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Posted to dev@maven.apache.org by Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de> on 2012/08/30 10:55:13 UTC
Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Hi folks!
Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils to maven-shared-utils.
The reason is simple:
1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And people feared about side effects which could harm stability.
As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package name we can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style and don't need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few classes extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably available is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was originally hosted btw - 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of old ant/jakarta/commons stuff). And since the codehaus repo got closed down silently I have no confidence in that stuff anymore.
I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any problems. I think we can get this done in 1 week + another week of cleaning up the obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other mail.
Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
LieGrue,
strub
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>.
+1 for StAX as well. But first steps first :)
I do of course agree that we should keep xpp3 so far. Even if this has the downside that we still need to ship the old plexus-utils in maven-core.
LieGrue,
strub
----- Original Message -----
> From: Hervé BOUTEMY <he...@free.fr>
> To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>
> Cc:
> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 1:48 PM
> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>
> I like it
>
> we should probably set a dependencyManagement in maven parent pom to
> streamline library version.
>
> Notice that this rewrite with package change will do the job for most parts of
> plexus-utils but not for Xpp3, since this one has objects created in Maven
> core that get manipulated by plugins: we absolutely need binary compatibility
> here.
> Or finally find a way to replace XPP3 by StAX, like dreamt a long time ago...
> [1]
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Hervé
>
> [1]
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/MAVENOLD/Use+StAX+instead+of+XPP3
>
> Le jeudi 30 août 2012 09:55:13 Mark Struberg a écrit :
>> Hi folks!
>>
>> Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
>> I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils to
>> maven-shared-utils.
>>
>> The reason is simple:
>> 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils because
> we
>> don't know how many plugins are using it. And people feared about side
>> effects which could harm stability. As we do this now in a whole new module
>> with a new package name we can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper
>> 2012 style and don't need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
>>
>> 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few classes
>> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably available
>> is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was originally hosted btw -
>> 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of old ant/jakarta/commons stuff).
>> And since the codehaus repo got closed down silently I have no confidence
>> in that stuff anymore.
>>
>>
>> I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any problems. I
>> think we can get this done in 1 week + another week of cleaning up the
>> obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other mail.
>>
>> Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
>>
>> LieGrue,
>> strub
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Hervé BOUTEMY <he...@free.fr>.
I like it
we should probably set a dependencyManagement in maven parent pom to
streamline library version.
Notice that this rewrite with package change will do the job for most parts of
plexus-utils but not for Xpp3, since this one has objects created in Maven
core that get manipulated by plugins: we absolutely need binary compatibility
here.
Or finally find a way to replace XPP3 by StAX, like dreamt a long time ago...
[1]
Regards,
Hervé
[1]
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/MAVENOLD/Use+StAX+instead+of+XPP3
Le jeudi 30 août 2012 09:55:13 Mark Struberg a écrit :
> Hi folks!
>
> Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
> I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils to
> maven-shared-utils.
>
> The reason is simple:
> 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils because we
> don't know how many plugins are using it. And people feared about side
> effects which could harm stability. As we do this now in a whole new module
> with a new package name we can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper
> 2012 style and don't need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
>
> 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few classes
> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably available
> is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was originally hosted btw -
> 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of old ant/jakarta/commons stuff).
> And since the codehaus repo got closed down silently I have no confidence
> in that stuff anymore.
>
>
> I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any problems. I
> think we can get this done in 1 week + another week of cleaning up the
> obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other mail.
>
> Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
>
> LieGrue,
> strub
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Kristian Rosenvold <kr...@gmail.com>.
I prefer you take the wagon stuff ;) I'm still a little +- on the
timing since I basically want to *do* some stuff first ;)
"2 weeks" should be interpreted in a very liberal sense.
Kristian
2012/8/30 Olivier Lamy <ol...@apache.org>:
> Great !
> Will you take care about wagon release or you prefer I do ?
>
> --
> Olivier
> Le 30 août 2012 11:51, "Kristian Rosenvold" <kr...@gmail.com>
> a écrit :
>
>> I've been working on some core stuff that I'd like to release once I
>> finish. I'd think a couple of weeks, give or take.
>>
>> Kristian
>>
>>
>> 2012/8/30 Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>:
>> > Hi folks!
>> >
>> > Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
>> > I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils to
>> maven-shared-utils.
>> >
>> > The reason is simple:
>> > 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils
>> because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And people feared
>> about side effects which could harm stability.
>> > As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package name we can
>> really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style and don't need to
>> keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
>> >
>> > 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few classes
>> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably available
>> is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was originally hosted btw -
>> 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of old ant/jakarta/commons stuff).
>> And since the codehaus repo got closed down silently I have no confidence
>> in that stuff anymore.
>> >
>> >
>> > I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any problems.
>> I think we can get this done in 1 week + another week of cleaning up the
>> obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other mail.
>> >
>> > Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
>> >
>> > LieGrue,
>> > strub
>> >
>> >
>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
>> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>> >
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>>
>>
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Olivier Lamy <ol...@apache.org>.
Great !
Will you take care about wagon release or you prefer I do ?
--
Olivier
Le 30 août 2012 11:51, "Kristian Rosenvold" <kr...@gmail.com>
a écrit :
> I've been working on some core stuff that I'd like to release once I
> finish. I'd think a couple of weeks, give or take.
>
> Kristian
>
>
> 2012/8/30 Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>:
> > Hi folks!
> >
> > Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
> > I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils to
> maven-shared-utils.
> >
> > The reason is simple:
> > 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils
> because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And people feared
> about side effects which could harm stability.
> > As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package name we can
> really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style and don't need to
> keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
> >
> > 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few classes
> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably available
> is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was originally hosted btw -
> 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of old ant/jakarta/commons stuff).
> And since the codehaus repo got closed down silently I have no confidence
> in that stuff anymore.
> >
> >
> > I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any problems.
> I think we can get this done in 1 week + another week of cleaning up the
> obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other mail.
> >
> > Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
> >
> > LieGrue,
> > strub
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>
>
Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Kristian Rosenvold <kr...@gmail.com>.
I've been working on some core stuff that I'd like to release once I
finish. I'd think a couple of weeks, give or take.
Kristian
2012/8/30 Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>:
> Hi folks!
>
> Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
> I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils to maven-shared-utils.
>
> The reason is simple:
> 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And people feared about side effects which could harm stability.
> As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package name we can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style and don't need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
>
> 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few classes extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably available is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was originally hosted btw - 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of old ant/jakarta/commons stuff). And since the codehaus repo got closed down silently I have no confidence in that stuff anymore.
>
>
> I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any problems. I think we can get this done in 1 week + another week of cleaning up the obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other mail.
>
> Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
>
> LieGrue,
> strub
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>.
I wrote up the current status in our Wiki
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/MAVEN/MavenSharedUtils
I've not yet finished the whole class matrix, will do that in the afternoon.
LieGrue,
strub
----- Original Message -----
> From: Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>
> To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>
> Cc:
> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 12:01 PM
> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>
>
>> Shading/delegating is the road to hell, later on it becomes easier to just
> add
>> one method implementation there and the show starts.
>
> Nope, with shading in the source/class dynamically it will _not_ kept in our
> SVN! Thus noone could tweak em ;)
>
>
>> Directly using commons-*
>> wherever needed should be the preferred way.
> That's the reason why I did NOT add any Base64 nor similar to m-shared-utils
> yet.
> One counter argument could be binary compatibility. We need some test project
> with _very_ old plugins to check if we are still fine.
> If maven-core brings in commons libs as dependencies, then we might clash with
> very old plugins which need ancient versions of commons as well.
> That kind of stuff is the the reason why framework projects most times shade
> those classes away into own packages which do not create classpath clashes.
> Even Sun does that with lots of Apache classes which get shipped inside the JRE
> jars.
> But we will for sure always take the original sources from commons and not
> maintain them ourselfs!
>
>> In short I'm looking for smth. like https://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals
> list
>
> I already added a table to the javadocs package.html. Not sure if this will
> remain there, but for now it's fine.
>
> LieGrue,
> strub
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>
>> To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>
>> Cc:
>> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:40 AM
>> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Mark Struberg" <st...@yahoo.de>
>>> To: "Maven Developers List" <de...@maven.apache.org>
>>> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 12:12:49 PM
>>> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>>>
>>> yes, that is exactly the goal. E.g. instead of imlementing our own
>>> Base64 stuff we will either shade in parts or delegate over to
>>> commons-io.
>>
>> Shading/delegating is the road to hell, later on it becomes easier to just
> add
>> one method implementation there and the show starts. Directly using
> commons-*
>> wherever needed should be the preferred way. Not to mention that it will be
> way
>> more familiar for people when they see org.apache.commons and having dealt
> with
>> it instead of org.apache.maven.shared.utils. At least for people like me it
> will
>> not make me move away because of the 48th Base64 implementation I see this
>> month. Even if it's simply calling commons-codec, different
>> class/method/parameter names make it a different API.
>>
>>>
>>> After the initial switch from p-u to m-s-u we will review all code
>>> and make a major upgrade and drop obsolete parts.
>> Doesn't that mean that this shading library will stay forever in
>> Maven+plugins deps just like plexus-containers-default 1.0 alpha(5...30)?
>> Also is the effort to moving to Apache commons ongoing?
>> Is there some page containing the pending conversions, what is the
> preferred
>> replacement, status of core components?
>> In short I'm looking for smth. like https://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals
> list
>> and https://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals/GSettingsMigration as a detailed
> example.
>> Are you actively looking for external help in this direction? Maybe I can
>> promote it to Fedora Java people as we already have done a lot of work to
>> streamline the dependencies so it becomes supportable for people building
> from
>> source and this is something that Linux distro guys are doing with or
> without
>> upstream so happening upstream would benefit everyone. But for this to
> happen
>> there needs to be an active upstream developer willing to review/commit
> patches.
>>
>> P.S My colleague Stanislav meant something like that when he wrote about
> porting
>> plugins away of maven-compat, when he wrote to that list sometime ago.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Alexander Kurtakov
>> Red Hat Eclipse Team
>>
>>>
>>> LieGrue,
>>> strub
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> > From: Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>
>>> > To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>; Mark
> Struberg
>>> > <st...@yahoo.de>
>>> > Cc:
>>> > Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:07 AM
>>> > Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > ----- Original Message -----
>>> >> From: "Mark Struberg" <st...@yahoo.de>
>>> >> To: "Maven Dev" <de...@maven.apache.org>
>>> >> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:55:13 AM
>>> >> Subject: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>>> >>
>>> >> Hi folks!
>>> >>
>>> >> Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
>>> >> I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from
>> plexus-utils
>>> >> to
>>> >> maven-shared-utils.
>>> >>
>>> >> The reason is simple:
>>> >> 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace
> plexus-utils
>>> >> because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And
>
>> people
>>> >> feared about side effects which could harm stability.
>>> >> As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package
> name
>>> >> we
>>> >> can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style
> and
>>> >> don't
>>> >> need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
>>> >>
>>> >> 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a
> few
>>> >> classes
>>> >> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be
> reliably
>>> >> available is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it
> was
>>> >> originally hosted btw - 80% of the plexus utils code is a
> fork of
>>> >> old ant/jakarta/commons stuff). And since the codehaus repo
> got
>>> >> closed down silently I have no confidence in that stuff
> anymore.
>>> >>
>>> > Can we hope that stuff that belongs to Apache commons will be
> used
>>> > from there or
>>> > contributed back instead of growing yet another utility library
>>> > that duplicates
>>> > commons-[io|lang|codec|beanutils|..]?
>>> > Java land is already full of such util libraries serving same
>>> > purposes but with
>>> > different problems and bugs, so let's try to not do it again.
>>> >
>>> > Regards,
>>> > Alexander Kurtakov
>>> > Red Hat Eclipse Team
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >>
>>> >> I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without
> any
>>> >> problems. I think we can get this done in 1 week + another
> week
>>> >> of
>>> >> cleaning up the obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the
> other
>>> >> mail.
>>> >>
>>> >> Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
>>> >>
>>> >> LieGrue,
>>> >> strub
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
>>> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>.
> Shading/delegating is the road to hell, later on it becomes easier to just add
> one method implementation there and the show starts.
Nope, with shading in the source/class dynamically it will _not_ kept in our SVN! Thus noone could tweak em ;)
> Directly using commons-*
> wherever needed should be the preferred way.
That's the reason why I did NOT add any Base64 nor similar to m-shared-utils yet.
One counter argument could be binary compatibility. We need some test project with _very_ old plugins to check if we are still fine.
If maven-core brings in commons libs as dependencies, then we might clash with very old plugins which need ancient versions of commons as well.
That kind of stuff is the the reason why framework projects most times shade those classes away into own packages which do not create classpath clashes.
Even Sun does that with lots of Apache classes which get shipped inside the JRE jars.
But we will for sure always take the original sources from commons and not maintain them ourselfs!
> In short I'm looking for smth. like https://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals list
I already added a table to the javadocs package.html. Not sure if this will remain there, but for now it's fine.
LieGrue,
strub
----- Original Message -----
> From: Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>
> To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>
> Cc:
> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:40 AM
> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Mark Struberg" <st...@yahoo.de>
>> To: "Maven Developers List" <de...@maven.apache.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 12:12:49 PM
>> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>>
>> yes, that is exactly the goal. E.g. instead of imlementing our own
>> Base64 stuff we will either shade in parts or delegate over to
>> commons-io.
>
> Shading/delegating is the road to hell, later on it becomes easier to just add
> one method implementation there and the show starts. Directly using commons-*
> wherever needed should be the preferred way. Not to mention that it will be way
> more familiar for people when they see org.apache.commons and having dealt with
> it instead of org.apache.maven.shared.utils. At least for people like me it will
> not make me move away because of the 48th Base64 implementation I see this
> month. Even if it's simply calling commons-codec, different
> class/method/parameter names make it a different API.
>
>>
>> After the initial switch from p-u to m-s-u we will review all code
>> and make a major upgrade and drop obsolete parts.
> Doesn't that mean that this shading library will stay forever in
> Maven+plugins deps just like plexus-containers-default 1.0 alpha(5...30)?
> Also is the effort to moving to Apache commons ongoing?
> Is there some page containing the pending conversions, what is the preferred
> replacement, status of core components?
> In short I'm looking for smth. like https://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals list
> and https://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals/GSettingsMigration as a detailed example.
> Are you actively looking for external help in this direction? Maybe I can
> promote it to Fedora Java people as we already have done a lot of work to
> streamline the dependencies so it becomes supportable for people building from
> source and this is something that Linux distro guys are doing with or without
> upstream so happening upstream would benefit everyone. But for this to happen
> there needs to be an active upstream developer willing to review/commit patches.
>
> P.S My colleague Stanislav meant something like that when he wrote about porting
> plugins away of maven-compat, when he wrote to that list sometime ago.
>
> Regards,
> Alexander Kurtakov
> Red Hat Eclipse Team
>
>>
>> LieGrue,
>> strub
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>
>> > To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>; Mark Struberg
>> > <st...@yahoo.de>
>> > Cc:
>> > Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:07 AM
>> > Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> >> From: "Mark Struberg" <st...@yahoo.de>
>> >> To: "Maven Dev" <de...@maven.apache.org>
>> >> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:55:13 AM
>> >> Subject: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>> >>
>> >> Hi folks!
>> >>
>> >> Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
>> >> I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from
> plexus-utils
>> >> to
>> >> maven-shared-utils.
>> >>
>> >> The reason is simple:
>> >> 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils
>> >> because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And
> people
>> >> feared about side effects which could harm stability.
>> >> As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package name
>> >> we
>> >> can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style and
>> >> don't
>> >> need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
>> >>
>> >> 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few
>> >> classes
>> >> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably
>> >> available is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was
>> >> originally hosted btw - 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of
>> >> old ant/jakarta/commons stuff). And since the codehaus repo got
>> >> closed down silently I have no confidence in that stuff anymore.
>> >>
>> > Can we hope that stuff that belongs to Apache commons will be used
>> > from there or
>> > contributed back instead of growing yet another utility library
>> > that duplicates
>> > commons-[io|lang|codec|beanutils|..]?
>> > Java land is already full of such util libraries serving same
>> > purposes but with
>> > different problems and bugs, so let's try to not do it again.
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> > Alexander Kurtakov
>> > Red Hat Eclipse Team
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >> I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any
>> >> problems. I think we can get this done in 1 week + another week
>> >> of
>> >> cleaning up the obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other
>> >> mail.
>> >>
>> >> Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
>> >>
>> >> LieGrue,
>> >> strub
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
>> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>.
I've created
https://jira.codehaus.org/browse/MSHARED-239
to cover this.
LieGrue,
strub
----- Original Message -----
> From: Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>
> To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>
> Cc:
> Sent: Friday, August 31, 2012 8:46 AM
> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Kristian Rosenvold" <kr...@gmail.com>
>> To: "Maven Developers List" <de...@maven.apache.org>
>> Sent: Friday, August 31, 2012 8:46:23 AM
>> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>>
>> > Are you actively looking for external help in this direction? Maybe
>> > I can promote it to Fedora Java people as we already have done a
>> > lot of work to streamline the dependencies so it becomes
>> > supportable for people building from source and this is something
>> > that Linux distro guys are doing with or without upstream so
>> > happening upstream would benefit everyone. But for this to happen
>> > there needs to be an active upstream developer willing to
>> > review/commit patches.
>>
>> If anyone wants to make cross-cutting patches that replaces all uses
>> of a a few classes with their commons-* counterparts, I'll happily
>> review them.
>> I think even is someone wants to replace a /single/ method/class
>> across the board I'd enjoy it; I think this is the way to go. (And
>> it's real easy to review ;)
>>
>> I would appreciate if any such efforts would cover the whole codebase
>> ( https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/maven/) and as long as you're not
>> replacing Xpp3Dom I'll check out the core bits too.
>
> Ok, Let's see whether Fedora can organize something.
>
> Alexander Kurtakov
> Red Hat Eclipse team
>
>>
>> Kristian
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>>
>>
>
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>.
----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kristian Rosenvold" <kr...@gmail.com>
> To: "Maven Developers List" <de...@maven.apache.org>
> Sent: Friday, August 31, 2012 8:46:23 AM
> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>
> > Are you actively looking for external help in this direction? Maybe
> > I can promote it to Fedora Java people as we already have done a
> > lot of work to streamline the dependencies so it becomes
> > supportable for people building from source and this is something
> > that Linux distro guys are doing with or without upstream so
> > happening upstream would benefit everyone. But for this to happen
> > there needs to be an active upstream developer willing to
> > review/commit patches.
>
> If anyone wants to make cross-cutting patches that replaces all uses
> of a a few classes with their commons-* counterparts, I'll happily
> review them.
> I think even is someone wants to replace a /single/ method/class
> across the board I'd enjoy it; I think this is the way to go. (And
> it's real easy to review ;)
>
> I would appreciate if any such efforts would cover the whole codebase
> ( https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/maven/) and as long as you're not
> replacing Xpp3Dom I'll check out the core bits too.
Ok, Let's see whether Fedora can organize something.
Alexander Kurtakov
Red Hat Eclipse team
>
> Kristian
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Kristian Rosenvold <kr...@gmail.com>.
> Are you actively looking for external help in this direction? Maybe I can promote it to Fedora Java people as we already have done a lot of work to streamline the dependencies so it becomes supportable for people building from source and this is something that Linux distro guys are doing with or without upstream so happening upstream would benefit everyone. But for this to happen there needs to be an active upstream developer willing to review/commit patches.
If anyone wants to make cross-cutting patches that replaces all uses
of a a few classes with their commons-* counterparts, I'll happily
review them.
I think even is someone wants to replace a /single/ method/class
across the board I'd enjoy it; I think this is the way to go. (And
it's real easy to review ;)
I would appreciate if any such efforts would cover the whole codebase
( https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/maven/) and as long as you're not
replacing Xpp3Dom I'll check out the core bits too.
Kristian
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>.
----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Struberg" <st...@yahoo.de>
> To: "Maven Developers List" <de...@maven.apache.org>
> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 12:12:49 PM
> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>
> yes, that is exactly the goal. E.g. instead of imlementing our own
> Base64 stuff we will either shade in parts or delegate over to
> commons-io.
Shading/delegating is the road to hell, later on it becomes easier to just add one method implementation there and the show starts. Directly using commons-* wherever needed should be the preferred way. Not to mention that it will be way more familiar for people when they see org.apache.commons and having dealt with it instead of org.apache.maven.shared.utils. At least for people like me it will not make me move away because of the 48th Base64 implementation I see this month. Even if it's simply calling commons-codec, different class/method/parameter names make it a different API.
>
> After the initial switch from p-u to m-s-u we will review all code
> and make a major upgrade and drop obsolete parts.
Doesn't that mean that this shading library will stay forever in Maven+plugins deps just like plexus-containers-default 1.0 alpha(5...30)?
Also is the effort to moving to Apache commons ongoing?
Is there some page containing the pending conversions, what is the preferred replacement, status of core components?
In short I'm looking for smth. like https://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals list and https://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals/GSettingsMigration as a detailed example.
Are you actively looking for external help in this direction? Maybe I can promote it to Fedora Java people as we already have done a lot of work to streamline the dependencies so it becomes supportable for people building from source and this is something that Linux distro guys are doing with or without upstream so happening upstream would benefit everyone. But for this to happen there needs to be an active upstream developer willing to review/commit patches.
P.S My colleague Stanislav meant something like that when he wrote about porting plugins away of maven-compat, when he wrote to that list sometime ago.
Regards,
Alexander Kurtakov
Red Hat Eclipse Team
>
> LieGrue,
> strub
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>
> > To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>; Mark Struberg
> > <st...@yahoo.de>
> > Cc:
> > Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:07 AM
> > Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Mark Struberg" <st...@yahoo.de>
> >> To: "Maven Dev" <de...@maven.apache.org>
> >> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:55:13 AM
> >> Subject: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
> >>
> >> Hi folks!
> >>
> >> Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
> >> I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils
> >> to
> >> maven-shared-utils.
> >>
> >> The reason is simple:
> >> 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils
> >> because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And people
> >> feared about side effects which could harm stability.
> >> As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package name
> >> we
> >> can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style and
> >> don't
> >> need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
> >>
> >> 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few
> >> classes
> >> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably
> >> available is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was
> >> originally hosted btw - 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of
> >> old ant/jakarta/commons stuff). And since the codehaus repo got
> >> closed down silently I have no confidence in that stuff anymore.
> >>
> > Can we hope that stuff that belongs to Apache commons will be used
> > from there or
> > contributed back instead of growing yet another utility library
> > that duplicates
> > commons-[io|lang|codec|beanutils|..]?
> > Java land is already full of such util libraries serving same
> > purposes but with
> > different problems and bugs, so let's try to not do it again.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Alexander Kurtakov
> > Red Hat Eclipse Team
> >
> >
> >>
> >> I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any
> >> problems. I think we can get this done in 1 week + another week
> >> of
> >> cleaning up the obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other
> >> mail.
> >>
> >> Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
> >>
> >> LieGrue,
> >> strub
> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
> >>
> >>
> >
>
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>
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>.
yes, that is exactly the goal. E.g. instead of imlementing our own Base64 stuff we will either shade in parts or delegate over to commons-io.
After the initial switch from p-u to m-s-u we will review all code and make a major upgrade and drop obsolete parts.
LieGrue,
strub
----- Original Message -----
> From: Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>
> To: Maven Developers List <de...@maven.apache.org>; Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>
> Cc:
> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:07 AM
> Subject: Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Mark Struberg" <st...@yahoo.de>
>> To: "Maven Dev" <de...@maven.apache.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:55:13 AM
>> Subject: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>>
>> Hi folks!
>>
>> Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
>> I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils to
>> maven-shared-utils.
>>
>> The reason is simple:
>> 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils
>> because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And people
>> feared about side effects which could harm stability.
>> As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package name we
>> can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style and don't
>> need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
>>
>> 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few classes
>> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably
>> available is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was
>> originally hosted btw - 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of
>> old ant/jakarta/commons stuff). And since the codehaus repo got
>> closed down silently I have no confidence in that stuff anymore.
>>
> Can we hope that stuff that belongs to Apache commons will be used from there or
> contributed back instead of growing yet another utility library that duplicates
> commons-[io|lang|codec|beanutils|..]?
> Java land is already full of such util libraries serving same purposes but with
> different problems and bugs, so let's try to not do it again.
>
> Regards,
> Alexander Kurtakov
> Red Hat Eclipse Team
>
>
>>
>> I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any
>> problems. I think we can get this done in 1 week + another week of
>> cleaning up the obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other
>> mail.
>>
>> Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
>>
>> LieGrue,
>> strub
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@maven.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@maven.apache.org
>>
>>
>
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Re: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
Posted by Aleksandar Kurtakov <ak...@redhat.com>.
----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Struberg" <st...@yahoo.de>
> To: "Maven Dev" <de...@maven.apache.org>
> Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 11:55:13 AM
> Subject: Any maven-shared or maven-core release pending?
>
> Hi folks!
>
> Is there any maven-core or maven-shared release pending?
> I'd like to start with moving all maven stuff from plexus-utils to
> maven-shared-utils.
>
> The reason is simple:
> 1.) It always got argued that we cannot just replace plexus-utils
> because we don't know how many plugins are using it. And people
> feared about side effects which could harm stability.
> As we do this now in a whole new module with a new package name we
> can really easily upgrade that stuff to proper 2012 style and don't
> need to keep em 2005ish anymore ;)
>
> 2.) For implementing the incremental build stuff I need a few classes
> extended, and the only way we can guarantee this to be reliably
> available is to host this stuff in maven itself (where it was
> originally hosted btw - 80% of the plexus utils code is a fork of
> old ant/jakarta/commons stuff). And since the codehaus repo got
> closed down silently I have no confidence in that stuff anymore.
>
Can we hope that stuff that belongs to Apache commons will be used from there or contributed back instead of growing yet another utility library that duplicates commons-[io|lang|codec|beanutils|..]?
Java land is already full of such util libraries serving same purposes but with different problems and bugs, so let's try to not do it again.
Regards,
Alexander Kurtakov
Red Hat Eclipse Team
>
> I locally already upgraded a few maven-shared libs without any
> problems. I think we can get this done in 1 week + another week of
> cleaning up the obsolete code as Kristian proposed in the other
> mail.
>
> Wdyt? When may I start with the transition?
>
> LieGrue,
> strub
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
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