Re: Example needed

[Tony Thompson <to...@stone-ware.com>]

Paul,

Maybe I should clarify a few points.  The echo server that I am talking about is just a simple example that I was hoping could easily demonstrate some very basic Avalon functionality.  It will listen on some configurable socket for some request and echo it back to the client.  That was really all I intended.  Maybe it is too basic but the idea was to demonstrate Avalon not implement some huge server.  They are intended as examples only and my intention is to make something that the Avalon team would deem fit to include as examples.

You were right.  I was not talking about Phoenix.  Unless I am mistaken, Phoenix seems to be several steps beyond where I was planning to start.  It would be a good idea to evolve it to a Phoenix example but, when you reach that level of sophistication, the example may be too simple.

I looked at the examples and they still jump in much deeper than I wanted to start with.  I am getting the impression that maybe there is not a need to start as basic as I am proposing (?????).  I wanted to start just by demonstrating the concept of COP (as simple as it can be).  Too basic for most and probably not a very practical application but, an example none the less.  Am I the only one that feels there is a need for this?

Thanks.
Tony

>>> Paul_Hammant@yahoo.com 03/31/02 08:54AM >>>
Tony,

We are currently working on docs.

It is not easy to find examples that talk about the application of the 
framework interfaces on their own.  All application of these concepts 
are tied to larger components.

More inline .....

>I am a new user to the Avalon framework and I cannot find any examples that demonstrate how to get started with this thing.  I have made several attempts to dive in and try to put something together.  I end up digging through the source code and find that I have just jumped in the deep end without a flotation device.  After spending some time going through the mailing list, I have found that there may be some other people out there in the same situation that I am in.
>
>So, in order to solve my problem (i.e. learn what I can about the framework), I am looking for an example that starts me in the kiddie pool.  Since none seems to exist (that I could find anyway.  If there is something out there or if someone is working on something, let me know.), I would like to attempt to put an example together myself.  The problem is, I need a push in the right direction to get started.
>
>Here is what I am proposing:
>
>- my simple example will be an echo server (and a client)
>
If you could make this open source then we would be quite peased.

I think you are talking of this as a Phoenix application.

If so look at 
http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs/jakarta-avalon-phoenix/src/pdk/ as the 
simplest/ugliest Phoenix app, and 
http://cvs.apache.org/viewcvs/jakarta-avalon-apps/demo/ (ignoring the 
altrmi and rmi stuff) as a more realistic basis for a clone.

>- there will actually be several servers that progressively add more and more Avalon concepts
>
Open source ?

>- the first server is very simple.  (Here is where I need the push)  It consists of one (?) component that implements what interfaces?  It will not do any logging and will be configured from the command line.  The component life cycle will probably be handled by main().
>
Ahh it appears you are not talking of Phoenix after all.

Well there are lumps of Phoenix you could copy for your /ill advised/ 
endeavour.  Do you want me to point you to them?

>- most text sent from the client to the server will be echoed back but, I would like to be able to send commands to the server (i.e. restart, stop, etc.).  Hopefully that can be used to demonstrate more Avalon concepts.
>
>I don't really know what I am asking for but, eventually it would be nice to see a server with more than one component involved, logging and configuration.  It would be nice to see a server that manages all of the components itself, one that uses a simple component manager, one that pulls in some Excalibur stuff (component manager/component handler), one that does ????? (more help needed here)
>
Phoenix is realy your beast you know.  Having said that it is not 
uncommon for a newbie to reject parts of Avalon for various reasons...

>While I want to start out with a very simple example, I also want to see it evolve smoothly as more and more concepts are added.  Since I am working at this from the wrong direction (I am trying to build something and I know nothing about the tools I am using), I would like to throw something out there and have it criticized (constructive only please!).
>
Please make your learning endeavours Phoenix compatible.  Be insipred by 
the PDK or the HelloWorld demo (above).  Use Ant (if you are not already).

>Any thoughts?
>
None left unuttered at this stage.

- Paul


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Re: Example needed

[Peter Donald <pe...@apache.org>]

On Mon, 1 Apr 2002 22:47, Tony Thompson wrote:
> I looked at the examples and they still jump in much deeper than I wanted
> to start with.  I am getting the impression that maybe there is not a need
> to start as basic as I am proposing (?????).  I wanted to start just by
> demonstrating the concept of COP (as simple as it can be).  Too basic for
> most and probably not a very practical application but, an example none the
> less.  Am I the only one that feels there is a need for this?

Theres a need but as yet no one has got to it. It is a relatively simple 
thing to write but getting it all into the computer with correct formats and 
in an easily digestable form is a HUGE amount of work. 

-- 
Cheers,

Pete

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Re: Example needed

[Paul Hammant <Pa...@yahoo.com>]

Tony,

>Paul,
>
>Maybe I should clarify a few points.  The echo server that I am talking about is just a simple example that I was hoping could easily demonstrate some very basic Avalon functionality.  It will listen on some configurable socket for some request and echo it back to the client.  That was really all I intended.  Maybe it is too basic but the idea was to demonstrate Avalon not implement some huge server.  They are intended as examples only and my intention is to make something that the Avalon team would deem fit to include as examples.
>
Understand.  I thought you meant the RFC specified 'echo'.

>You were right.  I was not talking about Phoenix.  Unless I am mistaken, Phoenix seems to be several steps beyond where I was planning to start.  It would be a good idea to evolve it to a Phoenix example but, when you reach that level of sophistication, the example may be too simple.
>
Well then < devils advocate mode = on > Avalon Framework and Avalon 
Excalibur are not necessarily just for servers.  They are equally 
applicable to client side code.

>I looked at the examples and they still jump in much deeper than I wanted to start with.  I am getting the impression that maybe there is not a need to start as basic as I am proposing (?????).  I wanted to start just by demonstrating the concept of COP (as simple as it can be).  Too basic for most and probably not a very practical application but, an example none the less.  Am I the only one that feels there is a need for this?
>
I had kind thought that the PDK showed the simplest of all servers that 
used Avalon concepts.  Next to that, I had thought that the HelloWorld 
demo was also quite simple....

I guess my education will continue upon seeing the product of your 
labors.  We will of course integrate simple demos to the codebase if 
suitably attributed as Apache license...

Regards,

- Paul


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