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Posted to users@activemq.apache.org by GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com> on 2007/02/20 01:46:23 UTC
ActiveMQ Broker dying
I'm having a problem with my Broker shutting down for no reason.
I'm running it with mostly default configuration from command line:
/opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq > /dev/null &
My config file sets up the broker with Derby persistence adapter.
<broker brokerName="amqDev2" useShutdownHook="false" useJmx="true"
xmlns="http://activemq.org/config/1.0">
Here are the last few logs out of activemq.log:
-----------
2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
- Deleted 0 old message(s).
2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
- Cleanup done.
2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
- Checkpoint done.
2007-02-20 00:14:47,336 [34.186.85:58648] DEBUG UsageManager
- Memory usage change. from: 19, to: 20
2007-02-20 00:16:17,991 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
- Checkpoint started.
2007-02-20 00:16:18,001 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
- Checkpoint done.
2007-02-20 00:18:03,432 [main ] INFO BrokerService
- ActiveMQ Message Broker (amqDev2,
ID:atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net-38553-1171920526058-1:0) is shutting down
2007-02-20 00:18:03,434 [main ] INFO NetworkConnector
- Network Connector default-nc Stopped
----------------
Everything is working fine, messages are going across, then all of a sudden,
for no reason broker shuts down.
This is driving me nuts, as this problem has been happening for a while now,
and I cannot figure out why.
Any suggestion is appreciated!
--
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Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by James Strachan <ja...@gmail.com>.
On 2/20/07, GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>
> I'm getting the feeling that my session terminal closing does have something
> to do with it.
>
> So, would you recommend using that JSW service? You said in the previous
> posts that it has problems, so should I even other trying?
>
> Our Linux guys are telling me to run it like this instead:
>
> "nohup /opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq > /dev/null &"
>
> Perhaps that should be put in your documentation as the only way to make
> sure the broker can be ran from command line as a background process without
> dying.
Good point - I've added a warning to the wiki page
http://cwiki.apache.org/ACTIVEMQ/run-broker.html
--
James
-------
http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by "Christopher G. Stach II" <cg...@ldsys.net>.
Christopher G. Stach II wrote:
> GaryG wrote:
>> I'm getting the feeling that my session terminal closing does have something
>> to do with it.
>>
>> So, would you recommend using that JSW service? You said in the previous
>> posts that it has problems, so should I even other trying?
>>
>> Our Linux guys are telling me to run it like this instead:
>>
>> "nohup /opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq > /dev/null &"
>>
>> Perhaps that should be put in your documentation as the only way to make
>> sure the broker can be ran from command line as a background process without
>> dying.
>
> Try either configuring JSW (better idea) or running your broker like this:
>
> nohup blahblah/bin/activemq start > /dev/null 2>&1 &
>
> The JSW packaged with 4.1.0 is out of date and the example wrapper.conf
> is pretty broken. There are some web pages about fixing the JSW config,
> though. Google for org.tanukisoftware.wrapper.WrapperStartStopApp and
> activemq, maybe.
>
Drrr. Somehow, I didn't realize you had already typed the nohup thing.
It's Mardi Gras. :)
--
Christopher G. Stach II
Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by "Christopher G. Stach II" <cg...@ldsys.net>.
GaryG wrote:
> I'm getting the feeling that my session terminal closing does have something
> to do with it.
>
> So, would you recommend using that JSW service? You said in the previous
> posts that it has problems, so should I even other trying?
>
> Our Linux guys are telling me to run it like this instead:
>
> "nohup /opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq > /dev/null &"
>
> Perhaps that should be put in your documentation as the only way to make
> sure the broker can be ran from command line as a background process without
> dying.
Try either configuring JSW (better idea) or running your broker like this:
nohup blahblah/bin/activemq start > /dev/null 2>&1 &
The JSW packaged with 4.1.0 is out of date and the example wrapper.conf
is pretty broken. There are some web pages about fixing the JSW config,
though. Google for org.tanukisoftware.wrapper.WrapperStartStopApp and
activemq, maybe.
--
Christopher G. Stach II
Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com>.
I'm getting the feeling that my session terminal closing does have something
to do with it.
So, would you recommend using that JSW service? You said in the previous
posts that it has problems, so should I even other trying?
Our Linux guys are telling me to run it like this instead:
"nohup /opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq > /dev/null &"
Perhaps that should be put in your documentation as the only way to make
sure the broker can be ran from command line as a background process without
dying.
Christopher G. Stach II wrote:
>
> GaryG wrote:
>> 1. Is JSW enabled by default in AMQ? Like I said, I don't see it
>> running.
>
> The wrapper init script (named activemq) and config (named wrapper.conf)
> live in apache-activemq-4.1.0-incubator/bin/linux/.
>
>> 3. By turning on the logging, are you talking about log4j for the AMQ?
>> I've already got it set to debug, what other debug options do you need
>> turned on?
>
> Yeah, log4j. Trace, maybe?
>
>> Also, it seems that when I run the broker as
>> "/opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq" without putting it into background
>> with
>> "&", it's been staying up since this morning. I don't see how that'd be
>> different from running it in the background. Just an observation.
>
> When you put the broker into the background with &, does that session
> stay open? Could the terminal's disonnection and HUP signal be killing
> it on you?
>
>> Is it recommended to always run it embedded, and not put it in background
>> as
>> a command line process?
>
> Totally depends on your requirements. Both are recommended, I think. :)
>
> --
> Christopher G. Stach II
>
>
>
--
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Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by "Christopher G. Stach II" <cg...@ldsys.net>.
GaryG wrote:
> 1. Is JSW enabled by default in AMQ? Like I said, I don't see it running.
The wrapper init script (named activemq) and config (named wrapper.conf)
live in apache-activemq-4.1.0-incubator/bin/linux/.
> 3. By turning on the logging, are you talking about log4j for the AMQ?
> I've already got it set to debug, what other debug options do you need
> turned on?
Yeah, log4j. Trace, maybe?
> Also, it seems that when I run the broker as
> "/opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq" without putting it into background with
> "&", it's been staying up since this morning. I don't see how that'd be
> different from running it in the background. Just an observation.
When you put the broker into the background with &, does that session
stay open? Could the terminal's disonnection and HUP signal be killing
it on you?
> Is it recommended to always run it embedded, and not put it in background as
> a command line process?
Totally depends on your requirements. Both are recommended, I think. :)
--
Christopher G. Stach II
Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com>.
1. Is JSW enabled by default in AMQ? Like I said, I don't see it running.
2. I'll try JVM 1.5.0_09
3. By turning on the logging, are you talking about log4j for the AMQ?
I've already got it set to debug, what other debug options do you need
turned on?
Also, it seems that when I run the broker as
"/opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq" without putting it into background with
"&", it's been staying up since this morning. I don't see how that'd be
different from running it in the background. Just an observation.
Is it recommended to always run it embedded, and not put it in background as
a command line process?
Christopher G. Stach II wrote:
>
>
> AMQ 4.1.0 comes with Java Service Wrapper in the standard binary
> package. It would restart the broker for you. Until you figure out why
> it's stopping, that may be your best bet.
>
> That's definitely a somewhat organized shutdown. It's not just a JVM
> crash, which wouldn't log anything. (The most stable VM I've run AMQ in
> was Sun 1.5.0_09, so you may want to try that just in case.) Turn
> logging up and see where the shutdown init is coming from?
>
> (Might want to obfuscate those "iss.net"s. :))
>
> --
> Christopher G. Stach II
>
>
>
--
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Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by "Christopher G. Stach II" <cg...@ldsys.net>.
GaryG wrote:
> Here's the tail-end of the activemq.log
> ------------------
> 2007-02-20 02:53:13,685 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
> - Deleted 0 old message(s).
> 2007-02-20 02:53:13,685 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
> - Cleanup done.
> 2007-02-20 02:53:13,685 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
> - Checkpoint done.
> 2007-02-20 02:54:42,690 [34.186.82:35922] DEBUG UsageManager
> - Memory usage change. from: 11, to: 12
> 2007-02-20 02:58:43,669 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
> - Checkpoint started.
> 2007-02-20 02:58:43,680 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
> - Cleaning up old messages.
> 2007-02-20 02:58:43,680 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
> - Executing SQL: DELETE FROM ACTIVEMQ_MSGS WHERE ( EXPIRATION<>0 AND
> EXPIRATION<?) OR ID <= ( SELECT min(ACTIVEMQ_ACKS.LAST_ACKED_ID) FROM
> ACTIVEMQ_ACKS WHERE ACTIVEMQ_ACKS.CONTAINER=ACTIVEMQ_MSGS.CONTAINER)
> 2007-02-20 02:58:43,681 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
> - Deleted 0 old message(s).
> 2007-02-20 02:58:43,682 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
> - Cleanup done.
> 2007-02-20 02:58:43,682 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
> - Checkpoint done.
> 2007-02-20 03:01:03,878 [main ] INFO BrokerService
> - ActiveMQ Message Broker (amqDev2,
> ID:atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net-38984-1171932491732-1:0) is shutting down
> 2007-02-20 03:01:03,879 [main ] INFO NetworkConnector
> - Network Connector default-nc Stopped
> ------------------------
>
> Following your posted commands, I looked for the Java Service Wrapper
> running, and did not see any such process. I couldn't find the wrapper.log
> either. I'm assuming from that it's not running. I'm not aware of us ever
> using this tool.
>
> Our OS is RedHat Linux. We're running java version "1.5.0_07"
>
> _Gary
AMQ 4.1.0 comes with Java Service Wrapper in the standard binary
package. It would restart the broker for you. Until you figure out why
it's stopping, that may be your best bet.
That's definitely a somewhat organized shutdown. It's not just a JVM
crash, which wouldn't log anything. (The most stable VM I've run AMQ in
was Sun 1.5.0_09, so you may want to try that just in case.) Turn
logging up and see where the shutdown init is coming from?
(Might want to obfuscate those "iss.net"s. :))
--
Christopher G. Stach II
Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com>.
Here's the tail-end of the activemq.log
------------------
2007-02-20 02:53:13,685 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
- Deleted 0 old message(s).
2007-02-20 02:53:13,685 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
- Cleanup done.
2007-02-20 02:53:13,685 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
- Checkpoint done.
2007-02-20 02:54:42,690 [34.186.82:35922] DEBUG UsageManager
- Memory usage change. from: 11, to: 12
2007-02-20 02:58:43,669 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
- Checkpoint started.
2007-02-20 02:58:43,680 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
- Cleaning up old messages.
2007-02-20 02:58:43,680 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
- Executing SQL: DELETE FROM ACTIVEMQ_MSGS WHERE ( EXPIRATION<>0 AND
EXPIRATION<?) OR ID <= ( SELECT min(ACTIVEMQ_ACKS.LAST_ACKED_ID) FROM
ACTIVEMQ_ACKS WHERE ACTIVEMQ_ACKS.CONTAINER=ACTIVEMQ_MSGS.CONTAINER)
2007-02-20 02:58:43,681 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
- Deleted 0 old message(s).
2007-02-20 02:58:43,682 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
- Cleanup done.
2007-02-20 02:58:43,682 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
- Checkpoint done.
2007-02-20 03:01:03,878 [main ] INFO BrokerService
- ActiveMQ Message Broker (amqDev2,
ID:atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net-38984-1171932491732-1:0) is shutting down
2007-02-20 03:01:03,879 [main ] INFO NetworkConnector
- Network Connector default-nc Stopped
------------------------
Following your posted commands, I looked for the Java Service Wrapper
running, and did not see any such process. I couldn't find the wrapper.log
either. I'm assuming from that it's not running. I'm not aware of us ever
using this tool.
Our OS is RedHat Linux. We're running java version "1.5.0_07"
_Gary
James.Strachan wrote:
>
> On 2/20/07, GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>>
>> No, I'm not sending any kill commands...
>>
>> I don't even know how to send a kill command to the broker. And I do not
>> have any JMX consoles open to connect to the process and kill it.
>>
>> Once the broker goes down I get errors like this on the receiver:
>>
>> ----------
>> 2007-02-20 03:01:04,296 [AcitveMQ Connection Worker:
>> tcp://atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net/209.134.186.83:61616] ERROR jms_comm -
>> FactoryUtil.onException: javax.jms.JMSException: java.io.EOFException
>> 2007-02-20 03:01:04,296 [AcitveMQ Connection Worker:
>> tcp://atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net/209.134.186.83:61616] DEBUG jms_comm -
>> JMS
>> Exception occured. Server is down.
>> ----------
>
> Is that a client log? Do you get anything in the ActiveMQ broker log?
> --
>
> James
> -------
> http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
>
>
--
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Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by James Strachan <ja...@gmail.com>.
On 2/20/07, GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>
> No, I'm not sending any kill commands...
>
> I don't even know how to send a kill command to the broker. And I do not
> have any JMX consoles open to connect to the process and kill it.
>
> Once the broker goes down I get errors like this on the receiver:
>
> ----------
> 2007-02-20 03:01:04,296 [AcitveMQ Connection Worker:
> tcp://atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net/209.134.186.83:61616] ERROR jms_comm -
> FactoryUtil.onException: javax.jms.JMSException: java.io.EOFException
> 2007-02-20 03:01:04,296 [AcitveMQ Connection Worker:
> tcp://atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net/209.134.186.83:61616] DEBUG jms_comm - JMS
> Exception occured. Server is down.
> ----------
Is that a client log? Do you get anything in the ActiveMQ broker log?
--
James
-------
http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com>.
No, I'm not sending any kill commands...
I don't even know how to send a kill command to the broker. And I do not
have any JMX consoles open to connect to the process and kill it.
Once the broker goes down I get errors like this on the receiver:
----------
2007-02-20 03:01:04,296 [AcitveMQ Connection Worker:
tcp://atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net/209.134.186.83:61616] ERROR jms_comm -
FactoryUtil.onException: javax.jms.JMSException: java.io.EOFException
2007-02-20 03:01:04,296 [AcitveMQ Connection Worker:
tcp://atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net/209.134.186.83:61616] DEBUG jms_comm - JMS
Exception occured. Server is down.
----------
James.Strachan wrote:
>
> On 2/20/07, GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>>
>> I am not using a Java Service Wrapper. Not sure what that is.
>>
>> Broker just died again last night.
>>
>> I am using the broker as installed, just from command line, with the only
>> modifications to the config file being the turning off of the shutdown
>> hook,
>> adding jmx, and commenting out the network connector stuff. Literally
>> it's
>> pretty much out of the box.
>>
>> This is absolutely critical for our system, I don't understand why the
>> broker just dies, and this has been happening regularly! I know it's not
>> due to a rogue "control-C" being pressed (had those issues too and fixed
>> them by disabling the shutdown hook)
>
> You sure noones sending it kill signals or using JMX to shut it down?
>
> I've never seen a broker just stop before, particularly with no errors.
>
> Whats your platform?
>
>> Does the broker HAVE to be used as "embedded" in a java process to keep
>> it
>> from dying?
>
> Its Java so you can embed it in any JVM you like, or use the command line
> tools.
>
> --
>
> James
> -------
> http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
>
>
--
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Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by James Strachan <ja...@gmail.com>.
On 2/20/07, GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>
> I am not using a Java Service Wrapper. Not sure what that is.
>
> Broker just died again last night.
>
> I am using the broker as installed, just from command line, with the only
> modifications to the config file being the turning off of the shutdown hook,
> adding jmx, and commenting out the network connector stuff. Literally it's
> pretty much out of the box.
>
> This is absolutely critical for our system, I don't understand why the
> broker just dies, and this has been happening regularly! I know it's not
> due to a rogue "control-C" being pressed (had those issues too and fixed
> them by disabling the shutdown hook)
You sure noones sending it kill signals or using JMX to shut it down?
I've never seen a broker just stop before, particularly with no errors.
Whats your platform?
> Does the broker HAVE to be used as "embedded" in a java process to keep it
> from dying?
Its Java so you can embed it in any JVM you like, or use the command line tools.
--
James
-------
http://radio.weblogs.com/0112098/
Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by "Christopher G. Stach II" <cg...@ldsys.net>.
GaryG wrote:
> I am not using a Java Service Wrapper. Not sure what that is.
Then how do you know that you aren't using it?
> I am using the broker as installed, just from command line, with the only
> modifications to the config file being the turning off of the shutdown hook,
> adding jmx, and commenting out the network connector stuff. Literally it's
> pretty much out of the box.
ps -auwwx | grep wrapper
cat `find / -type f -name wrapper.log`
:)
> This is absolutely critical for our system, I don't understand why the
> broker just dies, and this has been happening regularly! I know it's not
> due to a rogue "control-C" being pressed (had those issues too and fixed
> them by disabling the shutdown hook)
If it's absolutely critical, maybe you should hire someone to help you.
I don't think it's "just dying", but I have seen the service wrapper
kill a broker for a lot of reasons. It also restarts the broker when it
dies or the wrapper kills it, but I have also seen the wrapper fail to
restart the broker.
--
Christopher G. Stach II
Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by GaryG <gg...@us.ibm.com>.
I am not using a Java Service Wrapper. Not sure what that is.
Broker just died again last night.
I am using the broker as installed, just from command line, with the only
modifications to the config file being the turning off of the shutdown hook,
adding jmx, and commenting out the network connector stuff. Literally it's
pretty much out of the box.
This is absolutely critical for our system, I don't understand why the
broker just dies, and this has been happening regularly! I know it's not
due to a rogue "control-C" being pressed (had those issues too and fixed
them by disabling the shutdown hook)
Does the broker HAVE to be used as "embedded" in a java process to keep it
from dying?
Christopher G. Stach II wrote:
>
> GaryG wrote:
>> I'm having a problem with my Broker shutting down for no reason.
>>
>> I'm running it with mostly default configuration from command line:
>>
>> /opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq > /dev/null &
>>
>> My config file sets up the broker with Derby persistence adapter.
>>
>> <broker brokerName="amqDev2" useShutdownHook="false" useJmx="true"
>> xmlns="http://activemq.org/config/1.0">
>>
>> Here are the last few logs out of activemq.log:
>> -----------
>>
>> 2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
>> - Deleted 0 old message(s).
>> 2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
>> - Cleanup done.
>> 2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
>> - Checkpoint done.
>> 2007-02-20 00:14:47,336 [34.186.85:58648] DEBUG UsageManager
>> - Memory usage change. from: 19, to: 20
>> 2007-02-20 00:16:17,991 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
>> - Checkpoint started.
>> 2007-02-20 00:16:18,001 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
>> - Checkpoint done.
>> 2007-02-20 00:18:03,432 [main ] INFO BrokerService
>> - ActiveMQ Message Broker (amqDev2,
>> ID:atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net-38553-1171920526058-1:0) is shutting down
>> 2007-02-20 00:18:03,434 [main ] INFO NetworkConnector
>> - Network Connector default-nc Stopped
>> ----------------
>>
>> Everything is working fine, messages are going across, then all of a
>> sudden,
>> for no reason broker shuts down.
>>
>> This is driving me nuts, as this problem has been happening for a while
>> now,
>> and I cannot figure out why.
>>
>> Any suggestion is appreciated!
>
> Are you using Java Service Wrapper? What does the wrapper log say?
>
> --
> Christopher G. Stach II
>
>
>
--
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Re: ActiveMQ Broker dying
Posted by "Christopher G. Stach II" <cg...@ldsys.net>.
GaryG wrote:
> I'm having a problem with my Broker shutting down for no reason.
>
> I'm running it with mostly default configuration from command line:
>
> /opt/activemq-4.1.0/bin/activemq > /dev/null &
>
> My config file sets up the broker with Derby persistence adapter.
>
> <broker brokerName="amqDev2" useShutdownHook="false" useJmx="true"
> xmlns="http://activemq.org/config/1.0">
>
> Here are the last few logs out of activemq.log:
> -----------
>
> 2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG DefaultJDBCAdapter
> - Deleted 0 old message(s).
> 2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JDBCPersistenceAdapter
> - Cleanup done.
> 2007-02-20 00:11:18,003 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
> - Checkpoint done.
> 2007-02-20 00:14:47,336 [34.186.85:58648] DEBUG UsageManager
> - Memory usage change. from: 19, to: 20
> 2007-02-20 00:16:17,991 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
> - Checkpoint started.
> 2007-02-20 00:16:18,001 [eckpoint Worker] DEBUG JournalPersistenceAdapter
> - Checkpoint done.
> 2007-02-20 00:18:03,432 [main ] INFO BrokerService
> - ActiveMQ Message Broker (amqDev2,
> ID:atla-dev-aic2.mss.iss.net-38553-1171920526058-1:0) is shutting down
> 2007-02-20 00:18:03,434 [main ] INFO NetworkConnector
> - Network Connector default-nc Stopped
> ----------------
>
> Everything is working fine, messages are going across, then all of a sudden,
> for no reason broker shuts down.
>
> This is driving me nuts, as this problem has been happening for a while now,
> and I cannot figure out why.
>
> Any suggestion is appreciated!
Are you using Java Service Wrapper? What does the wrapper log say?
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Christopher G. Stach II