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Posted to users@tapestry.apache.org by Kevin Monceaux <Ke...@RawFedDogs.net> on 2009/01/02 19:51:21 UTC
T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
Tapestry Fans,
I've been tinkering with Tapestry a little bit off and on but am still
pretty much a complete newbie.
In the past I've tried a few other Java frameworks, but a framework that
requires more lines of XML configuration than lines of source code never
made any sense to me.
I've also tinkered a bit with various "script" based frameworks like Ruby
on Rails and Django. At the moment I have two websites I act as webmaster
for. My personal web site is currently a mixture of PHP and PSP(Pascal
Server Pages). Actually I think PSP is now known as PWU - Pascal Web
Units. The second is a local canine agility group's web site which is
currently Django based. I'm considering converting both to Tapestry.
In the past I purchased the PDF version of Enjoying Web Development with
Tapestry and went through part of it with Tapestry 4. That was quite a
while back and don't really remember any of it, which is probably a good
thing considering how different Tapestry 5 is.
I've gone through the Tapestry 5 tutorial a few times and was thrilled to
recently discover it now has some database examples. The last page of the
tutorial says:
... but Tapestry and this tutorial are a work in progress, so stay
patient, and check out the other Tapestry tutorials and resources
available on the Tapestry 5 home page.
I checked the Tapestry 5 home page but couldn't find any other tutorials.
I'm anxiously awaiting other tutorials and/or additional sections of the
current tutorial.
I purchased "Tapestry 5: Building Web Applications: A step-by-step guide
to Java Web development with the developer-friendly Apache Tapestry
framework" when I first heard about it but was underwhelmed, especially
with it's lack of database examples. Now that the tutorial has got me
going with some database examples, I'm taking another look at that book.
Will all the examples in the book work with the current version of
Tapestry 5 or are there any changes I should be aware of? Are there any
other Tapestry 5 books available now or in the near future?
Where can I find some relational database examples? I think I came across
a couple of entity examples with annotations along the line of
@ManyToMany, @OneToMany, etc., in the documentation section of the
Tapestry web site but I'm now having trouble finding them again.
Can the grid component handle hierarchical data? For example, the brags
page on WAG's website currently looks something like:
http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org/WAG/Brags/
which is pulling data from three different tables. The Members page
currently looks like:
http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org/WAG/Members/
It's currently a static page but I'm planning to move everything into the
database, which will also involve a few tables. If the grid component can
handle hierarchical data, can someone point me towards some examples?
Kevin
http://www.RawFedDogs.net
http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
Bruceville, TX
Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
Longum iter est per praecepta, breve et efficax per exempla!!!
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Re: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
Posted by Jonathan O'Connor <ni...@eircom.net>.
Kevin,
I'm a believer in Samson and Delilah. Cutting your hair is making you
weak! As a chess player, I never play chess the week after I get a
haircut, as I just loose. Also, Garry Kasparov, former world champion,
used to say that the brain worked better if it was 1 degree warmer than
the rest of the body. So if you must shave your head, at least wear a
woolly hat. Thinking caps are also good!
Ciao,
Jonathan
On 03/01/2009 05:57, Kevin Monceaux wrote:
> Jonathan,
>
> On Fri, 2 Jan 2009, Jonathan Barker wrote:
>
>> Search the list for the Jumpstart application. It has been kept
>> right up to date with the latest release of T5. I think you will
>> find it has many good examples. (Also, search the Wiki for titles
>> with "Tapestry5". It's not all up to date, but there's some great
>> stuff.)
>
> It looks like there's plenty there to keep me busy for a while. It
> doesn't seem to have any ManyToMany relation examples. The following
> in the Jumpstart root directory:
>
> # find . -name "*.java" -exec grep ManyToMany {} \;
>
> returns nothing. But, it does have a few OneToMany relations, which
> should be close enough to get me started.
>
> Searching the wiki for ManyToMany also turned up next to nothing. It
> turned up a couple of pages, but they just mentioned OneToMany,
> ManyToMany, etc., in passing without any actual code examples of the
> annotations. I was sure I saw a few examples in the tapestry5 doc
> section. Is the main Tapestry site indexed by Google? A Google
> search for:
>
> site:tapestry.apache.org/tapestry5 ManyToMany
>
> got no hits at all.
>
>> I'm not sure you really want a grid for what you have displayed, but
>> rather
>> Loops generating the tables on your own. Because you have both
>> column and
>> row groupings (COLSPAN,ROWSPAN) on the pages you listed, I'm not sure
>> how
>> you would do things like apply sorting.
>
> I suspected that might be the case. The grid component is impressive
> enough as it is. If it could "magically" handle multi-level
> hierarchical data I might not know how to act. :-) With Django I'm
> currently generating those pages with nested loops. Before Django I
> gave ASP.NET(via Mono on a FreeBSD box) a try and was generating those
> pages by dumping the data to XML and using XSLT.
>
>> Hibernate has a learning curve all its own, so if you're not familiar
>> with it, take some time to learn it on its own. At least be prepared
>> for some hair-pulling if you try to learn both Tapestry and Hibernate
>> at the same time.
>
> I'm a relative newbie to Tapestry, Hibernate, and Java. It might be a
> good thing that I have very little hair. I figure if I'm going to go
> bald some day I might as well beat nature to it. I alternate between
> clipping it as short as clippers will clip it, and shaving my head.
> I've let it grow out a bit for winter. Maybe I should shave it before
> Hibernate drives me to trying to pull what little I have left out. :-)
>
>
>
> Kevin
> http://www.RawFedDogs.net
> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
> Bruceville, TX
>
> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
> Longum iter est per praecepta, breve et efficax per exempla!!!
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
>
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Re: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
Posted by Geoff Callender <ge...@gmail.com>.
Kevin,
I, too, would recommend using a new entity to resolve the many-to-many
into a pair of one-to-many relationships. But please don't ask me to
justify that statement - I came to the conclusion too long ago to
remember the reasons. All I remember is that it's less pain in the
long run (and you'll keep more of your hair).
grep JumpStart for many-to-many and you'll find the UserRole example.
Regards,
Geoff
On 04/01/2009, at 4:16 AM, Jonathan Barker wrote:
> Kevin,
>
> Almost three years ago, I climbed learning curves for T4 (and
> Hivemind),
> Spring, Acegi, and Hibernate simultaneously. It was... challenging.
>
> Make sure you really need ManyToMany with Hibernate. Often, two
> OneToMany
> relationships will suffice.
>
> Take your time with Hibernate. See how the different options result
> in
> different implementations (in the database) of relationships. Reverse
> engineer an existing database and see what Hibernate gives you. I
> think I
> know Hibernate pretty well, and yet I keep the reference guide up
> whenever
> I'm working with it - even with content-assist. Oh, and take some
> time to
> figure out how you are going to implement equals() and hashCode() -
> those
> are important questions with Hibernate.
>
> Have fun!
>
> Jonathan
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: dokpm0@Phideaux.RawFedDogs.net
>> [mailto:dokpm0@Phideaux.RawFedDogs.net] On Behalf Of Kevin Monceaux
>> Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2009 00:58
>> To: Tapestry users
>> Subject: RE: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
>>
>> Jonathan,
>>
>> On Fri, 2 Jan 2009, Jonathan Barker wrote:
>>
>>> Search the list for the Jumpstart application. It has been kept
>>> right
>>> up to date with the latest release of T5. I think you will find
>>> it has
>>> many good examples. (Also, search the Wiki for titles with
>>> "Tapestry5".
>>> It's not all up to date, but there's some great stuff.)
>>
>> It looks like there's plenty there to keep me busy for a while. It
>> doesn't seem to have any ManyToMany relation examples. The
>> following in
>> the Jumpstart root directory:
>>
>> # find . -name "*.java" -exec grep ManyToMany {} \;
>>
>> returns nothing. But, it does have a few OneToMany relations, which
>> should be close enough to get me started.
>>
>> Searching the wiki for ManyToMany also turned up next to nothing. It
>> turned up a couple of pages, but they just mentioned OneToMany,
>> ManyToMany, etc., in passing without any actual code examples of the
>> annotations. I was sure I saw a few examples in the tapestry5 doc
>> section. Is the main Tapestry site indexed by Google? A Google
>> search
>> for:
>>
>> site:tapestry.apache.org/tapestry5 ManyToMany
>>
>> got no hits at all.
>>
>>> I'm not sure you really want a grid for what you have displayed, but
>> rather
>>> Loops generating the tables on your own. Because you have both
>>> column
>> and
>>> row groupings (COLSPAN,ROWSPAN) on the pages you listed, I'm not
>>> sure
>> how
>>> you would do things like apply sorting.
>>
>> I suspected that might be the case. The grid component is impressive
>> enough as it is. If it could "magically" handle multi-level
>> hierarchical
>> data I might not know how to act. :-) With Django I'm currently
>> generating those pages with nested loops. Before Django I gave
>> ASP.NET(via Mono on a FreeBSD box) a try and was generating those
>> pages by
>> dumping the data to XML and using XSLT.
>>
>>> Hibernate has a learning curve all its own, so if you're not
>>> familiar
>>> with it, take some time to learn it on its own. At least be
>>> prepared
>>> for some hair-pulling if you try to learn both Tapestry and
>>> Hibernate at
>>> the same time.
>>
>> I'm a relative newbie to Tapestry, Hibernate, and Java. It might
>> be a
>> good thing that I have very little hair. I figure if I'm going to
>> go bald
>> some day I might as well beat nature to it. I alternate between
>> clipping
>> it as short as clippers will clip it, and shaving my head. I've
>> let it
>> grow out a bit for winter. Maybe I should shave it before Hibernate
>> drives me to trying to pull what little I have left out. :-)
>>
>>
>>
>> Kevin
>> http://www.RawFedDogs.net
>> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
>> Bruceville, TX
>>
>> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
>> Longum iter est per praecepta, breve et efficax per exempla!!!
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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RE: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
Posted by Jonathan Barker <jo...@gmail.com>.
Kevin,
Almost three years ago, I climbed learning curves for T4 (and Hivemind),
Spring, Acegi, and Hibernate simultaneously. It was... challenging.
Make sure you really need ManyToMany with Hibernate. Often, two OneToMany
relationships will suffice.
Take your time with Hibernate. See how the different options result in
different implementations (in the database) of relationships. Reverse
engineer an existing database and see what Hibernate gives you. I think I
know Hibernate pretty well, and yet I keep the reference guide up whenever
I'm working with it - even with content-assist. Oh, and take some time to
figure out how you are going to implement equals() and hashCode() - those
are important questions with Hibernate.
Have fun!
Jonathan
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dokpm0@Phideaux.RawFedDogs.net
> [mailto:dokpm0@Phideaux.RawFedDogs.net] On Behalf Of Kevin Monceaux
> Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2009 00:58
> To: Tapestry users
> Subject: RE: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
>
> Jonathan,
>
> On Fri, 2 Jan 2009, Jonathan Barker wrote:
>
> > Search the list for the Jumpstart application. It has been kept right
> > up to date with the latest release of T5. I think you will find it has
> > many good examples. (Also, search the Wiki for titles with "Tapestry5".
> > It's not all up to date, but there's some great stuff.)
>
> It looks like there's plenty there to keep me busy for a while. It
> doesn't seem to have any ManyToMany relation examples. The following in
> the Jumpstart root directory:
>
> # find . -name "*.java" -exec grep ManyToMany {} \;
>
> returns nothing. But, it does have a few OneToMany relations, which
> should be close enough to get me started.
>
> Searching the wiki for ManyToMany also turned up next to nothing. It
> turned up a couple of pages, but they just mentioned OneToMany,
> ManyToMany, etc., in passing without any actual code examples of the
> annotations. I was sure I saw a few examples in the tapestry5 doc
> section. Is the main Tapestry site indexed by Google? A Google search
> for:
>
> site:tapestry.apache.org/tapestry5 ManyToMany
>
> got no hits at all.
>
> > I'm not sure you really want a grid for what you have displayed, but
> rather
> > Loops generating the tables on your own. Because you have both column
> and
> > row groupings (COLSPAN,ROWSPAN) on the pages you listed, I'm not sure
> how
> > you would do things like apply sorting.
>
> I suspected that might be the case. The grid component is impressive
> enough as it is. If it could "magically" handle multi-level hierarchical
> data I might not know how to act. :-) With Django I'm currently
> generating those pages with nested loops. Before Django I gave
> ASP.NET(via Mono on a FreeBSD box) a try and was generating those pages by
> dumping the data to XML and using XSLT.
>
> > Hibernate has a learning curve all its own, so if you're not familiar
> > with it, take some time to learn it on its own. At least be prepared
> > for some hair-pulling if you try to learn both Tapestry and Hibernate at
> > the same time.
>
> I'm a relative newbie to Tapestry, Hibernate, and Java. It might be a
> good thing that I have very little hair. I figure if I'm going to go bald
> some day I might as well beat nature to it. I alternate between clipping
> it as short as clippers will clip it, and shaving my head. I've let it
> grow out a bit for winter. Maybe I should shave it before Hibernate
> drives me to trying to pull what little I have left out. :-)
>
>
>
> Kevin
> http://www.RawFedDogs.net
> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
> Bruceville, TX
>
> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
> Longum iter est per praecepta, breve et efficax per exempla!!!
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
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RE: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
Posted by Kevin Monceaux <Ke...@RawFedDogs.net>.
Jonathan,
On Fri, 2 Jan 2009, Jonathan Barker wrote:
> Search the list for the Jumpstart application. It has been kept right
> up to date with the latest release of T5. I think you will find it has
> many good examples. (Also, search the Wiki for titles with "Tapestry5".
> It's not all up to date, but there's some great stuff.)
It looks like there's plenty there to keep me busy for a while. It
doesn't seem to have any ManyToMany relation examples. The following in
the Jumpstart root directory:
# find . -name "*.java" -exec grep ManyToMany {} \;
returns nothing. But, it does have a few OneToMany relations, which
should be close enough to get me started.
Searching the wiki for ManyToMany also turned up next to nothing. It
turned up a couple of pages, but they just mentioned OneToMany,
ManyToMany, etc., in passing without any actual code examples of the
annotations. I was sure I saw a few examples in the tapestry5 doc
section. Is the main Tapestry site indexed by Google? A Google search
for:
site:tapestry.apache.org/tapestry5 ManyToMany
got no hits at all.
> I'm not sure you really want a grid for what you have displayed, but rather
> Loops generating the tables on your own. Because you have both column and
> row groupings (COLSPAN,ROWSPAN) on the pages you listed, I'm not sure how
> you would do things like apply sorting.
I suspected that might be the case. The grid component is impressive
enough as it is. If it could "magically" handle multi-level hierarchical
data I might not know how to act. :-) With Django I'm currently
generating those pages with nested loops. Before Django I gave
ASP.NET(via Mono on a FreeBSD box) a try and was generating those pages by
dumping the data to XML and using XSLT.
> Hibernate has a learning curve all its own, so if you're not familiar
> with it, take some time to learn it on its own. At least be prepared
> for some hair-pulling if you try to learn both Tapestry and Hibernate at
> the same time.
I'm a relative newbie to Tapestry, Hibernate, and Java. It might be a
good thing that I have very little hair. I figure if I'm going to go bald
some day I might as well beat nature to it. I alternate between clipping
it as short as clippers will clip it, and shaving my head. I've let it
grow out a bit for winter. Maybe I should shave it before Hibernate
drives me to trying to pull what little I have left out. :-)
Kevin
http://www.RawFedDogs.net
http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
Bruceville, TX
Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
Longum iter est per praecepta, breve et efficax per exempla!!!
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
RE: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
Posted by Jonathan Barker <jo...@gmail.com>.
Search the list for the Jumpstart application. It has been kept right up to
date with the latest release of T5. I think you will find it has many good
examples. (Also, search the Wiki for titles with "Tapestry5". It's not all
up to date, but there's some great stuff.)
I'm not sure you really want a grid for what you have displayed, but rather
Loops generating the tables on your own. Because you have both column and
row groupings (COLSPAN,ROWSPAN) on the pages you listed, I'm not sure how
you would do things like apply sorting.
You could override the cell contents to come up with some really custom
stuff, and you can even put grids within cells of other grids.
The annotations you mention (like @OneToMany) are part of Hibernate
Annotations, and there is a tapestry-hibernate module for easy integration
of Hibernate. I do my Hibernate integration with Spring (and
tapestry-spring), but it will make life simpler if you can do it with
tapestry-hibernate. In the end, it doesn't really matter to Tapestry how
you construct your object graph.
Hibernate has a learning curve all its own, so if you're not familiar with
it, take some time to learn it on its own. At least be prepared for some
hair-pulling if you try to learn both Tapestry and Hibernate at the same
time.
Jonathan
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dokpm0@Phideaux.RawFedDogs.net
> [mailto:dokpm0@Phideaux.RawFedDogs.net] On Behalf Of Kevin Monceaux
> Sent: Friday, January 02, 2009 13:51
> To: Tapestry Users
> Subject: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
>
> Tapestry Fans,
>
> I've been tinkering with Tapestry a little bit off and on but am still
> pretty much a complete newbie.
>
> In the past I've tried a few other Java frameworks, but a framework that
> requires more lines of XML configuration than lines of source code never
> made any sense to me.
>
> I've also tinkered a bit with various "script" based frameworks like Ruby
> on Rails and Django. At the moment I have two websites I act as webmaster
> for. My personal web site is currently a mixture of PHP and PSP(Pascal
> Server Pages). Actually I think PSP is now known as PWU - Pascal Web
> Units. The second is a local canine agility group's web site which is
> currently Django based. I'm considering converting both to Tapestry.
>
> In the past I purchased the PDF version of Enjoying Web Development with
> Tapestry and went through part of it with Tapestry 4. That was quite a
> while back and don't really remember any of it, which is probably a good
> thing considering how different Tapestry 5 is.
>
> I've gone through the Tapestry 5 tutorial a few times and was thrilled to
> recently discover it now has some database examples. The last page of the
> tutorial says:
>
> ... but Tapestry and this tutorial are a work in progress, so stay
> patient, and check out the other Tapestry tutorials and resources
> available on the Tapestry 5 home page.
>
> I checked the Tapestry 5 home page but couldn't find any other tutorials.
> I'm anxiously awaiting other tutorials and/or additional sections of the
> current tutorial.
>
> I purchased "Tapestry 5: Building Web Applications: A step-by-step guide
> to Java Web development with the developer-friendly Apache Tapestry
> framework" when I first heard about it but was underwhelmed, especially
> with it's lack of database examples. Now that the tutorial has got me
> going with some database examples, I'm taking another look at that book.
> Will all the examples in the book work with the current version of
> Tapestry 5 or are there any changes I should be aware of? Are there any
> other Tapestry 5 books available now or in the near future?
>
> Where can I find some relational database examples? I think I came across
> a couple of entity examples with annotations along the line of
> @ManyToMany, @OneToMany, etc., in the documentation section of the
> Tapestry web site but I'm now having trouble finding them again.
>
> Can the grid component handle hierarchical data? For example, the brags
> page on WAG's website currently looks something like:
>
> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org/WAG/Brags/
>
> which is pulling data from three different tables. The Members page
> currently looks like:
>
> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org/WAG/Members/
>
> It's currently a static page but I'm planning to move everything into the
> database, which will also involve a few tables. If the grid component can
> handle hierarchical data, can someone point me towards some examples?
>
>
>
>
> Kevin
> http://www.RawFedDogs.net
> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
> Bruceville, TX
>
> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
> Longum iter est per praecepta, breve et efficax per exempla!!!
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: T5 newbie books/tutorials and a couple of questions?
Posted by Christian Edward Gruber <ch...@gmail.com>.
There are some on the tapestry wiki, under the Tapestry 5 How-Tos.
Christian.
On 2-Jan-09, at 13:51 , Kevin Monceaux wrote:
> Tapestry Fans,
>
> I've been tinkering with Tapestry a little bit off and on but am
> still pretty much a complete newbie.
>
> In the past I've tried a few other Java frameworks, but a framework
> that requires more lines of XML configuration than lines of source
> code never made any sense to me.
>
> I've also tinkered a bit with various "script" based frameworks like
> Ruby on Rails and Django. At the moment I have two websites I act
> as webmaster for. My personal web site is currently a mixture of
> PHP and PSP(Pascal Server Pages). Actually I think PSP is now known
> as PWU - Pascal Web Units. The second is a local canine agility
> group's web site which is currently Django based. I'm considering
> converting both to Tapestry.
>
> In the past I purchased the PDF version of Enjoying Web Development
> with Tapestry and went through part of it with Tapestry 4. That was
> quite a while back and don't really remember any of it, which is
> probably a good thing considering how different Tapestry 5 is.
>
> I've gone through the Tapestry 5 tutorial a few times and was
> thrilled to recently discover it now has some database examples.
> The last page of the tutorial says:
>
> ... but Tapestry and this tutorial are a work in progress, so stay
> patient, and check out the other Tapestry tutorials and resources
> available on the Tapestry 5 home page.
>
> I checked the Tapestry 5 home page but couldn't find any other
> tutorials. I'm anxiously awaiting other tutorials and/or additional
> sections of the current tutorial.
>
> I purchased "Tapestry 5: Building Web Applications: A step-by-step
> guide to Java Web development with the developer-friendly Apache
> Tapestry framework" when I first heard about it but was
> underwhelmed, especially with it's lack of database examples. Now
> that the tutorial has got me going with some database examples, I'm
> taking another look at that book. Will all the examples in the book
> work with the current version of Tapestry 5 or are there any changes
> I should be aware of? Are there any other Tapestry 5 books
> available now or in the near future?
>
> Where can I find some relational database examples? I think I came
> across a couple of entity examples with annotations along the line
> of @ManyToMany, @OneToMany, etc., in the documentation section of
> the Tapestry web site but I'm now having trouble finding them again.
>
> Can the grid component handle hierarchical data? For example, the
> brags page on WAG's website currently looks something like:
>
> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org/WAG/Brags/
>
> which is pulling data from three different tables. The Members page
> currently looks like:
>
> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org/WAG/Members/
>
> It's currently a static page but I'm planning to move everything
> into the database, which will also involve a few tables. If the
> grid component can handle hierarchical data, can someone point me
> towards some examples?
>
>
>
>
> Kevin
> http://www.RawFedDogs.net
> http://www.WacoAgilityGroup.org
> Bruceville, TX
>
> Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes.
> Longum iter est per praecepta, breve et efficax per exempla!!!
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
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