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Posted to dev@subversion.apache.org by Mark Watts <mw...@stny.rr.com> on 2004/04/09 18:00:30 UTC
Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
I would like to respectfully ask the Subversion developers consider fixing
whatever prevents the Perl bindings from being build on Win32 platforms for
the next release?
Justification/Reasoning:
SVK offers a huge amount of functionality that users are requesting. Over
the last several days I have seen several different users present situations
that can be addressed by using SVK. John Peacock has answered a number of
those emails and directed the users to SVK as a solution. I also know that
my work environment would be made easier if the merge and distributed
capabilities of SVK were available on the Windows platforms.
Now, I know that some of the features that SVK implements are intended to be
implemented in Subversion itself eventually. However, the emails and
discussions doing the planning for that release have not included any
mention (unless I missed it, which is possible) of the smart merge and
distributed capabilities. And I understand that, these are major features
that will take some time to design and implement.
Given that it will be some time, perhaps years, before Subversion will be
able to provide some of these features itself and that some of these
features are already available in SVK I would like to be able to use SVK.
However, I can't because the Perl bindings don't compile on Windows.
I have asked on the SVK mailing list and one of the developers graciously
reported that he spent about 6 hours trying to get them working. And he
also indicated that he was one of about 3 people who had tried to get them
working. Which begs the question: What about the Perl bindings is it that
causes them to work just fine on Linux and are so totally broken on Windows.
Please understand: I realize I am not a SVN developer, just a user, and that
as such I have very little input into what the priorities are. I just think
that the feature set available in SVK is so compelling that not having them
available on Windows is a big deal.
I suspect that there are other Windows Subversion users out there that would
also find a huge benefit in using SVK.
Respectfully,
-Mark Watts
PS: I don't have a choice about using the Windows platform. My customers
use it and therefore so must I.
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Re: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by "Michael S. Liebman" <m-...@northwestern.edu>.
At 02:43 PM 4/9/2004, Ben Reser wrote:
>This is really frustrating to hear. None of these people have reported
>the problems they experienced. None of these people have tried to work
>with me.
I mentioned a couple of things on users@ a couple of weeks ago, but I'll
bring them up again here. (I realize some of this might be moot in light of
Chris Foote's email, but what the heck...)
The first problem I ran into was the 'long long'/__int64 issue. I'll send a
patch for that in a bit.
Now that I resolved the 'long long' issue, I'm getting linker errors.
> Creating library
> ..\..\..\Release\subversion/bindings/swig\perl/_client.lib and object
> ..\..\..\Release\subversion/bindings/swig\perl/_client.exp
>libsvn_swig_perl-1.lib(swigutil_pl.obj) : error LNK2001: unresolved
>external symbol _snprintf
>..\..\..\Release\subversion/bindings/swig\perl\_client.dll : fatal error
>LNK1120: 1 unresolved externals
>Error executing link.exe.
Unfortunately, I have no idea how to proceed from here.
Michael
--
Michael S. Liebman m-liebman@northwestern.edu
http://msl521.freeshell.org/
"I have vision and the rest of the world wears bifocals."
-Paul Newman in "Butch Cassidy & the Sundance Kid"
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Re: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by "D.J. Heap" <dj...@shadyvale.net>.
Ben Reser wrote:
[snip]
> Ultimately, this hasn't happened because someone with the platform and
> the necessary tools hasn't made it a priority to make it work. I'll
> help anyway I can. But unless someone decides to buy me the necessary
> Windows software and pay me for my time I'm not going to do it myself.
> I suspect clkao is in a similar position.
>
> So once again, I'm making myself available. Drop me an email, catch me
> on IRC, etc... I'll do what I can to help.
>
This is using swig still, right? Getting swig working with python and
perl specifically is on my list of things to look at after finishing
gettext stuff. But my time is limited so it won't all that soon, probably.
My last swig-1.3.21 email is still where I'm at on the python bindings
-- any ideas on that? Basically it builds and everything seems fine,
but it looks like some wrapper .py files for the swig-genned dll's are
not being generated or something. Once I get that working I planned on
making sure perl worked and probably java, too...but again this is
limited to my available time.
DJ
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Re: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Ben Reser <be...@reser.org>.
On Fri, Apr 09, 2004 at 09:47:34PM -0500, Dave Rolsky wrote:
> If you're referring to Module::Build, then you're pretty far off here. It
> is fairly complete, and it does handle building XS with no problem, and
> recent versions should build XS on Win32 fine, as long you have a compiler
> available.
If so then the documentation is wrong because I was reading the
documentation on it just a few weeks ago looking at it to replace what
we're using now. I'm still not inclined to use it as a replacement for
MakeMaker until it's included with Perl, which from what the docs were
saying might happen with 5.10
> I think the problem, from what I've heard from CL Kao and others, is
> related to getting Swig working with Perl on Win32, not the build system.
I doubt that. We have Python bindings already working on Win32. There
are even instructions on it in the Perl5 section of the SWIG
documentation. So I'd say the issues are completely build
system/environment related.
--
Ben Reser <be...@reser.org>
http://ben.reser.org
"Conscience is the inner voice which warns us somebody may be looking."
- H.L. Mencken
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Re: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Dave Rolsky <au...@urth.org>.
On Fri, 9 Apr 2004, Ben Reser wrote:
> script and avoids the dependency on make. However, it's not complete,
> really can't handle building C files yet, and isn't included in Perl.
> Which means if I tried to switch to using it, I'd inconvience all the
> Unix installations just to try and make things easier for Windows.
If you're referring to Module::Build, then you're pretty far off here. It
is fairly complete, and it does handle building XS with no problem, and
recent versions should build XS on Win32 fine, as long you have a compiler
available.
I think the problem, from what I've heard from CL Kao and others, is
related to getting Swig working with Perl on Win32, not the build system.
-dave
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Re: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Chia-Liang Kao <cl...@clkao.org>.
On Sat, Apr 10, 2004 at 03:14:49PM +0100, Chris Foote wrote:
> I have managed to get the perl bindings to build on Win XP, but still need
> to
> integrate it into the make generator.
Could you give a howto and points to note for building perl bindings on win32?
> I also currently have no way to verify the it is compatible with the *nix
> version.
> I guess it would be a good start though.
Does the included test suites pass?
Cheers,
CLK
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RE: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Mark Watts <mw...@stny.rr.com>.
Chris,
That's great to hear! Up to now, nobody has indicated that it was even
possible, despite Perl being one of the primary supported languages for
SWIG.
Are these binaries available anywhere for 1.0.1? I would love to try and
work with SVK a bit while I am on the road. Also would you mind sending me
a diff of any changes you had to make against the subversion WC so I can
also try to build it myself?
-Mark
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Chris Foote [mailto:cfoote@v21.me.uk]
> Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2004 10:15
> To: Mark Watts; 'Ben Reser'; dev@subversion.tigris.org
> Subject: Re: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
>
> I have managed to get the perl bindings to build on Win XP,
> but still need to integrate it into the make generator.
>
> I also currently have no way to verify the it is compatible
> with the *nix version.
> I guess it would be a good start though.
>
> Chris
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Watts" <mw...@stny.rr.com>
> To: "'Ben Reser'" <be...@reser.org>; <de...@subversion.tigris.org>
> Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2004 1:31 PM
> Subject: RE: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
>
>
> > > From: Ben Reser [mailto:ben@reser.org]
> > [snip]
> > > So once again, I'm making myself available. Drop me an
> > > email, catch me on IRC, etc... I'll do what I can to help.
> >
> > Thanks for the offer. I probably take you up on it.
> However, I need to
> get
> > Subversion building first and I have a busy 10 days ahead
> of me with a
> > client trip so it will have to be after that.
> >
> > I spent about 3 hours last night trying compile subversion
> with no luck so
> > far. I only have VS.NET installed and it would appear that
> even though
> the
> > INSTALL file says VC 6.0 or greater it really means use VC
> 6.0, so I will
> > have to install that. I get an error trying to build the
> resource file
> for
> > the subversion executables. "Cannot find missing
> dependency 'strings.h'
> > for file 'svn.rc'".
> >
> > I will keep plugging away at it and get back with you about the Perl
> > bindings once I have subversion building and passing tests.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > -Mark
> >
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
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Re: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Chris Foote <cf...@v21.me.uk>.
I have managed to get the perl bindings to build on Win XP, but still need
to
integrate it into the make generator.
I also currently have no way to verify the it is compatible with the *nix
version.
I guess it would be a good start though.
Chris
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Watts" <mw...@stny.rr.com>
To: "'Ben Reser'" <be...@reser.org>; <de...@subversion.tigris.org>
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2004 1:31 PM
Subject: RE: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
> > From: Ben Reser [mailto:ben@reser.org]
> [snip]
> > So once again, I'm making myself available. Drop me an
> > email, catch me on IRC, etc... I'll do what I can to help.
>
> Thanks for the offer. I probably take you up on it. However, I need to
get
> Subversion building first and I have a busy 10 days ahead of me with a
> client trip so it will have to be after that.
>
> I spent about 3 hours last night trying compile subversion with no luck so
> far. I only have VS.NET installed and it would appear that even though
the
> INSTALL file says VC 6.0 or greater it really means use VC 6.0, so I will
> have to install that. I get an error trying to build the resource file
for
> the subversion executables. "Cannot find missing dependency 'strings.h'
> for file 'svn.rc'".
>
> I will keep plugging away at it and get back with you about the Perl
> bindings once I have subversion building and passing tests.
>
> Thanks
>
> -Mark
>
>
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>
>
>
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RE: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Mark Watts <mw...@stny.rr.com>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Arild Fines [mailto:arild.fines@broadpark.no]
>
> Mark Watts wrote:
> > I only have VS.NET installed and it would appear that even
> though the
> > INSTALL file says VC 6.0 or greater it really means use VC
> 6.0, so I
> > will have to install that.
>
> Subversion is definitely buildable using VS.NET. The AnkhSVN
> project has been building Subversion using VS.NET for over a year now.
>
OK. I will just have to figure out what is wrong/missing from my build
steps. Thanks
-Mark
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RE: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Arild Fines <ar...@broadpark.no>.
Mark Watts wrote:
> I only have VS.NET installed and it would appear that even though the
> INSTALL file says VC 6.0 or greater it really means use VC 6.0, so I will
> have to install that.
Subversion is definitely buildable using VS.NET. The AnkhSVN project has
been building Subversion using VS.NET for over a year now.
--
Arild
AnkhSVN: http://ankhsvn.tigris.org
Blog: http://ankhsvn.com/blog
IRC: irc://irc.freenode.net/ankhsvn
"We've got to find out what people want from fire, how they relate to it,
what sort of image it has for them.' The crowd were tense. They were
expecting something wonderful from Ford.`Stick it up your nose,' he
said.`Which is precisely the sort of thing we need to know,' insisted the
girl, `Do people want fire that can be fitted nasally?'"
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RE: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Mark Watts <mw...@stny.rr.com>.
> From: Ben Reser [mailto:ben@reser.org]
[snip]
> So once again, I'm making myself available. Drop me an
> email, catch me on IRC, etc... I'll do what I can to help.
Thanks for the offer. I probably take you up on it. However, I need to get
Subversion building first and I have a busy 10 days ahead of me with a
client trip so it will have to be after that.
I spent about 3 hours last night trying compile subversion with no luck so
far. I only have VS.NET installed and it would appear that even though the
INSTALL file says VC 6.0 or greater it really means use VC 6.0, so I will
have to install that. I get an error trying to build the resource file for
the subversion executables. "Cannot find missing dependency 'strings.h'
for file 'svn.rc'".
I will keep plugging away at it and get back with you about the Perl
bindings once I have subversion building and passing tests.
Thanks
-Mark
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Re: Next Release: Perl Bindings Fixed for Win32?
Posted by Ben Reser <be...@reser.org>.
On Fri, Apr 09, 2004 at 02:00:30PM -0400, Mark Watts wrote:
> I would like to respectfully ask the Subversion developers consider fixing
> whatever prevents the Perl bindings from being build on Win32 platforms for
> the next release?
I'd love to do this. I have 1 copy of Windows. But I don't have a
development environment for it and it runs under vmware which means it
is absurdly slow. So I won't do this myself.
> Given that it will be some time, perhaps years, before Subversion will be
> able to provide some of these features itself and that some of these
> features are already available in SVK I would like to be able to use SVK.
> However, I can't because the Perl bindings don't compile on Windows.
I'm really not entirely sure here. I've offered on multiple ocassions
to work with people to get this figured out. Nobody has really taken me
up on this.
Perl's build system is very Unix centric. Currently, a perl script runs
that builds a Makefile that is suitable for the systems make. There is
a new system being built (for perl) that does everything from the perl
script and avoids the dependency on make. However, it's not complete,
really can't handle building C files yet, and isn't included in Perl.
Which means if I tried to switch to using it, I'd inconvience all the
Unix installations just to try and make things easier for Windows.
Someone asked a while back if we could find a way to build the Perl
bindings without make. I said that it was simply easier for them to
install make than for me to re-engineer the entire perl build system.
Since then it has come to my attention that Microsoft development tools
ship with "nmake" which if your Perl install is properly configured
the Makefile.PL should be able to build a makefile that will work with
nmake.
> I have asked on the SVK mailing list and one of the developers graciously
> reported that he spent about 6 hours trying to get them working. And he
> also indicated that he was one of about 3 people who had tried to get them
> working. Which begs the question: What about the Perl bindings is it that
> causes them to work just fine on Linux and are so totally broken on Windows.
This is really frustrating to hear. None of these people have reported
the problems they experienced. None of these people have tried to work
with me.
> Please understand: I realize I am not a SVN developer, just a user, and that
> as such I have very little input into what the priorities are. I just think
> that the feature set available in SVK is so compelling that not having them
> available on Windows is a big deal.
>
> I suspect that there are other Windows Subversion users out there that would
> also find a huge benefit in using SVK.
I agree. I want the Perl bindings to build and work on Windows. But I
can't do it alone. We've had problems with other platforms (OS X) in
the past that we've fixed. I don't see dealing with this as any
different than other platforms.
Ultimately, this hasn't happened because someone with the platform and
the necessary tools hasn't made it a priority to make it work. I'll
help anyway I can. But unless someone decides to buy me the necessary
Windows software and pay me for my time I'm not going to do it myself.
I suspect clkao is in a similar position.
So once again, I'm making myself available. Drop me an email, catch me
on IRC, etc... I'll do what I can to help.
--
Ben Reser <be...@reser.org>
http://ben.reser.org
"Conscience is the inner voice which warns us somebody may be looking."
- H.L. Mencken
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