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Posted to users@subversion.apache.org by Moisei <mo...@gmail.com> on 2005/03/08 15:14:43 UTC
Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Hello, I just wondering whether this mail has arrived to the list?
Thanks
Moisei.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Moisei <mo...@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 18:06:52 +0200
Subject: Does Subversion enables compression automatically under Apache
To: users@subversion.tigris.org
Hello dear all,
I just wondering whether I need enable and configure mod_deflate for subversion
or it is enabled automatically, by default?
I run latest stable version of Apache under Windows 2000 server.
I do not understand it from the subversion book:
>> Also, both Neon itself and Apache's mod_deflate can understand the "deflate"
>> algorithm (the same one used by the PKZIP and gzip programs),
>> so requests can be sent in smaller, compressed chunks across the wire.
Thanks,
--
Best Regards,
Moisei
--
Best Regards,
Moisei
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by anton <an...@nezzwerk.com>.
Moisei wrote:
> Hello, I just wondering whether this mail has arrived to the list?
> Thanks
> Moisei.
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Moisei <mo...@gmail.com>
> Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 18:06:52 +0200
> Subject: Does Subversion enables compression automatically under Apache
> To: users@subversion.tigris.org
>
>
> Hello dear all,
> I just wondering whether I need enable and configure mod_deflate for subversion
> or it is enabled automatically, by default?
> I run latest stable version of Apache under Windows 2000 server.
> I do not understand it from the subversion book:
>
>>>Also, both Neon itself and Apache's mod_deflate can understand the "deflate"
>>>algorithm (the same one used by the PKZIP and gzip programs),
>>>so requests can be sent in smaller, compressed chunks across the wire.
>
>
> Thanks,
> --
> Best Regards,
> Moisei
>
>
you have to configure it yourself, please see documentation for
mod_deflate on httpd.apache.org
-anton
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Fwd: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Ryan Bloom <rb...@gmail.com>.
I meant to send this to the list.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Ryan Bloom <rb...@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 8 Mar 2005 19:12:44 -0500
Subject: Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
To: Moisei <mo...@gmail.com>
You need to remember that the compression is generally not a big help
for HTTP. There are a number of reasons for this, but basically
compression is only helping with the amount of data being transferred
over the network. For a local network, the network is generally not
the bottleneck, especially not for individual files.
Now, I will not pretend to be knowledgable at all about how SVN uses
HTTP, but if you have a lot of small files, HTTP is sending one file
at a time, so each file is compressed individually, and both client
and server take a hit to do that work.
Basically, I've never been a big fan of gzip compression for HTTP,
unless the content is already compressed, because for most
applications, the network isn't really the bottleneck unless you are
using a very slow connection, which generally isn't the case these
days. Especially not for revision control.
Just how much data is in your repository? How many files, and
megabytes. Also, I don't know how many threads the SVN client creates
when retreiving files, but parallelizing that work is likely to give a
better net effect than compression does.
Ryan
On Wed, 9 Mar 2005 00:10:16 +0200, Moisei <mo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thank you all for you replies, unfortunately, it does not help.
> This is probably my fault, I did not explain myself well, so I try again:
> I run checkout from scratch (empty directory) with and without mod_deflate,
> the time it takes is exactly same (about 40 min.).
> Neither client side configuration nor "deltas" are not the issues here,
> because I have to receive ALL the files FROM the server to my working copy.
>
> If somebody tried or using mod_deflate with subversion, I would
> appreciate any feeback.
>
> Thanks again,
> Moisei.
>
>
> On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 22:53:33 +0100, Erik Huelsmann <eh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 23:40:27 +0200, Moisei <mo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Thank you, Mark.
> > > I do my homework before I post to the list, so indeed I enabled and configured
> > > the mod_deflate with large memory buffer size and high compression level.
> > > Surprisingly, it takes the exactly same time to checkout quite large code-base.
> > > This is why I've asked whether it is already compressed, I just cannot find any
> > > another explanation.
> >
> > Also see the ~/.subversion/servers file to enable the http-compression
> > option in the client.
> >
> > HTH,
> >
> >
> > Erik.
> >
>
> --
> Best Regards,
> Moisei
>
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>
>
--
Ryan Bloom
rbb@apache.org
rbb@rkbloom.net
rbloom@gmail.com
--
Ryan Bloom
rbb@apache.org
rbb@rkbloom.net
rbloom@gmail.com
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Moisei <mo...@gmail.com>.
Thank you all for you replies, unfortunately, it does not help.
This is probably my fault, I did not explain myself well, so I try again:
I run checkout from scratch (empty directory) with and without mod_deflate,
the time it takes is exactly same (about 40 min.).
Neither client side configuration nor "deltas" are not the issues here,
because I have to receive ALL the files FROM the server to my working copy.
If somebody tried or using mod_deflate with subversion, I would
appreciate any feeback.
Thanks again,
Moisei.
On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 22:53:33 +0100, Erik Huelsmann <eh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 23:40:27 +0200, Moisei <mo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Thank you, Mark.
> > I do my homework before I post to the list, so indeed I enabled and configured
> > the mod_deflate with large memory buffer size and high compression level.
> > Surprisingly, it takes the exactly same time to checkout quite large code-base.
> > This is why I've asked whether it is already compressed, I just cannot find any
> > another explanation.
>
> Also see the ~/.subversion/servers file to enable the http-compression
> option in the client.
>
> HTH,
>
>
> Erik.
>
--
Best Regards,
Moisei
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Erik Huelsmann <eh...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 23:40:27 +0200, Moisei <mo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thank you, Mark.
> I do my homework before I post to the list, so indeed I enabled and configured
> the mod_deflate with large memory buffer size and high compression level.
> Surprisingly, it takes the exactly same time to checkout quite large code-base.
> This is why I've asked whether it is already compressed, I just cannot find any
> another explanation.
Also see the ~/.subversion/servers file to enable the http-compression
option in the client.
HTH,
Erik.
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Moisei <mo...@gmail.com>.
Aha, now we come closer to my problem :) Thanks.
> > checkouts and commits, Subversion sends all file data as binary diffs,
> > which are essentially already compressed.
That was exactly the question I've asked! Is it confirmed? Is it right for the
case of "checkout" -- when the delta is just a file itself?
In this case, there is no reason to use mod_deflate at all.
Here is my story, if somebody interested:
After 1 year's pilot we plan to switch from sourcesafe to subversion
on one of our
main code-base branches.
Subversion 1.1.3 runs on dedicated Xeon server witn 2 Gb RAM under
Windows 2000 server + apache 2.052
I imported the vss data into subversion repo - BDB backend and now I have
~13000 revisions. The repo size is about 500 MB.
The working copy size is 456 MB and it contains 110,000 files
and 21,000 folders -- all this include .svn folders.
Most of our developers are working in "house" office but few are
connecting from outside,
this is why I am interested to make their access as efficient as possible
Take into account the propaganda as well -- developers hate to change
their daily
workflow and subversion requires they change their mind in a very
stressful manner.
99% our code-base is C++ files.
Thanks a lot again to all of you for your replies,
such kind of support is so amazingly different from the one we have on
sourcesafe :)
Best Regards,
Moisei.
On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 21:02:01 -0500, Daniel Berlin <db...@dberlin.org> wrote:
> On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 15:55 -0600, Ben Collins-Sussman wrote:
> > On Mar 8, 2005, at 3:40 PM, Moisei wrote:
> >
> > > Thank you, Mark.
> > > I do my homework before I post to the list, so indeed I enabled and
> > > configured
> > > the mod_deflate with large memory buffer size and high compression
> > > level.
> > > Surprisingly, it takes the exactly same time to checkout quite large
> > > code-base.
> > > This is why I've asked whether it is already compressed, I just cannot
> > > find any
> > > another explanation.
> > >
> >
> > 90% of of the data travelling over the network is file data. For
> > checkouts and commits, Subversion sends all file data as binary diffs,
> > which are essentially already compressed. So turning on mod_deflate
> > isn't likely to decrease the amount of network traffic at all.
>
> This actually isn't true.
>
> New file data, and the instructions are suspectible to compression.
>
> zlib compression on them will probably buy you 10%, maybe more.
>
> In any case, it's *not* likely to increase the space taken :)
>
>
--
Best Regards,
Moisei
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Daniel Berlin <db...@dberlin.org>.
On Tue, 2005-03-08 at 15:55 -0600, Ben Collins-Sussman wrote:
> On Mar 8, 2005, at 3:40 PM, Moisei wrote:
>
> > Thank you, Mark.
> > I do my homework before I post to the list, so indeed I enabled and
> > configured
> > the mod_deflate with large memory buffer size and high compression
> > level.
> > Surprisingly, it takes the exactly same time to checkout quite large
> > code-base.
> > This is why I've asked whether it is already compressed, I just cannot
> > find any
> > another explanation.
> >
>
> 90% of of the data travelling over the network is file data. For
> checkouts and commits, Subversion sends all file data as binary diffs,
> which are essentially already compressed. So turning on mod_deflate
> isn't likely to decrease the amount of network traffic at all.
This actually isn't true.
New file data, and the instructions are suspectible to compression.
zlib compression on them will probably buy you 10%, maybe more.
In any case, it's *not* likely to increase the space taken :)
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Florian Weimer <fw...@deneb.enyo.de>.
* Ben Collins-Sussman:
> 90% of of the data travelling over the network is file data. For
> checkouts and commits, Subversion sends all file data as binary diffs,
> which are essentially already compressed. So turning on mod_deflate
> isn't likely to decrease the amount of network traffic at all.
Last time I looked at network traffic, the deltas were base64-encoded.
Has this been changed, or were I just imaging things?
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Ben Collins-Sussman <su...@collab.net>.
On Mar 8, 2005, at 3:40 PM, Moisei wrote:
> Thank you, Mark.
> I do my homework before I post to the list, so indeed I enabled and
> configured
> the mod_deflate with large memory buffer size and high compression
> level.
> Surprisingly, it takes the exactly same time to checkout quite large
> code-base.
> This is why I've asked whether it is already compressed, I just cannot
> find any
> another explanation.
>
90% of of the data travelling over the network is file data. For
checkouts and commits, Subversion sends all file data as binary diffs,
which are essentially already compressed. So turning on mod_deflate
isn't likely to decrease the amount of network traffic at all.
If anything, might *increase* the total time, because now there's
double (redundant) compression going on, which takes both client and
server CPU even more.
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Moisei <mo...@gmail.com>.
Thank you, Mark.
I do my homework before I post to the list, so indeed I enabled and configured
the mod_deflate with large memory buffer size and high compression level.
Surprisingly, it takes the exactly same time to checkout quite large code-base.
This is why I've asked whether it is already compressed, I just cannot find any
another explanation.
Thanks again,
Moisei.
On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 10:24:26 -0500, Mark Phippard <Ma...@softlanding.com> wrote:
> Moisei <mo...@gmail.com> wrote on 03/08/2005 10:14:43 AM:
>
> > Hello, I just wondering whether this mail has arrived to the list?
>
> Yes, it did.
>
> > I just wondering whether I need enable and configure mod_deflate for
> subversion
> > or it is enabled automatically, by default?
>
> You have to turn on mod_deflate.
>
> Mark
>
> _____________________________________________________________________________
> Scanned for SoftLanding Systems, Inc. by IBM Email Security Management Services powered by MessageLabs.
> _____________________________________________________________________________
>
--
Best Regards,
Moisei
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Re: Does Subversion enable compression automatically under Apache
Posted by Mark Phippard <Ma...@softlanding.com>.
Moisei <mo...@gmail.com> wrote on 03/08/2005 10:14:43 AM:
> Hello, I just wondering whether this mail has arrived to the list?
Yes, it did.
> I just wondering whether I need enable and configure mod_deflate for
subversion
> or it is enabled automatically, by default?
You have to turn on mod_deflate.
Mark
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