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Posted to dev@netbeans.apache.org by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> on 2022/03/08 19:12:21 UTC
Alternative NetBeans 13 packages with JDK (and DEB without)
Hi All,
Today I updated the Codelerity / Gj IT alternative packages to Apache
NetBeans 13.
https://www.codelerity.com/netbeans/
These are built with NBPackage using the official ASF zip release, but
are obviously third-party unofficial binaries themselves.
There is an Inno Setup based Windows installer bundled with Azul Zulu
JDK 17, DEB and AppImage for Linux x64 (again with Zulu), an AppImage
for Arm / Pi with BellSoft Liberica JDK 17, and an any architecture
DEB that uses system JDK.
For the same reasons as the official release, macOS is a little behind!
Feedback appreciated. And how would we feel about linking to
third-party convenience binaries from the Apache NetBeans website? It
is something other projects do, while needing to make sure the wording
doesn't make them look like they're coming from ASF.
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Re: Alternative NetBeans 13 packages with JDK (and DEB without)
Posted by Eric Bresie <eb...@gmail.com>.
Cool…
Minor cosmetic suggestion, on the https://github.com/apache/netbeans-tools README is missing an entry for nbpackager (as well as probably a few others). Is it worth updating to add andentry with basic description of the tool?
By the way, I know it’s coming but I went ahead and raised an issue on the netbeans-installer for macOS support. I don’t have a Mac so can’t support anything beyond that.
Eric Bresie
Ebresie@gmail.com
> On March 9, 2022 at 8:14:05 AM CST, Neil C Smith <neilcsmith@apache.org (mailto:neilcsmith@apache.org)> wrote:
> On Wed, 9 Mar 2022 at 11:14, Michael Bien <mbien42@gmail.com (mailto:mbien42@gmail.com)> wrote:
> > > These are built with NBPackage using the official ASF zip release, but
> > > are obviously third-party unofficial binaries themselves.
> >
> > pretty cool! Is the JDK installed globally or is it only used by NB?
>
> With these it's only local as part of the overall package. Location
> within the package differs slightly depending on package type.
>
> It's the package.runtime property in NBPackage, which is optional, and
> could also be a custom (JLink'd) runtime, although more for RCP than
> the IDE.
>
> More info / build config at
>
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans-tools/tree/master/nbpackage
> https://github.com/codelerity/netbeans-installers
>
> In theory, something like the Inno Setup installer could also be
> templated to include a JDK installer and run that first. Would be
> good if the JDK location detection in the launcher still worked on
> Windows. Am looking at a way to add it into the Inno Setup installer
> and shortcut instead.
>
> If we can get useful JDK detection to work there, it might also be
> possible to publish a JDK-less Windows installer built that way as an
> ASF artefact. The .deb without JDK already could be.
>
> > > Feedback appreciated. And how would we feel about linking to
> > > third-party convenience binaries from the Apache NetBeans website?
> >
> > sure why not. Maybe in a community-packages section or something like that?
>
> Yes, or third-party packages?
>
> I would suggest adding wording similar to httpd? - "Individual
> committers may provide binary packages as a convenience, but it is not
> a release deliverable.", although with the latter part rewritten
> somewhat so it's more understandable by humans! :-)
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
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>
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Re: Alternative NetBeans 13 packages with JDK (and DEB without)
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Fri, 11 Mar 2022 at 13:38, Michael Bien <mb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I believe it might be worth noting on your site that it doesn't install
> the JDK globally, its only used as runtime for NB ("NetBeans standalone
> package"). Linux/mac users likely have their own way how to keep JDKs
> up2date, e.g via package managers or scripts/other helpers.
Yes, we do! :-) Taken your suggestion and added a note about that.
> what is your opinion on a platform independent launcher? It could run
> the zip download/extraction/check and even be responsible for in-place
> upgrades later. (Basically what most computer games have if they don't
> use a third party service for deployment which already serves as a launcher)
Firstly, the other difference with our installers is they're
configured for in-place upgrades.
I'm not sure about a platform independent launcher. In some ways I'm
more interested in us moving more towards platform native distribution
formats than in the other direction.
OTOH, NBPackage works with zip extraction (of IDE and JDK) to OS
expected structure. Adding download capability with verification to
that might be something useful ... Maybe that's more for
build-a-package-as-a-service though. :-)
> Sure, sounds good. My thought was: "third-party" is fairly neutral while
> "community" has a more positive co-notation.
Good call! I'll put forward a PR with that wording.
Thanks,
Neil
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Re: Alternative NetBeans 13 packages with JDK (and DEB without)
Posted by Michael Bien <mb...@gmail.com>.
On 09.03.22 15:14, Neil C Smith wrote:
> On Wed, 9 Mar 2022 at 11:14, Michael Bien <mb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> These are built with NBPackage using the official ASF zip release, but
>>> are obviously third-party unofficial binaries themselves.
>> pretty cool! Is the JDK installed globally or is it only used by NB?
> With these it's only local as part of the overall package. Location
> within the package differs slightly depending on package type.
awesome! My first question I ask myself when i see an installer is if it
makes any changes to my workstation beside installing the tool.
I believe it might be worth noting on your site that it doesn't install
the JDK globally, its only used as runtime for NB ("NetBeans standalone
package"). Linux/mac users likely have their own way how to keep JDKs
up2date, e.g via package managers or scripts/other helpers.
> It's the package.runtime property in NBPackage, which is optional, and
> could also be a custom (JLink'd) runtime, although more for RCP than
> the IDE.
agreed, NB needs almost everything. Stripping it down to save a few MB
doesn't make a lot of sense + you want to code against a full JDK in the
IDE anyway.
> More info / build config at
>
> https://github.com/apache/netbeans-tools/tree/master/nbpackage
> https://github.com/codelerity/netbeans-installers
>
> In theory, something like the Inno Setup installer could also be
> templated to include a JDK installer and run that first. Would be
> good if the JDK location detection in the launcher still worked on
> Windows. Am looking at a way to add it into the Inno Setup installer
> and shortcut instead.
what is your opinion on a platform independent launcher? It could run
the zip download/extraction/check and even be responsible for in-place
upgrades later. (Basically what most computer games have if they don't
use a third party service for deployment which already serves as a launcher)
>>> Feedback appreciated. And how would we feel about linking to
>>> third-party convenience binaries from the Apache NetBeans website?
>> sure why not. Maybe in a community-packages section or something like that?
> Yes, or third-party packages?
>
> I would suggest adding wording similar to httpd? - "Individual
> committers may provide binary packages as a convenience, but it is not
> a release deliverable.", although with the latter part rewritten
> somewhat so it's more understandable by humans! :-)
Sure, sounds good. My thought was: "third-party" is fairly neutral while
"community" has a more positive co-notation. Both sound completely fine
to me.
great job Neil!
-michael
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
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Re: Alternative NetBeans 13 packages with JDK (and DEB without)
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Wed, 9 Mar 2022 at 11:14, Michael Bien <mb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > These are built with NBPackage using the official ASF zip release, but
> > are obviously third-party unofficial binaries themselves.
>
> pretty cool! Is the JDK installed globally or is it only used by NB?
With these it's only local as part of the overall package. Location
within the package differs slightly depending on package type.
It's the package.runtime property in NBPackage, which is optional, and
could also be a custom (JLink'd) runtime, although more for RCP than
the IDE.
More info / build config at
https://github.com/apache/netbeans-tools/tree/master/nbpackage
https://github.com/codelerity/netbeans-installers
In theory, something like the Inno Setup installer could also be
templated to include a JDK installer and run that first. Would be
good if the JDK location detection in the launcher still worked on
Windows. Am looking at a way to add it into the Inno Setup installer
and shortcut instead.
If we can get useful JDK detection to work there, it might also be
possible to publish a JDK-less Windows installer built that way as an
ASF artefact. The .deb without JDK already could be.
> > Feedback appreciated. And how would we feel about linking to
> > third-party convenience binaries from the Apache NetBeans website?
>
> sure why not. Maybe in a community-packages section or something like that?
Yes, or third-party packages?
I would suggest adding wording similar to httpd? - "Individual
committers may provide binary packages as a convenience, but it is not
a release deliverable.", although with the latter part rewritten
somewhat so it's more understandable by humans! :-)
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Alternative NetBeans 13 packages with JDK (and DEB without)
Posted by Michael Bien <mb...@gmail.com>.
On 08.03.22 20:12, Neil C Smith wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> Today I updated the Codelerity / Gj IT alternative packages to Apache
> NetBeans 13.
>
> https://www.codelerity.com/netbeans/
>
> These are built with NBPackage using the official ASF zip release, but
> are obviously third-party unofficial binaries themselves.
pretty cool! Is the JDK installed globally or is it only used by NB?
> Feedback appreciated. And how would we feel about linking to
> third-party convenience binaries from the Apache NetBeans website?
sure why not. Maybe in a community-packages section or something like that?
best regards,
michael
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Re: Alternative NetBeans 13 packages with JDK (and DEB without)
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
Nice and yes to all.
Gj
On Tue, 8 Mar 2022 at 20:12, Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> Today I updated the Codelerity / Gj IT alternative packages to Apache
> NetBeans 13.
>
> https://www.codelerity.com/netbeans/
>
> These are built with NBPackage using the official ASF zip release, but
> are obviously third-party unofficial binaries themselves.
>
> There is an Inno Setup based Windows installer bundled with Azul Zulu
> JDK 17, DEB and AppImage for Linux x64 (again with Zulu), an AppImage
> for Arm / Pi with BellSoft Liberica JDK 17, and an any architecture
> DEB that uses system JDK.
>
> For the same reasons as the official release, macOS is a little behind!
>
> Feedback appreciated. And how would we feel about linking to
> third-party convenience binaries from the Apache NetBeans website? It
> is something other projects do, while needing to make sure the wording
> doesn't make them look like they're coming from ASF.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>
Re: Alternative NetBeans 13 packages with JDK (and DEB without)
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Tue, 8 Mar 2022 at 19:12, Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> wrote:
> For the same reasons as the official release, macOS is a little behind!
Our macOS installer is now available!
https://www.codelerity.com/netbeans/
Best wishes,
Neil
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