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Posted to dev@cayenne.apache.org by Øyvind Harboe <oy...@zylin.com> on 2006/05/31 08:49:30 UTC
Standalone Cayenne Modeler application
One of the appreciated features of Cayenne Modeler is evidently that it
does not require a particular IDE.
It is possible to use Eclipse platform to create a standalone
application that does not require Eclipse.
Such an application generated by Eclipse, but which does not require
Eclipse, is called an Eclipse RCP application.
http://www.eclipse.org/rcp
I think it might be a good idea to develop the Cayenne Modeler as an RCP
application:
Some pros:
- Eclipse RCP applications use SWT instead of Swing. SWT gives a better
user experience than Swing. IMO this is objectively true(oxymoron :-)
- The same code that goes into the Eclipse plugin can go into
the standalone Cayenne Modeler.
- The Cayenne modeler can draw on other Eclipse infrastructure as
relevant(e.g. throw in something from
http://www.eclipse.org/datatools , XML editors, etc.)
Cons:
- Eclipse RCP applications require SWT. Swing is part of all JRE's.
- There may exist platforms that have a JRE which support Swing, but
that does not have SWT support that the Cayenne crowd cares about.
I don't know of any such platforms.
- Cayenne would have to distribute the necessary SWT pieces for, say,
Mac, Linux & Windows and leave the compilation of the Cayenne Modeler
for other platforms as an exercise for the user.
--
Øyvind Harboe
http://www.zylin.com
RE: Standalone Cayenne Modeler application
Posted by "Gentry, Michael (Contractor)" <mi...@fanniemae.com>.
I'm not certain anything has been decided about a CM replacement yet. There have been discussions about using NetBeans (Matisse) to create it and also do a plugin type approach. We also have to be careful about licenses for any tools/JARs we use to create it -- has to be Apache (or compatible). I don't know the Eclipse RCP license offhand. I would imagine the new JARs introduced with Matisse would be OK since they will be part of Swing and Java 1.6 (Mustang).
I'm not familiar with Eclipse DTP and don't have time right now to look through it (knee-deep in documentation), but what I'd personally like to see CM grow into is CM + some EOModeler features + DBEdit + a few other new Cayenne-only features. The database plugins I've seen for Eclipse so far have allowed you to enter some SQL and fetch rows back, but they have no idea of the model/schema. There is no way for them to follow relationships, etc. This is a hugely important feature. So much so that right now I would keep a separate EOModel just to run DBEdit -- it is well worth maintaining two models. That option doesn't really exist for Windows/Linux users, though.
Obviously CM is very important and this will require a lot more discussion and thought to get it right. This is a Good Thing!
Thanks,
/dev/mrg
-----Original Message-----
From: Øyvind Harboe [mailto:oyvind.harboe@zylin.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 7:16 AM
To: cayenne-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Standalone Cayenne Modeler application
On Wed, 2006-05-31 at 06:56 -0400, Kevin Menard wrote:
> We had bounced around a similar idea not to long ago on this list. The
> general concensus, however, seemed to be that that the NetBeans RCP would
> be better for our needs than the Eclipse one. Right now, I see very
> little value in rewriting the entire application any RCP, let alone
> switching all to SWT.
I read over the thread below.
http://www.objectstyle.org/cayenne/lists/cayenne-devel/2006/02/0051.html
I didn't find this in the discussion:
- Which route will give the most synergy effects? e.g. Cayenne
Modeler alone is fine, but it would be nice to have a database
browser http://www.eclipse.org/datatools (?) built in as well,
XML editor/viewer?
- References to the Eclipse plugin. If the Eclipse plugin effort becomes
significant, then perhaps the modeler will be folded into that plugin
anyway. Using Eclipse RCP would be a way to make that plugin available
as a standalone app.
--
Øyvind Harboe
http://www.zylin.com
Re: Standalone Cayenne Modeler application
Posted by Øyvind Harboe <oy...@zylin.com>.
On Wed, 2006-05-31 at 06:56 -0400, Kevin Menard wrote:
> We had bounced around a similar idea not to long ago on this list. The
> general concensus, however, seemed to be that that the NetBeans RCP would
> be better for our needs than the Eclipse one. Right now, I see very
> little value in rewriting the entire application any RCP, let alone
> switching all to SWT.
I read over the thread below.
http://www.objectstyle.org/cayenne/lists/cayenne-devel/2006/02/0051.html
I didn't find this in the discussion:
- Which route will give the most synergy effects? e.g. Cayenne
Modeler alone is fine, but it would be nice to have a database
browser http://www.eclipse.org/datatools (?) built in as well,
XML editor/viewer?
- References to the Eclipse plugin. If the Eclipse plugin effort becomes
significant, then perhaps the modeler will be folded into that plugin
anyway. Using Eclipse RCP would be a way to make that plugin available
as a standalone app.
--
Øyvind Harboe
http://www.zylin.com
Re: Standalone Cayenne Modeler application
Posted by Kevin Menard <km...@servprise.com>.
We had bounced around a similar idea not to long ago on this list. The
general concensus, however, seemed to be that that the NetBeans RCP would
be better for our needs than the Eclipse one. Right now, I see very
little value in rewriting the entire application any RCP, let alone
switching all to SWT.
--
Kevin
On Wed, 31 May 2006 02:49:30 -0400, Øyvind Harboe
<oy...@zylin.com> wrote:
> Such an application generated by Eclipse, but which does not require
> Eclipse, is called an Eclipse RCP application.
> http://www.eclipse.org/rcp
>
> I think it might be a good idea to develop the Cayenne Modeler as an RCP
> application: