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Posted to general@incubator.apache.org by Niclas Hedhman <ni...@hedhman.org> on 2007/04/03 10:27:08 UTC
OpenEJB as TLP [was;[proposal] OpenEJB Graduation Proposal]
On Tuesday 03 April 2007 12:19, Brett Porter wrote:
> The OpenEJB PPMC would like to take feedback on the following
> graduation proposal before putting it to a vote by the incubator PMC.
Before voting officially on this, I would like to hear from the OpenEJB and
OpenJPA communities, of the apparent overlap in scope and whether we will see
some form of convergence between the projects has been discussed, and if so
what the conclusions are.
Cheers
--
Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer
I live here; http://tinyurl.com/2qq9er
I work here; http://tinyurl.com/2ymelc
I relax here; http://tinyurl.com/2cgsug
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Re: OpenEJB as TLP [was;[proposal] OpenEJB Graduation Proposal]
Posted by Craig L Russell <Cr...@Sun.COM>.
Hi Niclas,
On Apr 3, 2007, at 1:27 AM, Niclas Hedhman wrote:
>
> On Tuesday 03 April 2007 12:19, Brett Porter wrote:
>> The OpenEJB PPMC would like to take feedback on the following
>> graduation proposal before putting it to a vote by the incubator PMC.
>
> Before voting officially on this, I would like to hear from the
> OpenEJB and
> OpenJPA communities, of the apparent overlap in scope and whether
> we will see
> some form of convergence between the projects has been discussed,
> and if so
> what the conclusions are.
I see the OpenEJB and OpenJPA projects as complementary with no overlap.
Craig
>
> Cheers
> --
> Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer
>
> I live here; http://tinyurl.com/2qq9er
> I work here; http://tinyurl.com/2ymelc
> I relax here; http://tinyurl.com/2cgsug
>
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
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>
Craig Russell
DB PMC, OpenJPA PPMC
clr@apache.org http://db.apache.org/jdo
Re: OpenEJB as TLP [was;[proposal] OpenEJB Graduation Proposal]
Posted by Jacek Laskowski <ja...@laskowski.net.pl>.
On 4/3/07, Niclas Hedhman <ni...@hedhman.org> wrote:
> IIUIC, both Hibernate and Kodo builds EJB3 & (Hibernate|JDO) on top of the JPA
> layers in the same product.
Hibernate != EJB 3.0 whereas JBoss AS 4/5 + EJB 3.0 profile == EJB 3.0.
Hibernate EntityManager is a JPA provider as Apache OpenJPA and
TopLink Essentials and Cayenne partially. Hibernate is a foundation
for Hibernate EntityManager.
AFAIK, Kodo is a commercial product based on OpenJPA + some JDO stuff.
So, no EJB 3.0 exists in the products mentioned - Hibernate and Kodo.
EJB 3.0 is more than (merely ;-)) JPA.
> So you are saying that somewhere down the line we could have a "ménage à
> trois" TLP constellation of OpenJPA -> OpenEJB -> Geronimo?
Sort of. Geronimo is a Java EE application server, so with some work,
one could think of any EJB 3.0 container embedded in Geronimo
(OpenEJB, EasyBeans from ObjectWeb, JBoss EJB, etc.). Another question
is how these EJB 3.0 containers support the spec, esp. JPA. Whether
they rely on their own containers or leverage what's available on the
market. OpenEJB relies on OpenJPA. Since JPA introduces a concept of
"outside the container", i.e. there's no need to have a full blown
application server to run JPA apps, I could easily imagine a scenario
where OpenJPA -> Geronimo or OpenJPA alone. All mixtures are possible,
even partial EJB 3.0 support without JPA.
Thanks for the phrase 'ménage à trois'! Never heard of it.
> Ok, cool... I mostly want to hear that there is a cross-community
> communication and collaboration going on, and the ties are in healthy
> condition.
Sure! You ask we provide ;-) Take a look at the OpenJPA archives where
Dain (Apache OpenEJB/Geronimo committer) cooperate with OpenJPA
community. There are many JPA stuff in OpenEJB and Geronimo archives,
too.
I think it's very healthy, but there can be more and will be. AFAIUI,
the only factor that prevent us from extending our collaboration is
time. OpenEJB'd been lucky lately and the team of committers grew up a
little. We expect more to come once Geronimo 2.0 hits the shelves.
Jacek
--
Jacek Laskowski
http://www.JacekLaskowski.pl
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Re: OpenEJB as TLP [was;[proposal] OpenEJB Graduation Proposal]
Posted by Niclas Hedhman <ni...@hedhman.org>.
On Tuesday 03 April 2007 17:23, Jacek Laskowski wrote:
> I wonder what you meant by 'apparent overlap'.
IIUIC, both Hibernate and Kodo builds EJB3 & (Hibernate|JDO) on top of the JPA
layers in the same product.
> EJB 3.0 spec is made of two parts - EJB 3.0 Core and JPA. The former is
> what OpenEJB aims for whereas the latter is what OpenJPA takes care of.
> They're complimentary.
Yeah, I kind of know that.
> Moreover OpenEJB CMP 2.1 is laid on OpenJPA, that shows
> our relationship and cooperation. It's not that Apache Geronimo is the
> place they can live together, but it's an excellent RI for their
> promises ;-) In its default distro - Apache Geronimo 2 provides EJB
> 3.0 via OpenEJB 3.0-SNAPSHOT, which in turn provides JPA via OpenJPA
> 0.9.6. I couldn't think of any better relationship and partnership and
> /* whatever */ than it's happening now.
So you are saying that somewhere down the line we could have a "ménage à
trois" TLP constellation of OpenJPA -> OpenEJB -> Geronimo?
Ok, cool... I mostly want to hear that there is a cross-community
communication and collaboration going on, and the ties are in healthy
condition.
Cheers
--
Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer
I live here; http://tinyurl.com/2qq9er
I work here; http://tinyurl.com/2ymelc
I relax here; http://tinyurl.com/2cgsug
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Re: OpenEJB as TLP [was;[proposal] OpenEJB Graduation Proposal]
Posted by Jacek Laskowski <ja...@laskowski.net.pl>.
On 4/3/07, Niclas Hedhman <ni...@hedhman.org> wrote:
> Before voting officially on this, I would like to hear from the OpenEJB and
> OpenJPA communities, of the apparent overlap in scope and whether we will see
> some form of convergence between the projects has been discussed, and if so
> what the conclusions are.
Hi Niclas,
I wonder what you meant by 'apparent overlap'. EJB 3.0 spec is made of
two parts - EJB 3.0 Core and JPA. The former is what OpenEJB aims for
whereas the latter is what OpenJPA takes care of. They're
complimentary. Moreover OpenEJB CMP 2.1 is laid on OpenJPA, that shows
our relationship and cooperation. It's not that Apache Geronimo is the
place they can live together, but it's an excellent RI for their
promises ;-) In its default distro - Apache Geronimo 2 provides EJB
3.0 via OpenEJB 3.0-SNAPSHOT, which in turn provides JPA via OpenJPA
0.9.6. I couldn't think of any better relationship and partnership and
/* whatever */ than it's happening now.
(I hope I haven't messed it up too much and am not too biased to not
notice any obvious similarities we haven't leveraged yet).
Jacek
Apache OpenEJB and Apache Geronimo (P)PMC member and committer
Apache OpenJPA user/lurker
--
Jacek Laskowski
http://www.JacekLaskowski.pl
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