> > > >- AMF support getting better
>> > > >- RemoteObject support!
>> > > >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
>> > > >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
>> > > >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
>> > > >- Works in several IDE's
>> > > >
>> > > >A few weaknesses to add:
>> > > >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all
>>done
>> in
>> > > >FlexJS yet.
>> > > >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
>> > > >wonderful!)
>> > > >- Lack of documentation
>> > > >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
>> > > >
>> > > >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
>> > > >
>> > > >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to React,
>> > > >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking
>>in
>> to
>> > > >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
>> > > >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective,
>> would a
>> > > >>SWOT
>> > > >> help?
>> > > >>
>> > > >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the
>> reality
>> > > >>and
>> > > >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses
>>and
>> > > >>threats
>> > > >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
>> > > >>
>> > > >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes
>> FlexJS
>> > > >>stand
>> > > >> out.
>> > > >>
>> > > >> STRENGTH
>> > > >>
>> > > >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
>> > > >>    - Multiplatform
>> > > >>    - Open Source
>> > > >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
>> > > >>    - ...
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> WEAKNESSES
>> > > >>
>> > > >>    - Association with Flash
>> > > >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
>> > > >>    -
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> OPPORTUNITIES
>> > > >>
>> > > >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
>> > > >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
>> > > >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
>> > > >>    - Powered by the community
>> > > >>
>> > > >> THREATS
>> > > >>
>> > > >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
>> > > >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
>> > > >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> Berty Tonta
>> > > >>
>> > > >> ____________________________________________________________
>> > > >> ________________
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >>
>> > > >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
>> > > >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
>> > > >>
>> > > >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net>
>> > wrote:
>> > > >>
>> > > >> > In addition to...
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications,
>>and
>> > not
>> > > >>go
>> > > >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS
>> > rather
>> > > >> than
>> > > >> > ..."
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its
>> lifecycle
>> > by
>> > > >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from
>>mainstream
>> > > >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some
>> compelling
>> > > >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> >
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
>> > > >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> > >     Hi All,
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question.
>>I'm
>> > > >>posting
>> > > >> > it also
>> > > >> > >     here:
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely
>> some
>> > > >> > publicity, I
>> > > >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS
>>applications,
>> > and
>> > > >> not
>> > > >> > go
>> > > >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g.
>>TypeScript/Angular?
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a
>>compelling
>> > > >>way, we
>> > > >> > are in
>> > > >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at
>> least)
>> > > >>and
>> > > >> it
>> > > >> > gives
>> > > >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> > >     [1]
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>> > > http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>> > > >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
>> > > 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
>> > > >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
>> > > 7C63641100209603241
>> > > >>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
>> > > >> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-
>> > FlexJS-td64292.html
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> > >     Thanks,
>> > > >> > >     Piotr
>> > > >> > >
>> > > >> >
>> > > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com>]

I have looked at the MDL Table, and it's going to work for most of the
use-cases, for sure. The MDL components [1] went a long way to showing me
what could be done in FlexJS.

Using a React-based DataGrid isn't important, the important part is having
an awesome datagrid to display and manipulate data. I believe it's possible
in FlexJS now, but I haven't seen any awesome ones yet.

Looking back (a decade..), the third party components for Flex was a big
part of what attracted us. You could seemingly do anything, and if not, it
wasn't hard to expand upon an existing component, and you didn't have to
worry about browser compatabilities at all! It was awesome. Now? Well,
we're looking at all the options. The biggest thing we will have to say
goodbye to is LCDS at this point. DataServices was fun...

While I'm at it - does anyone know of any good Calendar components that
FlexJS could use? We've been using the KC-Calendar in a couple of projects
for a while now, and I am not looking forward to replacing that either..

https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/FLEX/Table+Of+Components


On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 3:03 PM, OmPrakash Muppirala <bi...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>
> > I have another developer going through our apps and identifying
> components
> > that are potential issues going forward.
> >
> > So far they have only found a few third-party components - so, not a
> fault
> > of FlexJS really.
> >
> > The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled with the
> > Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we use
> that
> > in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.
> >
>
> Have you looked at the MDTable? http://s.apache.org/MDLExample
> That is a good starting point to add more features.
>
> Thanks,
> Om
>
>
> >
> > Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's motto
> in
> > the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end
> result..
> >
> > On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Adam,
> > >
> > > What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
> > >
> > > Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get control
> > over
> > > your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high priority
> > > for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in the
> past,
> > > you can just commit the change.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > -Alex
> > >
> > > On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > >More strengths to add:
> > > >- AMF support getting better
> > > >- RemoteObject support!
> > > >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
> > > >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
> > > >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
> > > >- Works in several IDE's
> > > >
> > > >A few weaknesses to add:
> > > >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all done
> in
> > > >FlexJS yet.
> > > >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
> > > >wonderful!)
> > > >- Lack of documentation
> > > >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
> > > >
> > > >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
> > > >
> > > >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to React,
> > > >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking in
> to
> > > >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
> > > >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective,
> would a
> > > >>SWOT
> > > >> help?
> > > >>
> > > >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the
> reality
> > > >>and
> > > >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and
> > > >>threats
> > > >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
> > > >>
> > > >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes
> FlexJS
> > > >>stand
> > > >> out.
> > > >>
> > > >> STRENGTH
> > > >>
> > > >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
> > > >>    - Multiplatform
> > > >>    - Open Source
> > > >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
> > > >>    - ...
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> WEAKNESSES
> > > >>
> > > >>    - Association with Flash
> > > >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
> > > >>    -
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> OPPORTUNITIES
> > > >>
> > > >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
> > > >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
> > > >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
> > > >>    - Powered by the community
> > > >>
> > > >> THREATS
> > > >>
> > > >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
> > > >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
> > > >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> Berty Tonta
> > > >>
> > > >> ____________________________________________________________
> > > >> ________________
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> > > >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
> > > >>
> > > >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net>
> > wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> > In addition to...
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and
> > not
> > > >>go
> > > >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS
> > rather
> > > >> than
> > > >> > ..."
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its
> lifecycle
> > by
> > > >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
> > > >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some
> compelling
> > > >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
> > > >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >     Hi All,
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm
> > > >>posting
> > > >> > it also
> > > >> > >     here:
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely
> some
> > > >> > publicity, I
> > > >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications,
> > and
> > > >> not
> > > >> > go
> > > >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling
> > > >>way, we
> > > >> > are in
> > > >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at
> least)
> > > >>and
> > > >> it
> > > >> > gives
> > > >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >     [1]
> > > >> > >
> > > >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> > > http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
> > > >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
> > > 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
> > > >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
> > > 7C63641100209603241
> > > >>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
> > > >> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-
> > FlexJS-td64292.html
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >     Thanks,
> > > >> > >     Piotr
> > > >> > >
> > > >> >
> > > >>
> > >
> > >
> >
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[OmPrakash Muppirala <bi...@gmail.com>]

On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:53 PM, Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:

> I have another developer going through our apps and identifying components
> that are potential issues going forward.
>
> So far they have only found a few third-party components - so, not a fault
> of FlexJS really.
>
> The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled with the
> Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we use that
> in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.
>

Have you looked at the MDTable? http://s.apache.org/MDLExample
That is a good starting point to add more features.

Thanks,
Om


>
> Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's motto in
> the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end result..
>
> On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi Adam,
> >
> > What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
> >
> > Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get control
> over
> > your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high priority
> > for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in the past,
> > you can just commit the change.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > -Alex
> >
> > On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
> >
> > >More strengths to add:
> > >- AMF support getting better
> > >- RemoteObject support!
> > >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
> > >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
> > >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
> > >- Works in several IDE's
> > >
> > >A few weaknesses to add:
> > >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all done in
> > >FlexJS yet.
> > >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
> > >wonderful!)
> > >- Lack of documentation
> > >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
> > >
> > >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
> > >
> > >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to React,
> > >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking in to
> > >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
> > >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
> > >
> > >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective, would a
> > >>SWOT
> > >> help?
> > >>
> > >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the reality
> > >>and
> > >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and
> > >>threats
> > >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
> > >>
> > >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes FlexJS
> > >>stand
> > >> out.
> > >>
> > >> STRENGTH
> > >>
> > >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
> > >>    - Multiplatform
> > >>    - Open Source
> > >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
> > >>    - ...
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> WEAKNESSES
> > >>
> > >>    - Association with Flash
> > >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
> > >>    -
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> OPPORTUNITIES
> > >>
> > >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
> > >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
> > >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
> > >>    - Powered by the community
> > >>
> > >> THREATS
> > >>
> > >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
> > >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
> > >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Berty Tonta
> > >>
> > >> ____________________________________________________________
> > >> ________________
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> > >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
> > >>
> > >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > In addition to...
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and
> not
> > >>go
> > >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS
> rather
> > >> than
> > >> > ..."
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its lifecycle
> by
> > >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
> > >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling
> > >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
> > >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >> > >
> > >> > >     Hi All,
> > >> > >
> > >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm
> > >>posting
> > >> > it also
> > >> > >     here:
> > >> > >
> > >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
> > >> > publicity, I
> > >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> > >> > >
> > >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications,
> and
> > >> not
> > >> > go
> > >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
> > >> > >
> > >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling
> > >>way, we
> > >> > are in
> > >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least)
> > >>and
> > >> it
> > >> > gives
> > >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
> > >> > >
> > >> > >     [1]
> > >> > >
> > >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> > http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
> > >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
> > 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
> > >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
> > 7C63641100209603241
> > >>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
> > >> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-
> FlexJS-td64292.html
> > >> > >
> > >> > >     Thanks,
> > >> > >     Piotr
> > >> > >
> > >> >
> > >>
> >
> >
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

Hi Adam,

If using a React-based DataGrid is important to you, and that will get you
involved as a contributor, we can try to help you make that happen.

Let us know,
-Alex

On 9/15/17, 1:53 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:

>I have another developer going through our apps and identifying components
>that are potential issues going forward.
>
>So far they have only found a few third-party components - so, not a fault
>of FlexJS really.
>
>The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled with the
>Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we use that
>in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.
>
>Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's motto in
>the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end result..
>
>On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
>wrote:
>
>> Hi Adam,
>>
>> What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
>>
>> Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get control
>>over
>> your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high priority
>> for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in the
>>past,
>> you can just commit the change.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> -Alex
>>
>> On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>>
>> >More strengths to add:
>> >- AMF support getting better
>> >- RemoteObject support!
>> >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
>> >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
>> >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
>> >- Works in several IDE's
>> >
>> >A few weaknesses to add:
>> >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all done
>>in
>> >FlexJS yet.
>> >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
>> >wonderful!)
>> >- Lack of documentation
>> >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
>> >
>> >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
>> >
>> >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to React,
>> >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking in
>>to
>> >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
>> >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
>> >
>> >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective, would
>>a
>> >>SWOT
>> >> help?
>> >>
>> >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the reality
>> >>and
>> >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and
>> >>threats
>> >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
>> >>
>> >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes FlexJS
>> >>stand
>> >> out.
>> >>
>> >> STRENGTH
>> >>
>> >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
>> >>    - Multiplatform
>> >>    - Open Source
>> >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
>> >>    - ...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> WEAKNESSES
>> >>
>> >>    - Association with Flash
>> >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
>> >>    -
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> OPPORTUNITIES
>> >>
>> >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
>> >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
>> >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
>> >>    - Powered by the community
>> >>
>> >> THREATS
>> >>
>> >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
>> >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
>> >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Berty Tonta
>> >>
>> >> ____________________________________________________________
>> >> ________________
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
>> >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net>
>>wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > In addition to...
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and
>>not
>> >>go
>> >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS
>>rather
>> >> than
>> >> > ..."
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its
>>lifecycle by
>> >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
>> >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling
>> >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
>> >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> > >
>> >> > >     Hi All,
>> >> > >
>> >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm
>> >>posting
>> >> > it also
>> >> > >     here:
>> >> > >
>> >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
>> >> > publicity, I
>> >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
>> >> > >
>> >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications,
>>and
>> >> not
>> >> > go
>> >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>> >> > >
>> >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling
>> >>way, we
>> >> > are in
>> >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least)
>> >>and
>> >> it
>> >> > gives
>> >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
>> >> > >
>> >> > >     [1]
>> >> > >
>> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
>> http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>> >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
>> 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
>> >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
>> 7C63641100209603241
>> >>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
>> >> > 
>>com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
>> >> > >
>> >> > >     Thanks,
>> >> > >     Piotr
>> >> > >
>> >> >
>> >>
>>
>>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com>]

I have another developer going through our apps and identifying components
that are potential issues going forward.

So far they have only found a few third-party components - so, not a fault
of FlexJS really.

The datagrid is a little lacking as well; we have been spoiled with the
Flexicious one, and they have gone with a new React one... can we use that
in FlexJS? Haven't tried yet.

Giving the 'freedom to not care about JS' should have been Flex's motto in
the beginning! Now FlexJS has to care about it, as that's the end result..

On Fri, Sep 15, 2017 at 1:28 PM, Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>
wrote:

> Hi Adam,
>
> What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?
>
> Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get control over
> your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high priority
> for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in the past,
> you can just commit the change.
>
> Thanks,
> -Alex
>
> On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:
>
> >More strengths to add:
> >- AMF support getting better
> >- RemoteObject support!
> >- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
> >- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
> >- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
> >- Works in several IDE's
> >
> >A few weaknesses to add:
> >- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all done in
> >FlexJS yet.
> >- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
> >wonderful!)
> >- Lack of documentation
> >- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
> >
> >I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
> >
> >Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to React,
> >Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking in to
> >all of our options, of which there are many these days.
> >
> >
> >
> >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
> >berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
> >
> >> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective, would a
> >>SWOT
> >> help?
> >>
> >> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the reality
> >>and
> >> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and
> >>threats
> >> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
> >>
> >> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes FlexJS
> >>stand
> >> out.
> >>
> >> STRENGTH
> >>
> >>    - Robust AS3 foundations
> >>    - Multiplatform
> >>    - Open Source
> >>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
> >>    - ...
> >>
> >>
> >> WEAKNESSES
> >>
> >>    - Association with Flash
> >>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
> >>    -
> >>
> >>
> >> OPPORTUNITIES
> >>
> >>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
> >>    - A potential enterprise class solution
> >>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
> >>    - Powered by the community
> >>
> >> THREATS
> >>
> >>    - Other "native" JS platforms
> >>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
> >>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Berty Tonta
> >>
> >> ____________________________________________________________
> >> ________________
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
> >>
> >> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> > In addition to...
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not
> >>go
> >> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS rather
> >> than
> >> > ..."
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > The company will need to support their app throughout its lifecycle by
> >> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
> >> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling
> >> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > >
> >> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
> >> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > >     Hi All,
> >> > >
> >> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm
> >>posting
> >> > it also
> >> > >     here:
> >> > >
> >> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
> >> > publicity, I
> >> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> >> > >
> >> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and
> >> not
> >> > go
> >> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
> >> > >
> >> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling
> >>way, we
> >> > are in
> >> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least)
> >>and
> >> it
> >> > gives
> >> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
> >> > >
> >> > >     [1]
> >> > >
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
> >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
> 7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
> >>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
> 7C63641100209603241
> >>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
> >> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
> >> > >
> >> > >     Thanks,
> >> > >     Piotr
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
>
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

Hi Adam,

What components are you looking for that haven't been done yet?

Again, the supposed advantage of contributing is that you get control over
your destiny.  If there is a bug in the framework that is high priority
for you and you have earned committer status by contributing in the past,
you can just commit the change.

Thanks,
-Alex

On 9/15/17, 12:22 PM, "Adam Malejko" <ad...@malejko.com> wrote:

>More strengths to add:
>- AMF support getting better
>- RemoteObject support!
>- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
>- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
>- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
>- Works in several IDE's
>
>A few weaknesses to add:
>- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all done in
>FlexJS yet.
>- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
>wonderful!)
>- Lack of documentation
>- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks
>
>I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.
>
>Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to React,
>Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking in to
>all of our options, of which there are many these days.
>
>
>
>On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
>berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:
>
>> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective, would a
>>SWOT
>> help?
>>
>> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the reality
>>and
>> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and
>>threats
>> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
>>
>> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes FlexJS
>>stand
>> out.
>>
>> STRENGTH
>>
>>    - Robust AS3 foundations
>>    - Multiplatform
>>    - Open Source
>>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
>>    - ...
>>
>>
>> WEAKNESSES
>>
>>    - Association with Flash
>>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
>>    -
>>
>>
>> OPPORTUNITIES
>>
>>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
>>    - A potential enterprise class solution
>>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
>>    - Powered by the community
>>
>> THREATS
>>
>>    - Other "native" JS platforms
>>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
>>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Berty Tonta
>>
>> ____________________________________________________________
>> ________________
>>
>>
>>
>> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
>> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>> > In addition to...
>> >
>> >
>> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not
>>go
>> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
>> >
>> >
>> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
>> >
>> >
>> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS rather
>> than
>> > ..."
>> >
>> >
>> > The company will need to support their app throughout its lifecycle by
>> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
>> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling
>> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > >
>> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
>> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > >     Hi All,
>> > >
>> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm
>>posting
>> > it also
>> > >     here:
>> > >
>> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
>> > publicity, I
>> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
>> > >
>> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and
>> not
>> > go
>> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>> > >
>> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling
>>way, we
>> > are in
>> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least)
>>and
>> it
>> > gives
>> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
>> > >
>> > >     [1]
>> > >     
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdab072253c474bc9c0dc08
>>d4fc6f3d48%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C63641100209603241
>>9&sdata=Z5wdmDlGuaDWy96FIy0Q4UaBCfOWAMctoTgATFbHIaY%3D&reserved=0.
>> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
>> > >
>> > >     Thanks,
>> > >     Piotr
>> > >
>> >
>>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Adam Malejko <ad...@malejko.com>]

More strengths to add:
- AMF support getting better
- RemoteObject support!
- Less to re-write when porting Flex apps
- Can use other JS components (with caveats, unfortunately)
- Type-checking, SWF output and validation
- Works in several IDE's

A few weaknesses to add:
- It's not done yet. The components we use from Flex are not all done in
FlexJS yet.
- No commercial support if you want it (but the Apache support is
wonderful!)
- Lack of documentation
- Smaller community than some of the bigger JS frameworks

I like the Opportunities listed, and the Threats I agree with.

Yes, we could volunteer to contribute; or we could switch to React,
Angular, ExtJS, or something else.. we're on the fence and looking in to
all of our options, of which there are many these days.



On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:46 PM, Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <
berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro> wrote:

> If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective, would a SWOT
> help?
>
> The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the reality and
> then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and threats
> and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
>
> We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes FlexJS stand
> out.
>
> STRENGTH
>
>    - Robust AS3 foundations
>    - Multiplatform
>    - Open Source
>    - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
>    - ...
>
>
> WEAKNESSES
>
>    - Association with Flash
>    - Abandoned by Adobe???
>    -
>
>
> OPPORTUNITIES
>
>    - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
>    - A potential enterprise class solution
>    - Rebirth into an open source platform
>    - Powered by the community
>
> THREATS
>
>    - Other "native" JS platforms
>    - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
>    - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
>
>
>
>
>
> Berty Tonta
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> ________________
>
>
>
> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
>
> On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > In addition to...
> >
> >
> > "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
> > with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
> >
> >
> > it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
> >
> >
> > "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS rather
> than
> > ..."
> >
> >
> > The company will need to support their app throughout its lifecycle by
> > hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
> > technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling
> > business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >     Hi All,
> > >
> > >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting
> > it also
> > >     here:
> > >
> > >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
> > publicity, I
> > >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> > >
> > >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and
> not
> > go
> > >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
> > >
> > >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we
> > are in
> > >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and
> it
> > gives
> > >     the marketing folks something to work with.
> > >
> > >     [1]
> > >     http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.
> > com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
> > >
> > >     Thanks,
> > >     Piotr
> > >
> >
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Carlos Rovira <ca...@codeoscopic.com>]

Hi Berty,

very interesting thoughts to think about.

Thanks for sharing!

2017-09-15 20:26 GMT+02:00 Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.invalid>:

> Hi Berty,
>
> Thanks for that analysis.  I will try to make sure others have seen this.
>
> -Alex
>
> On 9/14/17, 9:46 PM, "Berty Tonta (Leadstalk)" <be...@leadstalk.pro>
> wrote:
>
> >If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective, would a
> >SWOT
> >help?
> >
> >The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the reality and
> >then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and
> >threats
> >and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
> >
> >We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes FlexJS
> >stand
> >out.
> >
> >STRENGTH
> >
> >   - Robust AS3 foundations
> >   - Multiplatform
> >   - Open Source
> >   - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
> >   - ...
> >
> >
> >WEAKNESSES
> >
> >   - Association with Flash
> >   - Abandoned by Adobe???
> >   -
> >
> >
> >OPPORTUNITIES
> >
> >   - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
> >   - A potential enterprise class solution
> >   - Rebirth into an open source platform
> >   - Powered by the community
> >
> >THREATS
> >
> >   - Other "native" JS platforms
> >   - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
> >   - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Berty Tonta
> >
> >___________________________________________________________
> _______________
> >__
> >
> >
> >
> >LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> >TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
> >
> >On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >
> >> In addition to...
> >>
> >>
> >> "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
> >> with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
> >>
> >>
> >> it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
> >>
> >>
> >> "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS rather
> >>than
> >> ..."
> >>
> >>
> >> The company will need to support their app throughout its lifecycle by
> >> hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
> >> technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling
> >> business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
> >> piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >     Hi All,
> >> >
> >> >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting
> >> it also
> >> >     here:
> >> >
> >> >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
> >> publicity, I
> >> >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> >> >
> >> >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and
> >>not
> >> go
> >> >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
> >> >
> >> >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way,
> >>we
> >> are in
> >> >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and
> >>it
> >> gives
> >> >     the marketing folks something to work with.
> >> >
> >> >     [1]
> >> >
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
> >>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%
> 7Cf6e78ad817e14216650308
> >>d4fbff5317%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
> 7C63641052141052364
> >>9&sdata=IVc0uuvzVjWhJZbIsmRfIVlRV9SSqoAvP%2BJPRIHwXnw%3D&reserved=0.
> >> com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
> >> >
> >> >     Thanks,
> >> >     Piotr
> >> >
> >>
>
>


-- 

<http://www.codeoscopic.com>

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: +34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com

http://www.avant2.es


Conocenos en 1 minuto! <https://youtu.be/P2IEAYDG5HU>


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Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

Hi Berty,

Thanks for that analysis.  I will try to make sure others have seen this.

-Alex

On 9/14/17, 9:46 PM, "Berty Tonta (Leadstalk)" <be...@leadstalk.pro>
wrote:

>If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective, would a
>SWOT
>help?
>
>The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the reality and
>then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and
>threats
>and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.
>
>We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes FlexJS
>stand
>out.
>
>STRENGTH
>
>   - Robust AS3 foundations
>   - Multiplatform
>   - Open Source
>   - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
>   - ...
>
>
>WEAKNESSES
>
>   - Association with Flash
>   - Abandoned by Adobe???
>   -
>
>
>OPPORTUNITIES
>
>   - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
>   - A potential enterprise class solution
>   - Rebirth into an open source platform
>   - Powered by the community
>
>THREATS
>
>   - Other "native" JS platforms
>   - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
>   - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy
>
>
>
>
>
>Berty Tonta
>
>__________________________________________________________________________
>__
>
>
>
>LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
>TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
>
>On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>> In addition to...
>>
>>
>> "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
>> with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
>>
>>
>> it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
>>
>>
>> "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS rather
>>than
>> ..."
>>
>>
>> The company will need to support their app throughout its lifecycle by
>> hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
>> technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling
>> business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
>>
>>
>>
>> >
>> >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
>> piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >     Hi All,
>> >
>> >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting
>> it also
>> >     here:
>> >
>> >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
>> publicity, I
>> >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
>> >
>> >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and
>>not
>> go
>> >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>> >
>> >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way,
>>we
>> are in
>> >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and
>>it
>> gives
>> >     the marketing folks something to work with.
>> >
>> >     [1]
>> >     
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>>ex-development.2333347.n4.nabble&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cf6e78ad817e14216650308
>>d4fbff5317%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C63641052141052364
>>9&sdata=IVc0uuvzVjWhJZbIsmRfIVlRV9SSqoAvP%2BJPRIHwXnw%3D&reserved=0.
>> com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
>> >
>> >     Thanks,
>> >     Piotr
>> >
>>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

["Berty Tonta (Leadstalk)" <be...@leadstalk.pro>]

If it has not been done yet, and from a marketing perspective, would a SWOT
help?

The point of the SWOT (example below) would be to look at the reality and
then identify those engaging arguments to (1) answer weaknesses and threats
and (2) leverage on Strength and opportunities.

We could then select the 3 - 4 key arguments that really makes FlexJS stand
out.

STRENGTH

   - Robust AS3 foundations
   - Multiplatform
   - Open Source
   - Security???? (I'm not a developer and need you to confirm)
   - ...


WEAKNESSES

   - Association with Flash
   - Abandoned by Adobe???
   -


OPPORTUNITIES

   - AS3/Flex a more robust/structured development platform
   - A potential enterprise class solution
   - Rebirth into an open source platform
   - Powered by the community

THREATS

   - Other "native" JS platforms
   - Potential to be rejected by pure JS/HTML5 developers
   - Perception of poor security....Flash legacy





Berty Tonta

____________________________________________________________________________



LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO

On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:38 PM, gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net> wrote:

> In addition to...
>
>
> "Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
> with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"
>
>
> it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is,
>
>
> "Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS rather than
> ..."
>
>
> The company will need to support their app throughout its lifecycle by
> hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream
> technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling
> business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).
>
>
>
> >
> >     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <
> piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >     Hi All,
> >
> >     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting
> it also
> >     here:
> >
> >     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
> publicity, I
> >     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> >
> >     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not
> go
> >     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
> >
> >     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we
> are in
> >     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it
> gives
> >     the marketing folks something to work with.
> >
> >     [1]
> >     http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.
> com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
> >
> >     Thanks,
> >     Piotr
> >
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net>]

In addition to...


"Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?"


it may also be useful to think of the end customer. That is, 


"Why should a company prefer their app to be written in FlexJS rather than ..."


The company will need to support their app throughout its lifecycle by hiring developers, etc, which, the further you go from mainstream technologies, is harder to justify. There should be some compelling business reason(s) to do so (faster development, etc.).



> 
>     On September 14, 2017 at 6:38 AM Piotr Zarzycki <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>     Hi All,
> 
>     Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting it also
>     here:
> 
>     With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some publicity, I
>     want to ask the community to answer this question:
> 
>     Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
>     with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
> 
>     I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we are in
>     a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it gives
>     the marketing folks something to work with.
> 
>     [1]
>     http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-dev-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html
> 
>     Thanks,
>     Piotr
> 

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

Hi Carlos,

When that topic comes up, I talk about corporate-driven open source vs
Apache open source.  Corporate-driven open source has the advantage of
serious money and marketing, but the disadvantage of an individual
customer having less impact.  In Apache open source, especially Flex where
there isn't a lot of people from any one corporation, the individual
customer can have a major impact. If you have a bug you need fixed in the
framework and have earned commit rights in an Apache project, you just go
and put in your fix.  It may not be as easy to do that in corporate-driven
projects.  Just think back to the Adobe days.  That was also
corporate-driven open source.  Could you get a bug fixed added to the code
at the last minute before a release?  Adobe had product managers
prioritizing everything in order to make a deadline.

Of course, I could be wrong...
-Alex

On 9/19/17, 1:10 PM, "carlos.rovira@gmail.com on behalf of Carlos Rovira"
<carlos.rovira@gmail.com on behalf of carlos.rovira@codeoscopic.com> wrote:

>That's great point. For me our real weakness is that our competitors has
>behind Google, Facebook... and for me is the only thing that don't know
>how
>to overpass
>
>2017-09-19 21:51 GMT+02:00 Jeffry Houser <je...@dot-com-it.com>:
>
>>
>> On 9/19/2017 12:29 PM, Alex Harui wrote:
>>
>>> It might be interesting to hear why people chose Flex in the first
>>>place.
>>> There was competition back then as well (Silverlight, Lazlo, and more).
>>>
>> 1) It targeted the Flash Player, which was on just about every browser.
>> Silverlight couldn't offer that; and I heard of projects going w/ Flex
>> because SL didn't have the penetration.
>> 2) It came from a big company, something that Lazlo couldn't offer.
>>
>>
>> I believe that developer productivity was a major factor.
>>>
>>   In my version of the world, the people that often make decisions have
>>no
>> way to evaluate the truth behind the technology decisions. That may have
>> been part of the sales pitch, but I honestly don't know if it was
>>reality.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Jeffry Houser
>> Technical Entrepreneur
>> 
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeffr
>>yhouser.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C76cf2c6f91864e6e109b08d4ff9a7ff7%7Cfa7b1b5a
>>7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414486416992291&sdata=tsY1ej8UXV2ti
>>anrIxkZT1fN6%2BdmZKe0sN7LmgzFO70%3D&reserved=0
>> 203-379-0773
>>
>>
>
>
>-- 
>
><https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.codeo
>scopic.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C76cf2c6f91864e6e109b08d4ff9a7ff7%7Cfa7b1b5a7b
>34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414486416992291&sdata=YJ7WarFDjZ8p4VO7
>CA4qpc%2FzfuggqHi1c8O%2F59L8NDA%3D&reserved=0>
>
>Carlos Rovira
>
>Director General
>
>M: +34 607 22 60 05
>
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.codeos
>copic.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C76cf2c6f91864e6e109b08d4ff9a7ff7%7Cfa7b1b5a7b3
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>A4qpc%2FzfuggqHi1c8O%2F59L8NDA%3D&reserved=0
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>.es&data=02%7C01%7C%7C76cf2c6f91864e6e109b08d4ff9a7ff7%7Cfa7b1b5a7b3443879
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>
>Conocenos en 1 minuto!
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>oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación
>necesaria.

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Carlos Rovira <ca...@codeoscopic.com>]

Hi, ok that's an argument that I was not considering. Still think that
people are more confortable with projects managed by a large company.
Apache has great name and if project gets to a good shape a maturity I
think OS foundations are better than a big company that can change the
product or kill it when they want.

Maybe we are now in a position of disadvantage but we could change that as
we progress in the following months and years.

So, not as bad as I thought....



2017-09-19 22:27 GMT+02:00 Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:

> Yes, I've heard the support topic before.  I'm not quite sure how other
> Apache projects handle support.  I would think that many of these same
> "bigger clients" are using at least one Apache project's releases.  Like
> HTTPD or Maven, etc.
>
> Do we know how "big" the support company would have to be?  If not too
> big, maybe the Moonshine folks could become a support vendor.
>
> Thoughts?
> -Alex
>
> On 9/19/17, 1:19 PM, "Jeffry Houser" <je...@dot-com-it.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >  I think that Apache is a big enough name that it is probably 'good
> >enough' to give anyone confidence in using an Apache Project.
> >
> >  What we're missing is a formal support infrastructure.  I find that
> >many of my bigger clients want a "formal" support agreement so they can
> >yell at someone when things go bad.
> >
> >  At this time, I don't think FlexJS has a high enough demand for a
> >support company to spring up in the ecosystem.
> >
> >
> >On 9/19/2017 4:10 PM, Carlos Rovira wrote:
> >> That's great point. For me our real weakness is that our competitors
> >> has behind Google, Facebook... and for me is the only thing that don't
> >> know how to overpass
> >>
> >> 2017-09-19 21:51 GMT+02:00 Jeffry Houser <jeffry@dot-com-it.com
> >> <ma...@dot-com-it.com>>:
> >>
> >>
> >>     On 9/19/2017 12:29 PM, Alex Harui wrote:
> >>
> >>         It might be interesting to hear why people chose Flex in the
> >>         first place.
> >>         There was competition back then as well (Silverlight, Lazlo,
> >>         and more).
> >>
> >>     1) It targeted the Flash Player, which was on just about every
> >>     browser.  Silverlight couldn't offer that; and I heard of projects
> >>     going w/ Flex because SL didn't have the penetration.
> >>     2) It came from a big company, something that Lazlo couldn't offer.
> >>
> >>
> >>         I believe that developer productivity was a major factor.
> >>
> >>       In my version of the world, the people that often make decisions
> >>     have no way to evaluate the truth behind the technology decisions.
> >>     That may have been part of the sales pitch, but I honestly don't
> >>     know if it was reality.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>     --
> >>     Jeffry Houser
> >>     Technical Entrepreneur
> >>
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeffr
> >>yhouser.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9b
> d438%7Cfa7b1b5a
> >>7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&
> sdata=ODMRMEkY8EX44
> >>Dzkd7PQUBs2dmJe%2Bams0nB8gXl4hq4%3D&reserved=0
> >>     203-379-0773
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >>
> >><https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.code
> >>oscopic.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9b
> d438%7Cfa7b1b5a
> >>7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&
> sdata=qWCDp42L7fV2H
> >>YPAscv5oykPqq6iTGqY2qbqLGDyCe4%3D&reserved=0>
> >>
> >> Carlos Rovira
> >>
> >> Director General
> >>
> >> M: +34 607 22 60 05
> >>
> >>
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.codeo
> >>scopic.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9b
> d438%7Cfa7b1b5a7
> >>b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&
> sdata=qWCDp42L7fV2HY
> >>PAscv5oykPqq6iTGqY2qbqLGDyCe4%3D&reserved=0
> >><https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.code
> >>oscopic.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9b
> d438%7Cfa7b1
> >>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&
> sdata=f7cqlsmRVf
> >>nLwrJKBz%2F6qGPMfNFlwSgNoV%2BS6b07Kow%3D&reserved=0>
> >>
> >>
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.avant
> >>2.es&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9b
> d438%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438
> >>794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=
> 1oTqkxGwVcKDN1y1wlDF
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> >><https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.avan
> >>t2.es%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9b
> d438%7Cfa7b1b5a7b3
> >>4438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&
> sdata=oYO1Eh3ByES3M62Z
> >>NbQ1jAV5QBbsCGLjwyyzbDge5i8%3D&reserved=0>
> >>
> >> *
> >> *
> >>
> >> Conocenos en 1 minuto!
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> >> *
> >>
> >>
> >> Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede
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> >> mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por
> >> esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.
> >>
> >> De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le
> >> comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable
> >> es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la
> >> prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted
> >> derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos
> >> dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036,
> >> Madrid con la documentación necesaria.
> >>
> >
> >--
> >Jeffry Houser
> >Technical Entrepreneur
> >https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeffry
> >houser.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9b
> d438%7Cfa7b1b5a7b
> >34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&
> sdata=ODMRMEkY8EX44Dzk
> >d7PQUBs2dmJe%2Bams0nB8gXl4hq4%3D&reserved=0
> >203-379-0773
> >
>
>


-- 

<http://www.codeoscopic.com>

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: +34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com

http://www.avant2.es


Conocenos en 1 minuto! <https://youtu.be/P2IEAYDG5HU>


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener
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S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del
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rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras
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necesaria.

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

Yes, I've heard the support topic before.  I'm not quite sure how other
Apache projects handle support.  I would think that many of these same
"bigger clients" are using at least one Apache project's releases.  Like
HTTPD or Maven, etc.

Do we know how "big" the support company would have to be?  If not too
big, maybe the Moonshine folks could become a support vendor.

Thoughts?
-Alex

On 9/19/17, 1:19 PM, "Jeffry Houser" <je...@dot-com-it.com> wrote:

>
>  I think that Apache is a big enough name that it is probably 'good
>enough' to give anyone confidence in using an Apache Project.
>
>  What we're missing is a formal support infrastructure.  I find that
>many of my bigger clients want a "formal" support agreement so they can
>yell at someone when things go bad.
>
>  At this time, I don't think FlexJS has a high enough demand for a
>support company to spring up in the ecosystem.
>
>
>On 9/19/2017 4:10 PM, Carlos Rovira wrote:
>> That's great point. For me our real weakness is that our competitors
>> has behind Google, Facebook... and for me is the only thing that don't
>> know how to overpass
>>
>> 2017-09-19 21:51 GMT+02:00 Jeffry Houser <jeffry@dot-com-it.com
>> <ma...@dot-com-it.com>>:
>>
>>
>>     On 9/19/2017 12:29 PM, Alex Harui wrote:
>>
>>         It might be interesting to hear why people chose Flex in the
>>         first place.
>>         There was competition back then as well (Silverlight, Lazlo,
>>         and more).
>>
>>     1) It targeted the Flash Player, which was on just about every
>>     browser.  Silverlight couldn't offer that; and I heard of projects
>>     going w/ Flex because SL didn't have the penetration.
>>     2) It came from a big company, something that Lazlo couldn't offer.
>>
>>
>>         I believe that developer productivity was a major factor.
>>
>>       In my version of the world, the people that often make decisions
>>     have no way to evaluate the truth behind the technology decisions.
>>     That may have been part of the sales pitch, but I honestly don't
>>     know if it was reality.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>     -- 
>>     Jeffry Houser
>>     Technical Entrepreneur
>>     
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeffr
>>yhouser.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9bd438%7Cfa7b1b5a
>>7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=ODMRMEkY8EX44
>>Dzkd7PQUBs2dmJe%2Bams0nB8gXl4hq4%3D&reserved=0
>>     203-379-0773
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> 
>><https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.code
>>oscopic.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9bd438%7Cfa7b1b5a
>>7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=qWCDp42L7fV2H
>>YPAscv5oykPqq6iTGqY2qbqLGDyCe4%3D&reserved=0>
>>
>> Carlos Rovira
>>
>> Director General
>>
>> M: +34 607 22 60 05
>>
>> 
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.codeo
>>scopic.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9bd438%7Cfa7b1b5a7
>>b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=qWCDp42L7fV2HY
>>PAscv5oykPqq6iTGqY2qbqLGDyCe4%3D&reserved=0
>><https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.code
>>oscopic.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9bd438%7Cfa7b1
>>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=f7cqlsmRVf
>>nLwrJKBz%2F6qGPMfNFlwSgNoV%2BS6b07Kow%3D&reserved=0>
>>
>> 
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.avant
>>2.es&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9bd438%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438
>>794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=1oTqkxGwVcKDN1y1wlDF
>>aomnTOkQR8600jxIfQLh%2FS8%3D&reserved=0
>><https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.avan
>>t2.es%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9bd438%7Cfa7b1b5a7b3
>>4438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=oYO1Eh3ByES3M62Z
>>NbQ1jAV5QBbsCGLjwyyzbDge5i8%3D&reserved=0>
>>
>> *
>> *
>>
>> Conocenos en 1 minuto!
>><https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.b
>>e%2FP2IEAYDG5HU&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9bd438%7Cfa7b
>>1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=9%2FcLuE5
>>uevHHrYBVlXrmOBtPhtttsxhdpRueUXogGQw%3D&reserved=0>*
>> *
>>
>>
>> Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede
>> contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este
>> mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por
>> esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.
>>
>> De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le
>> comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable
>> es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la
>> prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted
>> derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos
>> dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036,
>> Madrid con la documentación necesaria.
>>
>
>-- 
>Jeffry Houser
>Technical Entrepreneur
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeffry
>houser.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C0b2e99db27b048a1669508d4ff9bd438%7Cfa7b1b5a7b
>34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414492131639976&sdata=ODMRMEkY8EX44Dzk
>d7PQUBs2dmJe%2Bams0nB8gXl4hq4%3D&reserved=0
>203-379-0773
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Jeffry Houser <je...@dot-com-it.com>]

  I think that Apache is a big enough name that it is probably 'good 
enough' to give anyone confidence in using an Apache Project.

  What we're missing is a formal support infrastructure.  I find that 
many of my bigger clients want a "formal" support agreement so they can 
yell at someone when things go bad.

  At this time, I don't think FlexJS has a high enough demand for a 
support company to spring up in the ecosystem.


On 9/19/2017 4:10 PM, Carlos Rovira wrote:
> That's great point. For me our real weakness is that our competitors 
> has behind Google, Facebook... and for me is the only thing that don't 
> know how to overpass
>
> 2017-09-19 21:51 GMT+02:00 Jeffry Houser <jeffry@dot-com-it.com 
> <ma...@dot-com-it.com>>:
>
>
>     On 9/19/2017 12:29 PM, Alex Harui wrote:
>
>         It might be interesting to hear why people chose Flex in the
>         first place.
>         There was competition back then as well (Silverlight, Lazlo,
>         and more).
>
>     1) It targeted the Flash Player, which was on just about every
>     browser.  Silverlight couldn't offer that; and I heard of projects
>     going w/ Flex because SL didn't have the penetration.
>     2) It came from a big company, something that Lazlo couldn't offer.
>
>
>         I believe that developer productivity was a major factor.
>
>       In my version of the world, the people that often make decisions
>     have no way to evaluate the truth behind the technology decisions.
>     That may have been part of the sales pitch, but I honestly don't
>     know if it was reality.
>
>
>
>
>     -- 
>     Jeffry Houser
>     Technical Entrepreneur
>     http://www.jeffryhouser.com
>     203-379-0773
>
>
>
>
> -- 
>
> <http://www.codeoscopic.com>
>
> Carlos Rovira
>
> Director General
>
> M: +34 607 22 60 05
>
> http://www.codeoscopic.com <http://www.codeoscopic.com/>
>
> http://www.avant2.es <http://www.avant2.es/>
>
> *
> *
>
> Conocenos en 1 minuto! <https://youtu.be/P2IEAYDG5HU>*
> *
>
>
> Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede 
> contener información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este 
> mensaje por error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por 
> esta misma vía y proceda a su destrucción.
>
> De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le 
> comunicamos que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable 
> es CODEOSCOPIC S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la 
> prestación del servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted 
> derecho de acceso, rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos 
> dirigiéndose a nuestras oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, 
> Madrid con la documentación necesaria.
>

-- 
Jeffry Houser
Technical Entrepreneur
http://www.jeffryhouser.com
203-379-0773

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Carlos Rovira <ca...@codeoscopic.com>]

That's great point. For me our real weakness is that our competitors has
behind Google, Facebook... and for me is the only thing that don't know how
to overpass

2017-09-19 21:51 GMT+02:00 Jeffry Houser <je...@dot-com-it.com>:

>
> On 9/19/2017 12:29 PM, Alex Harui wrote:
>
>> It might be interesting to hear why people chose Flex in the first place.
>> There was competition back then as well (Silverlight, Lazlo, and more).
>>
> 1) It targeted the Flash Player, which was on just about every browser.
> Silverlight couldn't offer that; and I heard of projects going w/ Flex
> because SL didn't have the penetration.
> 2) It came from a big company, something that Lazlo couldn't offer.
>
>
> I believe that developer productivity was a major factor.
>>
>   In my version of the world, the people that often make decisions have no
> way to evaluate the truth behind the technology decisions. That may have
> been part of the sales pitch, but I honestly don't know if it was reality.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Jeffry Houser
> Technical Entrepreneur
> http://www.jeffryhouser.com
> 203-379-0773
>
>


-- 

<http://www.codeoscopic.com>

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: +34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com

http://www.avant2.es


Conocenos en 1 minuto! <https://youtu.be/P2IEAYDG5HU>


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener
información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por
error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y
proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos
que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC
S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del
servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso,
rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras
oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación
necesaria.

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Jeffry Houser <je...@dot-com-it.com>]

On 9/19/2017 12:29 PM, Alex Harui wrote:
> It might be interesting to hear why people chose Flex in the first place.
> There was competition back then as well (Silverlight, Lazlo, and more).
1) It targeted the Flash Player, which was on just about every browser.  
Silverlight couldn't offer that; and I heard of projects going w/ Flex 
because SL didn't have the penetration.
2) It came from a big company, something that Lazlo couldn't offer.


> I believe that developer productivity was a major factor.
   In my version of the world, the people that often make decisions have 
no way to evaluate the truth behind the technology decisions. That may 
have been part of the sales pitch, but I honestly don't know if it was 
reality.




-- 
Jeffry Houser
Technical Entrepreneur
http://www.jeffryhouser.com
203-379-0773

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

Hi, 

What's the feeling here about the trend of replacing web sites with mobile
apps? I realize that not everyone in the world has a smart phone or tablet
and now the baseline is a simple computer with a browser, but it seems
more often that a company-specific app gets the end user more. These are
probably more expensive to produce as well.

It seems to me that FlexJS would also help in this manner, too. We have
integration with AIR and Cordova and perhaps we could one day generate
more native apps (perhaps MXML/AS -> Java or Swift).

If you have been developing a web app with FlexJS, then you are probably
more than halfway to getting a mobile app going as well. Whereas a pure
JavaScript (or JS/HTML) site would have a tougher time making that
transition. 

—peter

On 9/19/17, 12:29 PM, "Alex Harui" <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID> wrote:

>It might be interesting to hear why people chose Flex in the first place.
>There was competition back then as well (Silverlight, Lazlo, and more).
>
>I believe that developer productivity was a major factor.  And
>performance/bandwidth advantages of AMF.  To me, FlexJS bets heavily on
>the developer productivity factor.  Especially when building enterprise
>class applications.  Traditional Flex apps could rely on the Flash Player
>to enforce structure and eliminate at least one security exploit:  In SWF,
>you cannot change a function at runtime.
>
>In various talks I given about FlexJS, I say that nobody has ever built a
>skyscraper out of wood and nails.  Instead, steel beams and pre-formed
>braces and fittings are used to ensure that a very large building has
>sufficient supporting structure and everything fits exactly together
>exactly as it should.  The Flash runtime provides this sort of thing with
>its runtime verifier.  If you bring in a module and expect it to conform
>to an interface and it doesn't.  Flash will tell you at load time.  We
>could probably add code to try to do runtime verification, but it would
>run in JS and not in the runtime.
>
>That's how Flex on Flash met Berty's criteria of "Enterprise Class" and
>"Security".  It is one reason why I still think it is useful to have SWF
>equivalents at least with UI mocks so you can test all of your code paths
>in a stricter, enterprise-class, secure runtime.  Then you know when it
>runs on a less secure runtime (the JS runtime) that you did fit all of
>your beams together correctly.
>
>There may always be other JS frameworks out there that are more popular.
>I don't even think we need to compete against their UI feature set.  I'd
>still be interested in seeing if we can integrate React's UI widgets into
>a FlexJS app.  I think we can differentiate on the workflow for enterprise
>apps.  You might be able to get "Hello World" up faster on some other JS
>framework, especially one without a tool chain, but as your app grows in
>complexity, who will help you finish your app on time by helping you find
>bugs sooner and integrate code written by different teams.  There is a
>saying that the cost of finding a bug is directly proportional to how long
>it takes to find it.  If you catch it as you write it, it is much cheaper
>to fix it then, than if it ships and some customer calls support about it.
> Structured languages, tool chains and even runtime verifiers are all
>things that Java has and Flex on Flash has to help you find bugs sooner.
>
>FlexJS is intended to bring as much of Flex to other runtimes.  I am
>looking forward to seeing more of you try to bring your apps from Flash to
>JS so we can truly see how much of it we can bring over.
>
>My 2 cents,
>-Alex
>
>On 9/19/17, 7:50 AM, "Jeffry Houser" <je...@dot-com-it.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>   In my version of the world, the biggest 'competitors' for the "HTML5
>>Framework" space are:
>>
>>1) *React *for reasons that Peter mentioned.  I think this is the
>>'biggest Player' in the current job market, but the licensing / patent
>>issues will probably hurt it.
>>
>>2) *Angular*, which is from Google, is built in TypeScript.  My
>>impression is that it's 80% of what React already is.  Unfortunately,
>>the move from AngularJS [a JavaScript framework] to Angular [a
>>TypeScript] framework was jarring--think like moving from Halo to Spark
>>components with Flex.  I think that is the primary reason why React is
>>eating Angular's lunch in the job market.
>>
>>3) *VueJS*:  The new up and comer.  I don't know much about it, but I
>>keep hearing about it more and more.
>>
>>   Unfortunately, much of Berty's list of great things about FlexJS can
>>also apply to React and Angular and Vue.
>>
>>On 9/14/2017 1:38 PM, Peter Ent wrote:
>>> I think you also need to include folks who would choose to use React
>>>over
>>> TypeScript/Angular and other things. React seems very popular to me and
>>> offers a similar experience to Flex in that you have class files that
>>> combine presentation and code (like MXML) or just plain code. Plus it
>>>is a
>>> gateway to React/Native. I think from the technology point of view,
>>>this
>>> is a big competitor.
>>>
>>> ‹peter
>>>
>>> On 9/14/17, 9:38 AM, "Piotr Zarzycki" <pi...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi All,
>>>>
>>>> Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting it
>>>>also
>>>> here:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
>>>>publicity, I
>>>> want to ask the community to answer this question:
>>>>
>>>> Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not
>>>>go
>>>> with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>>>>
>>>> I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we
>>>>are in
>>>> a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it
>>>>gives
>>>> the marketing folks something to work with.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [1]
>>>> 
>>>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-
>>>>f
>>>>le
>>>> 
>>>>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web
>>>>-
>>>>de
>>>> 
>>>>v-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cecab775e076045860df708d4
>>>>f
>>>>b7
>>>> 
>>>>5d709%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636409930918412857&s
>>>>d
>>>>at
>>>> a=41u1L20hGG7t2r3g3vnepAvG37RZtAv1a9t2Y7G5w%2FE%3D&reserved=0
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Piotr
>>
>>-- 
>>Jeffry Houser
>>Technical Entrepreneur
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeffr
>>y
>>houser.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C5faa3e9e72d04fa5d01608d4ff6dd21d%7Cfa7b1b5a7
>>b
>>34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414294518144028&sdata=NQ1sKoWOBllW5t%
>>2
>>BnjiNxVeReeXsUTBwH3IzU5GLLggs%3D&reserved=0
>>203-379-0773
>>
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

It might be interesting to hear why people chose Flex in the first place.
There was competition back then as well (Silverlight, Lazlo, and more).

I believe that developer productivity was a major factor.  And
performance/bandwidth advantages of AMF.  To me, FlexJS bets heavily on
the developer productivity factor.  Especially when building enterprise
class applications.  Traditional Flex apps could rely on the Flash Player
to enforce structure and eliminate at least one security exploit:  In SWF,
you cannot change a function at runtime.

In various talks I given about FlexJS, I say that nobody has ever built a
skyscraper out of wood and nails.  Instead, steel beams and pre-formed
braces and fittings are used to ensure that a very large building has
sufficient supporting structure and everything fits exactly together
exactly as it should.  The Flash runtime provides this sort of thing with
its runtime verifier.  If you bring in a module and expect it to conform
to an interface and it doesn't.  Flash will tell you at load time.  We
could probably add code to try to do runtime verification, but it would
run in JS and not in the runtime.

That's how Flex on Flash met Berty's criteria of "Enterprise Class" and
"Security".  It is one reason why I still think it is useful to have SWF
equivalents at least with UI mocks so you can test all of your code paths
in a stricter, enterprise-class, secure runtime.  Then you know when it
runs on a less secure runtime (the JS runtime) that you did fit all of
your beams together correctly.

There may always be other JS frameworks out there that are more popular.
I don't even think we need to compete against their UI feature set.  I'd
still be interested in seeing if we can integrate React's UI widgets into
a FlexJS app.  I think we can differentiate on the workflow for enterprise
apps.  You might be able to get "Hello World" up faster on some other JS
framework, especially one without a tool chain, but as your app grows in
complexity, who will help you finish your app on time by helping you find
bugs sooner and integrate code written by different teams.  There is a
saying that the cost of finding a bug is directly proportional to how long
it takes to find it.  If you catch it as you write it, it is much cheaper
to fix it then, than if it ships and some customer calls support about it.
 Structured languages, tool chains and even runtime verifiers are all
things that Java has and Flex on Flash has to help you find bugs sooner.

FlexJS is intended to bring as much of Flex to other runtimes.  I am
looking forward to seeing more of you try to bring your apps from Flash to
JS so we can truly see how much of it we can bring over.

My 2 cents,
-Alex

On 9/19/17, 7:50 AM, "Jeffry Houser" <je...@dot-com-it.com> wrote:

>
>   In my version of the world, the biggest 'competitors' for the "HTML5
>Framework" space are:
>
>1) *React *for reasons that Peter mentioned.  I think this is the
>'biggest Player' in the current job market, but the licensing / patent
>issues will probably hurt it.
>
>2) *Angular*, which is from Google, is built in TypeScript.  My
>impression is that it's 80% of what React already is.  Unfortunately,
>the move from AngularJS [a JavaScript framework] to Angular [a
>TypeScript] framework was jarring--think like moving from Halo to Spark
>components with Flex.  I think that is the primary reason why React is
>eating Angular's lunch in the job market.
>
>3) *VueJS*:  The new up and comer.  I don't know much about it, but I
>keep hearing about it more and more.
>
>   Unfortunately, much of Berty's list of great things about FlexJS can
>also apply to React and Angular and Vue.
>
>On 9/14/2017 1:38 PM, Peter Ent wrote:
>> I think you also need to include folks who would choose to use React
>>over
>> TypeScript/Angular and other things. React seems very popular to me and
>> offers a similar experience to Flex in that you have class files that
>> combine presentation and code (like MXML) or just plain code. Plus it
>>is a
>> gateway to React/Native. I think from the technology point of view, this
>> is a big competitor.
>>
>> ‹peter
>>
>> On 9/14/17, 9:38 AM, "Piotr Zarzycki" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting it
>>>also
>>> here:
>>>
>>>
>>> With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some
>>>publicity, I
>>> want to ask the community to answer this question:
>>>
>>> Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
>>> with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>>>
>>> I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we
>>>are in
>>> a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it
>>>gives
>>> the marketing folks something to work with.
>>>
>>>
>>> [1]
>>> 
>>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-f
>>>le
>>> 
>>>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-
>>>de
>>> 
>>>v-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cecab775e076045860df708d4f
>>>b7
>>> 
>>>5d709%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636409930918412857&sd
>>>at
>>> a=41u1L20hGG7t2r3g3vnepAvG37RZtAv1a9t2Y7G5w%2FE%3D&reserved=0
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Piotr
>
>-- 
>Jeffry Houser
>Technical Entrepreneur
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.jeffry
>houser.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7C5faa3e9e72d04fa5d01608d4ff6dd21d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b
>34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636414294518144028&sdata=NQ1sKoWOBllW5t%2
>BnjiNxVeReeXsUTBwH3IzU5GLLggs%3D&reserved=0
>203-379-0773
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Jeffry Houser <je...@dot-com-it.com>]

   In my version of the world, the biggest 'competitors' for the "HTML5 
Framework" space are:

1) *React *for reasons that Peter mentioned.  I think this is the 
'biggest Player' in the current job market, but the licensing / patent 
issues will probably hurt it.

2) *Angular*, which is from Google, is built in TypeScript.  My 
impression is that it's 80% of what React already is.  Unfortunately, 
the move from AngularJS [a JavaScript framework] to Angular [a 
TypeScript] framework was jarring--think like moving from Halo to Spark 
components with Flex.  I think that is the primary reason why React is 
eating Angular's lunch in the job market.

3) *VueJS*:  The new up and comer.  I don't know much about it, but I 
keep hearing about it more and more.

   Unfortunately, much of Berty's list of great things about FlexJS can 
also apply to React and Angular and Vue.

On 9/14/2017 1:38 PM, Peter Ent wrote:
> I think you also need to include folks who would choose to use React over
> TypeScript/Angular and other things. React seems very popular to me and
> offers a similar experience to Flex in that you have class files that
> combine presentation and code (like MXML) or just plain code. Plus it is a
> gateway to React/Native. I think from the technology point of view, this
> is a big competitor.
>
> ‹peter
>
> On 9/14/17, 9:38 AM, "Piotr Zarzycki" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting it also
>> here:
>>
>>
>> With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some publicity, I
>> want to ask the community to answer this question:
>>
>> Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
>> with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>>
>> I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we are in
>> a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it gives
>> the marketing folks something to work with.
>>
>>
>> [1]
>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fle
>> x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-de
>> v-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cecab775e076045860df708d4fb7
>> 5d709%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636409930918412857&sdat
>> a=41u1L20hGG7t2r3g3vnepAvG37RZtAv1a9t2Y7G5w%2FE%3D&reserved=0
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Piotr

-- 
Jeffry Houser
Technical Entrepreneur
http://www.jeffryhouser.com
203-379-0773

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

I think you also need to include folks who would choose to use React over
TypeScript/Angular and other things. React seems very popular to me and
offers a similar experience to Flex in that you have class files that
combine presentation and code (like MXML) or just plain code. Plus it is a
gateway to React/Native. I think from the technology point of view, this
is a big competitor.

‹peter

On 9/14/17, 9:38 AM, "Piotr Zarzycki" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Hi All,
>
>Erik on dev [1] list came up wit interesting question. I'm posting it also
>here:
>
>
>With the upcoming fork and renewed focus and most likely some publicity, I
>want to ask the community to answer this question:
>
>Why should a web dev choose FlexJS to write JS applications, and not go
>with a more mainstream option like e.g. TypeScript/Angular?
>
>I think that if we can answer that question in a compelling way, we are in
>a good place as a project (from a code perspective, at least) and it gives
>the marketing folks something to work with.
>
>
>[1]
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fle
>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFLEXJS-Marketing-why-should-a-web-de
>v-choose-FlexJS-td64292.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cecab775e076045860df708d4fb7
>5d709%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636409930918412857&sdat
>a=41u1L20hGG7t2r3g3vnepAvG37RZtAv1a9t2Y7G5w%2FE%3D&reserved=0
>
>Thanks,
>Piotr

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[0xC3 <ts...@outlook.com>]

I spend most of my time in embedded machine controllers, so c binaries would
be nice. Honestly I don't have a preference right now because my customers
are happy with AIR as their replacement for Flash Player, but as always the
winds of change will bring a new thing and I will have to port to that.

If I have to back to browsers, I think WebAssembly (or the idea of it)
sounds good.




--
Sent from: http://apache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com/

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

Hi,

Yes, we may target other output besides JS someday.  Are there any you
consider important?

Thanks in advance,
-Alex

On 9/15/17, 3:24 PM, "0xC3" <ts...@outlook.com> wrote:

>To everybody we really do appreciate the hard work and accomplishments
>made
>by all involved. I really hope I did not come off negative, I wanted to
>point to the amazing ability of knowing I could output to JS without
>having
>to know it, provided by everybody's hard work.
>
>Of course you would need to focus on the output product of the compiler
>that's totally understandable. I was just trying to make a point that I
>feel
>Apache Flex, of which FlexJS is a part of, is larger than JS by way of
>enabling other targets if needed/wanted. Honestly FlexJS was one of the
>reasons we decided to stick with Flex vs other options.
>
>So, I guess my marketing point would be that FlexJS is not another JS
>framework, it's a good structured language that happens to compile to JS
>(among other thing).
>
>I apologize if I am missing the mark on FlexJS, full disclosure I haven't
>made anything with it yet I am only going by what I have read on the
>progress.
>
>
>
>
>--
>Sent from: 
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fle
>x-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C06ba53eee6e6444cc9ad08d
>4fc88815d%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636411110600661538&
>sdata=SoM1X3mVPS9Bqi81BzR0oBQeijgi093upfygqOFi5d0%3D&reserved=0

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[0xC3 <ts...@outlook.com>]

To everybody we really do appreciate the hard work and accomplishments made
by all involved. I really hope I did not come off negative, I wanted to
point to the amazing ability of knowing I could output to JS without having
to know it, provided by everybody's hard work.

Of course you would need to focus on the output product of the compiler
that's totally understandable. I was just trying to make a point that I feel
Apache Flex, of which FlexJS is a part of, is larger than JS by way of
enabling other targets if needed/wanted. Honestly FlexJS was one of the
reasons we decided to stick with Flex vs other options.

So, I guess my marketing point would be that FlexJS is not another JS
framework, it's a good structured language that happens to compile to JS
(among other thing).

I apologize if I am missing the mark on FlexJS, full disclosure I haven't
made anything with it yet I am only going by what I have read on the
progress.




--
Sent from: http://apache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com/

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com.INVALID>]

Hi,

Thanks for your history and thoughts.

I think we agree that FlexJS or whatever we call it is trying to hide the
bad parts of JS and improve developer productivity by letting you use
declarative and structured languages from a single provider.

I may have misunderstood your point about the output taking precedence
over the language, but for sure we do have to spend quite a bit of energy
worrying about the output because we don't have Flash to hide the browser
differences.

Anyway, sorry to keep repeating myself, but the main reason for even our
lurkers to get more involved is to help control your destiny as well.  If
you are happy with AIR and still using Apache Flex but run into a bug, you
can more directly get it fixed.  If you want to make sure FlexJS support
for AIR is sufficient for you to write new AIR apps in FlexJS so you can
more easily target something else someday, you can help make that happen
as well.

Thanks for speaking up.  We'd like to hear from other lurkers as well.

-Alex

On 9/15/17, 12:33 PM, "0xC3" <ts...@outlook.com> wrote:

>Hi, I haven't posted before (more of a lurker) however I am a log time
>user
>of Flex and I may be slightly off topic here, but I think it applies
>(specifically to the idea of forking).
>   Here we make hardware and needed some way to display the information,
>we
>started using Flash around 2004, because it was a quick way to develop a
>display to view the information to multiple concurrent users without much
>fuss. Around 2007 we started transitioning some of our controls to Flex
>because MXML/AS was a better model for us then Flash, now everything we
>have
>is Flex based. Last year we decided to transition to AIR for 4 reasons:
>
>1.	We needed to have more of a mobile presence.
>2.	Loading and updating app’s is not much of a concern anymore.
>3.	We could use the existing codebase to accomplish #1, while still using
>it
>on our core area, the Desktop
>4.	If we needed/wanted to go back or add browser based stuff we could use
>FlexJS to help with that.
>
>  With the idea of forking it feels like the output is taking precedence
>over the language, i.e. the transpiled JS is more important than the
>compiler. To me the best feature of Flex was that I did not have to worry
>about how to get somewhere.
>
>  As to the original question, I feel the strongest point of FlexJS is the
>freedom to not care about JS.
>
>Probably not the best for marketing.
>
>
>
>
>--
>Sent from: 
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fle
>x-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C83d1d2b8aff644a22b1a08d
>4fc70a53f%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636411008121678901&
>sdata=LkBmCrM%2F4ItcfMVXPtBehrW0ZzreCDyKI8%2FX3PEBGfM%3D&reserved=0

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[0xC3 <ts...@outlook.com>]

Hi, I haven't posted before (more of a lurker) however I am a log time user
of Flex and I may be slightly off topic here, but I think it applies
(specifically to the idea of forking). 
   Here we make hardware and needed some way to display the information, we
started using Flash around 2004, because it was a quick way to develop a
display to view the information to multiple concurrent users without much
fuss. Around 2007 we started transitioning some of our controls to Flex
because MXML/AS was a better model for us then Flash, now everything we have
is Flex based. Last year we decided to transition to AIR for 4 reasons:

1.	We needed to have more of a mobile presence.
2.	Loading and updating app’s is not much of a concern anymore.
3.	We could use the existing codebase to accomplish #1, while still using it
on our core area, the Desktop
4.	If we needed/wanted to go back or add browser based stuff we could use
FlexJS to help with that.

  With the idea of forking it feels like the output is taking precedence
over the language, i.e. the transpiled JS is more important than the
compiler. To me the best feature of Flex was that I did not have to worry
about how to get somewhere.

  As to the original question, I feel the strongest point of FlexJS is the
freedom to not care about JS.

Probably not the best for marketing.




--
Sent from: http://apache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com/

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net>]

> Does that help clarify?


Absolutely! Thanks so much

> 
>     On September 19, 2017 at 1:00 PM Jeffry Houser <je...@dot-com-it.com> wrote:
> 
>     On 9/19/2017 12:00 PM, gkk gb wrote:
> 
>         > > 
> >             > > > 
> > >             Our sweet spot is single page applications.
> > >             We are not a great fit for ... multi-page applications.
> > >             Can anyone expand on the above comment? Like Flex, isn't FlexJS geared towards enterprise applications that are fairly complex, where HTML is not a good fit?
> > > 
> > >         > > 
> >     > 
>     I didn't see a response yet. I'm not sure what needs expanding.
> 
>     Most "HTML5" applications are intended to be single page
>     applications. that means you reload data from the server and redraw
>     parts of the screen as appropriate without reloading the page. This is
>     exactly the same type of applications we built with Flex. They are
>     built on a services based architecture. So, click a button or link,
>     often a REST service is called, the data is returned and the UI is
>     updated. Gmail is a good example of this.
> 
>     A multi-page application means that everytime you click a link, a new
>     page is loaded. Each page is like it's own separate application. Often
>     the server software (Java, .NET, ColdFusion, PHP, whatever) will often
>     make calls directly to the database, turn it into HTML, and return that
>     HTML to the browser. Amazon.com is a good example of a multi-page
>     application.
> 
>     They are two fundamentally different paradigms for application
>     development.
> 
>     The JQuery framework comes from the multi-page application days, but
>     can be used today to build out single page applications too. Angular,
>     Vue, React, FlexJS, and even Flex are all designed for single page
>     applications.
> 
>     All of this is completely independent of the ability of any given
>     framework to build complex Enterprise applications.
> 
>     Does that help clarify?
> 
>     --
>     Jeffry Houser
>     Technical Entrepreneur
>     http://www.jeffryhouser.com
>     203-379-0773
> 

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Jeffry Houser <je...@dot-com-it.com>]

On 9/19/2017 12:00 PM, gkk gb wrote:
>> Our sweet spot is single page applications.
>> We are not a great fit for ... multi-page applications.
> Can anyone expand on the above comment? Like Flex, isn't FlexJS geared towards enterprise applications that are fairly complex, where HTML is not a good fit?

  I didn't see a response yet.  I'm not sure what needs expanding.

  Most "HTML5" applications are intended to be single page 
applications.  that means you reload data from the server and redraw 
parts of the screen as appropriate without reloading the page.  This is 
exactly the same type of applications we built with Flex.  They are 
built on a services based architecture.  So, click a button or link, 
often a REST service is called, the data is returned and the UI is 
updated.  Gmail is a good example of this.

  A multi-page application means that everytime you click a link, a new 
page is loaded.  Each page is like it's own separate application.  Often 
the server software (Java, .NET, ColdFusion, PHP, whatever) will often 
make calls directly to the database, turn it into HTML, and return that 
HTML to the browser. Amazon.com is a good example of a multi-page 
application.

  They are two fundamentally different paradigms for application 
development.

  The JQuery framework comes from the multi-page application days, but 
can be used today to build out single page applications too. Angular, 
Vue, React, FlexJS, and even Flex are all designed for single page 
applications.

  All of this is completely independent of the ability of any given 
framework to build complex Enterprise applications.

  Does that help clarify?

-- 
Jeffry Houser
Technical Entrepreneur
http://www.jeffryhouser.com
203-379-0773

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[gkk gb <mo...@comcast.net>]

> Our sweet spot is single page applications.
> We are not a great fit for ... multi-page applications.

Can anyone expand on the above comment? Like Flex, isn't FlexJS geared towards enterprise applications that are fairly complex, where HTML is not a good fit? 

> On September 19, 2017 at 1:58 AM Harbs <ha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> 
> To me, the key differentiators of FlexJS is:
> 
> 1. We consider HTML a rendering engine rather than an authoring language.
> 2. End-to-end tooling which eliminates a lot of the pain points of web app development
> 3. MXML
> 4. Flexibly interchangeable component sets.
> 
> Point #1 can be considered an advantage or a disadvantage depending on your perspective.
> 
> Our sweet spot is single page applications.
> We are not a great fit for web sites and multi-page applications.
> 
> One area which will give some folks pause is the lack of automated testing.
> 
> I think our strongest market at the moment is for migrating applications from Flash. I would like to see us strengthen our selling points for other devs as well.
> 
> My $0.02,
> Harbs
> 
> > On Sep 19, 2017, at 10:59 AM, Carlos Rovira <ca...@codeoscopic.com> wrote:
> > 
> > Hi Berty,
> > 
> > I think all points are ok but the second (security) don't know how much
> > effort was put in that corner, maybe others could give some thoughts there,
> > and I think nowadays is a key point.
> > 
> > Thanks!
> > 
> > Carlos
> > 
> > 
> > 2017-09-19 4:15 GMT+02:00 Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro
> >> :
> > 
> >> My first short list of why people should go for FlexJS.
> >> Disclaimer: as a non-developer, I'm not sure if they really apply today to
> >> FlexJS and if there are more engaging features for developers. Would be
> >> great to have your confirmation.
> >> 
> >> 1. Enterprise-class: for As3/Flex robust platform/architecture
> >> 2. Security: I need confirmation here.
> >> 3. Advanced multi-platform: Out of the box and future-proof (@Olaf, I
> >> agree)
> >> 4. Open-source: We must encourage more developers to embrace it and more
> >> organisations to buy-in...not just Adobe.
> >> 
> >> If think the above list (or something along those lines) can send the
> >> message: "Hey, guys, this is serious stuff: We're taking Enterprse (not
> >> games), Security (at it's core), ADVANCED multi-platform (swift low-cost
> >> development/deployment) and a growing/serious community of contributors"
> >> 
> >> OK now. How true is this? If not, is this compatible with the Vision for
> >> FlexJS?
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> Berty Tonta
> >> 
> >> ____________________________________________________________
> >> ________________
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> >> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
> >> 
> >> On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 12:40 AM, Olaf Krueger <ma...@olafkrueger.net>
> >> wrote:
> >> 
> >>> Hi,
> >>> an important thing for me is sustainability.
> >>> Every day a new JS framework is born and another dies.
> >>> Angular was written from scratch... all who have invested in Angular1
> >> were
> >>> lost.
> >>> This is not suitable for the enterprise.
> >>> 
> >>> My understanding is that FlexJS was built with the experience of over a
> >>> decade of Flex development.
> >>> So my hope is that the architecture is well-thought-out and future-proof.
> >>> 
> >>> If we'll speak about WebAssembly or whatever other targets someday...
> >>> FlexJS
> >>> has the potential to fit for them all... hopefully ;-)
> >>> 
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Olaf
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> 
> >>> --
> >>> Sent from: http://apache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com/
> >>> 
> >> 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > 
> > <http://www.codeoscopic.com>
> > 
> > Carlos Rovira
> > 
> > Director General
> > 
> > M: +34 607 22 60 05
> > 
> > http://www.codeoscopic.com
> > 
> > http://www.avant2.es
> > 
> > 
> > Conocenos en 1 minuto! <https://youtu.be/P2IEAYDG5HU>
> > 
> > 
> > Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener
> > información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por
> > error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y
> > proceda a su destrucción.
> > 
> > De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos
> > que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC
> > S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del
> > servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso,
> > rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras
> > oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación
> > necesaria.
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>]

To me, the key differentiators of FlexJS is:

1. We consider HTML a rendering engine rather than an authoring language.
2. End-to-end tooling which eliminates a lot of the pain points of web app development
3. MXML
4. Flexibly interchangeable component sets.

Point #1 can be considered an advantage or a disadvantage depending on your perspective.

Our sweet spot is single page applications.
We are not a great fit for web sites and multi-page applications.

One area which will give some folks pause is the lack of automated testing.

I think our strongest market at the moment is for migrating applications from Flash. I would like to see us strengthen our selling points for other devs as well.

My $0.02,
Harbs

> On Sep 19, 2017, at 10:59 AM, Carlos Rovira <ca...@codeoscopic.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi Berty,
> 
> I think all points are ok but the second (security) don't know how much
> effort was put in that corner, maybe others could give some thoughts there,
> and I think nowadays is a key point.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Carlos
> 
> 
> 2017-09-19 4:15 GMT+02:00 Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro
>> :
> 
>> My first short list of why people should go for FlexJS.
>> Disclaimer: as a non-developer, I'm not sure if they really apply today to
>> FlexJS and if there are more engaging features for developers. Would be
>> great to have your confirmation.
>> 
>> 1. Enterprise-class: for As3/Flex robust platform/architecture
>> 2. Security: I need confirmation here.
>> 3. Advanced multi-platform: Out of the box and future-proof (@Olaf, I
>> agree)
>> 4. Open-source: We must encourage more developers to embrace it and more
>> organisations to buy-in...not just Adobe.
>> 
>> If think the above list (or something along those lines) can send the
>> message: "Hey, guys, this is serious stuff: We're taking Enterprse (not
>> games), Security (at it's core), ADVANCED multi-platform (swift low-cost
>> development/deployment) and a growing/serious community of contributors"
>> 
>> OK now. How true is this? If not, is this compatible with the Vision for
>> FlexJS?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Berty Tonta
>> 
>> ____________________________________________________________
>> ________________
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
>> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
>> 
>> On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 12:40 AM, Olaf Krueger <ma...@olafkrueger.net>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> an important thing for me is sustainability.
>>> Every day a new JS framework is born and another dies.
>>> Angular was written from scratch... all who have invested in Angular1
>> were
>>> lost.
>>> This is not suitable for the enterprise.
>>> 
>>> My understanding is that FlexJS was built with the experience of over a
>>> decade of Flex development.
>>> So my hope is that the architecture is well-thought-out and future-proof.
>>> 
>>> If we'll speak about WebAssembly or whatever other targets someday...
>>> FlexJS
>>> has the potential to fit for them all... hopefully ;-)
>>> 
>>> Thanks,
>>> Olaf
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Sent from: http://apache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com/
>>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> <http://www.codeoscopic.com>
> 
> Carlos Rovira
> 
> Director General
> 
> M: +34 607 22 60 05
> 
> http://www.codeoscopic.com
> 
> http://www.avant2.es
> 
> 
> Conocenos en 1 minuto! <https://youtu.be/P2IEAYDG5HU>
> 
> 
> Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener
> información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por
> error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y
> proceda a su destrucción.
> 
> De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos
> que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC
> S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del
> servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso,
> rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras
> oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación
> necesaria.

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Carlos Rovira <ca...@codeoscopic.com>]

Hi Berty,

I think all points are ok but the second (security) don't know how much
effort was put in that corner, maybe others could give some thoughts there,
and I think nowadays is a key point.

Thanks!

Carlos


2017-09-19 4:15 GMT+02:00 Berty Tonta (Leadstalk) <berty.tonta@leadstalk.pro
>:

> My first short list of why people should go for FlexJS.
> Disclaimer: as a non-developer, I'm not sure if they really apply today to
> FlexJS and if there are more engaging features for developers. Would be
> great to have your confirmation.
>
> 1. Enterprise-class: for As3/Flex robust platform/architecture
> 2. Security: I need confirmation here.
> 3. Advanced multi-platform: Out of the box and future-proof (@Olaf, I
> agree)
> 4. Open-source: We must encourage more developers to embrace it and more
> organisations to buy-in...not just Adobe.
>
> If think the above list (or something along those lines) can send the
> message: "Hey, guys, this is serious stuff: We're taking Enterprse (not
> games), Security (at it's core), ADVANCED multi-platform (swift low-cost
> development/deployment) and a growing/serious community of contributors"
>
> OK now. How true is this? If not, is this compatible with the Vision for
> FlexJS?
>
>
>
>
>
> Berty Tonta
>
> ____________________________________________________________
> ________________
>
>
>
> LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
> TEL  +230 57 43 81 34 - BERTY.TONTA@LEADSTALK.PRO - LEADSTALK.PRO
>
> On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 12:40 AM, Olaf Krueger <ma...@olafkrueger.net>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> > an important thing for me is sustainability.
> > Every day a new JS framework is born and another dies.
> > Angular was written from scratch... all who have invested in Angular1
> were
> > lost.
> > This is not suitable for the enterprise.
> >
> > My understanding is that FlexJS was built with the experience of over a
> > decade of Flex development.
> > So my hope is that the architecture is well-thought-out and future-proof.
> >
> > If we'll speak about WebAssembly or whatever other targets someday...
> > FlexJS
> > has the potential to fit for them all... hopefully ;-)
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Olaf
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Sent from: http://apache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com/
> >
>



-- 

<http://www.codeoscopic.com>

Carlos Rovira

Director General

M: +34 607 22 60 05

http://www.codeoscopic.com

http://www.avant2.es


Conocenos en 1 minuto! <https://youtu.be/P2IEAYDG5HU>


Este mensaje se dirige exclusivamente a su destinatario y puede contener
información privilegiada o confidencial. Si ha recibido este mensaje por
error, le rogamos que nos lo comunique inmediatamente por esta misma vía y
proceda a su destrucción.

De la vigente Ley Orgánica de Protección de Datos (15/1999), le comunicamos
que sus datos forman parte de un fichero cuyo responsable es CODEOSCOPIC
S.A. La finalidad de dicho tratamiento es facilitar la prestación del
servicio o información solicitados, teniendo usted derecho de acceso,
rectificación, cancelación y oposición de sus datos dirigiéndose a nuestras
oficinas c/ Paseo de la Habana 9-11, 28036, Madrid con la documentación
necesaria.

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

["Berty Tonta (Leadstalk)" <be...@leadstalk.pro>]

My first short list of why people should go for FlexJS.
Disclaimer: as a non-developer, I'm not sure if they really apply today to
FlexJS and if there are more engaging features for developers. Would be
great to have your confirmation.

1. Enterprise-class: for As3/Flex robust platform/architecture
2. Security: I need confirmation here.
3. Advanced multi-platform: Out of the box and future-proof (@Olaf, I agree)
4. Open-source: We must encourage more developers to embrace it and more
organisations to buy-in...not just Adobe.

If think the above list (or something along those lines) can send the
message: "Hey, guys, this is serious stuff: We're taking Enterprse (not
games), Security (at it's core), ADVANCED multi-platform (swift low-cost
development/deployment) and a growing/serious community of contributors"

OK now. How true is this? If not, is this compatible with the Vision for
FlexJS?





Berty Tonta

____________________________________________________________________________



LEADSTALK - 4 BENGALI STREET, BEAU BASSIN, MAURITIUS
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On Tue, Sep 19, 2017 at 12:40 AM, Olaf Krueger <ma...@olafkrueger.net> wrote:

> Hi,
> an important thing for me is sustainability.
> Every day a new JS framework is born and another dies.
> Angular was written from scratch... all who have invested in Angular1 were
> lost.
> This is not suitable for the enterprise.
>
> My understanding is that FlexJS was built with the experience of over a
> decade of Flex development.
> So my hope is that the architecture is well-thought-out and future-proof.
>
> If we'll speak about WebAssembly or whatever other targets someday...
> FlexJS
> has the potential to fit for them all... hopefully ;-)
>
> Thanks,
> Olaf
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from: http://apache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com/
>

Re: [FLEXJS][Marketing] why should a web dev choose FlexJS?

[Olaf Krueger <ma...@olafkrueger.net>]

Hi,
an important thing for me is sustainability.
Every day a new JS framework is born and another dies.
Angular was written from scratch... all who have invested in Angular1 were
lost.
This is not suitable for the enterprise.

My understanding is that FlexJS was built with the experience of over a
decade of Flex development.
So my hope is that the architecture is well-thought-out and future-proof.

If we'll speak about WebAssembly or whatever other targets someday... FlexJS
has the potential to fit for them all... hopefully ;-)

Thanks,
Olaf



--
Sent from: http://apache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com/