RE: Xecrses and Windows | UNFORTUNATE OPINION INCLUDED, SOMEWHAT OFF-TOPIC :-)

[Vijendra_Malhotra <Vi...@satyam.com>]

Thanks a lot Brad and u are correct about using Ms with other techs. but
when the client will have it in no other way what do we do? 
what I really wanted to know is if xerces too has a COM compatible component
or not. cause if it does then a lot of my job is made simpler (learning
curve and all that) but if it doesn't then I will go the MSXML way.
anyways thanks a lot to brad for all the insite. appreciate it a lot
 

Vijendra Malhotra 
GE-GLASS 
Harsha Towers 
7846101 - 5652 (note the change) 

-----Original Message-----
From: Brad O'Hearne [mailto:brado@neurofire.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 30, 2001 12:09 PM
To: xerces-j-user@xml.apache.org
Subject: RE: Xecrses and Windows | UNFORTUNATE OPINION INCLUDED, SOMEWHAT
OFF-TOPIC :-)


I don't want to distract all the Xerces list readers with something
extremely off-topic, but it seems that there is not a full but a
partial-port issue at hand here?  (It would seem that you want COM, and you
have new development in VC or VB, but yet you have an old app that won't be
ported, is this right?)  I believe Apache has a C++ XML parser as well, you
might take a look at that.
 
I certainly don't own the corner on ideas here, but quite frankly, unless
you are dealing with an exceptionally large app, the work you go to preserve
whatever exists now (which apparently is ok in your scenario, since you can
preserve your existing Java app) might be better spent porting.  You are
basically in no man's land when it comes to COM wrapping Java.  In 1998 I
managed a project with this exact scenario (interestingly enough, it was an
XML project too), using J++ as a tool to wrap Java objects.  There was (and
still may be) a bug with releasing references for COM-wrapped Java objects
hosted in MTS, which lead to a memory leak we couldn't control.  Because of
the Sun-MS lawsuit, MS pretty much halted support, and changed from
promising to fix the bug to encouraging us instead to port to C++, which we
had to, as we had a shipped product and a user base that couldn't be held
treading water in a political situation.  The lesson learned for me: don't
multi-vendor anything when it comes to MS technology.  MS builds technology
to plug into MS technology -- and much of it is fantastic.  But remember, MS
is an implementation-driven world (*read*: we make the plumbing ourselves,
and you use our stuff), while much of non-MS (and in particular Java) is a
specification-driven world (*read*: we spec the plumbing ourselves, and you
can choose between the best implementations available from vendors).  Which
means....if you go multi-vendor while using an MS component technology (COM,
COM+, etc.), it will most likely add an unsupportable element to your app.
Without going too much into this, implementation vs. specification also
leads to two different support philosophies: implementation driven focuses
on the specific products you use, which means if you step outside the
product list, support tends to fade;  specification driven focuses on
whether the product properly supports the specification, and while still
product-specific somewhat, it is the specification that is the center of
attention --- think about that for a while, the implications actually become
really important.  (This idea and the implications of it have a lot to do
with how my preferences have evolved in the industry....but that's a whole
other tangent).
 
My advice is one of two courses: 
 
1) Stay pure Java, implement your other apps on the Java platform, and enjoy
the benefits of portability, running on Windows and other OS's.  
2) Port completely to MS technology (VB or VC++), and COM, and use MSXML.
 
I apologize to all for the opinion here, and mostly non-Xerces content.  If
there are MS people on the list, understand this is neither pro or anti MS,
just my view of the lay of the land, and I have happened to tread a very
real ground between Java and MS in my work experience which might prove
useful info to Vijendra.  There is in no way any evangelism or bashing of
any kind intended.....I am a friend to all...
 
Sincerely,
 
BradO

-----Original Message-----
From: Vijendra_Malhotra [mailto:Vijendra_Malhotra@satyam.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 10:13 PM
To: xerces-j-user@xml.apache.org
Subject: RE: Xecrses and Windows 


thanks brad,
what i want is a COM implimentation of Xerces so that i can use this with
say VC or VB as my XML parser instead of MSXML ( not that the MS version is
bad or some thing, it's just that there are a lot of dependencies in my old
app to xerces!)
 

Vijendra Malhotra 
GE-GLASS 
Harsha Towers 
7846101 - 5644 

-----Original Message-----
From: Brad O'Hearne [mailto:brado@neurofire.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 9:11 PM
To: xerces-j-user@xml.apache.org
Subject: RE: Xecrses and Windows 


Porting a Java app to Windows?  Since Xerces and Java apps in general work
on Windows, I suppose what you are really saying is you are porting out of
Java to another language in which you are using COM as the component
architecture.  (I hope you aren't implying that you are using J++ -- if so,
I would advise rethinking this if you can...J++ is dead, and there is little
to no support on it).  If you are porting out of Java, then you should
probably be looking at switching to the MSXML objects.  Basically, as soon
as you are in the MS world, the answer for basically everything is at
http://msdn.microsoft.com <http://msdn.microsoft.com> .  Not to get
religious here, but MS doesn't issue specifications, they issue
implementations, which means that most (if not all) framework-type pieces
for a software app are going to come directly from MS, rather from a third
party.  As another idea, you could COM-wrap Xerces, but that might be more
trouble than its worth.
 
Now having said that, I will have to defer to one of the experts on the
Apache projects...perhaps the C++ version has a COM implementation
somewhere.
 
BradO

-----Original Message-----
From: Vijendra_Malhotra [mailto:Vijendra_Malhotra@satyam.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2001 12:53 AM
To: xerces-j-user@xml.apache.org
Subject: Xecrses and Windows 



hi, 
i am to port an application using xerces (java) to windows. now is there
xerces avaible that I can use with COM ? 

Vijendra Malhotra 
GE-GLASS 
Harsha Towers 
7846101 - 5644