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Posted to user@cayenne.apache.org by Florijan Stamenkovic <fl...@mac.com> on 2007/06/26 15:36:46 UTC
Java Client
Hi everyone,
I am a WebObjects user, and since the future of Java Client support
in the WebObjects suite is not certain, I would appreciate some
insight into the following:
1. Are there many people using Java Clients with Cayenne?
2. How do the users of it see the effort / results proportion?
3. Is there a sub-community in Cayenne working together on solving
common JC problems, I am especially interested in integrating it with
rich Swing apps?
4. If someone is familiar with both EOF and Cayenne, can you draw
some comparison (related to JC possibilities and handling)?
Thanks in advance,
Flor
Re: Java Client
Posted by Florijan Stamenkovic <fl...@mac.com>.
Hi everyone,
Thanks a lot for the feedback, I really appreciate it! It made it
clear to me that there are efforts to make rich apps backed by
Cayenne, and people working on it.
At the moment Java Client is still alive within WO, but none of us
know how that will progress. Anyway, without knowing if Apple will
abandon it or not, I am not willing to switch to Cayenne, I have
invested already a lot of work into what Aristeded describes below,
with WO.
However, the future seems a bit brighter :)
Thanks!
Florijan
CNG Havaso Ltd.
> On 26/06/2007, at 11:36 PM, Florijan Stamenkovic wrote:
>
>> 1. Are there many people using Java Clients with Cayenne?
>
> Probably quite a few. Here's ours: www.ish.com.au/oncourse You can
> download and play with it since it is free....
>
>> 2. How do the users of it see the effort / results proportion?
>
> Terrific. We always wish that code just wrote itself :-) but
> Cayenne has worked really well.
>
>> 3. Is there a sub-community in Cayenne working together on solving
>> common JC problems, I am especially interested in integrating it
>> with rich Swing apps?
>
> I am not aware of one, but perhaps this list is a good place to
> start. If others get bored we could always form a separate group,
> but let's see who is interested. Some of things we've done with
> Cayenne/Swing which may be of interest are:
>
> * a controller hierarchy (not strict MVC but almost) which deals
> with Cayenne objects within a Swing layout
> * listeners and events which load values directly into subclasses
> of text areas, jlabels, combos, etc, etc.
> * a pretty sophisticated type-ahead (clairvoyance) field
> * Cayenne validation propagated visually back to entry areas within
> the GUI
>
> I'd guess that about 30-50 man-months of effort have gone into our
> GUI and how it interacts with Cayenne. Quite a lot of work for a
> small company like us, but the results have been very nice. Under
> some circumstances I'd consider opening up what we've done to
> others but I'm a little concerned about the amount of effort for us
> to document and generalise some of our code suitable for outsiders
> to use, particularly given the large amount of work we have on at
> the moment.
>
>> 4. If someone is familiar with both EOF and Cayenne, can you draw
>> some comparison (related to JC possibilities and handling)?
>
> Our initial decision to go with Cayenne was based on licensing
> issues with EOF some years ago and the lack of documentation about
> EOF three-tier. We are glad we decided the go the way we did.
> Although the technologies are similar in many ways, Cayenne of
> course has the clear advantage of being completely transparent: if
> you want to add a feature or fix a bug you can...
>
>
> Ari Maniatis
>
>
>
> -------------------------->
> Aristedes Maniatis
> phone +61 2 9660 9700
> PGP fingerprint 08 57 20 4B 80 69 59 E2 A9 BF 2D 48 C2 20 0C C8
>
>
Re: Java Client
Posted by Aristedes Maniatis <ar...@maniatis.org>.
On 26/06/2007, at 11:36 PM, Florijan Stamenkovic wrote:
> 1. Are there many people using Java Clients with Cayenne?
Probably quite a few. Here's ours: www.ish.com.au/oncourse You can
download and play with it since it is free....
> 2. How do the users of it see the effort / results proportion?
Terrific. We always wish that code just wrote itself :-) but Cayenne
has worked really well.
> 3. Is there a sub-community in Cayenne working together on solving
> common JC problems, I am especially interested in integrating it
> with rich Swing apps?
I am not aware of one, but perhaps this list is a good place to
start. If others get bored we could always form a separate group, but
let's see who is interested. Some of things we've done with Cayenne/
Swing which may be of interest are:
* a controller hierarchy (not strict MVC but almost) which deals with
Cayenne objects within a Swing layout
* listeners and events which load values directly into subclasses of
text areas, jlabels, combos, etc, etc.
* a pretty sophisticated type-ahead (clairvoyance) field
* Cayenne validation propagated visually back to entry areas within
the GUI
I'd guess that about 30-50 man-months of effort have gone into our
GUI and how it interacts with Cayenne. Quite a lot of work for a
small company like us, but the results have been very nice. Under
some circumstances I'd consider opening up what we've done to others
but I'm a little concerned about the amount of effort for us to
document and generalise some of our code suitable for outsiders to
use, particularly given the large amount of work we have on at the
moment.
> 4. If someone is familiar with both EOF and Cayenne, can you draw
> some comparison (related to JC possibilities and handling)?
Our initial decision to go with Cayenne was based on licensing issues
with EOF some years ago and the lack of documentation about EOF three-
tier. We are glad we decided the go the way we did. Although the
technologies are similar in many ways, Cayenne of course has the
clear advantage of being completely transparent: if you want to add a
feature or fix a bug you can...
Ari Maniatis
-------------------------->
Aristedes Maniatis
phone +61 2 9660 9700
PGP fingerprint 08 57 20 4B 80 69 59 E2 A9 BF 2D 48 C2 20 0C C8
Re: Java Client
Posted by Marek Wawrzyczny <ma...@internode.on.net>.
Hi Florijan,
I was involved with a Swing client/server project a while back that utilised
the Remote Object Persistence part of Cayenne. We used ROP at its very early
stage so we had a few niggling issues but overall I have to say I was/am very
impressed with the speed at which one can setup the object model and get
solid results.
We were able to develop MVC patterns that allowed us to build custom widgets
which were "wired" into Cayenne. Once we devised an event driven mechanism
for exchanging data, all one would need to do is set a Cayenne object within
the controller and staticly tell the widgets which properties they represent.
Data input/output and validation is sent using events.
I know that the team has since done a lot more work, especially with
the 'trigger-like' functionality of Cayenne's ROP.
The project took a fair amount of work but keep in mind that for most of the
participants it was the first real Swing application and an extremely
ambitious one at that. Cayenne integration took a fair bit of the development
time but mostly because it was in its early stages and because we were (and
the team still is) pushing the framework to its limits.
I very strongly recommend Cayenne and ROP.
Cheers,
Marek Wawrzyczny
On Tue, 26 Jun 2007 23:36:46 Florijan Stamenkovic wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
>
> I am a WebObjects user, and since the future of Java Client support
> in the WebObjects suite is not certain, I would appreciate some
> insight into the following:
>
> 1. Are there many people using Java Clients with Cayenne?
> 2. How do the users of it see the effort / results proportion?
> 3. Is there a sub-community in Cayenne working together on solving
> common JC problems, I am especially interested in integrating it with
> rich Swing apps?
> 4. If someone is familiar with both EOF and Cayenne, can you draw
> some comparison (related to JC possibilities and handling)?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Flor
Re: Java Client
Posted by John Armstrong <si...@gmail.com>.
I can only speak to my swing experience. I'm mid-way through building
a Cayenne backed swing app and its been really smooth sailing. Not
sure how to answer your questions more specifically around that, are
you having troubles?
John-
On 6/26/07, Florijan Stamenkovic <fl...@mac.com> wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
>
> I am a WebObjects user, and since the future of Java Client support
> in the WebObjects suite is not certain, I would appreciate some
> insight into the following:
>
> 1. Are there many people using Java Clients with Cayenne?
> 2. How do the users of it see the effort / results proportion?
> 3. Is there a sub-community in Cayenne working together on solving
> common JC problems, I am especially interested in integrating it with
> rich Swing apps?
> 4. If someone is familiar with both EOF and Cayenne, can you draw
> some comparison (related to JC possibilities and handling)?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Flor
>