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Posted to general@incubator.apache.org by "Geir Magnusson Jr." <ge...@optonline.net> on 2003/08/05 17:41:18 UTC
[PROPOSAL] An Apache J2EE server project
Proposal for an Apache J2EE server project
==========================================
05 Aug 2003 : Geir Magnusson Jr., James Strachan and Richard
Monson-Haefel
Section 0 : Rationale
---------------------
The Java 2, Enterprise Edition (J2EE) platform is employed widely by
organizations implementing enterprise applications. It is commonly used
in
business-to-consumer and most recently in Web service deployments.
Most of
the largest business organizations today have deployed applications on a
J2EE platform.
While the J2EE specification is implemented by a number of large and
small
vendors, there is no open source J2EE container available with a BSD or
BSD-derived licence nor is there an open source project today that
provides
a fully compliant implementation. Verifiable compliance with the J2EE
specification is important to business because it ensures that
applications
deployed by developers are portable and interoperable across J2EE
providers.
As a result organizations large and small have felt compelled to pay
thousands of dollars to commercial vendors in order to deploy
applications
based on J2EE compliant servers.
The Apache foundation supports several projects that implement pieces
of the
J2EE platform such as Servlets, JSP, Tag Libraries, and a Web services
stack. However, Apache does not currently support a J2EE project.
The aim of the project is to produce a large and healthy community of
J2EE
developers tasked with the development of an open source, certified J2EE
server which is ASF licensed and passes Sun's TCK reusing the best
ASF/BSD
licensed code available today and adding new code to complete the J2EE
stack.
Section 0.1 : criteria
----------------------
We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the following
project aspects are carefully considered :
a) Meritocracy: The project will be meritocratic - the usual Apache
meritocracy rules would apply.
b) Community: The user community for this project is potentially
massive.
The initial developer community for this project consists of developers
from
Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j, and OpenEJB projects. The aim is for this
community to grow considerably once this project goes public.
c) Core Developers: The initial developers are listed below and consist
of
some existing Apache committers together with committers from Castor,
JBoss, mx4j and OpenEJB. We believe that as the project grows, the
modular
nature of the J2EE stack will require steady expansion of the committer
group that is considered 'core' - thus providing a healthier, more
robust
developer community.
d) Alignment: There is clear alignment with many existing Apache
projects.
From Jakarta projects such as Tomcat, James and log4j initially as well
as
possibly others along the way. J2EE now includes a web services stack
and so
there will be some alignment with the WS project, Axis in particular,
along
with the reuse of several XML projects. In addition the J2EE Server
project
may reuse other ASF/BSD licensed code which is not currently hosted in
source form at Apache such as (at time of writing) mx4j, openjms and
tyrex.
However we see the J2EE Server project as a separate project to existing
Apache projects, serving two primary roles
* integration of various existing and new code bases into a J2EE stack,
with those codebases existing both inside and outside of the project
* certification of the J2EE stack
Note that the J2EE server project can happily support competition
within the
J2EE services stack (for example, offering choices for elements such as
the
servlet engine like Tomcat or Jetty, or some new JTA implementation
versus
Tyrex or some new JMS implementation versus OpenJMS etc).
Section 0.2 : warning signs
----------------------------
We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the following
warning signs do not apply to the project we are proposing :
a) Orphaned products: This project is starting with a new code base
together
with reusing lots of the currently available high quality J2EE open
source
code out there which is ASF/BSD licensed.
b) Inexperience with open source: The initial community is made up of
existing Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j , and OpenEJB committers.
c) Homogeneous developers: The current list of committers represents
developers from various backgrounds and open source projects, employed
by
various companies and based around the globe in the US, Europe, Asia and
Australia. There will be no majority bloc, at least from the start.
d) Reliance on salaried developers: None of the initial developers are
currently paid to work on the J2EE project.
e) No ties to other Apache products: The J2EE Server project is
complementary to existing technologies at Apache. Indeed it will
integrate
many of those technologies in an effort to provide a code base that can
be
J2EE certified according to the JCP process.
f) A fascination with the Apache brand: The committers are interested in
developing a healthy open source community around an ASF/BSD licensed
J2EE
certified server, whether Apache is the right place or not. The
aspects of
Apache that attract this effort are the experienced stewardship of open
source projects by the ASF, the non-profit status of the ASF for TCK
certification, and the existing Java community that has been a
longstanding
part of the ASF.
Section 1 : scope of the project
--------------------------------
There are two main aspects to this Apache project :
* a complete J2EE certified server which is fully ASF/BSD licensed and
backed by a healthy open source community.
* to create a fully modular J2EE stack so that the Apache community can
use
whichever parts of the J2EE stack they require separate from the J2EE
server
project.
Section 2 : initial source from which the project is to be populated
--------------------------------------------------------------------
There are several potential initial contributions. Upon formation of the
project our first action will be an open, public call for contribution
and
comment from the J2EE community. Because of recent circumstances in the
J2EE OSS community, all code proposed for inclusion must be publicly
reviewed and open to public comment.
Section 3: identify the ASF resources to be created
----------------------------------------------------
Section 3.1 : mailing lists
* geronimo-dev
* geronimo-user
Section 3.2: CVS repositories
* geronimo
Section 3.3: Bugzilla
* geronimo
Though would there be an issue with using JIRA?
Section 4: identify the initial set of committers
-------------------------------------------------
The committers are listed below, along with the open source project(s)
where
they also have commit privileges.
* Bruce Snyder (Castor JDO)
* Dain Sundstrom (JBoss)
* David Blevins (OpenEJB)
* David Jencks (JBoss)
* Geir Magnusson Jr. (Apache)
* Greg Wilkins (JBoss/Jetty)
* James Strachan (Apache)
* Jan Bartel (JBoss/Jetty)
* Jason Dillon (JBoss)
* Jeremy Boynes (JBoss)
* Jim Jagielski (Apache)
* Jules Golsnell (JBoss/Jetty)
* Richard Monson-Haefel (OpenEJB)
* Remigio Chirino (JBoss)
* Simone Bordet (mx4j)
Section 5: identify apache sponsoring individual
------------------------------------------------
* Ceki Gülcü
* Geir Magnusson Jr.
* James Strachan
* Jim Jagielski
Section 6: open issues for discussion
-------------------------------------
--
Geir Magnusson Jr 203-956-2604(w)
Adeptra, Inc. 203-434-2093(m)
geirm@adeptra.com 203-247-1713(m)
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Re: [PROPOSAL] An Apache J2EE server project - Vote no EJB
Posted by Vic Cekvenich <ma...@baseBeans.com>.
(Note: I am not a comitter, but a user)
-1
Here is why:
http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
And I am with JBoss on this, you can't just fork the code.
(http://sourceforge.net/projects/elba )
No need for complexia :
http://www.softwarereality.com/programming/ejb/index.jsp
Users want KISS. No need for an EJB project.
(did anyone vote? This is not regular)
.V
ps:
I think ASF endoring SUN's EJB, makes no sense now, to late.
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=SUNW&d=c&k=c2&a=v&p=e5,m20,m100,m200,e200&t=2y&l=off&z=l&q=l
vs:
http://viva.sourceforge.net/
They are trading near liquidation, the value of cash in bank.
"Geir Magnusson Jr." <ge...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:414F75FB-C75B-11D7-B25C-000A95A01192@optonline.net...
Proposal for an Apache J2EE server project
==========================================
05 Aug 2003 : Geir Magnusson Jr., James Strachan and Richard
Monson-Haefel
Section 0 : Rationale
---------------------
The Java 2, Enterprise Edition (J2EE) platform is employed widely by
organizations implementing enterprise applications. It is commonly used
in
business-to-consumer and most recently in Web service deployments.
Most of
the largest business organizations today have deployed applications on a
J2EE platform.
While the J2EE specification is implemented by a number of large and
small
vendors, there is no open source J2EE container available with a BSD or
BSD-derived licence nor is there an open source project today that
provides
a fully compliant implementation. Verifiable compliance with the J2EE
specification is important to business because it ensures that
applications
deployed by developers are portable and interoperable across J2EE
providers.
As a result organizations large and small have felt compelled to pay
thousands of dollars to commercial vendors in order to deploy
applications
based on J2EE compliant servers.
The Apache foundation supports several projects that implement pieces
of the
J2EE platform such as Servlets, JSP, Tag Libraries, and a Web services
stack. However, Apache does not currently support a J2EE project.
The aim of the project is to produce a large and healthy community of
J2EE
developers tasked with the development of an open source, certified J2EE
server which is ASF licensed and passes Sun's TCK reusing the best
ASF/BSD
licensed code available today and adding new code to complete the J2EE
stack.
Section 0.1 : criteria
----------------------
We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the following
project aspects are carefully considered :
a) Meritocracy: The project will be meritocratic - the usual Apache
meritocracy rules would apply.
b) Community: The user community for this project is potentially
massive.
The initial developer community for this project consists of developers
from
Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j, and OpenEJB projects. The aim is for this
community to grow considerably once this project goes public.
c) Core Developers: The initial developers are listed below and consist
of
some existing Apache committers together with committers from Castor,
JBoss, mx4j and OpenEJB. We believe that as the project grows, the
modular
nature of the J2EE stack will require steady expansion of the committer
group that is considered 'core' - thus providing a healthier, more
robust
developer community.
d) Alignment: There is clear alignment with many existing Apache
projects.
From Jakarta projects such as Tomcat, James and log4j initially as well
as
possibly others along the way. J2EE now includes a web services stack
and so
there will be some alignment with the WS project, Axis in particular,
along
with the reuse of several XML projects. In addition the J2EE Server
project
may reuse other ASF/BSD licensed code which is not currently hosted in
source form at Apache such as (at time of writing) mx4j, openjms and
tyrex.
However we see the J2EE Server project as a separate project to existing
Apache projects, serving two primary roles
* integration of various existing and new code bases into a J2EE stack,
with those codebases existing both inside and outside of the project
* certification of the J2EE stack
Note that the J2EE server project can happily support competition
within the
J2EE services stack (for example, offering choices for elements such as
the
servlet engine like Tomcat or Jetty, or some new JTA implementation
versus
Tyrex or some new JMS implementation versus OpenJMS etc).
Section 0.2 : warning signs
----------------------------
We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the following
warning signs do not apply to the project we are proposing :
a) Orphaned products: This project is starting with a new code base
together
with reusing lots of the currently available high quality J2EE open
source
code out there which is ASF/BSD licensed.
b) Inexperience with open source: The initial community is made up of
existing Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j , and OpenEJB committers.
c) Homogeneous developers: The current list of committers represents
developers from various backgrounds and open source projects, employed
by
various companies and based around the globe in the US, Europe, Asia and
Australia. There will be no majority bloc, at least from the start.
d) Reliance on salaried developers: None of the initial developers are
currently paid to work on the J2EE project.
e) No ties to other Apache products: The J2EE Server project is
complementary to existing technologies at Apache. Indeed it will
integrate
many of those technologies in an effort to provide a code base that can
be
J2EE certified according to the JCP process.
f) A fascination with the Apache brand: The committers are interested in
developing a healthy open source community around an ASF/BSD licensed
J2EE
certified server, whether Apache is the right place or not. The
aspects of
Apache that attract this effort are the experienced stewardship of open
source projects by the ASF, the non-profit status of the ASF for TCK
certification, and the existing Java community that has been a
longstanding
part of the ASF.
Section 1 : scope of the project
--------------------------------
There are two main aspects to this Apache project :
* a complete J2EE certified server which is fully ASF/BSD licensed and
backed by a healthy open source community.
* to create a fully modular J2EE stack so that the Apache community can
use
whichever parts of the J2EE stack they require separate from the J2EE
server
project.
Section 2 : initial source from which the project is to be populated
--------------------------------------------------------------------
There are several potential initial contributions. Upon formation of the
project our first action will be an open, public call for contribution
and
comment from the J2EE community. Because of recent circumstances in the
J2EE OSS community, all code proposed for inclusion must be publicly
reviewed and open to public comment.
Section 3: identify the ASF resources to be created
----------------------------------------------------
Section 3.1 : mailing lists
* geronimo-dev
* geronimo-user
Section 3.2: CVS repositories
* geronimo
Section 3.3: Bugzilla
* geronimo
Though would there be an issue with using JIRA?
Section 4: identify the initial set of committers
-------------------------------------------------
The committers are listed below, along with the open source project(s)
where
they also have commit privileges.
* Bruce Snyder (Castor JDO)
* Dain Sundstrom (JBoss)
* David Blevins (OpenEJB)
* David Jencks (JBoss)
* Geir Magnusson Jr. (Apache)
* Greg Wilkins (JBoss/Jetty)
* James Strachan (Apache)
* Jan Bartel (JBoss/Jetty)
* Jason Dillon (JBoss)
* Jeremy Boynes (JBoss)
* Jim Jagielski (Apache)
* Jules Golsnell (JBoss/Jetty)
* Richard Monson-Haefel (OpenEJB)
* Remigio Chirino (JBoss)
* Simone Bordet (mx4j)
Section 5: identify apache sponsoring individual
------------------------------------------------
* Ceki G�lc�
* Geir Magnusson Jr.
* James Strachan
* Jim Jagielski
Section 6: open issues for discussion
-------------------------------------
--
Geir Magnusson Jr 203-956-2604(w)
Adeptra, Inc. 203-434-2093(m)
geirm@adeptra.com 203-247-1713(m)=
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Re: [PROPOSAL] An Apache J2EE server project
Posted by Vic Cekvenich <vi...@basebeans.com>.
Henri Yandell wrote:
>
> Geronimo had nothing to do with elba.
>
> Also, nothing wrong with elba forking the code. That's open source at
> work. What would be wrong would be Geronimo using elba, as elba must be
> GPL'd.
>
> Geronimo is a different product to JBoss. JBoss is 'free-software' with
> all the viral/GNU trappings. Geronimo will be 'open-source-software',
> with all the useful-in-commercial environments/BSD trappings.
>
>
There is a diference between legal and ethical. Airline can legaly
overbook a flight, but it sucks for people that can't get fly now
becuase it is oversold.
I wonder where the code is coming from?
If they check in code to sf someplace, and they have a public vote, OK.
Lets just be pro OS.
(over and out, I hope)
.V
ps:
This is in the news as well, similar MO:
http://www.computerworld.com/softwaretopics/os/unix/story/0,10801,82967,00.html
http://www.newsfactor.com/perl/board/mboard.pl?board=nfntalkback&thread=7438&id=7442&display=1#message_7442
http://www.hostingtech.com/news/2003/7/11/St_Nitf_Sun_expands_Unix_deal_with_SCO_c0710002.9zf.html
(this kind of wisper thing tends not to come out)
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Re: [PROPOSAL] An Apache J2EE server project
Posted by Nicola Ken Barozzi <ni...@apache.org>.
Simply put:
- Apache is not forking the code
- Apache will make any useful community-based project as long as there
are developers that want to do it, especially if server-side, and
it's difficult to argue that there is no use of J2EE products
- This is regular, as it has been discussed by Apache members and
decided by the Apache board
Please don't spread FUD.
Vic Cekvenich wrote, On 07/08/2003 15.51:
> (Note: I am not a comitter, but a user)
> -1
> Here is why:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
> http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
>
> And I am with JBoss on this, you can't just fork the code.
> (http://sourceforge.net/projects/elba )
>
> No need for complexia :
> http://www.softwarereality.com/programming/ejb/index.jsp
> Users want KISS. No need for an EJB project.
>
> (did anyone vote? This is not regular)
>
> .V
>
> ps:
>
> I think ASF endoring SUN's EJB, makes no sense now, to late.
>
> http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=SUNW&d=c&k=c2&a=v&p=e5,m20,m100,m200,e200&t=2y&l=off&z=l&q=l
> vs:
> http://viva.sourceforge.net/
> They are trading near liquidation, the value of cash in bank.
--
Nicola Ken Barozzi nicolaken@apache.org
- verba volant, scripta manent -
(discussions get forgotten, just code remains)
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Re: [PROPOSAL] An Apache J2EE server project
Posted by Henri Yandell <ba...@generationjava.com>.
On Thu, 7 Aug 2003, Vic Cekvenich wrote:
> (Note: I am not a comitter, but a user)
> -1
> Here is why:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
> http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
<teasing-flame>Links to conversation between Andrew Oliver and Jon Stevens
is like linking to an argument on TSS between Fleury and
Sun</teasing-flame>
>
> And I am with JBoss on this, you can't just fork the code.
> (http://sourceforge.net/projects/elba )
Geronimo had nothing to do with elba.
Also, nothing wrong with elba forking the code. That's open source at
work. What would be wrong would be Geronimo using elba, as elba must be
GPL'd.
Geronimo is a different product to JBoss. JBoss is 'free-software' with
all the viral/GNU trappings. Geronimo will be 'open-source-software',
with all the useful-in-commercial environments/BSD trappings.
> No need for complexia :
> http://www.softwarereality.com/programming/ejb/index.jsp
> Users want KISS. No need for an EJB project.
Not doing a project because a proportion of the developer community do not
believe in it is not a good reason.
I do not believe in JSF/Struts' MVC Model 2 crap. So let's scrap those
projects.
> (did anyone vote? This is not regular)
Regular for what? I'm sure incubation rules are being followed with
Geronimo. The only criticism in how things have been done with Gerry is
that the announcement was perhaps too inviting and that Geronimo is not a
Jakarta project.
> .V
>
> ps:
>
> I think ASF endoring SUN's EJB, makes no sense now, to late.
>
> http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=SUNW&d=c&k=c2&a=v&p=e5,m20,m100,m200,e200&t=2y&l=off&z=l&q=l
> vs:
> http://viva.sourceforge.net/
> They are trading near liquidation, the value of cash in bank.
Coding Java is not dependent on Sun's commercial position, or are you
suggesting we should switch to C# because Sun look so weak?
Hen
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Re: [PROPOSAL] An Apache J2EE server project
Posted by James Strachan <ja...@yahoo.co.uk>.
J2EE != EJB. I suggest you read some FAQs rather than flaming.
On Thursday, August 7, 2003, at 02:51 pm, Vic Cekvenich wrote:
> (Note: I am not a comitter, but a user)
> -1
> Here is why:
>
> http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
> http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
>
> And I am with JBoss on this, you can't just fork the code.
> (http://sourceforge.net/projects/elba )
>
> No need for complexia :
> http://www.softwarereality.com/programming/ejb/index.jsp
> Users want KISS. No need for an EJB project.
>
> (did anyone vote? This is not regular)
>
> .V
>
> ps:
>
> I think ASF endoring SUN's EJB, makes no sense now, to late.
>
> http://finance.yahoo.com/
> q?s=SUNW&d=c&k=c2&a=v&p=e5,m20,m100,m200,e200&t=2y&l=off&z=l&q=l
> vs:
> http://viva.sourceforge.net/
> They are trading near liquidation, the value of cash in bank.
>
>
>
>
> "Geir Magnusson Jr." <ge...@optonline.net> wrote in message
> news:414F75FB-C75B-11D7-B25C-000A95A01192@optonline.net...
> Proposal for an Apache J2EE server project
> ==========================================
>
> 05 Aug 2003 : Geir Magnusson Jr., James Strachan and Richard
> Monson-Haefel
>
> Section 0 : Rationale
> ---------------------
>
> The Java 2, Enterprise Edition (J2EE) platform is employed widely by
> organizations implementing enterprise applications. It is commonly used
> in
> business-to-consumer and most recently in Web service deployments.
> Most of
> the largest business organizations today have deployed applications on
> a
> J2EE platform.
>
> While the J2EE specification is implemented by a number of large and
> small
> vendors, there is no open source J2EE container available with a BSD or
> BSD-derived licence nor is there an open source project today that
> provides
> a fully compliant implementation. Verifiable compliance with the J2EE
> specification is important to business because it ensures that
> applications
> deployed by developers are portable and interoperable across J2EE
> providers.
> As a result organizations large and small have felt compelled to pay
> thousands of dollars to commercial vendors in order to deploy
> applications
> based on J2EE compliant servers.
>
> The Apache foundation supports several projects that implement pieces
> of the
> J2EE platform such as Servlets, JSP, Tag Libraries, and a Web services
> stack. However, Apache does not currently support a J2EE project.
>
> The aim of the project is to produce a large and healthy community of
> J2EE
> developers tasked with the development of an open source, certified
> J2EE
> server which is ASF licensed and passes Sun's TCK reusing the best
> ASF/BSD
> licensed code available today and adding new code to complete the J2EE
> stack.
>
>
> Section 0.1 : criteria
> ----------------------
>
> We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the
> following
> project aspects are carefully considered :
>
> a) Meritocracy: The project will be meritocratic - the usual Apache
> meritocracy rules would apply.
>
> b) Community: The user community for this project is potentially
> massive.
> The initial developer community for this project consists of developers
> from
> Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j, and OpenEJB projects. The aim is for this
> community to grow considerably once this project goes public.
>
> c) Core Developers: The initial developers are listed below and consist
> of
> some existing Apache committers together with committers from Castor,
> JBoss, mx4j and OpenEJB. We believe that as the project grows, the
> modular
> nature of the J2EE stack will require steady expansion of the committer
> group that is considered 'core' - thus providing a healthier, more
> robust
> developer community.
>
> d) Alignment: There is clear alignment with many existing Apache
> projects.
> From Jakarta projects such as Tomcat, James and log4j initially as
> well
> as
> possibly others along the way. J2EE now includes a web services stack
> and so
> there will be some alignment with the WS project, Axis in particular,
> along
> with the reuse of several XML projects. In addition the J2EE Server
> project
> may reuse other ASF/BSD licensed code which is not currently hosted in
> source form at Apache such as (at time of writing) mx4j, openjms and
> tyrex.
>
> However we see the J2EE Server project as a separate project to
> existing
> Apache projects, serving two primary roles
>
> * integration of various existing and new code bases into a J2EE stack,
> with those codebases existing both inside and outside of the project
> * certification of the J2EE stack
>
> Note that the J2EE server project can happily support competition
> within the
> J2EE services stack (for example, offering choices for elements such as
> the
> servlet engine like Tomcat or Jetty, or some new JTA implementation
> versus
> Tyrex or some new JMS implementation versus OpenJMS etc).
>
>
> Section 0.2 : warning signs
> ----------------------------
> We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the
> following
> warning signs do not apply to the project we are proposing :
>
> a) Orphaned products: This project is starting with a new code base
> together
> with reusing lots of the currently available high quality J2EE open
> source
> code out there which is ASF/BSD licensed.
>
> b) Inexperience with open source: The initial community is made up of
> existing Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j , and OpenEJB committers.
>
> c) Homogeneous developers: The current list of committers represents
> developers from various backgrounds and open source projects, employed
> by
> various companies and based around the globe in the US, Europe, Asia
> and
> Australia. There will be no majority bloc, at least from the start.
>
> d) Reliance on salaried developers: None of the initial developers are
> currently paid to work on the J2EE project.
>
> e) No ties to other Apache products: The J2EE Server project is
> complementary to existing technologies at Apache. Indeed it will
> integrate
> many of those technologies in an effort to provide a code base that can
> be
> J2EE certified according to the JCP process.
>
> f) A fascination with the Apache brand: The committers are interested
> in
> developing a healthy open source community around an ASF/BSD licensed
> J2EE
> certified server, whether Apache is the right place or not. The
> aspects of
> Apache that attract this effort are the experienced stewardship of open
> source projects by the ASF, the non-profit status of the ASF for TCK
> certification, and the existing Java community that has been a
> longstanding
> part of the ASF.
>
>
> Section 1 : scope of the project
> --------------------------------
>
> There are two main aspects to this Apache project :
>
> * a complete J2EE certified server which is fully ASF/BSD licensed and
> backed by a healthy open source community.
>
> * to create a fully modular J2EE stack so that the Apache community can
> use
> whichever parts of the J2EE stack they require separate from the J2EE
> server
> project.
>
>
> Section 2 : initial source from which the project is to be populated
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> There are several potential initial contributions. Upon formation of
> the
> project our first action will be an open, public call for contribution
> and
> comment from the J2EE community. Because of recent circumstances in
> the
> J2EE OSS community, all code proposed for inclusion must be publicly
> reviewed and open to public comment.
>
>
> Section 3: identify the ASF resources to be created
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
> Section 3.1 : mailing lists
>
> * geronimo-dev
> * geronimo-user
>
>
> Section 3.2: CVS repositories
>
> * geronimo
>
>
> Section 3.3: Bugzilla
>
> * geronimo
>
> Though would there be an issue with using JIRA?
>
>
> Section 4: identify the initial set of committers
> -------------------------------------------------
>
> The committers are listed below, along with the open source project(s)
> where
> they also have commit privileges.
>
> * Bruce Snyder (Castor JDO)
> * Dain Sundstrom (JBoss)
> * David Blevins (OpenEJB)
> * David Jencks (JBoss)
> * Geir Magnusson Jr. (Apache)
> * Greg Wilkins (JBoss/Jetty)
> * James Strachan (Apache)
> * Jan Bartel (JBoss/Jetty)
> * Jason Dillon (JBoss)
> * Jeremy Boynes (JBoss)
> * Jim Jagielski (Apache)
> * Jules Golsnell (JBoss/Jetty)
> * Richard Monson-Haefel (OpenEJB)
> * Remigio Chirino (JBoss)
> * Simone Bordet (mx4j)
>
>
> Section 5: identify apache sponsoring individual
> ------------------------------------------------
>
> * Ceki Gülcü
> * Geir Magnusson Jr.
> * James Strachan
> * Jim Jagielski
>
>
> Section 6: open issues for discussion
> -------------------------------------
>
> --
> Geir Magnusson Jr 203-956-2604(w)
> Adeptra, Inc. 203-434-2093(m)
> geirm@adeptra.com 203-247-1713(m)=
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
James
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Re: [PROPOSAL] An Apache J2EE server project
Posted by Vic Cekvenich <ma...@baseBeans.com>.
(Note: I am not a comitter, but a user)
-1
Here is why:
http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
http://www.mail-archive.com/general@jakarta.apache.org/msg03376.html
And I am with JBoss on this, you can't just fork the code.
(http://sourceforge.net/projects/elba )
No need for complexia :
http://www.softwarereality.com/programming/ejb/index.jsp
Users want KISS. No need for an EJB project.
(did anyone vote? This is not regular)
.V
ps:
I think ASF endoring SUN's EJB, makes no sense now, to late.
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=SUNW&d=c&k=c2&a=v&p=e5,m20,m100,m200,e200&t=2y&l=off&z=l&q=l
vs:
http://viva.sourceforge.net/
They are trading near liquidation, the value of cash in bank.
"Geir Magnusson Jr." <ge...@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:414F75FB-C75B-11D7-B25C-000A95A01192@optonline.net...
Proposal for an Apache J2EE server project
==========================================
05 Aug 2003 : Geir Magnusson Jr., James Strachan and Richard
Monson-Haefel
Section 0 : Rationale
---------------------
The Java 2, Enterprise Edition (J2EE) platform is employed widely by
organizations implementing enterprise applications. It is commonly used
in
business-to-consumer and most recently in Web service deployments.
Most of
the largest business organizations today have deployed applications on a
J2EE platform.
While the J2EE specification is implemented by a number of large and
small
vendors, there is no open source J2EE container available with a BSD or
BSD-derived licence nor is there an open source project today that
provides
a fully compliant implementation. Verifiable compliance with the J2EE
specification is important to business because it ensures that
applications
deployed by developers are portable and interoperable across J2EE
providers.
As a result organizations large and small have felt compelled to pay
thousands of dollars to commercial vendors in order to deploy
applications
based on J2EE compliant servers.
The Apache foundation supports several projects that implement pieces
of the
J2EE platform such as Servlets, JSP, Tag Libraries, and a Web services
stack. However, Apache does not currently support a J2EE project.
The aim of the project is to produce a large and healthy community of
J2EE
developers tasked with the development of an open source, certified J2EE
server which is ASF licensed and passes Sun's TCK reusing the best
ASF/BSD
licensed code available today and adding new code to complete the J2EE
stack.
Section 0.1 : criteria
----------------------
We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the following
project aspects are carefully considered :
a) Meritocracy: The project will be meritocratic - the usual Apache
meritocracy rules would apply.
b) Community: The user community for this project is potentially
massive.
The initial developer community for this project consists of developers
from
Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j, and OpenEJB projects. The aim is for this
community to grow considerably once this project goes public.
c) Core Developers: The initial developers are listed below and consist
of
some existing Apache committers together with committers from Castor,
JBoss, mx4j and OpenEJB. We believe that as the project grows, the
modular
nature of the J2EE stack will require steady expansion of the committer
group that is considered 'core' - thus providing a healthier, more
robust
developer community.
d) Alignment: There is clear alignment with many existing Apache
projects.
From Jakarta projects such as Tomcat, James and log4j initially as well
as
possibly others along the way. J2EE now includes a web services stack
and so
there will be some alignment with the WS project, Axis in particular,
along
with the reuse of several XML projects. In addition the J2EE Server
project
may reuse other ASF/BSD licensed code which is not currently hosted in
source form at Apache such as (at time of writing) mx4j, openjms and
tyrex.
However we see the J2EE Server project as a separate project to existing
Apache projects, serving two primary roles
* integration of various existing and new code bases into a J2EE stack,
with those codebases existing both inside and outside of the project
* certification of the J2EE stack
Note that the J2EE server project can happily support competition
within the
J2EE services stack (for example, offering choices for elements such as
the
servlet engine like Tomcat or Jetty, or some new JTA implementation
versus
Tyrex or some new JMS implementation versus OpenJMS etc).
Section 0.2 : warning signs
----------------------------
We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the following
warning signs do not apply to the project we are proposing :
a) Orphaned products: This project is starting with a new code base
together
with reusing lots of the currently available high quality J2EE open
source
code out there which is ASF/BSD licensed.
b) Inexperience with open source: The initial community is made up of
existing Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j , and OpenEJB committers.
c) Homogeneous developers: The current list of committers represents
developers from various backgrounds and open source projects, employed
by
various companies and based around the globe in the US, Europe, Asia and
Australia. There will be no majority bloc, at least from the start.
d) Reliance on salaried developers: None of the initial developers are
currently paid to work on the J2EE project.
e) No ties to other Apache products: The J2EE Server project is
complementary to existing technologies at Apache. Indeed it will
integrate
many of those technologies in an effort to provide a code base that can
be
J2EE certified according to the JCP process.
f) A fascination with the Apache brand: The committers are interested in
developing a healthy open source community around an ASF/BSD licensed
J2EE
certified server, whether Apache is the right place or not. The
aspects of
Apache that attract this effort are the experienced stewardship of open
source projects by the ASF, the non-profit status of the ASF for TCK
certification, and the existing Java community that has been a
longstanding
part of the ASF.
Section 1 : scope of the project
--------------------------------
There are two main aspects to this Apache project :
* a complete J2EE certified server which is fully ASF/BSD licensed and
backed by a healthy open source community.
* to create a fully modular J2EE stack so that the Apache community can
use
whichever parts of the J2EE stack they require separate from the J2EE
server
project.
Section 2 : initial source from which the project is to be populated
--------------------------------------------------------------------
There are several potential initial contributions. Upon formation of the
project our first action will be an open, public call for contribution
and
comment from the J2EE community. Because of recent circumstances in the
J2EE OSS community, all code proposed for inclusion must be publicly
reviewed and open to public comment.
Section 3: identify the ASF resources to be created
----------------------------------------------------
Section 3.1 : mailing lists
* geronimo-dev
* geronimo-user
Section 3.2: CVS repositories
* geronimo
Section 3.3: Bugzilla
* geronimo
Though would there be an issue with using JIRA?
Section 4: identify the initial set of committers
-------------------------------------------------
The committers are listed below, along with the open source project(s)
where
they also have commit privileges.
* Bruce Snyder (Castor JDO)
* Dain Sundstrom (JBoss)
* David Blevins (OpenEJB)
* David Jencks (JBoss)
* Geir Magnusson Jr. (Apache)
* Greg Wilkins (JBoss/Jetty)
* James Strachan (Apache)
* Jan Bartel (JBoss/Jetty)
* Jason Dillon (JBoss)
* Jeremy Boynes (JBoss)
* Jim Jagielski (Apache)
* Jules Golsnell (JBoss/Jetty)
* Richard Monson-Haefel (OpenEJB)
* Remigio Chirino (JBoss)
* Simone Bordet (mx4j)
Section 5: identify apache sponsoring individual
------------------------------------------------
* Ceki G�lc�
* Geir Magnusson Jr.
* James Strachan
* Jim Jagielski
Section 6: open issues for discussion
-------------------------------------
--
Geir Magnusson Jr 203-956-2604(w)
Adeptra, Inc. 203-434-2093(m)
geirm@adeptra.com 203-247-1713(m)=
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Re: [PROPOSAL] An Apache J2EE server project
Posted by Paul Hammant <Pa...@ThoughtWorks.net>.
Geir,
+1
If voting on this is required at all. The Board deems this strategic,
and thus I believe it is in already. A vertable who's who of J2EE
computing seems to be on the ticket, Geronimo!
- Paul Hammant
Incubator PMC
> Proposal for an Apache J2EE server project
> ==========================================
>
> 05 Aug 2003 : Geir Magnusson Jr., James Strachan and Richard
> Monson-Haefel
>
> Section 0 : Rationale
> ---------------------
>
> The Java 2, Enterprise Edition (J2EE) platform is employed widely by
> organizations implementing enterprise applications. It is commonly
> used in
> business-to-consumer and most recently in Web service deployments.
> Most of
> the largest business organizations today have deployed applications on a
> J2EE platform.
>
> While the J2EE specification is implemented by a number of large and
> small
> vendors, there is no open source J2EE container available with a BSD or
> BSD-derived licence nor is there an open source project today that
> provides
> a fully compliant implementation. Verifiable compliance with the J2EE
> specification is important to business because it ensures that
> applications
> deployed by developers are portable and interoperable across J2EE
> providers.
> As a result organizations large and small have felt compelled to pay
> thousands of dollars to commercial vendors in order to deploy
> applications
> based on J2EE compliant servers.
>
> The Apache foundation supports several projects that implement pieces
> of the
> J2EE platform such as Servlets, JSP, Tag Libraries, and a Web services
> stack. However, Apache does not currently support a J2EE project.
>
> The aim of the project is to produce a large and healthy community of
> J2EE
> developers tasked with the development of an open source, certified J2EE
> server which is ASF licensed and passes Sun's TCK reusing the best
> ASF/BSD
> licensed code available today and adding new code to complete the J2EE
> stack.
>
>
> Section 0.1 : criteria
> ----------------------
>
> We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the following
> project aspects are carefully considered :
>
> a) Meritocracy: The project will be meritocratic - the usual Apache
> meritocracy rules would apply.
>
> b) Community: The user community for this project is potentially massive.
> The initial developer community for this project consists of
> developers from
> Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j, and OpenEJB projects. The aim is for this
> community to grow considerably once this project goes public.
>
> c) Core Developers: The initial developers are listed below and
> consist of
> some existing Apache committers together with committers from Castor,
> JBoss, mx4j and OpenEJB. We believe that as the project grows, the
> modular
> nature of the J2EE stack will require steady expansion of the committer
> group that is considered 'core' - thus providing a healthier, more robust
> developer community.
>
> d) Alignment: There is clear alignment with many existing Apache
> projects.
> From Jakarta projects such as Tomcat, James and log4j initially as
> well as
> possibly others along the way. J2EE now includes a web services stack
> and so
> there will be some alignment with the WS project, Axis in particular,
> along
> with the reuse of several XML projects. In addition the J2EE Server
> project
> may reuse other ASF/BSD licensed code which is not currently hosted in
> source form at Apache such as (at time of writing) mx4j, openjms and
> tyrex.
>
> However we see the J2EE Server project as a separate project to existing
> Apache projects, serving two primary roles
>
> * integration of various existing and new code bases into a J2EE stack,
> with those codebases existing both inside and outside of the project
> * certification of the J2EE stack
>
> Note that the J2EE server project can happily support competition
> within the
> J2EE services stack (for example, offering choices for elements such
> as the
> servlet engine like Tomcat or Jetty, or some new JTA implementation
> versus
> Tyrex or some new JMS implementation versus OpenJMS etc).
>
>
> Section 0.2 : warning signs
> ----------------------------
> We feel that this project has a good chance for success as the following
> warning signs do not apply to the project we are proposing :
>
> a) Orphaned products: This project is starting with a new code base
> together
> with reusing lots of the currently available high quality J2EE open
> source
> code out there which is ASF/BSD licensed.
>
> b) Inexperience with open source: The initial community is made up of
> existing Apache, Castor, JBoss, mx4j , and OpenEJB committers.
>
> c) Homogeneous developers: The current list of committers represents
> developers from various backgrounds and open source projects, employed by
> various companies and based around the globe in the US, Europe, Asia and
> Australia. There will be no majority bloc, at least from the start.
>
> d) Reliance on salaried developers: None of the initial developers are
> currently paid to work on the J2EE project.
>
> e) No ties to other Apache products: The J2EE Server project is
> complementary to existing technologies at Apache. Indeed it will
> integrate
> many of those technologies in an effort to provide a code base that
> can be
> J2EE certified according to the JCP process.
>
> f) A fascination with the Apache brand: The committers are interested in
> developing a healthy open source community around an ASF/BSD licensed
> J2EE
> certified server, whether Apache is the right place or not. The
> aspects of
> Apache that attract this effort are the experienced stewardship of open
> source projects by the ASF, the non-profit status of the ASF for TCK
> certification, and the existing Java community that has been a
> longstanding
> part of the ASF.
>
>
> Section 1 : scope of the project
> --------------------------------
>
> There are two main aspects to this Apache project :
>
> * a complete J2EE certified server which is fully ASF/BSD licensed and
> backed by a healthy open source community.
>
> * to create a fully modular J2EE stack so that the Apache community
> can use
> whichever parts of the J2EE stack they require separate from the J2EE
> server
> project.
>
>
> Section 2 : initial source from which the project is to be populated
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> There are several potential initial contributions. Upon formation of the
> project our first action will be an open, public call for contribution
> and
> comment from the J2EE community. Because of recent circumstances in the
> J2EE OSS community, all code proposed for inclusion must be publicly
> reviewed and open to public comment.
>
>
> Section 3: identify the ASF resources to be created
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
> Section 3.1 : mailing lists
>
> * geronimo-dev
> * geronimo-user
>
>
> Section 3.2: CVS repositories
>
> * geronimo
>
>
> Section 3.3: Bugzilla
>
> * geronimo
>
> Though would there be an issue with using JIRA?
>
>
> Section 4: identify the initial set of committers
> -------------------------------------------------
>
> The committers are listed below, along with the open source project(s)
> where
> they also have commit privileges.
>
> * Bruce Snyder (Castor JDO)
> * Dain Sundstrom (JBoss)
> * David Blevins (OpenEJB)
> * David Jencks (JBoss)
> * Geir Magnusson Jr. (Apache)
> * Greg Wilkins (JBoss/Jetty)
> * James Strachan (Apache)
> * Jan Bartel (JBoss/Jetty)
> * Jason Dillon (JBoss)
> * Jeremy Boynes (JBoss)
> * Jim Jagielski (Apache)
> * Jules Golsnell (JBoss/Jetty)
> * Richard Monson-Haefel (OpenEJB)
> * Remigio Chirino (JBoss)
> * Simone Bordet (mx4j)
>
>
> Section 5: identify apache sponsoring individual
> ------------------------------------------------
>
> * Ceki Gülcü
> * Geir Magnusson Jr.
> * James Strachan
> * Jim Jagielski
>
>
> Section 6: open issues for discussion
> -------------------------------------
>
--
http://www.thoughtworks.com -> The art of heavy lifting.
Home for many Agile practicing, Open Source activists...
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