You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to dev@flex.apache.org by Roland Zwaga <ro...@stackandheap.com> on 2013/01/14 23:05:16 UTC
[OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Hi there,
I'm sure plenty of folks here will have heard and/or worked with the
Parsley framework.
Jens just posted his farewell to Flex message on the spicefactory site:
http://www.spicefactory.org/news/news-2013-01-14.php
Sad to see him go off to new horizons, but not much of a surprise either.
Jens is an awesome developer and I learnt quite few things from him, plus I
had some nice
technical discussions with him.
cheers,
Roland
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Michael Schmalle <ap...@teotigraphix.com>.
No it means I'm not corporate and don't give a crap about anything. ;-)
Like I said, I would be the last one this project wants talking for
them. Like I told you Roland, at least Apache recycles. I consider
them one of the greenest companies on the planet. Go Apache!
Mike
Quoting Roland Zwaga <ro...@stackandheap.com>:
>> And if not! I already wrote my farewell blog post in January of 2012, it's
>> still on my blog! ;-)
>>
>
> Which means, you are already dead yourself too. So, you're undead now.
>
> MIKE IS A ZOMBIE!!!
>
--
Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
http://www.teotigraphix.com
http://blog.teotigraphix.com
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Roland Zwaga <ro...@stackandheap.com>.
> And if not! I already wrote my farewell blog post in January of 2012, it's
> still on my blog! ;-)
>
Which means, you are already dead yourself too. So, you're undead now.
MIKE IS A ZOMBIE!!!
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by "Michael A. Labriola" <la...@digitalprimates.net>.
>JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left. This decade of my life will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing his face with jQuery muffins. I think this project has a >chance, because you get enough smart people together, something WILL happen.
Just made me do a spit take.
Thanks for making my afternoon better,
Mike
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Greg Reddin <gr...@gmail.com>.
On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 4:22 PM, Michael Schmalle
<ap...@teotigraphix.com>wrote:
> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left. This decade of my life
> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing his
> face with jQuery muffins.
Love that comment :-)
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by "Michael A. Labriola" <la...@digitalprimates.net>.
>Care to explain what's wrong with singletons?
As others have mentioned, true singletons preclude unit testing IMO. A true unit test relies on the fact that one test does not affect another. If one test creates any global states, including a singleton, then it necessarily alters the starting state for the next test.
I have no problem with something _acting_ like a singleton and ensuring that, within a given context, there is only one copy. I just think that enforcement should happen via something like dependency injection wherein you can choose whether it is truly 'globalish', contextual or that you choose to create a new one every time (which is the case when you are testing).
Hope that makes some sense. Honestly, there is nothing wrong with any pattern, it is simply that patterns have usefulness within certain confines. A singleton is a great way to approach certain applications but begins to get in your way when you have multiple modules (especially if you want to unload them), testing or areas of your application that need different contexts. This is not the case for many, many applications and hence like any other tool, I say use them but understand when not to.
Mike
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Roland Zwaga <ro...@stackandheap.com>.
Singletons can get confusing once your application is separated into
functional modules,
sometimes you may want to have a 'singleton', but only within the scope of
a functional module.
If you don't use some kind of dependency injection container that takes
care of this scoping
things can become quite complicated.
So, there is certainly nothing wrong with the concept of a singleton, but
the way that is implemented
in some Actionscript frameworks makes it rather rigid. I mean this kind of
code:
MySingletonClass.getInstance()
Which in a unit testing scenario is a nightmare. In general, static
functions might even be considered a
code smell. (But I'm sure folks can come up with scenario's where they are
perfectly suitable).
Roland
On 16 January 2013 14:51, Edouard <ed...@gmail.com> wrote:
> In case of Module wich are load and unload, Singleton can be a huge problem
> for memory leaks
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 2:46 PM, Harbs <ha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Well, I've never done unit testing, so maybe that explains why I don't
> > "get it"…
> >
> > On Jan 16, 2013, at 3:39 PM, Michael Schmalle wrote:
> >
> > > IMHO;
> > >
> > > Singletons serve a purpose just like every other design pattern. Having
> > developed/architected quite large frameworks in my day, Singletons are
> evil
> > in the context of a framework. You will soon see when you start unit
> > testing how evil they are. (IE I put one in FalconJx temporarily to stop
> > jsdocs from being emitted in the unit tests, now that damn thing is all
> > over the tests and I have to kill it)
> > >
> > > As far as applications, I believe it's really up to the developer
> > because they program what they were taught and familiar with.
> > >
> > > Mike
> > >
> > > Quoting Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>:
> > >
> > >> Over the years I'm heard this from time to time, but I never
> understood
> > the prejudice. I personally like singletons because it keeps things nice
> > and simple. I don't like over-engineering things for no reason.
> > >>
> > >> Care to explain what's wrong with singletons?
> > >>
> > >> On Jan 16, 2013, at 8:41 AM, Avi Kessner wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> I'm in the 'singletons are evil' camp.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > > --
> > > Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
> > > http://www.teotigraphix.com
> > > http://blog.teotigraphix.com
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Edouard Bataille
> Epita MTI 2008
> Consultant Expert Java Flex
>
--
regards,
Roland
--
Roland Zwaga
Senior Consultant | Stack & Heap BVBA
+32 (0)486 16 12 62 | roland@stackandheap.com | http://www.stackandheap.com
http://zwaga.blogspot.com
http://www.springactionscript.org
http://www.as3commons.org
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Edouard <ed...@gmail.com>.
In case of Module wich are load and unload, Singleton can be a huge problem
for memory leaks
On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 2:46 PM, Harbs <ha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Well, I've never done unit testing, so maybe that explains why I don't
> "get it"…
>
> On Jan 16, 2013, at 3:39 PM, Michael Schmalle wrote:
>
> > IMHO;
> >
> > Singletons serve a purpose just like every other design pattern. Having
> developed/architected quite large frameworks in my day, Singletons are evil
> in the context of a framework. You will soon see when you start unit
> testing how evil they are. (IE I put one in FalconJx temporarily to stop
> jsdocs from being emitted in the unit tests, now that damn thing is all
> over the tests and I have to kill it)
> >
> > As far as applications, I believe it's really up to the developer
> because they program what they were taught and familiar with.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Quoting Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>:
> >
> >> Over the years I'm heard this from time to time, but I never understood
> the prejudice. I personally like singletons because it keeps things nice
> and simple. I don't like over-engineering things for no reason.
> >>
> >> Care to explain what's wrong with singletons?
> >>
> >> On Jan 16, 2013, at 8:41 AM, Avi Kessner wrote:
> >>
> >>> I'm in the 'singletons are evil' camp.
> >>
> >>
> >
> > --
> > Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
> > http://www.teotigraphix.com
> > http://blog.teotigraphix.com
> >
>
>
--
Edouard Bataille
Epita MTI 2008
Consultant Expert Java Flex
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>.
Well, I've never done unit testing, so maybe that explains why I don't "get it"…
On Jan 16, 2013, at 3:39 PM, Michael Schmalle wrote:
> IMHO;
>
> Singletons serve a purpose just like every other design pattern. Having developed/architected quite large frameworks in my day, Singletons are evil in the context of a framework. You will soon see when you start unit testing how evil they are. (IE I put one in FalconJx temporarily to stop jsdocs from being emitted in the unit tests, now that damn thing is all over the tests and I have to kill it)
>
> As far as applications, I believe it's really up to the developer because they program what they were taught and familiar with.
>
> Mike
>
> Quoting Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>:
>
>> Over the years I'm heard this from time to time, but I never understood the prejudice. I personally like singletons because it keeps things nice and simple. I don't like over-engineering things for no reason.
>>
>> Care to explain what's wrong with singletons?
>>
>> On Jan 16, 2013, at 8:41 AM, Avi Kessner wrote:
>>
>>> I'm in the 'singletons are evil' camp.
>>
>>
>
> --
> Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
> http://www.teotigraphix.com
> http://blog.teotigraphix.com
>
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Michael Schmalle <ap...@teotigraphix.com>.
IMHO;
Singletons serve a purpose just like every other design pattern.
Having developed/architected quite large frameworks in my day,
Singletons are evil in the context of a framework. You will soon see
when you start unit testing how evil they are. (IE I put one in
FalconJx temporarily to stop jsdocs from being emitted in the unit
tests, now that damn thing is all over the tests and I have to kill it)
As far as applications, I believe it's really up to the developer
because they program what they were taught and familiar with.
Mike
Quoting Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>:
> Over the years I'm heard this from time to time, but I never
> understood the prejudice. I personally like singletons because it
> keeps things nice and simple. I don't like over-engineering things
> for no reason.
>
> Care to explain what's wrong with singletons?
>
> On Jan 16, 2013, at 8:41 AM, Avi Kessner wrote:
>
>> I'm in the 'singletons are evil' camp.
>
>
--
Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
http://www.teotigraphix.com
http://blog.teotigraphix.com
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>.
Over the years I'm heard this from time to time, but I never understood the prejudice. I personally like singletons because it keeps things nice and simple. I don't like over-engineering things for no reason.
Care to explain what's wrong with singletons?
On Jan 16, 2013, at 8:41 AM, Avi Kessner wrote:
> I'm in the 'singletons are evil' camp.
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Avi Kessner <ak...@gmail.com>.
Jude, good point about generic event dispatchers, however that makes you
reliant on either static classes or singletons that care about state.
I'm in the 'singletons are evil' camp.
On Jan 16, 2013 12:52 AM, "jude" <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 1:30 PM, Tianzhen Lin <ta...@usa.net> wrote:
>
> > I told the whiners of Flash if they hate Flash ads, they can disable the
> > plugin by default with the browser, and there are plenty of those
> add-in's.
> > But once the same Flash ad producers start making the same crappy ads in
> > HTML 5, there is no more block HTML 5 feature. :)
>
>
> Exactly! They should want Flash back specifically *because* you can disable
> it.
>
> @Avi - Sortof. You can dispatch events from any object that extends
> IEventDispatcher. If that object is a display object and is on the display
> list that event will bubble up through it (if bubbles are set to true). If
> it's a regular object you would just add an event listener to it to to
> handle any of it's events. Also, as for singletons, they don't get as much
> MXML love as the rest of the SDK but that doesn't mean you have to give up
> on them. A few months ago I made a Singleton Enforcer class so that *any*
> class can be a Singleton and referenced in MXML.
>
> The way it works is you declare in the root application or a document an
> instance of your class /singleton in MXML (yes MXML). This can be any class
> with instance variables on it (they don't have to be static and you don't
> need to create a getInstance() method except if you want to reference it in
> AS). Next, you add a RegisterSingleton MXML class and bind it to that
> instance. That registers it in Flex's global singleton manager. Then in any
> component you need it you can declare your singleton class (in MXML) and
> add a SingletonEnforcer class next to it. When you run your application the
> Singleton Enforcer class will ensure that that instance is the same
> instance across the application. Reading previous discussions it sounds
> like AOT accomplishes the same thing.
>
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Avi Kessner <ak...@gmail.com>.
After laerning puremvc and robotlegs I got a mate project. At first I found
it frustrating, then I got used to it. Then I wondered why the views were
written so tightly that I couldn't shift the ui from the top to the left
side. I think its similar enough to robotlegs , but not so good at
preventing you from 'doing it wrong' as RL2 is.
On Jan 16, 2013 12:59 PM, "Justin Mclean" <ju...@classsoftware.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> > I have heard good things about "Mate" for MVC. Has anyone used it?
>
> A few years ago on several projects - but a bit rusty now. I
> particularly liked how it used declarative markup (MXML) for the event
> maps. If you needed to order multiple server calls it made it very easy.
>
> Justin
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Avi Kessner <ak...@gmail.com>.
Oh and software craftsmanship
On Jan 16, 2013 10:04 PM, "Avi Kessner" <ak...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Cleancoders and 'uncle Bob martins' fanbase
>
> Also do searches for 'katas' , 'TDD' , 'Kent' and 'smalltalk' that
> should send you into all the right circles.
> On Jan 16, 2013 9:38 PM, "Harbs" <ha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I guess I'll have to learn good unit testing practices one day.
>>
>> Any good resources on the topic?
>>
>> On Jan 16, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Avi Kessner wrote:
>>
>> > Not only do singleton's make it hard to test but they also make it
>> harder
>> > to get people to write testable code.
>> >
>> > As for static functions, I like to think of them as baby steps towards
>> > writing functional language code and a nice fence around making sure
>> your
>> > functions have no side affects.
>> > On Jan 16, 2013 8:18 PM, "Avi Kessner" <ak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> After laerning puremvc and robotlegs I got a mate project. At first I
>> >> found it frustrating, then I got used to it. Then I wondered why the
>> views
>> >> were written so tightly that I couldn't shift the ui from the top to
>> the
>> >> left
>> >> On Jan 16, 2013 12:59 PM, "Justin Mclean" <ju...@classsoftware.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Hi,
>> >>>
>> >>>> I have heard good things about "Mate" for MVC. Has anyone used it?
>> >>>
>> >>> A few years ago on several projects - but a bit rusty now. I
>> >>> particularly liked how it used declarative markup (MXML) for the event
>> >>> maps. If you needed to order multiple server calls it made it very
>> easy.
>> >>>
>> >>> Justin
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Avi Kessner <ak...@gmail.com>.
Cleancoders and 'uncle Bob martins' fanbase
Also do searches for 'katas' , 'TDD' , 'Kent' and 'smalltalk' that should
send you into all the right circles.
On Jan 16, 2013 9:38 PM, "Harbs" <ha...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I guess I'll have to learn good unit testing practices one day.
>
> Any good resources on the topic?
>
> On Jan 16, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Avi Kessner wrote:
>
> > Not only do singleton's make it hard to test but they also make it harder
> > to get people to write testable code.
> >
> > As for static functions, I like to think of them as baby steps towards
> > writing functional language code and a nice fence around making sure your
> > functions have no side affects.
> > On Jan 16, 2013 8:18 PM, "Avi Kessner" <ak...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> After laerning puremvc and robotlegs I got a mate project. At first I
> >> found it frustrating, then I got used to it. Then I wondered why the
> views
> >> were written so tightly that I couldn't shift the ui from the top to the
> >> left
> >> On Jan 16, 2013 12:59 PM, "Justin Mclean" <ju...@classsoftware.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>>> I have heard good things about "Mate" for MVC. Has anyone used it?
> >>>
> >>> A few years ago on several projects - but a bit rusty now. I
> >>> particularly liked how it used declarative markup (MXML) for the event
> >>> maps. If you needed to order multiple server calls it made it very
> easy.
> >>>
> >>> Justin
> >>
> >>
>
>
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>.
I guess I'll have to learn good unit testing practices one day.
Any good resources on the topic?
On Jan 16, 2013, at 8:25 PM, Avi Kessner wrote:
> Not only do singleton's make it hard to test but they also make it harder
> to get people to write testable code.
>
> As for static functions, I like to think of them as baby steps towards
> writing functional language code and a nice fence around making sure your
> functions have no side affects.
> On Jan 16, 2013 8:18 PM, "Avi Kessner" <ak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> After laerning puremvc and robotlegs I got a mate project. At first I
>> found it frustrating, then I got used to it. Then I wondered why the views
>> were written so tightly that I couldn't shift the ui from the top to the
>> left
>> On Jan 16, 2013 12:59 PM, "Justin Mclean" <ju...@classsoftware.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>>> I have heard good things about "Mate" for MVC. Has anyone used it?
>>>
>>> A few years ago on several projects - but a bit rusty now. I
>>> particularly liked how it used declarative markup (MXML) for the event
>>> maps. If you needed to order multiple server calls it made it very easy.
>>>
>>> Justin
>>
>>
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by "Michael A. Labriola" <la...@digitalprimates.net>.
>Non constant static vars would be the code smell then, no?
If they are being used for any type of states, yes. If they aren't, then I would need to wonder why they are constants. It's difficult to get complete code isolation, and static vars are a good example of where people tend to simply use them. I think, when possible, it's worth going to extra mile to make it isolatable.
Mike
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Avi Kessner <ak...@gmail.com>.
Non constant static vars would be the code smell then, no?
On Jan 16, 2013 9:01 PM, "Michael A. Labriola" <la...@digitalprimates.net>
wrote:
> >As for static functions, I like to think of them as baby steps towards
> writing functional language code and a nice fence around making sure your
> functions have no side affects.
>
> Except they can have side effects and prevent the isolation of any code
> using such a function during testing.
>
> Mike
>
>
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by "Michael A. Labriola" <la...@digitalprimates.net>.
>As for static functions, I like to think of them as baby steps towards writing functional language code and a nice fence around making sure your functions have no side affects.
Except they can have side effects and prevent the isolation of any code using such a function during testing.
Mike
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Avi Kessner <ak...@gmail.com>.
Not only do singleton's make it hard to test but they also make it harder
to get people to write testable code.
As for static functions, I like to think of them as baby steps towards
writing functional language code and a nice fence around making sure your
functions have no side affects.
On Jan 16, 2013 8:18 PM, "Avi Kessner" <ak...@gmail.com> wrote:
> After laerning puremvc and robotlegs I got a mate project. At first I
> found it frustrating, then I got used to it. Then I wondered why the views
> were written so tightly that I couldn't shift the ui from the top to the
> left
> On Jan 16, 2013 12:59 PM, "Justin Mclean" <ju...@classsoftware.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> > I have heard good things about "Mate" for MVC. Has anyone used it?
>>
>> A few years ago on several projects - but a bit rusty now. I
>> particularly liked how it used declarative markup (MXML) for the event
>> maps. If you needed to order multiple server calls it made it very easy.
>>
>> Justin
>
>
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Avi Kessner <ak...@gmail.com>.
After laerning puremvc and robotlegs I got a mate project. At first I found
it frustrating, then I got used to it. Then I wondered why the views were
written so tightly that I couldn't shift the ui from the top to the left
On Jan 16, 2013 12:59 PM, "Justin Mclean" <ju...@classsoftware.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> > I have heard good things about "Mate" for MVC. Has anyone used it?
>
> A few years ago on several projects - but a bit rusty now. I
> particularly liked how it used declarative markup (MXML) for the event
> maps. If you needed to order multiple server calls it made it very easy.
>
> Justin
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Justin Mclean <ju...@classsoftware.com>.
Hi,
> I have heard good things about "Mate" for MVC. Has anyone used it?
A few years ago on several projects - but a bit rusty now. I particularly liked how it used declarative markup (MXML) for the event maps. If you needed to order multiple server calls it made it very easy.
Justin
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Kessler CTR Mark J <ma...@usmc.mil>.
I have heard good things about "Mate" for MVC. Has anyone used it?
Mate URL: http://mate.asfusion.com/
-Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: Nick Tsitlakidis [mailto:nickt@perfectedz.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 20:46
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Speaking of Singletons and frameworks, Robotlegs has solved this problem in
a very nice way. They say that a class should not care about how many
instances it has. So there are no Singletons but there are dependency
injections that will always pass the one and only instance. The logic is
the same (there are times when you need only one instance) but the
implementation differs.
On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 12:51 AM, jude <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 1:30 PM, Tianzhen Lin <ta...@usa.net> wrote:
>
> > I told the whiners of Flash if they hate Flash ads, they can disable the
> > plugin by default with the browser, and there are plenty of those
> add-in's.
> > But once the same Flash ad producers start making the same crappy ads in
> > HTML 5, there is no more block HTML 5 feature. :)
>
>
> Exactly! They should want Flash back specifically *because* you can disable
> it.
>
> @Avi - Sortof. You can dispatch events from any object that extends
> IEventDispatcher. If that object is a display object and is on the display
> list that event will bubble up through it (if bubbles are set to true). If
> it's a regular object you would just add an event listener to it to to
> handle any of it's events. Also, as for singletons, they don't get as much
> MXML love as the rest of the SDK but that doesn't mean you have to give up
> on them. A few months ago I made a Singleton Enforcer class so that *any*
> class can be a Singleton and referenced in MXML.
>
> The way it works is you declare in the root application or a document an
> instance of your class /singleton in MXML (yes MXML). This can be any class
> with instance variables on it (they don't have to be static and you don't
> need to create a getInstance() method except if you want to reference it in
> AS). Next, you add a RegisterSingleton MXML class and bind it to that
> instance. That registers it in Flex's global singleton manager. Then in any
> component you need it you can declare your singleton class (in MXML) and
> add a SingletonEnforcer class next to it. When you run your application the
> Singleton Enforcer class will ensure that that instance is the same
> instance across the application. Reading previous discussions it sounds
> like AOT accomplishes the same thing.
>
--
Nick Tsitlakidis,
CEO and Software Architect at Perfect Edge LTD.
www.perfectedz.com
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Nick Tsitlakidis <ni...@perfectedz.com>.
Speaking of Singletons and frameworks, Robotlegs has solved this problem in
a very nice way. They say that a class should not care about how many
instances it has. So there are no Singletons but there are dependency
injections that will always pass the one and only instance. The logic is
the same (there are times when you need only one instance) but the
implementation differs.
On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 12:51 AM, jude <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 1:30 PM, Tianzhen Lin <ta...@usa.net> wrote:
>
> > I told the whiners of Flash if they hate Flash ads, they can disable the
> > plugin by default with the browser, and there are plenty of those
> add-in's.
> > But once the same Flash ad producers start making the same crappy ads in
> > HTML 5, there is no more block HTML 5 feature. :)
>
>
> Exactly! They should want Flash back specifically *because* you can disable
> it.
>
> @Avi - Sortof. You can dispatch events from any object that extends
> IEventDispatcher. If that object is a display object and is on the display
> list that event will bubble up through it (if bubbles are set to true). If
> it's a regular object you would just add an event listener to it to to
> handle any of it's events. Also, as for singletons, they don't get as much
> MXML love as the rest of the SDK but that doesn't mean you have to give up
> on them. A few months ago I made a Singleton Enforcer class so that *any*
> class can be a Singleton and referenced in MXML.
>
> The way it works is you declare in the root application or a document an
> instance of your class /singleton in MXML (yes MXML). This can be any class
> with instance variables on it (they don't have to be static and you don't
> need to create a getInstance() method except if you want to reference it in
> AS). Next, you add a RegisterSingleton MXML class and bind it to that
> instance. That registers it in Flex's global singleton manager. Then in any
> component you need it you can declare your singleton class (in MXML) and
> add a SingletonEnforcer class next to it. When you run your application the
> Singleton Enforcer class will ensure that that instance is the same
> instance across the application. Reading previous discussions it sounds
> like AOT accomplishes the same thing.
>
--
Nick Tsitlakidis,
CEO and Software Architect at Perfect Edge LTD.
www.perfectedz.com
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by jude <fl...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 1:30 PM, Tianzhen Lin <ta...@usa.net> wrote:
> I told the whiners of Flash if they hate Flash ads, they can disable the
> plugin by default with the browser, and there are plenty of those add-in's.
> But once the same Flash ad producers start making the same crappy ads in
> HTML 5, there is no more block HTML 5 feature. :)
Exactly! They should want Flash back specifically *because* you can disable
it.
@Avi - Sortof. You can dispatch events from any object that extends
IEventDispatcher. If that object is a display object and is on the display
list that event will bubble up through it (if bubbles are set to true). If
it's a regular object you would just add an event listener to it to to
handle any of it's events. Also, as for singletons, they don't get as much
MXML love as the rest of the SDK but that doesn't mean you have to give up
on them. A few months ago I made a Singleton Enforcer class so that *any*
class can be a Singleton and referenced in MXML.
The way it works is you declare in the root application or a document an
instance of your class /singleton in MXML (yes MXML). This can be any class
with instance variables on it (they don't have to be static and you don't
need to create a getInstance() method except if you want to reference it in
AS). Next, you add a RegisterSingleton MXML class and bind it to that
instance. That registers it in Flex's global singleton manager. Then in any
component you need it you can declare your singleton class (in MXML) and
add a SingletonEnforcer class next to it. When you run your application the
Singleton Enforcer class will ensure that that instance is the same
instance across the application. Reading previous discussions it sounds
like AOT accomplishes the same thing.
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Tianzhen Lin <ta...@usa.net>.
I told the whiners of Flash if they hate Flash ads, they can disable the
plugin by default with the browser, and there are plenty of those add-in's.
But once the same Flash ad producers start making the same crappy ads in
HTML 5, there is no more block HTML 5 feature. :) They still don't get it,
they still think Google's JS engine is faster than AVM2, true -- but Flash
is very fast when translating DisplayObject to pixels on the screen, whereas
HTML DOM -- that's where all the bottlenecks are.
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Schmalle [mailto:apache@teotigraphix.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2013 1:53 PM
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Usually I'm not a gossip but since this is OT...
What I laugh at is Flash adds could only "do" so much because of it's
restrictions as a plugin.
Now, how many times do you get HTML5 JS popup advertisements that take over
your whole friggin screen. They force you to click close, who knows where
those close clicks will be taking you in a year, I just hit the back button.
The common man thought Flash was bad with adds, just wait till more and more
incompetent designers get their hands on the JS popup libraries, you will be
thinking your browser is getting locked out by adds because now we have div
popups that the browser really can't do anything about.
2cents over...
Mike
Quoting Tianzhen Lin <ta...@usa.net>:
> I am glad I have skipped Parsley and looked into RobotLegs, which is
> about to release RobotLegs 2.
>
> As for HTML 5, I still don't get all the frenzy around the
> technologies where they are built on old JavaScript that is not
> strongly typed, and pretty much every features HTML 5 has to offer are
> "I am catching up with Flash." But all the decision makers who have
> zero understanding of Flash and just a few whitepaper on HTML 5 would
> go frenzy with the latest stuff, most stemmed from the hatred of Flash
> because of those annoying Flash advertisements that incompetent designers
have come up with.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael Schmalle [mailto:apache@teotigraphix.com]
> Sent: Monday, January 14, 2013 6:09 PM
> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
>
> Right, the eating and beating was a visual for the hedonism of the
> HTML5 community and there reckless JavaScript development.
>
> I agree, if I can use ActionScript to make WebAudio applications in 1
> year, this will be a success. :)
>
> Mike
>
> Quoting Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 1/14/13 2:22 PM, "Michael Schmalle" <ap...@teotigraphix.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left.
>> Native (mobile) apps is also a possible road.
>>
>>> This decade of my life
>>> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
>>> his face with jQuery muffins.
>> Thanks for making me laugh. I wish I were an artist because I would
> sketch
>> a political cartoon of that. But remember, the hare got beat by
>> snoozing, not by overeating. And really, I don't think we have to
>> beat the hare to
> be
>> successful.
>>
>> --
>> Alex Harui
>> Flex SDK Team
>> Adobe Systems, Inc.
>> http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
>>
>>
>
> --
> Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
> http://www.teotigraphix.com
> http://blog.teotigraphix.com
>
>
--
Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
http://www.teotigraphix.com
http://blog.teotigraphix.com
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Michael Schmalle <ap...@teotigraphix.com>.
Usually I'm not a gossip but since this is OT...
What I laugh at is Flash adds could only "do" so much because of it's
restrictions as a plugin.
Now, how many times do you get HTML5 JS popup advertisements that take
over your whole friggin screen. They force you to click close, who
knows where those close clicks will be taking you in a year, I just
hit the back button.
The common man thought Flash was bad with adds, just wait till more
and more incompetent designers get their hands on the JS popup
libraries, you will be thinking your browser is getting locked out by
adds because now we have div popups that the browser really can't do
anything about.
2cents over...
Mike
Quoting Tianzhen Lin <ta...@usa.net>:
> I am glad I have skipped Parsley and looked into RobotLegs, which is about
> to release RobotLegs 2.
>
> As for HTML 5, I still don't get all the frenzy around the technologies
> where they are built on old JavaScript that is not strongly typed, and
> pretty much every features HTML 5 has to offer are "I am catching up with
> Flash." But all the decision makers who have zero understanding of Flash
> and just a few whitepaper on HTML 5 would go frenzy with the latest stuff,
> most stemmed from the hatred of Flash because of those annoying Flash
> advertisements that incompetent designers have come up with.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael Schmalle [mailto:apache@teotigraphix.com]
> Sent: Monday, January 14, 2013 6:09 PM
> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
>
> Right, the eating and beating was a visual for the hedonism of the
> HTML5 community and there reckless JavaScript development.
>
> I agree, if I can use ActionScript to make WebAudio applications in 1
> year, this will be a success. :)
>
> Mike
>
> Quoting Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 1/14/13 2:22 PM, "Michael Schmalle" <ap...@teotigraphix.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left.
>> Native (mobile) apps is also a possible road.
>>
>>> This decade of my life
>>> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
>>> his face with jQuery muffins.
>> Thanks for making me laugh. I wish I were an artist because I would
> sketch
>> a political cartoon of that. But remember, the hare got beat by snoozing,
>> not by overeating. And really, I don't think we have to beat the hare to
> be
>> successful.
>>
>> --
>> Alex Harui
>> Flex SDK Team
>> Adobe Systems, Inc.
>> http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
>>
>>
>
> --
> Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
> http://www.teotigraphix.com
> http://blog.teotigraphix.com
>
>
--
Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
http://www.teotigraphix.com
http://blog.teotigraphix.com
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Avi Kessner <ak...@gmail.com>.
As great as events are they are limited to the display list.
I still think singleton's should be avoided as much as possible.
On Jan 15, 2013 8:57 PM, "David Coleman" <da...@hotmail.com>
wrote:
> Having used (and DESPISED) Parsley, I can say with pleasure "Good
> Riddance". For me it was overkill and added little to no value to the
> quality of the code. All the ppl I know who used Parsley said "oh but you
> have dependency injection" "oh but you have encapsulation of this" "oh but
> you have decoupled code"... I say "ever hear of a singleton? flex doesn't
> need dependency injection if you are smart" "why encapsulate? don't your
> developers know how to use the Flex SDK?, what are you afraid of writing
> your own code" and to the ppl who blather on about decoupled code... I
> laugh in their faces and ask them "ever hear of Events?"
>
> Ok so maybe there were some benefits, and of course my opinions are
> admittedly acid, draconian and intentionally dismissive... But I believe
> that Flex is a great framework all by itself, and if you need an extra
> package to do MVC, you don't understand what MVC is in the first place, and
> no matter what you do, it won't be good.
>
> > From: tangent@usa.net
> > To: dev@flex.apache.org
> > Subject: RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
> > Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:44:31 -0500
> >
> > I am glad I have skipped Parsley and looked into RobotLegs, which is
> about
> > to release RobotLegs 2.
> >
> > As for HTML 5, I still don't get all the frenzy around the technologies
> > where they are built on old JavaScript that is not strongly typed, and
> > pretty much every features HTML 5 has to offer are "I am catching up with
> > Flash." But all the decision makers who have zero understanding of Flash
> > and just a few whitepaper on HTML 5 would go frenzy with the latest
> stuff,
> > most stemmed from the hatred of Flash because of those annoying Flash
> > advertisements that incompetent designers have come up with.
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Michael Schmalle [mailto:apache@teotigraphix.com]
> > Sent: Monday, January 14, 2013 6:09 PM
> > To: dev@flex.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
> >
> > Right, the eating and beating was a visual for the hedonism of the
> > HTML5 community and there reckless JavaScript development.
> >
> > I agree, if I can use ActionScript to make WebAudio applications in 1
> > year, this will be a success. :)
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > Quoting Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 1/14/13 2:22 PM, "Michael Schmalle" <ap...@teotigraphix.com>
> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >>
> > >> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left.
> > > Native (mobile) apps is also a possible road.
> > >
> > >> This decade of my life
> > >> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
> > >> his face with jQuery muffins.
> > > Thanks for making me laugh. I wish I were an artist because I would
> > sketch
> > > a political cartoon of that. But remember, the hare got beat by
> snoozing,
> > > not by overeating. And really, I don't think we have to beat the hare
> to
> > be
> > > successful.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Alex Harui
> > > Flex SDK Team
> > > Adobe Systems, Inc.
> > > http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
> > http://www.teotigraphix.com
> > http://blog.teotigraphix.com
> >
>
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by dude <du...@atheist.com>.
Wow, so much arrogance and ignorance in one single post.
Am 15.01.2013 19:57, schrieb David Coleman:
> Having used (and DESPISED) Parsley, I can say with pleasure "Good Riddance". For me it was overkill and added little to no value to the quality of the code. All the ppl I know who used Parsley said "oh but you have dependency injection" "oh but you have encapsulation of this" "oh but you have decoupled code"... I say "ever hear of a singleton? flex doesn't need dependency injection if you are smart" "why encapsulate? don't your developers know how to use the Flex SDK?, what are you afraid of writing your own code" and to the ppl who blather on about decoupled code... I laugh in their faces and ask them "ever hear of Events?"
>
> Ok so maybe there were some benefits, and of course my opinions are admittedly acid, draconian and intentionally dismissive... But I believe that Flex is a great framework all by itself, and if you need an extra package to do MVC, you don't understand what MVC is in the first place, and no matter what you do, it won't be good.
>
>> From: tangent@usa.net
>> To: dev@flex.apache.org
>> Subject: RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
>> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:44:31 -0500
>>
>> I am glad I have skipped Parsley and looked into RobotLegs, which is about
>> to release RobotLegs 2.
>>
>> As for HTML 5, I still don't get all the frenzy around the technologies
>> where they are built on old JavaScript that is not strongly typed, and
>> pretty much every features HTML 5 has to offer are "I am catching up with
>> Flash." But all the decision makers who have zero understanding of Flash
>> and just a few whitepaper on HTML 5 would go frenzy with the latest stuff,
>> most stemmed from the hatred of Flash because of those annoying Flash
>> advertisements that incompetent designers have come up with.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Michael Schmalle [mailto:apache@teotigraphix.com]
>> Sent: Monday, January 14, 2013 6:09 PM
>> To: dev@flex.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
>>
>> Right, the eating and beating was a visual for the hedonism of the
>> HTML5 community and there reckless JavaScript development.
>>
>> I agree, if I can use ActionScript to make WebAudio applications in 1
>> year, this will be a success. :)
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> Quoting Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 1/14/13 2:22 PM, "Michael Schmalle" <ap...@teotigraphix.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left.
>>> Native (mobile) apps is also a possible road.
>>>
>>>> This decade of my life
>>>> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
>>>> his face with jQuery muffins.
>>> Thanks for making me laugh. I wish I were an artist because I would
>> sketch
>>> a political cartoon of that. But remember, the hare got beat by snoozing,
>>> not by overeating. And really, I don't think we have to beat the hare to
>> be
>>> successful.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Alex Harui
>>> Flex SDK Team
>>> Adobe Systems, Inc.
>>> http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
>> http://www.teotigraphix.com
>> http://blog.teotigraphix.com
>>
>
>
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by David Coleman <da...@hotmail.com>.
Having used (and DESPISED) Parsley, I can say with pleasure "Good Riddance". For me it was overkill and added little to no value to the quality of the code. All the ppl I know who used Parsley said "oh but you have dependency injection" "oh but you have encapsulation of this" "oh but you have decoupled code"... I say "ever hear of a singleton? flex doesn't need dependency injection if you are smart" "why encapsulate? don't your developers know how to use the Flex SDK?, what are you afraid of writing your own code" and to the ppl who blather on about decoupled code... I laugh in their faces and ask them "ever hear of Events?"
Ok so maybe there were some benefits, and of course my opinions are admittedly acid, draconian and intentionally dismissive... But I believe that Flex is a great framework all by itself, and if you need an extra package to do MVC, you don't understand what MVC is in the first place, and no matter what you do, it won't be good.
> From: tangent@usa.net
> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> Subject: RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
> Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 13:44:31 -0500
>
> I am glad I have skipped Parsley and looked into RobotLegs, which is about
> to release RobotLegs 2.
>
> As for HTML 5, I still don't get all the frenzy around the technologies
> where they are built on old JavaScript that is not strongly typed, and
> pretty much every features HTML 5 has to offer are "I am catching up with
> Flash." But all the decision makers who have zero understanding of Flash
> and just a few whitepaper on HTML 5 would go frenzy with the latest stuff,
> most stemmed from the hatred of Flash because of those annoying Flash
> advertisements that incompetent designers have come up with.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael Schmalle [mailto:apache@teotigraphix.com]
> Sent: Monday, January 14, 2013 6:09 PM
> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
>
> Right, the eating and beating was a visual for the hedonism of the
> HTML5 community and there reckless JavaScript development.
>
> I agree, if I can use ActionScript to make WebAudio applications in 1
> year, this will be a success. :)
>
> Mike
>
> Quoting Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
>
> >
> >
> >
> > On 1/14/13 2:22 PM, "Michael Schmalle" <ap...@teotigraphix.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>
> >> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left.
> > Native (mobile) apps is also a possible road.
> >
> >> This decade of my life
> >> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
> >> his face with jQuery muffins.
> > Thanks for making me laugh. I wish I were an artist because I would
> sketch
> > a political cartoon of that. But remember, the hare got beat by snoozing,
> > not by overeating. And really, I don't think we have to beat the hare to
> be
> > successful.
> >
> > --
> > Alex Harui
> > Flex SDK Team
> > Adobe Systems, Inc.
> > http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
> >
> >
>
> --
> Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
> http://www.teotigraphix.com
> http://blog.teotigraphix.com
>
RE: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Tianzhen Lin <ta...@usa.net>.
I am glad I have skipped Parsley and looked into RobotLegs, which is about
to release RobotLegs 2.
As for HTML 5, I still don't get all the frenzy around the technologies
where they are built on old JavaScript that is not strongly typed, and
pretty much every features HTML 5 has to offer are "I am catching up with
Flash." But all the decision makers who have zero understanding of Flash
and just a few whitepaper on HTML 5 would go frenzy with the latest stuff,
most stemmed from the hatred of Flash because of those annoying Flash
advertisements that incompetent designers have come up with.
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Schmalle [mailto:apache@teotigraphix.com]
Sent: Monday, January 14, 2013 6:09 PM
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Right, the eating and beating was a visual for the hedonism of the
HTML5 community and there reckless JavaScript development.
I agree, if I can use ActionScript to make WebAudio applications in 1
year, this will be a success. :)
Mike
Quoting Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
>
>
>
> On 1/14/13 2:22 PM, "Michael Schmalle" <ap...@teotigraphix.com> wrote:
>
>
>>
>> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left.
> Native (mobile) apps is also a possible road.
>
>> This decade of my life
>> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
>> his face with jQuery muffins.
> Thanks for making me laugh. I wish I were an artist because I would
sketch
> a political cartoon of that. But remember, the hare got beat by snoozing,
> not by overeating. And really, I don't think we have to beat the hare to
be
> successful.
>
> --
> Alex Harui
> Flex SDK Team
> Adobe Systems, Inc.
> http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
>
>
--
Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
http://www.teotigraphix.com
http://blog.teotigraphix.com
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Michael Schmalle <ap...@teotigraphix.com>.
Right, the eating and beating was a visual for the hedonism of the
HTML5 community and there reckless JavaScript development.
I agree, if I can use ActionScript to make WebAudio applications in 1
year, this will be a success. :)
Mike
Quoting Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
>
>
>
> On 1/14/13 2:22 PM, "Michael Schmalle" <ap...@teotigraphix.com> wrote:
>
>
>>
>> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left.
> Native (mobile) apps is also a possible road.
>
>> This decade of my life
>> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
>> his face with jQuery muffins.
> Thanks for making me laugh. I wish I were an artist because I would sketch
> a political cartoon of that. But remember, the hare got beat by snoozing,
> not by overeating. And really, I don't think we have to beat the hare to be
> successful.
>
> --
> Alex Harui
> Flex SDK Team
> Adobe Systems, Inc.
> http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
>
>
--
Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
http://www.teotigraphix.com
http://blog.teotigraphix.com
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>.
On 1/14/13 2:22 PM, "Michael Schmalle" <ap...@teotigraphix.com> wrote:
>
> JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left.
Native (mobile) apps is also a possible road.
> This decade of my life
> will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
> his face with jQuery muffins.
Thanks for making me laugh. I wish I were an artist because I would sketch
a political cartoon of that. But remember, the hare got beat by snoozing,
not by overeating. And really, I don't think we have to beat the hare to be
successful.
--
Alex Harui
Flex SDK Team
Adobe Systems, Inc.
http://blogs.adobe.com/aharui
Re: [OT] The end of the SpiceFactory
Posted by Michael Schmalle <ap...@teotigraphix.com>.
Yeah, haha interesting comment about Swiz...
This is the true fact that Apache Flex is going to have to come to
terms with. What was is dead, what this project is to me, is the
ability to use the Apache infrastructure to build something new based
on the 10,000 of hours of work put into something.
JavaScript unfortunately is the only road left. This decade of my life
will be fulfilled if the tortoise can walk passed the hare stuffing
his face with jQuery muffins. I think this project has a chance,
because you get enough smart people together, something WILL happen.
And if not! I already wrote my farewell blog post in January of 2012,
it's still on my blog! ;-)
Mike
Quoting Roland Zwaga <ro...@stackandheap.com>:
> Hi there,
>
> I'm sure plenty of folks here will have heard and/or worked with the
> Parsley framework.
>
> Jens just posted his farewell to Flex message on the spicefactory site:
>
> http://www.spicefactory.org/news/news-2013-01-14.php
>
> Sad to see him go off to new horizons, but not much of a surprise either.
> Jens is an awesome developer and I learnt quite few things from him, plus I
> had some nice
> technical discussions with him.
>
> cheers,
>
> Roland
>
--
Michael Schmalle - Teoti Graphix, LLC
http://www.teotigraphix.com
http://blog.teotigraphix.com