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Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by Rory O'Farrell <of...@iol.ie> on 2014/12/09 18:23:11 UTC
Java 32
If we are working towards a new release, could the "Java not found" message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be amended to say something like "OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which has not been found on this machine".
Many Windows users know they have Java installed and are baffled when OO doesn't find it.
--
Rory O'Farrell <of...@iol.ie>
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Kay Schenk <ka...@gmail.com>.
On Thu, Dec 18, 2014 at 3:00 AM, Carl Marcum <cm...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> On 12/14/2014 05:46 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Carl Marcum <cm...@apache.org> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On 12/12/2014 06:04 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:
>>>
>>> On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
>>>>>
>>>>> +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message,
>>>>>> should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will
>>>>>> depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64
>>>>>> Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64
>>>>>> binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making
>>>>>> the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more
>>>>>> confusing to casual users.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by
>>>>>> Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing
>>>>>> progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if
>>>>>> necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that
>>>>>> java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no
>>>>>> simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on.
>>>>> For me it's fine.
>>>>>
>>>>> Marcus
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>
>>>>>> From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49
>>>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>>> Subject: Re: Java 32
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [ ... ]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one
>>>>>> person):
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. Find a proper wording for
>>>>>> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore
>>>>>
>>>> requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this.
>>>>
>>>> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
>>>>
>>>>> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
>>>>>> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
>>>>>> systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
>>>>>> should take care of it
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here
>>>>>> (and
>>>>>> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
>>>>>> committers, even better)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
>>>>>> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about
>>>>>> this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> ---------
>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Also,
>>>
>>> When attempting to run an UNO client Java application on a system using
>>> Java 64 bit you receive an error:
>>>
>>> "Can't load IA 32-bit .dll on a AMD 64-bit platform"
>>>
>>> This message probably comes from Java but it may be useful to mention it
>>> because the end user may not be aware.
>>>
>>> Unfortunately there is no way to get the user from that error to the
>>> java.html page.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Carl
>>>
>>
>> hmmm...This should be mentioned in the Development Guide I would think.
>>
>> https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/DevGuide
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
> I was thinking of the end user of a client application that may know
> nothing about development.
Oh I see. Well maybe you could propose some appropriate wording and suggest
a good place to put this. I would think the provider of such an app would
inform the user about this, though.
>
>
>
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>
>
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MzK
"There's a bit of magic in everything,
and some loss to even things out."
-- Lou Reed
Re: Java 32
Posted by Carl Marcum <cm...@apache.org>.
On 12/14/2014 05:46 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Carl Marcum <cm...@apache.org> wrote:
>>
>> On 12/12/2014 06:04 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote:
>>>
>>>> Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
>>>>
>>>>> +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan.
>>>>>
>>>>> There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message,
>>>>> should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will
>>>>> depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64
>>>>> Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64
>>>>> binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making
>>>>> the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more
>>>>> confusing to casual users.
>>>>>
>>>>> For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by
>>>>> Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing
>>>>> progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if
>>>>> necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that
>>>>> java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no
>>>>> simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first.
>>>>>
>>>> OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on.
>>>> For me it's fine.
>>>>
>>>> Marcus
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49
>>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>> Subject: Re: Java 32
>>>>>
>>>>> [ ... ]
>>>>>
>>>>> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one
>>>>> person):
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. Find a proper wording for
>>>>> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
>>>>>
>>>> The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore
>>> requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this.
>>>
>>> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
>>>>> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
>>>>> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
>>>>> systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
>>>>> should take care of it
>>>>>
>>>>> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
>>>>> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
>>>>> committers, even better)
>>>>>
>>>>> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
>>>>> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
>>>>>
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>
>>>>
>> Also,
>>
>> When attempting to run an UNO client Java application on a system using
>> Java 64 bit you receive an error:
>>
>> "Can't load IA 32-bit .dll on a AMD 64-bit platform"
>>
>> This message probably comes from Java but it may be useful to mention it
>> because the end user may not be aware.
>>
>> Unfortunately there is no way to get the user from that error to the
>> java.html page.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Carl
>
> hmmm...This should be mentioned in the Development Guide I would think.
>
> https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/DevGuide
>
>
>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>
>>
I was thinking of the end user of a client application that may know
nothing about development.
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Kay Schenk <ka...@gmail.com>.
On Fri, Dec 12, 2014 at 6:00 PM, Carl Marcum <cm...@apache.org> wrote:
>
>
> On 12/12/2014 06:04 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:
>
>>
>> On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote:
>>
>>> Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
>>>
>>>> +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan.
>>>>
>>>> There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message,
>>>> should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will
>>>> depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64
>>>> Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64
>>>> binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making
>>>> the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more
>>>> confusing to casual users.
>>>>
>>>> For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by
>>>> Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing
>>>> progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if
>>>> necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that
>>>> java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no
>>>> simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first.
>>>>
>>> OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on.
>>> For me it's fine.
>>>
>>> Marcus
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
>>>> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49
>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>> Subject: Re: Java 32
>>>>
>>>> [ ... ]
>>>>
>>>> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one
>>>> person):
>>>>
>>>> 1. Find a proper wording for
>>>> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
>>>>
>>> The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore
>> requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this.
>>
>> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
>>>>
>>>> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
>>>> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
>>>> systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
>>>> should take care of it
>>>>
>>>> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
>>>> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
>>>> committers, even better)
>>>>
>>>> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
>>>> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
>>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>>
>>>
> Also,
>
> When attempting to run an UNO client Java application on a system using
> Java 64 bit you receive an error:
>
> "Can't load IA 32-bit .dll on a AMD 64-bit platform"
>
> This message probably comes from Java but it may be useful to mention it
> because the end user may not be aware.
>
> Unfortunately there is no way to get the user from that error to the
> java.html page.
>
> Thanks,
> Carl
hmmm...This should be mentioned in the Development Guide I would think.
https://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/DevGuide
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
>
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MzK
"There's a bit of magic in everything,
and some loss to even things out."
-- Lou Reed
Re: Java 32
Posted by Carl Marcum <cm...@apache.org>.
On 12/12/2014 06:04 PM, Kay Schenk wrote:
>
> On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote:
>> Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
>>> +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan.
>>>
>>> There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message,
>>> should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will
>>> depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64
>>> Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64
>>> binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making
>>> the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more
>>> confusing to casual users.
>>>
>>> For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by
>>> Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing
>>> progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if
>>> necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that
>>> java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no
>>> simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first.
>> OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on.
>> For me it's fine.
>>
>> Marcus
>>
>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
>>> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49
>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>> Subject: Re: Java 32
>>>
>>> [ ... ]
>>>
>>> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person):
>>>
>>> 1. Find a proper wording for
>>> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
> The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore
> requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this.
>
>>> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
>>>
>>> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
>>> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
>>> systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
>>> should take care of it
>>>
>>> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
>>> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
>>> committers, even better)
>>>
>>> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
>>> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>
Also,
When attempting to run an UNO client Java application on a system using
Java 64 bit you receive an error:
"Can't load IA 32-bit .dll on a AMD 64-bit platform"
This message probably comes from Java but it may be useful to mention it
because the end user may not be aware.
Unfortunately there is no way to get the user from that error to the
java.html page.
Thanks,
Carl
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Kay Schenk <ka...@gmail.com>.
On 12/11/2014 12:37 PM, Marcus wrote:
> Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
>> +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan.
>>
>> There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message,
>> should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will
>> depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64
>> Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64
>> binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making
>> the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more
>> confusing to casual users.
>>
>> For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by
>> Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing
>> progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if
>> necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that
>> java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no
>> simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first.
>
> OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on.
> For me it's fine.
>
> Marcus
>
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
>> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: Java 32
>>
>> [ ... ]
>>
>> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person):
>>
>> 1. Find a proper wording for
>> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
The crux of this problem is that Windows AOO is 32 bit and therefore
requires a 32-bit jvm. I will change java.html to note this.
>>
>> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
>>
>> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
>> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
>> systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
>> should take care of it
>>
>> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
>> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
>> committers, even better)
>>
>> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
>> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
MzK
"There's a bit of magic in everything,
and some loss to even things out."
-- Lou Reed
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12/11/2014 04:58 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
> +1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan.
>
> There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users.
>
> For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first.
OK, then first a developer has to sort this out before we can go on.
For me it's fine.
Marcus
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Java 32
>
> [ ... ]
>
> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person):
>
> 1. Find a proper wording for
> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
>
> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
>
> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
> systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
> should take care of it
>
> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
> committers, even better)
>
> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
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RE: Java 32
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
+1 to Andreas. Sounds like a plan.
There seems to be some disagreement on what (3), the dialog message, should be. It is likely that should be agreed first, since (1) will depend on it. That there are only possible mismatches on x64 Windows/Mac operating systems (or any others that run both x86 and x64 binaries) needs to be clear. Not in the message. I don't see making the message even more complicated about lore that will be even more confusing to casual users.
For (1), the java.html page, I think we can address the concern by Andreas Säger by keeping the java.html page simple and providing progressive disclosure of specific details on supplementary pages if necessary. That means more page-translation work, so I suggest that java.html be kept straightforward and as simple as possible (but no simpler, of course, and definitely accurate) first.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2014 00:49
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
[ ... ]
My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person):
1. Find a proper wording for
http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
should take care of it
4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
committers, even better)
5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
Regards,
Andrea.
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Re: Java 32
Posted by jonathon <to...@gmail.com>.
On 19/12/14 23:45, V Stuart Foote wrote:
>> Doesn't a11y functionality/capability require Java?
> Not since early in the 4.1 release cycle with implementation of IAccessible2 based native bridge for Windows,
Thanks.
That sort of explains a bizarre call had with GW Micro.
jonathon
Re: Java 32
Posted by V Stuart Foote <VS...@utsa.edu>.
jonathon-3 wrote
> On 11/12/14 11:13, Andreas Säger wrote:
>
>> A Java runtime environment (JRE) is required to use the following
>> functionality:
>>
>> *Wizards*, namely:
>>
>> *Macros*
>>
>> *Extensions*
>>
>> Finding keywords in the F1 help depends on Java.
>>
>> *Database access*
>
> Doesn't a11y functionality/capability require Java?
Not since early in the 4.1 release cycle with implementation of IAccessible2
based native bridge for Windows, and then JAB based code was removed for
final release. Same over on the LibreOffice side at their 4.3 release.
Stuart
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Re: Java 32
Posted by jonathon <to...@gmail.com>.
On 11/12/14 11:13, Andreas Säger wrote:
> A Java runtime environment (JRE) is required to use the following
> functionality:
>
> *Wizards*, namely:
>
> *Macros*
>
> *Extensions*
>
> Finding keywords in the F1 help depends on Java.
>
> *Database access*
Doesn't a11y functionality/capability require Java?
jonathon
RE: Java 32
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
-- in reply to --
From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 09:55
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
Am 12/22/2014 05:13 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
> +1 !!
Sounds like a good solution in general. But I don't know how to
integrate a variable URL into the error message for the dialogbox.
It must be something like the follwong:
"http://www.openoffice.org/" + $ISO_CODE + "java.html"
Another thing we need a core developer for. ;-)
So, adding a link that points to "w.oo.o/d/c/java.html" seems to be the
faster solution.
Marcus
<orcnote>
Two cases come to mind:
1. One way would be for the default (no language code in the URL)
case would be to add a script at the web page to redirect to
different pages based on any browser language-preference setting.
That way, the web pages don't have to be internationalized in step
with the different language builds.
2. Another way would be to have the URL internationalized at the
same time as the message that the URL is in. Then, where there
is no custom page at that location, there could be a redirect to
the English page or an obvious second choice.
I favor (1) because it doesn't force the same language as on the
product.
I suppose that for either (1-2), it would be good for the pages to
have sidebars that indicate the other available-language pages
having translations of the information.
How do users who prefer non-English pages prefer this to work?
Are there preferences (or even requirements) for use in multi-
lingual countries such as Canada, Belgium, and Switzerland?
</orcnote>
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RE: Java 32
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
+1 Looks like a workable case, especially if translators know what to do.
-- and reply to ---
From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 13:41
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
[ ... ] in the ENGLISH string you write the link as
http://www.openoffice.org/java.html
<orcnote>
Since <http://openoffice.org> resolves to
<http://www.openoffice.org> anyhow, I thought
it useful to recommend the shorter URL to
users.
</orcnote>
Then the Italian translators, for example, in the Italian translation in
Pootle (not in the code) use http://www.openoffice.org/it/java.html but
there is no need for anything special, we do it in several places
already, especially the README.
Regards,
Andrea.
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12/22/2014 10:40 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
> Marcus wrote:
>> Sounds like a good solution in general. But I don't know how to
>> integrate a variable URL into the error message for the dialogbox.
>
> You needn't do that.
>
>> It must be something like the follwong:
>> "http://www.openoffice.org/" + $ISO_CODE + "java.html"
>
> No, in the ENGLISH string you write the link as
> http://www.openoffice.org/java.html
>
> Then the Italian translators, for example, in the Italian translation in
> Pootle (not in the code) use http://www.openoffice.org/it/java.html but
> there is no need for anything special, we do it in several places
> already, especially the README.
of course you are right. Sorry for not thinking further than 2 strings. ;-)
Marcus
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
Marcus wrote:
> Sounds like a good solution in general. But I don't know how to
> integrate a variable URL into the error message for the dialogbox.
You needn't do that.
> It must be something like the follwong:
> "http://www.openoffice.org/" + $ISO_CODE + "java.html"
No, in the ENGLISH string you write the link as
http://www.openoffice.org/java.html
Then the Italian translators, for example, in the Italian translation in
Pootle (not in the code) use http://www.openoffice.org/it/java.html but
there is no need for anything special, we do it in several places
already, especially the README.
Regards,
Andrea.
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12/22/2014 05:13 PM, schrieb Dennis E. Hamilton:
> +1 !!
Sounds like a good solution in general. But I don't know how to
integrate a variable URL into the error message for the dialogbox.
It must be something like the follwong:
"http://www.openoffice.org/" + $ISO_CODE + "java.html"
Another thing we need a core developer for. ;-)
So, adding a link that points to "w.oo.o/d/c/java.html" seems to be the
faster solution.
Marcus
> -- in reply to --
> From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 00:12
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Java 32
>
> On 22/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>> I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I
>> see no problem with where it is kept.
>> One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language
>> versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one.
>
> The page could be included in the set of "standard pages" (the "xx
> pages", see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then
> each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their
> translated one.
>
> <orcnote>
> Great! That's wonderful. I must remember to do that sort of thing
> on other sites.
>
> - Dennis
>
> PS: I wanted to provoke the Java messages and I figured the AOO 4.1.1
> I have on the Windows 10 Technical Preview would work for that.
> Except Java SE Development Kit 7 Update 55 is already installed!
> I had no recollection of doing such a thing. It turns out it came
> with the Visual Studio 2015 Technical Preview (along with Google's
> Android SDK Tools) and a Git version 1.9.0 that needs to get the
> security update. (The copy in GitHub for Windows is current.)
> </orcnote>
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RE: Java 32
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
+1 !!
-- in reply to --
From: Andrea Pescetti [mailto:pescetti@apache.org]
Sent: Monday, December 22, 2014 00:12
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
On 22/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I
> see no problem with where it is kept.
> One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language
> versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one.
The page could be included in the set of "standard pages" (the "xx
pages", see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then
each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their
translated one.
<orcnote>
Great! That's wonderful. I must remember to do that sort of thing
on other sites.
- Dennis
PS: I wanted to provoke the Java messages and I figured the AOO 4.1.1
I have on the Windows 10 Technical Preview would work for that.
Except Java SE Development Kit 7 Update 55 is already installed!
I had no recollection of doing such a thing. It turns out it came
with the Visual Studio 2015 Technical Preview (along with Google's
Android SDK Tools) and a Git version 1.9.0 that needs to get the
security update. (The copy in GitHub for Windows is current.)
</orcnote>
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
On 22/12/2014 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I
> see no problem with where it is kept.
> One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language
> versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one.
The page could be included in the set of "standard pages" (the "xx
pages", see http://openoffice.apache.org/website-native.html and then
each translation team can decide whether to use the English one or their
translated one.
Regards,
Andrea.
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RE: Java 32
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
-- in reply to --
From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2014 15:32
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
Am 12/21/2014 11:06 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
[ ... ]
>>> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
when thinking a bit, I would favor to completely move the file to the
root of w.oo.o
As it is the explaining text how OpenOffice and Java are working
together and therefore it has nothing to do with the download - as it
was in former days as the JRE was included - it's better suited there
than in the download area.
What do others think?
<orcnote>
I think the reason for redirecting from the top level was simply
to have something still at the original location for those who
might be linked to it for some reason.
It doesn't matter which location has the actual file, versus which
one redirects.
I am assuming that we can do the job with a single text. So I
see no problem with where it is kept.
One consideration might be the maintenance of the different-language
versions and how browsers are routed to the correct one. I don't
have any sense of what is involved for that.
Marcus, would localization and browser branching on language
be a factor in preference for the location of the file?
</orcnote>
[ ... ]
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12/21/2014 11:06 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
> On 11/12/2014 Andreas Säger wrote:
>> Am 11.12.2014 um 09:49 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>>> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one
>>> person):
>>> 1. Find a proper wording for
>>> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
>> More detailed info is needed to overthrow the common prejudice that
>> OpenOffice relies heavily on Java which is not even true for the Base
>> component.
>
> Thanks for the excellent text. Indeed, the page could be written in the
> form of FAQ and this one (link to archives:
> http://markmail.org/message/zr5cjxxpv7qqu5y3 ) be the answer to "What is
> Java needed for in OpenOffice?".
>
>>> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
when thinking a bit, I would favor to completely move the file to the
root of w.oo.o
As it is the explaining text how OpenOffice and Java are working
together and therefore it has nothing to do with the download - as it
was in former days as the JRE was included - it's better suited there
than in the download area.
What do others think?
>>> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
>>> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
>
> And here we have this proposal by Dennis, which can work for me.
> http://markmail.org/thread/awj3rdjxluw4kdf3
He updated his suggestion a bit. Now it's:
"Some OpenOffice operations use Java Runtime (JRE).
A suitable JRE is not installed. For details
http://openoffice.org/java.html"
>> This would be very easy if the dialog box would not show inadequate
>> JREs. If it would list only the JREs with correct bitness, the list of
>> JREs could have a slightly modified label with a 32 or 64 bit prefix
>> like this:
>> <32|64> bit Java runtime environments (JRE) already installed:
>> I strongly suggest to fix the list content first. Showing the right
>> label text with wrong options does not help much.
>
> At the moment, this will have to be postponed since nobody volunteered
> to do the needed code fix. So I would go on with the rest, otherwise we
> will wait forever.
>
>>> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
>>> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
>>> committers, even better)
>>>
>>> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
>>> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
>
> This is still perfectly feasible, so my recommendation is: just do it!
> We have the text, creating a patch from it is easy and even it is a
> small improvement it will help many users.
Then it's time to go to point #4.
Marcus
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
On 11/12/2014 Andreas Säger wrote:
> Am 11.12.2014 um 09:49 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person):
>> 1. Find a proper wording for
>> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
> More detailed info is needed to overthrow the common prejudice that
> OpenOffice relies heavily on Java which is not even true for the Base
> component.
Thanks for the excellent text. Indeed, the page could be written in the
form of FAQ and this one (link to archives:
http://markmail.org/message/zr5cjxxpv7qqu5y3 ) be the answer to "What is
Java needed for in OpenOffice?".
>> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
>>
>> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
>> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
And here we have this proposal by Dennis, which can work for me.
http://markmail.org/thread/awj3rdjxluw4kdf3
> This would be very easy if the dialog box would not show inadequate
> JREs. If it would list only the JREs with correct bitness, the list of
> JREs could have a slightly modified label with a 32 or 64 bit prefix
> like this:
> <32|64> bit Java runtime environments (JRE) already installed:
> I strongly suggest to fix the list content first. Showing the right
> label text with wrong options does not help much.
At the moment, this will have to be postponed since nobody volunteered
to do the needed code fix. So I would go on with the rest, otherwise we
will wait forever.
>> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
>> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
>> committers, even better)
>>
>> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
>> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
This is still perfectly feasible, so my recommendation is: just do it!
We have the text, creating a patch from it is easy and even it is a
small improvement it will help many users.
Regards,
Andrea.
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Andreas Säger <sa...@t-online.de>.
Am 11.12.2014 um 09:49 schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
> Marcus wrote:
>> Of course I can change it in the code with a commit. However, I'm not
>> able to create a build to check myself to see if my fix is good or
>> produces an ugly build breaker. I'm not yet so far to build AOO from
>> scratch myself. I wanted to try this for the quite days at this years
>> end.
>> Any tips?
>
> My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person):
>
> 1. Find a proper wording for
> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
>
More detailed info is needed to overthrow the common prejudice that
OpenOffice relies heavily on Java which is not even true for the Base
component.
A Java runtime environment (JRE) is required to use the following
functionality:
*Wizards*, namely:
menu:File>Wizard>Letter...
menu:File>Wizard>Fax...
menu:File>Wizard>Agenda...
menu:File>Wizard>Web Page...
*Macros*
JavaScript and BeanShell macros require Java
The dialog menu:Tools>Macros>Run... can't be used.
Without Java you can still use menu:Tools>Macros>Organize... to run
Python and Basic macros.
> https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=86541
*Extensions*
Extensions coded in Java
Finding keywords in the F1 help depends on Java.
*Database access*
All Base wizards are coded in Java.
The embedded HSQLDB and any other JDBC connetion requires Java.
Contrary to the current text stating that Base depends entirely on Java,
most of the Base component is functional without Java. You can query and
mail merge any kind of non-Java database and you can create fully
functional input forms manually without the questionable help of the
form wizard.
You can even create a new database without Java. This results in a (less
functionable) dBase directory.
*Required JRE* when needing any of the above features:
Any recent version of Java 7 or 8
Windwos: 32 bit JRE in any case since OpenOffice for Windows is a 32 bit
application
Mac: 64 bit JRE for all recent versions of OpenOffice since all recent
versions for the Mac are 64 bit versions.
Linux: 32 or 64 bit JRE according to the bitness of OpenOffice which
should be the same as the system bitness.
> 2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
>
> 3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
> www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
> systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
> should take care of it
>
This would be very easy if the dialog box would not show inadequate
JREs. If it would list only the JREs with correct bitness, the list of
JREs could have a slightly modified label with a 32 or 64 bit prefix
like this:
<32|64> bit Java runtime environments (JRE) already installed:
I strongly suggest to fix the list content first. Showing the right
label text with wrong options does not help much.
> 4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
> if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
> committers, even better)
>
> 5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
> tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
>
> Regards,
> Andrea.
>
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>
>
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
Marcus wrote:
> Of course I can change it in the code with a commit. However, I'm not
> able to create a build to check myself to see if my fix is good or
> produces an ugly build breaker. I'm not yet so far to build AOO from
> scratch myself. I wanted to try this for the quite days at this years end.
> Any tips?
My suggestion (can be executed as a team, not necessarily by one person):
1. Find a proper wording for
http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
2. Create a link www.openoffice.org/java pointing at it
3. Find a short (short!) text for the dialog box, sending the people to
www.openoffice.org/java for any details (including 32 and 64-bit
systems); I don't know if links are supported, but the short URL at 2
should take care of it
4. Place #3 in form of a patch in Bugzilla and send the number here (and
if the patch comes from someone who is not one of the usual code
committers, even better)
5. At that point it will be easy for people who have their own build
tree to check the patch before we get it in, so don't worry about this.
Regards,
Andrea.
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RE: Java 32
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Marcus,
Thank you for reminding me about this message. I have used your clues to dig into the code farther. Remarks in-line below.
I am tired digging through the code for now.
-- in reply to --
From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 14:49
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
Am 12/10/2014 08:22 AM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
> Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum
>
> "JRE is Defective
> No Java installation could be found
> Please check your installation"
thanks for your help.
I think I've found the locations in the code and it seems to be a
combined text from 2 sources:
http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/svtools/source/java/javaerror.src
Line 86
<orcnote>
That code defines 5 dialog boxes, all about Java situations.
The five STR_... definitions are for the titles on those
dialog boxes.
Messages with those dialogs are produced by the file
Main/svtools/source/java/javainteractionhandler.cxx in method
JavaInteractionHandler::handle. This function noses around
And then produces exactly one of those 5 dialogs, without
Any apparent modification of the messages.
If that analysis holds, it is easy to adjust the five
messages. Here are the exceptions that lead to
each one, with the default title on the dialog box and
the default message in the box.
com::sun::star::Java::JavaNotFoundException
Title: "JRE required"
%PRODUCTNAME requires a Java runtime environment (JRE)
to perform this task. Please install a JRE and
restart %PRODUCTNAME.
[This is the only one to customize, I think.]
com::sun::star::Java::InvalidJavaSettingsException
Title: "Select JRE"
%The %PRODUCTNAME configuration has been changed.
Under Tools - Options - %PRODUCTNAME - Java, select
the Java runtime environment you want to have used
by %PRODUCTNAME.
com::sun::star::java::JavaDisabledException
Title: "Enable JRE"
%PRODUCTNAME requires a Java runtime environment (JRE)
to perform this task. However, use of a JRE has been
disabled. Do you want to enable the use of a JRE now?
[Responses are Yes, No, Cancel]
com::sun::star::java::JavaVMCreationFailureException
Title: "JRE is Defective"
%PRODUCTNAME requies a Java runtime environment (JRE)
to perform this task. The selected JRE is defective.
Please select another version or install a new JRE
and select it under Tools - Options - %PRODUCTNAME
- Java.
com::sun::star::java::RestartRequiredException
Title: "Restart Required"
For the selected Java runtime environment to work
properly, %PRODUCTNAME must be restarted. Please
restart %PRODUCTNAME now.
</orcmid>
and
http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/connectivity/source/resource/conn_shared_res.src
Line 535
<orcnote>
The definition in conn_shared_res.src is a definition of the
string resource with ID of STR_NO_JAVA and initial value
{ Text [ en-US ] = "No Java installation could be found. \
Please check your installation."
[Line break is my addition above to keep the lines short.]
This line is internationalized in a ton of languages
elsewhere. However, in code in trunk/main, this string
resource is only used in the following ways:
main/connectivity/source/drivers/jdbc/JConnection.cxx:
throwGenericSQLException(STR_NO_JAVA,*this);
main/connectivity/source/drivers/jdbc/JConnection.cxx:
throwGenericSQLException(STR_NO_JAVA,*this);
main/connectivity/source/inc/resource/common_res.hrc:
#define STR_NO_JAVA ( STR_COMMON_BASE + 22 )
main/connectivity/source/resource/conn_shared_res.src:
String STR_NO_JAVA (setting the default message)
The use in JConnection.cxx is on failure to get a JVM
Connected for setting up a Java SQL Connection.
There are numerous usages of the function
throwGenericSQLException( ). When the final catch
happens and a dialog comes up, the message is composed
by combining messages from the cascade of exceptions
that may be involved. That takes more examination to
find out where any other messages, if any, come from
in this case. This seems to be handled in
main/connectivity/source/commontools/dbexception.cxx.
I don't think there is any cascading in this case,
But more analysis is required. I can see modifying
the STR_NO_JAVA message text depending on how that
turns out.
</orcnote>
[ ... ]
>>>> If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but
>>> in
>>>> huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle:
>>>> https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/
>>>> and find the English original, then do the above.
>>>>
>>>> Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it
>>>> and report the number here if you have doubts.
>>>
>>> OK, let's see.
>>>
>>> Marcus
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12/10/2014 08:22 AM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
> On Tue, 09 Dec 2014 23:01:01 +0000
> Rory O'Farrell<of...@iol.ie> wrote:
>>
>> On 9 December 2014 22:19:41 GMT+00:00, Marcus<ma...@wtnet.de> wrote:
>>> Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>>>> Marcus wrote:
>>>>> Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
>>>>>> If we are working towards a new release, could the "Java not found"
>>>>>> message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could
>>> be
>>>>>> amended to say something like "OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java,
>>> which
>>>>>> has not been found on this machine". ...
>>>>> Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code
>>> to
>>>>> extend it?
>>>>
>>>> If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find
>>> it
>>>> here (in English):
>>>> http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/
>>>
>>> maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits.
>>> ;-)
>>
>> I'll uninstall Java on on unused windows machine tomorrow and catch the error message, but it is likely to be about 15 hours from now as I have meetings tomorrow morning. Going to bed now!
>
>
> Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum
>
> "JRE is Defective
> No Java installation could be found
> Please check your installation"
thanks for your help.
I think I've found the locations in the code and it seems to be a
combined text from 2 sources:
http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/svtools/source/java/javaerror.src
Line 86
and
http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/xref/aoo-trunk/main/connectivity/source/resource/conn_shared_res.src
Line 535
The problem that I see is that it's a generic message for all platforms.
So, when changing the wording like "... Windows needs a 32-bit JRE ..."
then it will look stupid on Linux and Mac. ;-)
So, we have to find a better generic wording.
My suggestion is:
- don't use "JRE is defective" at all as it is missleading with the next
both sentences.
- instead of just writing "No Java installation could be found. Please
check your installation." better would be to add another sentence like
"Hint: When using a 32-bit operation system then also a 32-bit JRE has
to be installed. Or a 64-bit JRE when using a 64-bit operating system."
And then maybe add the URL Kay has mentioned.
Next problem for me:
Of course I can change it in the code with a commit. However, I'm not
able to create a build to check myself to see if my fix is good or
produces an ugly build breaker. I'm not yet so far to build AOO from
scratch myself. I wanted to try this for the quite days at this years end.
Any tips?
BTW:
At least we can satisfy Dennis' request to find a better word for
"defective". :-P
Marcus
>>>> If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but
>>> in
>>>> huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle:
>>>> https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/
>>>> and find the English original, then do the above.
>>>>
>>>> Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it
>>>> and report the number here if you have doubts.
>>>
>>> OK, let's see.
>>>
>>> Marcus
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Jürgen Schmidt <jo...@gmail.com>.
On 10/12/14 08:22, Rory O'Farrell wrote:
> On Tue, 09 Dec 2014 23:01:01 +0000
> Rory O'Farrell <of...@iol.ie> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On 9 December 2014 22:19:41 GMT+00:00, Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de> wrote:
>>> Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>>>> Marcus wrote:
>>>>> Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
>>>>>> If we are working towards a new release, could the "Java not found"
>>>>>> message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could
>>> be
>>>>>> amended to say something like "OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java,
>>> which
>>>>>> has not been found on this machine". ...
>>>>> Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code
>>> to
>>>>> extend it?
>>>>
>>>> If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find
>>> it
>>>> here (in English):
>>>> http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/
>>>
>>> maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits.
>>> ;-)
>>
>> I'll uninstall Java on on unused windows machine tomorrow and catch the error message, but it is likely to be about 15 hours from now as I have meetings tomorrow morning. Going to bed now!
>
>
> Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum
>
> "JRE is Defective
> No Java installation could be found
> Please check your installation"
>
I am currently have no proper windows machine in place but have anybody
tested AOO on Windows with a 64 bit Java and added a JVM parameter -d32
to run the JVM in 32 mode.
I can't remember if it works or not, some features will definitely not
work but these are not so often used from the average user. It can
potentially help to improve the search functionality and in case of a 64
bit Java this parameter is added. But I am not sure a swell if this
parameter still exists in the latest Java versions.
The longterm goal should be to become a 64 bit application on Windows
but this is of course a little bit more more work.
Juergen
>>>
>>>> If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but
>>> in
>>>> huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle:
>>>> https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/
>>>> and find the English original, then do the above.
>>>>
>>>> Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it
>>>> and report the number here if you have doubts.
>>>
>>> OK, let's see.
>>>
>>> Marcus
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>
>> --
>> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>>
>>
>
>
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Rory O'Farrell <of...@iol.ie>.
On Wed, 10 Dec 2014 21:04:37 -0800
"Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org> wrote:
> Great, Marcus and Kay!
>
> Yes, "Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See <helpful URL>."
>
> The <http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html> page is a great start.
>
> 1. It needs to say "Versions Of Apache OpenOffice do not include a JRE."
> (The case for OpenOffice.org 3.4 doesn't matter.)
>
> 2. The 32-bit versus 64-bit distinction needs to be covered.
>
> 3. There is some wordsmithing that would be useful before submitting the page to any translation.
> (The last-sentence use of "appreciate" is quaint. I would think the link to java.com above is fine, since it provides download links immediately. The last sentence can be removed.)
>
> Is it sufficient to hack directly on
> <https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/ooo-site/trunk/content/download/common/java.html>?
>
> - Dennis
I read the latest posts in this thread just before going to sleep last night and made no comment at the time. I remind the thread readers that I raised this function in the context specifically of Windows _needing_ a 32 bit Java, no matter what the bitness of the Windows is. I have not run into any other instances of OpenOffice/Operating Systems with differing bitness - these may exist, but are rare in my opinion and Forum experience. So I urge a message such as
"A Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations using OpenOffice. If using 64 bit version of Windows, a 32 bit Java must be installed to work with OpenOffice. See
>> <helpful URL>."
I read through the text at the target URL: my thoughts are that it is over-complex and (specifically) didn't mention the
problem of the bit-matching. Remember that our major User-base is of Windows Users, many of whom are using older machines running XP(32), Win 7(32). I may re-read the text at that URL later, but can't guarantee it - my central heating has died and I have to go investigate - I fear it is serious!
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 14:49
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Java 32
>
> Am 12/10/2014 11:08 PM, schrieb Kay Schenk:
> > On 12/10/2014 08:52 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> [ ... ]
> >> Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it
> >> seems something like
> >>
> >> "A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See
> >> <helpful URL>."
> >
> > I've tracked down info needed to change this message.
> >
> > Do we want to use the following for the helpful URL --
> > http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
>
> looks good (however, I've not yet read the complete text).
>
> Is it possible to include a URL that is actually clickable? If not, the
> user has to write it down and then input it into the browser's URL field
> to get to the webpage. IMHO not really user-friendly.
>
> If we can get it copyable - like in the About dialogbox - then it's for
> sure better.
>
> Marcus
>
>
>
> >> I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser
> >> sniffing could take care of language there. That does mean the
> >> openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with
> >> this.
> >>
> [ ... ]
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
>
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RE: Java 32
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
Great, Marcus and Kay!
Yes, "Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See <helpful URL>."
The <http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html> page is a great start.
1. It needs to say "Versions Of Apache OpenOffice do not include a JRE."
(The case for OpenOffice.org 3.4 doesn't matter.)
2. The 32-bit versus 64-bit distinction needs to be covered.
3. There is some wordsmithing that would be useful before submitting the page to any translation.
(The last-sentence use of "appreciate" is quaint. I would think the link to java.com above is fine, since it provides download links immediately. The last sentence can be removed.)
Is it sufficient to hack directly on
<https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/openoffice/ooo-site/trunk/content/download/common/java.html>?
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 14:49
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
Am 12/10/2014 11:08 PM, schrieb Kay Schenk:
> On 12/10/2014 08:52 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
[ ... ]
>> Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it
>> seems something like
>>
>> "A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See
>> <helpful URL>."
>
> I've tracked down info needed to change this message.
>
> Do we want to use the following for the helpful URL --
> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
looks good (however, I've not yet read the complete text).
Is it possible to include a URL that is actually clickable? If not, the
user has to write it down and then input it into the browser's URL field
to get to the webpage. IMHO not really user-friendly.
If we can get it copyable - like in the About dialogbox - then it's for
sure better.
Marcus
>> I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser
>> sniffing could take care of language there. That does mean the
>> openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with
>> this.
>>
[ ... ]
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12/10/2014 11:08 PM, schrieb Kay Schenk:
>
> On 12/10/2014 08:52 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
>> "JRE is Defective" is an awful and unhelpful message in any
>> language.
>>
>> There is no programmatic basis for claiming that as a fact, and the
>> software certainly does not have a way of determining it. The
>> requested remedy is pretty opaque to ordinary users too.
>>
>> I suggest that this be modified somehow.
>>
>> It appears that this message arises because a 32-bit Java Runtime
>> Environment (JRE) is required for some functions.
>>
>> Somehow, there needs to be some sort of link or help that explains
>> what functions matter and what to do to enable them. That's what
>> users care about.
>>
>> Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it
>> seems something like
>>
>> "A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See
>> <helpful URL>."
>
> I've tracked down info needed to change this message.
>
> Do we want to use the following for the helpful URL --
> http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
looks good (however, I've not yet read the complete text).
Is it possible to include a URL that is actually clickable? If not, the
user has to write it down and then input it into the browser's URL field
to get to the webpage. IMHO not really user-friendly.
If we can get it copyable - like in the About dialogbox - then it's for
sure better.
Marcus
>> I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser
>> sniffing could take care of language there. That does mean the
>> openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with
>> this.
>>
>> Too much work?
>>
>> If someone holds my hand, I'm happy to help with that. I think
>> user-sensitive Forum folk like Rory will be indispensable in vetting
>> understandability and utility of the result.
>>
>> - Dennis
>>
>> -----Original Message----- From: Rory O'Farrell
>> [mailto:ofarrwrk@iol.ie] Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 23:22 To:
>> dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32
>>
>> [ ... ]
>>
>>
>> Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum
>>
>> "JRE is Defective No Java installation could be found Please check
>> your installation"
>>
>> [ ... ]
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Kay Schenk <ka...@gmail.com>.
On 12/10/2014 08:52 AM, Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> "JRE is Defective" is an awful and unhelpful message in any
> language.
>
> There is no programmatic basis for claiming that as a fact, and the
> software certainly does not have a way of determining it. The
> requested remedy is pretty opaque to ordinary users too.
>
> I suggest that this be modified somehow.
>
> It appears that this message arises because a 32-bit Java Runtime
> Environment (JRE) is required for some functions.
>
> Somehow, there needs to be some sort of link or help that explains
> what functions matter and what to do to enable them. That's what
> users care about.
>
> Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it
> seems something like
>
> "A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed for some operations. See
> <helpful URL>."
I've tracked down info needed to change this message.
Do we want to use the following for the helpful URL --
http://www.openoffice.org/download/common/java.html
>
> I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser
> sniffing could take care of language there. That does mean the
> openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with
> this.
>
> Too much work?
>
> If someone holds my hand, I'm happy to help with that. I think
> user-sensitive Forum folk like Rory will be indispensable in vetting
> understandability and utility of the result.
>
> - Dennis
>
> -----Original Message----- From: Rory O'Farrell
> [mailto:ofarrwrk@iol.ie] Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 23:22 To:
> dev@openoffice.apache.org Subject: Re: Java 32
>
> [ ... ]
>
>
> Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum
>
> "JRE is Defective No Java installation could be found Please check
> your installation"
>
> [ ... ]
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
MzK
"There's a bit of magic in everything,
and some loss to even things out."
-- Lou Reed
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RE: Java 32
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org>.
"JRE is Defective" is an awful and unhelpful message in any language.
There is no programmatic basis for claiming that as a fact, and the software certainly does not have a way of determining it. The requested remedy is pretty opaque to ordinary users too.
I suggest that this be modified somehow.
It appears that this message arises because a 32-bit Java Runtime Environment (JRE) is required for some functions.
Somehow, there needs to be some sort of link or help that explains what functions matter and what to do to enable them. That's what users care about.
Since the message is limited in length and must translate easily, it seems something like
"A 32-bit Java Runtime (JRE) is needed
for some operations. See <helpful URL>."
I assume the URL would not need to be translated, and browser sniffing could take care of language there.
That does mean the openoffice.org site needs a place with short URL for dealing with this.
Too much work?
If someone holds my hand, I'm happy to help with that. I think user-sensitive Forum folk like Rory will be indispensable in vetting understandability and utility of the result.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Rory O'Farrell [mailto:ofarrwrk@iol.ie]
Sent: Tuesday, December 9, 2014 23:22
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: Java 32
[ ... ]
Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum
"JRE is Defective
No Java installation could be found
Please check your installation"
[ ... ]
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Rory O'Farrell <of...@iol.ie>.
On Tue, 09 Dec 2014 23:01:01 +0000
Rory O'Farrell <of...@iol.ie> wrote:
>
>
> On 9 December 2014 22:19:41 GMT+00:00, Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de> wrote:
> >Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
> >> Marcus wrote:
> >>> Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
> >>>> If we are working towards a new release, could the "Java not found"
> >>> > message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could
> >be
> >>> > amended to say something like "OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java,
> >which
> >>> > has not been found on this machine". ...
> >>> Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code
> >to
> >>> extend it?
> >>
> >> If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find
> >it
> >> here (in English):
> >> http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/
> >
> >maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits.
> >;-)
>
> I'll uninstall Java on on unused windows machine tomorrow and catch the error message, but it is likely to be about 15 hours from now as I have meetings tomorrow morning. Going to bed now!
Here is the message as quoted on the en-Forum
"JRE is Defective
No Java installation could be found
Please check your installation"
> >
> >> If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but
> >in
> >> huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle:
> >> https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/
> >> and find the English original, then do the above.
> >>
> >> Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it
> >> and report the number here if you have doubts.
> >
> >OK, let's see.
> >
> >Marcus
> >
> >
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> >For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
> --
> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Rory O'Farrell <of...@iol.ie>.
On 9 December 2014 22:19:41 GMT+00:00, Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de> wrote:
>Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
>> Marcus wrote:
>>> Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
>>>> If we are working towards a new release, could the "Java not found"
>>> > message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could
>be
>>> > amended to say something like "OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java,
>which
>>> > has not been found on this machine". ...
>>> Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code
>to
>>> extend it?
>>
>> If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find
>it
>> here (in English):
>> http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/
>
>maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits.
>;-)
I'll uninstall Java on on unused windows machine tomorrow and catch the error message, but it is likely to be about 15 hours from now as I have meetings tomorrow morning. Going to bed now!
>
>> If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but
>in
>> huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle:
>> https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/
>> and find the English original, then do the above.
>>
>> Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it
>> and report the number here if you have doubts.
>
>OK, let's see.
>
>Marcus
>
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12/09/2014 11:10 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
> Marcus wrote:
>> Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
>>> If we are working towards a new release, could the "Java not found"
>> > message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be
>> > amended to say something like "OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which
>> > has not been found on this machine". ...
>> Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to
>> extend it?
>
> If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find it
> here (in English):
> http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/
maybe Rory can help here. It's easier than to search through 1560 hits. ;-)
> If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but in
> huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle:
> https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/
> and find the English original, then do the above.
>
> Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it
> and report the number here if you have doubts.
OK, let's see.
Marcus
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
Marcus wrote:
> Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
>> If we are working towards a new release, could the "Java not found"
> > message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be
> > amended to say something like "OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which
> > has not been found on this machine". ...
> Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to
> extend it?
If you have the exact error string, it should be fairly easy to find it
here (in English):
http://opengrok.adfinis-sygroup.org/source/
If you have a translation, the fastest way (it's in OpenGrok too, but in
huge files) is probably to search for it in Pootle:
https://translate.apache.org/projects/aoo40/
and find the English original, then do the above.
Fixing the message should be quite easy too, but open an issue for it
and report the number here if you have doubts.
Regards,
Andrea.
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Re: Java 32
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12/09/2014 06:23 PM, schrieb Rory O'Farrell:
>
> If we are working towards a new release, could the "Java not found"
> message from Windows be extended to be more informative? It could be
> amended to say something like "OpenOffice needs a 32 bit Java, which
> has not been found on this machine".
>
> Many Windows users know they have Java installed and are baffled
>when OO doesn't find it.
right, this could help indeed. Especially when the Win 64-bit users have
installed a 64-bit Java and now doesn't understand why AOO doesn't find
it - when actually a 32-bit Java needs to be found.
Of course this little addition in the sentence needs to be translated, too.
Do you (or someone else) know where to find the sentence in teh code to
extend it?
Marcus
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