[Struts Wiki] Update of "DefinePita" by DakotaJack

[Apache Wiki <wi...@apache.org>]

Dear Wiki user,

You have subscribed to a wiki page or wiki category on "Struts Wiki" for change notification.

The following page has been changed by DakotaJack:
http://wiki.apache.org/struts/DefinePita

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
   * Interjecting pet topics into any given thread ("hijacking").
   * Replying to your own rants.
   * Thinking being a PITA is a good thing.
+  * Focusing on persons rather than on principles.
+  * Using ad hominem remarks or labels rather than reasoned discussion
+  * Responding to a thread without reading it first.
+  * Collecting allies rather than information.
  

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org

Re: [Struts Wiki] Update of "DefinePita" by DakotaJack

[Ted Husted <te...@gmail.com>]

On 5/6/05, Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Your note, Ted, seems to make an assumption that I am talking about
> some "we" which includes you and the community.  That is not true.  I
> find almost all the people on this list exemplary, hekpful,
> insightful, and plain just dandy..  And, I really have no difficulty
> in myself with you either, although I find you philosophy lacking.  I
> was adding values which I think are real and which are commonly
> breached by a few people.  I think we can leave this to consensus?

First, I should apologize for posting the additional definitions here.
At this point, the right path seems to be to move these to the Apache
Incubator area, and, as mentioned, add some definitions for other
Apache words and phrases. We've gotten away from the scope of the
Struts project, and into the scope of the Apache Incubator.

The only motivation for the new entries was happenstance. While
looking for something else, I happened to come across an old post by
Ken Coar (a longtime member of the HTTPD team, ASF officer, and
ApacheCon organizer) to members@, where he mentioned that someone was
"not interested in the Truth, only in Being Right", and that Ken
wasn't going to respond to any more of that person's "trolls".

So, having posted PITA here, I went ahead and added Trolls. But, I
think it's time for these "daffy-nitions" to move to the Incubator,
where they belong. As our XP friends say, "Do it right the first
time." <head-slap/>

Again, I apologize for wasting Struts bandwidth with this, and,
hopefully, we can now return the business of this forum to the
forthcoming 1.2.7 and 1.3.0 releases :)

-Ted.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org

Re: [Struts Wiki] Update of "DefinePita" by DakotaJack

[Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com>]

Your note, Ted, seems to make an assumption that I am talking about
some "we" which includes you and the community.  That is not true.  I
find almost all the people on this list exemplary, hekpful,
insightful, and plain just dandy..  And, I really have no difficulty
in myself with you either, although I find you philosophy lacking.  I
was adding values which I think are real and which are commonly
breached by a few people.  I think we can leave this to consensus?


-- 
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org

Re: [Struts Wiki] Update of "DefinePita" by DakotaJack

[Ted Husted <te...@gmail.com>]

On 5/5/05, Apache Wiki <wi...@apache.org> wrote:
> +  * Focusing on persons rather than on principles.
> +  * Using ad hominem remarks or labels rather than reasoned discussion
> +  * Responding to a thread without reading it first.
> +  * Collecting allies rather than information.

Hmmm, not so much. :)

The ASF is a meritocracy. People earn merit by doing things that
matter to other people. We're a people-place. We're driven by
warm-and-squishy ideas like consensus and agreement.

It's cool to have neat code, but what's really important to us is the
community that creates the code. The code itself, and all the reasoned
logic behind it, is a byproduct.

Great communities create great code, but, paradoxically, great code,
by itself, doesn't build great communities. If we have to choose
between code and community, we'll take community every time.

What these definitions say is that it's not about Being Right, it's
about finding the right path.

The right path, for us, is  dictated by consensus. Each one of us
might feel some other path is "better", but the right path is the one
we can all walk together.

So, are we 

* Focusing on persons rather than on principles?

Our primary principle is meritocracy: Or, "them that do the work make
the decisions". So, yes, we do focus on people. Without volunteers,
there is no project. People are our only working capital.

Are we in the habit of

* Using ad hominem remarks or labels rather than reasoned discussion?

Yes, Apaches often say zen-like things like "Merit never expires" and
"Thanks for volunteering". Often, these remarks represents discussions
we've already had many, many times.

Might we be 

* Responding to a thread without reading it first?

Not often, but when a thread is going sour, people may sometimes try
to change the subject. Not to hijack the thread, but to rescue it.

Are we

* Collecting allies rather than information?

In a meritocracy, allies matter. Information doesn't do the work. Allies do. 

-Ted.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org