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Posted to dev@subversion.apache.org by Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <de...@subversion.apache.org> on 2026/08/03 17:01:02 UTC

[PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Hello,

INSTALL says that I have to explicitly specify --with-serf when running
./configure to enable ra_serf. This doesn't seem to be the case because
pkg-config is used to automatically detect whether libserf is installed on
the system.

(I think that the current wording is from the ra_neon era, when --with-serf
selected ra_serf instead of ra_neon).

Log message:

* INSTALL
  (I.C.7): clarify that libserf is automatically detected by pkg-config

Patch by: Pavel Lyalyakin <ly...@apache.org>

-- 
With best regards,
Pavel Lyalyakin
VisualSVN Team

Re: [PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Posted by Nathan Hartman <ha...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Aug 4, 2026 at 4:20 PM Daniel Sahlberg
<da...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> tis 4 aug. 2026 kl. 20:45 skrev Nathan Hartman <ha...@gmail.com>:
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 4, 2026 at 2:04 PM Nathan Hartman <ha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > On Tue, Aug 4, 2026 at 12:37 PM Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <de...@subversion.apache.org> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hello,
>> >
>> > (snip)
>> >>
>> >> The thing is that the INSTALL document needs a major rework (I think that everyone can agree with this).
>> >
>> > (snip)
>> >
>> > I agree with this!
>> >
>> > It is something I have looked into in the past, but every time I did, I became overwhelmed by how extensively INSTALL needed to change.
>> >
>> > One good thing is that after the CMake & vcpkg build becomes the "official" way to build on Windows in 1.16, a huge amount of cruft can be removed (all of section II-E). That will result in renumbering the later sections, so maybe it's a good time to just go in there with a wrecking ball.
>> >
>> > Thanks for giving INSTALL some much needed love!!
>> >
>> > By the way, I don't agree that it's not glamorous: for many users, INSTALL is likely one of the first pieces of documentation they encounter once they decide to try Subversion. It was for me when I installed Subversion for my $dayjob for the first time in 2007. INSTALL was very good, very clear, and it gave me confidence that I was dealing with a well made tool. There's something glamorous in that :-)
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>>
>>
>> I have nominated both changes (r1936876, r1936877) for backport to
>> 1.15.x in r1936879.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Nathan
>
>
> I don’t have access to my computer tonight so I cannot vote but if you are able, would you like to add my +1 and approve (since it is not core code) ?
>
> /Daniel
>
>>

Sure, done in r1936883.

Cheers,
Nathan

Re: [PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Posted by Daniel Sahlberg <da...@gmail.com>.
tis 4 aug. 2026 kl. 20:45 skrev Nathan Hartman <ha...@gmail.com>:

> On Tue, Aug 4, 2026 at 2:04 PM Nathan Hartman <ha...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 4, 2026 at 12:37 PM Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <
> dev@subversion.apache.org> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hello,
> >
> > (snip)
> >>
> >> The thing is that the INSTALL document needs a major rework (I think
> that everyone can agree with this).
> >
> > (snip)
> >
> > I agree with this!
> >
> > It is something I have looked into in the past, but every time I did, I
> became overwhelmed by how extensively INSTALL needed to change.
> >
> > One good thing is that after the CMake & vcpkg build becomes the
> "official" way to build on Windows in 1.16, a huge amount of cruft can be
> removed (all of section II-E). That will result in renumbering the later
> sections, so maybe it's a good time to just go in there with a wrecking
> ball.
> >
> > Thanks for giving INSTALL some much needed love!!
> >
> > By the way, I don't agree that it's not glamorous: for many users,
> INSTALL is likely one of the first pieces of documentation they encounter
> once they decide to try Subversion. It was for me when I installed
> Subversion for my $dayjob for the first time in 2007. INSTALL was very
> good, very clear, and it gave me confidence that I was dealing with a well
> made tool. There's something glamorous in that :-)
> >
> > Cheers,
>
>
> I have nominated both changes (r1936876, r1936877) for backport to
> 1.15.x in r1936879.
>
> Cheers,
> Nathan


I don’t have access to my computer tonight so I cannot vote but if you are
able, would you like to add my +1 and approve (since it is not core code) ?

/Daniel


>

Re: [PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Posted by Nathan Hartman <ha...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Aug 4, 2026 at 2:04 PM Nathan Hartman <ha...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Tue, Aug 4, 2026 at 12:37 PM Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <de...@subversion.apache.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>
> (snip)
>>
>> The thing is that the INSTALL document needs a major rework (I think that everyone can agree with this).
>
> (snip)
>
> I agree with this!
>
> It is something I have looked into in the past, but every time I did, I became overwhelmed by how extensively INSTALL needed to change.
>
> One good thing is that after the CMake & vcpkg build becomes the "official" way to build on Windows in 1.16, a huge amount of cruft can be removed (all of section II-E). That will result in renumbering the later sections, so maybe it's a good time to just go in there with a wrecking ball.
>
> Thanks for giving INSTALL some much needed love!!
>
> By the way, I don't agree that it's not glamorous: for many users, INSTALL is likely one of the first pieces of documentation they encounter once they decide to try Subversion. It was for me when I installed Subversion for my $dayjob for the first time in 2007. INSTALL was very good, very clear, and it gave me confidence that I was dealing with a well made tool. There's something glamorous in that :-)
>
> Cheers,


I have nominated both changes (r1936876, r1936877) for backport to
1.15.x in r1936879.

Cheers,
Nathan

Re: [PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Posted by Nathan Hartman <ha...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Aug 4, 2026 at 12:37 PM Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <
dev@subversion.apache.org> wrote:

> Hello,
>
(snip)

> The thing is that the INSTALL document needs a major rework (I think that
> everyone can agree with this).
>
(snip)

I agree with this!

It is something I have looked into in the past, but every time I did, I
became overwhelmed by how extensively INSTALL needed to change.

One good thing is that after the CMake & vcpkg build becomes the "official"
way to build on Windows in 1.16, a huge amount of cruft can be removed (all
of section II-E). That will result in renumbering the later sections, so
maybe it's a good time to just go in there with a wrecking ball.

Thanks for giving INSTALL some much needed love!!

By the way, I don't agree that it's not glamorous: for many users, INSTALL
is likely one of the first pieces of documentation they encounter once they
decide to try Subversion. It was for me when I installed Subversion for my
$dayjob for the first time in 2007. INSTALL was very good, very clear, and
it gave me confidence that I was dealing with a well made tool. There's
something glamorous in that :-)

Cheers,
Nathan

Re: [PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Posted by Daniel Sahlberg <da...@gmail.com>.
tis 4 aug. 2026 kl. 18:37 skrev Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <
dev@subversion.apache.org>:

> Hello,
>
> On Tue, 4 Aug 2026 at 10:45, Daniel Sahlberg <da...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Den mån 3 aug. 2026 kl 19:02 skrev Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <
>> dev@subversion.apache.org>:
>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> INSTALL says that I have to explicitly specify --with-serf when running
>>> ./configure to enable ra_serf. This doesn't seem to be the case because
>>> pkg-config is used to automatically detect whether libserf is installed on
>>> the system.
>>>
>>> (I think that the current wording is from the ra_neon era, when
>>> --with-serf selected ra_serf instead of ra_neon).
>>>
>>
>> I see that the existing text use the word "place" but for all other uses
>> (except for BDB) we use the word "location" so I would take the opportunity
>> to change it here.
>>
>> I would suggest to add something about "if you don't have pkg-config
>> installed" (as you already discovered in an earlier mail onlist[1] ). I do
>> see that we mention pkg-config elsewhere and I assume the same issue occur
>> for all dependencies if you don't have pkg-config installed so maybe that
>> is something that could go into section I.C.14?
>>
>
> That pkg-config part can be improved by changing the document's layout and
> by explicitly stating that pkg-config is used for automatic detection of
> some of SVN's dependencies (with a list of said dependencies). Adding a
> note about pkg-config to each dependency's section is somewhat bulky and
> just duplicates info that can be stated once is a single place (like a
> hypothetical section 'Build system dependencies', separate from the other
> dependencies).
>
> The thing is that the INSTALL document needs a major rework (I think that
> everyone can agree with this). Right now I'm going through the document and
> attempting to fix the most obvious issues where a small fix would be a real
> improvement over the current version. The pkg-config issue is more of a
> structural one, IMHO, so I'm putting it off until the smaller issues are
> fixed. I hope I should be able to suggest a better INSTALL layout a bit
> later, which by itself might resolve many of the issues with the document.
>

Thanks for looking at this not-so-glamorous-but-very-important work!


>
>> If you want to add the pkg-config related note under the Serf headline,
>> maybe something like:
>>
>> "If you don't use pkg-config and serf is installed in a non-standard
>> location, you should use"
>>
>
> Yep, this reads better, but I changed "..., you should use" to "..., then
> use:" for consistency.
>
>
>> Whichever way you choose, you have my +1 to edit INSTALL as you see fit,
>> either this patch or a variation thereof.
>>
>
> An updated variant committed in r1936877.
>

Thank you! (And thanks for the other commit as well!)


> Thanks for the review!
>
>
>> Thanks,
>> Daniel
>>
>>
>> [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/7f51kjmlxqls7nql8q5v0l22f0m5c372
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Log message:
>>>
>>> * INSTALL
>>>   (I.C.7): clarify that libserf is automatically detected by pkg-config
>>>
>>> Patch by: Pavel Lyalyakin <ly...@apache.org>
>>>
>>
>>> --
>>> With best regards,
>>> Pavel Lyalyakin
>>> VisualSVN Team
>>>
>>
>
> --
> With best regards,
> Pavel Lyalyakin
> VisualSVN Team
>

Re: [PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Posted by Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <de...@subversion.apache.org>.
Hello,

On Tue, 4 Aug 2026 at 10:45, Daniel Sahlberg <da...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Den mån 3 aug. 2026 kl 19:02 skrev Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <
> dev@subversion.apache.org>:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>> INSTALL says that I have to explicitly specify --with-serf when running
>> ./configure to enable ra_serf. This doesn't seem to be the case because
>> pkg-config is used to automatically detect whether libserf is installed on
>> the system.
>>
>> (I think that the current wording is from the ra_neon era, when
>> --with-serf selected ra_serf instead of ra_neon).
>>
>
> I see that the existing text use the word "place" but for all other uses
> (except for BDB) we use the word "location" so I would take the opportunity
> to change it here.
>
> I would suggest to add something about "if you don't have pkg-config
> installed" (as you already discovered in an earlier mail onlist[1] ). I do
> see that we mention pkg-config elsewhere and I assume the same issue occur
> for all dependencies if you don't have pkg-config installed so maybe that
> is something that could go into section I.C.14?
>

That pkg-config part can be improved by changing the document's layout and
by explicitly stating that pkg-config is used for automatic detection of
some of SVN's dependencies (with a list of said dependencies). Adding a
note about pkg-config to each dependency's section is somewhat bulky and
just duplicates info that can be stated once is a single place (like a
hypothetical section 'Build system dependencies', separate from the other
dependencies).

The thing is that the INSTALL document needs a major rework (I think that
everyone can agree with this). Right now I'm going through the document and
attempting to fix the most obvious issues where a small fix would be a real
improvement over the current version. The pkg-config issue is more of a
structural one, IMHO, so I'm putting it off until the smaller issues are
fixed. I hope I should be able to suggest a better INSTALL layout a bit
later, which by itself might resolve many of the issues with the document.


> If you want to add the pkg-config related note under the Serf headline,
> maybe something like:
>
> "If you don't use pkg-config and serf is installed in a non-standard
> location, you should use"
>

Yep, this reads better, but I changed "..., you should use" to "..., then
use:" for consistency.


> Whichever way you choose, you have my +1 to edit INSTALL as you see fit,
> either this patch or a variation thereof.
>

An updated variant committed in r1936877.

Thanks for the review!


> Thanks,
> Daniel
>
>
> [1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/7f51kjmlxqls7nql8q5v0l22f0m5c372
>
>
>>
>> Log message:
>>
>> * INSTALL
>>   (I.C.7): clarify that libserf is automatically detected by pkg-config
>>
>> Patch by: Pavel Lyalyakin <ly...@apache.org>
>>
>> --
>> With best regards,
>> Pavel Lyalyakin
>> VisualSVN Team
>>
>

-- 
With best regards,
Pavel Lyalyakin
VisualSVN Team

Re: [PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Posted by Daniel Sahlberg <da...@gmail.com>.
Den mån 3 aug. 2026 kl 19:02 skrev Pavel Lyalyakin via dev <
dev@subversion.apache.org>:

> Hello,
>
> INSTALL says that I have to explicitly specify --with-serf when running
> ./configure to enable ra_serf. This doesn't seem to be the case because
> pkg-config is used to automatically detect whether libserf is installed on
> the system.
>
> (I think that the current wording is from the ra_neon era, when
> --with-serf selected ra_serf instead of ra_neon).
>

I see that the existing text use the word "place" but for all other uses
(except for BDB) we use the word "location" so I would take the opportunity
to change it here.

I would suggest to add something about "if you don't have pkg-config
installed" (as you already discovered in an earlier mail onlist[1] ). I do
see that we mention pkg-config elsewhere and I assume the same issue occur
for all dependencies if you don't have pkg-config installed so maybe that
is something that could go into section I.C.14?

If you want to add the pkg-config related note under the Serf headline,
maybe something like:

"If you don't use pkg-config and serf is installed in a non-standard
location, you should use"

Whichever way you choose, you have my +1 to edit INSTALL as you see fit,
either this patch or a variation thereof.

Thanks,
Daniel


[1] https://lists.apache.org/thread/7f51kjmlxqls7nql8q5v0l22f0m5c372


>
> Log message:
>
> * INSTALL
>   (I.C.7): clarify that libserf is automatically detected by pkg-config
>
> Patch by: Pavel Lyalyakin <ly...@apache.org>
>
> --
> With best regards,
> Pavel Lyalyakin
> VisualSVN Team
>

Re: [PATCH] INSTALL: clarify that libserf is auto-detected by pkg-config

Posted by Pavel Lyalyakin <ly...@apache.org>.
On Mon, 3 Aug 2026 at 20:01, Pavel Lyalyakin <pa...@visualsvn.com>
wrote:

> Hello,
>
> INSTALL says that I have to explicitly specify --with-serf when running
> ./configure to enable ra_serf. This doesn't seem to be the case because
> pkg-config is used to automatically detect whether libserf is installed on
> the system.
>
> (I think that the current wording is from the ra_neon era, when
> --with-serf selected ra_serf instead of ra_neon).
>
> Log message:
>
> * INSTALL
>   (I.C.7): clarify that libserf is automatically detected by pkg-config
>
> Patch by: Pavel Lyalyakin <ly...@apache.org>
>

(Yeah, this was supposed to be sent from my @apache.org email address, but
I used @visualsvn.com by mistake.)

--
With best regards,
Pavel Lyalyakin