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Posted to user@turbine.apache.org by Nick Ide <id...@nlm.nih.gov> on 2008/01/30 23:09:48 UTC
what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
We have built several projects in the past using turbine.
We are beginning a new project and trying to decide whether to
use turbine or try something else.
We are a little concerned that turbine is dead or dying from lack of
community.
My questions:
1. When will turbine 2.3.3 be released ?
2. Is anybody working on that release ?
3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
5. Probably asking the crowd since the people who voted with their feet
have stopped listening, but what do you suppose
people have adopted to use instead of turbine ? is it VelocityStruts ?
is it Spring ? Others ?
-Nick
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Re: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by Thomas Vandahl <tv...@apache.org>.
Siegfried Goeschl wrote:
> HI Thomas,
>
> in Fulcrum we have JSR-223 support ...
> http://turbine.apache.org/fulcrum/fulcrum-script/index.html
Yep, I know. That's why I wanted to generalize the PythonScreen, Action
etc. classes to use this service. As I said, I could need some limited
PHP-suport. Would you mind a release of fulcrum-script?
Bye, Thomas.
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Re: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by Siegfried Goeschl <si...@it20one.at>.
HI Thomas,
in Fulcrum we have JSR-223 support ...
http://turbine.apache.org/fulcrum/fulcrum-script/index.html
I use it combined with JavaScript for production
Cheers,
Siegfried Goeschl
Thomas Vandahl wrote:
> Scott Eade wrote:
>> We hope to release 2.3.3 real soon now. The blocker is that we want
>> to use Torque 3.3 and we want to wait another week before voting on
>> that so that people will have had a chance to provide feedback on
>> it's RC-3 release. I don't believe we have any plans for a 2.3.3 RC
>> release - straight to final would be my suggestion.
>
> Yep that would have been my suggestion as well.
>
>>> 3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
>> As time permits we (and this includes Siegfried and others) are
>> working on tidying up the trunk in order to get to a 2.4 release, but
>> progress is indeed very slow.
>
> I made a couple of cleanup back-and-forth-ports between the 2.3-branch
> and the Fulcrum components during the last year and will strive to
> release some Fulcrum services one-by-one (and kill others).
>
>>> 4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
>>> everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
>> It is probably fair to say that many have moved to other frameworks
>> that are more in vogue, however there are plenty of people that have
>> existing applications that need to be maintained into the future so
>> support for and slow forward progress of turbine should still occur.
>> Your point about stability may also be true to a certain extent.
>
> I strongly believe that Turbine is well-suited for a fair number of
> web applications. Applications are easy to write and easy to maintain.
> Extensions to the framework can be easily integrated. The different
> service backends open the doors to a lot of ready-made components. And
> Turbine 2.3.2 is (almost) rock-solid.
>
> On my list of wishes for Turbine are better I18N-support, a bit more
> flexibility with screen elements and a generic JSR-223-support in the
> backend (I hate^Wneed PHP). All these will come up if time permits.
>
>> Another option to consider is diving in and helping with turbine. It
>> sounds like you have a long term interest in the continued support of
>> turbine so why not invest a little time in keeping it moving
>> forward. After a couple of decent patches we are usually fairly
>> happy to vote on commit access.
>
> I would like to second that. If you have anything you want to
> contribute, please do.
>
> Bye, Thomas.
>
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>
>
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Re: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by Thomas Vandahl <tv...@apache.org>.
Scott Eade wrote:
> We hope to release 2.3.3 real soon now. The blocker is that we want to
> use Torque 3.3 and we want to wait another week before voting on that so
> that people will have had a chance to provide feedback on it's RC-3
> release. I don't believe we have any plans for a 2.3.3 RC release -
> straight to final would be my suggestion.
Yep that would have been my suggestion as well.
>> 3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
> As time permits we (and this includes Siegfried and others) are working
> on tidying up the trunk in order to get to a 2.4 release, but progress
> is indeed very slow.
I made a couple of cleanup back-and-forth-ports between the 2.3-branch
and the Fulcrum components during the last year and will strive to
release some Fulcrum services one-by-one (and kill others).
>> 4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
>> everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
> It is probably fair to say that many have moved to other frameworks that
> are more in vogue, however there are plenty of people that have existing
> applications that need to be maintained into the future so support for
> and slow forward progress of turbine should still occur. Your point
> about stability may also be true to a certain extent.
I strongly believe that Turbine is well-suited for a fair number of web
applications. Applications are easy to write and easy to maintain.
Extensions to the framework can be easily integrated. The different
service backends open the doors to a lot of ready-made components. And
Turbine 2.3.2 is (almost) rock-solid.
On my list of wishes for Turbine are better I18N-support, a bit more
flexibility with screen elements and a generic JSR-223-support in the
backend (I hate^Wneed PHP). All these will come up if time permits.
> Another option to consider is diving in and helping with turbine. It
> sounds like you have a long term interest in the continued support of
> turbine so why not invest a little time in keeping it moving forward.
> After a couple of decent patches we are usually fairly happy to vote on
> commit access.
I would like to second that. If you have anything you want to
contribute, please do.
Bye, Thomas.
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Re: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by Scott Eade <se...@backstagetech.com.au>.
Nick Ide wrote:
>
> We have built several projects in the past using turbine.
> We are beginning a new project and trying to decide whether to
> use turbine or try something else. We are a little concerned that
> turbine is dead or dying from lack of community.
>
> My questions:
>
> 1. When will turbine 2.3.3 be released ?
We hope to release 2.3.3 real soon now. The blocker is that we want to
use Torque 3.3 and we want to wait another week before voting on that so
that people will have had a chance to provide feedback on it's RC-3
release. I don't believe we have any plans for a 2.3.3 RC release -
straight to final would be my suggestion.
> 2. Is anybody working on that release ?
Thomas V. and myself are working on this as time permits.
> 3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
As time permits we (and this includes Siegfried and others) are working
on tidying up the trunk in order to get to a 2.4 release, but progress
is indeed very slow.
> 4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
> everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
It is probably fair to say that many have moved to other frameworks that
are more in vogue, however there are plenty of people that have existing
applications that need to be maintained into the future so support for
and slow forward progress of turbine should still occur. Your point
about stability may also be true to a certain extent.
> 5. Probably asking the crowd since the people who voted with their
> feet have stopped listening, but what do you suppose
> people have adopted to use instead of turbine ? is it VelocityStruts
> ? is it Spring ? Others ?
There will be no short answers to this question. There are plenty of
interesting frameworks out there with various pros and cons and
certainly many of them have a lot more momentum than turbine. Of course
the framework that best suits you will be different from the one that
best suits me or anyone else.
I am a big fan of ExtJS (http://extjs.com/) so I'm going to favour
solution that integrates nicely with that. Mucking about with
JavaScript all the time is a PITA so I may take a look at GWT with
gwt-ext (http://code.google.com/p/gwt-ext/) some time. Tapestry 5
(http://tapestry.apache.org/tapestry5/) is looking fairly interesting,
though a 1.0 release may still be a little while away. But neither of
these are exactly main stream and I certainly have not looked to see if
these support the range of services that are available with turbine.
I am certainly interested to see responses from others, with
justifications (and why various alternatives were ruled out).
Another option to consider is diving in and helping with turbine. It
sounds like you have a long term interest in the continued support of
turbine so why not invest a little time in keeping it moving forward.
After a couple of decent patches we are usually fairly happy to vote on
commit access.
Scott
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Re: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by Siegfried Goeschl <si...@it20one.at>.
"It just works" - that's the most boring thing you can say about an OSS
project but I see is as a big achievement.
Cheers,
Siegfried Goeschl
Jeffery Painter wrote:
> It is nice to hear from the same old gang again... I remember most of the
> recent posters from several years back when I was a Turbine newbie...
>
> Unfortunately, my career has taken me into the dark side (C#/.net) but I
> must agree that if I were to have to write another web based app tomorrow,
> I would still pick Turbine. It is a robust (and dependable) system.
>
> Maybe that is to explain for the lack of traffic in the past few months.
>
> Most of the projects I created with Turbine 3-4+ years ago are still in
> production (as far as I know) and fortunately "just work"
>
> cheers,
> Jeff
>
>
>
>> I have used turbine on a number of commercial projects, including some
>> very large ones, for many years.
>>
>> I'm just writing a revision for a project and am using turbine 2.4M1. I
>> am pleased to be able to second Thomas Vandahl's comments. It works for
>> me!
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Peter
>>
>> AFrieze wrote:
>>
>>> Tony Oslund wrote:
>>>
>>>> Adoption of technology should be based upon things such as need, cost,
>>>> ease of use, maintainability, and availability of resources, past
>>>> success, amongst others.
>>>> I find that Turbine in conjunction with Velocity serves these needs
>>>> very
>>>> well.
>>>>
>>>> I have also wondered at times why this site is very quiet, and then I
>>>> realize that I rarely need to post questions, since there is the
>>>> archive.
>>>> It would be a shame to see a great technology fall by the wayside
>>>> simply
>>>> because it has been successful, people learn it quickly, the community
>>>> has been supportive, and because others make more noise.
>>>>
>>>> You used the term "several projects", which probably means several
>>>> successful projects.
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps more noise is the answer...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Nick Ide [mailto:ide@nlm.nih.gov] Sent: Wednesday, January 30,
>>>> 2008 4:10 PM
>>>> To: user@turbine.apache.org
>>>> Subject: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
>>>>
>>>> We have built several projects in the past using turbine.
>>>> We are beginning a new project and trying to decide whether to
>>>> use turbine or try something else. We are a little concerned that
>>>> turbine is dead or dying from lack of community.
>>>>
>>>> My questions:
>>>>
>>>> 1. When will turbine 2.3.3 be released ?
>>>> 2. Is anybody working on that release ?
>>>> 3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
>>>> 4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
>>>> everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
>>>> 5. Probably asking the crowd since the people who voted with their
>>>> feet have stopped listening, but what do you suppose
>>>> people have adopted to use instead of turbine ? is it VelocityStruts ?
>>>>
>>>> is it Spring ? Others ?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -Nick
>>>>
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Just thought I would pop in real quick to let you all know that this
>>> is something I have been very interested in as well. I have worked
>>> heavily with a turbine project for the last 3 years and it has worked
>>> quite well for me. I am about to start a new project, and was also
>>> curious if turbine is dead, or if its just completed and bug free...
>>>
>>> AFrieze
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
>
>
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Re: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by Jeffery Painter <pa...@kiasoft.com>.
It is nice to hear from the same old gang again... I remember most of the
recent posters from several years back when I was a Turbine newbie...
Unfortunately, my career has taken me into the dark side (C#/.net) but I
must agree that if I were to have to write another web based app tomorrow,
I would still pick Turbine. It is a robust (and dependable) system.
Maybe that is to explain for the lack of traffic in the past few months.
Most of the projects I created with Turbine 3-4+ years ago are still in
production (as far as I know) and fortunately "just work"
cheers,
Jeff
> I have used turbine on a number of commercial projects, including some
> very large ones, for many years.
>
> I'm just writing a revision for a project and am using turbine 2.4M1. I
> am pleased to be able to second Thomas Vandahl's comments. It works for
> me!
>
> Regards,
>
> Peter
>
> AFrieze wrote:
>> Tony Oslund wrote:
>>> Adoption of technology should be based upon things such as need, cost,
>>> ease of use, maintainability, and availability of resources, past
>>> success, amongst others.
>>> I find that Turbine in conjunction with Velocity serves these needs
>>> very
>>> well.
>>>
>>> I have also wondered at times why this site is very quiet, and then I
>>> realize that I rarely need to post questions, since there is the
>>> archive.
>>> It would be a shame to see a great technology fall by the wayside
>>> simply
>>> because it has been successful, people learn it quickly, the community
>>> has been supportive, and because others make more noise.
>>>
>>> You used the term "several projects", which probably means several
>>> successful projects.
>>>
>>> Perhaps more noise is the answer...
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Nick Ide [mailto:ide@nlm.nih.gov] Sent: Wednesday, January 30,
>>> 2008 4:10 PM
>>> To: user@turbine.apache.org
>>> Subject: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
>>>
>>> We have built several projects in the past using turbine.
>>> We are beginning a new project and trying to decide whether to
>>> use turbine or try something else. We are a little concerned that
>>> turbine is dead or dying from lack of community.
>>>
>>> My questions:
>>>
>>> 1. When will turbine 2.3.3 be released ?
>>> 2. Is anybody working on that release ?
>>> 3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
>>> 4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
>>> everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
>>> 5. Probably asking the crowd since the people who voted with their
>>> feet have stopped listening, but what do you suppose
>>> people have adopted to use instead of turbine ? is it VelocityStruts ?
>>>
>>> is it Spring ? Others ?
>>>
>>>
>>> -Nick
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> Just thought I would pop in real quick to let you all know that this
>> is something I have been very interested in as well. I have worked
>> heavily with a turbine project for the last 3 years and it has worked
>> quite well for me. I am about to start a new project, and was also
>> curious if turbine is dead, or if its just completed and bug free...
>>
>> AFrieze
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>
>>
>
>
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Re: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by Peter Courcoux <pe...@courcoux.biz>.
I have used turbine on a number of commercial projects, including some
very large ones, for many years.
I'm just writing a revision for a project and am using turbine 2.4M1. I
am pleased to be able to second Thomas Vandahl's comments. It works for me!
Regards,
Peter
AFrieze wrote:
> Tony Oslund wrote:
>> Adoption of technology should be based upon things such as need, cost,
>> ease of use, maintainability, and availability of resources, past
>> success, amongst others.
>> I find that Turbine in conjunction with Velocity serves these needs very
>> well.
>>
>> I have also wondered at times why this site is very quiet, and then I
>> realize that I rarely need to post questions, since there is the
>> archive.
>> It would be a shame to see a great technology fall by the wayside simply
>> because it has been successful, people learn it quickly, the community
>> has been supportive, and because others make more noise.
>>
>> You used the term "several projects", which probably means several
>> successful projects.
>>
>> Perhaps more noise is the answer...
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Nick Ide [mailto:ide@nlm.nih.gov] Sent: Wednesday, January 30,
>> 2008 4:10 PM
>> To: user@turbine.apache.org
>> Subject: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
>>
>> We have built several projects in the past using turbine.
>> We are beginning a new project and trying to decide whether to
>> use turbine or try something else. We are a little concerned that
>> turbine is dead or dying from lack of community.
>>
>> My questions:
>>
>> 1. When will turbine 2.3.3 be released ?
>> 2. Is anybody working on that release ?
>> 3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
>> 4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
>> everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
>> 5. Probably asking the crowd since the people who voted with their
>> feet have stopped listening, but what do you suppose
>> people have adopted to use instead of turbine ? is it VelocityStruts ?
>>
>> is it Spring ? Others ?
>>
>>
>> -Nick
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>>
>>
>>
> Just thought I would pop in real quick to let you all know that this
> is something I have been very interested in as well. I have worked
> heavily with a turbine project for the last 3 years and it has worked
> quite well for me. I am about to start a new project, and was also
> curious if turbine is dead, or if its just completed and bug free...
>
> AFrieze
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>
>
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Re: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by AFrieze <AF...@simmgene.com>.
Tony Oslund wrote:
> Adoption of technology should be based upon things such as need, cost,
> ease of use, maintainability, and availability of resources, past
> success, amongst others.
>
> I find that Turbine in conjunction with Velocity serves these needs very
> well.
>
> I have also wondered at times why this site is very quiet, and then I
> realize that I rarely need to post questions, since there is the
> archive.
>
> It would be a shame to see a great technology fall by the wayside simply
> because it has been successful, people learn it quickly, the community
> has been supportive, and because others make more noise.
>
> You used the term "several projects", which probably means several
> successful projects.
>
> Perhaps more noise is the answer...
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Nick Ide [mailto:ide@nlm.nih.gov]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 4:10 PM
> To: user@turbine.apache.org
> Subject: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
>
>
> We have built several projects in the past using turbine.
> We are beginning a new project and trying to decide whether to
> use turbine or try something else.
> We are a little concerned that turbine is dead or dying from lack of
> community.
>
> My questions:
>
> 1. When will turbine 2.3.3 be released ?
> 2. Is anybody working on that release ?
> 3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
> 4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
> everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
> 5. Probably asking the crowd since the people who voted with their feet
> have stopped listening, but what do you suppose
> people have adopted to use instead of turbine ? is it VelocityStruts ?
>
> is it Spring ? Others ?
>
>
> -Nick
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@turbine.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@turbine.apache.org
>
>
>
Just thought I would pop in real quick to let you all know that this is
something I have been very interested in as well. I have worked heavily
with a turbine project for the last 3 years and it has worked quite well
for me. I am about to start a new project, and was also curious if
turbine is dead, or if its just completed and bug free...
AFrieze
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RE: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
Posted by Tony Oslund <To...@prepare-enrich.com>.
Adoption of technology should be based upon things such as need, cost,
ease of use, maintainability, and availability of resources, past
success, amongst others.
I find that Turbine in conjunction with Velocity serves these needs very
well.
I have also wondered at times why this site is very quiet, and then I
realize that I rarely need to post questions, since there is the
archive.
It would be a shame to see a great technology fall by the wayside simply
because it has been successful, people learn it quickly, the community
has been supportive, and because others make more noise.
You used the term "several projects", which probably means several
successful projects.
Perhaps more noise is the answer...
-----Original Message-----
From: Nick Ide [mailto:ide@nlm.nih.gov]
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 4:10 PM
To: user@turbine.apache.org
Subject: what is current status and likely future of turbine ?
We have built several projects in the past using turbine.
We are beginning a new project and trying to decide whether to
use turbine or try something else.
We are a little concerned that turbine is dead or dying from lack of
community.
My questions:
1. When will turbine 2.3.3 be released ?
2. Is anybody working on that release ?
3. Is there any active work on the turbine code base ?
4. If there is no work, is that because it all just works or because
everybody has abandoned turbine in favor of something else ?
5. Probably asking the crowd since the people who voted with their feet
have stopped listening, but what do you suppose
people have adopted to use instead of turbine ? is it VelocityStruts ?
is it Spring ? Others ?
-Nick
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