You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <or...@apache.org> on 2011/08/30 23:34:00 UTC
[ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
Do you need a minimum of three?
It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Shane Curcuru [mailto:asf@shanecurcuru.org]
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 08:11
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
[ ... ]
Personally, if there were some committers who would volunteer to
moderate, I'd just create an ooo-user@ mailing list now. Almost all
projects already have a user list, so it'd be worth creating one if for
only to give interested users a place to start asking questions about
the future plans of the podling.
It also seems clear that with the OOo history and end-user base that
some of the existing forums (whatever kind) will need to be continued.
That's up to the project to figure out how to do and maintain. The only
bigger ASF issue is ensuring that any new content added to forums that
the ASF hosts is compatible with AL wherever possible.
- Shane
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Marcus (OOo)" <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 08/31/2011 09:46 PM, schrieb Eike Rathke:
> Hi Marcus,
>
> On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 20:56:16 +0200, Marcus (OOo) wrote:
>
>> For ooo-support@ files like doc, xls, ppt, odt, ods, odp will be
>> most important.
>
> I'd certainly not allow MS binary files as potential malicious code
> carriers.
I know. However how to help with an import problem when the user cannot
send his doc file?
Marcus
>> But also jpg, png, gif for screenshots could be
>> important. Additionally maybe pdf.
>
> pdf is fine.
>
> Eike
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Dennis,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 18:29:02 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> Oh, so it wasn't actually an MS Office file, but a spoof with a .doc filename?
I only vaguely remember, but I think it was that way.
> That would definitely be hard to catch. I'm not sure what would cause
> it to execute though.
Name it .doc and set the content type to text/html
Anyway, I'm not sure about .doc anymore, the same of course works with
.html and probably any other extension.
> Was there a condition under which the exploit
> could be made to be run while pretended to be a .doc file?
The trigger is the content type.
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Oh, so it wasn't actually an MS Office file, but a spoof with a .doc filename?
That would definitely be hard to catch. I'm not sure what would cause it to execute though. Was there a condition under which the exploit could be made to be run while pretended to be a .doc file?
-----Original Message-----
From: Eike Rathke [mailto:ooo@erack.de]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 16:01
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Hi Dennis,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 14:17:38 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
[... reordering quotes and adding a quote level for better readability, stripping rest ...]
> From: TJ Frazier
>> Funny you should mention that. That very problem occurred on Bugzilla,
>> with DOC attachments bearing Trojan viruses. --/tj/
> Wow!
>
> When was that?
Last year? But I think what TJ was referring was a case of .doc
attachments to make them look like a testcase but instead contained
a JavaScript snippet redirecting the browser to a different site that
tried to install malware. Quite clever.
> I assume that bugzilla still accepts attachments (we were talking about lists).
A bug tracker _has_ to accept attachments, without it is useless in many
cases.
> What do we do to protect it?
How about a virus scan on attachments? That probably wouldn't help
against the JavaScript case though. Virus scans could even be done for
mail attachments before the mailing list distributes them. Question is
if Apache infra supports both cases.
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
The attachment spoken of in the bug report you are linking to is an .html file, so it is likely it would attempt to execute if opened in a browser. And it could do things with a malicious site.
I don't see a case of a .doc file attachment being malicious, or even being spoofed. Is there another?
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: TJ Frazier [mailto:tjfrazier@cfl.rr.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 16:36
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
On 8/31/2011 19:01, Eike Rathke wrote:
> Hi Dennis,
>
> On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 14:17:38 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>
> [... reordering quotes and adding a quote level for better readability, stripping rest ...]
>
>> From: TJ Frazier
>>> Funny you should mention that. That very problem occurred on Bugzilla,
>>> with DOC attachments bearing Trojan viruses. --/tj/
>
>> Wow!
>>
>> When was that?
>
> Last year? But I think what TJ was referring was a case of .doc
> attachments to make them look like a testcase but instead contained
> a JavaScript snippet redirecting the browser to a different site that
> tried to install malware. Quite clever.
Yes, H. Duerr provided a link to the issue:
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=113088
The spammers' accounts have apparently been removed, but some of the
attachments may have survived. I found a couple of attachments
attributed to "Unknown". This might happen if the account was deleted
before all "contributions" were removed. --/tj/
>
>> I assume that bugzilla still accepts attachments (we were talking about lists).
>
> A bug tracker _has_ to accept attachments, without it is useless in many
> cases.
>
>> What do we do to protect it?
>
> How about a virus scan on attachments? That probably wouldn't help
> against the JavaScript case though. Virus scans could even be done for
> mail attachments before the mailing list distributes them. Question is
> if Apache infra supports both cases.
>
> Eike
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by TJ Frazier <tj...@cfl.rr.com>.
On 8/31/2011 19:01, Eike Rathke wrote:
> Hi Dennis,
>
> On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 14:17:38 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>
> [... reordering quotes and adding a quote level for better readability, stripping rest ...]
>
>> From: TJ Frazier
>>> Funny you should mention that. That very problem occurred on Bugzilla,
>>> with DOC attachments bearing Trojan viruses. --/tj/
>
>> Wow!
>>
>> When was that?
>
> Last year? But I think what TJ was referring was a case of .doc
> attachments to make them look like a testcase but instead contained
> a JavaScript snippet redirecting the browser to a different site that
> tried to install malware. Quite clever.
Yes, H. Duerr provided a link to the issue:
https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=113088
The spammers' accounts have apparently been removed, but some of the
attachments may have survived. I found a couple of attachments
attributed to "Unknown". This might happen if the account was deleted
before all "contributions" were removed. --/tj/
>
>> I assume that bugzilla still accepts attachments (we were talking about lists).
>
> A bug tracker _has_ to accept attachments, without it is useless in many
> cases.
>
>> What do we do to protect it?
>
> How about a virus scan on attachments? That probably wouldn't help
> against the JavaScript case though. Virus scans could even be done for
> mail attachments before the mailing list distributes them. Question is
> if Apache infra supports both cases.
>
> Eike
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Dennis,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 14:17:38 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
[... reordering quotes and adding a quote level for better readability, stripping rest ...]
> From: TJ Frazier
>> Funny you should mention that. That very problem occurred on Bugzilla,
>> with DOC attachments bearing Trojan viruses. --/tj/
> Wow!
>
> When was that?
Last year? But I think what TJ was referring was a case of .doc
attachments to make them look like a testcase but instead contained
a JavaScript snippet redirecting the browser to a different site that
tried to install malware. Quite clever.
> I assume that bugzilla still accepts attachments (we were talking about lists).
A bug tracker _has_ to accept attachments, without it is useless in many
cases.
> What do we do to protect it?
How about a virus scan on attachments? That probably wouldn't help
against the JavaScript case though. Virus scans could even be done for
mail attachments before the mailing list distributes them. Question is
if Apache infra supports both cases.
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Wow!
When was that?
I assume that bugzilla still accepts attachments (we were talking about lists). What do we do to protect it?
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: TJ Frazier [mailto:tjfrazier@cfl.rr.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 14:08
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
On 8/31/2011 16:56, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> When's the last time you heard of malicious code in a Microsoft Office file? No recent version will run macro code without warning and default disabling on load. I would expect mail clients to also be circumspect about allowing direct opening of document files provided as attachments.
>
Funny you should mention that. That very problem occurred on Bugzilla,
with DOC attachments bearing Trojan viruses. --/tj/
> I think the recommendation for those, for the wary, would be to allow Zip and encourage people to package anything simpler than an image that way. Of course images and PDFs have exploits too.
>
> Perhaps the truly-safe cases are only text and zip?
>
> I don't know about you, but I also only receive e-mail in plaintext.
>
> - Dennis
<snip>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by TJ Frazier <tj...@cfl.rr.com>.
On 8/31/2011 16:56, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> When's the last time you heard of malicious code in a Microsoft Office file? No recent version will run macro code without warning and default disabling on load. I would expect mail clients to also be circumspect about allowing direct opening of document files provided as attachments.
>
Funny you should mention that. That very problem occurred on Bugzilla,
with DOC attachments bearing Trojan viruses. --/tj/
> I think the recommendation for those, for the wary, would be to allow Zip and encourage people to package anything simpler than an image that way. Of course images and PDFs have exploits too.
>
> Perhaps the truly-safe cases are only text and zip?
>
> I don't know about you, but I also only receive e-mail in plaintext.
>
> - Dennis
<snip>
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
+1
I like that fixed-footer idea a great deal. Please go for it.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Weir [mailto:apache@robweir.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 16:48
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:43 PM, Jean Weber <je...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 1, 2011 at 08:35, Dennis E. Hamilton <hi...@orcmid.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hmm, so the problem in the case of the list is that it is a broadcast medium, and someone can be expected to not practice safe unzipping. Got it.
>>
>> OK, no attachments.
>>
>
> There is also the issue that even if the attachments are safe, a
> mailing list distributes them to hundreds of people who have no need
> for them and don't want to receive them. On a forum, it's different;
> you can get or not as you choose.
>
> So IMO, no attachments on a *user* list.
>
Good point. Maybe we can get a fixed footer to occur on the user list
emails, just 2 or 3 lines giving the most important info that could
help reduce frustration and increase the signal/noise ratio. Things
like:
1) How to unsubscribe to the list
2) Where to report bugs
3) Where the support forums are
4) File attachments not supported, so here's where to go to share a file
We could also put that info in the original welcome note that is sent
to new subscribers. But that note always gets lost. Better to put the
info right in each note.
> --Jean
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@openoffice.org>.
On 01/09/2011 Rob Weir wrote:
> Good point. Maybe we can get a fixed footer to occur on the user list
> emails, just 2 or 3 lines ...
> 1) How to unsubscribe to the list
> 2) Where to report bugs
> 3) Where the support forums are
> 4) File attachments not supported, so here's where to go to share a file
Good idea, but I'd replace it with a single line linking to a wiki page.
About attachments: I believe that the current openoffice.org lists do
allow them (even quite large ones), but users, at least on the Italian
mailing lists, use them very rarely, so it's not important to migrate
the ability to support attachments on users lists.
However, I'd definitely consider the possibility to automatically save
stripped attachments to an online repository and replace them with a
link in the message (and possibly deleting them 30 days later): this is
what Mailman and Yahoo Groups have done for years, and it offers a good
trade-off between usability and convenience/security.
Regards,
Andrea.
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ap...@robweir.com>.
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:43 PM, Jean Weber <je...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Sep 1, 2011 at 08:35, Dennis E. Hamilton <hi...@orcmid.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hmm, so the problem in the case of the list is that it is a broadcast medium, and someone can be expected to not practice safe unzipping. Got it.
>>
>> OK, no attachments.
>>
>
> There is also the issue that even if the attachments are safe, a
> mailing list distributes them to hundreds of people who have no need
> for them and don't want to receive them. On a forum, it's different;
> you can get or not as you choose.
>
> So IMO, no attachments on a *user* list.
>
Good point. Maybe we can get a fixed footer to occur on the user list
emails, just 2 or 3 lines giving the most important info that could
help reduce frustration and increase the signal/noise ratio. Things
like:
1) How to unsubscribe to the list
2) Where to report bugs
3) Where the support forums are
4) File attachments not supported, so here's where to go to share a file
We could also put that info in the original welcome note that is sent
to new subscribers. But that note always gets lost. Better to put the
info right in each note.
> --Jean
>
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Right you are. Thanks.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jean Weber [mailto:jeanweber@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 15:44
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org; dennis.hamilton@acm.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
On Thu, Sep 1, 2011 at 08:35, Dennis E. Hamilton <hi...@orcmid.com> wrote:
>
> Hmm, so the problem in the case of the list is that it is a broadcast medium, and someone can be expected to not practice safe unzipping. Got it.
>
> OK, no attachments.
>
There is also the issue that even if the attachments are safe, a
mailing list distributes them to hundreds of people who have no need
for them and don't want to receive them. On a forum, it's different;
you can get or not as you choose.
So IMO, no attachments on a *user* list.
--Jean
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Jean Weber <je...@gmail.com>.
On Thu, Sep 1, 2011 at 08:35, Dennis E. Hamilton <hi...@orcmid.com> wrote:
>
> Hmm, so the problem in the case of the list is that it is a broadcast medium, and someone can be expected to not practice safe unzipping. Got it.
>
> OK, no attachments.
>
There is also the issue that even if the attachments are safe, a
mailing list distributes them to hundreds of people who have no need
for them and don't want to receive them. On a forum, it's different;
you can get or not as you choose.
So IMO, no attachments on a *user* list.
--Jean
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <hi...@orcmid.com>.
" I receive any format that was sent, I just read them only in plaintext ;)"
Ich auch.
Hmm, so the problem in the case of the list is that it is a broadcast medium, and someone can be expected to not practice safe unzipping. Got it.
OK, no attachments.
Then it is up to those who pull them from wherever they are parked to be prudent? I suppose that is better.
Not sure about the issue-tracker case. Waiting to hear the story about that one.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Eike Rathke [mailto:ooo@erack.de]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 15:10
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Hi Dennis,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 13:56:13 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> When's the last time you heard of malicious code in a Microsoft Office
> file? No recent version will run macro code without warning and
> default disabling on load.
True, nowadays sending such may be pointless.
> I would expect mail clients to also be
> circumspect about allowing direct opening of document files provided
> as attachments.
Double Click, "Do you really want to open this attachment?" YES, OK.
> I think the recommendation for those, for the wary, would be to allow
> Zip and encourage people to package anything simpler than an image
> that way. Of course images and PDFs have exploits too.
>
> Perhaps the truly-safe cases are only text and zip?
To the contrary. Only this month I received about 50 .zip attachments
that exclusively contained malware, .exe .com .scr .cmd .bat etc. Not
including mails that were filtered out by anti-spam measures before they
even reached my inbox.
> I don't know about you, but I also only receive e-mail in plaintext.
I receive any format that was sent, I just read them only in plaintext ;)
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Dennis,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 13:56:13 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> When's the last time you heard of malicious code in a Microsoft Office
> file? No recent version will run macro code without warning and
> default disabling on load.
True, nowadays sending such may be pointless.
> I would expect mail clients to also be
> circumspect about allowing direct opening of document files provided
> as attachments.
Double Click, "Do you really want to open this attachment?" YES, OK.
> I think the recommendation for those, for the wary, would be to allow
> Zip and encourage people to package anything simpler than an image
> that way. Of course images and PDFs have exploits too.
>
> Perhaps the truly-safe cases are only text and zip?
To the contrary. Only this month I received about 50 .zip attachments
that exclusively contained malware, .exe .com .scr .cmd .bat etc. Not
including mails that were filtered out by anti-spam measures before they
even reached my inbox.
> I don't know about you, but I also only receive e-mail in plaintext.
I receive any format that was sent, I just read them only in plaintext ;)
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
When's the last time you heard of malicious code in a Microsoft Office file? No recent version will run macro code without warning and default disabling on load. I would expect mail clients to also be circumspect about allowing direct opening of document files provided as attachments.
I think the recommendation for those, for the wary, would be to allow Zip and encourage people to package anything simpler than an image that way. Of course images and PDFs have exploits too.
Perhaps the truly-safe cases are only text and zip?
I don't know about you, but I also only receive e-mail in plaintext.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Eike Rathke [mailto:ooo@erack.de]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 12:46
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Hi Marcus,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 20:56:16 +0200, Marcus (OOo) wrote:
> For ooo-support@ files like doc, xls, ppt, odt, ods, odp will be
> most important.
I'd certainly not allow MS binary files as potential malicious code
carriers.
> But also jpg, png, gif for screenshots could be
> important. Additionally maybe pdf.
pdf is fine.
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Marcus,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 20:56:16 +0200, Marcus (OOo) wrote:
> For ooo-support@ files like doc, xls, ppt, odt, ods, odp will be
> most important.
I'd certainly not allow MS binary files as potential malicious code
carriers.
> But also jpg, png, gif for screenshots could be
> important. Additionally maybe pdf.
pdf is fine.
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Yes, undisciplined use arises on the LibreOffice lists as well (with the usual smattering of "unsubscribe me" and "please reply directly because I am not subscribed" pleas).
I don't think we can expect an occasional visitor to be disciplined, especially for a novice at coming to a list for support.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Larry Gusaas [mailto:larry.gusaas@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 12:29
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org]
On 2011-08-31 1:09 PM Rob Weir wrote:
> ooo-users, the future home ofusers@openoffice.org
>
> Like the existing list, it would not be exclusively support. It would
> be used for discussions, new feature ideas, etc., whatever users want
> to post (within reason).
>
> We can't prevent users from posting support questions there. Heck, we
> can't prevent them from posting support questions on ooo-dev. But we
> can steer support questions to a more appropriate venue where needed.
The OOo Users Mailing List was supposed to be exclusively for support. Other discussions about
OOo were supposed to occur on the OOo Discuss Mailing List.
In reality, many people were undisciplined and did not post their comments on the appropriate list.
--
_________________________________
Larry I. Gusaas
Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan Canada
Website: http://larry-gusaas.com
"An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind theirs." - Edgard Varese
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org
[Was: Re: [Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com>.
On 2011-08-31 1:09 PM Rob Weir wrote:
> ooo-users, the future home ofusers@openoffice.org
>
> Like the existing list, it would not be exclusively support. It would
> be used for discussions, new feature ideas, etc., whatever users want
> to post (within reason).
>
> We can't prevent users from posting support questions there. Heck, we
> can't prevent them from posting support questions on ooo-dev. But we
> can steer support questions to a more appropriate venue where needed.
The OOo Users Mailing List was supposed to be exclusively for support. Other discussions about
OOo were supposed to occur on the OOo Discuss Mailing List.
In reality, many people were undisciplined and did not post their comments on the appropriate list.
--
_________________________________
Larry I. Gusaas
Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan Canada
Website: http://larry-gusaas.com
"An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind theirs." - Edgard Varese
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>.
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 2:56 PM, Marcus (OOo) <ma...@wtnet.de> wrote:
> Am 08/31/2011 08:10 PM, schrieb Rob Weir:
>>
>> Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
>>
>> The default policy appears to be forbid many attachments, silently
>> stripping them. This would cause chaos on a list used for end-user
>> support, since they will naturally want to attach sample documents,
>> screen shots, etc., that illustrate their problems.
>>
>> Of course, allowing all attachments unconstrained by type and size is
>> also a path to chaos.
>>
>> Any recommendations for what we should enable?
>
> Do you mean ooo-users@ ? Or ooo-support@ ?
>
ooo-users, the future home of users@openoffice.org
Like the existing list, it would not be exclusively support. It would
be used for discussions, new feature ideas, etc., whatever users want
to post (within reason).
We can't prevent users from posting support questions there. Heck, we
can't prevent them from posting support questions on ooo-dev. But we
can steer support questions to a more appropriate venue where needed.
> For ooo-support@ files like doc, xls, ppt, odt, ods, odp will be most
> important. But also jpg, png, gif for screenshots could be important.
> Additionally maybe pdf.
>
> But for ooo-users@ I don't know if attachments are really necessary.
>
> Marcus
>
>
>
>> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Rob Weir<ro...@robweir.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Great. Thanks. Could we get a couple more moderator volunteers, say
>>> a couple from Europe? Note that a user list will require more
>>> moderator assistance than a dev list, with people having difficulties
>>> signing off, with need to remove people with badly behaving
>>> out-of-the-office agents, etc.
>>>
>>> -Rob
>>>
>>> On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 6:17 PM, Kazunari Hirano<kh...@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Dennis and all,
>>>>
>>>> I will take care of CJK users and questions.
>>>> :)
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> khirano
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:34 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton<or...@apache.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you need a minimum of three?
>>>>>
>>>>> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the
>>>>> occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too,
>>>>> depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the
>>>>> difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>>>>>
>>>>> - Dennis
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Marcus (OOo)" <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 08/31/2011 08:10 PM, schrieb Rob Weir:
> Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
>
> The default policy appears to be forbid many attachments, silently
> stripping them. This would cause chaos on a list used for end-user
> support, since they will naturally want to attach sample documents,
> screen shots, etc., that illustrate their problems.
>
> Of course, allowing all attachments unconstrained by type and size is
> also a path to chaos.
>
> Any recommendations for what we should enable?
Do you mean ooo-users@ ? Or ooo-support@ ?
For ooo-support@ files like doc, xls, ppt, odt, ods, odp will be most
important. But also jpg, png, gif for screenshots could be important.
Additionally maybe pdf.
But for ooo-users@ I don't know if attachments are really necessary.
Marcus
> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Rob Weir<ro...@robweir.com> wrote:
>> Great. Thanks. Could we get a couple more moderator volunteers, say
>> a couple from Europe? Note that a user list will require more
>> moderator assistance than a dev list, with people having difficulties
>> signing off, with need to remove people with badly behaving
>> out-of-the-office agents, etc.
>>
>> -Rob
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 6:17 PM, Kazunari Hirano<kh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hi Dennis and all,
>>>
>>> I will take care of CJK users and questions.
>>> :)
>>> Thanks,
>>> khirano
>>>
>>> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:34 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton<or...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>>>>
>>>> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>>>>
>>>> Do you need a minimum of three?
>>>>
>>>> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>>>>
>>>> - Dennis
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Rob,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 14:10:45 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
> Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
>
> Any recommendations for what we should enable?
Allow all ODF of known extensions, e.g. .odt .ods .odp ...
For screenshots allow .png .jpg .jpeg
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Dennis,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 13:56:13 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> Not being able to send attachments is apparently a constant for user
> lists. I'm not sure they work here on ooo-dev either.
At least plain text attachments get through, of various MIME types.
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Not being able to send attachments is apparently a constant for user lists. I'm not sure they work here on ooo-dev either.
-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Weir [mailto:robweir@apache.org]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 11:11
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
The default policy appears to be forbid many attachments, silently
stripping them. This would cause chaos on a list used for end-user
support, since they will naturally want to attach sample documents,
screen shots, etc., that illustrate their problems.
Of course, allowing all attachments unconstrained by type and size is
also a path to chaos.
Any recommendations for what we should enable?
-Rob
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com> wrote:
> Great. Thanks. Could we get a couple more moderator volunteers, say
> a couple from Europe? Note that a user list will require more
> moderator assistance than a dev list, with people having difficulties
> signing off, with need to remove people with badly behaving
> out-of-the-office agents, etc.
>
> -Rob
>
> On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 6:17 PM, Kazunari Hirano <kh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Dennis and all,
>>
>> I will take care of CJK users and questions.
>> :)
>> Thanks,
>> khirano
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:34 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
>>> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>>>
>>> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>>>
>>> Do you need a minimum of three?
>>>
>>> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>>>
>>> - Dennis
>>
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by TJ Frazier <tj...@cfl.rr.com>.
Hi, Manfred, *
On 8/31/2011 14:51, Manfred A. Reiter wrote:
> 2011/8/31 Rob Weir<ro...@apache.org>:
>> Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
>>
>
> The experience with the german OOo-users list have shown
> that attachments should be banned. Today it is not an art piece
> to save a file in net and refer to a link to it.
>
> If the user of de-users didn't know how to do it, they were helped.
>
> [...]
>
> M.
>
While I agree that attachments should be stripped, I'd appreciate it if
you would post a little of that "help" for saving a file on the net. The
best I can do, occasionally helping users, is to have them send the file
directly to me. But that means that no one else can pick up on the
problem and work on it. I suspect that other helpers would like this
information, too.
--
/tj/
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by drew <dr...@baseanswers.com>.
On Wed, 2011-08-31 at 17:19 -0400, drew wrote:
> The average size of an attachment is: 48.7 KB [some of my old numbers
> have this at 36.4]
one correction - current avg size is 36 KB my old notes had 48.7.
Total current storage space used by attachments is 373 MB.
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by drew <dr...@baseanswers.com>.
On Wed, 2011-08-31 at 16:21 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 2:51 PM, Manfred A. Reiter <ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > 2011/8/31 Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>:
> >> Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
> >>
> >
> > The experience with the german OOo-users list have shown
> > that attachments should be banned. Today it is not an art piece
> > to save a file in net and refer to a link to it.
> >
>
> Did you give the users some sort of automated error message if they
> tried to add an attachment?
No, there was no automated message.
>
> That is the part that concerns me, that we silently strip the
> attachments. This will just lead to increased noise:
You don't need to use conjecture here - there are real examples - it
doesn't usually go quite that way, again IIRC.
One example of a support ML that accepts attachments is GIMP. They limit
(not sure if it is enforced in code or just their rules) attachments to
10KB - they also strongly discourage adding any attachment.
As for numbers from a non-ML but same subject:
[sorry some of these numbers are from past times, but a quick look just
now and I think they should be in line still]
current:
The en forums has 10,235 attachments from 193,615 total posts.
The average size of an attachment is: 48.7 KB [some of my old numbers
have this at 36.4]
[old numbers - I no longer have enough access rights to pull these any
longer]
MS format files: ~8%
ODF format files: ~48%
Compressed [zip, 7z, etc] ~1%
The rest are different image formats [jpg, png, tiff]
Anyway - I hope that helps somehow.
//drew
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Manfred A. Reiter" <ma...@gmail.com>.
2011/8/31 Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>:
> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 2:51 PM, Manfred A. Reiter <ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 2011/8/31 Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>:
>>> Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
>>>
>>
>> The experience with the german OOo-users list have shown
>> that attachments should be banned. Today it is not an art piece
>> to save a file in net and refer to a link to it.
>>
>
> Did you give the users some sort of automated error message if they
> tried to add an attachment?
>
> That is the part that concerns me, that we silently strip the
> attachments. This will just lead to increased noise:
>
> 1) User posts message with attempted attachment
>
> 2) User notices attachment is missing and sends the note again, saying
> "sorry, I forget the attachment" (Users often blame themselves)
>
> 3) Seeing the attachment is not there again, they are angry and post
> another note, saying, "Where the #%$% is my attachment"
>
> 4) Helpful support person comes in and says that attachments are not
> allowed and points them to alternatives file sharing mechanisms.
>
I think all questions are answered ... during my rest and a day of
hard work in the fruit plot ;-)
... only to know, we had a weekly pointer ...
to "educate" people on the users list ... and it worked fine
http://openoffice.org/projects/de/lists/users/archive/2010-03/message/0
a rough translation from google translate :
-------------------------------------------------- -----------------
The etiquette of users@de.openoffice.org-Mailingliste
-------------------------------------------------- -----------------
What is it about?
-------------------------------------------------- -----------------
Did you end up on a mailing list with a sometimes very high
Registered mail traffic. To a smooth handling
to allow this mass of mails that have some
Agreements proved. You will of the majority of participants
accepted and applied.
It is not to prescribe anything to anybody. Who
reads the rules will soon realize that all their meaning
have and simplify the handling of the list for all. However
opens up this sense is not always immediate. Wants this email
provide clarity.
A more detailed version of this text with many other
Tips can be found under
http://www.eschkitai.de/openoffice/netikette.html;.
The eight golden rules for good contributions:
-------------------------------------------------- -----------------
1st Helping people help themselves
2nd Give your real name
3rd For each question, please create a new mail
4th Answers shorten useful
5th Watch for good readability
6th Feedback in the form of a summary
7th Properly configure the mail program
8th Do not send attachments to the list
The main points in detail:
-------------------------------------------------- -----------------
# # 1 # # # # to help themselves
Try first of all on-line help for OpenOffice.org
To find help. Try more keywords from the index,
not always the first hit or sit, the term,
you chose, or your problem.
You can find instructions in the documentation portal to individual
Modules, support for installation and answers to frequently
Asked Questions ("FAQ"): http://de.openoffice.org/doc/
The left-hand navigation bar provides a search function. Try them
out.
The sides of the international project
Help (http://www.openoffice.org/) more. Although in English,
they describe exactly those issues, as they also
encounters, and often very evident.
Additional help can be found on pages
Directory of OpenOffice.org (http://www.ooo-portal.de/)
the OpenOffice.org forum (http://de.openoffice.info/) and
the OpenOffice.org Wiki (http://www.ooowiki.de/).
A look to it worthwhile.
Maybe your question is already on the mailing list
been asked and answered. In this case, a look into the
Archive, which under
http://de.openoffice.org/servlets/SummarizeList?listName=users or
http://www.mail-archive.com/users% to find 40de.openoffice.org
is.
If you solve your problem with these aids do not already own
could, but this preliminary work will allow you, your concerns
to describe precisely, and help provide answers to your question
to understand better. Then you should also dig deeper to some
slight fall.
Please do not forget to tell your readers, which version
OpenOffice.org and what operating system you work.
Finally, you can find under
http://de.openoffice.org/about-ooo/about-users-mailinglist.html
further guidance on using the mailing list and to
Logging in and out.
# # 2 # # # # Enter your real name
Please enter your first and last name in the From: line. We
like to know with whom we converse. In real life is
you look so well with the name before and forges links to
others. We find the mention of the name helps solve that
is from an anonymous group of users, a community.
3 # # # # # # For each question, please create a new mail
Participants often use the _Antwortfunktion_ the mail program,
to start a new topic. They delete the quotation as
the imported content and the subject. Remain at this
Process the (invisible) management information of the mail
receive and the mail is now the recipient within the
original issue sorted.
Imagine that you burst into a conversation with a completely different
Theme inside. Accordingly, the reaction of the other rough
. fail
So write a _neue_ mail. Many mail programs support
You here, by equating the list address in the To: field
. enter Just look to see if your mail program can also.
Give your email a title (subject) that clearly to your
Problem points, such as 'Calc (OOo 1.1RC4): cell formatting'.
# # # # # 4 # cut answers make sense
When replying to your mail program reads the old mail, provided with
Quote characters (>) again. Now you have it so easy to
. reply But delete everything, you refer to is not you. Lasse
But the paragraph to which you are replying. Your answer is
separated under this paragraph, a blank line. This corresponds to the
usual reading direction from top to bottom.
TOFU is absolutely unnecessary = (complete) T (ext your answer) O (up)
F (ullqoute so complete text of the old mail) (bottom) U. Unnecessary
is the reverse form TUFO.
Occasionally, for the participants of abbreviations phrases
used. Such abbreviations are explained here:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netzjargon
# # # # # # 5 Pay attention to readability
In German-speaking countries this includes compliance with the wholesale and
Sensitive. Over a misspelling nobody gets upset, a
gross disregard of spelling rules, or ignoring
Punctuation contrast makes reading the text cumbersome.
Note: On screen text reads differently than on paper.
Therefore not save the set of paragraphs. Your readers will
will thank you.
Most programs can be well-read on line break
set at 72 characters.
# # # # # # 6 back in the form of a summary
The moment where the solution to a problem requires a lot of mails
and has the final answer is somewhere in the thread (group
of messages that belong to a hidden issue), it is useful
explain in a final email to all once again how
the problem was and how it was resolved. This makes the
List archive into a valuable pool of knowledge from the other
can be used.
Proposed solutions should be followed by a brief response, the
other readers said that the proposed solution worked.
7 # # # # # # Mail program configured properly
Take a closer look at the configuration of your menus
Mail program.
Your character set should be properly declared, so that umlauts
are clearly displayed. Most suitable iso-8859-1, iso-
8859-15 or UTF-8 encoding.
The maximum line length is 72 characters, 68 are located in the
Practice of many very successful. The text of your mail is in the naked
Text (ASCII) are (often the default is HTML), the
Quote character is a '>' (greater) characters plus a space,
the labeling for an answer is a single 'Re:' plus
a space.
Unfortunately, many mail programs ignore these standards in their
Basic configuration. However, it is usually quite easy, the
switch. Please make this effort.
Please make your mail program so that no receiving / reading
confirmations are required. An email that you send will
receive about 500 times. If your comparison would be not so nice, the
To prevent confirmation mail would be in your Inbox shortly
flooded.
# # # 8 # # # Do not send attachments to the list
Any mail that you send to this list will automatically
several hundred recipients forwarded. Many of them use
Modems or other narrowband connections. Therefore, the
Amount of data that goes over the list, be as small as possible (hence
e.g. Only ASCII-mails).
If a screenshot or a file necessary for understanding a
Problem, then deputy to the file on one down Sever
and post the link to load only on the list. You can also
Mail shipping offer - then just wait until someone you this
prompts to send the file via PM (private mail).
On good cooperation,
The team from the mailing list
*******************************************
HTH
M.
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 2:51 PM, Manfred A. Reiter <ma...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2011/8/31 Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>:
>> Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
>>
>
> The experience with the german OOo-users list have shown
> that attachments should be banned. Today it is not an art piece
> to save a file in net and refer to a link to it.
>
Did you give the users some sort of automated error message if they
tried to add an attachment?
That is the part that concerns me, that we silently strip the
attachments. This will just lead to increased noise:
1) User posts message with attempted attachment
2) User notices attachment is missing and sends the note again, saying
"sorry, I forget the attachment" (Users often blame themselves)
3) Seeing the attachment is not there again, they are angry and post
another note, saying, "Where the #%$% is my attachment"
4) Helpful support person comes in and says that attachments are not
allowed and points them to alternatives file sharing mechanisms.
I think it would be good if we can avoid the initial confusion.
> If the user of de-users didn't know how to do it, they were helped.
>
> [...]
>
> M.
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Manfred A. Reiter" <ma...@gmail.com>.
2011/8/31 Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>:
> Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
>
The experience with the german OOo-users list have shown
that attachments should be banned. Today it is not an art piece
to save a file in net and refer to a link to it.
If the user of de-users didn't know how to do it, they were helped.
[...]
M.
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>.
Something else to think about for the ooo-users list: file attachments.
The default policy appears to be forbid many attachments, silently
stripping them. This would cause chaos on a list used for end-user
support, since they will naturally want to attach sample documents,
screen shots, etc., that illustrate their problems.
Of course, allowing all attachments unconstrained by type and size is
also a path to chaos.
Any recommendations for what we should enable?
-Rob
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com> wrote:
> Great. Thanks. Could we get a couple more moderator volunteers, say
> a couple from Europe? Note that a user list will require more
> moderator assistance than a dev list, with people having difficulties
> signing off, with need to remove people with badly behaving
> out-of-the-office agents, etc.
>
> -Rob
>
> On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 6:17 PM, Kazunari Hirano <kh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Dennis and all,
>>
>> I will take care of CJK users and questions.
>> :)
>> Thanks,
>> khirano
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:34 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
>>> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>>>
>>> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>>>
>>> Do you need a minimum of three?
>>>
>>> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>>>
>>> - Dennis
>>
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Simon Phipps <si...@webmink.com>.
I'd be happy to help out (usually UK timezone).
S.
On 31 Aug 2011, at 15:32, Rob Weir wrote:
> Great. Thanks. Could we get a couple more moderator volunteers, say
> a couple from Europe? Note that a user list will require more
> moderator assistance than a dev list, with people having difficulties
> signing off, with need to remove people with badly behaving
> out-of-the-office agents, etc.
>
> -Rob
>
> On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 6:17 PM, Kazunari Hirano <kh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Dennis and all,
>>
>> I will take care of CJK users and questions.
>> :)
>> Thanks,
>> khirano
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:34 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
>>> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>>>
>>> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>>>
>>> Do you need a minimum of three?
>>>
>>> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>>>
>>> - Dennis
>>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
Great. Thanks. Could we get a couple more moderator volunteers, say
a couple from Europe? Note that a user list will require more
moderator assistance than a dev list, with people having difficulties
signing off, with need to remove people with badly behaving
out-of-the-office agents, etc.
-Rob
On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 6:17 PM, Kazunari Hirano <kh...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Dennis and all,
>
> I will take care of CJK users and questions.
> :)
> Thanks,
> khirano
>
> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:34 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
>> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>>
>> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>>
>> Do you need a minimum of three?
>>
>> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>>
>> - Dennis
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Kazunari Hirano <kh...@gmail.com>.
Hi Dennis and all,
I will take care of CJK users and questions.
:)
Thanks,
khirano
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 6:34 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>
> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>
> Do you need a minimum of three?
>
> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>
> - Dennis
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>.
JIRA issue entered:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INFRA-3905
-Rob
On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 5:34 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>
> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>
> Do you need a minimum of three?
>
> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>
> - Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Shane Curcuru [mailto:asf@shanecurcuru.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 08:11
> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
>
> [ ... ]
>
> Personally, if there were some committers who would volunteer to
> moderate, I'd just create an ooo-user@ mailing list now. Almost all
> projects already have a user list, so it'd be worth creating one if for
> only to give interested users a place to start asking questions about
> the future plans of the podling.
>
> It also seems clear that with the OOo history and end-user base that
> some of the existing forums (whatever kind) will need to be continued.
> That's up to the project to figure out how to do and maintain. The only
> bigger ASF issue is ensuring that any new content added to forums that
> the ASF hosts is compatible with AL wherever possible.
>
> - Shane
>
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Manfred A. Reiter" <ma...@gmail.com>.
2011/8/30 Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org>:
> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>
me too, (if we are talking about en germanophone ML)
but I think you are only talking about an english written ML
> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>
> Do you need a minimum of three?
>
M.
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>.
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 9:29 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton
<de...@acm.org> wrote:
> Hmm, for (2) I think you have to use orcmid@msn.com for me, then. Most of my e-mail addresses (including orcmid@apache.org) are not associated with an SMTP server, if I get your drift.
>
> Where do we learn how to send the commands involved in (2).
If you are a moderator for a list, you can send a blank email to
foo-help. So, for example, to ooo-users-help@i.a.o
That will return a list of moderator commands.
>
> If you want to experiment on how strong that condition is, register both of those addresses above, and I'll see if only one of them works.
>
> I assume it is obvious when the list software does not recognize a moderator sending in the required manner.
>
> - Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rob Weir [mailto:robweir@apache.org]
> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 16:40
> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
>
> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 7:19 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, 2011-08-31 at 18:41 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
>>> On Aug 31, 2011, at 6:25 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > On Thu, 2011-09-01 at 08:05 +1000, Gavin McDonald wrote:
>>> >> Sometime before this thread has deviated into too many different directions it may
>>> >> be an idea if someone created an infra issue asking for the list to be created.
>>> >
>>> > *chuckling*....what an idea.
>>> >
>>> > haven't had the pleasure of using JIRA yet, I could do this.
>>> >
>>> > @Lsit
>>> > Is it just ooo-user@i.a.o for now then?
>>> >
>>> > Dennis, Rob and Simon as moderators IIRC.
>>> >
>>> > Going once..
>>>
>>> Uh. I had already said I would enter a JIRA issue for this. I wanted
>>> a few more moderators first and to get consensus on the attachment
>>> question.
>>
>> OK - it's all yours...no problem.
>>
>
> Sorry, I didn't mean to come off as being territorial on that.
>
> I'd also like to to confirm email addresses before sending in the request.
>
>
> Dennis: orcmid@apache.org
> Rob: robweir@apache.org
> Simon: simon@webmink.com
> Hirano-san: khirano@gmail.com
>
> There are two kinds of moderation duties that come up.
>
> 1) Passing or rejecting posts from non-subscribers. These require
> that you either do a response to the email or click the embedded link
> in the moderation note. Since the authentication tokens are embedded
> in the moderation note, it doesn't really matter what email address
> you use to deal with this.
>
> 2) Dealing with repetitive out-of-the-office notices, people who
> cannot figure out how to unsubscribe, spammers, etc. This is done
> by sending email commands from your moderator address. Sending from
> another address or spoofing the moderator address won't cut it. You
> really need to be sending from an SMTP server associated with your
> address. At least that has been my experience.
>
> So if a moderator wants to use a different address for moderation,
> especially considering the requirements for 2) above, please let me
> know.
>
> -Rob
>
>>
>> Best wishes,
>>
>> /drew
>>
>>
>
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Daniel Shahaf <d....@daniel.shahaf.name>.
orcmid@a.o has access to SMTP at smtps://people.apachea.org:465/
Moderators can approve emails from any address, but access to the -log,
-list, and the moderator's version of -help only works from the address
listed as moderator.
Only infra can change the moderator addresses on a list.
Dennis E. Hamilton wrote on Thu, Sep 01, 2011 at 11:38:59 -0700:
> I think you are right. I already have a list where orcmid@apache.org is a moderator, so I will see if I can access the moderator features there.
>
> - Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eike Rathke [mailto:ooo@erack.de]
> Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2011 08:11
> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
>
> Hi Dennis,
>
> On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 18:29:02 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>
> > Hmm, for (2) I think you have to use orcmid@msn.com for me, then.
> > Most of my e-mail addresses (including orcmid@apache.org) are not
> > associated with an SMTP server, if I get your drift.
>
> I think what counts is the envelope From, so if your ISP's SMTP allows
> you to send with an arbitrary envelope From (which is fine if the user
> is authenticated to the SMTP server anyway) you should be good.
>
> Eike
>
> --
> PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
> Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
>
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
I think you are right. I already have a list where orcmid@apache.org is a moderator, so I will see if I can access the moderator features there.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Eike Rathke [mailto:ooo@erack.de]
Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2011 08:11
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Hi Dennis,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 18:29:02 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> Hmm, for (2) I think you have to use orcmid@msn.com for me, then.
> Most of my e-mail addresses (including orcmid@apache.org) are not
> associated with an SMTP server, if I get your drift.
I think what counts is the envelope From, so if your ISP's SMTP allows
you to send with an arbitrary envelope From (which is fine if the user
is authenticated to the SMTP server anyway) you should be good.
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Dennis,
On Wednesday, 2011-08-31 18:29:02 -0700, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> Hmm, for (2) I think you have to use orcmid@msn.com for me, then.
> Most of my e-mail addresses (including orcmid@apache.org) are not
> associated with an SMTP server, if I get your drift.
I think what counts is the envelope From, so if your ISP's SMTP allows
you to send with an arbitrary envelope From (which is fine if the user
is authenticated to the SMTP server anyway) you should be good.
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Hmm, for (2) I think you have to use orcmid@msn.com for me, then. Most of my e-mail addresses (including orcmid@apache.org) are not associated with an SMTP server, if I get your drift.
Where do we learn how to send the commands involved in (2).
If you want to experiment on how strong that condition is, register both of those addresses above, and I'll see if only one of them works.
I assume it is obvious when the list software does not recognize a moderator sending in the required manner.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Weir [mailto:robweir@apache.org]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 16:40
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 7:19 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 2011-08-31 at 18:41 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
>> On Aug 31, 2011, at 6:25 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
>>
>> > On Thu, 2011-09-01 at 08:05 +1000, Gavin McDonald wrote:
>> >> Sometime before this thread has deviated into too many different directions it may
>> >> be an idea if someone created an infra issue asking for the list to be created.
>> >
>> > *chuckling*....what an idea.
>> >
>> > haven't had the pleasure of using JIRA yet, I could do this.
>> >
>> > @Lsit
>> > Is it just ooo-user@i.a.o for now then?
>> >
>> > Dennis, Rob and Simon as moderators IIRC.
>> >
>> > Going once..
>>
>> Uh. I had already said I would enter a JIRA issue for this. I wanted
>> a few more moderators first and to get consensus on the attachment
>> question.
>
> OK - it's all yours...no problem.
>
Sorry, I didn't mean to come off as being territorial on that.
I'd also like to to confirm email addresses before sending in the request.
Dennis: orcmid@apache.org
Rob: robweir@apache.org
Simon: simon@webmink.com
Hirano-san: khirano@gmail.com
There are two kinds of moderation duties that come up.
1) Passing or rejecting posts from non-subscribers. These require
that you either do a response to the email or click the embedded link
in the moderation note. Since the authentication tokens are embedded
in the moderation note, it doesn't really matter what email address
you use to deal with this.
2) Dealing with repetitive out-of-the-office notices, people who
cannot figure out how to unsubscribe, spammers, etc. This is done
by sending email commands from your moderator address. Sending from
another address or spoofing the moderator address won't cut it. You
really need to be sending from an SMTP server associated with your
address. At least that has been my experience.
So if a moderator wants to use a different address for moderation,
especially considering the requirements for 2) above, please let me
know.
-Rob
>
> Best wishes,
>
> /drew
>
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Kazunari Hirano <kh...@gmail.com>.
Hi Rob,
Thanks.
On Thu, Sep 1, 2011 at 8:40 AM, Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org> wrote:
> I'd also like to to confirm email addresses before sending in the request.
>
>
> Dennis: orcmid@apache.org
> Rob: robweir@apache.org
> Simon: simon@webmink.com
> Hirano-san: khirano@gmail.com
Mine is OK.
> There are two kinds of moderation duties that come up.
>
> 1) Passing or rejecting posts from non-subscribers. These require
> that you either do a response to the email or click the embedded link
> in the moderation note. Since the authentication tokens are embedded
> in the moderation note, it doesn't really matter what email address
> you use to deal with this.
>
> 2) Dealing with repetitive out-of-the-office notices, people who
> cannot figure out how to unsubscribe, spammers, etc. This is done
> by sending email commands from your moderator address. Sending from
> another address or spoofing the moderator address won't cut it. You
> really need to be sending from an SMTP server associated with your
> address. At least that has been my experience.
>
> So if a moderator wants to use a different address for moderation,
> especially considering the requirements for 2) above, please let me
> know.
I will use khirano@gmail.com for 1) and 2).
Thanks,
khirano
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>.
On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 7:19 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 2011-08-31 at 18:41 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
>> On Aug 31, 2011, at 6:25 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
>>
>> > On Thu, 2011-09-01 at 08:05 +1000, Gavin McDonald wrote:
>> >> Sometime before this thread has deviated into too many different directions it may
>> >> be an idea if someone created an infra issue asking for the list to be created.
>> >
>> > *chuckling*....what an idea.
>> >
>> > haven't had the pleasure of using JIRA yet, I could do this.
>> >
>> > @Lsit
>> > Is it just ooo-user@i.a.o for now then?
>> >
>> > Dennis, Rob and Simon as moderators IIRC.
>> >
>> > Going once..
>>
>> Uh. I had already said I would enter a JIRA issue for this. I wanted
>> a few more moderators first and to get consensus on the attachment
>> question.
>
> OK - it's all yours...no problem.
>
Sorry, I didn't mean to come off as being territorial on that.
I'd also like to to confirm email addresses before sending in the request.
Dennis: orcmid@apache.org
Rob: robweir@apache.org
Simon: simon@webmink.com
Hirano-san: khirano@gmail.com
There are two kinds of moderation duties that come up.
1) Passing or rejecting posts from non-subscribers. These require
that you either do a response to the email or click the embedded link
in the moderation note. Since the authentication tokens are embedded
in the moderation note, it doesn't really matter what email address
you use to deal with this.
2) Dealing with repetitive out-of-the-office notices, people who
cannot figure out how to unsubscribe, spammers, etc. This is done
by sending email commands from your moderator address. Sending from
another address or spoofing the moderator address won't cut it. You
really need to be sending from an SMTP server associated with your
address. At least that has been my experience.
So if a moderator wants to use a different address for moderation,
especially considering the requirements for 2) above, please let me
know.
-Rob
>
> Best wishes,
>
> /drew
>
>
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by drew <dr...@baseanswers.com>.
On Wed, 2011-08-31 at 18:41 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
> On Aug 31, 2011, at 6:25 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 2011-09-01 at 08:05 +1000, Gavin McDonald wrote:
> >> Sometime before this thread has deviated into too many different directions it may
> >> be an idea if someone created an infra issue asking for the list to be created.
> >
> > *chuckling*....what an idea.
> >
> > haven't had the pleasure of using JIRA yet, I could do this.
> >
> > @Lsit
> > Is it just ooo-user@i.a.o for now then?
> >
> > Dennis, Rob and Simon as moderators IIRC.
> >
> > Going once..
>
> Uh. I had already said I would enter a JIRA issue for this. I wanted
> a few more moderators first and to get consensus on the attachment
> question.
OK - it's all yours...no problem.
Best wishes,
/drew
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ra...@gmail.com>.
On Aug 31, 2011, at 6:25 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 2011-09-01 at 08:05 +1000, Gavin McDonald wrote:
>> Sometime before this thread has deviated into too many different directions it may
>> be an idea if someone created an infra issue asking for the list to be created.
>
> *chuckling*....what an idea.
>
> haven't had the pleasure of using JIRA yet, I could do this.
>
> @Lsit
> Is it just ooo-user@i.a.o for now then?
>
> Dennis, Rob and Simon as moderators IIRC.
>
> Going once..
Uh. I had already said I would enter a JIRA issue for this. I wanted
a few more moderators first and to get consensus on the attachment
question.
-Rob
>
> //drew
>
>>
>> Gav...
>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:orcmid@apache.org]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, 31 August 2011 7:34 AM
>>> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>> Cc: asf@shanecurcuru.org
>>> Subject: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
>>> dev@openoffice.org]
>>>
>>> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>>>
>>> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>>>
>>> Do you need a minimum of three?
>>>
>>> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional
>>> CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too,
>>> depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the
>>> difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>>>
>>> - Dennis
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Shane Curcuru [mailto:asf@shanecurcuru.org]
>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 08:11
>>> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
>>> Subject: Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
>>> dev@openoffice.org]
>>>
>>> [ ... ]
>>>
>>> Personally, if there were some committers who would volunteer to
>>> moderate, I'd just create an ooo-user@ mailing list now. Almost all projects
>>> already have a user list, so it'd be worth creating one if for only to give
>>> interested users a place to start asking questions about the future plans of
>>> the podling.
>>>
>>> It also seems clear that with the OOo history and end-user base that some of
>>> the existing forums (whatever kind) will need to be continued.
>>> That's up to the project to figure out how to do and maintain. The only
>>> bigger ASF issue is ensuring that any new content added to forums that the
>>> ASF hosts is compatible with AL wherever possible.
>>>
>>> - Shane
>>
>>
>>
>
>
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Also Hirano-san to keep an eye out for CJK messages that we won't know what to do with.
[Yes, I thought Shane had offered, but I suppose not without a request.]
There's a web page somewhere on how to make the request for a mailing list. Probably among the [P]PMC materials. (I can never find this stuff a second time, and I don't think to bookmark it the first time.)
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: drew [mailto:drew@baseanswers.com]
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 15:25
To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
On Thu, 2011-09-01 at 08:05 +1000, Gavin McDonald wrote:
> Sometime before this thread has deviated into too many different directions it may
> be an idea if someone created an infra issue asking for the list to be created.
*chuckling*....what an idea.
haven't had the pleasure of using JIRA yet, I could do this.
@Lsit
Is it just ooo-user@i.a.o for now then?
Dennis, Rob and Simon as moderators IIRC.
Going once...
//drew
>
> Gav...
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:orcmid@apache.org]
> > Sent: Wednesday, 31 August 2011 7:34 AM
> > To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> > Cc: asf@shanecurcuru.org
> > Subject: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
> > dev@openoffice.org]
> >
> > Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
> >
> > Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
> >
> > Do you need a minimum of three?
> >
> > It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional
> > CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too,
> > depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the
> > difference between spam and user inquiries.)
> >
> > - Dennis
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Shane Curcuru [mailto:asf@shanecurcuru.org]
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 08:11
> > To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
> > dev@openoffice.org]
> >
> > [ ... ]
> >
> > Personally, if there were some committers who would volunteer to
> > moderate, I'd just create an ooo-user@ mailing list now. Almost all projects
> > already have a user list, so it'd be worth creating one if for only to give
> > interested users a place to start asking questions about the future plans of
> > the podling.
> >
> > It also seems clear that with the OOo history and end-user base that some of
> > the existing forums (whatever kind) will need to be continued.
> > That's up to the project to figure out how to do and maintain. The only
> > bigger ASF issue is ensuring that any new content added to forums that the
> > ASF hosts is compatible with AL wherever possible.
> >
> > - Shane
>
>
>
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by drew <dr...@baseanswers.com>.
On Thu, 2011-09-01 at 08:05 +1000, Gavin McDonald wrote:
> Sometime before this thread has deviated into too many different directions it may
> be an idea if someone created an infra issue asking for the list to be created.
*chuckling*....what an idea.
haven't had the pleasure of using JIRA yet, I could do this.
@Lsit
Is it just ooo-user@i.a.o for now then?
Dennis, Rob and Simon as moderators IIRC.
Going once...
//drew
>
> Gav...
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:orcmid@apache.org]
> > Sent: Wednesday, 31 August 2011 7:34 AM
> > To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> > Cc: asf@shanecurcuru.org
> > Subject: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
> > dev@openoffice.org]
> >
> > Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
> >
> > Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
> >
> > Do you need a minimum of three?
> >
> > It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional
> > CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too,
> > depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the
> > difference between spam and user inquiries.)
> >
> > - Dennis
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Shane Curcuru [mailto:asf@shanecurcuru.org]
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 08:11
> > To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
> > dev@openoffice.org]
> >
> > [ ... ]
> >
> > Personally, if there were some committers who would volunteer to
> > moderate, I'd just create an ooo-user@ mailing list now. Almost all projects
> > already have a user list, so it'd be worth creating one if for only to give
> > interested users a place to start asking questions about the future plans of
> > the podling.
> >
> > It also seems clear that with the OOo history and end-user base that some of
> > the existing forums (whatever kind) will need to be continued.
> > That's up to the project to figure out how to do and maintain. The only
> > bigger ASF issue is ensuring that any new content added to forums that the
> > ASF hosts is compatible with AL wherever possible.
> >
> > - Shane
>
>
>
RE: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Gavin McDonald <ga...@16degrees.com.au>.
Sometime before this thread has deviated into too many different directions it may
be an idea if someone created an infra issue asking for the list to be created.
Gav...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:orcmid@apache.org]
> Sent: Wednesday, 31 August 2011 7:34 AM
> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Cc: asf@shanecurcuru.org
> Subject: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
> dev@openoffice.org]
>
> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>
> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>
> Do you need a minimum of three?
>
> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional
> CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too,
> depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the
> difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>
> - Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Shane Curcuru [mailto:asf@shanecurcuru.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 08:11
> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
> dev@openoffice.org]
>
> [ ... ]
>
> Personally, if there were some committers who would volunteer to
> moderate, I'd just create an ooo-user@ mailing list now. Almost all projects
> already have a user list, so it'd be worth creating one if for only to give
> interested users a place to start asking questions about the future plans of
> the podling.
>
> It also seems clear that with the OOo history and end-user base that some of
> the existing forums (whatever kind) will need to be continued.
> That's up to the project to figure out how to do and maintain. The only
> bigger ASF issue is ensuring that any new content added to forums that the
> ASF hosts is compatible with AL wherever possible.
>
> - Shane
Re: [ooo-user] was RE: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@apache.org>.
I can cover the other coast.
-Rob
On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 5:34 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hey, over here (waving arm in the air)!
>
> Yes, I will moderate ooo-users.
>
> Do you need a minimum of three?
>
> It would also be good to have one additional so we can handle the occasional CJK and Eastern European message that comes in, maybe others too, depending on what committers we have. (At least to help us tell the difference between spam and user inquiries.)
>
> - Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Shane Curcuru [mailto:asf@shanecurcuru.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 08:11
> To: ooo-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: users@openoffice.org [Was: Re: [Discussion] dev@openoffice.org]
>
> [ ... ]
>
> Personally, if there were some committers who would volunteer to
> moderate, I'd just create an ooo-user@ mailing list now. Almost all
> projects already have a user list, so it'd be worth creating one if for
> only to give interested users a place to start asking questions about
> the future plans of the podling.
>
> It also seems clear that with the OOo history and end-user base that
> some of the existing forums (whatever kind) will need to be continued.
> That's up to the project to figure out how to do and maintain. The only
> bigger ASF issue is ensuring that any new content added to forums that
> the ASF hosts is compatible with AL wherever possible.
>
> - Shane
>
>