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Posted to dev@myfaces.apache.org by Mario Ivankovits <ma...@ops.co.at> on 2007/09/08 21:04:00 UTC
Re: [orchestra] Conversation Timeouts (was changed scope
configuration)
Simon,
>If this element is not specified,
>the container must set its default
>timeout
I think the spec is not very helpful with this text as it does not say what the "container default value" is.
With respect to memory usage this is even more important for Orhestra as a developer often do not even know which entities live in the persitence context cache.
I definitely think this "small topic" is worth discussing it - later we have to argue why we felt the decision in one way or the other - we should be prepared; regardless of what we decide at the end ...
Mario
-----Original Message-----
From: simon <si...@chello.at>
Date: Saturday, Sep 8, 2007 8:36 pm
Subject: Re: [orchestra] Conversation Timeouts (was changed scope configuration)
To: Reply- "MyFaces Development" <de...@myfaces.apache.org>To: MyFaces Development <de...@myfaces.apache.org>
Ok, so I guess orchestra could use that same convention. This is still a
>"magic number" that people will need to look up in the docs, though.
>
>I still think it is more intuitive for people to not get a conversation timeout unless they configure one. There will be absolutely no surprised developers wondering where their beans went.
>
>The http session really does have to be a sane default as otherwise memory usage will eventually bring down the whole webapp. But with
>Orchestra, the conversations do eventually go away - when the session does.
>
>My, we have spent a lot of bandwidth on a very small point :-)
>
>It's nice to see people are interested in Orchestra though.
>
>Regards,
>
>Simon
>
>On Sat, 2007-09-08 at 19:03 +0200, Bernhard Huemer wrote:
> Hello,
>
> according to the Servlet specification:
>
> ///
> The session-timeout element defines the default
> session timeout interval for all sessions created
> in this web application. The specified timeout
> must be expressed in a whole number of minutes.
> If the timeout is 0 or less, the container ensures
> the default behaviour of sessions is never to time
> out. If this element is not specified, the container
> must set its default timeout period.
> \\\
>
> regards,
> Bernhard
>
> On 08.09.2007 18:48, Mario Ivankovits wrote:
> > Hi!
> >
> >
> >> If no timeout property is present, then no timeout applies.
> >> Otherwise, the specified timeout applies.
> >>
> >
> > You are right too with all you said.
> > Hmmm .... No pc here yet, but, how do a servlet container behave if there is no session timeout configured or is it a required configuration?
> >
> > Ciao,
> > Mario
> >
>
>
Re: [orchestra] Conversation Timeouts (was changed scope configuration)
Posted by Mario Ivankovits <ma...@ops.co.at>.
Hi!
> IMHO, a conversation should behave exactly the same as the session
> does today - per default. There is nothing elementary different just
> because you can have a multitude of conversations per user.
>
Getting in touch to the servlet timeout means we have to extend the
FrameworkAdapter interface with something like getDefaultTimeout(), but,
based on another ml thread, I thought about using Orchestra in a
non-servlet-based environment and then why should this framework have a
default timeout at all. A Swing-based application framework wouldn't
provide any timeout value too.
Which means, depending on the framework you use Orchestra with you have
to set a timeout value or not.
Regarding the session timeout. For example, we use a rather small
session timeout and a regular AJAX poll to keep it alive. In such a
setup (which might become even more popular) the default is just wrong
and you'd set the conversation timeout to something different.
Finally, I tend to NOT set any default value as it is easy to understand
and document how to set one yourself, but it might become tricky to tell
the user when a default timeout applies and when it doesn't.
Ciao,
Mario
Re: [orchestra] Conversation Timeouts (was changed scope configuration)
Posted by Martin Marinschek <ma...@gmail.com>.
IMHO, a conversation should behave exactly the same as the session
does today - per default. There is nothing elementary different just
because you can have a multitude of conversations per user.
regards,
Martin
On 9/8/07, Mario Ivankovits <ma...@ops.co.at> wrote:
> Simon,
>
> >If this element is not specified,
> >the container must set its default
> >timeout
>
> I think the spec is not very helpful with this text as it does not say what the "container default value" is.
>
> With respect to memory usage this is even more important for Orhestra as a developer often do not even know which entities live in the persitence context cache.
>
> I definitely think this "small topic" is worth discussing it - later we have to argue why we felt the decision in one way or the other - we should be prepared; regardless of what we decide at the end ...
>
>
> Mario
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: simon <si...@chello.at>
> Date: Saturday, Sep 8, 2007 8:36 pm
> Subject: Re: [orchestra] Conversation Timeouts (was changed scope configuration)
> To: Reply- "MyFaces Development" <de...@myfaces.apache.org>To: MyFaces Development <de...@myfaces.apache.org>
>
> Ok, so I guess orchestra could use that same convention. This is still a
> >"magic number" that people will need to look up in the docs, though.
> >
> >I still think it is more intuitive for people to not get a conversation timeout unless they configure one. There will be absolutely no surprised developers wondering where their beans went.
> >
> >The http session really does have to be a sane default as otherwise memory usage will eventually bring down the whole webapp. But with
> >Orchestra, the conversations do eventually go away - when the session does.
> >
> >My, we have spent a lot of bandwidth on a very small point :-)
> >
> >It's nice to see people are interested in Orchestra though.
> >
> >Regards,
> >
> >Simon
> >
> >On Sat, 2007-09-08 at 19:03 +0200, Bernhard Huemer wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > according to the Servlet specification:
> >
> > ///
> > The session-timeout element defines the default
> > session timeout interval for all sessions created
> > in this web application. The specified timeout
> > must be expressed in a whole number of minutes.
> > If the timeout is 0 or less, the container ensures
> > the default behaviour of sessions is never to time
> > out. If this element is not specified, the container
> > must set its default timeout period.
> > \\\
> >
> > regards,
> > Bernhard
> >
> > On 08.09.2007 18:48, Mario Ivankovits wrote:
> > > Hi!
> > >
> > >
> > >> If no timeout property is present, then no timeout applies.
> > >> Otherwise, the specified timeout applies.
> > >>
> > >
> > > You are right too with all you said.
> > > Hmmm .... No pc here yet, but, how do a servlet container behave if there is no session timeout configured or is it a required configuration?
> > >
> > > Ciao,
> > > Mario
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
--
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