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Posted to dev@cordova.apache.org by Andrew Grieve <ag...@chromium.org> on 2013/06/17 21:47:23 UTC
Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile a
version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the source
files instead.
My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code much
easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio by
default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to work.
We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports, and I
think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it easier
for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to see &
tweak the code.
Agree / object?
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Brian LeRoux <b...@brian.io>.
We def do not want to do this before 3.0 ...too big of a change.
I think while we are seeing lots of benefits in issue tracking for iOS
I share Joe's anxiety that we may end up with cowboy upgrades
conflicting with project upgrades. Lets get 3 out the door and have a
look after.
Added to roadmap backlog which we'll be discussing much later this
summer I'm sure. [1]
[1] http://wiki.apache.org/cordova/RoadmapProjects
On Tue, Jun 18, 2013 at 3:23 AM, Andrew Grieve <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
> I don't think it's caused any issues on iOS, and it definitely has improved
> bug reports. That's because you get better stack traces on iOS though, I
> don't think the same is true for Android.
>
> I'll also point out that with 3.0, the majority of the code will already be
> in the form of source files since plugin code will not be in the form of
> jars.
>
> There have been several times on Android where I've had back-and-forth on a
> JIRA issue where I say "Hey - can you trying changing this line to that and
> see what happens" and their reply is "I have a JAR and so can't do that".
> If they have the source, then this flow works.
>
> Joe (or anyone else who thinks this is not a good idea) - I'd like to hear
> more about why you think this will cause things to break?
>
>
> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 6:07 PM, Kerri Shotts <ke...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> We surely have data on this, since iOS has transitioned; how many issues
>> have been raised on iOS because someone mucked around where they shouldn't
>> have? Perhaps not directly applicable to Android, but it would perhaps be a
>> rough estimate.
>>
>>
>> ___________________________________
>> Kerri Shotts
>> photoKandy Studios, LLC
>>
>> On the Web: http://www.photokandy.com/
>>
>> Social Media:
>> Twitter: @photokandy, http://twitter.com/photokandy
>> Tumblr: http://photokandy.tumblr.com/
>> Github: https://github.com/kerrishotts
>> https://github.com/organizations/photokandyStudios
>> CoderWall: https://coderwall.com/kerrishotts
>>
>> Apps on the Apple Store:
>>
>> https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/photokandy-studios-llc/id498577828
>>
>> Books:
>>
>> http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-2-mobile-application-hotshot/book
>> http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-social-app-development/book
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jun 17, 2013, at 16:37, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > My bet is six months
>> >
>> > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 2:32 PM, Filip Maj <fi...@adobe.com> wrote:
>> >> I'm ambivalent on this issue.
>> >>
>> >> To play devil's advocate, Joe, it hasn't been an issue on iOS or Windows
>> >> Phone, so any speculation that this _will_ be an issue in the future is
>> >> just that: speculation.
>> >>
>> >> If anything we should set an over/under on how long it will take after
>> >> introducing this change before we get "Hey gaiz I changed
>> >> CordovaWebView.java and now nothing works!" issues ;)
>> >>
>> >> My bet is: a long time.
>> >>
>> >> On 6/17/13 2:11 PM, "Benn Mapes" <be...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> +1
>> >>> I really like having source code. On Windows Phone we have moved from a
>> >>> pre-compiled .dll to just the source as well. Like Kerri said, it is
>> very
>> >>> helpful when stepping through your application and debugging any
>> problems
>> >>> you might have, as well as getting more people looking at the code and
>> >>> understanding it better.
>> >>>
>> >>> If users don't want to look at the source at all they can just treat
>> the
>> >>> cordovaLib folder like it's a .jar and not touch it.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> -1
>> >>>>
>> >>>> This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't
>> >>>> debug
>> >>>> Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge
>> >>>> backlash
>> >>>> from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
>> >>>> On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org>
>> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile
>> a
>> >>>>> version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the
>> source
>> >>>>> files instead.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code
>> >>>> much
>> >>>>> easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio
>> >>>> by
>> >>>>> default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to
>> >>>> work.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
>> >>>>> framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
>> >>>>> results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports,
>> >>>> and
>> >>>> I
>> >>>>> think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it
>> >>>> easier
>> >>>>> for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to
>> >>>> see &
>> >>>>> tweak the code.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Agree / object?
>> >>
>>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Braden Shepherdson <br...@chromium.org>.
I think we should seriously consider this, but agree that it should wait
until after 3.0. It's a good point that 90% of the code formerly in the jar
will be copied in from plugins now.
Braden
On Tue, Jun 18, 2013 at 6:12 AM, Jesse MacFadyen <pu...@gmail.com>wrote:
> The wp7 change Benn mentioned has several motivations behind it. The
> windows phone permission model and the app store's static analysis
> decide permission based on linkage, so having 1 library dll would
> require all permissions, and a separate dll for each API was unwieldy.
>
> In my mind, given our move to plugin separation, the base library
> should be small enough to re-create on every new project.
>
> However, I do understand Joe's position, but I think it is going to
> make less sense once there is just a bridge, and some helpers in the
> 'what was once a jar'
>
> Having people go and change specific lines of code leads to
> challenging updates, since the entire repo becomes modified. That is
> the benefit of having a distributed built library, or linking to a
> library project. Also, in my mind, distributing a .dll/.jar/.a says
> 'here is a thing you can use' while source says, 'here's a pile to
> sift thru and take what you need,' but I'm old school. And code is
> never finished anyway...
>
> Also, instead of basing things on number of issues filed, I suggest
> helping people on the pg mailing list, you will learn a lot more about
> what we do right and wrong.
>
> Cheers,
> Jesse
>
> Sent from my iPhone5
>
> On Jun 17, 2013, at 6:24 PM, Andrew Grieve <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
>
> I don't think it's caused any issues on iOS, and it definitely has improved
> bug reports. That's because you get better stack traces on iOS though, I
> don't think the same is true for Android.
>
> I'll also point out that with 3.0, the majority of the code will already be
> in the form of source files since plugin code will not be in the form of
> jars.
>
> There have been several times on Android where I've had back-and-forth on a
> JIRA issue where I say "Hey - can you trying changing this line to that and
> see what happens" and their reply is "I have a JAR and so can't do that".
> If they have the source, then this flow works.
>
> Joe (or anyone else who thinks this is not a good idea) - I'd like to hear
> more about why you think this will cause things to break?
>
>
> > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 6:07 PM, Kerri Shotts <ke...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > We surely have data on this, since iOS has transitioned; how many issues
> > have been raised on iOS because someone mucked around where they
> shouldn't
> > have? Perhaps not directly applicable to Android, but it would perhaps
> be a
> > rough estimate.
> >
> >
> > ___________________________________
> > Kerri Shotts
> > photoKandy Studios, LLC
> >
> > On the Web: http://www.photokandy.com/
> >
> > Social Media:
> > Twitter: @photokandy, http://twitter.com/photokandy
> > Tumblr: http://photokandy.tumblr.com/
> > Github: https://github.com/kerrishotts
> >
> https://github.com/organizations/photokandyStudios
> > CoderWall: https://coderwall.com/kerrishotts
> >
> > Apps on the Apple Store:
> >
> > https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/photokandy-studios-llc/id498577828
> >
> > Books:
> >
> > http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-2-mobile-application-hotshot/book
> > http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-social-app-development/book
> >
> >
> >
> >>> On Jun 17, 2013, at 16:37, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> My bet is six months
> >>
> >>> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 2:32 PM, Filip Maj <fi...@adobe.com> wrote:
> >>> I'm ambivalent on this issue.
> >>>
> >>> To play devil's advocate, Joe, it hasn't been an issue on iOS or
> Windows
> >>> Phone, so any speculation that this _will_ be an issue in the future is
> >>> just that: speculation.
> >>>
> >>> If anything we should set an over/under on how long it will take after
> >>> introducing this change before we get "Hey gaiz I changed
> >>> CordovaWebView.java and now nothing works!" issues ;)
> >>>
> >>> My bet is: a long time.
> >>>
> >>>> On 6/17/13 2:11 PM, "Benn Mapes" <be...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> +1
> >>>> I really like having source code. On Windows Phone we have moved from
> a
> >>>> pre-compiled .dll to just the source as well. Like Kerri said, it is
> > very
> >>>> helpful when stepping through your application and debugging any
> > problems
> >>>> you might have, as well as getting more people looking at the code and
> >>>> understanding it better.
> >>>>
> >>>> If users don't want to look at the source at all they can just treat
> > the
> >>>> cordovaLib folder like it's a .jar and not touch it.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -1
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't
> >>>>> debug
> >>>>> Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge
> >>>>> backlash
> >>>>> from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
> >>>>> On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org>
> > wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile
> > a
> >>>>>> version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the
> > source
> >>>>>> files instead.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code
> >>>>> much
> >>>>>> easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android
> Studio
> >>>>> by
> >>>>>> default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this
> to
> >>>>> work.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
> >>>>>> framework library to just copying over source files), and I think
> the
> >>>>>> results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports,
> >>>>> and
> >>>>> I
> >>>>>> think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it
> >>>>> easier
> >>>>>> for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able
> to
> >>>>> see &
> >>>>>> tweak the code.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Agree / object?
> >
>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Jesse MacFadyen <pu...@gmail.com>.
The wp7 change Benn mentioned has several motivations behind it. The
windows phone permission model and the app store's static analysis
decide permission based on linkage, so having 1 library dll would
require all permissions, and a separate dll for each API was unwieldy.
In my mind, given our move to plugin separation, the base library
should be small enough to re-create on every new project.
However, I do understand Joe's position, but I think it is going to
make less sense once there is just a bridge, and some helpers in the
'what was once a jar'
Having people go and change specific lines of code leads to
challenging updates, since the entire repo becomes modified. That is
the benefit of having a distributed built library, or linking to a
library project. Also, in my mind, distributing a .dll/.jar/.a says
'here is a thing you can use' while source says, 'here's a pile to
sift thru and take what you need,' but I'm old school. And code is
never finished anyway...
Also, instead of basing things on number of issues filed, I suggest
helping people on the pg mailing list, you will learn a lot more about
what we do right and wrong.
Cheers,
Jesse
Sent from my iPhone5
On Jun 17, 2013, at 6:24 PM, Andrew Grieve <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
I don't think it's caused any issues on iOS, and it definitely has improved
bug reports. That's because you get better stack traces on iOS though, I
don't think the same is true for Android.
I'll also point out that with 3.0, the majority of the code will already be
in the form of source files since plugin code will not be in the form of
jars.
There have been several times on Android where I've had back-and-forth on a
JIRA issue where I say "Hey - can you trying changing this line to that and
see what happens" and their reply is "I have a JAR and so can't do that".
If they have the source, then this flow works.
Joe (or anyone else who thinks this is not a good idea) - I'd like to hear
more about why you think this will cause things to break?
> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 6:07 PM, Kerri Shotts <ke...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> We surely have data on this, since iOS has transitioned; how many issues
> have been raised on iOS because someone mucked around where they shouldn't
> have? Perhaps not directly applicable to Android, but it would perhaps be a
> rough estimate.
>
>
> ___________________________________
> Kerri Shotts
> photoKandy Studios, LLC
>
> On the Web: http://www.photokandy.com/
>
> Social Media:
> Twitter: @photokandy, http://twitter.com/photokandy
> Tumblr: http://photokandy.tumblr.com/
> Github: https://github.com/kerrishotts
> https://github.com/organizations/photokandyStudios
> CoderWall: https://coderwall.com/kerrishotts
>
> Apps on the Apple Store:
>
> https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/photokandy-studios-llc/id498577828
>
> Books:
>
> http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-2-mobile-application-hotshot/book
> http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-social-app-development/book
>
>
>
>>> On Jun 17, 2013, at 16:37, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> My bet is six months
>>
>>> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 2:32 PM, Filip Maj <fi...@adobe.com> wrote:
>>> I'm ambivalent on this issue.
>>>
>>> To play devil's advocate, Joe, it hasn't been an issue on iOS or Windows
>>> Phone, so any speculation that this _will_ be an issue in the future is
>>> just that: speculation.
>>>
>>> If anything we should set an over/under on how long it will take after
>>> introducing this change before we get "Hey gaiz I changed
>>> CordovaWebView.java and now nothing works!" issues ;)
>>>
>>> My bet is: a long time.
>>>
>>>> On 6/17/13 2:11 PM, "Benn Mapes" <be...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> +1
>>>> I really like having source code. On Windows Phone we have moved from a
>>>> pre-compiled .dll to just the source as well. Like Kerri said, it is
> very
>>>> helpful when stepping through your application and debugging any
> problems
>>>> you might have, as well as getting more people looking at the code and
>>>> understanding it better.
>>>>
>>>> If users don't want to look at the source at all they can just treat
> the
>>>> cordovaLib folder like it's a .jar and not touch it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> -1
>>>>>
>>>>> This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't
>>>>> debug
>>>>> Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge
>>>>> backlash
>>>>> from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
>>>>> On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org>
> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile
> a
>>>>>> version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the
> source
>>>>>> files instead.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code
>>>>> much
>>>>>> easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio
>>>>> by
>>>>>> default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to
>>>>> work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
>>>>>> framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
>>>>>> results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports,
>>>>> and
>>>>> I
>>>>>> think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it
>>>>> easier
>>>>>> for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to
>>>>> see &
>>>>>> tweak the code.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Agree / object?
>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Andrew Grieve <ag...@chromium.org>.
I don't think it's caused any issues on iOS, and it definitely has improved
bug reports. That's because you get better stack traces on iOS though, I
don't think the same is true for Android.
I'll also point out that with 3.0, the majority of the code will already be
in the form of source files since plugin code will not be in the form of
jars.
There have been several times on Android where I've had back-and-forth on a
JIRA issue where I say "Hey - can you trying changing this line to that and
see what happens" and their reply is "I have a JAR and so can't do that".
If they have the source, then this flow works.
Joe (or anyone else who thinks this is not a good idea) - I'd like to hear
more about why you think this will cause things to break?
On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 6:07 PM, Kerri Shotts <ke...@gmail.com> wrote:
> We surely have data on this, since iOS has transitioned; how many issues
> have been raised on iOS because someone mucked around where they shouldn't
> have? Perhaps not directly applicable to Android, but it would perhaps be a
> rough estimate.
>
>
> ___________________________________
> Kerri Shotts
> photoKandy Studios, LLC
>
> On the Web: http://www.photokandy.com/
>
> Social Media:
> Twitter: @photokandy, http://twitter.com/photokandy
> Tumblr: http://photokandy.tumblr.com/
> Github: https://github.com/kerrishotts
> https://github.com/organizations/photokandyStudios
> CoderWall: https://coderwall.com/kerrishotts
>
> Apps on the Apple Store:
>
> https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/photokandy-studios-llc/id498577828
>
> Books:
>
> http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-2-mobile-application-hotshot/book
> http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-social-app-development/book
>
>
>
> On Jun 17, 2013, at 16:37, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > My bet is six months
> >
> > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 2:32 PM, Filip Maj <fi...@adobe.com> wrote:
> >> I'm ambivalent on this issue.
> >>
> >> To play devil's advocate, Joe, it hasn't been an issue on iOS or Windows
> >> Phone, so any speculation that this _will_ be an issue in the future is
> >> just that: speculation.
> >>
> >> If anything we should set an over/under on how long it will take after
> >> introducing this change before we get "Hey gaiz I changed
> >> CordovaWebView.java and now nothing works!" issues ;)
> >>
> >> My bet is: a long time.
> >>
> >> On 6/17/13 2:11 PM, "Benn Mapes" <be...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>> +1
> >>> I really like having source code. On Windows Phone we have moved from a
> >>> pre-compiled .dll to just the source as well. Like Kerri said, it is
> very
> >>> helpful when stepping through your application and debugging any
> problems
> >>> you might have, as well as getting more people looking at the code and
> >>> understanding it better.
> >>>
> >>> If users don't want to look at the source at all they can just treat
> the
> >>> cordovaLib folder like it's a .jar and not touch it.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> -1
> >>>>
> >>>> This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't
> >>>> debug
> >>>> Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
> >>>>
> >>>> I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge
> >>>> backlash
> >>>> from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
> >>>> On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org>
> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile
> a
> >>>>> version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the
> source
> >>>>> files instead.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code
> >>>> much
> >>>>> easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio
> >>>> by
> >>>>> default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to
> >>>> work.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
> >>>>> framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
> >>>>> results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports,
> >>>> and
> >>>> I
> >>>>> think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it
> >>>> easier
> >>>>> for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to
> >>>> see &
> >>>>> tweak the code.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Agree / object?
> >>
>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Kerri Shotts <ke...@gmail.com>.
We surely have data on this, since iOS has transitioned; how many issues have been raised on iOS because someone mucked around where they shouldn't have? Perhaps not directly applicable to Android, but it would perhaps be a rough estimate.
___________________________________
Kerri Shotts
photoKandy Studios, LLC
On the Web: http://www.photokandy.com/
Social Media:
Twitter: @photokandy, http://twitter.com/photokandy
Tumblr: http://photokandy.tumblr.com/
Github: https://github.com/kerrishotts
https://github.com/organizations/photokandyStudios
CoderWall: https://coderwall.com/kerrishotts
Apps on the Apple Store:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/photokandy-studios-llc/id498577828
Books:
http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-2-mobile-application-hotshot/book
http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-social-app-development/book
On Jun 17, 2013, at 16:37, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> My bet is six months
>
> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 2:32 PM, Filip Maj <fi...@adobe.com> wrote:
>> I'm ambivalent on this issue.
>>
>> To play devil's advocate, Joe, it hasn't been an issue on iOS or Windows
>> Phone, so any speculation that this _will_ be an issue in the future is
>> just that: speculation.
>>
>> If anything we should set an over/under on how long it will take after
>> introducing this change before we get "Hey gaiz I changed
>> CordovaWebView.java and now nothing works!" issues ;)
>>
>> My bet is: a long time.
>>
>> On 6/17/13 2:11 PM, "Benn Mapes" <be...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> +1
>>> I really like having source code. On Windows Phone we have moved from a
>>> pre-compiled .dll to just the source as well. Like Kerri said, it is very
>>> helpful when stepping through your application and debugging any problems
>>> you might have, as well as getting more people looking at the code and
>>> understanding it better.
>>>
>>> If users don't want to look at the source at all they can just treat the
>>> cordovaLib folder like it's a .jar and not touch it.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> -1
>>>>
>>>> This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't
>>>> debug
>>>> Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
>>>>
>>>> I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge
>>>> backlash
>>>> from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
>>>> On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile a
>>>>> version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the source
>>>>> files instead.
>>>>>
>>>>> My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code
>>>> much
>>>>> easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio
>>>> by
>>>>> default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to
>>>> work.
>>>>>
>>>>> We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
>>>>> framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
>>>>> results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports,
>>>> and
>>>> I
>>>>> think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it
>>>> easier
>>>>> for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to
>>>> see &
>>>>> tweak the code.
>>>>>
>>>>> Agree / object?
>>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com>.
My bet is six months
On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 2:32 PM, Filip Maj <fi...@adobe.com> wrote:
> I'm ambivalent on this issue.
>
> To play devil's advocate, Joe, it hasn't been an issue on iOS or Windows
> Phone, so any speculation that this _will_ be an issue in the future is
> just that: speculation.
>
> If anything we should set an over/under on how long it will take after
> introducing this change before we get "Hey gaiz I changed
> CordovaWebView.java and now nothing works!" issues ;)
>
> My bet is: a long time.
>
> On 6/17/13 2:11 PM, "Benn Mapes" <be...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>+1
>>I really like having source code. On Windows Phone we have moved from a
>>pre-compiled .dll to just the source as well. Like Kerri said, it is very
>>helpful when stepping through your application and debugging any problems
>>you might have, as well as getting more people looking at the code and
>>understanding it better.
>>
>>If users don't want to look at the source at all they can just treat the
>>cordovaLib folder like it's a .jar and not touch it.
>>
>>
>>On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> -1
>>>
>>> This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't
>>>debug
>>> Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
>>>
>>> I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge
>>>backlash
>>> from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
>>> On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> > I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile a
>>> > version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the source
>>> > files instead.
>>> >
>>> > My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code
>>>much
>>> > easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio
>>>by
>>> > default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to
>>> work.
>>> >
>>> > We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
>>> > framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
>>> > results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports,
>>>and
>>> I
>>> > think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it
>>> easier
>>> > for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to
>>> see &
>>> > tweak the code.
>>> >
>>> > Agree / object?
>>> >
>>>
>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Filip Maj <fi...@adobe.com>.
I'm ambivalent on this issue.
To play devil's advocate, Joe, it hasn't been an issue on iOS or Windows
Phone, so any speculation that this _will_ be an issue in the future is
just that: speculation.
If anything we should set an over/under on how long it will take after
introducing this change before we get "Hey gaiz I changed
CordovaWebView.java and now nothing works!" issues ;)
My bet is: a long time.
On 6/17/13 2:11 PM, "Benn Mapes" <be...@gmail.com> wrote:
>+1
>I really like having source code. On Windows Phone we have moved from a
>pre-compiled .dll to just the source as well. Like Kerri said, it is very
>helpful when stepping through your application and debugging any problems
>you might have, as well as getting more people looking at the code and
>understanding it better.
>
>If users don't want to look at the source at all they can just treat the
>cordovaLib folder like it's a .jar and not touch it.
>
>
>On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> -1
>>
>> This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't
>>debug
>> Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
>>
>> I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge
>>backlash
>> from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
>> On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
>>
>> > I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile a
>> > version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the source
>> > files instead.
>> >
>> > My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code
>>much
>> > easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio
>>by
>> > default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to
>> work.
>> >
>> > We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
>> > framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
>> > results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports,
>>and
>> I
>> > think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it
>> easier
>> > for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to
>> see &
>> > tweak the code.
>> >
>> > Agree / object?
>> >
>>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Benn Mapes <be...@gmail.com>.
+1
I really like having source code. On Windows Phone we have moved from a
pre-compiled .dll to just the source as well. Like Kerri said, it is very
helpful when stepping through your application and debugging any problems
you might have, as well as getting more people looking at the code and
understanding it better.
If users don't want to look at the source at all they can just treat the
cordovaLib folder like it's a .jar and not touch it.
On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> -1
>
> This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't debug
> Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
>
> I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge backlash
> from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
> On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
>
> > I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile a
> > version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the source
> > files instead.
> >
> > My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code much
> > easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio by
> > default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to
> work.
> >
> > We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
> > framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
> > results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports, and
> I
> > think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it
> easier
> > for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to
> see &
> > tweak the code.
> >
> > Agree / object?
> >
>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Joe Bowser <bo...@gmail.com>.
-1
This only caters to a minority of our users. Most of our users can't debug
Cordova, since they can't write Java (or even Javascript) well.
I think this will have far more things break and we'll have a huge backlash
from our mainstream users, just like when we deprecated plugins.
On Jun 17, 2013 12:48 PM, "Andrew Grieve" <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
> I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile a
> version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the source
> files instead.
>
> My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code much
> easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio by
> default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to work.
>
> We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
> framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
> results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports, and I
> think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it easier
> for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to see &
> tweak the code.
>
> Agree / object?
>
Re: Android: Use source files instead of .jar file
Posted by Kerri Shotts <ke...@gmail.com>.
Big +1 from me: Being able to debug in to the IOS internals has saved me
more than once. Usually a change in the internals isn't necessary, but
often elucidates why my approach is failing, more than an error message (or
a silently failing error) does.
My only potential concern is build time. My machine builds (from scratch) a
Cordova project pretty quickly (a few tens of seconds at the longest). Any
longer than that and places where you have to clean the project and rebuild
might be frustrating. (Even so, I prefer being able to debug rather than
having a fast clean build).
Sent from my phone.
___________________________________
Kerri Shotts
photoKandy Studios, LLC
On the Web: http://www.photokandy.com/
Social Media:
Twitter: @photokandy, http://twitter.com/photokandy
Tumblr: http://photokandy.tumblr.com/
Github: https://github.com/kerrishotts
https://github.com/organizations/photokandyStudios
CoderWall: https://coderwall.com/kerrishotts
Apps on the Apple Store:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/artist/photokandy-studios-llc/id498577828
Books:
http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-2-mobile-application-hotshot/book
http://www.packtpub.com/phonegap-social-app-development/book
On Jun 17, 2013, at 14:48, Andrew Grieve <ag...@chromium.org> wrote:
I'd like to propose that instead of having the create script compile a
version of Cordova into a .jar, that instead it copies over the source
files instead.
My main motivation is that doing so will make debugging native code much
easier since the source code will show up in Eclipse / Android Studio by
default instead of needing to reconfigure your project to get this to work.
We did the same change on iOS a while ago (moving from a precompiled
framework library to just copying over source files), and I think the
results were quite positive. It helps users file better bug reports, and I
think also encourages them to submit bug fixes. It will also make it easier
for Plugin developers to figure out our APIs since they'll be able to see &
tweak the code.
Agree / object?