Gephi & NetBeans was: NetBeans platform: roadmap for compatibility with recent JDKs and the Java module system?

[Jaroslav Tulach <ja...@gmail.com>]

Dne úterý 9. února 2021 10:04:57 CET, Clement Levallois napsal(a):
> Dear all,
> 
> This is my first message to this list, happy to join!
> 
> Gephi (www.gephi.org / https://github.com/gephi/gephi) is a successful
> opensource desktop app built on top of the NetBeans platform (release82). 

Great, say hello to Mathieu!

> NetBeans (release82) is not compatible with the Java module system

Well, if there is any problem running NetBeans 8.2 to modern JDK, then it is 
not a problem of NetBeans, but of the JDK!  Actually that's not my statement, 
but an OSGi statement made with respect to Jigsaw - e.g. Java module system. 
Whatever JDK decides it do, there is no point in breaking previously running 
applications (like NetBeans Runtime Container). I believe people are still 
using NetBeans 8.2 even on JDK15. That said, I'd be really glad if Gephi 
migrated to recent Apache NetBeans.

> roadmap of development for the NetBeans platform, with regards to
> compatibility with recent JDKs and in relation with the Java module

There has been one PR by Jan Lahoda trying to bridge the gap between NetBeans 
module system and Jigsaw. It has not been integrated (yet).

> The support for loading / offloading of java modules at runtime has emerged:
> https://github.com/moditect/layrry

Great for layrry! From NetBeans twenty five year's perspective this is however 
just an another attempt to define what NetBeans (and also OSGi) did more than 
twenty years ago. Please apologize my lack of enthusiasm.

> nbm-maven-plugin relies on pack200

No, that's not true. nbm-maven-plugin doesn't rely on pack200. You can 
configure it to not use pack200.

> Also it was great meeting you Geertjan at FOSDEM '19 and talking about
> Netbeans.
> Unfortunately things on our side have not been as expected and we have not
> been able to progress at all on Gephi or contribute to the Netbeans
> platform. I am the only maintainer and at the moment I am not able to
> properly do it.
> I still think Gephi is a great and needed software with many users and
> would not like it to become even more stale, but with my current personal
> situation I am not able to work on Gephi as much as I used to do.

I am really glad for Gephi and I'd like to get it running on latest Apache 
NetBeans. However:

In such case you need no layrry. You don't need any new features. You also 
need to stop waiting!

NetBeans project is famous for keeping backward compatibility. Just replace 
the 8.2 binaries with 12.x binaries and it is going to work. If not, report 
errors. We'll investigate.

Dear Eduardo, projects like NetBeans do understand the maintenance issues. We 
attempt to simplify your live not by introducing new, trendy approaches to 
Jigsaw & co., but by keeping the old, already working solutions still working. 
No more excuses: Just upgrade!

Then we'll help.
-jt





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Re: Gephi & NetBeans was: NetBeans platform: roadmap for compatibility with recent JDKs and the Java module system?

[Jan Lahoda <la...@gmail.com>]

On Tue, Feb 9, 2021 at 8:56 PM Jaroslav Tulach <ja...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Dne úterý 9. února 2021 10:04:57 CET, Clement Levallois napsal(a):
> > Dear all,
> >
> > This is my first message to this list, happy to join!
> >
> > Gephi (www.gephi.org / https://github.com/gephi/gephi) is a successful
> > opensource desktop app built on top of the NetBeans platform
> (release82).
>
> Great, say hello to Mathieu!
>
> > NetBeans (release82) is not compatible with the Java module system
>
> Well, if there is any problem running NetBeans 8.2 to modern JDK, then it
> is
> not a problem of NetBeans, but of the JDK!  Actually that's not my
> statement,
> but an OSGi statement made with respect to Jigsaw - e.g. Java module
> system.
> Whatever JDK decides it do, there is no point in breaking previously
> running
> applications (like NetBeans Runtime Container). I believe people are still
> using NetBeans 8.2 even on JDK15. That said, I'd be really glad if Gephi
> migrated to recent Apache NetBeans.
>
> > roadmap of development for the NetBeans platform, with regards to
> > compatibility with recent JDKs and in relation with the Java module
>
> There has been one PR by Jan Lahoda trying to bridge the gap between
> NetBeans
> module system and Jigsaw. It has not been integrated (yet).
>

FTR, it is this PR:
https://github.com/apache/netbeans/pull/291

It is intended to allow NetBeans modules to express dependencies on JDK
modules.

Jan


> > The support for loading / offloading of java modules at runtime has
> emerged:
> > https://github.com/moditect/layrry
>
> Great for layrry! From NetBeans twenty five year's perspective this is
> however
> just an another attempt to define what NetBeans (and also OSGi) did more
> than
> twenty years ago. Please apologize my lack of enthusiasm.
>
> > nbm-maven-plugin relies on pack200
>
> No, that's not true. nbm-maven-plugin doesn't rely on pack200. You can
> configure it to not use pack200.
>
> > Also it was great meeting you Geertjan at FOSDEM '19 and talking about
> > Netbeans.
> > Unfortunately things on our side have not been as expected and we have
> not
> > been able to progress at all on Gephi or contribute to the Netbeans
> > platform. I am the only maintainer and at the moment I am not able to
> > properly do it.
> > I still think Gephi is a great and needed software with many users and
> > would not like it to become even more stale, but with my current personal
> > situation I am not able to work on Gephi as much as I used to do.
>
> I am really glad for Gephi and I'd like to get it running on latest Apache
> NetBeans. However:
>
> In such case you need no layrry. You don't need any new features. You also
> need to stop waiting!
>
> NetBeans project is famous for keeping backward compatibility. Just
> replace
> the 8.2 binaries with 12.x binaries and it is going to work. If not,
> report
> errors. We'll investigate.
>
> Dear Eduardo, projects like NetBeans do understand the maintenance issues.
> We
> attempt to simplify your live not by introducing new, trendy approaches to
> Jigsaw & co., but by keeping the old, already working solutions still
> working.
> No more excuses: Just upgrade!
>
> Then we'll help.
> -jt
>
>
>
>
>
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> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>