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Posted to user@lenya.apache.org by Jorden Woods <jo...@paradigmsgroup.com> on 2004/09/28 20:12:51 UTC
Roadmap
In the past I have worked with quite a few large CMSs like Bricolage,
Interwoven, Vignette, Documentum, etc.(over 7 years exp.).
I have been working with Lenya for the past 10 days and like the fact that it
is intuitive, "light", and multilingual.
It is clearly a 'work in progress', though, and I have some questions about the
roadmap.
Specifically, there are quite a few capabilities (features) that could be added
to Lenya to make it more user friendly.
Please let me know which, if any, of the following features are on the near
term roadmap:
o GUI for setting up new projects
o GUI for configuring and managing workflows
o GUI for creating, managing, applying doctypes (information architecture)
o GUI-based tools for template creation
o "mypage" GUI showing activities outstanding for each user
o Project management GUI screens for managing users/projects
o Alerts management screens for setting and receiving notifications
o GUI for publishing/staging projects
Also, if any of these should be added to the enhancement list please let me
know.
Cheers,
Jorden.
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Andreas Kuckartz wrote:
> Andreas Hartmann wrote about the view which currently dominates the Apache Lenya
> community. But please note that this is about human resources and priorities. If
> people are particularly interested in improving the GUI aspects than certainly
> nobody would oppose such efforts.
Exactly, thanks for the remark.
I guess nobody would mind having more GUI components in
Lenya, but there must be someone who implements and
maintains them.
-- Andreas
>
> Cheers,
> Andreas
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Andreas Hartmann" <an...@apache.org>
> To: <le...@cocoon.apache.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2004 9:30 PM
> Subject: Re: Roadmap
>
>
>
>>Jorden Woods wrote:
>>
>>>In the past I have worked with quite a few large CMSs like Bricolage,
>>>Interwoven, Vignette, Documentum, etc.(over 7 years exp.).
>>>
>>>I have been working with Lenya for the past 10 days and like the fact that
>
> it
>
>>>is intuitive, "light", and multilingual.
>>>
>>>It is clearly a 'work in progress', though, and I have some questions about
>
> the
>
>>>roadmap.
>>>
>>>Specifically, there are quite a few capabilities (features) that could be
>
> added
>
>>>to Lenya to make it more user friendly.
>>
>>
>>A general remark from my point of view:
>>
>>Lenya is a content management framework, which means it
>>should be suitable for implementing a big number of
>>different CMS-/publishing-related applications. We focus
>>on flexibility rather than providing components for end
>>user GUIs in the Lenya core.
>>
>>In our experiences, the requirements for GUI layers are
>>far too different as that we could provide a general "one fits
>>all" solution in the core. That's not what Lenya focuses on.
>>We could add GUI components to choose from, but the Lenya
>>community has limited human resources and therefore other
>>things which are necessary for industrial strength and stability
>>and which are needed by all Lenya-based applications get a
>>higher priority (repository integration, transactions, a solid
>>basis for asset and meta data management, ...).
>>
>>Setting up specific GUIs is mostly up to the integrator
>>(the developer who implements a CMS using the Lenya CMF).
>>Since there are many existing Cocoon components for typical
>>publishing usecases, this shouldn't be a problem in most cases.
>>
>>-- Andreas
>>
>>
>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jorden Woods wrote:
> Andreas Kuckartz <A.Kuckartz <at> ping.de> writes:
>
>
>>Andreas Hartmann wrote about the view which currently dominates the Apache
>
> Lenya
>
>>community. But please note that this is about human resources and priorities.
>
> If
>
>>people are particularly interested in improving the GUI aspects than certainly
>>nobody would oppose such efforts.
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Andreas
>
>
> Thank you for the clear responses. The Lenya philosophy is quite clear. From
> your responses I see a vision of Lenya as an engine on top of which a team
> could build a custom UI. So Lenya could be seen as providing powerful backend
> functionality (a platform)on top of which a team could develop a custom product
> suited to its needs.
>
> Is this accurate?
From my point of view, yes :)
-- Andreas
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Jorden Woods <jo...@paradigmsgroup.com>.
Andreas Kuckartz <A.Kuckartz <at> ping.de> writes:
>
> Andreas Hartmann wrote about the view which currently dominates the Apache
Lenya
> community. But please note that this is about human resources and priorities.
If
> people are particularly interested in improving the GUI aspects than certainly
> nobody would oppose such efforts.
>
> Cheers,
> Andreas
Thank you for the clear responses. The Lenya philosophy is quite clear. From
your responses I see a vision of Lenya as an engine on top of which a team
could build a custom UI. So Lenya could be seen as providing powerful backend
functionality (a platform)on top of which a team could develop a custom product
suited to its needs.
Is this accurate?
It is also good to know that you are open to extending the GUI since this will
make it easier to use/modify :-).
Cheers,
Jorden.
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jann Forrer wrote:
> On Tue, 28 Sep 2004, Andreas Kuckartz wrote:
>
>
>>Andreas Hartmann wrote about the view which currently dominates the Apache Lenya
>>community. But please note that this is about human resources and priorities. If
>>people are particularly interested in improving the GUI aspects than certainly
>>nobody would oppose such efforts.
>>
>
>
> There is another things to rembember:
> As far as i know a lot of the gui stuff is in the core.
"A lot" translates to the stuff which is at the moment
common for all publications (admin area, site area).
> That means if I
> want to enhance existing guis i have to patch lenya core classes.
Usually the GUI should be implemented using XSLT and CSS.
In this case, overriding is supported by the fallback
concept - patching should not be necessary. If it is, then
it's a bug :)
> But
> what happens if lenya come up with a new major release. In that case i
> have to check all my patches in order to ensure that my "special" gui
> will work with the new release too.
Major releases are not bound to backwards compatibility, so
the answer is "yes". But this applies to everything, including
publications. I guess we have to provide a upgrade-how-to
when releasing 1.4.
-- Andreas
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Jann Forrer <ja...@id.unizh.ch>.
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004, Andreas Kuckartz wrote:
> Andreas Hartmann wrote about the view which currently dominates the Apache Lenya
> community. But please note that this is about human resources and priorities. If
> people are particularly interested in improving the GUI aspects than certainly
> nobody would oppose such efforts.
>
There is another things to rembember:
As far as i know a lot of the gui stuff is in the core. That means if I
want to enhance existing guis i have to patch lenya core classes. But
what happens if lenya come up with a new major release. In that case i
have to check all my patches in order to ensure that my "special" gui
will work with the new release too.
Jann
> Cheers,
> Andreas
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Andreas Hartmann" <an...@apache.org>
> To: <le...@cocoon.apache.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2004 9:30 PM
> Subject: Re: Roadmap
>
>
> > Jorden Woods wrote:
> > > In the past I have worked with quite a few large CMSs like Bricolage,
> > > Interwoven, Vignette, Documentum, etc.(over 7 years exp.).
> > >
> > > I have been working with Lenya for the past 10 days and like the fact that
> it
> > > is intuitive, "light", and multilingual.
> > >
> > > It is clearly a 'work in progress', though, and I have some questions about
> the
> > > roadmap.
> > >
> > > Specifically, there are quite a few capabilities (features) that could be
> added
> > > to Lenya to make it more user friendly.
> >
> >
> > A general remark from my point of view:
> >
> > Lenya is a content management framework, which means it
> > should be suitable for implementing a big number of
> > different CMS-/publishing-related applications. We focus
> > on flexibility rather than providing components for end
> > user GUIs in the Lenya core.
> >
> > In our experiences, the requirements for GUI layers are
> > far too different as that we could provide a general "one fits
> > all" solution in the core. That's not what Lenya focuses on.
> > We could add GUI components to choose from, but the Lenya
> > community has limited human resources and therefore other
> > things which are necessary for industrial strength and stability
> > and which are needed by all Lenya-based applications get a
> > higher priority (repository integration, transactions, a solid
> > basis for asset and meta data management, ...).
> >
> > Setting up specific GUIs is mostly up to the integrator
> > (the developer who implements a CMS using the Lenya CMF).
> > Since there are many existing Cocoon components for typical
> > publishing usecases, this shouldn't be a problem in most cases.
> >
> > -- Andreas
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: lenya-user-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: lenya-user-help@cocoon.apache.org
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: lenya-user-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: lenya-user-help@cocoon.apache.org
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------
Jann Forrer
Informatikdienste
Universität Zürich
Winterthurerstr. 190
CH-8057 Zuerich
oooO mail: jann.forrer@id.unizh.ch
( ) phone: +41 1 63 56772
\ ( fax: +41 1 63 54505
\_) http://www.id.unizh.ch
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Andreas Kuckartz <A....@ping.de>.
Andreas Hartmann wrote about the view which currently dominates the Apache Lenya
community. But please note that this is about human resources and priorities. If
people are particularly interested in improving the GUI aspects than certainly
nobody would oppose such efforts.
Cheers,
Andreas
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andreas Hartmann" <an...@apache.org>
To: <le...@cocoon.apache.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2004 9:30 PM
Subject: Re: Roadmap
> Jorden Woods wrote:
> > In the past I have worked with quite a few large CMSs like Bricolage,
> > Interwoven, Vignette, Documentum, etc.(over 7 years exp.).
> >
> > I have been working with Lenya for the past 10 days and like the fact that
it
> > is intuitive, "light", and multilingual.
> >
> > It is clearly a 'work in progress', though, and I have some questions about
the
> > roadmap.
> >
> > Specifically, there are quite a few capabilities (features) that could be
added
> > to Lenya to make it more user friendly.
>
>
> A general remark from my point of view:
>
> Lenya is a content management framework, which means it
> should be suitable for implementing a big number of
> different CMS-/publishing-related applications. We focus
> on flexibility rather than providing components for end
> user GUIs in the Lenya core.
>
> In our experiences, the requirements for GUI layers are
> far too different as that we could provide a general "one fits
> all" solution in the core. That's not what Lenya focuses on.
> We could add GUI components to choose from, but the Lenya
> community has limited human resources and therefore other
> things which are necessary for industrial strength and stability
> and which are needed by all Lenya-based applications get a
> higher priority (repository integration, transactions, a solid
> basis for asset and meta data management, ...).
>
> Setting up specific GUIs is mostly up to the integrator
> (the developer who implements a CMS using the Lenya CMF).
> Since there are many existing Cocoon components for typical
> publishing usecases, this shouldn't be a problem in most cases.
>
> -- Andreas
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: lenya-user-unsubscribe@cocoon.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: lenya-user-help@cocoon.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jorden Woods wrote:
> In the past I have worked with quite a few large CMSs like Bricolage,
> Interwoven, Vignette, Documentum, etc.(over 7 years exp.).
>
> I have been working with Lenya for the past 10 days and like the fact that it
> is intuitive, "light", and multilingual.
>
> It is clearly a 'work in progress', though, and I have some questions about the
> roadmap.
>
> Specifically, there are quite a few capabilities (features) that could be added
> to Lenya to make it more user friendly.
A general remark from my point of view:
Lenya is a content management framework, which means it
should be suitable for implementing a big number of
different CMS-/publishing-related applications. We focus
on flexibility rather than providing components for end
user GUIs in the Lenya core.
In our experiences, the requirements for GUI layers are
far too different as that we could provide a general "one fits
all" solution in the core. That's not what Lenya focuses on.
We could add GUI components to choose from, but the Lenya
community has limited human resources and therefore other
things which are necessary for industrial strength and stability
and which are needed by all Lenya-based applications get a
higher priority (repository integration, transactions, a solid
basis for asset and meta data management, ...).
Setting up specific GUIs is mostly up to the integrator
(the developer who implements a CMS using the Lenya CMF).
Since there are many existing Cocoon components for typical
publishing usecases, this shouldn't be a problem in most cases.
-- Andreas
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jorden Woods wrote:
> In the past I have worked with quite a few large CMSs like Bricolage,
> Interwoven, Vignette, Documentum, etc.(over 7 years exp.).
>
> I have been working with Lenya for the past 10 days and like the fact that it
> is intuitive, "light", and multilingual.
>
> It is clearly a 'work in progress', though, and I have some questions about the
> roadmap.
>
> Specifically, there are quite a few capabilities (features) that could be added
> to Lenya to make it more user friendly.
>
> Please let me know which, if any, of the following features are on the near
> term roadmap:
>
My personal feeling what could be supported
-- very unlikely
?? maybe
++ very likely
> o GUI for setting up new projects
-- (incredibly complex)
> o GUI for configuring and managing workflows
?? (state machine editor, low prio)
> o GUI for creating, managing, applying doctypes (information architecture)
?? (far away, first step would be doctype packages)
> o GUI-based tools for template creation
-- (would decrease flexibility)
> o "mypage" GUI showing activities outstanding for each user
++ (will probably be there in Lenya 1.4:
metadata queries to get custom workflow/AC-based
reports about documents+assets)
> o Project management GUI screens for managing users/projects
User management already exists
What do you mean by "project managment"?
> o Alerts management screens for setting and receiving notifications
++ (more sophisiticated notification component was already
proposed on the mailing list, maybe in 1.4)
> o GUI for publishing/staging projects
What do you mean here?
You can add file each of your feature request as an enhancement
bug. But then it would be nice to have a detailed description
about the functionality. It is always a good idea to write a
proposal in the "Proposals and Ideas" section at
http://wiki.apache.org/cocoon-lenya/. There you could also
add some ASCII art and upload some GUI sketches.
-- Andreas
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Re: Roadmap
Posted by Andreas Kuckartz <A....@ping.de>.
Jorden Woods wrote:
> o "mypage" GUI showing activities outstanding for each user
This enhancement request already exists:
Overview of documents in a certain workflow state
http://nagoya.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=28667
But someone has to implement it!
Cheers,
Andreas
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