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Posted to dev@cloudstack.apache.org by "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com> on 2013/11/05 19:05:04 UTC
Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
We currently don’t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with snapshots and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
1) Attach a data disk to a VM
2) Snapshot the VM
3) Detach the data disk
4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM — FAILS since you cannot attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not appear to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite differently than Xen.
Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not? IMO, on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they can no longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug of some kind.
-Chris
--
Chris Suich
chris.suich@netapp.com
NetApp Software Engineer
Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>.
Hi Chris,
I have not experimented with VM snapshots via CloudStack, but this sounds
really bad.
Perhaps the simplest fix is to not allow disks to be detached from VMs with
snapshots.
I'll be curious to see what others have to say.
Talk to you later
On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:05 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
> We currently don’t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with snapshots and
> allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
>
> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
> 2) Snapshot the VM
> 3) Detach the data disk
> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot — FAILS since the data disk
> is no longer there, although it is expected to be
> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM — FAILS since you cannot
> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no
> longer there, although it is expected to be
>
> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not appear to
> fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite
> differently than Xen.
>
> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not? IMO,
> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they can no
> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug of some
> kind.
>
> -Chris
> --
> Chris Suich
> chris.suich@netapp.com
> NetApp Software Engineer
> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>
>
--
*Mike Tutkowski*
*Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
o: 303.746.7302
Advancing the way the world uses the
cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
*™*
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by Nux! <nu...@li.nux.ro>.
On 07.11.2013 21:17, Mike Tutkowski wrote:
> Especially since it appears to have been working for XenServer and I'd
> hate
> to take that functionality away from people who might be using it.
+100, removing functionality will not gain you any extra points;
especially doing it for what is probably the least deployed hypervisor
(quotation needed).
--
Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux!
www.nux.ro
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>.
Especially since it appears to have been working for XenServer and I'd hate
to take that functionality away from people who might be using it.
On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 2:15 PM, Mike Tutkowski <mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> wrote:
> I can see the appeal in consistent behavior, but I'm not sure we want
> CloudStack to always follow a least-common-denominator approach.
>
> Personally I recommend we leave XenServer's functionality here as is.
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 6:14 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for replying, Kelvin.
>>
>> Now, should we only not allow this on VMWare, or should we prohibit it on
>> XenServer as well. It appears to work fine on XenServer, but it may be a
>> good idea to have a consistent experience, regardless of hypervisor.
>>
>> -Chris
>> --
>> Chris Suich
>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>> NetApp Software Engineer
>> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>
>> On Nov 6, 2013, at 9:09 PM, Kelven Yang <ke...@citrix.com> wrote:
>>
>> > We should dis-allow detaching volume from VM when it has VM snapshots.
>> > VMware keeps VM snapshot meta information at VM basis, disk membership
>> > change behind its back will cause problem and it does not provide
>> official
>> > API to manipulate at volume level for a VM snapshot.
>> >
>> > This is a bug
>> >
>> > Kelven
>> >
>> > On 11/6/13, 5:58 AM, "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Bumping this. I believe we need the imput of a VMWare expert, please.
>> >>
>> >> -Chris
>> >> --
>> >> Chris Suich
>> >> chris.suich@netapp.com
>> >> NetApp Software Engineer
>> >> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
>> >> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>> >>
>> >> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:46 PM, Mike Tutkowski <
>> mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> OK, well, depending on if we can or can't get a VMware person to chime
>> >>> in
>> >>> on this issue, we may have to disallow disks from being detached from
>> >>> VMware VMs with snapshots in 4.3.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:44 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
>> >>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Correct.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> #6 FAILS with VMWare and SUCCEEDS with Xen
>> >>>>
>> >>>> --
>> >>>> Chris Suich
>> >>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>> >>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>> >>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
>> >>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:35 PM, Mike Tutkowski
>> >>>> <mi...@solidfire.com>
>> >>>> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> I assume 6 fails with VMware, as well?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Is Xen OK with 6?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:26 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
>> >>>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is
>> restored
>> >>>>>> in
>> >>>>>> step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this
>> appears
>> >>>>>> to
>> >>>>>> really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we
>> >>>>>> can
>> >>>>>> handle this?
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> -Chris
>> >>>>>> --
>> >>>>>> Chris Suich
>> >>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>> >>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>> >>>>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
>> >>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <
>> >>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com>
>> >>>>>> wrote:
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> We currently don¹t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with
>> >>>>>>> snapshots
>> >>>>>> and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
>> >>>>>>> 2) Snapshot the VM
>> >>>>>>> 3) Detach the data disk
>> >>>>>>> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot ‹ FAILS since the
>> >>>>>>> data
>> >>>>>> disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
>> >>>>>>> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM ‹ FAILS since you
>> >>>>>>> cannot
>> >>>>>> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
>> >>>>>>> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot ‹ FAILS since the data disk
>> is
>> >>>>>>> no
>> >>>>>> longer there, although it is expected to be
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not
>> >>>>>>> appear
>> >>>>>> to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots
>> quite
>> >>>>>> differently than Xen.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or
>> not?
>> >>>> IMO,
>> >>>>>> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they
>> >>>>>> can
>> >>>> no
>> >>>>>> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug
>> >>>>>> of
>> >>>> some
>> >>>>>> kind.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> -Chris
>> >>>>>>> --
>> >>>>>>> Chris Suich
>> >>>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>> >>>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>> >>>>>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
>> >>>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> --
>> >>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>> >>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>> >>>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
>> >>>>> o: 303.746.7302
>> >>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>> >>>>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>> >>>>> * *
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>> >>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>> >>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
>> >>> o: 303.746.7302
>> >>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>> >>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>> >>> * *
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> *Mike Tutkowski*
> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> o: 303.746.7302
> Advancing the way the world uses the cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
> *™*
>
--
*Mike Tutkowski*
*Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
o: 303.746.7302
Advancing the way the world uses the
cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
*™*
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>.
I can see the appeal in consistent behavior, but I'm not sure we want
CloudStack to always follow a least-common-denominator approach.
Personally I recommend we leave XenServer's functionality here as is.
On Thu, Nov 7, 2013 at 6:14 AM, SuichII, Christopher <Chris.Suich@netapp.com
> wrote:
> Thanks for replying, Kelvin.
>
> Now, should we only not allow this on VMWare, or should we prohibit it on
> XenServer as well. It appears to work fine on XenServer, but it may be a
> good idea to have a consistent experience, regardless of hypervisor.
>
> -Chris
> --
> Chris Suich
> chris.suich@netapp.com
> NetApp Software Engineer
> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>
> On Nov 6, 2013, at 9:09 PM, Kelven Yang <ke...@citrix.com> wrote:
>
> > We should dis-allow detaching volume from VM when it has VM snapshots.
> > VMware keeps VM snapshot meta information at VM basis, disk membership
> > change behind its back will cause problem and it does not provide
> official
> > API to manipulate at volume level for a VM snapshot.
> >
> > This is a bug
> >
> > Kelven
> >
> > On 11/6/13, 5:58 AM, "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >> Bumping this. I believe we need the imput of a VMWare expert, please.
> >>
> >> -Chris
> >> --
> >> Chris Suich
> >> chris.suich@netapp.com
> >> NetApp Software Engineer
> >> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
> >> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
> >>
> >> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:46 PM, Mike Tutkowski <
> mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> OK, well, depending on if we can or can't get a VMware person to chime
> >>> in
> >>> on this issue, we may have to disallow disks from being detached from
> >>> VMware VMs with snapshots in 4.3.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:44 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
> >>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Correct.
> >>>>
> >>>> #6 FAILS with VMWare and SUCCEEDS with Xen
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> Chris Suich
> >>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
> >>>> NetApp Software Engineer
> >>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
> >>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
> >>>>
> >>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:35 PM, Mike Tutkowski
> >>>> <mi...@solidfire.com>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> I assume 6 fails with VMware, as well?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Is Xen OK with 6?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:26 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
> >>>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is restored
> >>>>>> in
> >>>>>> step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this appears
> >>>>>> to
> >>>>>> really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we
> >>>>>> can
> >>>>>> handle this?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -Chris
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> Chris Suich
> >>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
> >>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
> >>>>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
> >>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <
> >>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com>
> >>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> We currently don¹t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with
> >>>>>>> snapshots
> >>>>>> and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
> >>>>>>> 2) Snapshot the VM
> >>>>>>> 3) Detach the data disk
> >>>>>>> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot ‹ FAILS since the
> >>>>>>> data
> >>>>>> disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
> >>>>>>> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM ‹ FAILS since you
> >>>>>>> cannot
> >>>>>> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
> >>>>>>> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot ‹ FAILS since the data disk is
> >>>>>>> no
> >>>>>> longer there, although it is expected to be
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not
> >>>>>>> appear
> >>>>>> to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite
> >>>>>> differently than Xen.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not?
> >>>> IMO,
> >>>>>> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they
> >>>>>> can
> >>>> no
> >>>>>> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug
> >>>>>> of
> >>>> some
> >>>>>> kind.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> -Chris
> >>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>> Chris Suich
> >>>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
> >>>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
> >>>>>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
> >>>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
> >>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> >>>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> >>>>> o: 303.746.7302
> >>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the
> >>>>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
> >>>>> * *
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> *Mike Tutkowski*
> >>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> >>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> >>> o: 303.746.7302
> >>> Advancing the way the world uses the
> >>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
> >>> * *
> >>
> >
>
>
--
*Mike Tutkowski*
*Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
o: 303.746.7302
Advancing the way the world uses the
cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
*™*
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com>.
Thanks for replying, Kelvin.
Now, should we only not allow this on VMWare, or should we prohibit it on XenServer as well. It appears to work fine on XenServer, but it may be a good idea to have a consistent experience, regardless of hypervisor.
-Chris
--
Chris Suich
chris.suich@netapp.com
NetApp Software Engineer
Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
On Nov 6, 2013, at 9:09 PM, Kelven Yang <ke...@citrix.com> wrote:
> We should dis-allow detaching volume from VM when it has VM snapshots.
> VMware keeps VM snapshot meta information at VM basis, disk membership
> change behind its back will cause problem and it does not provide official
> API to manipulate at volume level for a VM snapshot.
>
> This is a bug
>
> Kelven
>
> On 11/6/13, 5:58 AM, "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com> wrote:
>
>> Bumping this. I believe we need the imput of a VMWare expert, please.
>>
>> -Chris
>> --
>> Chris Suich
>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>> NetApp Software Engineer
>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>
>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:46 PM, Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> OK, well, depending on if we can or can't get a VMware person to chime
>>> in
>>> on this issue, we may have to disallow disks from being detached from
>>> VMware VMs with snapshots in 4.3.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:44 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Correct.
>>>>
>>>> #6 FAILS with VMWare and SUCCEEDS with Xen
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Chris Suich
>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>>
>>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:35 PM, Mike Tutkowski
>>>> <mi...@solidfire.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I assume 6 fails with VMware, as well?
>>>>>
>>>>> Is Xen OK with 6?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:26 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
>>>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is restored
>>>>>> in
>>>>>> step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this appears
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we
>>>>>> can
>>>>>> handle this?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -Chris
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Chris Suich
>>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>>>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
>>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <
>>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We currently don¹t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with
>>>>>>> snapshots
>>>>>> and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
>>>>>>> 2) Snapshot the VM
>>>>>>> 3) Detach the data disk
>>>>>>> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot ‹ FAILS since the
>>>>>>> data
>>>>>> disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
>>>>>>> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM ‹ FAILS since you
>>>>>>> cannot
>>>>>> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
>>>>>>> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot ‹ FAILS since the data disk is
>>>>>>> no
>>>>>> longer there, although it is expected to be
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not
>>>>>>> appear
>>>>>> to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite
>>>>>> differently than Xen.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not?
>>>> IMO,
>>>>>> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they
>>>>>> can
>>>> no
>>>>>> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug
>>>>>> of
>>>> some
>>>>>> kind.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -Chris
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Chris Suich
>>>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>>>>>> Data Center Platforms Cloud Solutions
>>>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>>>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
>>>>> o: 303.746.7302
>>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>>>>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>>>>> **
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
>>> o: 303.746.7302
>>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>>> **
>>
>
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by Kelven Yang <ke...@citrix.com>.
We should dis-allow detaching volume from VM when it has VM snapshots.
VMware keeps VM snapshot meta information at VM basis, disk membership
change behind its back will cause problem and it does not provide official
API to manipulate at volume level for a VM snapshot.
This is a bug
Kelven
On 11/6/13, 5:58 AM, "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com> wrote:
>Bumping this. I believe we need the imput of a VMWare expert, please.
>
>-Chris
>--
>Chris Suich
>chris.suich@netapp.com
>NetApp Software Engineer
>Data Center Platforms � Cloud Solutions
>Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>
>On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:46 PM, Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>
>wrote:
>
>> OK, well, depending on if we can or can't get a VMware person to chime
>>in
>> on this issue, we may have to disallow disks from being detached from
>> VMware VMs with snapshots in 4.3.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:44 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Correct.
>>>
>>> #6 FAILS with VMWare and SUCCEEDS with Xen
>>>
>>> --
>>> Chris Suich
>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>> Data Center Platforms � Cloud Solutions
>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>
>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:35 PM, Mike Tutkowski
>>><mi...@solidfire.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I assume 6 fails with VMware, as well?
>>>>
>>>> Is Xen OK with 6?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:26 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
>>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is restored
>>>>>in
>>>>> step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this appears
>>>>>to
>>>>> really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we
>>>>>can
>>>>> handle this?
>>>>>
>>>>> -Chris
>>>>> --
>>>>> Chris Suich
>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>>>> Data Center Platforms � Cloud Solutions
>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>>>
>>>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <
>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> We currently don�t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with
>>>>>>snapshots
>>>>> and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
>>>>>> 2) Snapshot the VM
>>>>>> 3) Detach the data disk
>>>>>> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot � FAILS since the
>>>>>>data
>>>>> disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
>>>>>> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM � FAILS since you
>>>>>>cannot
>>>>> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
>>>>>> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot � FAILS since the data disk is
>>>>>>no
>>>>> longer there, although it is expected to be
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not
>>>>>>appear
>>>>> to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite
>>>>> differently than Xen.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not?
>>> IMO,
>>>>> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they
>>>>>can
>>> no
>>>>> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug
>>>>>of
>>> some
>>>>> kind.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -Chris
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Chris Suich
>>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>>>>> Data Center Platforms � Cloud Solutions
>>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
>>>> o: 303.746.7302
>>>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>>>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>>>> *�*
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
>> o: 303.746.7302
>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>> *�*
>
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com>.
Bumping this. I believe we need the imput of a VMWare expert, please.
-Chris
--
Chris Suich
chris.suich@netapp.com
NetApp Software Engineer
Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:46 PM, Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com> wrote:
> OK, well, depending on if we can or can't get a VMware person to chime in
> on this issue, we may have to disallow disks from being detached from
> VMware VMs with snapshots in 4.3.
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:44 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>
>> Correct.
>>
>> #6 FAILS with VMWare and SUCCEEDS with Xen
>>
>> --
>> Chris Suich
>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>> NetApp Software Engineer
>> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>
>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:35 PM, Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I assume 6 fails with VMware, as well?
>>>
>>> Is Xen OK with 6?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:26 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
>>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is restored in
>>>> step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this appears to
>>>> really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we can
>>>> handle this?
>>>>
>>>> -Chris
>>>> --
>>>> Chris Suich
>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>>> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>>
>>>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <
>> Chris.Suich@netapp.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> We currently don’t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with snapshots
>>>> and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
>>>>> 2) Snapshot the VM
>>>>> 3) Detach the data disk
>>>>> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot — FAILS since the data
>>>> disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
>>>>> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM — FAILS since you cannot
>>>> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
>>>>> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no
>>>> longer there, although it is expected to be
>>>>>
>>>>> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not appear
>>>> to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite
>>>> differently than Xen.
>>>>>
>>>>> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not?
>> IMO,
>>>> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they can
>> no
>>>> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug of
>> some
>>>> kind.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Chris
>>>>> --
>>>>> Chris Suich
>>>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>>>> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
>>>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> *Mike Tutkowski*
>>> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
>>> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
>>> o: 303.746.7302
>>> Advancing the way the world uses the
>>> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
>>> *™*
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> *Mike Tutkowski*
> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> o: 303.746.7302
> Advancing the way the world uses the
> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
> *™*
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>.
OK, well, depending on if we can or can't get a VMware person to chime in
on this issue, we may have to disallow disks from being detached from
VMware VMs with snapshots in 4.3.
On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:44 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
> Correct.
>
> #6 FAILS with VMWare and SUCCEEDS with Xen
>
> --
> Chris Suich
> chris.suich@netapp.com
> NetApp Software Engineer
> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>
> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:35 PM, Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I assume 6 fails with VMware, as well?
> >
> > Is Xen OK with 6?
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:26 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
> > Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
> >
> >> FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is restored in
> >> step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this appears to
> >> really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we can
> >> handle this?
> >>
> >> -Chris
> >> --
> >> Chris Suich
> >> chris.suich@netapp.com
> >> NetApp Software Engineer
> >> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
> >> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
> >>
> >> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <
> Chris.Suich@netapp.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> We currently don’t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with snapshots
> >> and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
> >>>
> >>> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
> >>> 2) Snapshot the VM
> >>> 3) Detach the data disk
> >>> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot — FAILS since the data
> >> disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
> >>> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM — FAILS since you cannot
> >> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
> >>> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no
> >> longer there, although it is expected to be
> >>>
> >>> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not appear
> >> to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite
> >> differently than Xen.
> >>>
> >>> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not?
> IMO,
> >> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they can
> no
> >> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug of
> some
> >> kind.
> >>>
> >>> -Chris
> >>> --
> >>> Chris Suich
> >>> chris.suich@netapp.com
> >>> NetApp Software Engineer
> >>> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
> >>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > *Mike Tutkowski*
> > *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> > e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> > o: 303.746.7302
> > Advancing the way the world uses the
> > cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
> > *™*
>
>
--
*Mike Tutkowski*
*Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
o: 303.746.7302
Advancing the way the world uses the
cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
*™*
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com>.
Correct.
#6 FAILS with VMWare and SUCCEEDS with Xen
--
Chris Suich
chris.suich@netapp.com
NetApp Software Engineer
Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:35 PM, Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com> wrote:
> I assume 6 fails with VMware, as well?
>
> Is Xen OK with 6?
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:26 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
> Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
>
>> FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is restored in
>> step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this appears to
>> really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we can
>> handle this?
>>
>> -Chris
>> --
>> Chris Suich
>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>> NetApp Software Engineer
>> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>
>> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <Ch...@netapp.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> We currently don’t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with snapshots
>> and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
>>>
>>> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
>>> 2) Snapshot the VM
>>> 3) Detach the data disk
>>> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot — FAILS since the data
>> disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
>>> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM — FAILS since you cannot
>> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
>>> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no
>> longer there, although it is expected to be
>>>
>>> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not appear
>> to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite
>> differently than Xen.
>>>
>>> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not? IMO,
>> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they can no
>> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug of some
>> kind.
>>>
>>> -Chris
>>> --
>>> Chris Suich
>>> chris.suich@netapp.com
>>> NetApp Software Engineer
>>> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
>>> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> *Mike Tutkowski*
> *Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
> e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
> o: 303.746.7302
> Advancing the way the world uses the
> cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
> *™*
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by Mike Tutkowski <mi...@solidfire.com>.
I assume 6 fails with VMware, as well?
Is Xen OK with 6?
On Tue, Nov 5, 2013 at 11:26 AM, SuichII, Christopher <
Chris.Suich@netapp.com> wrote:
> FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is restored in
> step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this appears to
> really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we can
> handle this?
>
> -Chris
> --
> Chris Suich
> chris.suich@netapp.com
> NetApp Software Engineer
> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>
> On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <Ch...@netapp.com>
> wrote:
>
> > We currently don’t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with snapshots
> and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
> >
> > 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
> > 2) Snapshot the VM
> > 3) Detach the data disk
> > 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot — FAILS since the data
> disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
> > 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM — FAILS since you cannot
> attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
> > 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no
> longer there, although it is expected to be
> >
> > I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not appear
> to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite
> differently than Xen.
> >
> > Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not? IMO,
> on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they can no
> longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug of some
> kind.
> >
> > -Chris
> > --
> > Chris Suich
> > chris.suich@netapp.com
> > NetApp Software Engineer
> > Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
> > Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
> >
>
>
--
*Mike Tutkowski*
*Senior CloudStack Developer, SolidFire Inc.*
e: mike.tutkowski@solidfire.com
o: 303.746.7302
Advancing the way the world uses the
cloud<http://solidfire.com/solution/overview/?video=play>
*™*
Re: Bug? Should we allow detaching volumes when VMs have snapshots
Posted by "SuichII, Christopher" <Ch...@netapp.com>.
FWIW, after looking into this more with Xen, when the VM is restored in step 4, it simply no longer has the volume attached, so this appears to really be a VMWare issue. Any VMWare experts out there know how we can handle this?
-Chris
--
Chris Suich
chris.suich@netapp.com
NetApp Software Engineer
Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
On Nov 5, 2013, at 1:05 PM, SuichII, Christopher <Ch...@netapp.com> wrote:
> We currently don’t allow volumes to be attached to VMs with snapshots and allowing volumes to be detached causes quite a bug:
>
> 1) Attach a data disk to a VM
> 2) Snapshot the VM
> 3) Detach the data disk
> 4) Attempt to restore the VM from the snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
> 5) Attempt to re-attach the volume to the VM — FAILS since you cannot attach volumes to VMs with snapshots
> 6) Attempt to delete the VM snapshot — FAILS since the data disk is no longer there, although it is expected to be
>
> I have verified the above steps on VMWare, however Xen does not appear to fail on step 4, presumably because VMWare handles snapshots quite differently than Xen.
>
> Does anyone else have any thoughts on whether this is a bug or not? IMO, on VMWare, this set of steps can get users into a state where they can no longer attach new data disks to their VM, so it appears to be a bug of some kind.
>
> -Chris
> --
> Chris Suich
> chris.suich@netapp.com
> NetApp Software Engineer
> Data Center Platforms – Cloud Solutions
> Citrix, Cisco & Red Hat
>