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Posted to users@tomcat.apache.org by "Christoph P.U. Kukulies" <ku...@kukulies.org> on 2015/05/26 12:45:29 UTC

native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

There is this native Apache API if I recall correctly to speed up 
Apache. Is there such for Tomcat too?
And should this be established at any rate for production servers?

--
Christoph Kukulies


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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
David kerber wrote:
> On 5/26/2015 9:36 AM, Christopher Schultz wrote:
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> 
> ...
> 
>>
>>> The rebooting the server is a cure.
>>
>> That seems to be a popular cure with Microsoft Windows servers ;)
>>
> 
> But unfortunately, it's only treating the symptoms, not curing the 
> disease...   :-(
> 

Wait, I am a bit confused now. Is Microsoft Windows the symptom, or the disease ?


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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by David kerber <dc...@verizon.net>.
On 5/26/2015 9:36 AM, Christopher Schultz wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

...

>
>> The rebooting the server is a cure.
>
> That seems to be a popular cure with Microsoft Windows servers ;)
>

But unfortunately, it's only treating the symptoms, not curing the 
disease...   :-(




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RE: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by Jeffrey Janner <Je...@PolyDyne.com>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christoph P.U. Kukulies [mailto:kuku@kukulies.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 26, 2015 9:37 AM
> To: Tomcat Users List
> Subject: Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster
> 
> Am 26.05.2015 um 15:36 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
> >
> > So you are using either mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy?
> 
> mod_proxy
> 
> 
> >
> > Are you using TLS anywhere in the mix? (I should hope so, since you
> > are deploying a CMS). Does httpd terminate TLS? Do you encrypt the
> > connection(s) between httpd and Tomcat using TLS?
> 
> No, not using TSL between Apache and tomcat. Using secure http (https)
> is
> planned to be used soon.
> 
> >> We are observing that the server sometimes delivers pages
> >> incompletely.
> > Have you been able to determine if Tomcat is not sending the whole
> > page, or if httpd is not proxying the whole page?
> 
> I have not yet found the time to debug the connection and to locate the
> actual
> missing pieces. It just seems that some js or css is not being loaded
> since the source
> code of the page itself is there.
> 
> >
> >> Portions of the page do not show and trying to restart the service
> >> results in a time out.
> > A time out where? The service-restart times out, or after a service
> > restart, requests time out?
> 
> When I type NET STOP tomcat7 on the server to stop the service, it
> hangs. Normally
> the service should be shut down smoothly.
> 
From my experience, this is a symptom that indicates that the JVM has died but the service wrapper didn't catch it and is still running. Or perhaps just an important thread died in the JVM.  Check your Tomcat and application logs for errors (OOM errors particularly exhibit this symptom).

> >
> > I'm unaware of any problems when up-to-date versions of all components
> > are being used.
> >
> >> The rebooting the server is a cure.
> > That seems to be a popular cure with Microsoft Windows servers ;)
> >
> >
> --
> Christoph
> 
> 
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RE: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by "Caldarale, Charles R" <Ch...@unisys.com>.
> From: Christoph P.U. Kukulies [mailto:kuku@kukulies.org] 
> Subject: Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

> > That sounds like you have a resource leak of some kind, which is tying 
> > up server resources (memory, probably).

> This sounds a bit like that but I'm not sure.

Please stick to one topic per e-mail thread.  This one has conflated a performance question (use of APR) with a stability problem.  The only relationship between the two is that performance is zero when the system is being restarted.  You should start a separate thread for the instability issue if you want help with that.

> Anyway, to come back to the use of the APR-library: how can I check 
> whether it is already installed or how can I activate it?

Look in the Tomcat logs.  If APR is enabled it will be noted there during Tomcat startup.  The file tcnative-1.dll must be present in Tomcat's bin directory in order to use APR; that file is included in the 64-bit Windows zip download and in the 32-bit/64-bit Windows Service Installer download.  By default, APR will be used if tcnative-1.dll is present, but settings in server.xml can prevent that.  Look here for details:
http://tomcat.apache.org/tomcat-7.0-doc/config/http.html

 - Chuck


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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by "Christoph P.U. Kukulies" <ku...@kukulies.org>.
Am 26.05.2015 um 17:41 schrieb David kerber:
> On 5/26/2015 11:26 AM, Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
>> Am 26.05.2015 um 17:18 schrieb André Warnier:
>>> Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
>>>> Am 26.05.2015 um 15:36 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
>>>>>
>>>>> So you are using either mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy?
>>>>
>>>> mod_proxy
>>>>
>> ....
>>>> I have not yet found the time to debug the connection and to locate
>>>> the actual
>>>> missing pieces. It just seems that some js or css is not being loaded
>>>> since the source
>>>> code of the page itself is there.
>>>
>>> Now that may be something else entirely.
>>> Did you check your js/css links (in the Tomcat pages) and your proxy
>>> directives in Apache httpd carefully, to see if these (separate)
>>> requests for the js/css pieces are being sent to where these files
>>> really are ?
>>>
>>
>> It's not that the site doesn't work. Normally it works fine (after a
>> reboot) but after a couple  days of running
>> this effect occurs (that parts of the page do not appear any longer).
>
> That sounds like you have a resource leak of some kind, which is tying 
> up server resources (memory, probably).
>
>

This sounds a bit like that but I'm not sure.
Anyway, to come back to the use of the APR-library: how can I check 
whether it is already installed or how
can I activate it?

--
Christoph


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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by David kerber <dc...@verizon.net>.
On 5/26/2015 11:26 AM, Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
> Am 26.05.2015 um 17:18 schrieb André Warnier:
>> Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
>>> Am 26.05.2015 um 15:36 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
>>>>
>>>> So you are using either mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy?
>>>
>>> mod_proxy
>>>
> ....
>>> I have not yet found the time to debug the connection and to locate
>>> the actual
>>> missing pieces. It just seems that some js or css is not being loaded
>>> since the source
>>> code of the page itself is there.
>>
>> Now that may be something else entirely.
>> Did you check your js/css links (in the Tomcat pages) and your proxy
>> directives in Apache httpd carefully, to see if these (separate)
>> requests for the js/css pieces are being sent to where these files
>> really are ?
>>
>
> It's not that the site doesn't work. Normally it works fine (after a
> reboot) but after a couple  days of running
> this effect occurs (that parts of the page do not appear any longer).

That sounds like you have a resource leak of some kind, which is tying 
up server resources (memory, probably).


>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Portions of the page do not show and trying to restart the service
>>>>> results in a time out.
>>>> A time out where? The service-restart times out, or after a service
>>>> restart, requests time out?
>>>
>>> When I type NET STOP tomcat7 on the server to stop the service, it
>>> hangs. Normally
>>> the service should be shut down smoothly.
>>>
>>
>> And that may be a totally separate, unrelated to the first above, issue.
>>
> Yes, maybe, or probably.
> --
> Christoph
>
>
>
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>
>


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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by "Christoph P.U. Kukulies" <ku...@kukulies.org>.
Am 26.05.2015 um 17:18 schrieb André Warnier:
> Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
>> Am 26.05.2015 um 15:36 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
>>>
>>> So you are using either mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy?
>>
>> mod_proxy
>>
....
>> I have not yet found the time to debug the connection and to locate 
>> the actual
>> missing pieces. It just seems that some js or css is not being loaded 
>> since the source
>> code of the page itself is there.
>
> Now that may be something else entirely.
> Did you check your js/css links (in the Tomcat pages) and your proxy 
> directives in Apache httpd carefully, to see if these (separate) 
> requests for the js/css pieces are being sent to where these files 
> really are ?
>

It's not that the site doesn't work. Normally it works fine (after a 
reboot) but after a couple  days of running
this effect occurs (that parts of the page do not appear any longer).

>>
>>>
>>>> Portions of the page do not show and trying to restart the service
>>>> results in a time out.
>>> A time out where? The service-restart times out, or after a service
>>> restart, requests time out?
>>
>> When I type NET STOP tomcat7 on the server to stop the service, it 
>> hangs. Normally
>> the service should be shut down smoothly.
>>
>
> And that may be a totally separate, unrelated to the first above, issue.
>
Yes, maybe, or probably.
--
Christoph



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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by André Warnier <aw...@ice-sa.com>.
Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
> Am 26.05.2015 um 15:36 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
>>
>> So you are using either mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy?
> 
> mod_proxy
> 
> 
>>
>> Are you using TLS anywhere in the mix? (I should hope so, since you
>> are deploying a CMS). Does httpd terminate TLS? Do you encrypt the
>> connection(s) between httpd and Tomcat using TLS?
> 
> No, not using TSL between Apache and tomcat. Using secure http (https) is
> planned to be used soon.
> 
>>> We are observing that the server sometimes delivers pages
>>> incompletely.
>> Have you been able to determine if Tomcat is not sending the whole
>> page, or if httpd is not proxying the whole page?
> 
> I have not yet found the time to debug the connection and to locate the 
> actual
> missing pieces. It just seems that some js or css is not being loaded 
> since the source
> code of the page itself is there.

Now that may be something else entirely.
Did you check your js/css links (in the Tomcat pages) and your proxy directives in Apache 
httpd carefully, to see if these (separate) requests for the js/css pieces are being sent 
to where these files really are ?

> 
>>
>>> Portions of the page do not show and trying to restart the service
>>> results in a time out.
>> A time out where? The service-restart times out, or after a service
>> restart, requests time out?
> 
> When I type NET STOP tomcat7 on the server to stop the service, it 
> hangs. Normally
> the service should be shut down smoothly.
> 

And that may be a totally separate, unrelated to the first above, issue.

>>
>> I'm unaware of any problems when up-to-date versions of all components
>> are being used.
>>
>>> The rebooting the server is a cure.
>> That seems to be a popular cure with Microsoft Windows servers ;)
>>
>>
> -- 
> Christoph
> 
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tomcat.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tomcat.apache.org
> 
> 


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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Christoph,

On 5/26/15 10:36 AM, Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
> Am 26.05.2015 um 15:36 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
>> 
>> So you are using either mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy?
> 
> mod_proxy

I meant to say mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy_http. I'm assuming the
latter is in use.

>> Are you using TLS anywhere in the mix? (I should hope so, since
>> you are deploying a CMS). Does httpd terminate TLS? Do you
>> encrypt the connection(s) between httpd and Tomcat using TLS?
> 
> No, not using TSL between Apache and tomcat. Using secure http
> (https) is planned to be used soon.

Okay. For now, there's no reason to switch to the APR-based connector
because the only real performance benefit is when you are using TLS.
But, you might want to start testing with it, now, so that you have
everything ready for your switch to TLS.

You could also use something like stunnel (or equivalent in the
Microsoft Windows world) so that you are using plain-old HTTP between
httpd and Tomcat, but the networking itself supplies the encryption.
Depending upon your configuration and use case, this may be slightly
more efficient.

>>> We are observing that the server sometimes delivers pages 
>>> incompletely.
>> Have you been able to determine if Tomcat is not sending the
>> whole page, or if httpd is not proxying the whole page?
> 
> I have not yet found the time to debug the connection and to
> locate the actual missing pieces. It just seems that some js or css
> is not being loaded since the source code of the page itself is
> there.

You will obviously want to locate the source of the problem,
regardless of your choice of connector. Again, I'm not aware of any
problems with your version of Tomcat and the Java-based connectors.

>>> Portions of the page do not show and trying to restart the
>>> service results in a time out.
>> A time out where? The service-restart times out, or after a
>> service restart, requests time out?
> 
> When I type NET STOP tomcat7 on the server to stop the service, it 
> hangs. Normally the service should be shut down smoothly.

My (limited) experience with Windows Services is that they often get
cranky with Java-based server processes. Check your Tomcat log files
to see if something is shutting-down particularly slowly.

Anyway, you can download a binary of the tcnative library here:
http://tomcat.apache.org/download-native.cgi

Remember to use the proper architecture, and choose whether you want
OCSP support. If you don't know what that is, you probably don't need it
.

- -chris
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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by "Christoph P.U. Kukulies" <ku...@kukulies.org>.
Am 26.05.2015 um 15:36 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
>
> So you are using either mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy?

mod_proxy


>
> Are you using TLS anywhere in the mix? (I should hope so, since you
> are deploying a CMS). Does httpd terminate TLS? Do you encrypt the
> connection(s) between httpd and Tomcat using TLS?

No, not using TSL between Apache and tomcat. Using secure http (https) is
planned to be used soon.

>> We are observing that the server sometimes delivers pages
>> incompletely.
> Have you been able to determine if Tomcat is not sending the whole
> page, or if httpd is not proxying the whole page?

I have not yet found the time to debug the connection and to locate the 
actual
missing pieces. It just seems that some js or css is not being loaded 
since the source
code of the page itself is there.

>
>> Portions of the page do not show and trying to restart the service
>> results in a time out.
> A time out where? The service-restart times out, or after a service
> restart, requests time out?

When I type NET STOP tomcat7 on the server to stop the service, it 
hangs. Normally
the service should be shut down smoothly.

>
> I'm unaware of any problems when up-to-date versions of all components
> are being used.
>
>> The rebooting the server is a cure.
> That seems to be a popular cure with Microsoft Windows servers ;)
>
>
--
Christoph


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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Christoph,

On 5/26/15 9:25 AM, Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
> Am 26.05.2015 um 15:06 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA256
>> 
>> Christoph,
>> 
>> On 5/26/15 6:45 AM, Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
>>> There is this native Apache API if I recall correctly to speed
>>> up Apache. Is there such for Tomcat too?
>> If by "Apache" you mean "Apache httpd", you need to understand
>> that Apache httpd is 100% "native", as it's all written in C.
>> 
>> Apache Tomcat has a connector which is based upon the Apache
>> Portable Runtime, which is a native library.
> 
> Yes, APR, was the term, not API. I'm seeing discussion running on 
> another issue on APR here, BTW.
> 
> Anyway, we have a production server (Windows 7/64) , that is
> running a CMS under Tomcat 7.0.61 (64bit jdk 1.8.0_5) and serves a
> website to the public via Apache 2.4  and connectors (not modjk).

So you are using either mod_proxy_ajp or mod_proxy?

Are you using TLS anywhere in the mix? (I should hope so, since you
are deploying a CMS). Does httpd terminate TLS? Do you encrypt the
connection(s) between httpd and Tomcat using TLS?

> We are observing that the server sometimes delivers pages
> incompletely.

Have you been able to determine if Tomcat is not sending the whole
page, or if httpd is not proxying the whole page?

> Portions of the page do not show and trying to restart the service 
> results in a time out.

A time out where? The service-restart times out, or after a service
restart, requests time out?

I'm unaware of any problems when up-to-date versions of all components
are being used.

> The rebooting the server is a cure.

That seems to be a popular cure with Microsoft Windows servers ;)

- -chris
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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by "Christoph P.U. Kukulies" <ku...@kukulies.org>.
Am 26.05.2015 um 15:06 schrieb Christopher Schultz:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Christoph,
>
> On 5/26/15 6:45 AM, Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
>> There is this native Apache API if I recall correctly to speed up
>> Apache. Is there such for Tomcat too?
> If by "Apache" you mean "Apache httpd", you need to understand that
> Apache httpd is 100% "native", as it's all written in C.
>
> Apache Tomcat has a connector which is based upon the Apache Portable
> Runtime, which is a native library.

Yes, APR, was the term, not API. I'm seeing discussion running on 
another issue on APR
here, BTW.

Anyway, we have a production server (Windows 7/64) , that is running a 
CMS under Tomcat 7.0.61 (64bit jdk 1.8.0_5)
and serves a website to the public via Apache 2.4  and connectors (not 
modjk).


We are observing that the server sometimes delivers pages incompletely. 
Portions of the page
do not show and trying to restart the service results in a time out. The 
rebooting the server
is a cure.


>> And should this be established at any rate for production servers?
> That depends. Are you suffering any performance problems? What does
> your production deployment look like? There is really only one
> use-case where the APR-based connector really makes a difference.
>
--
Christoph

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Re: native API - to make Apache/Tomcat faster

Posted by Christopher Schultz <ch...@christopherschultz.net>.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Christoph,

On 5/26/15 6:45 AM, Christoph P.U. Kukulies wrote:
> There is this native Apache API if I recall correctly to speed up 
> Apache. Is there such for Tomcat too?

If by "Apache" you mean "Apache httpd", you need to understand that
Apache httpd is 100% "native", as it's all written in C.

Apache Tomcat has a connector which is based upon the Apache Portable
Runtime, which is a native library.

> And should this be established at any rate for production servers?

That depends. Are you suffering any performance problems? What does
your production deployment look like? There is really only one
use-case where the APR-based connector really makes a difference.

- -chris
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