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Posted to dev@lenya.apache.org by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org> on 2009/02/03 14:35:21 UTC
Re: Docu publication redesign
Hi Jürgen,
do you know what's the current state of our design contest venture?
Is there anything we can do? I could spend a bit of time helping.
TIA!
BTW, is it OK for you at all to keep the lead in this matter?
-- Andreas
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Hi lenya devs
>
>
> I'm sorry that it took me ages to follow up on the discussion about
> «Lenya redesign considerations». I was busy on other projects at work.
>
>
> To proceed with a redesign I suggest the following steps:
> ---------------------------------------------------------
>
> - Start with a redesign of the documentation publication (maybe do a
> separate redesig of the default publication later depending on the
> question whether to merge the two pubs).
>
> > For the redesign I setup a folder docupub-redesign in sandbox/design;
> it currently contains a index.html file with a style switcher (cookie
> based); please give it a try by opening index.html and let me know if
> you find it practical as a starting point for webdevelopers
>
> - I suggest to add the photoshop / fireworks templates to the same folder
>
> - When the redesign package is finished provide a zip-File for download
>
> - Put a description about the idea on the lenya website
>
> - Announce the redesign contest on the lenya website and in design /
> webdeveloper blogs forums etc.
>
>
> Andreas mentioned that the xhtml structure will have to be well thought
> through in order to give the designers sufficient freedom in positioning
> etc.. My feeling is, that the currently used xhtml is at quite a good
> niveau in that respect. Some design ideas however might require some
> restructuring - I'm not shure yet how to handle these - maybe we can ask
> the designers to use the photoshop / fireworks approach and write about
> the problems they had with the xhtml provided.
>
>
> I took the code (unchanged) for the styleswitcher from
> http://www.alistapart.com/articles/alternate/
> I'm aware that this is probably against the licence policy; any
> suggestions here?
>
>
> Thanks a lot for feedback
>
> Jürgen
>
>
>
>
> null-oder-eins GmbH Zürich
> web & graphic design
>
> www.null-oder-eins.ch
>
> ragaller@apache.org
> Skype: callto://ragaller
--
Andreas Hartmann, CTO
BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Thorsten Scherler schrieb:
> On Sun, 2009-04-19 at 11:01 +0200, Jürgen Ragaller wrote:
>> Hello Thorsten
>>
>> Am 01.04.2009 um 12:20 schrieb Thorsten Scherler:
> ...
>>> Why do they have to be subscribed before?
>> I'm not shure if we talk about the same thing here.
>> The one year subscription is not necessary to participants in the
>> contest (they will submit their design pictures in a bugzilla entry)
>> but rather for the voters.
>>
>> The «one year» rule should ensure that there is no way to quickly
>> subscribe and vote but rather be envolved a bit longer before gaining
>> the right to vote.
>> I suggest to stick to the above mailing ist poster definition.
>
> Thanks for the clarification Jürgen. I am not sure about the voting
> part. We have clear guidelines on which votes counts for an official
> vote (all PMC members have a binding vote).
I'm not sure if these guidelines should apply here. The design contest
is rather an informal act that is not covered by the project guidelines.
> In the case of the redesign (and actually any other case) we normally
> listen to all votes.
Do you think that the votes of people without any merit should have the
same weight as the votes of mailing list contributors and committers?
IMO the star system is a good way to honor the merit people have earned.
> The problem I see is how to control this one year rule? Some people are
> subscribed years without posting, other via newsgroups, etc..
The rule applies only to people who posted at least one mail during the
period of one year.
-- Andreas
--
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BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@juntadeandalucia.es>.
On Sun, 2009-04-19 at 11:01 +0200, Jürgen Ragaller wrote:
> Hello Thorsten
>
> Am 01.04.2009 um 12:20 schrieb Thorsten Scherler:
...
> > Why do they have to be subscribed before?
>
> I'm not shure if we talk about the same thing here.
> The one year subscription is not necessary to participants in the
> contest (they will submit their design pictures in a bugzilla entry)
> but rather for the voters.
>
> The «one year» rule should ensure that there is no way to quickly
> subscribe and vote but rather be envolved a bit longer before gaining
> the right to vote.
> I suggest to stick to the above mailing ist poster definition.
Thanks for the clarification Jürgen. I am not sure about the voting
part. We have clear guidelines on which votes counts for an official
vote (all PMC members have a binding vote).
In the case of the redesign (and actually any other case) we normally
listen to all votes.
The problem I see is how to control this one year rule? Some people are
subscribed years without posting, other via newsgroups, etc..
IMO everybody should vote.
salu2
--
Thorsten Scherler <thorsten.at.apache.org>
Open Source Java <consulting, training and solutions>
Sociedad Andaluza para el Desarrollo de la Sociedad
de la Información, S.A.U. (SADESI)
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hello Thorsten
Am 01.04.2009 um 12:20 schrieb Thorsten Scherler:
> On Wed, 2009-04-01 at 11:37 +0200, Andreas Hartmann wrote:
> ...
>> BTW, what are your opinions on the "mailing list poster" definition?
>>
>> "Persons who posted at least one message to any Lenya mailing list
>> during the period of one year prior to the start of the contest"
>>
>> Is this OK for everybody? (I sent another mail some days ago)
>
> I must admit that I do not see the need for it. If a person just
> subscribes to the list and post their proposals that is fine with me.
> Why do they have to be subscribed before?
I'm not shure if we talk about the same thing here.
The one year subscription is not necessary to participants in the
contest (they will submit their design pictures in a bugzilla entry)
but rather for the voters.
The «one year» rule should ensure that there is no way to quickly
subscribe and vote but rather be envolved a bit longer before gaining
the right to vote.
I suggest to stick to the above mailing ist poster definition.
Jürgen
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org>.
On Wed, 2009-04-01 at 11:37 +0200, Andreas Hartmann wrote:
...
> BTW, what are your opinions on the "mailing list poster" definition?
>
> "Persons who posted at least one message to any Lenya mailing list
> during the period of one year prior to the start of the contest"
>
> Is this OK for everybody? (I sent another mail some days ago)
I must admit that I do not see the need for it. If a person just
subscribes to the list and post their proposals that is fine with me.
Why do they have to be subscribed before?
salu2
--
Thorsten Scherler <thorsten.at.apache.org>
Open Source <consulting, training and solutions>
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Am 01.04.2009 um 11:37 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>>
>> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>>> Am 30.03.2009 um 17:04 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> IMO this is a good idea. Would it be possible to use the standard
>>>>>> Lenya logo (incl. the brand name "apache" and the feather)? I
>>>>>> think there should be only one version of the logo (the "built
>>>>>> with" is a compromise because of the narrow column width).
>>>>> You're right. We should use one Lenya logo. What about promoting
>>>>> the design contest as an addition to the Logo - see my latest
>>>>> suggestion. I got carried away a bit with the previous suggestion
>>>>> ;-). Logo-Design is a nice thing...
>>>>
>>>> I like this one better than the previous one. I'm not sure how
>>>> attached you are to your creation
>>>> – a friend of mine is a designer and familiar with logos and such
>>>> things, shall I ask her if she'd like to make another suggestion?
>>> Thats fine I'm open to more suggestions.
>>
>> alright – I asked her to come up with something until Saturday, April
>> 4. I'll go on vacation on Sunday, but I could publish the
>> announcements (or send the requests) on/to the sites I mentioned on
>> Saturday. The problem is that we don't know yet what the banner will
>> look like, so maybe I should rather send the banner to the list and
>> let you start with the announcements (with whatever banner you agree on).
>
> Any news on the banner design?
No, I'm sorry for the delay – my friend didn't come up with something
until now, so from my POV we can proceed with what we have now.
-- Andreas
--
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BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hi devs
I added a draft of the announcement for the design contest, and
modified the dates.
https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
Jürgen
Am 26.04.2009 um 11:18 schrieb Jürgen Ragaller:
> Hello Devs
>
>
> Am 21.04.2009 um 23:05 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
>> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>>
>>> Any news on the banner design?
>>
>> I played a bit with Inkscape tonight. The PNG version is included
>> below Jürgen's banner. I have also attached the SVG version.
>
>
> Lenya devs: what are your opinions about the design contest banners?
>
> the green or red/brown design?
>
> See here:
> https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> Jürgen
>
>
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Hello Devs
>
>
> Am 21.04.2009 um 23:05 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
>> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>>
>>> Any news on the banner design?
>>
>> I played a bit with Inkscape tonight. The PNG version is included
>> below Jürgen's banner. I have also attached the SVG version.
>
>
> Lenya devs: what are your opinions about the design contest banners?
>
> the green or red/brown design?
>
> See here:
> https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
My designer friend finally found the time to create a banner, I added it
to the page. It says "Web Design Contest", though – if we choose this
variant we should probably change it to "Website Design Contest".
-- Andreas
--
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BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Hello Devs
>
>
> Am 21.04.2009 um 23:05 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
>> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>>
>>> Any news on the banner design?
>>
>> I played a bit with Inkscape tonight. The PNG version is included
>> below Jürgen's banner. I have also attached the SVG version.
>
>
> Lenya devs: what are your opinions about the design contest banners?
>
> the green or red/brown design?
BTW, I'm affected by deuteranopia [1], so the colors are more or less a
shot in the dark :) If you like the other aspects of the design, feel
free to change the colors.
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deuteranopia#Dichromacy
-- Andreas
> See here:
> https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
>
>
>
> Thanks!
>
> Jürgen
--
Andreas Hartmann, CTO
BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Design Contest: Request for Review (was: Docu publication redesign)
Posted by Rudolf Korhummel <ru...@korhummel.de>.
Am 20.05.2009 um 17:07 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>> Hi Andreas
>> Am 20.05.2009 um 14:22 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>> [...]
>>> Shall we postpone the deadline? At the moment it's June 30, maybe
>>> we should set it to mid- or end-July?
>> +1 I would say end of july.
>
> OK, I added one month to all dates.
> From my POV the page is ready to be published and announced.
+1
Rudolf
>
>
>
> @all: Please review the contest page. TIA!
>
> https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
>
> -- Andreas
>
>
> --
> Andreas Hartmann, CTO
> BeCompany GmbH
> http://www.becompany.ch
> Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
>
>
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Design Contest: Request for Review (was: Docu publication redesign)
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Hi Andreas
>
> Am 20.05.2009 um 14:22 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
> [...]
>
>> Shall we postpone the deadline? At the moment it's June 30, maybe we
>> should set it to mid- or end-July?
>
> +1 I would say end of july.
OK, I added one month to all dates.
From my POV the page is ready to be published and announced.
@all: Please review the contest page. TIA!
https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
-- Andreas
--
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BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hi Andreas
Am 20.05.2009 um 14:22 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
[...]
> https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
>
> Shall we postpone the deadline? At the moment it's June 30, maybe we
> should set it to mid- or end-July?
+1 I would say end of july.
Jürgen
null-oder-eins GmbH Zürich
web & graphic design
www.null-oder-eins.ch
ragaller@apache.org
Skype: callto://ragaller
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Hi Andres
>
> Am 15.05.2009 um 10:34 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
> [...]
>
>> Or shall I ask her to change it?
>
> yes, if that's possible
Done:
https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
Shall we postpone the deadline? At the moment it's June 30, maybe we
should set it to mid- or end-July?
-- Andreas
--
Andreas Hartmann, CTO
BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hi Andres
Am 15.05.2009 um 10:34 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
[...]
> Or shall I ask her to change it?
yes, if that's possible
Thanks
Jürgen
null-oder-eins GmbH Zürich
web & graphic design
www.null-oder-eins.ch
ragaller@apache.org
Skype: callto://ragaller
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Hi Jürgen,
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Am 14.05.2009 um 23:46 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
>> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>>> Hello Devs
>>> Am 21.04.2009 um 23:05 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>>>> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>>>>
>>>>> Any news on the banner design?
[…]
> I opt for the design of Your friend.
yes, I think this is the most professional one. The only minor issue is
that it says "Web Design Contest" instead of "Website Design Contest".
Can we live with that? Or shall I ask her to change it? Unfortunately I
don't have an editable version of the banner.
-- Andreas
--
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BeCompany GmbH
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Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Good morning everybody
Am 14.05.2009 um 23:46 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>> Hello Devs
>> Am 21.04.2009 um 23:05 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>>> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>>>
>>>> Any news on the banner design?
>>>
>>> I played a bit with Inkscape tonight. The PNG version is included
>>> below Jürgen's banner. I have also attached the SVG version.
>> Lenya devs: what are your opinions about the design contest banners?
>
> Any opinions here?
>
>
> Maybe none of the banners meets our high quality requirements :)
I kinda got stuck a bit in the design process - I must confess that
I'm not such a big fan of the logo itself; so my banner designs tend
to move away from it; the result is then somewhat inconsequent. I
agree with you, that the logo should be untouched. Changing it would
be a different story.
I opt for the design of Your friend. But yours would be fine too; the
colours look good there.
Jürgen
null-oder-eins GmbH Zürich
web & graphic design
www.null-oder-eins.ch
ragaller@apache.org
Skype: callto://ragaller
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Hello Devs
>
>
> Am 21.04.2009 um 23:05 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
>> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>>
>>> Any news on the banner design?
>>
>> I played a bit with Inkscape tonight. The PNG version is included
>> below Jürgen's banner. I have also attached the SVG version.
>
>
> Lenya devs: what are your opinions about the design contest banners?
Any opinions here?
Maybe none of the banners meets our high quality requirements :)
How about publishing the announcement without a banner? Or we just use
Jürgen's version, after all he came up with the idea.
-- Andreas
--
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BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hello Devs
Am 21.04.2009 um 23:05 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>
>> Any news on the banner design?
>
> I played a bit with Inkscape tonight. The PNG version is included
> below Jürgen's banner. I have also attached the SVG version.
Lenya devs: what are your opinions about the design contest banners?
the green or red/brown design?
See here:
https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
Thanks!
Jürgen
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Any news on the banner design?
I played a bit with Inkscape tonight. The PNG version is included below
Jürgen's banner. I have also attached the SVG version.
-- Andreas
--
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BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hi
Sorry for another delay - I am currently under some pressure at work.
And have only limited time for Lenya - I wish I could contribute more.
If things move on to snailish and someone would like to take over the
lead on this one - that would be fine with me.
Am 01.04.2009 um 11:37 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
> Hi Jürgen,
>
> Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>> Am 30.03.2009 um 17:04 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> IMO this is a good idea. Would it be possible to use the
>>>>> standard Lenya logo (incl. the brand name "apache" and the
>>>>> feather)? I think there should be only one version of the logo
>>>>> (the "built with" is a compromise because of the narrow column
>>>>> width).
>>>> You're right. We should use one Lenya logo. What about promoting
>>>> the design contest as an addition to the Logo - see my latest
>>>> suggestion. I got carried away a bit with the previous
>>>> suggestion ;-). Logo-Design is a nice thing...
>>>
>>> I like this one better than the previous one. I'm not sure how
>>> attached you are to your creation
>>> – a friend of mine is a designer and familiar with logos and such
>>> things, shall I ask her if she'd like to make another suggestion?
>> Thats fine I'm open to more suggestions.
>
> alright – I asked her to come up with something until Saturday,
> April 4. I'll go on vacation on Sunday, but I could publish the
> announcements (or send the requests) on/to the sites I mentioned on
> Saturday. The problem is that we don't know yet what the banner will
> look like, so maybe I should rather send the banner to the list and
> let you start with the announcements (with whatever banner you agree
> on).
Any news on the banner design?
Next I'll recreate the bugzilla entry.
>
> BTW, what are your opinions on the "mailing list poster" definition?
>
> "Persons who posted at least one message to any Lenya mailing list
> during the period of one year prior to the start of the contest"
>
> Is this OK for everybody? (I sent another mail some days ago)
+1
Jürgen
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Hi Jürgen,
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Am 30.03.2009 um 17:04 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> IMO this is a good idea. Would it be possible to use the standard
>>>> Lenya logo (incl. the brand name "apache" and the feather)? I think
>>>> there should be only one version of the logo (the "built with" is a
>>>> compromise because of the narrow column width).
>>> You're right. We should use one Lenya logo. What about promoting the
>>> design contest as an addition to the Logo - see my latest suggestion.
>>> I got carried away a bit with the previous suggestion ;-).
>>> Logo-Design is a nice thing...
>>
>> I like this one better than the previous one. I'm not sure how
>> attached you are to your creation
>> – a friend of mine is a designer and familiar with logos and such
>> things, shall I ask her if she'd like to make another suggestion?
>
> Thats fine I'm open to more suggestions.
alright – I asked her to come up with something until Saturday, April 4.
I'll go on vacation on Sunday, but I could publish the announcements (or
send the requests) on/to the sites I mentioned on Saturday. The problem
is that we don't know yet what the banner will look like, so maybe I
should rather send the banner to the list and let you start with the
announcements (with whatever banner you agree on).
BTW, what are your opinions on the "mailing list poster" definition?
"Persons who posted at least one message to any Lenya mailing list
during the period of one year prior to the start of the contest"
Is this OK for everybody? (I sent another mail some days ago)
-- Andreas
--
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BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hello Andreas
Am 30.03.2009 um 17:04 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>>>>
>>>
>>> IMO this is a good idea. Would it be possible to use the standard
>>> Lenya logo (incl. the brand name "apache" and the feather)? I
>>> think there should be only one version of the logo (the "built
>>> with" is a compromise because of the narrow column width).
>> You're right. We should use one Lenya logo. What about promoting
>> the design contest as an addition to the Logo - see my latest
>> suggestion. I got carried away a bit with the previous
>> suggestion ;-). Logo-Design is a nice thing...
>
> I like this one better than the previous one. I'm not sure how
> attached you are to your creation
> – a friend of mine is a designer and familiar with logos and such
> things, shall I ask her if she'd like to make another suggestion?
Thats fine I'm open to more suggestions.
>
>>>> I added a bugzilla entry for the redesign contest
>>>> https://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=46887
>>>> - the description «bug»-description needs some changes...- I
>>>> doubt it is still possible to change it.
>>>> Does anyone now how to change a bug-description?
>> ? - I might have to delete the existing one and create a new one.
>
> Yes, I guess the only other option would be to ask the
> infrastructure team to give you permissions for the Bugzilla DB :)
I'll redo the incomplete bug entry.
>>>> My suggestion about the time line of the contest would be to end
>>>> it at the end of may.
>>>
>>> +1
>> I put in the dates for the timeline.
>> TODO:
>> - Promote the contest
>
> Unfortunately I can't change any wiki pages ATM (I contacted
> infra@), but I'd offer to publish the announcement on these sites:
>
> * Facebook: Apache Lenya group
> * cocoonforum.de
> * becompany.ch
> * cmswire.com (request)
> * apachenews.org (request)
> * Xing: Content Management group, Web-Design group
Cool - thanks for that!
Have a nice evening!
Jürgen
Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Hi Jürgen,
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
[…]
>>> To promote the Lenya Design Contest I created a visual element for
>>> the Contest (you can find it on the same page).
>>> What do you think about it?
>>
>> IMO this is a good idea. Would it be possible to use the standard
>> Lenya logo (incl. the brand name "apache" and the feather)? I think
>> there should be only one version of the logo (the "built with" is a
>> compromise because of the narrow column width).
>
> You're right. We should use one Lenya logo.
> What about promoting the design contest as an addition to the Logo - see
> my latest suggestion. I got carried away a bit with the previous
> suggestion ;-). Logo-Design is a nice thing...
I like this one better than the previous one. I'm not sure how attached
you are to your creation – a friend of mine is a designer and familiar
with logos and such things, shall I ask her if she'd like to make
another suggestion?
>>> I added a bugzilla entry for the redesign contest
>>> https://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=46887
>>> - the description «bug»-description needs some changes...- I doubt it
>>> is still possible to change it.
>>> Does anyone now how to change a bug-description?
>
> ? - I might have to delete the existing one and create a new one.
Yes, I guess the only other option would be to ask the infrastructure
team to give you permissions for the Bugzilla DB :)
>>> My suggestion about the time line of the contest would be to end it
>>> at the end of may.
>>
>> +1
>
> I put in the dates for the timeline.
>
> TODO:
> - Promote the contest
Unfortunately I can't change any wiki pages ATM (I contacted infra@),
but I'd offer to publish the announcement on these sites:
* Facebook: Apache Lenya group
* cocoonforum.de
* becompany.ch
* cmswire.com (request)
* apachenews.org (request)
* Xing: Content Management group, Web-Design group
-- Andreas
--
Andreas Hartmann, CTO
BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hello Andreas
Am 23.03.2009 um 11:42 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
[...]
> [...] I just changed some minor things (mostly typos).
Thanks a lot!
>
>> Can we delete the wiki page?
>
> +1, to avoid changes in the wrong place.
done.
>
>> To promote the Lenya Design Contest I created a visual element for
>> the Contest (you can find it on the same page).
>> What do you think about it?
>
> IMO this is a good idea. Would it be possible to use the standard
> Lenya logo (incl. the brand name "apache" and the feather)? I think
> there should be only one version of the logo (the "built with" is a
> compromise because of the narrow column width).
You're right. We should use one Lenya logo.
What about promoting the design contest as an addition to the Logo -
see my latest suggestion. I got carried away a bit with the previous
suggestion ;-). Logo-Design is a nice thing...
>
>
>> I added a bugzilla entry for the redesign contest
>> https://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=46887
>> - the description «bug»-description needs some changes...- I doubt
>> it is still possible to change it.
>> Does anyone now how to change a bug-description?
? - I might have to delete the existing one and create a new one.
>> My suggestion about the time line of the contest would be to end it
>> at the end of may.
>
> +1
I put in the dates for the timeline.
TODO:
- Promote the contest
- Write the announcement in the user mailing list
- cross fingers that there will be nice fresh design ideas!
Have a nice Sunday everybody!
Jürgen
Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Hi Jürgen,
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> I moved the content of the wiki page over to the lenya website (not yet
> published).
> https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
great, thanks! I just changed some minor things (mostly typos).
> Can we delete the wiki page?
+1, to avoid changes in the wrong place.
> To promote the Lenya Design Contest I created a visual element for the
> Contest (you can find it on the same page).
> What do you think about it?
IMO this is a good idea. Would it be possible to use the standard Lenya
logo (incl. the brand name "apache" and the feather)? I think there
should be only one version of the logo (the "built with" is a compromise
because of the narrow column width).
> I added a bugzilla entry for the redesign contest
> https://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=46887
> - the description «bug»-description needs some changes...- I doubt it is
> still possible to change it.
> Does anyone now how to change a bug-description?
>
> My suggestion about the time line of the contest would be to end it at
> the end of may.
+1
-- Andreas
--
Andreas Hartmann, CTO
BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hi devs!
I moved the content of the wiki page over to the lenya website (not
yet published).
https://lenya.zones.apache.org/cms/docu/authoring/community/docudesigncontest.html
Can we delete the wiki page?
To promote the Lenya Design Contest I created a visual element for the
Contest (you can find it on the same page).
What do you think about it?
I added a bugzilla entry for the redesign contest
https://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=46887
- the description «bug»-description needs some changes...- I doubt it
is still possible to change it.
Does anyone now how to change a bug-description?
My suggestion about the time line of the contest would be to end it at
the end of may.
So there is enough time to promote the event and to give the designers
some time to work.
Thanks for your feedbacks and have a nice Sunday!
Jürgen
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hello Andreas
Am 11.03.2009 um 10:01 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
>
> * Provide the logo as download for those not familiar with SVN
This is already the case (we have pdf and eps available for the design
pros):
http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/lenya/sandbox/design/docupub-redesign/resources/
> * Drop the "height on the homepage only" remark – the requirement is
> about screen resolution, IMO it's OK if the homepage requires some
> vertical scrolling to see the less important stuff
+1
>
> I don't quite understand the meaning of this sentence:
>
> "This may be improved by voting for every entry before vote for best
> entry."
>
> Does it mean that you can improve your own chances if you distribute
> your votes evenly over your entries?
Mmmh neither do these words convey their meaning to me... I decided to
drop that sentence (for now).
>
>
>> Might still have some rough edges here and there...
>> http://wiki.apache.org/lenya/DocuPublicationRedesignContestDraft
>> Maybe it would make sense to better describe the open source spirit
>> - community process. The Time Line is not yet filled in - any
>> suggestions about it (maybe early summer?) Or towards a next Lenya
>> user/dev Meeting?!
>
> That depends on how much time we think it takes to spread the word,
> plus the time it takes to do the design work. There's no date for
> the next user meeting, but I think it won't take place before May.
> If we consider 1 1/2 months sufficient, we could schedule the
> deadline for the end of April. Or is this too early?
I think thats too early. What about end of may?
>
> BTW, ATM it's not possible to edit the Wiki page. Looks like
> something is broken. The error message is:
>
> "Page could not get locked. Missing 'current' file?"
Seems to be back to normal - at least for me here now.
Thanks for the feedback!
Jürgen
Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Hi Jürgen,
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
>> Are there still any open issues, or can we publish the page on the
>> website and proceed with the announcements?
>
> I gave my best to condense the findings so far to something practical.
> A had to throw out some parts to make it clearer - I hope this was ok
> for everyone - otherwise please put it back in or let me know.
Thanks a lot!
I'd suggest some small additions/changes:
* Provide the logo as download for those not familiar with SVN
* Drop the "height on the homepage only" remark – the requirement is
about screen resolution, IMO it's OK if the homepage requires some
vertical scrolling to see the less important stuff
I don't quite understand the meaning of this sentence:
"This may be improved by voting for every entry before vote for best entry."
Does it mean that you can improve your own chances if you distribute
your votes evenly over your entries?
> Might still have some rough edges here and there...
> http://wiki.apache.org/lenya/DocuPublicationRedesignContestDraft
>
> Maybe it would make sense to better describe the open source spirit -
> community process.
> The Time Line is not yet filled in - any suggestions about it (maybe
> early summer?) Or towards a next Lenya user/dev Meeting?!
That depends on how much time we think it takes to spread the word, plus
the time it takes to do the design work. There's no date for the next
user meeting, but I think it won't take place before May. If we consider
1 1/2 months sufficient, we could schedule the deadline for the end of
April. Or is this too early?
BTW, ATM it's not possible to edit the Wiki page. Looks like something
is broken. The error message is:
"Page could not get locked. Missing 'current' file?"
Thanks again for taking care of this,
-- Andreas
--
Andreas Hartmann, CTO
BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hi devs!
Am 09.03.2009 um 14:22 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
>
> Are there still any open issues, or can we publish the page on the
> website and proceed with the announcements?
I gave my best to condense the findings so far to something practical.
A had to throw out some parts to make it clearer - I hope this was ok
for everyone - otherwise please put it back in or let me know.
Might still have some rough edges here and there...
http://wiki.apache.org/lenya/DocuPublicationRedesignContestDraft
Maybe it would make sense to better describe the open source spirit -
community process.
The Time Line is not yet filled in - any suggestions about it (maybe
early summer?) Or towards a next Lenya user/dev Meeting?!
Next steps:
- create a bugzilla thread for the entries
- move the wiki content once finished to a lenya page
- invite all your friend interested in design to a tasty dinner with a
nice glass of whine!
Thanks everyone for feedback
Jürgen
Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by =?...@athena.apache.org,
_privat=22?= <jr...@datacomm.ch>.
Good Morning, Andreas
Am 09.03.2009 um 14:22 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
...[…[…]…]...
>
> Are there still any open issues, or can we publish the page on the
> website and proceed with the announcements?
I will update the wiki page and create the bugzilla entry for
submissions
- should be able to squeeze in some time tonight!
Thanks for the wakeup call...
Jürgen
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
>> sorry for my previous post using the wrong sender address;
looks so strange that I decided to write again.
Good Morning, Andreas
Am 09.03.2009 um 14:22 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
...[…[…]…]...
>
> Are there still any open issues, or can we publish the page on the
> website and proceed with the announcements?
I will update the wiki page and create the bugzilla entry for
submissions
- should be able to squeeze in some time tonight!
Thanks for the wakeup call...
Jürgen
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Hi Jürgen,
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Am 08.02.2009 um 17:40 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
[…]
> It now boils down to:
> 10: commiters
> 8: regular user/dev ml-posters (definition of ml posters as described
> by solprovider)
> 6: persons with an apache.org email
> 4: everybody else
+1
[…]
>>> Announcement
>>> ---------------------
>>> I will do a search for appropriate blogs / design websites to promote
>>> the contest a bit
>>
>> Thanks! I'll be happy to do the same, maybe we have to coordinate this
>> a bit.
>
> Shure - we could start on the wiki page.
Yes, good idea.
Are there still any open issues, or can we publish the page on the
website and proceed with the announcements?
-- Andreas
--
Andreas Hartmann, CTO
BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hi Andreas
Am 08.02.2009 um 17:40 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
>
>> Voting :
>> ---------
>> The voting takes place on the user mailing list.
>> I suggest a star-system:
>> 10 stars for committers
>> 8 stars for persons with an apache.org email
>> 6 stars for regular user/dev ml-posters (definition of ml posters
>> as described by solprovider)
>
> Hmm, why are ASF committers from other projects higher valued than
> regular Lenya contributors? IMO the merit in the Lenya project
> should have a higher value …
I agree here.
>
>
>> 4 stars for everybody else
It now boils down to:
10: commiters
8: regular user/dev ml-posters (definition of ml posters as
described by solprovider)
6: persons with an apache.org email
4: everybody else
>>
>
> […]
>
>> Any entry can be vetoed by two -1 comming from committers
>> Committers participating in the contest loose their right to veto
>
> I see your point, but this is a tricky situation. What if a
> committer who participates in the contest has reasonable objections
> against an entry (usability etc.)?
OK let's leave the right to vetoe in any case - to block an entry, two
vetoes are needed anyway.
BTW looks like a good training for democracy advocates...
>
>
>> Cancellation of the contest
>> ------------------------------------
>> - less than 4(?) entries
>> - obvious misuse
>
> +1 (maybe 3 entries would be sufficient?
>
>> Announcement
>> ---------------------
>> I will do a search for appropriate blogs / design websites to
>> promote the contest a bit
>
> Thanks! I'll be happy to do the same, maybe we have to coordinate
> this a bit.
Shure - we could start on the wiki page.
>
>
>> Prices
>> --------
>> Meritocracy. - or maybe a sponsored price could still be nice; I'm
>> somewhat undecided about that
>
> I don't think we need a price. People should have other motivations
> to participate.
Ok let's leave it meritocratic.
Thanks for your feedback, Andreas
Jürgen
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Andreas Hartmann <an...@apache.org>.
Hi Jürgen,
Jürgen Ragaller schrieb:
> Am 03.02.2009 um 14:35 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>>
>> do you know what's the current state of our design contest venture?
>> Is there anything we can do? I could spend a bit of time helping.
[…]
> After we discuss the open topic here I'll update the wiki page / and
> create a Bugzilla thread for the entries.
> When the wiki page is finished, I suggest to move it over to the lenya
> website to give the contest more attention.
+1
> That's the text so far:
> http://wiki.apache.org/lenya/DocuPublicationRedesignContestDraft
>
>
> I suggest the following changes / additions
>
> How to Enter
> -----------------
> All entries must be attached to a bugzilla-thread; we should inform the
> users on the wiki page that the design will be under ASF-licence terms.
>
> I would leave out the 330 x 220px samples - we can always create these.
Makes sense, the entry barrier should be as low as possible.
> The 1024 x 768px layouts are more important.
> Those who decide to use the lenya docu zip and write css code should do
> a screenshot of the result in 1024 x 768px - so we can make a judgement
> based on the design alone.
+1
[…]
> Voting :
> ---------
> The voting takes place on the user mailing list.
>
> I suggest a star-system:
>
> 10 stars for committers
> 8 stars for persons with an apache.org email
> 6 stars for regular user/dev ml-posters (definition of ml posters as
> described by solprovider)
Hmm, why are ASF committers from other projects higher valued than
regular Lenya contributors? IMO the merit in the Lenya project should
have a higher value …
> 4 stars for everybody else
[…]
> Any entry can be vetoed by two -1 comming from committers
> Committers participating in the contest loose their right to veto
I see your point, but this is a tricky situation. What if a committer
who participates in the contest has reasonable objections against an
entry (usability etc.)?
> Cancellation of the contest
> ------------------------------------
> - less than 4(?) entries
> - obvious misuse
+1 (maybe 3 entries would be sufficient?)
> Announcement
> ---------------------
> I will do a search for appropriate blogs / design websites to promote
> the contest a bit
Thanks! I'll be happy to do the same, maybe we have to coordinate this a
bit.
> Prices
> --------
> Meritocracy. - or maybe a sponsored price could still be nice; I'm
> somewhat undecided about that
I don't think we need a price. People should have other motivations to
participate.
Thanks for your status report!
-- Andreas
--
Andreas Hartmann, CTO
BeCompany GmbH
http://www.becompany.ch
Tel.: +41 (0) 43 818 57 01
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Re: Docu publication redesign
Posted by Jürgen Ragaller <ra...@apache.org>.
Hello Andreas
Am 03.02.2009 um 14:35 schrieb Andreas Hartmann:
>
> do you know what's the current state of our design contest venture?
> Is there anything we can do? I could spend a bit of time helping.
Unfortunately I'm quite busy work-wise and will be available mostly on
weekends - so I do appreciate help here.
But I know you're working on the cocoon 2.2 migration - very
interesting to follow the steps!
And thanks for reactivating this topic.
After we discuss the open topic here I'll update the wiki page / and
create a Bugzilla thread for the entries.
When the wiki page is finished, I suggest to move it over to the lenya
website to give the contest more attention.
That's the text so far:
http://wiki.apache.org/lenya/DocuPublicationRedesignContestDraft
I suggest the following changes / additions
How to Enter
-----------------
All entries must be attached to a bugzilla-thread; we should inform
the users on the wiki page that the design will be under ASF-licence
terms.
I would leave out the 330 x 220px samples - we can always create
these. The 1024 x 768px layouts are more important.
Those who decide to use the lenya docu zip and write css code should
do a screenshot of the result in 1024 x 768px - so we can make a
judgement based on the design alone.
Legal issues
-----------------
Solved (I asked legal@apache): when creating a Bugzilla account the
user must agree to the ASF-terms / license.
Voting :
---------
The voting takes place on the user mailing list.
I suggest a star-system:
10 stars for committers
8 stars for persons with an apache.org email
6 stars for regular user/dev ml-posters (definition of ml posters as
described by solprovider)
4 stars for everybody else
A committer for example can vote like this:
No. Stars
3 5
2 3
12 1
4 1
Any entry can be vetoed by two -1 comming from committers
Committers participating in the contest loose their right to veto
Cancellation of the contest
------------------------------------
- less than 4(?) entries
- obvious misuse
Announcement
---------------------
I will do a search for appropriate blogs / design websites to promote
the contest a bit
Prices
--------
Meritocracy. - or maybe a sponsored price could still be nice; I'm
somewhat undecided about that
Timeline
------------
To be decided when the procedure is clear.
>
> BTW, is it OK for you at all to keep the lead in this matter?
Yes that's fine for me.
Jürgen