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Posted to user@couchdb.apache.org by deadshox <de...@barfooz.de> on 2009/10/22 12:37:52 UTC
My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
I want to say hello to all couchDB users.
I am from Germany and found the Project for a few Weeks.
It is realy nice and i will give a little bit back.
My Questions is, are you intressted in an community board?
So i would do this.
I think its much easier to start with couchDB in a board,
for new users.
My plan, when you are interested:
- talk about for a domain
- set up a fluxBB.org Board, http://www.fluxbb.org
- and lets go. :D
Unfortunately i can't give any support for couchDB, i still learning.
What do you think about it?
---
Sorry for this miserable english.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 20:17, Sven Helmberger wrote:
> What about the equivalent to people who just know enough of
> programming and logic to be able to write SQL queries?
>
> Shouldn't those people have the chance to at least try their luck
> with couchdb map and reduce functions?
>
> If that is the case, a separate forum might be worthwhile.
I think forum vs. email is largely orthogonal to the level of
experience you have. Inexperienced users can still use mail. My sister
has been using mail since she was 8! Heh. But there are two ways we
could improve the current state of affairs. We could create a new
mailing list for absolute beginners - and in fact, we are already
considering doing something like that but for Ubuntu users. As a
seperate and unrelated effort, we could create a discussion board,
like the highly sucessful Ubuntu boards, for use by CouchDB users of
any level.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Sven Helmberger <sv...@gmx.de>.
Noah Slater schrieb:
>
> On 22 Oct 2009, at 18:55, Georges Racinet wrote:
>
>> Glad to hear that :-) Didn't he mean that users of CouchDB are mostly
>> developers anyway, though ?
>
> Dunno. I think it's a bit odd to suggest that CouchDB could ever be for
> non-developers.
>
> There's a lot of activity at the moment, from various sides, to make
> CouchDB ubiquitous. UbuntuOne is a good example. But in the case where a
> user is using CouchDB because it is used for some application they have,
> that does not mean that they should care that it uses CouchDB. SQLite is
> used by Mail.app, but that doesn't mean that Mail.app users care about
> SQLite. CouchDB is a tool in your toolchain so that you can build user
> applications. CouchDB itself is not a user application. Again, if
> someone built a non-JSON GUI for CouchDB, then that would be a user
> application - but the CouchDB core is still just a tool. Maybe I'm
> talking shit. I'm sure I will be corrected if I am.
What about the equivalent to people who just know enough of programming
and logic to be able to write SQL queries?
Shouldn't those people have the chance to at least try their luck with
couchdb map and reduce functions?
If that is the case, a separate forum might be worthwhile.
Regards,
Sven Helmberger
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 20:05, Jim Kass wrote:
> It all depends on your definition of developer.
>
> In context I think it meant code contributors.
Sure, I guess it does depend on the context.
To clarify:
* I think that all direct users of CouchDB will be, in their own
right, developers.
* A CouchDB Developer is someone who contributes the CouchDB project.
Pretty confusing!
I guess we could use "developer" and "Developer" to distinguish. Heh.
Maybe even more confusing!
Anyway, the user@ list is for both of those types of people.
Hope this helps!
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Jim Kass <ji...@nhrevolution.com>.
It all depends on your definition of developer.
In context I think it meant code contributors.
To compare, think how many people use MySQL and how many of those are
on the mysql mailing list.
-Jim
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 22, 2009, at 11:01 AM, Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org> wrote:
>
> On 22 Oct 2009, at 18:55, Georges Racinet wrote:
>
>> Glad to hear that :-) Didn't he mean that users of CouchDB are mostly
>> developers anyway, though ?
>
> Dunno. I think it's a bit odd to suggest that CouchDB could ever be
> for non-developers.
>
> There's a lot of activity at the moment, from various sides, to make
> CouchDB ubiquitous. UbuntuOne is a good example. But in the case
> where a user is using CouchDB because it is used for some
> application they have, that does not mean that they should care that
> it uses CouchDB. SQLite is used by Mail.app, but that doesn't mean
> that Mail.app users care about SQLite. CouchDB is a tool in your
> toolchain so that you can build user applications. CouchDB itself is
> not a user application. Again, if someone built a non-JSON GUI for
> CouchDB, then that would be a user application - but the CouchDB
> core is still just a tool. Maybe I'm talking shit. I'm sure I will
> be corrected if I am.
>
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Nathan Stott <nr...@gmail.com>.
I'm in the process of creating a couchdb stackoverflow site. CouchDb is
working wonderfully for it!
On Fri, Oct 23, 2009 at 1:36 PM, Chris Anderson <jc...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 6:51 PM, Daniel Brüggemann <db...@barfooz.de> wrote:
> > The mailing list and the Discussion Board can exist
> > together, side by side.
> > It exist a lot of users, they don't like mailing list.
>
> I for one would like to see a web-based board. I don't think there is
> much of a rush, so it'd make sense to do it as a pure CouchApp, so it
> can easily be replicated.
>
> Maybe it'd be better to structure it as an FAQ with comments. Heh,
> maybe it'd make sense to punt on a CouchApp and just create a CouchDB
> Stack Overflow site or something.
>
> Chris
>
>
> > For me, i think, it is easier to post in a board for
> > a problem as in a mailing list.
> > Different people, different tasts.
> >
> > I didn't want to corrupt the mailing list or delete
> > the mailing list or whatever.
> >
> > Its not if better there are two or more ways to get
> > support to couchdb?
> > So you can raise lot of more people.
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Chris Anderson
> http://jchrisa.net
> http://couch.io
>
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Chris Anderson <jc...@apache.org>.
On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 6:51 PM, Daniel Brüggemann <db...@barfooz.de> wrote:
> The mailing list and the Discussion Board can exist
> together, side by side.
> It exist a lot of users, they don't like mailing list.
I for one would like to see a web-based board. I don't think there is
much of a rush, so it'd make sense to do it as a pure CouchApp, so it
can easily be replicated.
Maybe it'd be better to structure it as an FAQ with comments. Heh,
maybe it'd make sense to punt on a CouchApp and just create a CouchDB
Stack Overflow site or something.
Chris
> For me, i think, it is easier to post in a board for
> a problem as in a mailing list.
> Different people, different tasts.
>
> I didn't want to corrupt the mailing list or delete
> the mailing list or whatever.
>
> Its not if better there are two or more ways to get
> support to couchdb?
> So you can raise lot of more people.
>
--
Chris Anderson
http://jchrisa.net
http://couch.io
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Daniel Brüggemann <db...@barfooz.de>.
The mailing list and the Discussion Board can exist
together, side by side.
It exist a lot of users, they don't like mailing list.
For me, i think, it is easier to post in a board for
a problem as in a mailing list.
Different people, different tasts.
I didn't want to corrupt the mailing list or delete
the mailing list or whatever.
Its not if better there are two or more ways to get
support to couchdb?
So you can raise lot of more people.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 18:55, Georges Racinet wrote:
> Glad to hear that :-) Didn't he mean that users of CouchDB are mostly
> developers anyway, though ?
Dunno. I think it's a bit odd to suggest that CouchDB could ever be
for non-developers.
There's a lot of activity at the moment, from various sides, to make
CouchDB ubiquitous. UbuntuOne is a good example. But in the case where
a user is using CouchDB because it is used for some application they
have, that does not mean that they should care that it uses CouchDB.
SQLite is used by Mail.app, but that doesn't mean that Mail.app users
care about SQLite. CouchDB is a tool in your toolchain so that you can
build user applications. CouchDB itself is not a user application.
Again, if someone built a non-JSON GUI for CouchDB, then that would be
a user application - but the CouchDB core is still just a tool. Maybe
I'm talking shit. I'm sure I will be corrected if I am.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Georges Racinet <ge...@racinet.fr>.
On Thu, 2009-10-22 at 14:56 +0100, Noah Slater wrote:
> On 22 Oct 2009, at 14:40, Oliver Oli wrote:
>
> > but even the couchdb user list is for developers. i don't have the
> > capacity, to switch constantly between all kinds of different
> > communication platforms.
>
> Nope, the user@ list is provided as a catch-all for those who are
> not
> interested in @dev which also covers the development of CouchDB.
Glad to hear that :-) Didn't he mean that users of CouchDB are mostly
developers anyway, though ?
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 18:58, Daniel Brüggemann wrote:
> No no, i think a discussion board is for the masses
> and a mailing list is for developer. ;)
Well, this simply isn't true. But I understand YOU want a discussion
board.
> Couchdb has nothing to do with.
You're missing a word there.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 22:01, Paul Davis wrote:
> Does that mean we're not switching to Google Wave?
Well, I was going to suggest we move it all to Twitter, dev@ included.
Last time I checked, JPEG parsers ignore garbage at the end of the
file, so theoretically, we could cat a photo of Damien with the
release artifact, and then distribute via Twitpic. Welcome to the
future.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 22:16, Oliver Oli wrote:
> 1. i have a google wave account, but nobody waves to me. when will
> couchdb speak the wave protocol?
"Every program attempts to expand until it can read mail. Those
programs which cannot so expand are replaced by ones which can."
I guess Zawinski's Law of Software Envelopment needs updating for 2009.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Oliver Oli <ol...@gmail.com>.
On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 11:08 PM, Sebastian Cohnen
<se...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>> We will certainly NOT be getting rid of this list.
>>
>> Does that mean we're not switching to Google Wave?
>
> +1 on google wave ;-)
+1. i have a google wave account, but nobody waves to me. when will
couchdb speak the wave protocol?
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Sebastian Cohnen <se...@googlemail.com>.
On 22.10.2009, at 23:01, Paul Davis wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 4:53 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>
> wrote:
>>
>> On 22 Oct 2009, at 21:48, Daniel Trümper wrote:
>>
>>> no board please! The list is perfect for me. So if there would be an
>>> apache style voting, mine would be +1 for the list...
>>
>> We will certainly NOT be getting rid of this list.
>
> Does that mean we're not switching to Google Wave?
+1 on google wave ;-)
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Paul Davis <pa...@gmail.com>.
On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 4:53 PM, Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org> wrote:
>
> On 22 Oct 2009, at 21:48, Daniel Trümper wrote:
>
>> no board please! The list is perfect for me. So if there would be an
>> apache style voting, mine would be +1 for the list...
>
> We will certainly NOT be getting rid of this list.
Does that mean we're not switching to Google Wave?
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 21:48, Daniel Trümper wrote:
> no board please! The list is perfect for me. So if there would be an
> apache style voting, mine would be +1 for the list...
We will certainly NOT be getting rid of this list.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Daniel Trümper <da...@googlemail.com>.
Hi,
no board please! The list is perfect for me. So if there would be an
apache style voting, mine would be +1 for the list...
My 2 cents
Daniel
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Sebastian Cohnen <se...@googlemail.com>.
what I meant was, that the mass will never work with couchdb. couchdb
is only a tool or a backend for applications. the "masses" will "use"
couchdb not develop for it.
On 22.10.2009, at 19:58, Daniel Brüggemann wrote:
> No no, i think a discussion board is for the masses
> and a mailing list is for developer. ;)
> Couchdb has nothing to do with.
>
> On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 19:52:35 +0200, Sebastian Cohnen
> <se...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>>> I think a discussion board is for the
>>> masses and a mailing list is for the developer.
>>
>> CouchDB is for the masses and not for developers?
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Daniel Brüggemann <db...@barfooz.de>.
No no, i think a discussion board is for the masses
and a mailing list is for developer. ;)
Couchdb has nothing to do with.
On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 19:52:35 +0200, Sebastian Cohnen
<se...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> I think a discussion board is for the
>> masses and a mailing list is for the developer.
>
> CouchDB is for the masses and not for developers?
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Sebastian Cohnen <se...@googlemail.com>.
> I think a discussion board is for the
> masses and a mailing list is for the developer.
CouchDB is for the masses and not for developers?
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Federico <fe...@gmail.com>.
> It's not approval you need with community software, it's the support of the
> community.
Exactly.
I think that If theres the need and the way you choose to fullfil that
need is right....then support of the community will follow.
Remember his propose whas related to the need for support for new users.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 22:12, Federico wrote:
> Why can't you just build the board you want??
> Why do you think you need this list's approval?
It's not approval you need with community software, it's the support
of the community.
This is a crucial point, and so discussing this here is very sensible!
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Federico <fe...@gmail.com>.
Why can't you just build the board you want??
Why do you think you need this list's approval?
On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 2:46 PM, deadshox <de...@barfooz.de> wrote:
> I can't understand it.
> Where is the problem for a discussion board?
> Ok it doesn't use CouchDB, but thats not the
> topic.
> I think a discussion board is for the
> masses and a mailing list is for the developer.
>
> When there is no need for a discussion board,
> i forget it.
>
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by deadshox <de...@barfooz.de>.
I can't understand it.
Where is the problem for a discussion board?
Ok it doesn't use CouchDB, but thats not the
topic.
I think a discussion board is for the
masses and a mailing list is for the developer.
When there is no need for a discussion board,
i forget it.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 14:40, Oliver Oli wrote:
> but even the couchdb user list is for developers. i don't have the
> capacity, to switch constantly between all kinds of different
> communication platforms.
Nope, the user@ list is provided as a catch-all for those who are not
interested in @dev which also covers the development of CouchDB.
> i see this over and over again. a new users joins the mailing list and
> the first thing he proposes is to install yet another php/mysql web
> forum app. lucky for me, none of the mailing lists switched to a web
> forum. so, good luck! ;)
I've been with this project for over two years now, and the only
change we ever made was to switch FROM a board to a mailing list.
This is the first time in my memory that it has been suggested to use
a board again.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Oliver Oli <ol...@gmail.com>.
On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 3:07 PM, Sven Helmberger <sv...@gmx.de> wrote:
> Noah Slater schrieb:
>> [...] I know some people (usually people who are not as technically
>> experienced)
>>
>> prefer discussion boards [...]
>
> That's my impression, too.. Or expressed the other way around, the common
> developer's love for mailing list is usually not share among the general
> public.
but even the couchdb user list is for developers. i don't have the
capacity, to switch constantly between all kinds of different
communication platforms.
i see this over and over again. a new users joins the mailing list and
the first thing he proposes is to install yet another php/mysql web
forum app. lucky for me, none of the mailing lists switched to a web
forum. so, good luck! ;)
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Sven Helmberger <sv...@gmx.de>.
Noah Slater schrieb:
> [...] I know some people (usually people who are not as technically
experienced)
> prefer discussion boards [...]
That's my impression, too.. Or expressed the other way around, the
common developer's love for mailing list is usually not share among the
general public.
Regards,
Sven Helmberger
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Noah Slater <ns...@tumbolia.org>.
On 22 Oct 2009, at 11:54, Oliver Oli wrote:
> the mailing list is fine for me. there is a good archive too. please,
> not another communication channel.
Ubuntu uses discussion boards and mailing lists to great success, and
I know some people (usually people who are not as technically
experienced) prefer discussion boards, and that seems okay to me. If
this was going to happen, my instinct tells me it should either be an
Ubuntu board (Ubuntu people care to chime in?) or something hosted on
Apache infrastructure (ASF people care to chime in?) - of course you
are free to do what you want (community software FTW) but if you want
this to reach as many people as possible, you should try to do it
through the proper channels. I don't care if the discussion board is
done in CouchDB or not. I don't think it matters.
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Sven Helmberger <sv...@gmx.de>.
Oliver Oli schrieb:
> the mailing list is fine for me. there is a good archive too. please,
> not another communication channel.
>
> if people really prefer a web forum, it has to be couchdb based :-).
>
What do you mean with "couchdb based" ? Being a standalone CouchDB App
or being a traditional server-side app whose data happens to be stored
in CouchDB?
I recently released a example application for jcouchdb called Hood
( http://jcouchdb.googlecode.com/files/hood-beta-2.zip ) which
could be used as basis for a board thing. Its spring security
integration (which would also offer OpenID integration) could solve the
aforementioned security problems.
On the other hand I always felt that my Java lib is very much the
redheaded step-child among CouchDB language integrations, so people
might not like that..
Regards,
Sven
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Oliver Oli <ol...@gmail.com>.
the mailing list is fine for me. there is a good archive too. please,
not another communication channel.
if people really prefer a web forum, it has to be couchdb based :-).
On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 12:37 PM, deadshox <de...@barfooz.de> wrote:
> I want to say hello to all couchDB users.
>
> I am from Germany and found the Project for a few Weeks.
> It is realy nice and i will give a little bit back.
>
> My Questions is, are you intressted in an community board?
> So i would do this.
> I think its much easier to start with couchDB in a board,
> for new users.
>
> My plan, when you are interested:
> - talk about for a domain
> - set up a fluxBB.org Board, http://www.fluxbb.org
> - and lets go. :D
>
> Unfortunately i can't give any support for couchDB, i still learning.
>
>
> What do you think about it?
>
>
> ---
> Sorry for this miserable english.
>
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by deadshox <de...@barfooz.de>.
Ok, i think the same, but it doesn't exist a couchDB discussion board,
or?
At the time, i work on a content management system with couchCD support.
But i still learning to work with couchdb, so my day is too short.
On Thu, 22 Oct 2009 11:48:58 +0100, Alan Bell
<al...@theopenlearningcentre.com> wrote:
> well I think a web based discussion board isn't a bad idea, but it would
> be best to have one served up by CouchDB. One that was available for
> public replication would be cool, not sure the security model is up to
> that yet though.
>
> Alan.
>
> deadshox wrote:
>> I want to say hello to all couchDB users.
>>
>> I am from Germany and found the Project for a few Weeks.
>> It is realy nice and i will give a little bit back.
>>
>> My Questions is, are you intressted in an community board?
>> So i would do this.
>> I think its much easier to start with couchDB in a board,
>> for new users.
>>
>> My plan, when you are interested:
>> - talk about for a domain
>> - set up a fluxBB.org Board, http://www.fluxbb.org
>> - and lets go. :D
>>
>> Unfortunately i can't give any support for couchDB, i still learning.
>>
>>
>> What do you think about it?
>>
>>
>> ---
>> Sorry for this miserable english.
>>
Re: My first time i wrote to a mailing list.
Posted by Alan Bell <al...@theopenlearningcentre.com>.
well I think a web based discussion board isn't a bad idea, but it would
be best to have one served up by CouchDB. One that was available for
public replication would be cool, not sure the security model is up to
that yet though.
Alan.
deadshox wrote:
> I want to say hello to all couchDB users.
>
> I am from Germany and found the Project for a few Weeks.
> It is realy nice and i will give a little bit back.
>
> My Questions is, are you intressted in an community board?
> So i would do this.
> I think its much easier to start with couchDB in a board,
> for new users.
>
> My plan, when you are interested:
> - talk about for a domain
> - set up a fluxBB.org Board, http://www.fluxbb.org
> - and lets go. :D
>
> Unfortunately i can't give any support for couchDB, i still learning.
>
>
> What do you think about it?
>
>
> ---
> Sorry for this miserable english.
>